Toscanini is the best conductor ever lived in the modern times.Precise, Brilliant, powerful, and Sharply , really the best, extraordinary performance. 100%
Nunca he escuchado mejor interpretacion de esta pieza que Toscanini, Poderoso, Brillante, preciso. Sharply, fast, El sabia darle el toque maestro a las piezas musicales, Dificil que pudiera existir otro como Toscanini, Karajan, Stokowsky, Maazel o Muti, Furtwlangler muy buenos pero como Toscanini ninguno.
Toscanini es the best conductor ever, He was, powerful, precise, disciplined, no mistakes, really sharply, With Toscanini really we learned to appreciate the meaning of Classical Music.
My Father said Tosacanini was the best and really is truth. He knew how to explote the resources of the Orchestra.The Great Master Arturo Toscanini.
Best strings ever NBC!!!! Almost all top soloists comming from russia after the 1917 events!!it will never come back...today you make a nice sound with vibrato and they say you play to "solistic" for orchestra... LOOK HERE!!!! If you want nice sound from the strings you need to puch a bit the tempo....
simply , beautiful..i played verdi, in symphonic contest at the daytona beach music festival, a very prestigious competition..we left the judges in tears
very special, and so very beautiful...wonderful in all its glory and phases
simply , beautiful..i played verdi, in symphonic contest at the daytona beach music festival, a very prestigious competition..we left the judges in tears
There will never be another Toscanini Those broadcasts I remember those as a child riding in the car and listen to the genius a few were on television eventually also when my mother cried when he died
As some have observed, this recording is playing back a semitone too high, which of course means that the tempo is faster than what they actually played. You can see on iTunes/Spotify that Toscanini generally clocked in at around 7 minutes for this piece (not 6:30, as here), so he was fast, but not quite THIS fast :-)
@K491 i dunno, the clarinet and oboe solos sounded like the correct speed (very slow with ritard) and it was still a semitone too high. either way it sounds freakin epic
Might you have the version without the little 'historical' addition of that old guy talking about how he heard Toscanini on the radio? It'd help lots! Thanks.
I love his fast tempi, very different from what we'd hear today. What a pity there was no complete Toscanini "Forza" with Zinka Milanov, Richard,Tucker and Leonard Warren. THAT would have been the definitive statement on this opera. Today, with the lack of dramatic sopranos and Toscanini-like conductors, you're not likely to hear this opera AT ALL these days. A real loss. Gawd - listen to this orchestra play!!!!!
@SteveAndrewLangford - I find his "Traviata" recording unmercifully too fast, but THIS is SO appropriate for "La Forza del Destino". They just don't perform this music like this anymore. It's a whirlwind of emotional turmoil, bursting with guts and drama. The musicians must have felt like they were driving the Indy 500! I doubt whether we'll ever hear it done like this again. Bravo, Maestro!
Toscanini himself, recalling the incident, said he began playing piano and began to play (from memory!) The "Te Deum ".... got to the point of slowing down he performed not only with some inquetude to ....
In particular, he dwelt on "slowing down" in the "Te Deum" which, according Mugnone there was to be absolutely! The issue went on a bit 'of time until the publisher Giulio Ricordi, to put an end, he organized the meeting between Verdi and Toscanini Mugnone ...
Toscanini himself, recalling the incident, said he began playing piano and began to play (from memory!) The "Te Deum ".... got to the point of slowing down he performed not only with some inquetude to ....
Arturo Toscanini Verdi met in his villa at Sant 'Agata during a dispute between him and the born conductor Leopold Mugnone that, after the premiere of "The four sacred pieces," criticized him harshly on the most important Milan daily newspaper! The criticism concerned the fact that, according to the thought of Mugnone Toscanini took too many liberties running tempo tempo changes that were not marked on the score.
Toscanini absolutely LOOKED as a conductor should.Serious,dignified,in control.He started out playing the cellobut,as with Duke Ellinton,the orchestra was his instrument.Thank you so much for the posts.
His recording of the Overture in my opinion is still the best. This is rushed for the movie. Levine copied his recording o the note in his performances and recordings.
the force of destiny!! When some amatuer orchestra's do this I wish they could go faster. With Toscanini and Serafin being the two greatest Italian Conductors ever, I side with them.
Amazing! He seems to be going rather fast for the piece -- I'm playing this in my youth orchestra and we're not going at that tempo. But it sounds good anyway -- you can't beat listening to a great piece being conducted by a great composer.
Grazie Pastroni for the video, i really get creeps just listening this beautifull Ouverture, il maestro Toscanini was simply amazing... he was born in Parma where i live, his birthplace is about 1 km far away from were i live!! Great , isn't it??
He caught Verdi's idea, and did something to this beautiful piece of music which resulted in a 6 min. clip that was, is, and always will be so incredible.
@pedrovski10 So right! And that's because of lack of preparation - "not enough money to rehearse" - well then don't do it! Poorly prepared concerts are worse than no concerts at all. Then lack of fully understanding the music. There is no "feel" in most things that happen today = superficiality. It's very sad. I've seen professionals who's only goal is not to have a good concert anymore... but looking forward to the beers before and after the gig :( And i see that a lot.
