Andante- Sonata #2 - Alexandre Guilmant

[sherwinjtb]

i assume ur playing all these pieces, nice work

[musicfanatic6790]

How do you pronounce it: Alexandre Goolomon?

[64ftContraBombarde]

@musicfanatic6790

Its Alexandre Ghee-maun (with a french accent lol)

[musicfanatic6790]

Merci ;-)

[jmeister321684]

@64ftContraBombarde ''Gueelman'' (with no ''w'' sound in the ''u'', and no pronunciation of the last ''n'' ;- )

[bourdonboy]

Which instrument is this?

[musicfanatic6790]

organ

[Lopear27]

I would be reluctant, though, to relegate Guilmant to having been merely an organ pedagogue. I find much of his music to be well-crafted, tuneful if somewhat conservative. Thanks for your thoughts though.

regards

[tyfardee]

Yes, the craft is rather good. Nadia Boulanger, the famous music teacher, once said 'Technique without talent is boring. Talent without technique is a catastrophe.' Take that to mean what you wish, but I believe it applies to Guilmant, at least in his composing. Thanks for your thoughts, too. Best wishes.

[cornwall59]

What a beautiful piece of music & well played

i like this very much!! look forward to more.

[organman52]

Maybe so, but Guilmant's music is by entirely derivative. In other words, he contrived it. And there is absolutely no inspiration behind it.

[Lopear27]

I'm interested to know how you came to this opinion. From what is this music derived and how is it contrived???

[organman52]

In order to understand the notion that his music is derivative, one needs to know why great music is great. Let's take Mozart, for example. Every theme is original. Every melody is unique. The harmonic progressions sound self-generating. The modulations are inevitable. The transitions and episodes are just as dynamic as the themes that they surround. And the forms are not molds, but rather, serve as a structure within which the materials fit. I find Guilmant to have none of these ingredients.

[Lopear27]

I appreciate your detailed response, and naturally respect your opinion on this subject. I would describe Bach (undoubtedly on of the 'Greats') in similar terms to those you have described for Mozart. However, I would say that there are some fine moments in Guilmant's music, particularly in his contributions to the fugue, of which there are many examples, as self-standing pieces as well as fugues featured withing pieces. Have you heard any of these?

[Lopear27]

Admittedly, not everyone's music is pure gold 100% of the time (even Bach had his off day's!) but surely it is a touch unfair to say that his music was completely uninspired?

[tyfardee]

The few not-so-great pieces of Bach are really inconsequential. Most of his music - probably 98% of it - is beyond glorious in every respect. In Bach's case, as with all the true masters, the music seems to have been conceived instantaneously, rather than 'worked out.' He might have revised, but in the end, revisions are indetectable. Beethoven is 'famous' work 'strugglying'. I don't believe that for a minute. The finished masterworks are so perfect that they have no sense of uncertainty.

[tyfardee]

The thing with Guilmant, for me, anyway, is that his music RESEMBLES that of others. I don't hear a unique voice. Yes, there are certainly some nice moments, but I find them to be the result of formulas and devices. This is in no way to suggest that you agree. What moves you is what is important. By the way, I think that Chopin and Debussy were the most original musical geniuses of the last 200 years. This is not to say that they were the 'greatest' - just that they were unsurpassed pioneers.

[Lopear27]

Do you think of Louis Vierne in a simlar way?

[tyfardee]

I personally adore Vierne's music. It is so perfect for the organ and his style is unique. His inner ear was phenomenal - he couldn't have created all that beautiful harmony and counterpoint without the most refined ear. He is unlike any other master.

[Lopear27]

I'm glad you feel that way about Vierne, and I echo your sentiments. Regarding Guilmant though, he wasn't a pioneer, at least not compositionally. I think his priorities lay more with performance and leaving behind for future generations a solid example of excellence in organ technique.

[tyfardee]

Good point. I think you're right on.

[alecope]

my grate grand father was alexander guilmant

[stoppuller]

Op. 80 in C minor #3 -- #86 is 4

[Pieterman42]

Dear Walter.I don't understand, don't you agree?

I bought this sonate and it says: 4e Sonate en RE mineur. Opus 61. a mon ami Emile Bernard.

[PopeStevo]

You are correct, I played this from the Schott edition and it IS #61..this one long unavailable in the U.S.

The others I have are #56 & #80...Schirmer edition.

[Pieterman42]

Correction, this is from Sonate nr. IV

[mortonbelcher]

A wonderful, relaxing, calming piece to listen to... We shall look forward to some more peaceful selections from you on various organs that are at your disposal...