@Lastofthefreenames Perhaps I have not set up the scenario properly... I have always prefered to discuss things like this in person. I seem to have problems properly getting my point across when I must write it. What I mean however is that people who stand up against tyrants and are killed because of their refusal to kneel are, in essence, made into martyrs are they not? I do agree that the song is filled with misunderstood symbolicism though not in the same manner as you.
This song, band, and motion is about peace and avoid conflicts. Look at these comments, full of hate and anger. Fighting won't change anything, listen to the flobots. Make peace with all. "We could learn a lot from crayons.
Some are sharp, some are dull, some
are pretty, some have weird names, and all are different colors... but
they all have to learn to live in the same box."-Rachel Flowers ♥
You know, it's sad, it's only 2010 and yet we already have a strong contender for worst song of the century. Hear me out, please: it's riddled with oxymorons and and misunderstood symbolism. Most of this song just plain doesn't make sense. Take for example: "We come to you unarmed, we request to negotiate, you cannot do us harm." How are they unable to do them harm? They're unarmed, having abandoned their weapons. Also, the term "white-flag" does not peace, it means surrender.Are they giving up?
Also, them saying "we'd rather make our children martyrs than murderers" is completely bewildering. So they're saying they'd rather have their children die than defend themselves? How is that at all morally superior position to take? It sounds to me like they're giving sanction to an evil act, and can't be bothered to take a stand against it. They'll use only their words to fight; they should feel blessed that they're in America where such a tactic works as opposed to Iran.
@TytusTolshemLives Hmm... from my understanding being a martyr does not mean you cannot stand up for what is right... I would actually argue the opposite. To me, being a martyr is standing up for what you believe in. The definition of martyr is someone who is killed or persecuted for because of their beliefs and their unwillingness to change them correct? So, if say, I invaded a small village and made an example out of those who refused to bow to me, would those people not be martyrs?
@TytusTolshemLives Dude you may or may not understand the message but just think of Ghandi. He stood for a cause peacefully, without using weapons or anything, and even though the opposition may have physically hurt him and the other protestors, they couldn't do their cause harm. And the line we'd rather make our children martyrs than murderers completely makes sense. They're saying they'd rather have their children die peacefully than fight and end up getting killed anyway.
Think of the enemy Ghandi was facing: Great Britain. They aren't exactly (at least then or anymore) in the habit of slaughtering thousands of unarmed civilians, so in that sense a peaceful protest works because they weren't dealing with total barbarians. Should the Jews have staged peaceful protests against Germany? Should the American soldiers have just linked arms at Normandy and sung: "We shall not be moved!" to the Third Reich? At least they would have been martyrs than murderers, right?
When you're against an enemy that only understands force, coming up with a well reasoned argument for the evil of their acts will only fall on deaf ears. So you're saying it's better to lay down and die than to stand, fight, and maybe die in the name of a righteous cause? If a man is raping and murdering your family, what is the more moral position to take? Kill him, or have him kill your family and then you? Instead of one death, you stood by and allowed perhaps 4. How is that right?
@TytusTolshemLives I'm not saying whether its right or not, I'm saying that's the message that the flobots are trying to send, and that at some points in history it has worked. Sometimes you do have to fight, other times it's best to negotiate.
Oh, I know, but they think it is and if their other songs or the overall message of this one is any indication, they believe it is the only real answer. It's never a good thing to fight, but sometimes it's necessary, and while undoubtedly "war is child abuse", sometimes the alternative is much much worse.
@TytusTolshemLives dude, you guys are all jumping the gun here, you have no idea the message they are sendind, im sorry are you every band maember from flobots, did you write the song, NO, so stop actin ike you know exactly what they're trying to say, this is all fuckingspeculation, so why dont you stop being a disrespectful asshole and go fist yourself
@TheDylanAwesome For all we need they could be talking about enjoying chocolate fondue and this is all one giant metaphor. Hey, we aren't the band members, so how can we know what they're talking about? I guess we just have to GO BY THE LYRICS OF THE SONG TO UNDERSTAND THEM. What terrible logic you have. Basically no work of art can be judged good or bad because we aren't the artist? What a convenient line of thinking for someone who isn't any good at their craft.
@TytusTolshemLives you need to back up your facts buddy, martyrs dont lay and die, they are just willing to die for what they believe in, and a martyr wouldnt let someone rape and kill hs family, your just a dumbass!
@TheDylanAwesome Why the insults? Think about the implications of the line "I'd rather be a martyr than a murderer", why don't you? It's suggesting that one is having to choose: kill or be killed. They're touting the latter as the more noble of the two when it is in fact the most morally bankrupt for reasons I've already stated. Should one always wait to be attacked before defending himself? Also, by their definition as they make no distinction, a martyr is a murderer for killing to protect.
@arunalf Martyrs are also at times warriors, fighters in a cause who at times kill others in war. William Wallace was a martyr, members of the Jewish and French resistance during WW2 became martyrs when they were killed. Good try, though.
@TytusTolshemLives - I never said they were'nt AT TIMES. But only when forced. If ALL of the world would make peace with one another, there would be no need for war, without being spineless slaves like you said. You say "if all of the nations of the world had bowed down before the Third Reich instead of taking up arms" But what if the Third Reich never began the war in the first place? Warriors and martyr's are both unnecessary things. Get an education please.
@arunalf I'm going to try very hard not to be as insulting to you as you have been to me. Yeah, that would be absolutely wonderful if there were no bad people in this world, that if everyone out there was gentle and just, living moral lives and cared for their neighbors. See a problem with this world? It doesn't exist. And refusing to fight isn't going to bring us any closer to that utopia. Hence, to say that fighting is unnecessary is illogical and ethically shallow.
@arunalf You live in a fantasy world. Shutting your eyes and ears to the horrors out there isn't going to make them go away. You can either ignore evil--as we all did during the first part of WW2--or you can stand up in opposition to it. People like you extol peace, any peace, as the most virtuous path, but you never give a second's thought to its cost or its terms. At times, war is the more moral choice, especially when it's deciding between baring your neck to a murderer or fighting.
@TytusTolshemLives - You've got some issues that you need to deal with. That's all I have to say. We've all got our "demons" or so to say, but you've got enough for the world. I'm done with you. (Communication Blocked)
@arunalf You know, I'm trying to have a reasonable debate with you, and all you have to offer is insults and strange and vague assertions that I'm twisted and disgusting. It just makes you like childish. This is your forum to defend your beliefs and you have absolutely nothing to say. You're a major disappointment to your cause.
@arunalf Actually, your response is quite intriguing because it summarizes your world view and your personality or others like you all in a few sentences. You're not governed by rationality, you're ruled by emotion. When something you don't like comes your way, you're more content to ignore it than to confront it, all the while trying to position yourself as having the moral high ground. It's quite sad, really. Live in your fantasy, Eloi.
@arunalf I really can't wait to hear your response because to say that war isn't necessary is just outright foolish. In reply to the puzzling statement: "Get an education please" you can have 5 PhDs and be the president of Harvard and still be very unwise, as is too often the case.
art such as these. allows us to be the voice of the voiceless.
Im just asking before you say that we do it for the money like all greedy americans do, although thinkin about it im sure theres ppl who do it for just that, the money. But theres a lot of us who do it to protect the beauty that we have here. the music the people and the red sox baby. Like I said we dont get paid, but the idea of knowing im saving people makes up for it all in a hearbeat.
