A Call for Discernment Exposing the Word of Faith Movement

[redrocklove]

God bless you!

[redeemedOne32]

facebook blocked me from posting this video on my facebook page.

[edadan2009]

Google Thurman Scrivner and check him out. He is a REAL man of God. The Lord has worked many salvations and healing miracles through his ministry. No prosperity teaching - just the promises of God. It's a difficult teaching - no sugar coating. But, I have experienced it first hand and testify that this man is doing the work of Jesus Christ here today.

[MrTaills]

The Very WORD of God is by FAITH, for without IT, YOU can not please God.......the so called preachers one sees on a TV are out for themselves NOT of God at all.WE are to BELIEVE and ACCEPT what Gods WORD states by faith and stand on HIS WORD ALONE......so anyone who claims its not this or that is a simple LIAR. If you would simply READ you will see throughout the ENTIRE Bible, it says BY FAITH....they recieved, lame walked, deaf heard, dumb spoke,dead raised...all by FAITH in GOD ALONE !!!

[andreir2d2]

i am from romania . i start reading the biblie and i am glad that i find this video because i gree to the fact that the biblie is bad interpreteted by some people that they call themself teachers but only One is call the Theachers that is Christ

[shieldsff]

thank you for this wonderful discussion and interview  !

[barrypatrickius]

I'm pentecostal and ALL name it and claim it is from the devil and so is "lose your salvation" (salvation by WORKS). Calvinism is devil too.

[swingman24]

@barrypatrickius Calvinism is quite biblical.

[MrTaills]

For every Real Gift of God, there is always a false.If there is a Truth , there also is a Lie. People need to Read Gods Word and Abide in God Alone and stay away from man made religions and man made promises from ANYONE who says one must pay and or sow for God to move......Jesus ALREADY has Healed EVERYONE, the question is When will people accept what Jesus ALREADY did for them at Calvary....including this guy . Fish for the Real Word of God Trish and Justin and abide in Him Alone.

[borecleaner1]

@MrTaills What do you mean that ''Jesus has already healed everyone?.....What you wrote is the reason why some charismatics have no credibility whatsoever.....Isaiah 53 spoke of ''spiritual healing''.not carte blanche to EXPECT that we have an unfettered right to obtain physical healing...This what you wrote is more of the same old pentecostal bromide that God is somehow OBLIGATED to heal us of our diseases.He is NOT.He is God, WE ARE not........Quit getting your theology from TBN...........

[MrTaills]

@borecleaner1 READ the WORD of GOD..By His Stripes ye "WERE" healed ,not going to be or should be or maybe..but ALREADY WERE.maybe its you who , if you would READ would see Gods Truths instead of mens . Jesus Christ Died for ALL Mankind,and also for the HEALING of EVERYONE.its the teaching that He does not except Mr,or Mrs Holier then thou who attend a man made so and so church is why NO ONE accepts the TRUTH of Gods Word anymore.YOU stop listening to men and start Reading the Word yourself !!!

[borecleaner1]

@MrTaills I don't know if we are ssplitting theological hairs or whatever....God DOES heal.but I find NO reference in either the Old or the New Covenant that states that we have an unfettered RIGHT to healing...Has EVERYONE you have ever prayed for,for physical healing BEEN HEALED?All Healing is from God in his mercy and grace to his forgiven children,however sometimes he does not heal physically..Did the apostle Paul who repeatedly prayed for the thorn in his flesh,was he healed from that?

[MrTaills]

@borecleaner1 Speaking simple TRUTH of the WORD of God.Show me anyone in the Bible Jesus refused to heal anyway, no matter what they lived ? WE already BY HIS STRIPES WERE HEALED (OT).Jesus Christ was slain from the Foundation of the world (that means beginning btw) Jesus simply stated this fact , THY FAITH HATH MADE THEE WHOLE...THY FAITH , THY FAITH, THY FAITH.......throughout the ENTIRE BIBLE. It says To them that BELIEVES .Read the BIble..its that Simple !!! By thy Faith, ye were Healed !!!

[MrTaills]

@borecleaner1 Gods Grace Was Sufficient, Yes even for Paul, did Paul receive that grace ? I'm sure he did. It speaks no more of the matter.The problem is people will accept anything other then the simple TRUTH of Gods Word.But as it is written so it is,"If one come in his own name him you will receive,but because I come in my Fathers name , you receive me not "...SO it still is today !!! Again there is many healings, some is being taking from this world to glory, like the thief on the cross.

