Proof the Trinity is False: 2 Corinthians 3:17

[jameshussey313]

read john 1 : 1 john 1 : 14 revelation 1 : 8

[jameshussey313]

john 1:1 in the beginning was the word and the word was with God and the word was God john 1:14 and the word was made flesh revelation 1: 8 Jesus said these words i am alpha omega the beginning and the ending Jesus is God unless your not a Christian

[TheJmsauer]

The Father punished the Son for our sin. The Spirit applies this to the faithful. Without a trinitarian God there is no forgiveness for sin. God is one, but so are you and are more complex than a pencil. We are more complex than a pencil. and God is more complex than us. We were created to be relational because God is a relationship within Himself without being more than one God.

[TheTrinityDelusion]

@TheLionessjudah

Instead of Michael Rood, why don't you try listening to Jesus? His sheep know his voice.

[TheLionessjudah]

This man is so confused, what a waste.

[TheTrinityDelusion]

@TheLionessjudah

An easy charge to make without backing it up.

[TheLionessjudah]

@The You can't please YHWH without Faith, Abraham walked in Faith. Thomas needed to see the wounds, blessed are those who believe without seeing, It is written. What you are writing is playing into the hands of an enemy. All you needed to read, which you missed, is to ask God YHWH in the Name of Yahshua Messiah, if you ask it will be given. But to come on this utube and talk rolling your eyes back and forth, looking for an answer comes short of anything. You are lost, ask and it will be given.

[TheLionessjudah]

@TheTrinityDelusion I Corithinthians 2:9

[TheLionessjudah]

@TheTrinityDelusion I have to say to you to declare what YHWH has put forward as Truth and to headline your personal upload of yourself and say that YHWH's Word is false puts you as an enemy to YHWH. We have inherited a sin debt, without first we must confess that Christ Yahshua paid for our debt at the Cross, died, was buried and rose. I don't know if you are Jewish, but nevertheless, you are treading on very sacred ground here. Only a fool would put himself out there against the Word.

[TheTrinityDelusion]

@TheLionessjudah

And we must obey your interpretation of the Bible?

[TheLionessjudah]

@TheTrinityDelusion That is the WORD, not interpreted. You are an enemy of YHWH because you walk in disbelief, you are in rebellion, That is all through the O.T. and is expounded on. Obviously you have blinders on to the Truth if you find passages and do not believe. You are looking to find fault with God YHWH's Word. What do you expect from Him a pat on the back?

[TheTrinityDelusion]

@TheLionessjudah

You do a lot of footstamping.

[TheLionessjudah]

@TheTrinityDelusion Yes I do, I trample on serpents and scorpions in the name of Yahshua Messiah. The seed of the woman did crush the head of the serpent, but he did bruise His heel. First prophecy given and we wear the sandles of Peace of the Gospel, and Satan is under our feet, and we trample hard as Believers. Don't let the Devil turn you away from the Word. Listen to Les Feldick, listen to Michael Rood. You will not be left with an empty plate.

[MrTruth111]

@TheLionessjudah why is he confused?

[vassilischr]

They are paid to teach their official creeds, that's why don't get it.

[mcorrothers1]

Hello the trinity is one..... God is one, Father Son Holy Spirit. All one.

[mcorrothers1]

Jesus is not a spirit,

Jesus is God. The Holy Spirit is God. The Father is God. Just because you cannot get your mind around trinitarianism does not mean your understanding is absolute. This video is with out a doubt preposterous.

[TheTrinityDelusion]

@mcorrothers1

So you decided to imagine that I dont' understand Trinitarian doctrine did you?

The first man Adam became a living soul, the last Adam became life-giving Spirit. 1 Cor 15:45.

the veil is taken away in CHRIST... when one turns to THE LORD, the veil is taken away. THE LORD is the Spirit..... We do not preach ourselves but Jesus Christ as LORD. 2 Cor 3:14-4:5.

Truth or traditions?

[MrAtang14]

@TheTrinityDelusion Hi, we've talked before, Behold, "when one turns to THE LORD, the veil is taken away" VERSUS "But when Moses went in before the LORD to speak with him, he took the vail off, until he came out" Exodus 34:34. The Lord is 2 Cor 3:17 is certainly Jehovah, since it is taken out of the context of Exodus, where Moses turned to Jehovah. Now, you know that Jehovah is translated as the Lord in the NT. So, you have actually helped proved that Jesus is Jehovah.