@Zeldja I', A soilder in the US Army. your reason on why I am fighting is just wrong man. Im saying this in a very respectful tone trust me... But they pay for us is not good. so its really not the money. I love the fact that I get to fight for people like you to have the ability to say what you really feel and not suffer repercussions.
I agree though, I dont think killing solves all to much. But its something that we just have to do to protect others and allow for us to continue to create
@arunalf War is never necessary? Well, I suppose that can be true, if you're a spineless slave. I'm sure immediate peace would have been had if all of the nations of the world had bowed down before the Third Reich instead of taking up arms, but would that have been a world we would want to believe in?
While I don't politically agree with most of the Flobots opinions, I feel that the band first and foremost promotes free thinking, which few do now a days.
Saw them at Summerfest 2 years ago. SOOOOO stoked for the new album.
Ok punk thats your opinion as what I say was my opinion. But look at the world everything around is the result of wars and battles not sitting around with you finger up your ass. So I may be a dumb fuck to and all the other Punks, peace loving hippies. but thats find to me. My family is what is important to me and it that WAR, GUNS, and Violance to rid the world of terrorist, then so be it. Next your going to tell me that the US gov. was behind 9/11.
your a dumb fuck truckie. this is a war based on lies and intolerace of other ppl. your hateful cock sucker if you think war is the only way. im sorry im so harsh i just relized your just brainwashed like 95% of america
Yes you're right the war is based on lies and intolerance of other people. I completely agree with that statement. All the radicalized insurgents have no tolerance for anyone that does not follow their way of beliefs. The Hamas have no tolerance for anyone that doesn't follow their beliefs. I would love for the US to just up and leave but if you actually cared for human rights and freedom you'd see much more oppression and killing.
I am sorry i don't agree with you views. If you want to debat that find. First let me start by saying in my opinion you are an ANTI-American and if that hurts your feelings I am sorry but people are so quick you put there opinion on about how war is bad. WELL Guest what this world was founded on war and that is what give us freedom if you don't like go join an nation that tells you when and what to do.
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If loads troops don't even want to be over there, then they should have never join the arm force. This band is just a bunch of aniti-goverment, tree hugging hippies.
Don't come onto other people's videos to slag them off... Offer something constructive and debate. You have a point though, people shouldn't join the army and then complain about wars.
I still love the fact there are so many peace haters out there... ^^
Great song with a great meaning. I've seen too many people saying you have to fight for peace, and finally a band who believes that fighting in whatever way isn't justifiable.
I only just found this out as well. White flags don't always mean surrender, they are used when one force chooses to negotiate unarmed with the opposition.
@Soldieroncrakck Isn't what you're saying a little hypocritical? How are you a big supporter of armed forces and violence (I checked your youtube page) as well as a Rise Against fan at the same time...
Rise are more than political, they are anti-war as well, watch "Hero of war" or even better "the making of hero of war" on their website... Tim wanted the video to tell people that war only brings the worst out of people, and that it's never a means to negotiate.
I fully support the armed forces and what they do but i do think it is horrible that they do have to die. i know that war is a loathesom cesspool and no one wants it, but in some cases it is a necessarry evil in my opinion. thanks you for actualy doing your research and not coming off as a flat out dick on the web. keep youtube civil man.
on my page when i said i like violence i meant in movies and especially in my halo, gotta love smashing those grunts!
K, I see nothing wrong with virtual violence. I always try to research the subject before I argue my point; I find ignorant arguments incredibly easy to crush and upset everyone.
I really like the song but I still can't fully agree with the message. No I don't like that we went to war in Iraq. I think the biggest threat to peace right now is Iran and the Taliban in Afghanistan. I don't think many of you realize evil exists in the world and there is no negotiating that will make it stop. Yes the 1st action is always to try your best and to understand where the other side is coming from but u cant when their arguement is, "we want to kill the jew" (jew=every1 else)
@YoungGunz82 think you pay to much to american goverment honestly you think tht coz of our goverment sayin those are our enemies and thts how our goverment controls american ppl
NO, I don't listen to our government to decide if they are our enemies. No, I haven't been to the middle east to hear for myself, neither have you. When Iran's Ahmadinejad openly admits to wanting to nuke Israel at some point talking isn't going to matter. To quote Johny 5 himself, "At the extreme, some people gain the ability to accomplish horrific things, to create death and destruction." We spend so much time apply this to our own leaders and completely excuse the rest of the world.
I don't justify every action Israel does but from looking at both sides many of the attacks Israel has made were after numerous attacks from the Hamas, who are nice enough to use a school yards and other places where if retaliated against would cause the most violence against innocent lives.
No, Jew does not = "every1 else." Jew = Jew. The Middle East and the Muslim world are predominantly anti-Jewish for the sake of Zionism. Learn a few things about the Jewish aliyahs, the Irgun, and the Haganah and you will know why. Needless to note the recent atrocity in Gaza.
@YoungGunz82 Pfft. Sounds like you've been huffing the propaganda the US Government hands out...
You seriously think that the Us/British collation forces are really saints? Loads of the troops don't even want to be there...
That whole Iran saga sounds like another Iraq war... I could understand why Iran would be angry about Israel, though nuking is out of the question (wouldn't be worth it). Israel are out of bounds and if America weren't supporting them, they would have stopped by now.
No I do not think that they're saints and I have no delusions that we're self righteous in our actions. So much energy is spent to get our leaders to make peace. I wish more of the energy was directed to the people that our troops are fighting against. I am not just blindly following some gov propaganda. I simply see that there are radicalized groups that are doing far more horrendous things, while most people crying out for peace are putting the blame on the US.
Well I hope you like the fact that people are killing each other for oil i mean peace, it makes alot of sense ^^
People blame the US because before they decided to go and invade Iraq there wasn't 100,000 innocents dead.
Why these "extremists" are around is because they think the western world is fighting Islam, and they want to fight back... If the US stopped funding other terrorists in Israel maybe we'll see peace.
No, I have no delusions that the US/British coalition are completely self-righteous. We're blessed that you can say the things that you are saying. Again I ask you to try and put any of your effort into protesting not just against the US/British, but also against those that are troops are fighting. When in control they are the ones intolerant to anyone who doesn't obey, and when not in control are bombing and using innocents as human shields, raising their kids to be martyrs/suicide bombers
We do it too; just instead of suicide bombers, we have troops. They do it because they feel they are protecting their religion. We do it because we are PAYED to do it...
I agree that the insurgents are very right-wing and I oppose to their ideologies. However, I just don't believe that killing solves anything.
Our troops are not the same as suicide bombers. The majority of casualties of our troops have been from trying to protect innocent civilians. Suicide bombers are doing it to go to heaven and get their 40 virgins. The insurgents are not simply right-wing, they are extreme fascists are not just trying to defend their religion. They want to kill and oppress the religious sects that don't belong with them. That is how Saddam controlled Iraq, with extreme violence and force to anyone who protested
LOL. Saddam, he was AGAINST the so called terrorist organization. WE funded Iraq in the last century because they fought for the western world against eastern organizations unlike many other countries around them. Arab Socialism I think it was called.
What I get from your responses is total lack of understanding for what our troops are now fighting for in the middle east and you scapegoat everything that the insurgents are doing. I agree killing isn't solving anything. All those insurgent groups that are senselessly killing are gaining nothing from it. All it does is keep our troops there longer. I say again...Use some of your passion for peace to plead to those that are troops are fighting against.
