Merlin Madness

[jakobgrimminger]

No matter what side of the pond it was built, the Merlin is, and always will be the sweetest sounding engine ever built.

[SuperAviatar]

Read Alex Henshaw 'Sigh for a Merlin' , this has some of the history of snags encountered in Merlin production, especially the infamous 'skew gear failure' - no magnetos all of a sudden! - and the piston seizures on Packard Merlins, caused by the omission of a machining operation to save time.....the pistons had to wear to shape or die! Usually there were a few 'thuds' as the matter got resolved inside the engine, once in a while a rod gave up under the strain.

[yachtnick05]

Alison where into PT boats.

[RolloffDeBunk]

Gotta love a V12

[stubby692007]

Great sound

[ianevans67]

Who cares who built it or whats best, I'm British and I love that sound. Dont care if it's in a Stang or a spit, it's music to my ears.

[weversonman]

now the only thing great britain is famous for is soccer hooligans

[TheLloydA1]

@weversonman soccer hooligans dont make me laugh what are yanks famous for there healthy food lol

[GUTTERbOY001]

I am now fully aroused.

[howitsdun]

Lots of snitty remarks against the Yanks. For a reason, maybe. When speaking of the Mustang, it's rare that American commentators reveal the complete story. As in, "it was the best of all the planes of the war and it was AMERICAN". Like that.

Someone once said, "if ya gotta SAY you are, then you AIN'T"

[rampking1]

@howitsdun It's just a lot of sour grapes coming from a country that rivaled the Germans in engine technology during WWII.

During the Post-War, GB was #1 in jet engine and aircraft and then proceded to lose their lead. The selling of the Nene jet engine to the Soviets, military cutbacks and the failure of the Comet airliner helped sealed their fate.

The "snitty remarks" will always be a reference to what might have been,,,,

BUT was not.

[musicbruv]

@rampking1 This country was financially ruined after WW2 while the yanks made a profit from it, but we stood up to Hitler and played a big part in his defeat, no one can take that away from us.

[rampking1]

@musicbruv

Yes, AFTER you made Neville Chamberland a hero for avoiding war with the Nazi's at the Munich Agreement, you watched Adolf take Czechoslavakia and Poland, dumped Neville and upgraded to Churchhill and "stood up to Hitler"

But too late.

[musicbruv]

@rampking1 We made him a hero!! many knew as did Churchill that the Munich agreement was not worth the paper it was written on, its easy for you to be critical at our actions but you were not facing a second war in 20 years. Neville Chamberlain in the end realised Hitler would not stop as promised and declared war on Germany in sept 39.

[rampking1]

@musicbruv Churchhill was also wise to what the Soviets and Stalin were up to later in the war and at Yalta.

I still have not forgiven Roosivelt for this, or General Eisenhower for allowing the Soviets to take Berlin first....

so please believe that I am not just dumping on Great Britain.

The USA can take some hits as well.

[musicbruv]

@rampking1 I, like you would react if someone downplayed the spit or hurri as these planes won the BoB and so prevented us from being invaded which if we had then the US would properly stayed out of the war as they would have no where to base their troops and equipment to help defeat Hitler, I don't mind criticism that is fact but when it is non sense then I bite back like you would, in the end it was a joint effort. we are a tiny island but fought of Hitler I will always be proud of that.

[rampking1]

@musicbruv Btw, check this out. "Neville" was such a hero to GB that it became the top name given to newborn male babies in 1938-39

Poland never did get the military support it was promised by the treaty signed with GB and France.

Yes, it was too late for the ground forces to act, but where was the RAF and Royal Navy?

Despite all this, I have the highest respect for British military intel. , by far the best.

All the British Commonwealth countries soldiers were impact players, amazing troops!

[musicbruv]

@rampking1 Yeah we sacrifice Poland in an attempt to avoid another bloody war that we was not ready for, while it did not prevent ww2 it gave us a breathing space we needed. and as the Hitler/Stalin pact was still in force we would have to fight Germany and Russia......

[CaptJackSpeed]

Everyone always says the P-51 was the best. And in many ways, it was. However, the Japanese feared the Hellcat more than any other American fighter. Had the USAAF had P-51D's at Pearl Harbor and the Philippines in 1941, they would not have made much difference or changed the outcome of the war.

Even though the Hellcat is pudgy and not a good looking airplane with a great sound, it was still one of the best.

[darkmossie633]

yes beneehall, but aerodynamics of Mustang + Merlin engine probably made it top fighter at end of WW2-and Im a true Brit

[CaptainWatson234]

Nononono.

The only way to truly appreciate this engine is in a flyover from a Lanc and two Spits.

What a sonofabitch noise.

[mrspivvy]

amen to that! one of the finest sounds ever

[Scharfschutzen1]

What a joke, had to use a Brit motor. Spitfire was better.