[TheTrinityDelusion]

@MrAtang14

If you actually read the preceding context you would see that the "the Lord" in question here is most certainly NOT a reference to reality under the Law. And if you keep reading Paul says that he preaches JESUS CHRIST as Lord.

[aTang14]

@TheTrinityDelusion Actually, it's your position that must be revised. 2 Cor 3:17, "The Lord is the Spirit, where the Spirit of the Lord is,..." Here already are 2 Persons, since the Spirit is possessed by the Lord--the Spirit "OF" the Lord. The Spirit here is nominative in grammar; the Lord is genitive. NO ONE CAN POSSESS HIMSELF. I cannot call myself Arnold of Arnold. So there must be two distinct Persons, YET AT THE SAME TIME, the Spirit is the LORD. Therefore, the Lord must mean YHWH.

[TheTrinityDelusion]

@aTang14

I am afraid you are quite mistaken on 2 accounts.

1. Jesus' Spirit is not something or someone other than Jesus anymore than Adam's flesh is something or someone other than Adam. To say "Now Adam is the flesh and where the flesh of Adam is..." neither implies that Adam and his flesh are two different things nor that there are two persons in view.

2. To say the Lord is YHWH is to say the Triune Being is the Holy Spirit. That won't work either.

Why kick against the facts?

[aTang14]

@TheTrinityDelusion Dear friend, you still don't get my quote of Dr Tozer concerning YHWH. Anyway, Isaiah 8:13 versus 1 Peter 3:15 and Romans 9:33 and 1 Peter 2:8 are a final warning for you, and the words I have for you is don't reject pure reception of Scripture, such as those I gave you concerning Jesus and the Holy Spirit--every one of them. Peace.

[aTang14]

@aTang14 sorry 1 Peter 3:14-15, this will make the Truth all the more forceful.

[aTang14]

@TheTrinityDelusion Sorry, I should say Isaiah 8:12-13 Versus 1 Peter 3:14-15 and so on. That makes the Truth look much more blatant.

[aTang14]

@TheTrinityDelusion and Isaiah 8:14-15 Versus Romans 9:33 and 1 Peter 2:8. That should makes my point clearer. I have given you these last testimonies of the Scripture, along with all those obvious precious truths and testimonies I've been giving you these months, if you reject it, I am not responsible for that at the Judgment Seat. Remember, the Holy Spirit sent Jesus to the wilderness.

[TheTrinityDelusion]

@aTang14

You don't even have a point yet. You only have your wishful thinking.

"the veil is removed in CHRIST... whenever a person turns to THE LORD the veil is taken away. THE LORD is the Spirit... we do not preach ourselves but JESUS CHRIST AS LORD."

It is obvious who the Lord is here. But since you don't like it, you are trying to find ways to nullify the Scripture for the sake of your tradition.

[MrAtang14]

@TheTrinityDelusion the Father will send ANOTHER Comforter...

[TheTrinityDelusion]

@MrAtang14

Read Romans 7 about how the Roman Christians died with CHRIST so that they could belong to ANOTHER--> Him who was raised from the dead.

[aTang14]

Well, you should remember that the Holy Spirit drove Jesus to the wilderness to be tempted by the devil. So now Jesus has become the one who drove Himself? Also, friend, you picked the Roman verse out of context! Romans 7 said that we are no longer under law, but belong to Christ, we are dead to the law! that we should serve in newness of spirit, and not in the oldness of letter! NOT from the Old Jesus to Holy Spirit, that's absurd! Jesus Christ is the same yesterday, today, and forever!

[MrAtang14]

@TheTrinityDelusion Again, you say "the Triune God is the Spirit?" Yahweh does not mean 3 persons. Yahweh is Father. Yahweh is Son. Yahweh is Spirit. There's One Yahweh. Isaiah said, "mine eyes saw the Great King, Jehovah of Hosts." Jesus said, "No man has seen the Father." Who did Isaiah see?

[TheTrinityDelusion]

@MrAtang14

This response is incoherent. You can't say the Triune God is the Spirit even in Trinitarianism.... although you did attempt to do that in your other post.