[borecleaner1]

@MrTaills Are you willing to talk to this guy and tell him that iit is his''lack of faith''that prevented his healing?Not EVERY ONE is healed........Are you listening to this guy?BTW,I DO read the Bible.Do you listen to a pastor expounding on the word of God..If so,you are doing the same thing you accuse me of doing...Please think about that...........

[MrTaills]

@borecleaner1 YES I would talk to that guy and tell Him exactly what the Word of God says, not what some man tells Him or some preacher or TV money grabber says...and FYI, I do not follow ANY MAN, nor preacher, I follow the WORD of God lead by the Holy Ghost alone,.and btw that also is Written in His Word.again Try READING IT and asking GOD for HIS TRUTHS and not some mans or your own desires....YOu claim to be something of Christ yet deny HIm by the very words YOU speak !!!

[borecleaner1]

@MrTaills My brother,if my strident tone offended you please accept my deepest apologies.we are both God's children,bought and paid for by Christ's blood at Calvary.I sense inside of me that a pharasaical spirit has crept up and sometimes I find myself''flying like an ego''.We simply see the works and function of the Holy Spirit in a different light.......Your experiences no doubt differ than mine.but I remember what a preacher once said that the ground is level at the foot of the cross.......

[MrTaills]

@borecleaner1 No offense taken in any manner.The Holy Ghost is God Himself, how then it being His Spirit differ from one child of God to another? Simple answer He can Not .The Problem lies with what one is willing to accept, that being ALL of Gods Word or just the part one decides fits their own desire or willingness, or what they have learned of men. I am Not taught of men, but by the very Spirit in which I speak.IT can do nothing but witness of Himself, anything more or less, is Not of God .

[YodatheJedi12]

Excellent video; I 100% agree

[Goodlife51]

God bless this brother..u know i thought for a long time that Benny Hinn was real...but as i looked into it.....people have DIED after he says they are healed!!....he said he wouldnt air another "healing" w/o checking it out w doctors 1st..then he went right back to it!!.there is not ONE shred of evidence,but there are MANY death certificates.....Praise God for the TRUTH!!....Please do something on the oneness pentecostals..they are the new fast growing CULT!!..thank u

[headhonchess]

Excellent presentation. Valid biblical discussion and responses.

[YouGeneration]

It was a pleasure meeting J.P In Chicago and sitting in his class :)

[SpideyPranks]

It's time to become like the Bereans who were of more noble character because they searched the scriptures as the final authority.

[lauradell2be]

@SpideyPranks : It has never NOT been time to act as the Bereans did.

Our spiritual journey goes where we allow ourselves to be led. It should be checked and double-checked! It's a NARROW road, wide enough only for the One who leads and the one who follows behind Him. It is not to the right or the left of it to any degree.

[VvmagancommercevV]

Becoming saved is more a miracle than getting healed, that’s awesome!!!

[TrueShalom]

Is there anything good that has come from the Cherasmatic movement? I really want to know. I heard that Benny Hinn went to Africa and the image of Christians have been apparently tarnished since then.. I heard it's the same in India.. Is this true?

Todd claimed to have gone to heaven?? My goodness!! That's claiming to be of the standing of Elijah and Enoch!

[Venustarr]

@TrueShalom These "celebrity christians" are sent out by the devil to corrupt the world and to make true Christianity look bad.

[1Moriel]

Justin Peters is a gift from GOD to us in this dying and diseased world ! May GOD bless him and his ministry and keep him in the truth and faith to the end. Jesus warned us about wolfs in sheep's clothing and as we watch TBN ,GOD TV ,CHURCH TV ,etc they all love to have these kooks that prophecy falsely heal no one preach prosperity and only make themselves rich . I know it cost money to run a TV show but preaching a false gospel will send you and your followers to hell.

[hectorzit]

This guys Solid truth Thanks for posting Im going to look up more about him.

[hectorzit]

Is Todd Bently still at it???

