The Secret Life of Bees Question Entertainment Christian Review

[XSC3]

I've yet to meet ANYONE (Catholic or not) who prays to Mary as a "Goddess."

At best there are some fluffy agnostic/neopagan folks who use Mary as some kind of Goddess symbol, but I don't think they pray to her (or anything for that matter). They just like the IDEA of it.

[revloush309]

well i met a great many of catholics who worship mary as a goddess. many of them were nuns. they didn't make any bones about it. it wasn't a symbolic thing as you say. they said mary was their goddess. also the worship and deification of mary is part of authentic catholic dogma. the catholic church says that she is the "divine mother queen of heaven, queen of the angels". you can call that a title if you want to but to me that is out right deification of mary as a goddess.

[revloush309]

to me the Holy Spirit meets all my needs for a divine mother figure so i have no need of mary or any other goddess. but to each their own. the catholic church does officially venerate mary as the eternal virginal mother of God who was conceived without the stein of sin and who bodily ascended into heaven. now scripture only says that is true of Christ. it never said that this was the case for mary.

[revloush309]

because none of it is true. mary gave birth to Christ as a virgin but then had many children with her husband joseph who besides what some silly books say was not an old widower who had been married with kids before. that is just not true and not biblical. i don't need to justify anything to anyone. believe what you want. to me according to what i read in scripture prayer means "worship of God through communing with his being".

[revloush309]

prayer is worship. praying to a saint or to mary is worship. however my problem is with the use of the word prayer. i do not have a problem with some one talking to a saint and saying hey pray for me, or asking God to make them like a particular saint. but when you address a "prayer" to any being but God and petition them for things or praise them, then you are making them into a god when they are not! as i said believe what you will.

[XSC3]

to be fair, it sounds like the movie doesn't present authentic Catholic practice, even if that's what it is (just going by the review, I havent' seen the movie)

[revloush309]

the book doesn't claim to represent authentic catholic anything.

[XSC3]

Okay, so the point is from the POV of the reviewers, what goes on in the MOVIE is idolatry, but from what you were saying it sounded as if you were projecting this onto (real life) Catholicism itself. Did I misread you?

[XSC3]

how is prayer addressed to a saint "idolatry", I ask? seriously.

[revloush309]

prayer is a form of worship according to scripture! you are not suppose to pray to anything but God.

[EhudtheDeliverer]

The movie itself has a non-denominational all woman house meeting that is centered around a statue of Marry. It's not Catholic (though they are often characterized as also liking Marry) In the Movie it is idolatry because the characters are focused on this statue, they even get power from touching it. Being a "movie guy" I am very into symbolism and meaning - thus I see the value of ritual. That is not was was in this movie. It was about the statue

[reverendloush]

as a christian who is nethier protestant or catholic i have to say that i am deeply troubled by the catholic churches idolotry and the portestant evangelical churches lack of true spirituality!

blessed be!

L

[XSC3]

catholic church's "idolatry" reverendloush? Explain what you mean. Surely you're not so ignorant to think that Catholics actually "worship" saints or images, right?

[revloush309]

a great many catholics that i have known do very much practice idolotry. according to most of them i have known they pray to mary and the saints. since scripture considers prayer a type of worship and it says not to worship anything but God then yes it is idolotry. no the movie is not about authentic catholicism. nor does it claim to be. many catholics do worship saints angels, and mary! that is a fact. go to mexico or ireland and you will see what i mean.

[XSC3]

If so then they do so in direct violation of the official teaching of the Catholic Faith. I'm sure there are Catholics who fornicate, use artificial contraception and cheat too... but those things are similarly forbidden and taught against. It's not the fault of the Church if people disobey her teachings... we just need to do more to reach such folks. I'd like you to show me that "prayer" is automatically worship, from the Bible if you could. I've never met a Catholic who did these things.

[revloush309]

many catholics do worship mary, the angels, and the saints. i have known plenty who pray to the statues in their house. go to ireland or mexico and you will see mary vererated as a goddess! that is a fact. so you are the one who is in iggnorance!

[XSC3]

If so, then these folks are heretics, who are not practicing the Catholic faith. It'd be no different than if a Protestant did this. Unfortunately, when most people say this stuff, they believe it is what the Catholic Church teaches. But the you say that "prayer" addressing anyone but God is automatically worship, therefore idolatry. Perhaps you could justify this. Mary is not a Goddess, sorry.

[reverendloush]

august says in the book that mary does not reside in the statue or somehere out there like a fairy god mother but she lies within. what she was saying was that just because she prayed in the midst of the statue did not mean that she was praying to the statue. now i think it is idolotry to pray to mary instead of God. but the protestant church needs to relearn the value of ritual, beacuse it is in desperate need of what it has forgotten.

[reverendloush]

it seems to me that they did not read the book or watch the deleted scenes, nor do these two people understand the importance of ritual. i must say that uneducated people calleing themselves christians do nothing to advance the cause of Christ. i am concerned that it is people like this who are representing my religion and my reedemer to the world. they speak of idolotry. touching the heart of the statue is a symbolic act. praying the roseary is a symbolic act for catholics. and ...

[FATMIME]

You have peaked my interest in this movie. Maybe my wife needs to sit next to me through this "chick flick" with tissue in hand. Funny how great cinematography and great acting covers a multitude of sins.