This is absolutely astonishing. My God the tempo is so fast and yet not scrambled ....and the ensemble is spot on. Good God who would DARE take this at this speed nowadays.
Remember when htis recording was made there was a terrible war raging in Europe and the Pacific whose outcome was not certain. Terrible things were happenning to peoples ...
Yes, it does sound faster than usual but what a performance. Only Toscanini could have got an orchestra to play at such a speed and with perfect precision. It really has to be seen to be believed and the end result is simply thrilling. I doubt if any other conductor could match Toscannini in Verdi or Rossini but then he lived for music. His favourite pastime away from the rostrum was reading scores because he wanted... " to discover the secrets of the masters."
Thank you for your insighful post. After this performance most other versions sound a bit thick.
BTW - Late in life AT liked to watch boxing matches on TV shouting "vergonias" and "stupidos" at the poor fighters as though they were playing musically badly
this is the forza del destino!!!! why everybody today play this fantastic piece so slow and boring???? only toscanini and chailly caught the real aim of verdi...
No one can dispute that Toscanini knew what Verdi wanted, since he knew him personally and played in the premier performances of some of his works. And Verdi always wanted his tempos rushed .
Je trouve qu on peut la transformer c'est absolument magnifique et il y a moyen de l adapter. Un tempo pareil c est fantastique, mais lent ca fait réver.. comme dans Jean de flrorette un tres beau film, avec une histoire d'amour passionante. C'est tout la le charme de la musique, c 'est un morceau énorme, merci.
"this is the forza del destino!!!! why everybody today play this fantastic piece so slow and boring???? only toscanini and chailly caught the real aim of verdi"
-------------------\
IMO today the musicians think slow is profound and musical but they are really "stupido"
@SteveAndrewLangford Toscanini started as a cello player and with 19 y he was in the orchestra of the Scala Milano at the first performance of OTELLO (1887) ! Later then he conducted the first performance of FALSTAFF (1893) so you can be sure, that he he had strong relations to Verdi.
@jin12345678 unfortunately you are right... full of grey intellectual little robot able only to perform with the precision of a pc but so empty... disaster, poor verdi, where is his temperament , his passion? must be find it only from 30/40 years ago records...
I usually fell that other conductors who use quick tempi rush things and do not do it corectly. But with Toscanini, he is so right, musical, dramatic! I wish there will be another one like him in our lifetime
@LordMgls Tosca is one of the best for sure, but if i had to choose one of puccini's opera I think Turandot is the best one, the complete first act is amaizing, in questa reggia the best aria, and when liu dies is the saddest moment of the history. But there are many operas that are better than tosca as La forza del destino, Otello, Aida, Rigoletto, La traviata, Don Carlo, Tristan und Isolde
@ezev8logos Everyone has different opinions. I fully agree with that quote "Amongst great masterpieces, there's no order". I believe I prefer Tosca because it was my opera-WAKE-UP! I've probably listened to Bohème more times than Tosca, but Butterfly & Turandot are like eternal for me. They are all TOO MUCH GREAT :-P
But I would never put Forza before Tosca. Rigoletto is like my Verdi's Tosca - first opera watched live in my life.
But we must NEVER compare Wagner with Italians....
I understand what youre saying because Forza was my opera-WAKE-UP! Although I believe that Otello is much better , tosca is too an amaizing opera, I have friends who had never heard opera because they thought it was boring, when they ask me why I liked it so much I just made them listen to e lucevan le stelle and they were stunned when he says "L'ora è fuggita e muoio disperato!
E non ho amato mai tanto la vita". You're right about wagner, but i mentioned Tristan because is one of my favorites
LA VELOCITA' E' DOVUTA AL FATTO CHE E' STATA ACCELERATA LA PELLICOLA QUANDO L'HANNO TELECINEMATA, LO DIMOSTRA IL FATTO CHE IL SUONO E' QUASI MEZZO TONO SOPRA... chi ha fatto il telecinema ha portato a 25fps un film girato a 24fps
I meant, Toscanini and PUCCINI were great friends; Toscanini was the first who analysed Turandot in Puccini's life. Although he did, he almost never recorded him. I think there are only one or two operas complete recordings. :-(
We're doing the band arrangement of this for my high school and it iz totally awesome and the first clarinet part is pretty complicated but i love playing it omj what list is this song on: AA probably amazing
i just played this in Allstate Orchestra SC at Converse College this was my Favorite piece...I play the bass an there were some insaine parts in it and i enjoyed it very much
Sembra la realizzazione di un computer. Si perde così, credo, un certo alone che la muisca ha in sé. E che il direttore "deve" mostrare, additare, "far vedere".
@35Matteo Non sono affatto d'accordo: nessun finto alone (la vera arte lo possiede da sé!), nessuna mistificazione, nessun compromesso con la Verità e la Bellezza. E' la voce di Verdi e della sua incomparabile arte che parla in questa registrazione, grazie al Maestro di tutti i Maestri.
I don't know if he is ever to be surpassed, but the Royal Concertgebouw Orchestra, currently the finest in the world, is performing this piece at their christmas matinée december 25th. Watch it live at monteverdi @dot@ tv slash rco.