[O19393]

it certainly sounds 'holy' of Justin to accept whatever happens in his life as the 'mysterious will of God.' But it is not helpful, & it is not scriptural to play patty-cake with the devil & allow him to exert so much influence in your life. He believes everything that happens is God's will, right? Surely he'd agree that not every person is saved. How then, does he explain 2Peter3:9- God is "not WILLing that any should perish, but that ALL should come to repentance."

[billiefan2000]

to those attacking

justin peters

I have a question:

do you ever use discernment

regarding todd bentley or kenneth Copeland or their ilk?

[O19393]

I've made it the subject of much study for the last few years. Copeland has unerringly preached the uncompromised word of God, regardless of public opinion. Peters preaches his own experiences & uses the failures of others as examples. He adds asterisks to God's promises, cheapening the grace of God. He believes Jesus' sacrifice wasn't sufficient; he has greater faith in the devil's authority. It's this type of religious turpitude that's kept us in bondage to Satan. There is no help in him.

[billiefan2000]

019393

you believe copeland's prosperity gospel is biblical?

[O19393]

I have not found anything contradictory to it in the Bible; conversely, the entire thread of the blessing is easy to find once you know what to look for. The popular religious teaching of poverty & sickness as blessings is not at all scriptural, just an easy way to live - the devil doesn't resist you when you're already headed downhill.

[thirdsamuel]

2 corinthians 10:3-5

[O19393]

...?

[yamnema]

it's funny that everyone wants to start practicing "discernment" whenever someone suggests taking God's Word literally, but they are willing to nod along with anything that doesn't threaten their religious sensibilities, no matter how hopeless bleak it is.

you know what's annoying word....."ILK"

[yamnema]

**correction**

**no matter how hopelessLY bleak it is.**

[manhoot]

1 Timothy Ch 6 says:

8 And having food and raiment let us be therewith content. 9 But they that will be rich fall into temptation and a snare, and into many foolish and hurtful lusts, which drown men in destruction and perdition. 10 For the love of money is the root of all evil: which while some coveted after, they have erred from the faith, and pierced themselves through with many sorrows.

The prosperity pimps should revisit these verses and rework their sermons accordingly.

[O19393]

A fair amount of them actually preach from this segment often, using it as an example of the difference between -& consequences of- striving for riches without God, & accepting what he wants for you. Most of us know that money is nothing but a tool we use to work God's will in the earth [since money is undeniably what makes our world go 'round]. The point of these verses is to shun covetousness & not seek riches for their own sake. The LOVE of money is the root of all evil, not money itself.

[manhoot]

And the prosperity pimps sure do love their money.

Rod Parsley, in particular, is not shy about it.

Parsley is upfront with his congregation about the churchs need for money. I just love to talk about money, he told them. I just love to talk about your money. Let me be very clear — I want your money. I deserve it. This church deserves it.16

[O19393]

I don't really give a tiny rat's ass what Rod Parsley says. I don't base my beliefs on any particular preacher's discourse; I use them as stepping stones to point me in the right direction, & if I can't find it in the Word, I discard it.

[manhoot]

You should. Then you should look at the word and discard his distortions and all the false gospels from all the other prosperity pimps.

[O19393]

No thanks; I've lived enough of my life pinned under the thumb of manmade religion that tells me God hurts us because He loves us. There's no scriptural basis for this bullshit. It requires no faith, only a "thank you sir, may I have another" mentality. Christians are remarkable in their ability to be suspicious [read: jealous] of other people's good fortune, while mindlessly accepting the attacks of Satan as the 'will of God.' They preach like God wants us to kiss His ass & call it ice cream.

[Eric0873]

Um, no you're wrong....God is "what makes the world go around". Money is what we use as mistrusting human beings who've fallen so far from God that we need this bartering system. There's nothing wrong with money in and of itself, but as you said its the love of money that's the root of all evil.

[O19393]

I think the word 'prosperity' is what polarizes people. And since no one wants to put on their big girl panties & deal with it, I feel it does the message more justice to refer to it as the 'provision gospel.' After all, that's the heart of it: God loves us & has provided everything we need to successfully work His will in the earth. It's our responsibility to accept it & act on it.

[O19393]

I'm so disgusted with the attitude propagated by the religious community - those that fellate themselves over suffering & advertise their holiness w/inspirational plaques & daily devotional calendars. They give God lip service, emulating Job instead of Jesus. They decide for the rest of us how much faith is too much & what it should be used for, crying heretic if we step outside their lines. They equate suffering w/holiness, & their traditions make the power of God of no effect.

