It is quite sad that most ministries wrap the Scriptures around their own vain philosophies, instead of wrapping their philosophies around the Scriptures. Our beloved brother Paul warned Timothy that in latter times, including today, the people would not endure sound doctrine, but after their own desires would appoint teachers that would satisfy their tickling ears. Churches use worldly methods to bring unbelievers in, and play games instead of preach God's word, that is so sad indeed.
He contradicted himself a little. (paraphrased) He said if you were a believer or newly saved this church is not for you. . .then he goes to say we save you and train you up to proclaim the gospel.
The fundamental thing in a church is that it focuses on what pleases God, not the unbeliever. Its base and foundation is the Word of God. Never EVER is the church supposed to be shaped and formed around the unbeliever. The church is the gathering of believers for the preaching and teaching of the Word of God, fellowship, communion and prayer together (cf. Acts 2:42). In no way, shape, or form am I trying to say that evangelism is not important but the church IS for the believer!
To be fair to Pastor Steven (PS I do not, nor have I ever attended Elevation Church) He has changed his view on this subject very much. And If I am not mistaken this sermon was from several years ago. check him out in The Elephant Room. He responds to this question. I am not a huge Furtick fan but I do believe that he is a man of God. He has a lot of growing up to do spiritually but he is listening and being mentored by the right people, like James MacDonald and Mark Driscoll. Praying for him.
He claims that the church is no longer for you even if you got daved last week. So whgat was the point of Paul writing to the church to encourage them as a body of believers??? Doesn't make sense he just will end up with a huge church of people who will never grow spritiually as they are always being bullied to recruitng more soldiers for the army.
It's really easy to take a soundbite of someone and tear it to pieces. People do it with just about every bible teacher out there. I'm reformed and I know what he is saying because I watched the WHOLE sermon. He is not saying doctrine and salvation are exclusive. He's saying doctrine without a heart to see lost people came to Christ is sickening and a perversion of the Gospel.
Eph 4:11-16. And he gave the apostles, the prophets, the evangelists, the shepherds and teachers, to equip the saints for the work of ministry, for building up the body of Christ, until we all attain to the unity of the faith and of the knowledge of the Son of God, to mature manhood, to the measure of the stature of the fullness of Christ, so that we may no longer be children, tossed to and fro by the waves and carried about by every wind of doctrine, by human cunning...
@elohimito As it is written, Mark 2:17 ---> On hearing this, Jesus said to them, "It is not the healthy who need a doctor, but the sick. I have not come to call the righteous, but sinners." I don't think he's kicking out people who already believe, I think this is misunderstood because why would he invite unbelievers just to turn them away, contradicting the very purpose of calling unbelievers. I think he i saying he wants HIS SPECIFIC church to be a starting point for sinners.
Both lost people and saved people need the gospel exactly the same. The difference is that saved people know they need the gospel. The church is not just for lost people. The church is to preach the gospel to EVERYONE (christian and non-christian). The shephard is supposed to lead the sheep.
Elevation does so many great things but so many people strongly dislike Pastor Steven. I really with he wouldn't say things just to be shocking.
I agree the wolves are becoming more and more cunning and clever. I pray God will draw out His true children out of the leadership of wolves in sheep's clothing. The most dramatic separation will soon be happening (the rapture) and I pray it will be the wake up call many need. God have mercy....
elevation is some serious cult stuff...this furtick punk and his high and mighty garbage makes me sick to my stomach. he could not be any further from the truth behind our spirituality and conscious paradigm(s)...but then again that goes for any establishment religion. religion = slavery. the extent to the bigger picture and our conscious existances is much grander and liberating than any of this fear-driven hocus pocus.
Steven Furtick's church is bursting at the seems....you may say that numbers don't matter, but when he has a solid amount of people coming to know Christ in a weekly service...then those numbers do matter....I'd rather attend a church where 75-80% of weekend attendance consist of the unchurched...homosexuals....thieves....etc than 100% christian. The church shouldn't only exist to feed believers...but to do what Christ did...seek and save that which is lost.
PEOPLE, please listen. He was NOT saying that you shouldn't be in church once you become saved. He was SIMPLY saying that this specific church (elevation) was meant to save unbelievers so they can go and build themselves in another church. SO many people now have a bad taste in their mouth about Steven Furtick because of this video BECAUSE it is so misunderstood.
Wait, don't we have to understand the doctrine of grace to be saved? Isn't the first step to knowing you need a savior acknowledging that you are a sinner and don't deserve his love? maybe I'm misunderstanding this guy?
Anyone who wants a biblical critique on this guy, go to Pirate Christian Radio and do a search for Stephen Furtick. It's clear, Furtick is a false teacher.
God said to GO into ALL the world to preach the gospel. Yes meditating on the gospel is important as well, but what's the point of meditating on it all day, everyday and just keep it to ourselves? The main purpose is to preach the good news to the world, and what is the good news? the good news is to cloth the naked, feed the hunger.What's the point of sharing the word of god to someone who is hungry? A clear cut example,did jesus preach to the people who were sick? or did he just healed them?
The only reason that people like Steve can stand up there and say the things he does is because of people like John Calvin. We would all be Catholics brother...what is interesting is that Steve has to tell everybody the mission, instead of just doing the mission. That sounds EXACTLY like what he is against with the "doctrines of grace" people...just saying.
He hates Christians who study the Bible. He won't study doctrine because he's got FALSE doctrine that he hides by pretending he's got a nobler purpose.
We are "the church" elevation is a church. There is a huge difference. " Oh I go to elevation church" hahaha who cares. I go to church. I dont need a church that when you walk in it seems like it is a business. I mean you have the carolina panthers and other major league sports teams going to elevation. 10% of a 1,000,000 player is $100,000 tithing. It's not being a hater, Jesus didn't need a million dollar building to preach in.
Now how can his church encourage,help,heal or be of use if they aren't taught the whole counsel of God?He doesn't want a church,which is to feed and nourish Gods people,he wants evangelistic services.
Steven Furtick needs to re-evaluate what Ecclesiology is in biblical terms. Church should not be his evangelism program. Church is designed to feed the sheep (repentant and trusting in Jesus ppl) to then, go into all the world and preach the gospel. Christians come to church to learn more about Jesus (Theology) instead of legalism (what to do). I pray Steven understands the authorial intent in Scripture and how God would love to use him more appropriately!
@Eric0873 I would need to see these comments in a wider context. I agree, that, like a nation at war focuses all its might on waging war, the church should focus all it's might on saving the lost. But, just like a nation at war still needs schools and hospitals and factories to win the war, a church needs teaching, fellowship, Worship and ministry to enable it to evangelise. So YES all those things are important BUT they all need to ultimately feed the churche's "war effort".
@stu1002 Your war analogy is very appropriate, however I think that Furtick has his priorities out of order. Church is for the purpose of building up the saints; to learn to love Jesus more and be prepared to go out and tell others about Him. Sinners are welcome, but its not specifically for them. Furtick seems to want his church to be his draw card for the Christian faith. When was the last time you saw a Sargent request the war to come to him? There's training and learning, then TO war.
Look for the legalism coming! Why?Other than what the dude looks like-basically he personifies what it means to be an Independent Fundamental Baptist Pastor. Problem comes when a self-reliance that is never taught in the scriptures other than being equated with the sin nature-this pastor will fall.I am not saying I want him to fall. I do not.When what you do becomes more important than who you are-this is where self-righteousness becomes your righteousness but not the righteousness from Christ
@Persilver40 if you want to follow this goober so you can live your life then do it. But calling me a pharisee? Do you really even know the full context of making that statement? Obviously you do not! All the best you little Furtcikite
@kowsky761 Where will they be in ten years? Jim Jones had a crowd. I think at least for me, it is more important(if you have that many people) to have 500 people who can understamnd the gospel and are being sanctified by the blood of Christ and his word. Please understand one thing-this is not from someone who never saw anything happen in life but just seems those more concerned with the bible and growing the people they have will be more fruitful.
Notice that he says "then we train them up so that others can know Jesus" so obviously he realizes that they're is a place for discipleship in the church. I think he means that primary purpose of the church is to reach the lost. Look at Jesus. He didn't have seminars with the disciples on how to reach the lost but there were times where He taught them specifically. However, many times He led by example. They learned as everyone else did. I think this is the general idea here...
The Church is for the sheep, not to entertain the goats. The goats are in mind though, that is why the Gospel should be the focal point of service so that they can hear Truth in order to be born again. I understand where Pastor Furtick is coming from, and in no way do i think he is malicious, but he needs to get the priorities straight on what is supposed to happen in the church.
Since when is the church about getting people to come to hear the Gospel. I thought "church" was to train Christians to know what Jesus said. He likes to brag about people making commitments to Christ. People can not know who is saved. Its not about getting people to make a commitment, its about getting people to seek Christ!!