Non vi è alcun dubbio che egli sia, senza alcuna ombra di dubbio, il più grande direttore d'orchestra della storia della musica.. Riposa in pace Arturo...e grazie.....
Furthermore, remember folks, Verdi's main influence was Rossini, at this tempo, you can clearly hear Verdi's debt to Rossini's music. That is as it should be. Rossini had an enormous influence over the Italian opera style, and that means quick tempi, sharp phrases, and florid string writing.
Thanks,it's a great explanation, given by an expert. I know he could do no wrong, fast or slow he is it. By the way, I'm extremely impressed with the harp playing, as seen on your upload.
If one more person says this is "obscenely fast" or "too fast" I'm going to scream. This is the tempo Verdi marked on the score. I've practiced the harp part to this piece for auditions many many times, and yes, conductors expect you to play it this fast. Now, they may not perform it at this tempo because it's unbelievably difficult, and it's real hard to keep together an orchestra at this tempo. But, this is what Verdi wanted. Toscanini knew Verdi, remember.
Light and agile, authentic and to the point. Not a show off, just a really great conductor.
But, of course, as society gets more and more retarded, everthing has to be slooooowed down otherwise people will miss it.
But Toscanini was alert and sharp, not sleepy and dull. And, you will never see a more AWAKE orchestra. SO Toscaninians, ignore the noise of idiots particularly AulicExclusiva whom probably lives as a zombie who camouflages her/his dozing off to being sensitive.
The forces of destiny are quite fast. The older you are the quicker it moves. It must be your age that makes it slower. The maestro is a god of music. He is all knowing, didn't you know that is so? Why are you questioning it????
Thank you for your reply. Yes, I do agree. I don't know why he took it at this tempo, but I would never question him. Just looking at him, you can see that he is "His Majesty" of music. grazie ancora, Antonio
Does anyone know the name of the principal flutist and clarinetist in this NBC incarnation? Is this Augustin Duques on clarinet? The greatest string section in the contemporary history of orchestras!
...after you have heard Toscanini, play anything......you never want another interpretation.....and if you hear one, you again hear the Toscanini way of playing it....even as the foreign conductor plays.....Toscanini remains in your mind, the greatest conductor to ever pick up a baton....he belongs to the ages. Matchless perfection.
My orchestra is going to be playing this in our May concert, and it is extremely difficult, but I am so excited for it! It is such a wonderful piece, and this symphony plays it excellently! Seeing as my orchestra is a high school orchestra, I highly doubt we will be this good, but I sure hope we will come close! This is an amazing recording of "La Forza Del Destino" ("The Force of Destiny").
Well, MaestroVng, if you are 90% of what Toscanini was you must be top of the list of the world's greatest conductors...yet I have never heard of you. There is a 1952 version of this which is much more relaxed (and many unpublished versions, different again, can also be found). Often, the way overtures are performed depends on whether they are being performed in context ie: in the opera house with the opera to follow, or in the concert hall as part of an orchestral program.
Toscanini is the best conductor ever lived in the modern times.Precise, Brilliant, powerful, and Sharply , really the best, extraordinary performance. 100%
jivamoksha 1 week ago
Nunca he escuchado mejor interpretacion de esta pieza que Toscanini, Poderoso, Brillante, preciso. Sharply, fast, El sabia darle el toque maestro a las piezas musicales, Dificil que pudiera existir otro como Toscanini, Karajan, Stokowsky, Maazel o Muti, Furtwlangler muy buenos pero como Toscanini ninguno.
jivamoksha 2 months ago 2
@jivamoksha agree 100% , never truer words , Toscanini is the emblem of conductor, the greatest ever .
Trulyloyale 2 months ago
Toscanini es the best conductor ever, He was, powerful, precise, disciplined, no mistakes, really sharply, With Toscanini really we learned to appreciate the meaning of Classical Music.
My Father said Tosacanini was the best and really is truth. He knew how to explote the resources of the Orchestra.The Great Master Arturo Toscanini.
jivamoksha 2 months ago 3
Toscanini!
Thorneycroft1937 5 months ago
Best strings ever NBC!!!! Almost all top soloists comming from russia after the 1917 events!!it will never come back...today you make a nice sound with vibrato and they say you play to "solistic" for orchestra... LOOK HERE!!!! If you want nice sound from the strings you need to puch a bit the tempo....
egonsky 5 months ago
a question in this video, it plays clarinet solo ralph McLane?
tubazuca 6 months ago
perfetto Toscanini:)
sttar1982 6 months ago
simply , beautiful..i played verdi, in symphonic contest at the daytona beach music festival, a very prestigious competition..we left the judges in tears
very special, and so very beautiful...wonderful in all its glory and phases
stsuter 8 months ago
simply , beautiful..i played verdi, in symphonic contest at the daytona beach music festival, a very prestigious competition..we left the judges in tears
very special, and so very beautiful
stsuter 8 months ago
There will never be another Toscanini Those broadcasts I remember those as a child riding in the car and listen to the genius a few were on television eventually also when my mother cried when he died
goodspiritone 8 months ago
This is when italians were still italians...
neonenour89 8 months ago 2
BREATHTAKING !!! This is the first time I've seen TOSCANINI conducting...