[TracerBullet]

You are entitled to your own opinion and I appreciate your devotion to the false doctrine of prosperity. Can you answer these questions for me with biblical evidence and/or back up from actual scholastic theologian?

1. Has not your faith become "works"?

2. Can you look a suffering person with Cancer/AIDS/MS/Down syndrome/missing limbs or paralyzed etc. in the eye and tell them they will be healed, guaranteed?

3. Does being rich make life easier, or make everything more needy?

[O19393]

*cracks knuckles* Let's go:

1. When the bible speaks of works, it pertains to people's attempt to become justified by their works, nullifying the grace of Jesus by which they are saved. Faith without works is dead-Js.2:20, but grace & works are mutually exclusive.-Christ is become of no effect unto you, whosoever of you are justified by the law; ye are fallen from Grace.-Gal.5:4

[O19393]

2. Yes, b/c they were already healed 2000 yrs ago when Jesus purchased it for them.He doesn't come back & die all over again each time someone needs healing. During His earthly ministry He specifically charged & anointed those who follow Him to heal the sick, raise the dead & cast out devils-Mat.10:8.The church chokes on that, but we're instructed to perform the same & greater miracles than Jesus did-John14:12-14. We're just afraid it won't work, so we built up a doctrine to justify our fears.

[O19393]

3. Easier. The catch: use your wealth according to the will of God, acting as a conduit for His blessing. God defines wealth in 2Cor.9:8-And God is able to make all grace (EVERY favor and EARTHLY blessing) come to you in ABUNDANCE, so that you may ALWAYS and under ALL circumstances and whatever the need be SELF-SUFFICIENT [possessing enough to REQUIRE NO AID or support AND furnished in abundance for EVERY good work and charitable donation].-AmplifiedBible

[TracerBullet]

4. Where do you stand with the belief of Christian science?

5. Why do most of the leaders of this movement die of disease?

6. If I asked God to strike down an atheist that lives next door to me, and I had enough faith, would He do it?

7. Do you follow the whole law, or do you pick parts that you just enjoy the most?

[O19393]

4. Never heard of it, except the joke that it's neither christian nor science.

[O19393]

5. Nobody's perfect.

[O19393]

6. No. God cannot act on prayers that are contrary to His will-1John5:14-15. However -& this is something most people forget- Satan can. Any selfish, harmful, vindictive, controlling prayer is heard & acted upon by demonic forces, just as righteous prayers are acted upon by angelic forces. Satan is listening to you, & he's a legalist. He wields authority on the earth through humans, & we blame it on God. Satan's successes are the greatest when he appears with the name of God on his lips.-Gandhi

[O19393]

I follow Jesus, not the law, b/c He redeemed me from the curse of the law. I'm not justified by the law, but by Grace: Christ is become of no effect unto you, whosoever of you are justified by the law; ye are fallen from Grace.-Gal.5:4. God is Love, so I follow the commandment of Love, because on it hangs ALL the law & the prophets-Mat.22:40.

[O19393]

Instead of always putting people under condemnation from a law that's not meant for us, christians would do better to spread the love of God & grace of Jesus. Unfortunately, most don't even know it themselves; they spread doctrines of devils: fear, disbelief & hate. So many profess to live in love, but 1Cor13 tells us exactly what it means: love is not rude, it pays no attention to a suffered wrong & is ever ready to believe the best of every person. Doesn't sound like any christian I know.

[Eric0873]

So Jesus was wrong to use the moral law (10 commandments) to show the rich young ruler the standard for goodness? Being that Jesus is God who was manifested in the flesh and referred in the Bible as love...isn't it loving to show someone the true condition of a person's heart so that repentance and faith could be given to the hearer?

[Eric0873]

So Jesus was wrong to use the moral law (10 commandments) to show the rich young ruler His standard for goodness? (Luke 18, Mark 10) Is it not loving to show someone their present condition before God so that they may receive repentance and faith?

[O19393]

God most certainly did not give/cause/allow you to have MS. He didn't send Jesus to the cross with asterisks or a list of exceptions. If He said 'by His stripes you were healed,' He means it. No fine print. He did it all for you.