[rampking1]

@Scharfschutzen1 As a defensive fighter the Spitfire was better. Beyond that you have nothing.

Hats off to Rolls Royce though for a wonderful engine.

Efficiency and power in one engine. The "sound" was a bonus.

[Scharfschutzen1]

@rampking1 Including and beyond your statement which holds no merit, U have nothing.

[rampking1]

@Scharfschutzen1

Next time, put in another fuel tank in so you can get to the battles.

When was the last time you saw a Spitfire photo in combat over Germany?

Hell, it barely had the range to aid in the invasion at Normandy.

[Scharfschutzen1]

@rampking1 Spitfire still better than this P-51, seems American propaganda has diluted your thinking. Two nice size cannisters that were under the Mustangs wings called drop tanks which enabled their distance from bases in England and elsewhere. Brits fought with their fighter strictly in defensive mode over England with no need to enter German air, except for their bombers. America had no choice but to bring their war machine into Germany and find the means to do it. Edgar Schmued's P-51. Kraut

[rampking1]

@Scharfschutzen1

"Edgar Schmued's P-51. Kraut "

You are 100% correct and..............put a smile on my face.

I invite you to examine my YT channel, you will understand. ;-)))

The Focke-Wulf video at your Duxford show that I favorited should not be missed.

[Scharfschutzen1]

@rampking1 You were are are in my list of friends. Deutschland Uber Alles.

[musicbruv]

@rampking1 Check out my channel I too have a FW 190 in HD and other planes filmed at Duxford.

[musicbruv]

@rampking1 Check out my channel for a vid of FW 190 in hd, aswell as other aircraft filmed at Duxford.

[musicbruv]

@rampking1 Spitfire was not build to fly long distance it was a defensive fighter and played that role very well, the P51 was built to R.A.F specs from what they had learned in the war thus far, the P51 or Mustang as the Brit version was called was built to play a different role and did that very well, you cannot really compare the 2 aircraft.

[rampking1]

@musicbruv What can I say ?

Everything in your comment here is true.

I just can't keep silent when someone downplays the P-51.

I have attended the Reno Air Races since 1967, just to get to see and hear a P-51 Mustang fly past at max power.....it is incredible.

This despite being a huge fan of the Luftwaffe!

[musicbruv]

@rampking1 What we all have is national pride and thus a bit of bias, Brits think the Spit is best, the Yanks say the 51 is best and the Germans say the BF 109 or FW 190 was best, in the end it came down to pilot skill and as in the Battle of Britain a good command structure which meant the Luftwaffe were always confronted by fighters, I have seen P51's here in the UK at airshows and they sound almost the same as the Spit, but being biased I would say the spit sounds better ;))

[hofmaister1]

the sound is just amazing

[moleman1961]

Very pretty! I`m reminded of the scene in the movie "empire of the sun" with the slow motion pass of the P-51 past the young lad! Thats one lovely aircraft!

[otherether]

Ha! I saw that exact plane at an air show in Lethbridge, AB this year, 2009. It was the highlight, in my opinion. What a beautiful sound that engine makes. The best.

(The announcer said it had one confirmed kill.)

[Marshall7302]

where was this taken? Looks like Nevada or soemthing.

[iainet]

Anoraks

[whar29]

There is also the sound difference of the airscrew. the rounded tips of the P51 airscrew make less of a supersonic note than the more pointed spitfire airscrew.

[emforty2]

I wanna wake up every morning with that sound

[felixu95]

THe P-51 doesn't have a merlin engine, it has an Alison

[usmcpsu66]

no, the A-36 and the P-51A had the Allison, but later versions of the P-51, including the D-model shown here, had the Rolls Royce Merlin

[VMFA115Starloric]

Wow, you fail so hard.

The P-51D Mustang has a merlin engine.

All models below D have Alisons.

[beeceesp]

And you fail even harder. No Mustang had a Rolls Royce Merlin - it's a figure of speech. They had Packard V-1650 engines, a variant of the Rolls-Royce Merlin produced under licence (in the United States) by the Packard Motor Car Company.

[beneehall]

Not a variant but a clone. Essentially, a copy of the ENGLISH Merlin. The Yanks didn't know how to build a good engine. They had to steal the design from the Brits.

[beeceesp]

Another pub crawler with limited education and access to a computer displaying his ignorance to the whole world. Rolls Royce came to America in 1940, with their hat in their hand looking for someone to build Merlins at a faster rate than their own factory could produce and PAY them (licensing) to do it. Henry Ford turned them down flat. They chose Packard instead - who produced an improved VARIANT using women on an assembly line with much improved bearings, cooling system and supercharger.