This is not the purpose of the church. Actually Elevation Church beliefs on their website is correct. Which is it Steven? What your beliefs say you believe about the church, or what you preach to itch ears?
it sadens me to see so many negitive comments when Elevation is reaching out to the lost and leading them to Christ. if you are a christian it is your job to reach out the lost. so many of you have been consumed by Satan by saying these hateful words and not caring about the lost people in our world. Elevation not only wants to reach them but we want to reach you too! Elevation exists so that people far from God may be filled with life in Christ.
@lilhorton22 I can agree to apoint but the main emphasis is to love the Lord your God with all your soul, strength, and mind-well,that iswhat the bible teaches
wow. "hey steven is there any u think u can stereo type all calvinists in three sentances and throw them under a large bus while neglecting all Bible and logic........thanks a bunch!"
Guys, I think you misunderstand what pastor steven want's to point out from the time you have been saved you have already a calling to reach out to people he quote that "your in the army now" it means you are already part of the family to save other people and help other people. It doesn't mean you are not welcome, be a follower of Christ we are to called to honor God and make Disciples.
sooooo exactly what is church for then? then why are you, A CHRISTIAN PASTOR doing in church if you shouldnt attend once your saved?! as a christian, i think this is ridiculous. church is meant to be a community of BELIEVERS impacting the world. If there are no believers in the church to guide the new believers, what are you doing?
@joelb1 You`re wrong. As a Christian you have the responsibility to reveal Jesus` glory to the world. (the unbelievers are part of this world and Christ died for them too)
He said "if you are a Christian than this church is not for you" WHAT? This guy doesnt even know who the church is for. Elevation Church is like a lot of churches today. THEY ENTERTAIN THE GOATS WHILE THE SHEEP GOES STARVING!
@chasecatledge "He said "if you are a Christian than this church is not for you" WHAT? This guy doesnt even know who the church is for. Elevation Church is like a lot of churches today. THEY ENTERTAIN THE GOATS WHILE THE SHEEP GOES STARVING!"
They preach so that people get saved so that they can stick them in a small group and disciple others? Really? The problem with that is that they are still babes in Christ and need to be on milk and yet you want them to start to disciple others? They need to be brought up in the Word first and then start eating meat but the problem is that Steven Furtick and Perry Noble and others like them have a teaching that is about as deep as glass of water.
Would everyone get off his back? You guys are saying he doesn't know the purpose of the church at the same time you are tearing down your brother in Christ. Send him an e-mail if he is wrong, just quit gossiping about him. Build the kingdom, don't tear it down.
Haha seems like pastor got a few sunday-only Christians a bit uncomfortable. did Jesus have the disciples sitting around reading the laws of the Old Testament? No, they were out changing lives and influencing the world. SEEK AND SAVE THAT WHICH IS LOST!
For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine; but after their own lusts shall they heap to themselves teachers, having itching ears; And they shall turn away their ears from the truth, and shall be turned unto fables........ the purpose driven/willow creek organizations are doing nothing more than perverting the Gospel. Pray for them as you run from it.
how dare you say such terrible things about Pastor Steven. elevation is now almost 5 years old and i have been there for about 2 years. and let me tell you nothing has been more life changing than what pastor steven had said. he only "throws around numbers" at our church to get people fired up about God, not to show off.
it really amazes me how all these people commenting think they have the right to JUDGE what Steve is saying. There is a lot of merit to what he is saying. There is a BIG difference between "Church" and being in a Congregation. We grow through study and support of the church body, yes. But Church is not about sitting and soaking up teaching like a sponge, and I believe that's kinda what he is saying. "You're saved now, so get up and do something with it. Don't sit there and just listen."
@bjbrady147 The true church is like a wedding banquet. You don't tell the "Bride" to stop stuffing her face, and that she is going to get fat, and then tell her to get her fat but over to the soup kitchen and get to work. This man is speaking of a worldly "club", not the "wedding banquet" of the supernatural "true bride of Christ". The church is for the edification of the saints; "parakaleō" in the Greek. See 1 Thess 5.
Really, you should only care about the gospel, but it seems you don't. It's the place we should dwell, for the entire Christian life, as righteous sinners and adopted sons/daughters of God. I'm sorry, but this is off - how will your congregation learn to truly dwell in God's presence and to be utterly dependent on Him and His grace and mercy and love without the support of the church body? How will they learn to live by faith in the works of Christ producing tangible fruit of the Spirit?
Have you ever attend Elevation Church? My guess is NO. You listen to less than 2 minutes of this sermon and you know what Elevation Church and Pastor Steven is all about. That's very Shallow. To the thousands that attend this church, we know what it's about. Elevation fires you up to live, work and help for Jesus. It's a great place and I’m proud to call it home.
@DadsLife2 The problem is, after watching this video, I don't have the least bit of interest in attending this "church." I'm hearing that from more and more people. This guy has a screw loose, won't disclose how much money he's taking from people like you, and well, God bless you.
@efh0888 because your faith is your OWN! if you rely on man for your faith then you will ultimately fail! get in a group of believers and seek and save! it is not the church's job to keep you happy... how dare you be so selfish and self-centered.
He was saying this specific church was made to bring in lost souls and then they should find a home church that studies the word. I think many people watched this video and misunderstood it completely.
@Kierstinjade123 NO. I totally disagree that's what he's saying. He is saying that ALL true church exists for the purpose of saving the lost. As someone once said "The Church is the only organisation which exists solely and expressly for the needs of it's NON-members". What he is saying is, that once you become a member..the church is no longer FOR you, it's not ABOUT you..it's FOR the lost. "Ask not what our church can do for you...but what you can do for your church.."
So, furtick doesn't know the purpose of Christ's Church, his attitude is unGodly to say the least, and he throws around 'numbers' to justify a failed seeker method of creating false converts. He needs to put his effort into being Biblically correct rather than culturally relevant.
When we are faced with the numbers, we are faced with the truth. Its accountability. We all have it on our jobs in some way or another, and we should have it in our churches. If what we're doing is working to bring others to christ, then yeah...we should go with it. Its time out for blaming the holy spirit for our laziness, lack of creativity and shortcomings.
@Digitizeddragon23 Furticks church, which started in early 2006, adopted a governance system that has Furtick answering not to a group of lay members, as in many churches but to a board of five out-of-town pastors he chose. These friends and mentors, who lead big churches like Elevation, set his salary, which Furtick won't divulge... Why? It is to profit from the blind..... pray for them.
And yet their church is growing and lives are getting save. Why should he not get paid? You don't think that he just walks on stage and preaches do you? Ministers get it rough! and leading a church that size is just about a full time job. Pay your tithes and God blessed you. The church is OBVIOUSLY using their money to further the body of christ.
@Digitizeddragon23 1)Because a seeker church is growing in no way means it is Biblical and people are actually getting saved.Mormanism and muslims are growing but in no way are Biblical.2)furtick not only 'preaches', he also sells his services as a pawn to the willow creek non-Biblical organization.3)You really need to study the tithe as it relates or does not relate to the Christian today. Today's prosperity preachers distort the tithe topic to enrich themselves. Christ was the final sacrifice.
@titus2one When Jesus' followers grew guess what? it was the RELIGIOUS people that got mad. The tithe is about bringing your 10th to the HOUSE (church). Nowhere in the scriptures does it tell YOU a member what to do with that money or decide where it goes. The bible says to bring it to the house. Find a scripture against that. Only in church world do people do people want their leader to have nothing and drain every ounce of what they have. My God always wins when my intentions are pure.
@Digitizeddragon23 To respond,1)when Christ confronted people with the true state of their depravity in sin, the power of God and His spirit left the ones whom He chose to be saved.Yes,the religious establishment were worried that their postions of power was threatened.Today, your seeker type church knows not God but has heaped upon themselves teachers of their own desires that give you what you want and its not God.2)The OT tithe doesnt apply today 3)God wins no matter what your intentions are.
@titus2one u cnt judg harts How does telling people to give, love, forego lust and evil behavior, fixin marriages and setting up free counseling, feedin the needy with food drives self serving? They prch Lts b honest, God is happy with a lot of people hearing His word , and that makes some people nervous. rmbr th 3000 n 1 day? Jesus didn't say not to tithe and commended people for giv MORE. woman and her last penny, tax collector giving half of his possess. rebuke guy that wud not giv all he
OK all of you spiritual geniuses educated in the Word....How about you encourage this young preacher to keep his zeal and fire, while at the same time he matures in his abilities of leading Gods people. It is obvious he has gifts in encouragement and evangelism which some of YOU can glean from him. As the body of Christ, which you guys seem to have figured out already, we should be SHARING our gifts and building our brothers and sisters weaknesses. Stay strong young brother!!!!
@TheGunShow777 You are outlining the problem. Biblically and spiritually immature people should not be pastoring a church. From your argument, furtick needs to spend 10 to 20 years studying the Word of God then, if led, he could pastor a flock instead of misleading them.