[O19393]

This guy gets his rocks off by traveling the world telling people that b/c he wasn't healed at a WoF conference, then no one else should expect to be healed either. His entire foundation is faulty: he thinks WoF teaches us to manipulate God w/spiritual laws. No, it teaches man to walk in OBEDIENCE to spiritual laws God ordained. Clearly he's declared a one-man war against a doctrine he perceives has failed him. Discernment? He should exercise it. Jesus told us we'd have what we say, good OR bad.

[O19393]

Let me get this straight: Justin disparages the Word of Faith preachers for taking scriptures or examples of blessing as they appear in the lives of biblical figures & appropriating them unto themselves as heirs to the promise. Yet Justin is doing exactly the same: he searches the Bible for every example of sickness, death & failure & assigns them to himself & the rest of us. He says it's heresy to take good things personally but thinks we should accept all the bad things. Yuck. He can keep it.

[yamnema]

this guy makes me so mad! words cannot describe!!

[yamnema]

OH MY GOD, I can't believe you just said it is not ALWAYS GOD'S WILL for you to be healed!!! You are crazy! Stop believing the lies of the devil!

[TracerBullet]

I agree with you on part of that. God's will is always that we be healed and in fact Justin even says that in his full sermon. However, it's not always the case here on Earth. But we will all be healed in heaven. Do no fret.

"Lies of the devil"? Come on, grow up. You are just as bad as those people out there calling everything heretical that they don't agree with.

[yamnema]

really? if you believe that we're not going to be healed until heaven, how then do you explain the Lord's prayer that came straight from the mouth of Jesus?? "thy WILL be done ON EARTH, as it is IN HEAVEN?"

and yes I believe they are lies from the devil. you do know there is a devil, don't you. do you really think he plays fair?

[catalystblog]

Whilst I may not completely agree with everything he says. There are some serious questions he raises that we Pentecostals and Charasmatics should look at. Bless you abundantly my brother...

[EdotRich]

I should have him speak at my church for the young adult's ministry!

[EdotRich]

Sorry, that should have been FORMER church!

[neilmarcusrichardson]

I like the 'if you have enough faith to be saved, you have enough faith to be healed' comment. Salvation is certainly the greatest miracle. Praise the Lord for Justin.

[fishwithtrish]

That's my personal favorite quote of Justin's. The first time I heard him say it...it really hit me. Still does. :-)

[Piccobow]

I really dig Justin! In my book he is the best! I can't wait to see him in October of this year! Praise God for providing such a gifted preacher/teacher!

[SlavefourChrist]

Justin is a treasure in such a dark world!!

He came to our church in Florida for a seminar and provided such profound insight into the WOF movement and supported all discussion with 100% Scripture. Would highly recommend him to any Pastor who wants to equip his flock with the dangers of this movement and help them be able to speak out against the WOF movement! Having Justin come to speak is time well spent!!

[cronlannet]

Awesome. Thanks, Trish.

[SO4JTVandVideo]

Justin Peters is a Dear Christian Bro who does a Grreat Job Exposing the False Prosperity gospel...and he Preaches such Good Sound Doctrine..! He Travels all over the Country...working Tirelessly for the Lord with his: Seminars, Radio & TV Interviews...he's a true Humble Servant....who is dearly loved by many. We also have had the honor of working with him..and PTL for all hes doing to Expose "Word of Faith". Keep up the Great Work for Jesus Sis! All 4 Jesus & 4 God's Glory! (1 Cor 10:31)

[fishwithtrish]

Thanks gang for your kind comments. Justin is a huge blessing to many of us!

[heath49036]

A Different Gospel by D.R. McConnell

Excellent book on the WOFM.

[allstarboyscout]

God bless u trish

[heath49036]

Kenneth Hagin is the grand poobah of the Word of Faith movement.

[dragonfist25]

co-sign

[noahsark1962]

Key words,if you come to Christ for the wrong reasons it is a false conversion.I have to agree.

[geisler78]

We were blessed having him on RevivalRadio (.net) but I have to tell you, when my wife and I spent time with him for a weekend, he's like talking to a real angel. Mosy spiritual and REAL Christian I've ever seen and spoken to in my life.

[krisv001]

Great interview !