[beeceesp]

When the first of the Packard-built Merlins arrived in Britain, the engineers at Rolls-Royce stripped them down and were amazed to find the production-line built Packard engine, far from being as bad as they expected it to be for component tolerances, was actually better. America didn't steal anything from the Brits. The Americans built the Mustang airframe which was far superior to the Spitfire - does that mean the Brits didn't know how to make a fighter. Go to school, learn something.

[koitorob]

@beneehall maybe, but they knew how to build a damn good body to go around a merlin engine in the p51

[tomburley]

@beneehall - They didn't steal the design - we supplied it. The Mustang was also drawn up to a British specification and originally fitted with a non supercharged Allison engine. It just shows how AngloAmerican cooperation can work when politics are not a factor.

[MarsFKA]

@beneehall The Americans have always built good aircraft engines. The Merlins used in the P51, the Mk XVI Spitfire, some Lancasters and some Curtiss P40s, were all built under licence in the USA - the Americans did *not* "steal" the design. The Merlin was the only readily available alternative in-line engine when the Allison used in the early P51 was found to be inadequate. Later variants of the P51 reverted to Allison engines.

[deetjay1]

@beneehall

We sent about 250,000 G.I.s and a whole bunch of steel and rubber to bail out your pitiful little empire l...Pretty convenient memory you have there...

[musicbruv]

@beneehall They did not "steal" the design, they made it under licence from RR, it was a ready made engine that fitted into the P51 and made it the plane it was, in war time time is precious the Alison engine needed more development to make it a good engine, it makes sense to use an "off the shelf " engine that is a proven engine.

[kenns9]

@beneehall

F no Moron head.

All racing Merlins use Alison rods. The limeys couldn't design a decent lower end.

The Yanks had to 'make sumtin work' again that u Limeys F-d up on!

[ad356]

@beneehall goddamit. learn history. it was a licensed copy. we did NOT steal it. packard built merlins were build under license by packard in the USA. its not like we were the soviet union stealing the b29 design from crashed b29's.

[VMFA115Starloric]

im misinformed, you're a smartass..

it's a tradeoff.

[zeker111]

1:08: HIEJATSCHWOOOUUUUU!!!!!!!!

[ghpcaubo]

gesundheit

[intertr0ns]

man I'm getting all choked up...beautifull

[Hennersbass]

The English merlin and the packard merlin have the same sound difference as the exhaust note of a (for example) 62 Jag E-Type and a 62 Corvette. One growls, one purrs. This baby purrs where the old Spit' and Hawker growl away.

[Rikki0]

You don't get precisely the same sound from a Packard built Merlin that you get from a Rolls Royce Merlin. The reason is the Packard Merlin were assemly line built and the Rolls Royce Merlins were each hand built individually. The machine tooling on an assembly line is not quite as precise so the tolerances would not be the same as on a hand built Merlin. The differance was small, but noticeable in the sound of each.

[DanGlynwillie]

What were the many improvements? Packard Merlins were fitted in the Spitfire XVI which did not show any improvement in performance over the IX which had the Rolls Royce Merlin. The RAF only assigned the XVI a different mark number because Packard Merlin used different tooling. (I.E. their nuts and bolts were different).

[devil952]

P-51s, particularly the later models were mounted with Packard Merlins which had many improvements over rolls royce.

[finalreminder]

Kinda wierd watching a Mustang but hearing a Spit :/

Cool though!

[Rafal34671]

this is P51 ?????

[goozie72]

Rabbit leader! Yellow nose bastards at 5 o'clock high, coming down! Roger that rabbit6! All Rabbits break, break, break! daa daa daa daa daa! His on your tail johnny look out, look out! Ahhhhhhh, Your burning, Get out johnny get out! Again The battle of Britain move! Yes I'm a sad Fkr without a life! Gents if you ever get to england go to the Duxford air museum on their air display days and stand behind a Spit or Hurricane thats idling and feel the wind and engine re verb! Excellent I did it!

[jordyboy321]

lovely sounds

[mungoesmad]

Will you Brits stop knocking the septics, they're bloody good customers. Frank Wittle and Rolls Royce did very well when they wanted engines. As did the Germans and the Russians when they wanted rockets. I Know they're not the sharpest knives in the draw but for an isolated country they seem to have plenty of spondoolies. Oh! What joy, this beats badger baiting.

[goozie72]

It's like shooting rats in a barrel!

You'll be in a barrel if you don't watch out!

LOL

Battle of Britain.

[SLIMIMPHAL]

LOL!!

[britarthc]

bless you at 1:09

[gortch666]

that was funny!!!

[ThePhantomMajor]

Beware of the Hun in the Sun

[minuteman3]

I think I got a woody from this!!! Its like listening to a chevy 350 with a huge cam. What a treat!!! God, please never let us forget about internal combustion!!