[aTang14]

@TheTrinityDelusion Triune God is NOT the Spirit, you misunderstood me. What I'm saying is YHWH is the Spirit. I lend this phrase from A.W. Tozer to illustrate my point. I'm talking about that "ancient Godhead, expressing Himself as Father, expressing Himself as Son, expressing Himself as Holy Spirit" The LORD is the Spirit. Jesus Christ is the LORD. That makes no contradiction, so your argument is not valid.

[neekothesecond]

Jesus saith unto her, Touch me not; for I am not yet ascended to my Father: but go to my brethren, and say unto them, I ascend unto my Father, and your Father; and to my God, and your God.

"I ascend unto my Father, and ((your)) Father; and to my God, and ((your)) God."

[neekothesecond]

trinity doctrine keeps people from calling upon the name of the LORD JESUS and thus shuts up the kingdom to men.

[neekothesecond]

AND THESE THREE ARE ONE:

FATHER IS THE WORD IS THE HOLY GHOST

ONE AND THE SAME INDEED.

[neekothesecond]

JESUS CHRIST=LORD AND CHRIST

[neekothesecond]

"I AND MY FATHER ARE ONE"=JESUS CHRIST=FATHER AND SON

[xllxFusionxllx]

@neekothesecond When Jesus said that, he meant in collaboration with the father. If you read the next verse, he states that he AND the disciples are one with him as well. So does that mean the disciples are together with Jesus as one god? No. Also note, Jesus did not mention the holy spirit when he said that. 

[neekothesecond]

@xllxFusionxllx

"I am the vine, ye are the branches: He that abideth in me, and I in him, the same bringeth forth much fruit: for without me ye can do nothing."

"I am crucified with Christ: nevertheless I live; yet not I, but Christ liveth in me: and the life which I now live in the flesh I live by the faith of the Son of God, who loved me, and gave himself for me."

[neekothesecond]

@xllxFusionxllx

Matthew 10:24

The disciple is not above his master, nor the servant above his lord.

[neekothesecond]

@xllxFusionxllx Philippians 2:13

King James Version (KJV) 13For it is God which worketh in you both to will and to do of his good pleasure.

[D8tzmanu]

@neekothesecond the trinity is false my friend look up roman religions the romans belive in gods have 2 to 3faces sound familiar when did the trinity come into affect when constintine took power a roman leader he started teaching the trinity next to the bible look up what iv said wiki it your trinity is false an in no way inbodies what the bible says

[zorin85]

"The Bible does NOT teach the doctrine of the trinity.

NEITHER the word trinity itself, NOR such language as one in three, three in one, one essence or substance or three persons, is biblical language.

The language of the doctrine is the language of the ancient Church, taken NOT from the Bible but from classical Greek philosophy [Shirley C. Guthrie, Jr., Christian Doctrine, p 92]."

Verdict: Trinity was derived from the PAGAN Greeks. Neither Jesus nor his disciples had anything to do with it

[Mcstroke57]

Praise the Lord !

[adavecdave]

in a kingdom, there is only one king, there is no other above that king.

if Jesus is the King, and we know He is, then He is equal to Yahweh.

for Jesus is the King in the Kingdom of God

[TheTrinityDelusion]

@adavecdave You might want to read over 1 Chronicles 29:20-23 to see how King David and Solomon sat on the throne of YAHWEH.

Also note how the assembly worshiped (proskyneo) both YAHWEH and the King.

[adavecdave]

@TheTrinityDelusion indeed, all that you say is true, however, david and solomon, and many others sat on the Lords throne on earth, but only one sat with Yahweh on the throne in His kingdom in heaven....Jesus.

at the Fathers right hand, not above Him, not below him...equal with Him.

if you worship Yahweh, then worship Jesus exactly the same way, Yahweh commands it.

[TheTrinityDelusion]

@adavecdave

Yes, the men David and Solomon sat on the throne of YAHWEH ruling the nation of Israel. And so all Israel bowed down and worshiped YAHWEH and the King. (1 Chronicles 29:20-23).

Now, a man became superior to angels & sits on the throne of YAHWEH ruling all the nations, & all heaven and earth.

To sit at the right hand of God means you are exercising God's authority over heaven and earth. And that is what this man Jesus is doing, just as David and Solomon were doing over .

[adavecdave]

@TheTrinityDelusion still, there is none ever, save for Jesus, that has the same authority as Yahweh,

again, in John 5, Yahweh says worsip Jesus just the same as you would worship Him.

Jesus is equal to God.