I understand what they are fighting. And if I had no understanding I would just be blaming everything on some "terrorist" organization. They do no play by the rules, I understand that, and not once have I said what they do is right. But, not once have I said what we do is right. I have a lot of respect for our troops as most of them joined up to serve their country not to kill innocent people. But you cannot justify your actions by saying "yeah but al-quaeda is worse".
@YoungGunz82 martyrs are people who face persecution and death for refusing to renounce a belief, in this song the belief is murder through war..... i think you got suicide bomber through MARTYdom in COD modern warfare 2 both start with marty lol
I haven't played the game yet, heard its fun. I am not calling suicide bombers martyrs. I was inferring that suicide bombers believe that they are martyrs as well. Looking back at what I wrote I can see you could interpret what I wrote that way. I get long winded and was trying to condense my post.
yes they make millions but they could make millions and sit on their asses all day instead theyve fufilled the american dreams by making millions from a talent of theirs and use it to help people
THERE IS NO ENEMY. Many ppl think there is as they've been having their brains washed for ages (TV etc). They may be right after all. I just won't fall for it yet.
Only thing that sort of kills the live version of this song for me is Mackenzie's viola, sounds a bit off at times (Except the most of the breakdown, that was badass!). However, I'm not that educated on the instrument, so if that's just the way it sounds sometimes, then I accept it.
someone should tell all these musical artists that we shouldn't have to buy their albums to hear their music. they should use the internet to their advantage and upload GOOD copies of their songs, then maybe i'll pay the money to go see them in concert and make them filthy rich.
@suprTOONCES : I don't want to be an apologist for the recording industry, but your model won't work. Who is going to produce this "Good" copy of the song? How much do you think that will cost, and who do you think will finance it? Currently the record companies do that, sinking about $200k into a release. Unlike albums (which are financed by record companies), tours are at the expense of the artists. While some money is made on tours (and not subject to recoups) - the money is in licensure.
I'm sure your right and have more knowledge on the subject than me. I only base my opinion on a balance of the money. Us (the consumers) purchase concert tickets, CD's, digital tracks, merchandise, etc. While these musicians (not all of them) are millionaires, just for making music. there is a surplus of money being gathered by them, which is not a good thing. IMO
Now if they were saving peoples lives on a daily basis, then they would deserve millions. This, however, is not the case.
Yeah, I've always said that until songs get priced at £0.10-0.20/$0.15/0.30 then I'm gonna keep downloading illegally. Artists should make their income from concerts, not by taking advantage of their fans.
i agree with chgoshey. this isnt the place for a political agrument. honestly, no one watching this video cares. if you wanna fight about this stuff take it somewhere else
...No. This is what the song is about, why listen to it if you do not hold any opinions on war or politics, if you didn't, this song would be have no meaning to you.
If you want to talk about playing by the rules, what about contracted militaries supported by the United States that we have used many of times to uphold cruel dictatorships that supported capitalism while destroying their own community. Welcome to the game, where the rich get richer, and the poor get played with the false hope of attaining that wealthy status.
Yeah agreed. You say that We play by the rules while They don't. First of all they got you right there with the Us and Them Mentality. They are forging an enemy and forcing you to believe it. If you really want to know how this world runs lift the veil, do not learn from movies because they are made for entertainment and more realistically for revenue. They do not care about accurately informing you, if they were, they would not trivialize the matter, or make it more aesthetic.
I recommend that you all see the movie The Hurt Locker. It changed my perspective on the war. It made me realize how much we should not be in Iraq. But, it also shows that the Iraqi insurgents to don't play by the rules, and we for the most part do. Just something to think about.
conservatives are a fucking joke now. all you do is take shots at a man who tries to fix what you fuckers got us into. and you all worship palin. Shes a fucking dumbass. John McCain is probably the only republican with any sense any more. if only he was the one who stole an election because of the fucking electoral college
? Did I question whether or not people were created equal? Liberals seem to think that it's ok for radicals to attack us. How would you have responded? With a bleeding heart negotiation? Do you think they would CARE? No. They wouldn't.
I wouldn't sa that because there are conservatives with brilliant minds it this Radical Republican that ae douchebags and the democratic party is as much fo the blame as wel seeing how the end to the will of these idiots when you have a majority
The Tea Party is the worst thing that will ever happen to America. People who go watch their TV all day believing what Fox News is telling them that "It is Obama's fault for the last 8 years"
They are a bunch of old, stubborn, stuck up, ignorant people. Democrats try to pass something that will help millions of americans. Oh but no lets just vote NO because the democrats support it.
The republicans actually drafted some things that Senate and House Dems got behind and then the R. people flipped
@kludgerules, yea, the tea party is stupid because they are saying that the government is spending too much and then the tea party spent like 100,000+ dollars just for stupid parties
reading comments and were not reason for the terrorists you should try to learn some history on it and by the way terrorists are alot of diffrent people if your tlaking about the taliban/alqueda they hate anyone who doesnt believe what they believe not only america!
They aren't children anymore. They know the cost of freedom, a hell of a lot more than you flaming liberals do. Unlike you, they have the balls to fight against tyranny and theocracy. Guess what? Looks like our children actually have courage.
I'm not anti-war i think its nessesary. This war we are in now is point wasteful spending that could b use to better our economy. What you need to realize that tyranny isnt enough to fight a war. The Corperations controls our govt with lobbying and bribes. Fight for our freedom to not have a corrupt govt. that takes more balls than any fighting we are doing over in the middle east. Thats the type of bipartsanship america needs right now
How can they say that war isn't necessary? What about 9/11 and "we will never forget?" We'd rather think of children? Then fight, mutherfucker fight for them. Don't let them grow up in a world of brutal theocracies and terror. Crush the terrorists and support the troops!
@acescouter1992 Yeah, support war and forget peace; let you're children grow up in a war of terror fighting another man's cause. You do know America is the reason the 'terrorists' even exist, right? Look up the CIA backed coup de ta's against the former leaders of third world countries. Of course, we didn't think of them as SOB's back then, because they were our SOB's. Look for and question the facts instead of taking everything at face value.
Enough textbook liberalism. If we roll over they WILL dominate us. You're not getting brownie points for saying nice words, man. You're not. Be rational. They wanted this war. Let's give em hell.
The children are being brainwashed by idiots like you who take authority as truth instead of vice versa. The government says something, you automatically believe them; forget Watergate, the missing WMDs from Iraq, or the genetic testing of soldiers. They think they're fighting for freedom, but all we're doing is taking away our own liberties before the 'terroists' even have the chance, that's the irony. Liberal, what the hell does that even mean to you? It's skepticism kid, THINK!
So then let me ask you. Would you put your ass on the front lines after an enemy attacks us while we're at peace simply because we're a free society? Isn't that worth fighting for? Or are you not a patriot?
@acescouter1992 The patriotism you're talking about is blind obedience. You claim not to question people are created equal, yet you separate that term for the 'terrorists' overseas, since when were you their spokesmen anyways? Stop pulling this 'they're attacking us' B.S., yes, they hit us; but the US allowed that to happen, you think I'm lying, look up what REALLY happened in Pearl Harbor. Freedom is worth fighting for, but this isn't that fight, this is the U.S. creating more terror.
Gray, WATERGATE? REALLY? You are aware that that was election fraud, not an alien conspiracy, right? And GENETIC TESTING OF SOLDIERS?! We won't even pay for decent body armor for them! YOU think! Take off the tinfoil hat and crack a book. Is war evil? Yes! But is it nescessary? I know an officer who is overseas right now, and he works with civilians - the majority of whom want peace and support our troops removing the al quieda threat from their country.