It is like taking a Masterclass in Music from the Great One himself...
FASCINATING and so PASSIONATELY BRILLIANT...
theo4u4me41 9 months ago
is there a complete version, without the intermission of the voice?
gbzful 9 months ago
Damn, Toscanini is awesome.
bassoonistfromhell 10 months ago
Dang.... I'm listening while reading along with my music, and i can't help but think how much faster and with more precision they play everything!!
missmusicgirl0511 10 months ago
Comment removed
Globaltone 10 months ago
I guess we'll never know how close this performance was to the original performed in 1862. Too fast for mine.
Globaltone 10 months ago
Beautiful music....thanks for posting.
granbranfan 1 year ago
As some have observed, this recording is playing back a semitone too high, which of course means that the tempo is faster than what they actually played. You can see on iTunes/Spotify that Toscanini generally clocked in at around 7 minutes for this piece (not 6:30, as here), so he was fast, but not quite THIS fast :-)
K491 1 year ago 5
@K491 i dunno, the clarinet and oboe solos sounded like the correct speed (very slow with ritard) and it was still a semitone too high. either way it sounds freakin epic
crazitaco 11 months ago
The precision of the playing is ASTONISHING. It's like they're one big instrument played by one virtuoso.
My guess is you're not going to get anything like this any time soon, because men like Toscanini do not exist anymore. Take that for good or for ill.
I wish there were no talking interrupting the performance, but oh well.
MaestroTJS 1 year ago
Es el unico que sabe dar la potencia y fuerza dramatica necesaria a esta pieza.
lamanodeonansequeja 1 year ago
i do absolutely agree with emy 1968
macbeth55 1 year ago
Might you have the version without the little 'historical' addition of that old guy talking about how he heard Toscanini on the radio? It'd help lots! Thanks.
masteridiot123 1 year ago
One of my fav tunes
SandrineSoprano 1 year ago
can't be better!! just great
henrykkingdom 1 year ago
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As someone once said, "If you can't play it like that, you shouldn't play it at all." Magnificent.
74umgrad 1 year ago
As someone one said, "If you can't play it like that, you shouldn't play it all." Magnificent.
74umgrad 1 year ago
...same old Toscanini.....as usual, matchless perfection...these notes will never be played like this again....Toscanini belongs to the ages......
valdengo1 1 year ago 4
@valdengo1 ... is he a fireman now or a first-aid nurse ... ?
MusicPredominates 1 year ago
@valdengo1 ... good conducting comes from experience ... .
MusicPredominates 1 year ago
@MusicPredominates Agreed! At the time of this recording, Toscanini had 50 years of conducting experience!
SteveAndrewLangford 1 year ago
can't get any greater than this, Verdi's masterpiece proudly orchestrated at zenith level.
MrCamiDes 1 year ago
I love his fast tempi, very different from what we'd hear today. What a pity there was no complete Toscanini "Forza" with Zinka Milanov, Richard,Tucker and Leonard Warren. THAT would have been the definitive statement on this opera. Today, with the lack of dramatic sopranos and Toscanini-like conductors, you're not likely to hear this opera AT ALL these days. A real loss. Gawd - listen to this orchestra play!!!!!
Zva26 1 year ago
@Zva26 Toscanini would say, this is the tempi.
SteveAndrewLangford 1 year ago
@SteveAndrewLangford - I find his "Traviata" recording unmercifully too fast, but THIS is SO appropriate for "La Forza del Destino". They just don't perform this music like this anymore. It's a whirlwind of emotional turmoil, bursting with guts and drama. The musicians must have felt like they were driving the Indy 500! I doubt whether we'll ever hear it done like this again. Bravo, Maestro!
Zva26 1 year ago
@SteveAndrewLangford tempo
Alfgard1 5 months ago
still gives me shiver..........
percymartinez 1 year ago
You have to admire Toscanini...a true genius
adamwas 1 year ago
Toscanini himself, recalling the incident, said he began playing piano and began to play (from memory!) The "Te Deum ".... got to the point of slowing down he performed not only with some inquetude to ....
francesco65esposito 1 year ago
In particular, he dwelt on "slowing down" in the "Te Deum" which, according Mugnone there was to be absolutely! The issue went on a bit 'of time until the publisher Giulio Ricordi, to put an end, he organized the meeting between Verdi and Toscanini Mugnone ...
Toscanini himself, recalling the incident, said he began playing piano and began to play (from memory!) The "Te Deum ".... got to the point of slowing down he performed not only with some inquetude to ....
francesco65esposito 1 year ago
Arturo Toscanini Verdi met in his villa at Sant 'Agata during a dispute between him and the born conductor Leopold Mugnone that, after the premiere of "The four sacred pieces," criticized him harshly on the most important Milan daily newspaper! The criticism concerned the fact that, according to the thought of Mugnone Toscanini took too many liberties running tempo tempo changes that were not marked on the score.
francesco65esposito 1 year ago
magnifique !
giordanengo1 1 year ago
awesome
paulostroff99 1 year ago
Toscanini absolutely LOOKED as a conductor should.Serious,dignified,in control.He started out playing the cellobut,as with Duke Ellinton,the orchestra was his instrument.Thank you so much for the posts.
postatility 1 year ago
His recording of the Overture in my opinion is still the best. This is rushed for the movie. Levine copied his recording o the note in his performances and recordings.
tenorismo 1 year ago
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Is there a video of this performance available that doesn't have Menuhin's comments interrupting it in the middle of one of the best parts?
austin0031 1 year ago
Toscanini The Miracle Worker sending every emotion and idea through the
blood stream of the dazzled listener directly to the soul! His hand was on
the beating pulse of any composer he served for the purposes of enlighten-
ment, inspiration, mysticism, and the high truth of human feeling! Thank
you for sharing this sublime historic post and to Atilla65 for sending!