[TheTrinityDelusion]

@adavecdave

Obviously you didn't get the point at 1 Chronciles 29:20-23 where David is worshiped just as God is worshiped.

[adavecdave]

@TheTrinityDelusion that doesn't say that anywhere, you're making stuff up to fit your desire to tear Jesus down, repent and give Jesus praise, the same as you would Yahweh.

[TheTrinityDelusion]

@adavecdave

Ah yeah it does say that. Let me guess. You are using a Trinitarian translation that decided to translate a certain word differently in this case.

[adavecdave]

@TheTrinityDelusion it does say that???? show me.

and i use the one and only k.j.v.

also the greek interlinear bible.

cant wait to see your method of manipulation.

[TheTrinityDelusion]

@adavecdave

You mean the KJV which the fourth century Christians used?

[adavecdave]

@TheTrinityDelusion yes, the word the way God wanted us to have it. do enlighten me, what version do you use???

[TheTrinityDelusion]

@adavecdave

So God wanted you to have an English language KJV but he didn't care too much about the folks before the 17th century.

When I want to know what a writer intended, I look at the language he wrote it in.

[adavecdave]

@TheTrinityDelusion 17th century??? they are long gone, we are here and now, proclaim Jesus,

so, what bible version do you read???

[TheTrinityDelusion]

@adavecdave

I already told you what version. I read the version which has the words in the original languages not a translation. I would rather read the Greek Paul actually wrote than a translation by men.

[victoriamorris71]

allah means? oak in hebrew use the word god or he who exist since that is his name he who exists

[fgtuntr7j564ebh754nm]

72. Surely, they have disbelieved who say: "Allâh is the Messiah [‘Îsâ (Jesus)], son of Maryam (Mary)." But the Messiah [‘Îsâ (Jesus)] said: "O Children of Israel! Worship Allâh, my Lord and your Lord." Verily, whosoever sets up partners (in worship) with Allâh, then Allâh has forbidden Paradise to him, and the Fire will be his abode. And for the Zâlimûn (polytheists and wrong-doers) there are no helpers.

73. Surely, disbelievers are those who said:

Continue

[fgtuntr7j564ebh754nm]

@fgtuntr7j564ebh754nm

"Allâh is the third of the three (in a Trinity)." But there is no Ilâh (god) (none who has the right to be worshipped) but One Ilâh (God -Allâh). And if they cease not from what they say, verily, a painful torment will befall on the disbelievers among them.

74. Will they not turn with repentance to Allâh and ask His Forgiveness? For Allâh is Oft-Forgiving, Most Merciful.

75. The Messiah [‘Îsâ (Jesus)], son of Maryam (Mary), was no more than a Messenger;

Continue

[fgtuntr7j564ebh754nm]

@fgtuntr7j564ebh754nm

many were the Messengers that passed away before him. His mother [Maryam (Mary)] was a Siddîqah [i.e. she believed in the Words of Allâh and His Books (see Verse 66:12)]. They both used to eat food (as any other human being, while Allâh does not eat). Look how We make the Ayât (proofs, evidence, verses, lessons, signs, revelations, etc.) clear to them; yet look how they are deluded away (from the truth).

Continue

[fgtuntr7j564ebh754nm]

@fgtuntr7j564ebh754nm

76. Say (O Muhammad صلى الله عليه وسلم to mankind): "How do you worship besides Allâh something which has no power either to harm or benefit you? But it is Allâh Who is the All-Hearer, All-Knower."

77. Say (O Muhammad صلى الله عليه وسلم): "O people of the Scripture (Jews and Christians)! Exceed not the limits in your religion (by believing in something) other than the truth, and do not follow the vain desires of people who went astray before and who misled many,

Continue

[fgtuntr7j564ebh754nm]

@fgtuntr7j564ebh754nm and strayed (themselves) from the Right Path."

The Koran, chapter 5.

[epic103]

That the GOD of our Lord Jesus Christ, the Father of glory, may give unto you the spirit of wisdom and revelation in the knowledge of him. Epshesians.1:17

Taking in knowledge of who?? The answer = GOD, who is our Father!!! Taking in knowledge of the Father!!! The Father is the source!!!

Compare to John.17:3, this is eternal life that they know You, the only true GOD, and Jesus Christ the One that You sent forth!!!