News for you, we are not the reason extremists commit acts of terror. The people of the middle east have been at war for thousands of years before any foreigners got involved, and the only thing they like better than blowing each other to hell is killing anyone who says it shouldn't happen. Hatred like that transcends borders and causes 9-11 type attacks. We are there to support peaceful democracy and fight the terrorists who demand to force their agenda when the majority doesn't support it.
"Terrorist" - those who support government based on terror. An inflamatory definition, sure, but there are people who try to scare people into supporting their position (Republicans in the last Election / Hillary Clinton in the Democratic primary). We didn't buy it, but there are governments overseas who do. I think "Insugent" is the more musused word. Do you honestly believe that 9-11 wasn't an attempt at terrorist influencing of our society? Grow up.
First of all, if you want to make a discussion pls don't bother writing 'grow up' lines, we are simply not sharing the same point of view; it's not an age issue whatsoever. (:
Now, I'm one of those who believe it's an 'inside job'. That's how politics work in this capitalistic world, same w/ WWI, II, Vietnam, the Cold War etc.
I love all this "don't believe the government / tinfoil hat" debate that this kind of thing begets. Everyone seems to think our government is "big brother". Can you honestly say that we're worse than a religion based-government that tells it's followers that if they blow themselves up that they're getting straight into paradise? That's as manipulative as it gets. I draw the line at making my own kids martyrs, though. That's what's being done on both sides - and I find that line OFFENSIVE!
OMG ilove flobots and i practically had a heart attack when i heard tim mcclath's voice! Rise Against has been my favorite band for 3 years. This is COMPLETELY my new favorite song. :)
@Lastofthefreenames Perhaps I have not set up the scenario properly... I have always prefered to discuss things like this in person. I seem to have problems properly getting my point across when I must write it. What I mean however is that people who stand up against tyrants and are killed because of their refusal to kneel are, in essence, made into martyrs are they not? I do agree that the song is filled with misunderstood symbolicism though not in the same manner as you.
Lastofthefreenames 4 months ago
Its not the some without tim :(
SirRitter 1 year ago
The viola shall bring peace and rationale to the world :)
torontodave 1 year ago
This song, band, and motion is about peace and avoid conflicts. Look at these comments, full of hate and anger. Fighting won't change anything, listen to the flobots. Make peace with all. "We could learn a lot from crayons.
Some are sharp, some are dull, some
are pretty, some have weird names, and all are different colors... but
they all have to learn to live in the same box."-Rachel Flowers ♥
Skat3rDude1 1 year ago
i was wondering how they were gonna do that without Tim
punkrockr827 1 year ago
Defend yourself. Nobody wants to have to do it for you. :)
QueenOfTheForest1 1 year ago
You know, it's sad, it's only 2010 and yet we already have a strong contender for worst song of the century. Hear me out, please: it's riddled with oxymorons and and misunderstood symbolism. Most of this song just plain doesn't make sense. Take for example: "We come to you unarmed, we request to negotiate, you cannot do us harm." How are they unable to do them harm? They're unarmed, having abandoned their weapons. Also, the term "white-flag" does not peace, it means surrender.Are they giving up?
TytusTolshemLives 1 year ago
Also, them saying "we'd rather make our children martyrs than murderers" is completely bewildering. So they're saying they'd rather have their children die than defend themselves? How is that at all morally superior position to take? It sounds to me like they're giving sanction to an evil act, and can't be bothered to take a stand against it. They'll use only their words to fight; they should feel blessed that they're in America where such a tactic works as opposed to Iran.
TytusTolshemLives 1 year ago
@TytusTolshemLives theres a difference between murdering and killing in defense,
TheDylanAwesome 1 year ago
@TheDylanAwesome Yes, and they make no distinction whatsoever because in their mind there is no difference.
TytusTolshemLives 1 year ago
@TytusTolshemLives Hmm... from my understanding being a martyr does not mean you cannot stand up for what is right... I would actually argue the opposite. To me, being a martyr is standing up for what you believe in. The definition of martyr is someone who is killed or persecuted for because of their beliefs and their unwillingness to change them correct? So, if say, I invaded a small village and made an example out of those who refused to bow to me, would those people not be martyrs?
Lastofthefreenames 4 months ago
@TytusTolshemLives Completely agree...Too bad this band has a great sound but lyrics just come across misguided.
YoungGunz82 1 year ago
@TytusTolshemLives Dude you may or may not understand the message but just think of Ghandi. He stood for a cause peacefully, without using weapons or anything, and even though the opposition may have physically hurt him and the other protestors, they couldn't do their cause harm. And the line we'd rather make our children martyrs than murderers completely makes sense. They're saying they'd rather have their children die peacefully than fight and end up getting killed anyway.
jdoggy135 1 year ago
Think of the enemy Ghandi was facing: Great Britain. They aren't exactly (at least then or anymore) in the habit of slaughtering thousands of unarmed civilians, so in that sense a peaceful protest works because they weren't dealing with total barbarians. Should the Jews have staged peaceful protests against Germany? Should the American soldiers have just linked arms at Normandy and sung: "We shall not be moved!" to the Third Reich? At least they would have been martyrs than murderers, right?
TytusTolshemLives 1 year ago
When you're against an enemy that only understands force, coming up with a well reasoned argument for the evil of their acts will only fall on deaf ears. So you're saying it's better to lay down and die than to stand, fight, and maybe die in the name of a righteous cause? If a man is raping and murdering your family, what is the more moral position to take? Kill him, or have him kill your family and then you? Instead of one death, you stood by and allowed perhaps 4. How is that right?
TytusTolshemLives 1 year ago
@TytusTolshemLives I'm not saying whether its right or not, I'm saying that's the message that the flobots are trying to send, and that at some points in history it has worked. Sometimes you do have to fight, other times it's best to negotiate.
jdoggy135 1 year ago
Oh, I know, but they think it is and if their other songs or the overall message of this one is any indication, they believe it is the only real answer. It's never a good thing to fight, but sometimes it's necessary, and while undoubtedly "war is child abuse", sometimes the alternative is much much worse.
TytusTolshemLives 1 year ago
@TytusTolshemLives I hear ya man.
jdoggy135 1 year ago
@TytusTolshemLives dude, you guys are all jumping the gun here, you have no idea the message they are sendind, im sorry are you every band maember from flobots, did you write the song, NO, so stop actin ike you know exactly what they're trying to say, this is all fuckingspeculation, so why dont you stop being a disrespectful asshole and go fist yourself
TheDylanAwesome 1 year ago
@TheDylanAwesome For all we need they could be talking about enjoying chocolate fondue and this is all one giant metaphor. Hey, we aren't the band members, so how can we know what they're talking about? I guess we just have to GO BY THE LYRICS OF THE SONG TO UNDERSTAND THEM. What terrible logic you have. Basically no work of art can be judged good or bad because we aren't the artist? What a convenient line of thinking for someone who isn't any good at their craft.
TytusTolshemLives 1 year ago
@TytusTolshemLives you need to back up your facts buddy, martyrs dont lay and die, they are just willing to die for what they believe in, and a martyr wouldnt let someone rape and kill hs family, your just a dumbass!
TheDylanAwesome 1 year ago
@TheDylanAwesome Why the insults? Think about the implications of the line "I'd rather be a martyr than a murderer", why don't you? It's suggesting that one is having to choose: kill or be killed. They're touting the latter as the more noble of the two when it is in fact the most morally bankrupt for reasons I've already stated. Should one always wait to be attacked before defending himself? Also, by their definition as they make no distinction, a martyr is a murderer for killing to protect.