Kievest 1 year ago
MAGNIFICENT!, MAGIC!! Thank you very much Pastroni for posting and 65attila for sending me this Amazing recording!
ditogam 1 year ago
This is fantastic! Someone shared this with me and now I am sharing it on my Facebook...BAY-beh!
DoobieMcDonald 1 year ago
Eccezionale
Sayflay 1 year ago
Ecco l'eleganza nel dirigere.
atrebil71 2 years ago
Most College and youth Orchestra's play this too
slow, Remember Toscanini knew Verdi, and to
add Tullio Serafin also Conducts it at this pace.
When Conducting this piece or performing it you
must show emotion. La forza del destino means
the force of destiny!! When some amatuer orchestra's do this I wish they could go faster. With Toscanini and Serafin being the two greatest Italian Conductors ever, I side with them.
MAR3668 2 years ago
Amazing! He seems to be going rather fast for the piece -- I'm playing this in my youth orchestra and we're not going at that tempo. But it sounds good anyway -- you can't beat listening to a great piece being conducted by a great composer.
ems775 2 years ago
@ems775 No no no, It IS The tempo for the peace.
SteveAndrewLangford 1 year ago
Grazie Pastroni for the video, i really get creeps just listening this beautifull Ouverture, il maestro Toscanini was simply amazing... he was born in Parma where i live, his birthplace is about 1 km far away from were i live!! Great , isn't it??
natare50 2 years ago
Toscanini..
One sharp dude.
He caught Verdi's idea, and did something to this beautiful piece of music which resulted in a 6 min. clip that was, is, and always will be so incredible.
Simply amazing.
RE55 2 years ago 2
pardon my ignorance, but every detail but the composer ...
3NUNS 2 years ago
You have to click More Info in the box with my name at the top. It's listed in the Tags: Verdi.
Pastroni 2 years ago
pardon my ignorance for the second time
3NUNS 2 years ago
The composer is Verdi, and its the Ouverture of La Forza del Destino. Wonderful interpretation!
Swedanyrl 2 years ago 4
Giuseppe Verdi :D
GhuToB 2 years ago
Why is it being played in the wrong key?
Insanekid95 2 years ago
The Perfection had name: Toscanini
verdi0381 2 years ago
:°)
FirefoxWhite 2 years ago
That orchestra sounds way better than any of the ones today and that's with inferior sound recording technology.
pedrovski10 2 years ago 32
@pedrovski10 absolutely. I miss this vintage sound..
jglsd1 2 years ago
@pedrovski10 So right! And that's because of lack of preparation - "not enough money to rehearse" - well then don't do it! Poorly prepared concerts are worse than no concerts at all. Then lack of fully understanding the music. There is no "feel" in most things that happen today = superficiality. It's very sad. I've seen professionals who's only goal is not to have a good concert anymore... but looking forward to the beers before and after the gig :( And i see that a lot.
ukartist 1 year ago
@pedrovski10 absolutely right...
emy1968 1 year ago
@pedrovski10 : The bows must have been reasonably well rosinned !
MusicPredominates 1 year ago
@pedrovski10 What rubbish...
AfroPoli 6 months ago
This is absolutely astonishing. My God the tempo is so fast and yet not scrambled ....and the ensemble is spot on. Good God who would DARE take this at this speed nowadays.
Remember when htis recording was made there was a terrible war raging in Europe and the Pacific whose outcome was not certain. Terrible things were happenning to peoples ...
MrPoupard 2 years ago 6
Whoa Nelly!!!!! Now THAT'S what i call "The Force of Destiny"..... fantastic performance. Thanks for posting it!!!!!
HolyMotherofGrid 2 years ago 4
Yes, it does sound faster than usual but what a performance. Only Toscanini could have got an orchestra to play at such a speed and with perfect precision. It really has to be seen to be believed and the end result is simply thrilling. I doubt if any other conductor could match Toscannini in Verdi or Rossini but then he lived for music. His favourite pastime away from the rostrum was reading scores because he wanted... " to discover the secrets of the masters."
MartinPadderborn 2 years ago 3
@MartinPadderborn
Thank you for your insighful post. After this performance most other versions sound a bit thick.