The only true GOD is the Father(Yahweh, LORD)

[Rogokofats]

The idea of “three beings in one God” did not originate with the New Testament Church. Neither Christ nor the original twelve apostles taught it. Nor did Paul. The New Catholic Encyclopedia readily admits this, and as much as declares openly that the idea was derived from outside the boundary of Scripture! Missler is cut of from God through sin.The truth was in modern times revealed after being suppressed for 1900 years 100 X 19 year Hebrew time cycles only through Mr Herbert W Armstrong

[BigBodySlam]

The trinity is the gods of Hinduism Brahma , Vishnu and Shiva .

The fact that the false churches such as the baptist , methodist , catholics etc

say god is 3 when scriptures say god is one and the fact that they turn the one god of creation into 3 gods and name the god of the bible after the Hindu gods called the trinity sums it up for me . any church that teaches anything remotely similar to the Hindu trinity stay far away from it as you can because the trinity is demonic in nature

[BigBodySlam]

matthew 1:18 Now the birth of Jesus Christ was on this wise: When as his mother Mary was espoused to Joseph, before they came together, she was found with child of the Holy Ghost.

if the trinity is true than we have a problem, because the father is not the father of jesus the holy ghost is the father.

[majinish]

@BigBodySlam No, the Father is the father. People read Matthew 1:18 wrong a lot and it's understandable. It says Mary was found with child -of- the Holy Ghost, not by the Holy Ghost. In other words the Holy Ghost was with Christ and was also there to comfort Mary. If it said "by the Holy Ghost" then the Holy Ghost would be the father of Jesus. Whenever Jesus mentioned his father he said Father with the capital F indicated his father is God the Father.

[TheTrinityDelusion]

@majinish

1. Read Matthew 1:20.

2. There were no such things as "capital F's" when the New Testament books were written.

[BigBodySlam]

@majinish The words god the father , god the son or god the holy ghost is never used once in the bible. nor is the word trinity these words are un-biblical and man made. You're trying to invent 3 gods when the bible says there is only 1 god. Also you are trying to explain matthew 1:18 away and turn into your own doctrine. Lets apply the settings to a man. mary was found with child of bob ?

so bob is not the father huh ? But the father was his father ? makes perfect sense -_-

[majinish]

@BigBodySlam I'm not even a trinitarian.

[BigBodySlam]

@majinish Isaiah 9:6 says jesus is the everlasting father. matthew 23:9 And call no man your father upon the earth: for one is your Father, which is in heaven. so it is a sin to call any man on earth father. jesus was on earth and was called the everlasting father. well if jesus is not the father than he is a lair and a sinner for claiming he is the everlasting father. So if he is not the father and he is a liar and a sinner than no man has salvation and we are all going to hell

[majinish]

@BigBodySlam Right, Jesus said to only call the Father in Heaven Father. Jesus was on earth when he said that. Since he wasn't in Heaven at the time he wasn't referring to himself. Even the false "trinity" at least teaches Jesus is NOT the Father and that the Father is not Jesus and neither are the Holy Ghost/Spirit.

[jathomas901]

God- There are no other Gods before me, or after me. Thomas- My Lord and my God!

So theres one God, Christ made the law, came down as a son in the likeness of a man even in his relationship with God. And fulfilled the law :) Its simple.

[fionnlagh1]

This is a wonderful and clear explanation. I am a one-God, oneness believer and have been trying to find a way to explain the fallacy of the Trinitarian doctrine to my Trinitarian friends and family. The fullness of the Godhead dwells in Jesus Christ Bodily. Colossians 2:9

[TheTrinityDelusion]

@apopyalips

Both the Father and the risen Son share the same divine nature, the Holy Spirit.

[Ni1234ck]

PART I

WELL I WAS A JW FOR ALMOST 25 YEARS. AROUND THE SAME TIME WHEN YOU STARTED TO QUESTION TRINITY I STARTED TO QUESTION “UNITARISM”.

TO THIS DAY I DO NOT KNOW WHEATER TRINTY IS TURE OR NOT.

UNLIKE YOU I HAVE CHECKED ALL OCCURENCES OF THE WORD “GHOST “ AND OR “HOLY GHOST” IN THE NT YEARS AGO.THE FOLLOWING VERSES DIFFER BETWEEN THE HG AND JC. OR MAKES IT AT LEAST VERY DIFFUCLT FOR YOU. IF YOU CAN RECONCILE THEM WITH YOUR THEORY HG=JC THAN WEL DONE!!!