@berean1129 So answer this one question: Did Timothy spend 10-20 years studying "the word" before he began pastoring? Lets keep in mind there were no Bibles in the day of Timothy, Timothy was a young man, and Paul's emphasis towards Timothy was that he ignore people like the ones posting here and simply preach Christ.
So in your argument Paul should have told Timothy to quit pastoring and grow up. Am I hearing this correctly?
@TheGunShow777 Very simple... The Holy Spirit was with Paul and Timothy. They strived for Holiness not worldliness. The Furtick's and Perry Noble's are the equivalent of the Howard Sterns of entertainment. If Furtick wont preach the Gospel, what is the point.... other than making himself alot of money at the expense of gullible goats. that simply want to be entertained.
@berean1129 So from watching a few videos of this man on Youtube you now know what every single sermon the man ever taught was about? You guys are a trip. How the heck do you know he doesnt preach the gospel?
@TheGunShow777 For a time is coming(it is here) when people will no longer listen to sound and wholesome teaching. They will follow their own desires and will look for teachers who will tell them whatever their itching ears want to hear-2TIM 4:3. God bless...
If your itching ears are telling you to get to work for God instead of going to a church that is stagnant in growth , but comfortable in reaching no new souls then...that's good...right?
Paul and Timothy went out and sat with sinners in jails and converted people that would make our most violent offenders look like kids in time out. Is that the mission of your church? If such people were worth going after hundreds of years ago, them maybe Jesus still wants us to reach them now. IFurtick and Perry are basically going back to no nonesense preaching similar to that found in the bible. Still...Iike how you back up your ideas with scripture!
Dude, you are full of pride and error. I can read all these anger and resentment in your heart Steven. Great advise, best thing I heard was when he said "Elevation Church" is not for you" hahaha
His church exists to glorify the god of numbers, to lift up the name of the church of self, and to downfall of this man, he does it all in the name of Christ. This is NOT the true church that Christ established, this is Simon of Acts 8 that rapes the truth and purpose of God's church to build himself as one who is great. How much greater the wrath shall be on them that lead the sheep blindly. Emotionalism does NOT equal repentance in faith whom only Christ can grant
The purpose of church is to teach the whole Word of God in season and out and spread the Gospel. What the Church is not about is building empires and tickling peoples ears.
lv this! surrendered my life to Christ because of what God is doing at this church over a year ago and now in another city witnessing to others and seeing God's kingdom multiplied! my life has never been the same! talk about kingdom multiplication and people falling crazy in love with Jesus! God u r sooooo very good! thank u for obedient, radical believers, who live radically to see ur name lifted high! U R SO HOLY GOD!
@angiethe5 The problem, Angie, is that Furtick ignores the purpose of the church - to make disciples by teaching them to observe all that Jesus has commanded - it isn't just a weekly evangelistic crusade. Plus, the immature, arrogant attitude expressed in this video clip is NOT the characteristic of a Biblical pastor.God can do great things even through people's sin (think of Joseph's brothers!), but that doesn't make it right. Find a biblical church to mature, and continue to share the Gospel
The biblical church was run by the pharisees...go look those guys up! I think they killed Jesus. Be careful when you say things like immature and arrogant. We can't judge people so hastily based on one two or even five examples of them. We must pray for and encourage them. The way that the world is now, we as christians can't afford to turn on one another.
I think this guy needs to learn from REAL pastors like John MacArthur, John Piper, and Paul Washer.
He is out of line (not to mention just plain wrong) in what he is saying. Perhaps he should read and study the Bible more instead of shooting his mouth off about things he clearly does not understand.
Mr. Furtick needs to be a part of that congregation and leave the pastoral, preaching, and teaching duties to someone who knows what God says about His Church.
this message was a complete slap in the face to the precious bride of Christ, whom Jesus died for. Human beings souls aren't cattle. ppl don't need to line up at the auction to get their salvation card so they can join the army and then starve on an anemic , watered down diet of postmodernism.
you can't manipulate ppl with emotional, theatrical displays into "choosing Jesus". It's God and God alone that chooses whom He will have mercy upon.none of us deserve God's love. we should be pitied for our wretchedness without Christ, not pitied because we are so "lost and empty". it's good to feel a sense of guilt and repentance.. then you know God is changing your heart to love what He loves and hate what He hates.
The American Church as a whole is broken. So much division, so much jealousy, so much corruption, so much apathy-- We have gone from a church fixed on Christ and unified to do kingdom work together, to becoming a business. The Church has lost their focus. Now instead of fighting to gather the lost and seek the hurting, we are fighting over petty doctrine differences and figuring out ways to raise attendance and make more money. Churches like Elevation give hope that the Church can be restored.
I know this video was originally posted by "alittleleven" and gained much commentary. The intention of the original post was to serve as an example of "wrong" teaching or the churchy word: "apostate." It is truly a shame that this message is so edited and chopped up. Those who hate this type of church need to wake up to the real message BEHIND the message and that is "Church" the way we have always done it is NOT reaching the lost. We need God's timeless doctrine communicated a timely way.
MY LIFE HAS CHANGED AND I WILL NEVER BE THE SAME...CONTINUE TO CHANGE LIVES THROUGH ELEVATION FATHER! DO IT FOR YOUR NAME'S SAKE!
IN THE NAME OF JESUS "No weapon that is formed against you will prosper; And every tongue that accuses you in judgment you will condemn. This is the heritage of the servants of the LORD, And their vindication is from Me," declares the LORD.
This church is truly a tragedy...It's the logical result of modern evangelicalism's tendency to compartmentalize the gospel...as if it is for unbelievers only...or if discipleship has nothing to do with the gospel.
If all you do is listen to someone with the purpose of finding something wrong, then you almost always will. Even if there is nothing wrong, you will pick out on sentence, take it out of context, and only quote that to make your "point" Last time I checked, satan did the same thing to Jesus when tempting Him. He twisted a statement from the Bible to suit his purpose. When you take 1 or 2 statements out of context from a pastor, you do the same thing.
I'm wondering if any of the people trashing him have actually listened to other sermons? Or did they just click on a video where someone cut out the one part they didn't like, and then think they're informed? I grew up under many teachers who taught sound doctrine, and I have yet to find anything wrong with his messages. Yes, he's blunt, but he's honest. And if you ACTUALLY listen to what he's saying, you'll understand that it's not twisted or wrong.
The man basically admits his "church" isn't even a church. lol
I guess Elevation has thrown out the Bible too. Discipleship and evangelism is what you spend the rest of the week doing, not Sunday morning. Church is for the body of Christ to come together in worship of their God and to learn from the Word so that they will be equipped for the week ahead to go back out into the world. Mr. Furtick misses the whole point, I guess because he never bothered with "all that Bible stuff."
I understand where he's coming from, however, i would use some notes, because he worded some things that do contradict the Bible and the process of discipleship.
To those who condemn I have to say I understand your skepticism, however, you can not make assumptions based on one video, I challenge you to attend and see what is taught on a weekly basis. We ARE called to be saved then lead the lost to be saved as well. This church fights to save the lost and rocks out to God! What better way to reach the lost today than by creating a energetic and dynamic venue? We are the church, not the building. Hope to see ya there someday.
>To those who condemn I have to say I understand your skepticism, however, you can not make assumptions based on one video, I challenge you to attend and see what is taught on a weekly basis
We do, check out Chris Rosebrough's fightingforthefaith. We listen to these jokers all the time, it's the same rot week after week. WORK WORK WORK to please God, no sabbath rest, do the Holy Spirit's work for him,no, can't actually preach the gospel! Gotta work!(oh we might MENTION the WORD 'gospel.')
I don't understand any of you people commenting on this! There is nothing wrong with what he is saying, it's a little extreme but it is straight forward and to the point. And jesus did the same thing. we need to educate ourselves and tell the lost about the wonderful grace of god. And everyone should learn from that example.
There is plenty wrong with it. He's bought into the idea that the church is for unbelievers. NO, the church is for the building up of the body, the encouragement, edification, and education of believers so they CAN go out in their everyday lives and be Christ's witnesses.
What he's saying is the equivalent of sending toddlers to boot camp. "oh so you were just born, now you're in the army! Drop and give me 20!" Give me a break.
The church is the people. Not the building or the staff.
It is much more possible to build up your body, encouragement, edification, and education through Christ, God, and the virtue of the Holy Spirit daily than it is to for an hour and thirty minutes once a week.
This guy is a complete hypocrite!!! He calls other people pharisees while displaying some of the most self-righteuous behavior I have ever seen. Unbelievable. Do not be decived by these wannabe rock-star psudeo-pastors. If you really want to know Christ then go to a church that preaches Christ crucified. Furtick may find it passe' but it was good ebough for Paul. I'll go with Paul on this. The pastor may not be as hip as Furtick but he'll preach the truth.