TytusTolshemLives 1 year ago
@TytusTolshemLives - A martyr is someone who dies for a cause. Good try though.
arunalf 1 year ago
@arunalf Martyrs are also at times warriors, fighters in a cause who at times kill others in war. William Wallace was a martyr, members of the Jewish and French resistance during WW2 became martyrs when they were killed. Good try, though.
TytusTolshemLives 1 year ago
This has been flagged as spam show
@TytusTolshemLives - I never said they were'nt AT TIMES. But only when forced. If ALL of the world would make peace with one another, there would be no need for war, without being spineless slaves like you said. You say "if all of the nations of the world had bowed down before the Third Reich instead of taking up arms" But what if the Third Reich never began the war in the first place? Warriors and martyr's are both unnecessary things. Get an education please.
arunalf 1 year ago
@arunalf I'm going to try very hard not to be as insulting to you as you have been to me. Yeah, that would be absolutely wonderful if there were no bad people in this world, that if everyone out there was gentle and just, living moral lives and cared for their neighbors. See a problem with this world? It doesn't exist. And refusing to fight isn't going to bring us any closer to that utopia. Hence, to say that fighting is unnecessary is illogical and ethically shallow.
TytusTolshemLives 1 year ago
@arunalf You live in a fantasy world. Shutting your eyes and ears to the horrors out there isn't going to make them go away. You can either ignore evil--as we all did during the first part of WW2--or you can stand up in opposition to it. People like you extol peace, any peace, as the most virtuous path, but you never give a second's thought to its cost or its terms. At times, war is the more moral choice, especially when it's deciding between baring your neck to a murderer or fighting.
TytusTolshemLives 1 year ago
@TytusTolshemLives - You've got some issues that you need to deal with. That's all I have to say. We've all got our "demons" or so to say, but you've got enough for the world. I'm done with you. (Communication Blocked)
arunalf 1 year ago
@arunalf You know, I'm trying to have a reasonable debate with you, and all you have to offer is insults and strange and vague assertions that I'm twisted and disgusting. It just makes you like childish. This is your forum to defend your beliefs and you have absolutely nothing to say. You're a major disappointment to your cause.
TytusTolshemLives 1 year ago
@TytusTolshemLives look*
TytusTolshemLives 1 year ago
@arunalf Actually, your response is quite intriguing because it summarizes your world view and your personality or others like you all in a few sentences. You're not governed by rationality, you're ruled by emotion. When something you don't like comes your way, you're more content to ignore it than to confront it, all the while trying to position yourself as having the moral high ground. It's quite sad, really. Live in your fantasy, Eloi.
TytusTolshemLives 1 year ago
@arunalf I really can't wait to hear your response because to say that war isn't necessary is just outright foolish. In reply to the puzzling statement: "Get an education please" you can have 5 PhDs and be the president of Harvard and still be very unwise, as is too often the case.
TytusTolshemLives 1 year ago
He sounds like Jesse Pinkman from Breaking Bad.
Prio13 1 year ago
i m downloading this album with bittorrent at the moment
Realjhad 1 year ago
aww tim wasnt there good performance tho
sikchild247 1 year ago
this song rules
bahhstones 1 year ago 8
We'd rather make our children(Jimmy!?) lls thats funny
DubulWalz 1 year ago
art such as these. allows us to be the voice of the voiceless.
Im just asking before you say that we do it for the money like all greedy americans do, although thinkin about it im sure theres ppl who do it for just that, the money. But theres a lot of us who do it to protect the beauty that we have here. the music the people and the red sox baby. Like I said we dont get paid, but the idea of knowing im saving people makes up for it all in a hearbeat.
Peace and Love.
marssox 2 years ago
@Zeldja I', A soilder in the US Army. your reason on why I am fighting is just wrong man. Im saying this in a very respectful tone trust me... But they pay for us is not good. so its really not the money. I love the fact that I get to fight for people like you to have the ability to say what you really feel and not suffer repercussions.
I agree though, I dont think killing solves all to much. But its something that we just have to do to protect others and allow for us to continue to create
marssox 2 years ago 10
@marssox - War isn't necessary, it's child abuse... it's human abuse.
arunalf 1 year ago
@arunalf War is never necessary? Well, I suppose that can be true, if you're a spineless slave. I'm sure immediate peace would have been had if all of the nations of the world had bowed down before the Third Reich instead of taking up arms, but would that have been a world we would want to believe in?
TytusTolshemLives 1 year ago
live in*
TytusTolshemLives 1 year ago
Im enjoying the little argument goin on below there, but jesus, throw in some proper grammar and spelling every now and then why don't you???
nickelby247 2 years ago
I try but fill up the 500 character count pretty quickly. :)
YoungGunz82 2 years ago
Haha yea but your arguments are sound, filled with good grammar and spelling. And when you read you actually understand what you are talking about
nickelby247 2 years ago
While I don't politically agree with most of the Flobots opinions, I feel that the band first and foremost promotes free thinking, which few do now a days.
Saw them at Summerfest 2 years ago. SOOOOO stoked for the new album.
Sk4rl3tt 2 years ago
VISIT MY Videos FOR THE ACTUAL VIDEO!
hellogov 2 years ago
I was there :) that concert was awesome!!!
TheDarknessIsInMe 2 years ago
And punk if thats the case the your no better the Iran President. By the way I am not brainwashed I am a red blood american who loves his country.
On a better note You call me a hateful cock sucker. At least i am a proud American and not a Anti-American hippie fuck GOD BLESS THE USA
truckie22346 2 years ago
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truckie22346 2 years ago
Ok punk thats your opinion as what I say was my opinion. But look at the world everything around is the result of wars and battles not sitting around with you finger up your ass. So I may be a dumb fuck to and all the other Punks, peace loving hippies. but thats find to me. My family is what is important to me and it that WAR, GUNS, and Violance to rid the world of terrorist, then so be it. Next your going to tell me that the US gov. was behind 9/11.
truckie22346 2 years ago
your a dumb fuck truckie. this is a war based on lies and intolerace of other ppl. your hateful cock sucker if you think war is the only way. im sorry im so harsh i just relized your just brainwashed like 95% of america
punktheworld92 2 years ago 2
Yes you're right the war is based on lies and intolerance of other people. I completely agree with that statement. All the radicalized insurgents have no tolerance for anyone that does not follow their way of beliefs. The Hamas have no tolerance for anyone that doesn't follow their beliefs. I would love for the US to just up and leave but if you actually cared for human rights and freedom you'd see much more oppression and killing.
YoungGunz82 2 years ago
I am sorry i don't agree with you views. If you want to debat that find. First let me start by saying in my opinion you are an ANTI-American and if that hurts your feelings I am sorry but people are so quick you put there opinion on about how war is bad. WELL Guest what this world was founded on war and that is what give us freedom if you don't like go join an nation that tells you when and what to do.
HAVE A NICE DAY
truckie22346 2 years ago
I wish that weapons were never created.
peaceloveandROCK132 2 years ago
This comment has received too many negative votes show
If loads troops don't even want to be over there, then they should have never join the arm force. This band is just a bunch of aniti-goverment, tree hugging hippies.
truckie22346 2 years ago
Don't come onto other people's videos to slag them off... Offer something constructive and debate. You have a point though, people shouldn't join the army and then complain about wars.