[Ni1234ck]

PART 2

"- And I will pray the Father, and he shall give you ANOTHER Comforter...

(John 14:16)

-"And whosoever speaketh a word against the Son of man, it shall be forgiven him: but whosoever speaketh against the Holy Ghost, it shall not be forgiven him"(Mat 12:32)

-...the Lord Jesus Christ's sake, and for the love of the Spirit, that ye strive together with me in your prayers to God for me (Rom 15:30)

-"How God anointed Jesus of Nazareth with the Holy Ghost....".

(Acts 10:38)



[pretoshohmoofc]

You are mistaken. We Trinitarians DO believe that Christ has a spirit. His spirit (the Spirit of God) is contained within his physical body which is in heaven right now.

Rom 8:9

"But if anyone does not have the Spirit of Christ...."

[TheTrinityDelusion]

@pretoshohmoofc

You don't appear to understand Trinitarian doctrine. "The Spirit" in 2 Cor 3:17 verse is the Holy Spirit. That is made plain by the preceding context. In Trinity doctrine Christ is necessarily NOT the Holy Spirit. This is basic. Also, the Spirit of Christ at Romans 8:9 is the Holy Spirit. That also is made plain by the context.

[pretoshohmoofc]

@TheTrinityDelusion

In Rom 8:9 in Greek Christ is being called χριστου "christou". ου [pronounced-ou] in greek is possesion. Meaning, it belongs to him. That's why a literal translation is "of Christ".

In the same verse it says, "if God's spirit truly dwells in you..." The same thing is happening in the Greek. πνευμα θε*ου*. Spirit *OF* God. It's God's spirit.

[TheTrinityDelusion]

@pretoshohmoofc

In Rom 8:9 in Greek Christ is being called χριστου "christou". ου [pronounced-ou] in greek is possesion. Meaning, it belongs to him. That's why a literal translation is "of Christ".

Read Acts 2:33.

[pretoshohmoofc]

@TheTrinityDelusion Yes, you are insisting that we believe that Christ does not have a spirit. Which to us is untrue. And Acts 2:33 does not change anything. ou in Greek is possession . It is Christ's spirit.

Eph 3:14-19 tells us that if you bow your knee to the Father; in the power of the Holy Spirit; and have Christ dwell in your heart; in love of Christ, then,..you may be filled up with the ***fullness of God***. All three are at work within the Christian.

[pretoshohmoofc]

@TheTrinityDelusion Also, do you worship the Holy Spirit?

[pretoshohmoofc]

@TheTrinityDelusion You are confusing the three personhoods within the Trinity with the Spirit of God. The Trinity is like Time. Time is Past, Present and Future. Past is not Present, and Present is not Future, But all make up one thing. Time. So I can compare Time to being the spirit of God. And Past; Present and Future being the essense that makes up this Time.

So again, you are mistaken.

[TheTrinityDelusion]

@pretoshohmoofc

You have obviously missed the point completely. The very POINT of this video is that Paul is saying that Jesus is the Holy Spirit which cannot be true in Trinitarian doctrine because it would be saying the second person is the third person.

As for explaining how three can be one this is no big mystery but common to our everyday experience, 3 persons/1 trio, 3 feet/1 yard, 11 players/1 team. That is not the problem with the Trinity.

[pretoshohmoofc]

@TheTrinityDelusion Can you please circle in this verse where Paul is saying that Christ IS the Holy spirit? I can't seem to find it.

I need to see the words, "Christ IS THE HOLY SPRIT". In those words.

[TheTrinityDelusion]

@pretoshohmoofc

I need to see the words, "Christ IS THE HOLY SPRIT". In those words.

Why? You don't seem to need to see the words "God is a three person being" in the Scriptures? See the video again. It is quite clear who Paul has in mind when he says "the Lord is the Spirit." It does seem, however, that you prefer denial.

[pretoshohmoofc]

@TheTrinityDelusion All you had to say was, No, I can't show you the quote.

[pretoshohmoofc]

@TheTrinityDelusion 3 persons/1 trio, 3 feet

Is that how I explained the Trintiy to you? Jesus is only 1/3 of God? No! You are pulling a strawman on me. I said that the Trinity is like Time. Past is fully Time. Past is 100% Time.

YOU SAID the Trinity is 3 feet etc...