Seek and save the lost. But why are they lost and what are they saved from?? Like it or not mr psuedo wannabe rock-star, doctrine matters. That's great 500 people come to Jesus, and then you tell them not come back. That's great discipleship.
Raewhitlock, Great point! I'd guess that he hasn't thought about it. It's a sad state of affairs out there... and I'd pray that God sends the reformation we so desperately need.
The church is not just some salvation factory, the church is supposed grow in godliness toward Godly sanctification.
This man just admitted that his church and its members are NOT growing in the things of God. His church is not for Christians? I figured that out watching this video, it is not for anyone seeking the Christ either.
ONE of the functions of the church is to preach the gospel. It is not the only function and you are operating like the nose that doesn't need the head to survive.
The idea that we should give our money to one man's dream so we can throw a big party every weekend to deliver an unoffensive gospel is not biblical. The church is a place where believers gather, care for one another, pray for boldness then go into their world and lead people to Christ through the power of the Holy Spirit. Many pastors rob people of Christian adventure and leave them thinking that we should give to his dream and let him be the soul winner rock star for Jesus.
It think it is important to note that this is a selfish vain venture this pastor has set out on... he has salvation all wrong, HE HAS NO BEARING ON WHETHER ANYONE GETS SAVED. It is like the wind, God has picked his elect and we must preach to the whole world so that God may draw those elect close to him. God will raise up the rocks to do his will if he won't. He is arrogant and honestly to absorbed on what he thinks he can do instead of what God will do.
amazing reply. i'm in the midst of struggling at my church home which has become of the same "dream" process as this. we were just told today that we aren't there to be fed and it's not about Christians. at all .almost our entire church has left except for a few and the new people who are pouring in. there is no talk of sin only grace and love and grace and more love.. and the love movement. my soul is aching and i don't know what to do anymore
also make sure we understand the real definition of church..the devil likes to use people he knows he can get you with..and alot of the times he can use other believers to distract and wear us down..but dont let him win bc the word says all we will ever need to know to fight this spiritual battle
i think this is exactly what is wrong with christianity.People are too worried about what the preacher is sayin wrong that what he is saying right. He knows you have to love on everyone but hes saying that church isnt for people who think that they are just "okay" with what im doin.its a place for lost people to come and be loved on..so instead of arguing why dont we just follow God. are we not supposed to be ONE body of christ on earth fr one purpose!?! MARK 15:15.this is what life is all about
I think he really has the right idea but he should maybe tweak his message a little bit. We can't know Christ as we should if we remain on the sidelines and never put our faith into action. That is the message of the Book of James. Discipleship that doesn't have action at it's center is poor discipleship and he's right that too many Christians are selfish (growing fat) with their faith.
Tweak his message?? He has no message. He talks about saving the lost, but he doesn't say what we are called to save them from. And there is a reason he doesn't do that. It's because then he would have to talk about sin and justification. And that would force him to move beyons superficial gimmicks and rock bands. Better to reach 10 people with the truth than 100 people with gimmicks and bad rock music.
this philosophy is a reflection of the Reformers and the frontier revivalists who turned the Church into a "preaching station" who's ONLY purpose is to "reach the lost" ----God's Eternal Purpose for the true Body/Family of God goes far beyond "reaching the lost by human efforts and programs"
ususguy & coyne1988: I think you might be misunderstanding what he means. When he says "this church isn't for you" that didn't mean he wants his members to get out of the door and leave. He means that the aim of the church is to bring lost people to Christ. He didn't renouce when Jesus told Peter to feed his sheep, he actually hit that he said his mission was to train the people for the army of God in order to reach the lost. The chruch still does disciplship, they simply aim torwards the lost
This is church of the devil.Listen to this heritic-"if you know Jesus this church is not for you".Did not Jesus say feed my lambs or when Mary was sitting listening to the Lord
Jesus was very pleased with her more than Martha?Hm we better wake up.
usisguy, well said. If this Elevation "Church" is not for folks like myself who know Jesus, then I'll be sure not to attend, thank you. We should love the down-and-out, that is true, we should also love those who are the opposite as well. Just note that humble and poor in spirit doesnt always refer to the "down-&-out" crowd, in fact some down-&-out ppl are among the proud whom God resists. Does this guy honestly think that one who desires Bible-preaching is against evangelism and serving?
It is quite sad that most ministries wrap the Scriptures around their own vain philosophies, instead of wrapping their philosophies around the Scriptures. Our beloved brother Paul warned Timothy that in latter times, including today, the people would not endure sound doctrine, but after their own desires would appoint teachers that would satisfy their tickling ears. Churches use worldly methods to bring unbelievers in, and play games instead of preach God's word, that is so sad indeed.
underground0331 1 week ago
He contradicted himself a little. (paraphrased) He said if you were a believer or newly saved this church is not for you. . .then he goes to say we save you and train you up to proclaim the gospel.
SterlingTate 3 weeks ago
The fundamental thing in a church is that it focuses on what pleases God, not the unbeliever. Its base and foundation is the Word of God. Never EVER is the church supposed to be shaped and formed around the unbeliever. The church is the gathering of believers for the preaching and teaching of the Word of God, fellowship, communion and prayer together (cf. Acts 2:42). In no way, shape, or form am I trying to say that evangelism is not important but the church IS for the believer!
sonylox9 1 month ago
To be fair to Pastor Steven (PS I do not, nor have I ever attended Elevation Church) He has changed his view on this subject very much. And If I am not mistaken this sermon was from several years ago. check him out in The Elephant Room. He responds to this question. I am not a huge Furtick fan but I do believe that he is a man of God. He has a lot of growing up to do spiritually but he is listening and being mentored by the right people, like James MacDonald and Mark Driscoll. Praying for him.
matthewturneradams 1 month ago
He claims that the church is no longer for you even if you got daved last week. So whgat was the point of Paul writing to the church to encourage them as a body of believers??? Doesn't make sense he just will end up with a huge church of people who will never grow spritiually as they are always being bullied to recruitng more soldiers for the army.
greenbelter123 1 month ago
Jesus came to save the unsaved :)
hermionegranger1516 1 month ago
just a numbers game. Let's get people in but screw em once they're in. Forget decipleship that counts for nothing.
greenbelter123 1 month ago
@PENTECOSTALheresy I don't have to imagine, they spoke even harder words.
NailedDeadRisen87 1 month ago
@gtrjunky you say that cuz uve never been there. I'll pray for you hahaha ;)
219Carlisle 1 month ago
Too bad they don't actually preach Jesus there.
gtrjunky 1 month ago
It's really easy to take a soundbite of someone and tear it to pieces. People do it with just about every bible teacher out there. I'm reformed and I know what he is saying because I watched the WHOLE sermon. He is not saying doctrine and salvation are exclusive. He's saying doctrine without a heart to see lost people came to Christ is sickening and a perversion of the Gospel.
steelle77 1 month ago
Eph 4:11-16. And he gave the apostles, the prophets, the evangelists, the shepherds and teachers, to equip the saints for the work of ministry, for building up the body of Christ, until we all attain to the unity of the faith and of the knowledge of the Son of God, to mature manhood, to the measure of the stature of the fullness of Christ, so that we may no longer be children, tossed to and fro by the waves and carried about by every wind of doctrine, by human cunning...
bobabc1234567890 1 month ago
Ouch. Kicking the Church out of the church, and inviting unbelievers in...where's the Scripture to back that one up?
elohimito 2 months ago
@elohimito As it is written, Mark 2:17 ---> On hearing this, Jesus said to them, "It is not the healthy who need a doctor, but the sick. I have not come to call the righteous, but sinners." I don't think he's kicking out people who already believe, I think this is misunderstood because why would he invite unbelievers just to turn them away, contradicting the very purpose of calling unbelievers. I think he i saying he wants HIS SPECIFIC church to be a starting point for sinners.
PuertoRicanTakeOva 2 months ago
Both lost people and saved people need the gospel exactly the same. The difference is that saved people know they need the gospel. The church is not just for lost people. The church is to preach the gospel to EVERYONE (christian and non-christian). The shephard is supposed to lead the sheep.
Elevation does so many great things but so many people strongly dislike Pastor Steven. I really with he wouldn't say things just to be shocking.
briankayaker1 2 months ago
if only we had one of these churches in every city,,wow,imagine
Arkad412 2 months ago
I agree the wolves are becoming more and more cunning and clever. I pray God will draw out His true children out of the leadership of wolves in sheep's clothing. The most dramatic separation will soon be happening (the rapture) and I pray it will be the wake up call many need. God have mercy....
stop08it 3 months ago
elevation is some serious cult stuff...this furtick punk and his high and mighty garbage makes me sick to my stomach. he could not be any further from the truth behind our spirituality and conscious paradigm(s)...but then again that goes for any establishment religion. religion = slavery. the extent to the bigger picture and our conscious existances is much grander and liberating than any of this fear-driven hocus pocus.
joeyyb 3 months ago
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Steven Furtick's church is bursting at the seems....you may say that numbers don't matter, but when he has a solid amount of people coming to know Christ in a weekly service...then those numbers do matter....I'd rather attend a church where 75-80% of weekend attendance consist of the unchurched...homosexuals....thieves....etc than 100% christian. The church shouldn't only exist to feed believers...but to do what Christ did...seek and save that which is lost.
ryanc100 3 months ago
PEOPLE, please listen. He was NOT saying that you shouldn't be in church once you become saved. He was SIMPLY saying that this specific church (elevation) was meant to save unbelievers so they can go and build themselves in another church. SO many people now have a bad taste in their mouth about Steven Furtick because of this video BECAUSE it is so misunderstood.