I still love the fact there are so many peace haters out there... ^^
zeldja 2 years ago
this song really touches me (snf snf)
just kidding love the song though
jms4323 2 years ago
Everyones a Liberal till the bullets start flying.
Frankcastle522 2 years ago
Is that andy or brer sing "We'd rather make our chilren... Matryrs than murderers!!!" If that andy, I didnt know he had such a voice!!!
Wryz04 2 years ago
Great song with a great meaning. I've seen too many people saying you have to fight for peace, and finally a band who believes that fighting in whatever way isn't justifiable.
I only just found this out as well. White flags don't always mean surrender, they are used when one force chooses to negotiate unarmed with the opposition.
zeldja 2 years ago
Fighting is never agreable. But i do have to dissagree that fighting for some things has to happen.
Soldieroncrakck 2 years ago
@Soldieroncrakck Isn't what you're saying a little hypocritical? How are you a big supporter of armed forces and violence (I checked your youtube page) as well as a Rise Against fan at the same time...
Rise are more than political, they are anti-war as well, watch "Hero of war" or even better "the making of hero of war" on their website... Tim wanted the video to tell people that war only brings the worst out of people, and that it's never a means to negotiate.
zeldja 2 years ago
I fully support the armed forces and what they do but i do think it is horrible that they do have to die. i know that war is a loathesom cesspool and no one wants it, but in some cases it is a necessarry evil in my opinion. thanks you for actualy doing your research and not coming off as a flat out dick on the web. keep youtube civil man.
on my page when i said i like violence i meant in movies and especially in my halo, gotta love smashing those grunts!
Soldieroncrakck 2 years ago
K, I see nothing wrong with virtual violence. I always try to research the subject before I argue my point; I find ignorant arguments incredibly easy to crush and upset everyone.
zeldja 2 years ago
Same. Im in a debate club so it really ticks me off to see a bad argument.
EVERYONE SHOULD TAKE NOTE OF THIS.
Soldieroncrakck 2 years ago
I really like the song but I still can't fully agree with the message. No I don't like that we went to war in Iraq. I think the biggest threat to peace right now is Iran and the Taliban in Afghanistan. I don't think many of you realize evil exists in the world and there is no negotiating that will make it stop. Yes the 1st action is always to try your best and to understand where the other side is coming from but u cant when their arguement is, "we want to kill the jew" (jew=every1 else)
YoungGunz82 2 years ago
@YoungGunz82 think you pay to much to american goverment honestly you think tht coz of our goverment sayin those are our enemies and thts how our goverment controls american ppl
wind2040 2 years ago
NO, I don't listen to our government to decide if they are our enemies. No, I haven't been to the middle east to hear for myself, neither have you. When Iran's Ahmadinejad openly admits to wanting to nuke Israel at some point talking isn't going to matter. To quote Johny 5 himself, "At the extreme, some people gain the ability to accomplish horrific things, to create death and destruction." We spend so much time apply this to our own leaders and completely excuse the rest of the world.
YoungGunz82 2 years ago
@YoungGunz82
Ah yes, Ahmadinejad's words are a justification to attack and invade Iran, but Israel's open air-raids and attacks on its neighbors are permissible.
skuntem 2 years ago
I don't justify every action Israel does but from looking at both sides many of the attacks Israel has made were after numerous attacks from the Hamas, who are nice enough to use a school yards and other places where if retaliated against would cause the most violence against innocent lives.
YoungGunz82 2 years ago
@YoungGunz82
No, Jew does not = "every1 else." Jew = Jew. The Middle East and the Muslim world are predominantly anti-Jewish for the sake of Zionism. Learn a few things about the Jewish aliyahs, the Irgun, and the Haganah and you will know why. Needless to note the recent atrocity in Gaza.
skuntem 2 years ago
@YoungGunz82 Pfft. Sounds like you've been huffing the propaganda the US Government hands out...
You seriously think that the Us/British collation forces are really saints? Loads of the troops don't even want to be there...
That whole Iran saga sounds like another Iraq war... I could understand why Iran would be angry about Israel, though nuking is out of the question (wouldn't be worth it). Israel are out of bounds and if America weren't supporting them, they would have stopped by now.
zeldja 2 years ago
No I do not think that they're saints and I have no delusions that we're self righteous in our actions. So much energy is spent to get our leaders to make peace. I wish more of the energy was directed to the people that our troops are fighting against. I am not just blindly following some gov propaganda. I simply see that there are radicalized groups that are doing far more horrendous things, while most people crying out for peace are putting the blame on the US.
YoungGunz82 2 years ago
Well I hope you like the fact that people are killing each other for oil i mean peace, it makes alot of sense ^^
People blame the US because before they decided to go and invade Iraq there wasn't 100,000 innocents dead.
Why these "extremists" are around is because they think the western world is fighting Islam, and they want to fight back... If the US stopped funding other terrorists in Israel maybe we'll see peace.
zeldja 2 years ago
No, I have no delusions that the US/British coalition are completely self-righteous. We're blessed that you can say the things that you are saying. Again I ask you to try and put any of your effort into protesting not just against the US/British, but also against those that are troops are fighting. When in control they are the ones intolerant to anyone who doesn't obey, and when not in control are bombing and using innocents as human shields, raising their kids to be martyrs/suicide bombers
YoungGunz82 2 years ago
We do it too; just instead of suicide bombers, we have troops. They do it because they feel they are protecting their religion. We do it because we are PAYED to do it...
I agree that the insurgents are very right-wing and I oppose to their ideologies. However, I just don't believe that killing solves anything.
zeldja 2 years ago
Our troops are not the same as suicide bombers. The majority of casualties of our troops have been from trying to protect innocent civilians. Suicide bombers are doing it to go to heaven and get their 40 virgins. The insurgents are not simply right-wing, they are extreme fascists are not just trying to defend their religion. They want to kill and oppress the religious sects that don't belong with them. That is how Saddam controlled Iraq, with extreme violence and force to anyone who protested
YoungGunz82 2 years ago
LOL. Saddam, he was AGAINST the so called terrorist organization. WE funded Iraq in the last century because they fought for the western world against eastern organizations unlike many other countries around them. Arab Socialism I think it was called.
zeldja 2 years ago
What I get from your responses is total lack of understanding for what our troops are now fighting for in the middle east and you scapegoat everything that the insurgents are doing. I agree killing isn't solving anything. All those insurgent groups that are senselessly killing are gaining nothing from it. All it does is keep our troops there longer. I say again...Use some of your passion for peace to plead to those that are troops are fighting against.
YoungGunz82 2 years ago
I understand what they are fighting. And if I had no understanding I would just be blaming everything on some "terrorist" organization. They do no play by the rules, I understand that, and not once have I said what they do is right. But, not once have I said what we do is right. I have a lot of respect for our troops as most of them joined up to serve their country not to kill innocent people. But you cannot justify your actions by saying "yeah but al-quaeda is worse".
zeldja 2 years ago
@YoungGunz82 martyrs are people who face persecution and death for refusing to renounce a belief, in this song the belief is murder through war..... i think you got suicide bomber through MARTYdom in COD modern warfare 2 both start with marty lol
touryourmom 2 years ago
I haven't played the game yet, heard its fun. I am not calling suicide bombers martyrs. I was inferring that suicide bombers believe that they are martyrs as well. Looking back at what I wrote I can see you could interpret what I wrote that way. I get long winded and was trying to condense my post.