[TheTrinityDelusion]

@pretoshohmoofc

|Is that how I explained the Trintiy to you? Jesus is only 1/3 of God? No! You are pulling a strawman on me. I said that the Trinity is like Time. Past is fully Time. Past is 100% Time."

one person out of three is 1/3 of three persons. Perhaps you didn't realize this elementary thing yet.

[pretoshohmoofc]

@TheTrinityDelusion

All you arians are the same. YOU CAN'T argue the Trinity based on how WE define it. You always strawman it, in order to refute it.

This is PROOF that you are a false teacher, because only false teachers teach falsely.

[TheTrinityDelusion]

@pretoshohmoofc

I'm not an Arian. Not even close.

Why is it that you demand that 2 Cor 3:17 say "Christ is the Spirit" for you to recognize that the Lord of this verse is being identified as the Spirit? Everyone reading your posts knows why. You are making excuses for yourself. You don't need the Bible to say "God is a three person being" do you?

You have yet to address the points made in my video or identify "the Lord" of 2 Cor 3:17.

Sorry, but I have no patience for Trolls.

[pretoshohmoofc]

@TheTrinityDelusion Paul has been emphasizing that Christ is the key to the OT. Here he re-emphasizes that truth by saying, Now the Lord is the Spirit. The context suggests that the Lord is the spirit of the OT just as "the testimony of Jesus is the spirit of prophecy" (Rev 19:10). All types and shadows of the OT find their fulfillment in christ. Where the Spirit of the Lord is, there is liberty means that whereever Jesus Chrsit is recongnized as Lord or Jehovah, there is liberty. That's all.

[pretoshohmoofc]

@TheTrinityDelusion Again I will ask.

Do you worship the Holy Spirit?

[TheTrinityDelusion]

@pretoshohmoofc

Why do you say "Again" when this is the first time you have asked?

Do I worship a separate third person from the Father and Son called "the Holy Spirit"? NO.

Do I worship the Holy God the Father who is Holy Spirit? Absolutely.

[pretoshohmoofc]

@TheTrinityDelusion

John 4:20

God is spirit, and those who worship him must worship him in spirit and truth.

If you worship the Father who is Holy Spirit, then you worship HS.

[TheTrinityDelusion]

@pretoshohmoofc

It does not say to worship the HS but to worship the Father IN Spirit. But yes, to worship the Father is to worship the Spirit because the Father is Spirit.  And so is the risen Christ.

[pretoshohmoofc]

@TheTrinityDelusion "Why do you say "Again" when this is the first time you have asked?"

Look over your own Comments please. hint, Look at 1hour ago. Then, look up 2 hours ago.

[TheTrinityDelusion]

@pretoshohmoofc

"Why do you say "Again" when this is the first time you have asked?"

Look over your own Comments please. hint, Look at 1hour ago. Then, look up 2 hours ago."

For some reason they were not appearing in my inbox.

[Mojo1982]

The Trinity is nonsense, God is ONE entity: all powerful, all knowing, and all seeing!

[Mencel89]

so your saying that jesus became the Holy Spirit? if so, is your view that WE will become the HS as well?

[TheTrinityDelusion]

@Mencel89

Yes, we will become Holy Spirit. That's the point. The children of God will inherit the divine nature of our God and Father. As John says, we will be like him for we shall see him as he is. Or as Peter says, we are partakers of the divine nature. This is also why Paul says the Spirit now in the children of God is a deposit /pledge of what is to come.

Also 1 Cor 15:45, life-giving Spirit with 15:49.

To be truly a son of God means inheriting his divine nature of Spirit.

[dunklaw]

@TheTrinityDelusion "we will become Holy Spirit" - not at all - you are missing the point.

"The last Adam became a life-giving spirit." the last adam became a life giving action or way of doing things.

(2 Corinthians 12:18) . . .We walked in the same spirit, did we not? In the same footsteps, did we not?

[TheTrinityDelusion]

@dunklaw

Spirit is more than just the action itself. For example, God IS spirit and angels are spirit. This speaks to more than just action. It speaks to essence and being, what something is. IN the same way, spirit is contrasted with flesh in the Bible.

[dunklaw]

@TheTrinityDelusion No, we do not have to look at the statement this way God is action in just the same way that God is love.

God is action & we must worship him with action and truth.