Kierstinjade123 4 months ago
Wait, don't we have to understand the doctrine of grace to be saved? Isn't the first step to knowing you need a savior acknowledging that you are a sinner and don't deserve his love? maybe I'm misunderstanding this guy?
Marvive42 4 months ago
Anyone who wants a biblical critique on this guy, go to Pirate Christian Radio and do a search for Stephen Furtick. It's clear, Furtick is a false teacher.
rorshakks 4 months ago
God said to GO into ALL the world to preach the gospel. Yes meditating on the gospel is important as well, but what's the point of meditating on it all day, everyday and just keep it to ourselves? The main purpose is to preach the good news to the world, and what is the good news? the good news is to cloth the naked, feed the hunger.What's the point of sharing the word of god to someone who is hungry? A clear cut example,did jesus preach to the people who were sick? or did he just healed them?
floomsy1994 4 months ago
thank you, i think every believer shoule hear this! :)
floomsy1994 4 months ago
The only reason that people like Steve can stand up there and say the things he does is because of people like John Calvin. We would all be Catholics brother...what is interesting is that Steve has to tell everybody the mission, instead of just doing the mission. That sounds EXACTLY like what he is against with the "doctrines of grace" people...just saying.
chadlovesjesus 5 months ago
The wolves are getting clever. Imagine Jesus or Paul talking like this.
PENTECOSTALheresy 5 months ago 5
@PENTECOSTALheresy They did talk like this.
skandahle 6 days ago
He's slandering those who apparently have corrected him in the past
PENTECOSTALheresy 5 months ago
He hates Christians who study the Bible. He won't study doctrine because he's got FALSE doctrine that he hides by pretending he's got a nobler purpose.
PENTECOSTALheresy 5 months ago
We are "the church" elevation is a church. There is a huge difference. " Oh I go to elevation church" hahaha who cares. I go to church. I dont need a church that when you walk in it seems like it is a business. I mean you have the carolina panthers and other major league sports teams going to elevation. 10% of a 1,000,000 player is $100,000 tithing. It's not being a hater, Jesus didn't need a million dollar building to preach in.
triadcontractor1 5 months ago
Now how can his church encourage,help,heal or be of use if they aren't taught the whole counsel of God?He doesn't want a church,which is to feed and nourish Gods people,he wants evangelistic services.
Chino1207 5 months ago
This guy has no idea what a church is.
FAITHandLOGIC 5 months ago 2
Steven Furtick needs to re-evaluate what Ecclesiology is in biblical terms. Church should not be his evangelism program. Church is designed to feed the sheep (repentant and trusting in Jesus ppl) to then, go into all the world and preach the gospel. Christians come to church to learn more about Jesus (Theology) instead of legalism (what to do). I pray Steven understands the authorial intent in Scripture and how God would love to use him more appropriately!
Eric0873 6 months ago
@Eric0873 I would need to see these comments in a wider context. I agree, that, like a nation at war focuses all its might on waging war, the church should focus all it's might on saving the lost. But, just like a nation at war still needs schools and hospitals and factories to win the war, a church needs teaching, fellowship, Worship and ministry to enable it to evangelise. So YES all those things are important BUT they all need to ultimately feed the churche's "war effort".
stu1002 2 months ago
@stu1002 Your war analogy is very appropriate, however I think that Furtick has his priorities out of order. Church is for the purpose of building up the saints; to learn to love Jesus more and be prepared to go out and tell others about Him. Sinners are welcome, but its not specifically for them. Furtick seems to want his church to be his draw card for the Christian faith. When was the last time you saw a Sargent request the war to come to him? There's training and learning, then TO war.
Eric0873 2 months ago 2
Look for the legalism coming! Why?Other than what the dude looks like-basically he personifies what it means to be an Independent Fundamental Baptist Pastor. Problem comes when a self-reliance that is never taught in the scriptures other than being equated with the sin nature-this pastor will fall.I am not saying I want him to fall. I do not.When what you do becomes more important than who you are-this is where self-righteousness becomes your righteousness but not the righteousness from Christ
daveme7 6 months ago
@Persilver40 if you want to follow this goober so you can live your life then do it. But calling me a pharisee? Do you really even know the full context of making that statement? Obviously you do not! All the best you little Furtcikite
kowsky761 7 months ago
@kowsky761 Where will they be in ten years? Jim Jones had a crowd. I think at least for me, it is more important(if you have that many people) to have 500 people who can understamnd the gospel and are being sanctified by the blood of Christ and his word. Please understand one thing-this is not from someone who never saw anything happen in life but just seems those more concerned with the bible and growing the people they have will be more fruitful.
daveme7 6 months ago
Notice that he says "then we train them up so that others can know Jesus" so obviously he realizes that they're is a place for discipleship in the church. I think he means that primary purpose of the church is to reach the lost. Look at Jesus. He didn't have seminars with the disciples on how to reach the lost but there were times where He taught them specifically. However, many times He led by example. They learned as everyone else did. I think this is the general idea here...
MrAandbvideos 7 months ago
Why can't the church just exist for everybody?
friendjonny 7 months ago
The Church is for the sheep, not to entertain the goats. The goats are in mind though, that is why the Gospel should be the focal point of service so that they can hear Truth in order to be born again. I understand where Pastor Furtick is coming from, and in no way do i think he is malicious, but he needs to get the priorities straight on what is supposed to happen in the church.
txrich1974 7 months ago
Since when is the church about getting people to come to hear the Gospel. I thought "church" was to train Christians to know what Jesus said. He likes to brag about people making commitments to Christ. People can not know who is saved. Its not about getting people to make a commitment, its about getting people to seek Christ!!
ez33watchman 8 months ago
This is not the purpose of the church. Actually Elevation Church beliefs on their website is correct. Which is it Steven? What your beliefs say you believe about the church, or what you preach to itch ears?
ez33watchman 9 months ago
Jesus said, if you follow me i will make you fishers of men. if you are not fishing then you are not following
cbrianclark 9 months ago 5
it sadens me to see so many negitive comments when Elevation is reaching out to the lost and leading them to Christ. if you are a christian it is your job to reach out the lost. so many of you have been consumed by Satan by saying these hateful words and not caring about the lost people in our world. Elevation not only wants to reach them but we want to reach you too! Elevation exists so that people far from God may be filled with life in Christ.
lilhorton22 10 months ago 2
@lilhorton22 I can agree to apoint but the main emphasis is to love the Lord your God with all your soul, strength, and mind-well,that iswhat the bible teaches
daveme7 6 months ago
wow. "hey steven is there any u think u can stereo type all calvinists in three sentances and throw them under a large bus while neglecting all Bible and logic........thanks a bunch!"
historyismystory 10 months ago
@historyismystory Wow, your statement makes Christians look like idiots.
Persilver40 7 months ago
God's heart is more about discipleship than mere conversion.
joshuajduffy 10 months ago
Guys, I think you misunderstand what pastor steven want's to point out from the time you have been saved you have already a calling to reach out to people he quote that "your in the army now" it means you are already part of the family to save other people and help other people. It doesn't mean you are not welcome, be a follower of Christ we are to called to honor God and make Disciples.
nigros 10 months ago 2
sooooo exactly what is church for then? then why are you, A CHRISTIAN PASTOR doing in church if you shouldnt attend once your saved?! as a christian, i think this is ridiculous. church is meant to be a community of BELIEVERS impacting the world. If there are no believers in the church to guide the new believers, what are you doing?
byonse12 10 months ago
It's sad that so many pastors today do not even understand the biblical principles behind the church. The church is for believers..not unbelievers!
joelb1 10 months ago
@joelb1 You`re wrong. As a Christian you have the responsibility to reveal Jesus` glory to the world. (the unbelievers are part of this world and Christ died for them too)
DeeaCatalina 8 months ago
Douche.
hagios9 10 months ago
Sorry dude you are wrong. The church is for believers period.
joeforHistruth 10 months ago 2
Again another instance of him being a douche bag
kowsky761 11 months ago
@kowsky761 Again, another one being what he was preaching about. Hello front row pharisee.