YoungGunz82 2 years ago
im so glad flobots is coming out with a new album i saw them live in 2008 and they were fuckin amazing i was a huge fan after that :D
jonsprettylady 2 years ago 2
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scarface3131983 2 years ago
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scarface3131983 2 years ago
wow this video ahs gotten so many views since the single came out
it's an awesome song
the album is coming out March 16
bonwad1 2 years ago
I want to hear this song but the fags on youtube won't let us.
Xephon0930 2 years ago 2
when is the next album released
rlphrlph 2 years ago
16th March
JammyNoodles 2 years ago
is that the US release date? know when it's out in the UK?
erictheshort 2 years ago
yes they make millions but they could make millions and sit on their asses all day instead theyve fufilled the american dreams by making millions from a talent of theirs and use it to help people
failedequation 2 years ago
bad ass song!! great project.
jacoboscar79 2 years ago
So is Rise Against going to be touring with you guys Taht wouldbe tight
frostbytet17 2 years ago
Mackenzie should sing more often. Hearing her sing on "Never Had It" was amazing. This song is pretty strong too.
komatoran 2 years ago
she sings on the new song, "Atlantis," and probably a few others. her voice is definitely beautiful
TheOriginalFire93 2 years ago
@TheSporksrfun1
Lol, yeah I'm over it now, she's amazing :P
TheOriginalFire93 2 years ago 2
@Broheem6 [2]
THERE IS NO ENEMY. Many ppl think there is as they've been having their brains washed for ages (TV etc). They may be right after all. I just won't fall for it yet.
NickPyro667 2 years ago
just heard this song for the first time.. pretty damn good
plank1231990 2 years ago
Only thing that sort of kills the live version of this song for me is Mackenzie's viola, sounds a bit off at times (Except the most of the breakdown, that was badass!). However, I'm not that educated on the instrument, so if that's just the way it sounds sometimes, then I accept it.
ANYWAYS...
Amazing song, love The Flobots! :D
TheOriginalFire93 2 years ago
@TheOriginalFire93
I'd buy a ticket to listen to Mackenzie bash two rocks together.
TheSporksrfun1 2 years ago 3
I think it sounds great
Wryz04 2 years ago
Comment removed
lolifax 2 years ago
someone should tell all these musical artists that we shouldn't have to buy their albums to hear their music. they should use the internet to their advantage and upload GOOD copies of their songs, then maybe i'll pay the money to go see them in concert and make them filthy rich.
suprTOONCES 2 years ago
@suprTOONCES : I don't want to be an apologist for the recording industry, but your model won't work. Who is going to produce this "Good" copy of the song? How much do you think that will cost, and who do you think will finance it? Currently the record companies do that, sinking about $200k into a release. Unlike albums (which are financed by record companies), tours are at the expense of the artists. While some money is made on tours (and not subject to recoups) - the money is in licensure.
martinwk68 2 years ago
I'm sure your right and have more knowledge on the subject than me. I only base my opinion on a balance of the money. Us (the consumers) purchase concert tickets, CD's, digital tracks, merchandise, etc. While these musicians (not all of them) are millionaires, just for making music. there is a surplus of money being gathered by them, which is not a good thing. IMO
Now if they were saving peoples lives on a daily basis, then they would deserve millions. This, however, is not the case.
suprTOONCES 2 years ago
Don't forget Actors, Directors, Professional Sports Stars and all the forms of entertainment make millions
Sanguinis666 2 years ago
Yeah, I've always said that until songs get priced at £0.10-0.20/$0.15/0.30 then I'm gonna keep downloading illegally. Artists should make their income from concerts, not by taking advantage of their fans.
zeldja 2 years ago
everyone needs to read THE COMING INSURRECTION. it will truly inspire. (this is not spam, i wrote it intentionally)
MRmattconnell 2 years ago
kludgerules, you've been sucked in with that false hope that formerclarity8 spoke of. lift that veil, buddy. it's all a big game.
JesusYourLordOm 2 years ago
this song is AWESOME!
mucmucvi 2 years ago
wow i just realized something, it this was in VA on the 6th, then Tim would've been in FL at that time.
TOALEWA466 2 years ago
i agree with chgoshey. this isnt the place for a political agrument. honestly, no one watching this video cares. if you wanna fight about this stuff take it somewhere else
blackjack3420 2 years ago
...No. This is what the song is about, why listen to it if you do not hold any opinions on war or politics, if you didn't, this song would be have no meaning to you.
zeldja 2 years ago
how about we enjoy the song and leave the pollitcal bullshit to ourselves?
chgoshey 2 years ago 2
If you want to talk about playing by the rules, what about contracted militaries supported by the United States that we have used many of times to uphold cruel dictatorships that supported capitalism while destroying their own community. Welcome to the game, where the rich get richer, and the poor get played with the false hope of attaining that wealthy status.
formerclarity8 2 years ago 2
Yeah agreed. You say that We play by the rules while They don't. First of all they got you right there with the Us and Them Mentality. They are forging an enemy and forcing you to believe it. If you really want to know how this world runs lift the veil, do not learn from movies because they are made for entertainment and more realistically for revenue. They do not care about accurately informing you, if they were, they would not trivialize the matter, or make it more aesthetic.
formerclarity8 2 years ago
I recommend that you all see the movie The Hurt Locker. It changed my perspective on the war. It made me realize how much we should not be in Iraq. But, it also shows that the Iraqi insurgents to don't play by the rules, and we for the most part do. Just something to think about.
jgcgsgmg 2 years ago
Yeah but where did the Hurt Locker come from? The most bullshit and maniacal propaganda machine ever: Hollywood.
SoapClawtooth 2 years ago
@SoapClawtooth nasty movie!!!
Jtis22 2 years ago
conservatives are a fucking joke now. all you do is take shots at a man who tries to fix what you fuckers got us into. and you all worship palin. Shes a fucking dumbass. John McCain is probably the only republican with any sense any more. if only he was the one who stole an election because of the fucking electoral college
Jared1494 2 years ago
NOH8 Conservative douchebags
All people were created equal
kludgerules 2 years ago
? Did I question whether or not people were created equal? Liberals seem to think that it's ok for radicals to attack us. How would you have responded? With a bleeding heart negotiation? Do you think they would CARE? No. They wouldn't.
acescouter1992 2 years ago
@acescouter1992 What the hell are you even doing on this page anyways? Do you just look around for anti-war people to argue with?
GrayFox15 2 years ago
I wouldn't sa that because there are conservatives with brilliant minds it this Radical Republican that ae douchebags and the democratic party is as much fo the blame as wel seeing how the end to the will of these idiots when you have a majority
Gweezy12 2 years ago
The Tea Party is the worst thing that will ever happen to America. People who go watch their TV all day believing what Fox News is telling them that "It is Obama's fault for the last 8 years"
They are a bunch of old, stubborn, stuck up, ignorant people. Democrats try to pass something that will help millions of americans. Oh but no lets just vote NO because the democrats support it.
The republicans actually drafted some things that Senate and House Dems got behind and then the R. people flipped
kludgerules 2 years ago 2
@kludgerules, yea, the tea party is stupid because they are saying that the government is spending too much and then the tea party spent like 100,000+ dollars just for stupid parties
Nicknacmania 2 years ago 2
@Nicknacmania
Yeah and look at how ridiculous the Canadian Government is with the olympics.
Their plan was to spend 660 million dollars and it turned out to be closer to 5 billion spent on the olympics.
StopTheRobbery 2 years ago
This comment has received too many negative votes show
Totally agree...I fuck children every day.