BTW - Late in life AT liked to watch boxing matches on TV shouting "vergonias" and "stupidos" at the poor fighters as though they were playing musically badly
Regards-John
65attila 1 year ago
this is the forza del destino!!!! why everybody today play this fantastic piece so slow and boring???? only toscanini and chailly caught the real aim of verdi...
emy1968 2 years ago 40
No one can dispute that Toscanini knew what Verdi wanted, since he knew him personally and played in the premier performances of some of his works. And Verdi always wanted his tempos rushed .
yumyumwhatzohai 2 years ago
Je trouve qu on peut la transformer c'est absolument magnifique et il y a moyen de l adapter. Un tempo pareil c est fantastique, mais lent ca fait réver.. comme dans Jean de flrorette un tres beau film, avec une histoire d'amour passionante. C'est tout la le charme de la musique, c 'est un morceau énorme, merci.
0yenz 2 years ago
This has been flagged as spam show
emy1968 writes abd asks
"this is the forza del destino!!!! why everybody today play this fantastic piece so slow and boring???? only toscanini and chailly caught the real aim of verdi"
-------------------\
IMO today the musicians think slow is profound and musical but they are really "stupido"
Bravo for your insight and regards-JOHN.
65attila 1 year ago
@emy1968 Did not Toscanini meet Verdi?
SteveAndrewLangford 1 year ago
@SteveAndrewLangford Toscanini started as a cello player and with 19 y he was in the orchestra of the Scala Milano at the first performance of OTELLO (1887) ! Later then he conducted the first performance of FALSTAFF (1893) so you can be sure, that he he had strong relations to Verdi.
legislator06 1 year ago
It was Mascheroni not Toscanini who conducted the first performance of Verdi's Falstaff.
XP11XP 1 year ago
@emy1968 Have you heard Levine's version?
It is very powerfull,
ezev8logos 1 year ago
@emy1968 the problem isn't the tempi as much as the lack of inspiration and plebian musicality.
jin12345678 1 year ago
@jin12345678 unfortunately you are right... full of grey intellectual little robot able only to perform with the precision of a pc but so empty... disaster, poor verdi, where is his temperament , his passion? must be find it only from 30/40 years ago records...
emy1968 1 year ago 2
Comment removed
1965jeanpaul1965 1 year ago
@1965jeanpaul1965 the comment was about modern conductors as opposed to older conductors like toscanini, not about toscanini himself :)
jin12345678 1 year ago
Comment removed
1965jeanpaul1965 1 year ago
@jin12345678 OK friend... All right! Sorry for my mistake. ;-)
1965jeanpaul1965 1 year ago
I usually fell that other conductors who use quick tempi rush things and do not do it corectly. But with Toscanini, he is so right, musical, dramatic! I wish there will be another one like him in our lifetime
AOG93 2 years ago
'Who is this guy'' are you kidding what planet are you from.Listen and learn.
SCARPIA44 2 years ago
are you serious
---who is this guy???this is amazing
captainofyourstarshi 2 years ago
i say, everything is a PREFECT!
gunz4show 2 years ago
Amaizing. the perfect tempo For the best opera
ezev8logos 2 years ago
The perfect tempo, yes.
Not the best opera, son. The best opera is Puccini's Tosca.
LordMgls 2 years ago
No, Falstaff is.
yumyumwhatzohai 2 years ago
Tosca. Undoubtedly
LordMgls 2 years ago
@LordMgls Tosca is one of the best for sure, but if i had to choose one of puccini's opera I think Turandot is the best one, the complete first act is amaizing, in questa reggia the best aria, and when liu dies is the saddest moment of the history. But there are many operas that are better than tosca as La forza del destino, Otello, Aida, Rigoletto, La traviata, Don Carlo, Tristan und Isolde
ezev8logos 1 year ago
@ezev8logos Everyone has different opinions. I fully agree with that quote "Amongst great masterpieces, there's no order". I believe I prefer Tosca because it was my opera-WAKE-UP! I've probably listened to Bohème more times than Tosca, but Butterfly & Turandot are like eternal for me. They are all TOO MUCH GREAT :-P
But I would never put Forza before Tosca. Rigoletto is like my Verdi's Tosca - first opera watched live in my life.
But we must NEVER compare Wagner with Italians....
Cheers-B
LordMgls 1 year ago
I understand what youre saying because Forza was my opera-WAKE-UP! Although I believe that Otello is much better , tosca is too an amaizing opera, I have friends who had never heard opera because they thought it was boring, when they ask me why I liked it so much I just made them listen to e lucevan le stelle and they were stunned when he says "L'ora è fuggita e muoio disperato!
E non ho amato mai tanto la vita". You're right about wagner, but i mentioned Tristan because is one of my favorites
ezev8logos 1 year ago
wonderful! :D
amonitamusicarum 2 years ago
è veramente una cosa indescrivbile ... non è solo la velocità ... è allucinante
LESTAT84LESTAT 2 years ago
LA VELOCITA' E' DOVUTA AL FATTO CHE E' STATA ACCELERATA LA PELLICOLA QUANDO L'HANNO TELECINEMATA, LO DIMOSTRA IL FATTO CHE IL SUONO E' QUASI MEZZO TONO SOPRA... chi ha fatto il telecinema ha portato a 25fps un film girato a 24fps
cayman228 2 years ago 2
Comment removed
1965jeanpaul1965 1 year ago
He was born to conduct Verdi!
sists43 2 years ago 5
And after he was born, he lived to betray his old friend, The Great Puccini, who he rarely recorded, comparing with other composers. Isn't it?