Persilver40 7 months ago
He said "if you are a Christian than this church is not for you" WHAT? This guy doesnt even know who the church is for. Elevation Church is like a lot of churches today. THEY ENTERTAIN THE GOATS WHILE THE SHEEP GOES STARVING!
chasecatledge 11 months ago
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@chasecatledge "He said "if you are a Christian than this church is not for you" WHAT? This guy doesnt even know who the church is for. Elevation Church is like a lot of churches today. THEY ENTERTAIN THE GOATS WHILE THE SHEEP GOES STARVING!"
You got that right!
joeforHistruth 10 months ago
They preach so that people get saved so that they can stick them in a small group and disciple others? Really? The problem with that is that they are still babes in Christ and need to be on milk and yet you want them to start to disciple others? They need to be brought up in the Word first and then start eating meat but the problem is that Steven Furtick and Perry Noble and others like them have a teaching that is about as deep as glass of water.
swingman24 11 months ago
Would everyone get off his back? You guys are saying he doesn't know the purpose of the church at the same time you are tearing down your brother in Christ. Send him an e-mail if he is wrong, just quit gossiping about him. Build the kingdom, don't tear it down.
BozemanBuckJC82 1 year ago 2
Haha seems like pastor got a few sunday-only Christians a bit uncomfortable. did Jesus have the disciples sitting around reading the laws of the Old Testament? No, they were out changing lives and influencing the world. SEEK AND SAVE THAT WHICH IS LOST!
jackpocalypse 1 year ago 2
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For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine; but after their own lusts shall they heap to themselves teachers, having itching ears; And they shall turn away their ears from the truth, and shall be turned unto fables........ the purpose driven/willow creek organizations are doing nothing more than perverting the Gospel. Pray for them as you run from it.
titus2one 1 year ago
I like how they all love and know and IDOLIZE Furtick, but if you asked them about the Bible, very few would know anything about it.
laureliscool 1 year ago
how dare you say such terrible things about Pastor Steven. elevation is now almost 5 years old and i have been there for about 2 years. and let me tell you nothing has been more life changing than what pastor steven had said. he only "throws around numbers" at our church to get people fired up about God, not to show off.
cheer4life2182 1 year ago
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daveincsa 1 year ago
it really amazes me how all these people commenting think they have the right to JUDGE what Steve is saying. There is a lot of merit to what he is saying. There is a BIG difference between "Church" and being in a Congregation. We grow through study and support of the church body, yes. But Church is not about sitting and soaking up teaching like a sponge, and I believe that's kinda what he is saying. "You're saved now, so get up and do something with it. Don't sit there and just listen."
bjbrady147 1 year ago
@bjbrady147 The true church is like a wedding banquet. You don't tell the "Bride" to stop stuffing her face, and that she is going to get fat, and then tell her to get her fat but over to the soup kitchen and get to work. This man is speaking of a worldly "club", not the "wedding banquet" of the supernatural "true bride of Christ". The church is for the edification of the saints; "parakaleō" in the Greek. See 1 Thess 5.
timeless9you 1 year ago
Really, you should only care about the gospel, but it seems you don't. It's the place we should dwell, for the entire Christian life, as righteous sinners and adopted sons/daughters of God. I'm sorry, but this is off - how will your congregation learn to truly dwell in God's presence and to be utterly dependent on Him and His grace and mercy and love without the support of the church body? How will they learn to live by faith in the works of Christ producing tangible fruit of the Spirit?
efh0888 1 year ago 4
@efh0888
Have you ever attend Elevation Church? My guess is NO. You listen to less than 2 minutes of this sermon and you know what Elevation Church and Pastor Steven is all about. That's very Shallow. To the thousands that attend this church, we know what it's about. Elevation fires you up to live, work and help for Jesus. It's a great place and I’m proud to call it home.
DadsLife2 8 months ago 2
@DadsLife2 You said it right, "I'm proud" Thats the problem
davidjulie 6 months ago
@DadsLife2 The problem is, after watching this video, I don't have the least bit of interest in attending this "church." I'm hearing that from more and more people. This guy has a screw loose, won't disclose how much money he's taking from people like you, and well, God bless you.
ffhd1clt 6 months ago
@efh0888 because your faith is your OWN! if you rely on man for your faith then you will ultimately fail! get in a group of believers and seek and save! it is not the church's job to keep you happy... how dare you be so selfish and self-centered.
kingghostBASSWEIGHT 6 months ago
@efh0888
He was saying this specific church was made to bring in lost souls and then they should find a home church that studies the word. I think many people watched this video and misunderstood it completely.
Kierstinjade123 4 months ago
@Kierstinjade123 NO. I totally disagree that's what he's saying. He is saying that ALL true church exists for the purpose of saving the lost. As someone once said "The Church is the only organisation which exists solely and expressly for the needs of it's NON-members". What he is saying is, that once you become a member..the church is no longer FOR you, it's not ABOUT you..it's FOR the lost. "Ask not what our church can do for you...but what you can do for your church.."
stu1002 2 months ago
@stu1002
oh, yeah i agree :P my bad.
Kierstinjade123 2 months ago
@Kierstinjade123 lol. That's ok...sorry I shouted at you!!!!! :) oops.
stu1002 2 months ago
So, furtick doesn't know the purpose of Christ's Church, his attitude is unGodly to say the least, and he throws around 'numbers' to justify a failed seeker method of creating false converts. He needs to put his effort into being Biblically correct rather than culturally relevant.
berean1129 1 year ago
@berean1129
When we are faced with the numbers, we are faced with the truth. Its accountability. We all have it on our jobs in some way or another, and we should have it in our churches. If what we're doing is working to bring others to christ, then yeah...we should go with it. Its time out for blaming the holy spirit for our laziness, lack of creativity and shortcomings.
Digitizeddragon23 1 year ago
@Digitizeddragon23 Furticks church, which started in early 2006, adopted a governance system that has Furtick answering not to a group of lay members, as in many churches but to a board of five out-of-town pastors he chose. These friends and mentors, who lead big churches like Elevation, set his salary, which Furtick won't divulge... Why? It is to profit from the blind..... pray for them.
titus2one 1 year ago
@titus2one
And yet their church is growing and lives are getting save. Why should he not get paid? You don't think that he just walks on stage and preaches do you? Ministers get it rough! and leading a church that size is just about a full time job. Pay your tithes and God blessed you. The church is OBVIOUSLY using their money to further the body of christ.
Digitizeddragon23 7 months ago
@Digitizeddragon23 1)Because a seeker church is growing in no way means it is Biblical and people are actually getting saved.Mormanism and muslims are growing but in no way are Biblical.2)furtick not only 'preaches', he also sells his services as a pawn to the willow creek non-Biblical organization.3)You really need to study the tithe as it relates or does not relate to the Christian today. Today's prosperity preachers distort the tithe topic to enrich themselves. Christ was the final sacrifice.
titus2one 7 months ago
@titus2one When Jesus' followers grew guess what? it was the RELIGIOUS people that got mad. The tithe is about bringing your 10th to the HOUSE (church). Nowhere in the scriptures does it tell YOU a member what to do with that money or decide where it goes. The bible says to bring it to the house. Find a scripture against that. Only in church world do people do people want their leader to have nothing and drain every ounce of what they have. My God always wins when my intentions are pure.
Digitizeddragon23 7 months ago
@Digitizeddragon23 To respond,1)when Christ confronted people with the true state of their depravity in sin, the power of God and His spirit left the ones whom He chose to be saved.Yes,the religious establishment were worried that their postions of power was threatened.Today, your seeker type church knows not God but has heaped upon themselves teachers of their own desires that give you what you want and its not God.2)The OT tithe doesnt apply today 3)God wins no matter what your intentions are.
titus2one 6 months ago 2
@titus2one u cnt judg harts How does telling people to give, love, forego lust and evil behavior, fixin marriages and setting up free counseling, feedin the needy with food drives self serving? They prch Lts b honest, God is happy with a lot of people hearing His word , and that makes some people nervous. rmbr th 3000 n 1 day? Jesus didn't say not to tithe and commended people for giv MORE. woman and her last penny, tax collector giving half of his possess. rebuke guy that wud not giv all he
Digitizeddragon23 6 months ago
OK all of you spiritual geniuses educated in the Word....How about you encourage this young preacher to keep his zeal and fire, while at the same time he matures in his abilities of leading Gods people. It is obvious he has gifts in encouragement and evangelism which some of YOU can glean from him. As the body of Christ, which you guys seem to have figured out already, we should be SHARING our gifts and building our brothers and sisters weaknesses. Stay strong young brother!!!!
TheGunShow777 1 year ago
@TheGunShow777 YES!!!!!!!!!!!!!
daronjgeorge 1 year ago
@TheGunShow777 You are outlining the problem. Biblically and spiritually immature people should not be pastoring a church. From your argument, furtick needs to spend 10 to 20 years studying the Word of God then, if led, he could pastor a flock instead of misleading them.
berean1129 1 year ago
@berean1129 So answer this one question: Did Timothy spend 10-20 years studying "the word" before he began pastoring? Lets keep in mind there were no Bibles in the day of Timothy, Timothy was a young man, and Paul's emphasis towards Timothy was that he ignore people like the ones posting here and simply preach Christ.