WillSnipe4Tacos 2 years ago
@WillSnipe4Tacos what the fuck? whats wrong with you?
MrHeLmEtMaN 2 years ago 2
This has been flagged as spam show
It was a witty response to "Help the children, save the children, protect the children. You
know what I say? Fuck the children! " from jayc1300.
WillSnipe4Tacos 2 years ago
reading comments and were not reason for the terrorists you should try to learn some history on it and by the way terrorists are alot of diffrent people if your tlaking about the taliban/alqueda they hate anyone who doesnt believe what they believe not only america!
Ragelf 2 years ago 2
Well, thing is... Most of the "children" we're fighting to protect, are already over seas. They're the ones fighting for us. They need to come back
DragonLight369 2 years ago 2
They aren't children anymore. They know the cost of freedom, a hell of a lot more than you flaming liberals do. Unlike you, they have the balls to fight against tyranny and theocracy. Guess what? Looks like our children actually have courage.
acescouter1992 2 years ago
I'm not anti-war i think its nessesary. This war we are in now is point wasteful spending that could b use to better our economy. What you need to realize that tyranny isnt enough to fight a war. The Corperations controls our govt with lobbying and bribes. Fight for our freedom to not have a corrupt govt. that takes more balls than any fighting we are doing over in the middle east. Thats the type of bipartsanship america needs right now
Gweezy12 2 years ago
How can they say that war isn't necessary? What about 9/11 and "we will never forget?" We'd rather think of children? Then fight, mutherfucker fight for them. Don't let them grow up in a world of brutal theocracies and terror. Crush the terrorists and support the troops!
acescouter1992 2 years ago
@acescouter1992 Yeah, support war and forget peace; let you're children grow up in a war of terror fighting another man's cause. You do know America is the reason the 'terrorists' even exist, right? Look up the CIA backed coup de ta's against the former leaders of third world countries. Of course, we didn't think of them as SOB's back then, because they were our SOB's. Look for and question the facts instead of taking everything at face value.
GrayFox15 2 years ago
Enough textbook liberalism. If we roll over they WILL dominate us. You're not getting brownie points for saying nice words, man. You're not. Be rational. They wanted this war. Let's give em hell.
acescouter1992 2 years ago
The children are being brainwashed by idiots like you who take authority as truth instead of vice versa. The government says something, you automatically believe them; forget Watergate, the missing WMDs from Iraq, or the genetic testing of soldiers. They think they're fighting for freedom, but all we're doing is taking away our own liberties before the 'terroists' even have the chance, that's the irony. Liberal, what the hell does that even mean to you? It's skepticism kid, THINK!
GrayFox15 2 years ago
So then let me ask you. Would you put your ass on the front lines after an enemy attacks us while we're at peace simply because we're a free society? Isn't that worth fighting for? Or are you not a patriot?
acescouter1992 2 years ago
@acescouter1992 The patriotism you're talking about is blind obedience. You claim not to question people are created equal, yet you separate that term for the 'terrorists' overseas, since when were you their spokesmen anyways? Stop pulling this 'they're attacking us' B.S., yes, they hit us; but the US allowed that to happen, you think I'm lying, look up what REALLY happened in Pearl Harbor. Freedom is worth fighting for, but this isn't that fight, this is the U.S. creating more terror.
GrayFox15 2 years ago
Gray, WATERGATE? REALLY? You are aware that that was election fraud, not an alien conspiracy, right? And GENETIC TESTING OF SOLDIERS?! We won't even pay for decent body armor for them! YOU think! Take off the tinfoil hat and crack a book. Is war evil? Yes! But is it nescessary? I know an officer who is overseas right now, and he works with civilians - the majority of whom want peace and support our troops removing the al quieda threat from their country.
Broheem6 2 years ago
News for you, we are not the reason extremists commit acts of terror. The people of the middle east have been at war for thousands of years before any foreigners got involved, and the only thing they like better than blowing each other to hell is killing anyone who says it shouldn't happen. Hatred like that transcends borders and causes 9-11 type attacks. We are there to support peaceful democracy and fight the terrorists who demand to force their agenda when the majority doesn't support it.
Broheem6 2 years ago
@acescouter1992
I'm sry to say that but there are not ''terrorists'' whatsoever. xo
NickPyro667 2 years ago
how so?
acescouter1992 2 years ago
"Terrorist" - those who support government based on terror. An inflamatory definition, sure, but there are people who try to scare people into supporting their position (Republicans in the last Election / Hillary Clinton in the Democratic primary). We didn't buy it, but there are governments overseas who do. I think "Insugent" is the more musused word. Do you honestly believe that 9-11 wasn't an attempt at terrorist influencing of our society? Grow up.
Broheem6 2 years ago
@Broheem6
First of all, if you want to make a discussion pls don't bother writing 'grow up' lines, we are simply not sharing the same point of view; it's not an age issue whatsoever. (:
Now, I'm one of those who believe it's an 'inside job'. That's how politics work in this capitalistic world, same w/ WWI, II, Vietnam, the Cold War etc.
NickPyro667 2 years ago
I love all this "don't believe the government / tinfoil hat" debate that this kind of thing begets. Everyone seems to think our government is "big brother". Can you honestly say that we're worse than a religion based-government that tells it's followers that if they blow themselves up that they're getting straight into paradise? That's as manipulative as it gets. I draw the line at making my own kids martyrs, though. That's what's being done on both sides - and I find that line OFFENSIVE!
Broheem6 2 years ago
How can they say war isn't necessary? Whatever happened to 9/11 and "we will never forget?"
acescouter1992 2 years ago
hey that dude teaches at my highschool... East high denver colorado, home of the flobots... and the fray
larkin540 2 years ago
This comment has received too many negative votes show
I like Lil wayne better
koooldude7 2 years ago
LOL!
suiciderobotmonkey 2 years ago
immortal techince or idk how you spell it is prtty better than him
93jordan94 2 years ago
This comment has received too many negative votes show
GAY PUSSY BULLSHIT the world isnt as bad as you think it is
KILLSWITCHnut 2 years ago
OMG ilove flobots and i practically had a heart attack when i heard tim mcclath's voice! Rise Against has been my favorite band for 3 years. This is COMPLETELY my new favorite song. :)
IcarusmoosenX 2 years ago
i have the album version posted on my channel.
finlaw14 2 years ago
I haven't heard the version with TIm yet ARRRHGGGGHHHHHH >:o
PapaBurgundy0838 2 years ago
@PapaBurgundy0838 Dude are you serious? That shit is epic! just goto their myspace page and you can listen to that shit dude
AstroZombee87 2 years ago
tim mcilrath of rise against is in it :D
soooooo happeh cuz tht,
TheNervousBreakdown 2 years ago
Good song but not so good live and not so good without Tim from rise against
GaJooNGaHz13 2 years ago
This song is awesome!!!!!!!!! Who else thinks this will be a big hit for them???? Awesome that you were able to get this.
wildside227 2 years ago
thats just amazing
Over9000SuckIt 2 years ago
tim (from rise against) makes the song, kinda sad wasnt in this
Warioware117 2 years ago
this song was quite a dissapointment :(
it's partly because it's live, but im listening to their other songs and they sound sooooo much better...
chuby1tubby 2 years ago
@chuby1tubby ur kind of a fucking retard
Eduardotheserb 2 years ago
Hmm, the viola sounds a lot better on their studio recording. =)
thefallensaints 2 years ago