[TheTrinityDelusion]

@dunklaw

So let me be clear. Are you saying that "action" is EQUIVALENT to "spirit"? (no more, no less). Or are you saying spirit is God's energy (a slightly different idea)? Please expand and clarify.  I do believe this is a very valid point you are making.

[dunklaw]

@TheTrinityDelusion The NWT gives a good litteral translation of (Isaiah 40:26) Due to the abundance of dynamic energy, he also being vigorous in power, not one [of them] is missing.

This dynamic energy (continuously moving) - spirit is the emanation from god that makes all things move.

The word can also be used in its more human physical sense - BREATH (ruach - a wind that follows a prescribed path).

[dunklaw]

@TheTrinityDelusion This also leads to a new understanding of (Matthew 28:19) in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the holy spirit.

We can understand this from it Hebraic origins as 'in the name of YHWH and his foremost son and their special actions'.

[TheTrinityDelusion]

@dunklaw The primary idea, however, of Matthew 28:19 most certainly has to be about authority. "All AUTHORITY has been given to me.... go THEREFORE.... baptize in the NAME...." This type of language indicates what servants do in their Lord's name... under the authority of their Lord... they do things "in his name" or under his authority. The Spirit bestows this authority as given to the Son (Ac 2:33) and authorizing and empowering the disciples for this work. But yes, I agree it is implied.

[dunklaw]

@TheTrinityDelusion Also for Matthew 28:19 the 'name' should also be translated 'character' - in the character of YHWH his foremost son and their special actions.

[TheTrinityDelusion]

@dunklaw

I agree it mainly includes the notion of "character" and reputation but I think it means more and this would be limiting the Hebraic concept of "the name" especially in this case where it clearly is emphasizing authority. In other words, to baptized "in the name" necessarily implies a servant doing things which represent the charcter of his master or lord but that does in itself speak to authority - verse 18.

[dunklaw]

@TheTrinityDelusion Names as we understand them today would be meaningless to Ancient Hebrew speakers. The name was to denote the character - note Abraham's name change. YHWH itself means 'he exists' or as we would understand it - eternal.

Mat 28:18 And so, after approaching, Jesus spoke to them, by saying, "All authority (or: Every right) is (or: was) given to Me within heaven and upon the earth!

watch?v=51h8ssppxn0 (parts 1 & 2)

[dunklaw]

If you treat spirit as an entity you are really going to tie yourself up in knots. Where Jesus is quoted as saying "he" remember that Hebrew and Aramaic have no neuter.

Spirit put simply is action. Holy spirit is special action.

(James 2:26) Indeed, as the body without action is dead, so also faith without works (action) is dead.

[TheTrinityDelusion]

@dunklaw

Not as you think. Let's talk about my flesh as if it is an "it." It is indeed an "IT" isn't it? IT hungers, IT gets tired, IT bleeds, IT hurts when hit with an object, etc. But this IT is ME. I hunger, I get tired, I bleed, I hurt when hit.

Same idea with the Spirit. As my flesh is me, God's Holy Spirit is HIM. And the risen Jesus now bodily shares in that divine nature of God, that is, the Holy Spirit.  That's what verses like Col 2:9 and 1 Cor 15:45 and 2 Cor 3:17 are about.

[TheTrinityDelusion]

@TheTrinityDelusion

And yes, Spirit, as Spirit relates to us earthly humans, is about action. Romans 8:14. That is what Christianity is all about: Function. Unrisen Jesus was a son in FUNCTION but now in BEING. But the reward from God for this function, walking in the Spirit, is being. We become the food we eat (cf. Jn 4:34; 6:57), new divine natures in the resurrection which Paul describes as "life-giving Spirit" or more literally "life-making Spirit."

[dunklaw]

@TheTrinityDelusion (John 14:26) But the helper, the holy spirit (special action), which the Father will send in my name (character), that one will teach YOU all things and bring back to YOUR minds all the things I told YOU.

When looking at quotations from Jesus we must look at them from a Hebraic perspective.

(Psalm 51:11) Do not throw me away from before your face; And your holy spirit O do not take away from me.

[TheTrinityDelusion]

@dunklaw

You seem to be suggesting that spirit is equivalent to energy and not the source of energy.

[dunklaw]

@TheTrinityDelusion When the term is spirit or spirit of Jesus or anyone else this is their independent actions. When using the term holy spirit this is where it is recognised that god intervenes with an action - like the speaking in tongues or something else beyond the norm.