So in your argument Paul should have told Timothy to quit pastoring and grow up. Am I hearing this correctly?
TheGunShow777 1 year ago
@TheGunShow777 Very simple... The Holy Spirit was with Paul and Timothy. They strived for Holiness not worldliness. The Furtick's and Perry Noble's are the equivalent of the Howard Sterns of entertainment. If Furtick wont preach the Gospel, what is the point.... other than making himself alot of money at the expense of gullible goats. that simply want to be entertained.
berean1129 1 year ago
@berean1129 So from watching a few videos of this man on Youtube you now know what every single sermon the man ever taught was about? You guys are a trip. How the heck do you know he doesnt preach the gospel?
TheGunShow777 1 year ago
@TheGunShow777 For a time is coming(it is here) when people will no longer listen to sound and wholesome teaching. They will follow their own desires and will look for teachers who will tell them whatever their itching ears want to hear-2TIM 4:3. God bless...
berean1129 1 year ago
@berean1129
If your itching ears are telling you to get to work for God instead of going to a church that is stagnant in growth , but comfortable in reaching no new souls then...that's good...right?
Digitizeddragon23 1 year ago
@berean1129
Paul and Timothy went out and sat with sinners in jails and converted people that would make our most violent offenders look like kids in time out. Is that the mission of your church? If such people were worth going after hundreds of years ago, them maybe Jesus still wants us to reach them now. IFurtick and Perry are basically going back to no nonesense preaching similar to that found in the bible. Still...Iike how you back up your ideas with scripture!
Digitizeddragon23 1 year ago
@berean1129 By your philosophy Jesus should have studied longer too then.
Persilver40 7 months ago
Dude, you are full of pride and error. I can read all these anger and resentment in your heart Steven. Great advise, best thing I heard was when he said "Elevation Church" is not for you" hahaha
ragetoca 1 year ago
@ragetoca Christ's true Church knows no boundries. His bride is Holy not worldly.
berean1129 1 year ago
His church exists to glorify the god of numbers, to lift up the name of the church of self, and to downfall of this man, he does it all in the name of Christ. This is NOT the true church that Christ established, this is Simon of Acts 8 that rapes the truth and purpose of God's church to build himself as one who is great. How much greater the wrath shall be on them that lead the sheep blindly. Emotionalism does NOT equal repentance in faith whom only Christ can grant
bigbuck025 1 year ago
The purpose of church is to teach the whole Word of God in season and out and spread the Gospel. What the Church is not about is building empires and tickling peoples ears.
summa1129 1 year ago
lv this! surrendered my life to Christ because of what God is doing at this church over a year ago and now in another city witnessing to others and seeing God's kingdom multiplied! my life has never been the same! talk about kingdom multiplication and people falling crazy in love with Jesus! God u r sooooo very good! thank u for obedient, radical believers, who live radically to see ur name lifted high! U R SO HOLY GOD!
angiethe5 1 year ago
@angiethe5 The problem, Angie, is that Furtick ignores the purpose of the church - to make disciples by teaching them to observe all that Jesus has commanded - it isn't just a weekly evangelistic crusade. Plus, the immature, arrogant attitude expressed in this video clip is NOT the characteristic of a Biblical pastor.God can do great things even through people's sin (think of Joseph's brothers!), but that doesn't make it right. Find a biblical church to mature, and continue to share the Gospel
wbman1 1 year ago
@wbman1
The biblical church was run by the pharisees...go look those guys up! I think they killed Jesus. Be careful when you say things like immature and arrogant. We can't judge people so hastily based on one two or even five examples of them. We must pray for and encourage them. The way that the world is now, we as christians can't afford to turn on one another.
Digitizeddragon23 1 year ago
I think this guy needs to learn from REAL pastors like John MacArthur, John Piper, and Paul Washer.
He is out of line (not to mention just plain wrong) in what he is saying. Perhaps he should read and study the Bible more instead of shooting his mouth off about things he clearly does not understand.
Mr. Furtick needs to be a part of that congregation and leave the pastoral, preaching, and teaching duties to someone who knows what God says about His Church.
swingman24 2 years ago 3
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jeannejohnson 1 year ago
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jeannejohnson 1 year ago
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jeannejohnson 1 year ago
Awesome!!! Keep on teaching the truth!!! If we don't get involved then why bother listening!!!!
mmcape 2 years ago
this message was a complete slap in the face to the precious bride of Christ, whom Jesus died for. Human beings souls aren't cattle. ppl don't need to line up at the auction to get their salvation card so they can join the army and then starve on an anemic , watered down diet of postmodernism.
shockingalternative 2 years ago 2
you can't manipulate ppl with emotional, theatrical displays into "choosing Jesus". It's God and God alone that chooses whom He will have mercy upon.none of us deserve God's love. we should be pitied for our wretchedness without Christ, not pitied because we are so "lost and empty". it's good to feel a sense of guilt and repentance.. then you know God is changing your heart to love what He loves and hate what He hates.
shockingalternative 2 years ago
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shockingalternative 2 years ago
This guy has no idea what the purpose of the church is.
nemoforever90 2 years ago
The American Church as a whole is broken. So much division, so much jealousy, so much corruption, so much apathy-- We have gone from a church fixed on Christ and unified to do kingdom work together, to becoming a business. The Church has lost their focus. Now instead of fighting to gather the lost and seek the hurting, we are fighting over petty doctrine differences and figuring out ways to raise attendance and make more money. Churches like Elevation give hope that the Church can be restored.
qcualum5 2 years ago 2
I know this video was originally posted by "alittleleven" and gained much commentary. The intention of the original post was to serve as an example of "wrong" teaching or the churchy word: "apostate." It is truly a shame that this message is so edited and chopped up. Those who hate this type of church need to wake up to the real message BEHIND the message and that is "Church" the way we have always done it is NOT reaching the lost. We need God's timeless doctrine communicated a timely way.
65Truthseeker 2 years ago
just because people supposedly cave their lives to christ does not mean the got saved--tragic
educatedthug15 2 years ago
the church is where beleivers come to worship and how the heck can they win people for jesus if they dont even know what they beleive
educatedthug15 2 years ago
MY LIFE HAS CHANGED AND I WILL NEVER BE THE SAME...CONTINUE TO CHANGE LIVES THROUGH ELEVATION FATHER! DO IT FOR YOUR NAME'S SAKE!
IN THE NAME OF JESUS "No weapon that is formed against you will prosper; And every tongue that accuses you in judgment you will condemn. This is the heritage of the servants of the LORD, And their vindication is from Me," declares the LORD.
ISAIAH 54:17
angiethe5 2 years ago 2
This church is truly a tragedy...It's the logical result of modern evangelicalism's tendency to compartmentalize the gospel...as if it is for unbelievers only...or if discipleship has nothing to do with the gospel.
bradyc1982 2 years ago
If they are not teaching the Doctrines of Grace then how exactly are they "leading" anyone "to Christ"?
Oh right, people who know Jesus aren't welcome in the "church".
CarryANationIII 2 years ago
lol. im praying for you.
westonwerner 2 years ago
Stupid Character counts. lol
If all you do is listen to someone with the purpose of finding something wrong, then you almost always will. Even if there is nothing wrong, you will pick out on sentence, take it out of context, and only quote that to make your "point" Last time I checked, satan did the same thing to Jesus when tempting Him. He twisted a statement from the Bible to suit his purpose. When you take 1 or 2 statements out of context from a pastor, you do the same thing.
poolturtle 2 years ago
I'm wondering if any of the people trashing him have actually listened to other sermons? Or did they just click on a video where someone cut out the one part they didn't like, and then think they're informed? I grew up under many teachers who taught sound doctrine, and I have yet to find anything wrong with his messages. Yes, he's blunt, but he's honest. And if you ACTUALLY listen to what he's saying, you'll understand that it's not twisted or wrong.
poolturtle 2 years ago
This is just another useless, cookie cutter, "relevant", man-centered, entertainment driven, ear tickling, social club.
gtrjunky 2 years ago
Oh and by the way, John Calvin didn't define the doctrines of grace. He might realize that too if he was more focused on God than men.
WarrantedFaith 2 years ago
The man basically admits his "church" isn't even a church. lol
I guess Elevation has thrown out the Bible too. Discipleship and evangelism is what you spend the rest of the week doing, not Sunday morning. Church is for the body of Christ to come together in worship of their God and to learn from the Word so that they will be equipped for the week ahead to go back out into the world. Mr. Furtick misses the whole point, I guess because he never bothered with "all that Bible stuff."