LordMgls 2 years ago
You know, I don`t like to talk about composers and conductors... But it is true, I don`t know, they have to please the audience... Maybe that`s it!
sists43 2 years ago
It is a fact. No need to discuss!
I meant, Toscanini and PUCCINI were great friends; Toscanini was the first who analysed Turandot in Puccini's life. Although he did, he almost never recorded him. I think there are only one or two operas complete recordings. :-(
LordMgls 2 years ago
bow to the bows
shaggydowah 2 years ago
Great!
praissola 2 years ago
Super Tempo!
GiovanniNesi 2 years ago
wow!!!
very fast
5/5
mystfire 3 years ago
We're doing the band arrangement of this for my high school and it iz totally awesome and the first clarinet part is pretty complicated but i love playing it omj what list is this song on: AA probably amazing
No2clarinet 3 years ago
not that complicated. haha D:
kamikazepencil 2 years ago
haha
....now that i play it more itz pretty easy... that and molly on the shore!!!....~smiles~
do u know what list this is on???
^_^
No2clarinet 2 years ago
i just played this in Allstate Orchestra SC at Converse College this was my Favorite piece...I play the bass an there were some insaine parts in it and i enjoyed it very much
haleyerer 3 years ago
Sembra la realizzazione di un computer. Si perde così, credo, un certo alone che la muisca ha in sé. E che il direttore "deve" mostrare, additare, "far vedere".
35Matteo 3 years ago
@35Matteo Non sono affatto d'accordo: nessun finto alone (la vera arte lo possiede da sé!), nessuna mistificazione, nessun compromesso con la Verità e la Bellezza. E' la voce di Verdi e della sua incomparabile arte che parla in questa registrazione, grazie al Maestro di tutti i Maestri.
1965jeanpaul1965 1 year ago
The man was a perfect metronome, yes...but a total genius. Total Verdi as it was meant to be.
sirenadellopera 3 years ago
bello
liric01994 3 years ago
Very very nice.
ErikaRagazzi 3 years ago
What a great performance!
pigsong9 3 years ago 2
Is this a clip from The Art of Conducting?
noisydoll168 3 years ago 2
I don't know if he is ever to be surpassed, but the Royal Concertgebouw Orchestra, currently the finest in the world, is performing this piece at their christmas matinée december 25th. Watch it live at monteverdi @dot@ tv slash rco.
Thansferium 3 years ago
What masterfull conducting...
The brass section has a perfect balance between high and low.
The attacks of the begining are so perfect that it all most scares me.
The melancholi from the clarinet, and the eavil wawes from the strings right under. Verdi did a master piece.
fisk7aal 3 years ago 2
geez verionka, i can barely find a video that we played that you havent commented on. -___-
mattattack6187 3 years ago
i have played this song with the SC Youth Philharmonic. I love it
and i'm about to play it for allstate.
we didn't take it so fast. i wish we wil for allstate
i love the piece. very well written
Ronnie1027 3 years ago
really love it!!!
earthatic 3 years ago
Non vi è alcun dubbio che egli sia, senza alcuna ombra di dubbio, il più grande direttore d'orchestra della storia della musica.. Riposa in pace Arturo...e grazie.....
iaraculonna 3 years ago
provi a cercare i video e le registrazionidi mravnsky.
non sono sicuro che si scriva così ma sono certo che è l'anti toscanini per stile e scelta di repertorio.
ognuno ha i propri favoriti ma è bello fare confronti e mettere in dubbio le proprie certezze.
sa che Toscanini era costretto a dirigere con tempi rapidi pr stare nei tempi delle regisrazioni? questo solo quando era a NY.
credo si stato un grandissimo ma
forse il più grande di tutti è stato Celibidache, Mravinsky
udilio 3 years ago
This has been flagged as spam show
lets do somethin tonight! MSG me on M.S.N.
wow!! O.o mN
branyizoltan 3 years ago
uffffffffffff que violines!!!
hugaadro 3 years ago
The one and only Maestro T (or Mr. T)
jacobsimon 3 years ago
Furthermore, remember folks, Verdi's main influence was Rossini, at this tempo, you can clearly hear Verdi's debt to Rossini's music. That is as it should be. Rossini had an enormous influence over the Italian opera style, and that means quick tempi, sharp phrases, and florid string writing.
johnmannno 3 years ago
johnmannno,
Thanks,it's a great explanation, given by an expert. I know he could do no wrong, fast or slow he is it. By the way, I'm extremely impressed with the harp playing, as seen on your upload.
tonytib 3 years ago
If one more person says this is "obscenely fast" or "too fast" I'm going to scream. This is the tempo Verdi marked on the score. I've practiced the harp part to this piece for auditions many many times, and yes, conductors expect you to play it this fast. Now, they may not perform it at this tempo because it's unbelievably difficult, and it's real hard to keep together an orchestra at this tempo. But, this is what Verdi wanted. Toscanini knew Verdi, remember.
johnmannno 3 years ago 3
Impressionante. Chi osa avere dubbi sulla grandezza di Toscanini non sà cosa significhi fare la musica!
DERFNAM72 3 years ago
TOSCANINI: UN GENIO DELLA MUSICA!
VIAREGGIO1960 3 years ago
...Ma osservate la gestualità. Di un'eleganza e di una "nobiltà" uniche. Davvero un direttore d'altri tempi.
alcibiadel 3 years ago
Grande Toscanini!!!!
alcibiadel 3 years ago
Definitivamente uno de los grandes Toscanini, que dramatismo, es increible!!
flutemaniac 3 years ago
Light and agile, authentic and to the point. Not a show off, just a really great conductor.
But, of course, as society gets more and more retarded, everthing has to be slooooowed down otherwise people will miss it.
But Toscanini was alert and sharp, not sleepy and dull. And, you will never see a more AWAKE orchestra. SO Toscaninians, ignore the noise of idiots particularly AulicExclusiva whom probably lives as a zombie who camouflages her/his dozing off to being sensitive.
fabrizzzio48 3 years ago 5
This comment has received too many negative votes show
I'm no expert, but this sounds too fast!
molcb76 3 years ago
The forces of destiny are quite fast. The older you are the quicker it moves. It must be your age that makes it slower. The maestro is a god of music. He is all knowing, didn't you know that is so? Why are you questioning it????
tonytib 3 years ago 2
Because I've always listened to this piece, played at a slower tempo. that's all
molcb76 3 years ago
Thank you for your reply. Yes, I do agree. I don't know why he took it at this tempo, but I would never question him. Just looking at him, you can see that he is "His Majesty" of music. grazie ancora, Antonio
tonytib 3 years ago
Que bueno!!
iloventura 3 years ago
Increible el tempo, es como se toca, rápido.
Beathame88 3 years ago
its ..a bsolut.. i mean .. speachless
bonafont 3 years ago
As sensitive and subtle as an Italian village band at a beer bust!
AulicExclusiva 3 years ago
Does anyone know the name of the principal flutist and clarinetist in this NBC incarnation? Is this Augustin Duques on clarinet? The greatest string section in the contemporary history of orchestras!
ipmoic 3 years ago 2
半音高く聞こえるのは、この時代は４４４とか４４５Hzでチューニングを合わせるのがヨーロッパでは普通だったからなのさ。
それにしてもトスカニーニの演奏は早くて痛快だな
catstamon 3 years ago
Certo il tempo che usa nell'ultimo minuto è un pochino pochino rapido... un "assai molto prestissimissimo con fuoco" direi
bellinianodoc 3 years ago
is a very fast verion of the Armenian Dances, is aawersome!!
LittleBobMarley 3 years ago
...after you have heard Toscanini, play anything......you never want another interpretation.....and if you hear one, you again hear the Toscanini way of playing it....even as the foreign conductor plays.....Toscanini remains in your mind, the greatest conductor to ever pick up a baton....he belongs to the ages. Matchless perfection.
j72050 3 years ago
I agree with you 100%, I never saw him conduct in person, but my neighbors wife would go to New York just for his rehersahals.
666fred313 3 years ago
Senza parole. Ineffabile
nephelais 3 years ago
Quite outstanding and dramatic music than any other directors.
It's really impressive.
zs6ysaka 3 years ago 2
c'est un enregistrement légendaire de 1952 le meilleur qui ai jamais été réalisé
edwinire 4 years ago
son totalmente d'accordo. Magari non su tutto, ma Toscanini aveva genialità
nephelais 3 years ago
Excuse moi, c'est un enregistrement de 1944.
Tenia que corregirlo, disculpa.
Saludos desde l'Espagne!!
Music is my life, and my life is pure music.
LittleBobMarley 3 years ago
My orchestra is going to be playing this in our May concert, and it is extremely difficult, but I am so excited for it! It is such a wonderful piece, and this symphony plays it excellently! Seeing as my orchestra is a high school orchestra, I highly doubt we will be this good, but I sure hope we will come close! This is an amazing recording of "La Forza Del Destino" ("The Force of Destiny").
minervarose 4 years ago
my best wishes..!
nephelais 3 years ago
I'm going to play this too! Are very difficult, but it's a nice piece for my amateur orchestra, is...is the power in music!!!
LittleBobMarley 3 years ago
intéressant
guy1938 4 years ago
Le plus Grand, le destin qui vous rattrape,
une urgence de vivre. Oui le génie interprétatif existe, écoutez.
Dans Beethoven, Verdi et Wagner, la base,
les autres viennent après, même Furtwaengler
pour qui j'ai une immense admiration.
jacquesurlus 4 years ago
Too bad the beginning was interrupted by the likes of one of the most pompous has-been child prodigies.
zamyrabyrd 4 years ago
Well, MaestroVng, if you are 90% of what Toscanini was you must be top of the list of the world's greatest conductors...yet I have never heard of you. There is a 1952 version of this which is much more relaxed (and many unpublished versions, different again, can also be found). Often, the way overtures are performed depends on whether they are being performed in context ie: in the opera house with the opera to follow, or in the concert hall as part of an orchestral program.
hillwills 4 years ago 3
it never occurred to you, I suppose, that MaestroVNG is not the name by which he goes in the world?
jesuisravi 4 years ago
It's in e-minor the other tonality is e-dur, there have no anything of a-minor in this Overture.
MaestroVNG 4 years ago