WarrantedFaith 2 years ago
elevation church is a social hall
that promotes the seeker-driven garbage of bill hybels
steven furtick is a pastor like my dog humphrey is
billiefan2000 2 years ago
I understand where he's coming from, however, i would use some notes, because he worded some things that do contradict the Bible and the process of discipleship.
smilebigryan 2 years ago
"If you know Jesus this church is not for you." He has no idea how right he is!
mountainpilgrim 2 years ago
Furtick is the embodiment of Jude 12.
Yeeks. Yeah, knowing him won't get me to heaven, but the rest of it is lies.
He's utterly clueless about ecclesiology and pastoral ministry.
terriergal 2 years ago
"We're not perfect, but we know what we came to do..."
Uh, no, you're not. That's the point. That's where the "grace" thing comes in that you spit through sneering teeth.
TheATrain33 2 years ago
Seek and save THAT WHICH WAS lost, and that's something ascribed to GOD not you. Think about what else was lost at that time.
Gosh these emerg*** screwballs, if just one of them would read the new testament it'd all be over. What gives.
ZeratoulX 2 years ago
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saintleslie 2 years ago
This guy is my second cousin, and our whole family is so retarded and inbred it's not funny.
karmagirl314 2 years ago
To those who condemn I have to say I understand your skepticism, however, you can not make assumptions based on one video, I challenge you to attend and see what is taught on a weekly basis. We ARE called to be saved then lead the lost to be saved as well. This church fights to save the lost and rocks out to God! What better way to reach the lost today than by creating a energetic and dynamic venue? We are the church, not the building. Hope to see ya there someday.
God Bless!
Apassion4christ 3 years ago
>To those who condemn I have to say I understand your skepticism, however, you can not make assumptions based on one video, I challenge you to attend and see what is taught on a weekly basis
We do, check out Chris Rosebrough's fightingforthefaith. We listen to these jokers all the time, it's the same rot week after week. WORK WORK WORK to please God, no sabbath rest, do the Holy Spirit's work for him,no, can't actually preach the gospel! Gotta work!(oh we might MENTION the WORD 'gospel.')
terriergal 2 years ago
Amen! Im bout my Father's Buisness!!
mshelton0222 3 years ago
He acts as though missions and doctrine are mutually exclusive.
the13thof12 3 years ago
I don't understand any of you people commenting on this! There is nothing wrong with what he is saying, it's a little extreme but it is straight forward and to the point. And jesus did the same thing. we need to educate ourselves and tell the lost about the wonderful grace of god. And everyone should learn from that example.
Zundwig 3 years ago
There is plenty wrong with it. He's bought into the idea that the church is for unbelievers. NO, the church is for the building up of the body, the encouragement, edification, and education of believers so they CAN go out in their everyday lives and be Christ's witnesses.
What he's saying is the equivalent of sending toddlers to boot camp. "oh so you were just born, now you're in the army! Drop and give me 20!" Give me a break.
terriergal 2 years ago
The church is the people. Not the building or the staff.
It is much more possible to build up your body, encouragement, edification, and education through Christ, God, and the virtue of the Holy Spirit daily than it is to for an hour and thirty minutes once a week.
westonwerner 2 years ago
This guy is a complete hypocrite!!! He calls other people pharisees while displaying some of the most self-righteuous behavior I have ever seen. Unbelievable. Do not be decived by these wannabe rock-star psudeo-pastors. If you really want to know Christ then go to a church that preaches Christ crucified. Furtick may find it passe' but it was good ebough for Paul. I'll go with Paul on this. The pastor may not be as hip as Furtick but he'll preach the truth.
MackLeeGreen 3 years ago
Seek and save the lost. But why are they lost and what are they saved from?? Like it or not mr psuedo wannabe rock-star, doctrine matters. That's great 500 people come to Jesus, and then you tell them not come back. That's great discipleship.
MackLeeGreen 3 years ago
Numbers- not the Biblical ones, at that. Frustrating.
jszczyrb 3 years ago
Raewhitlock, Great point! I'd guess that he hasn't thought about it. It's a sad state of affairs out there... and I'd pray that God sends the reformation we so desperately need.
Lildude8123 3 years ago
I wonder if this guy is aware that Christians need the Gospel, too.
raewhitlock 3 years ago
The church is not just some salvation factory, the church is supposed grow in godliness toward Godly sanctification.
This man just admitted that his church and its members are NOT growing in the things of God. His church is not for Christians? I figured that out watching this video, it is not for anyone seeking the Christ either.
ONE of the functions of the church is to preach the gospel. It is not the only function and you are operating like the nose that doesn't need the head to survive.
simone56 3 years ago 2
The idea that we should give our money to one man's dream so we can throw a big party every weekend to deliver an unoffensive gospel is not biblical. The church is a place where believers gather, care for one another, pray for boldness then go into their world and lead people to Christ through the power of the Holy Spirit. Many pastors rob people of Christian adventure and leave them thinking that we should give to his dream and let him be the soul winner rock star for Jesus.
7to70 3 years ago
It think it is important to note that this is a selfish vain venture this pastor has set out on... he has salvation all wrong, HE HAS NO BEARING ON WHETHER ANYONE GETS SAVED. It is like the wind, God has picked his elect and we must preach to the whole world so that God may draw those elect close to him. God will raise up the rocks to do his will if he won't. He is arrogant and honestly to absorbed on what he thinks he can do instead of what God will do.
"I want..." that is how he starts.
simone56 3 years ago
amazing reply. i'm in the midst of struggling at my church home which has become of the same "dream" process as this. we were just told today that we aren't there to be fed and it's not about Christians. at all .almost our entire church has left except for a few and the new people who are pouring in. there is no talk of sin only grace and love and grace and more love.. and the love movement. my soul is aching and i don't know what to do anymore
shockingalternative 2 years ago
get out of there quick, i recently left my church becuase of the same thing
educatedthug15 2 years ago
MARK 16:15..i accidentally put 15 at first.
also make sure we understand the real definition of church..the devil likes to use people he knows he can get you with..and alot of the times he can use other believers to distract and wear us down..but dont let him win bc the word says all we will ever need to know to fight this spiritual battle
jts0906 3 years ago
i think this is exactly what is wrong with christianity.People are too worried about what the preacher is sayin wrong that what he is saying right. He knows you have to love on everyone but hes saying that church isnt for people who think that they are just "okay" with what im doin.its a place for lost people to come and be loved on..so instead of arguing why dont we just follow God. are we not supposed to be ONE body of christ on earth fr one purpose!?! MARK 15:15.this is what life is all about
jts0906 3 years ago
I think he really has the right idea but he should maybe tweak his message a little bit. We can't know Christ as we should if we remain on the sidelines and never put our faith into action. That is the message of the Book of James. Discipleship that doesn't have action at it's center is poor discipleship and he's right that too many Christians are selfish (growing fat) with their faith.
volner5 3 years ago
Tweak his message?? He has no message. He talks about saving the lost, but he doesn't say what we are called to save them from. And there is a reason he doesn't do that. It's because then he would have to talk about sin and justification. And that would force him to move beyons superficial gimmicks and rock bands. Better to reach 10 people with the truth than 100 people with gimmicks and bad rock music.
MackLeeGreen 3 years ago
this philosophy is a reflection of the Reformers and the frontier revivalists who turned the Church into a "preaching station" who's ONLY purpose is to "reach the lost" ----God's Eternal Purpose for the true Body/Family of God goes far beyond "reaching the lost by human efforts and programs"
EROPPER 3 years ago
wanastunt,
no, they don't miss the point.
Lildude8123 3 years ago
ususguy & coyne1988: I think you might be misunderstanding what he means. When he says "this church isn't for you" that didn't mean he wants his members to get out of the door and leave. He means that the aim of the church is to bring lost people to Christ. He didn't renouce when Jesus told Peter to feed his sheep, he actually hit that he said his mission was to train the people for the army of God in order to reach the lost. The chruch still does disciplship, they simply aim torwards the lost
wanastunt 3 years ago
hanven - do you agree with what he said on this video?
applesaucelid 3 years ago
i went to church with steven when i was a little kid and he was christ convent in shelby.
i love him. this man is one of the few guys i look up to as a spirtual leader.
hanveyn 3 years ago
This is church of the devil.Listen to this heritic-"if you know Jesus this church is not for you".Did not Jesus say feed my lambs or when Mary was sitting listening to the Lord
Jesus was very pleased with her more than Martha?Hm we better wake up.
usisguy 3 years ago
usisguy, well said. If this Elevation "Church" is not for folks like myself who know Jesus, then I'll be sure not to attend, thank you. We should love the down-and-out, that is true, we should also love those who are the opposite as well. Just note that humble and poor in spirit doesnt always refer to the "down-&-out" crowd, in fact some down-&-out ppl are among the proud whom God resists. Does this guy honestly think that one who desires Bible-preaching is against evangelism and serving?
Coyne1988 3 years ago