[robbie5380]

a chevy 350?? this is a 25litre V12..sounds even better than the chevy

[viceroytennis]

Very nice. Packard built the very best Merlins and that comes from Derby or should I say Crewe. Both Ford and Packard astounded RR with their very high standards. They were of course initially sceptical that anyone could match theirs. I'm a Brit by the way.

[tylerleatherman]

Ok, it's cool that some of u go to wiki to learn more about stuff... but don't get all wiki'ed up and leave comments on here to try and sound cool. You end up sounding dumber than already are...

[vonjager]

lol @ 1:09. Bless you!!! :)

[ThePhantomMajor]

hehe, hear what u mean mate, hope he brought his hanky.

[violinbloke]

Interesting point: British Merlins used a supercharger, US ones used a turbocharger. The output was similar, but the Britsh ones had 150lbs of thrust from the exaust pipes. That's 'free' power! The US ones sound nicer, though...they've got that whistle!!

[MaXiLeeCH]

@ Violinbloke, What a crock of shite.

All Merlins were Supercharged, not Turbocharged.

Some had a single stage blower, some had two stages, indeed, some had no supercharging at all and they were used in Tanks and other ground vehicles.

The whistle IS the supercharger, both it's intake noise and the gear drive for it.

It seems to me sometimes that this place is almost as bad as wikipedia for misinformation.

[violinbloke]

Thanks for being so polite. Wikipedia is, as you say, mostly misinformation. Have you not read the great Bernard Hooker book, 'Not Much of an Engineer'? He doubled the output of the supercharger at Rolls Royce, and then went on eventually to design the world's most efficient engine, the Bristol (later Rolls) Olympus.

[ThePhantomMajor]

What's the Griffen engine then ... thought it was for all intents & purposes a supercharged Merlin

[MaXiLeeCH]

Griffons too were supercharged (both single and two stage, not turboed. (After all, the Griffons were only a licenced copy of the RR Merlin, albeit a bit larger in engine capacity)

[MaXiLeeCH]

I believe that some of the only turbocarged WWII aircraft were the P47, the P38, the B29 and the Connie.

Generally speaking, turbocharging was predominatly used by the US of A and the Poms predominatly used superchargers.

There are merits for and against for each, but they are outside the scope of this discussion.

[violinbloke]

Maxileech....In your own words this was a croc of shite last week. Now it's true. Fab.

[saab900se]

Blimey have you been at the funny juice. The Griffon is nothing like the Merlin. It's a 37 litre engine which was developed from the Buzzard, itself a development of the engine that powered the Supermarine S6B. The work on the Buzzard was dropped to concentrate on the PV12 which became the Merlin. The other big difference that the Merlin and The Griffon rotated in opposite directions.

[musewolfman]

The Merlin would not take turbocharging. some would not perform properly, and others would overheat and explode. that was just one of the quirks of the engine.

[ragman95xf]

It does not matter what vehicle it is in,be it boat,car,plane,tractor whatever,you can always tell the unmistakable sound of a Rolls Royce engine..

[johnster1964]

All designed and built in the days before CAD, computers or even calculators!

I heard the story (and as a Brit I can tell it) that Rools Royce were rather sniffy about Packard's engineering abilities bearing in mind the amazingly consistent and close tolerances that assembly of this engine required. However since packard (with Peerless and Pierce Arrow) were the blue blood of American motordom (OK OK Duesenberg, Marmon etc), RR has to swallow their words when they saw the Packard product

[DG121480]

pencils and slide rules... Gotta love it!

[dday0606]

There is no sound like it!

[spitzbang]

It was Packard in the sense that Packard built a Merlin from RR specs. Like England sewing a Stars and Stripes and calling it English.

AJ

[paul1967sherwood]

would I be correct in thinking that the merlin fitted to the P51 was in fact a Packard merlin and not Rolls Royce?

[GERMANOPHILE]

Ya know, I,m a confirmed "Spitfire" lover, but the P51 is o, so close a second! beautiful plane!!!

[xshilox]

who cares wat one was better!because of them i dont have to speak german

[JayKay3000]

wow! I'v been browsing a lot of thse mustangs. The sound is like automotive sex to the ears aside from the bauty of the P51 - if only planes sounded like this still. Instead of the ear shattering roar from the jet engine.

[wildwoodd]

merlin..in a yank plane??? i dont get it.its wrong isnt it?it should be in a spit/mossie or am i wrong???

[ralpius]

I'm afraid that you are wrong/mistaken. The Mustang was a competant aeroplane that lacked high level performance. Realising that the Merlin was about the same size as the installed Alison unit British engineers installed one in a Mustang. The rest - as they say - is history.

[hatchzords]

rofl as much as the mozzi and spit owned they also another reason the mustang owned as well

[Alisterwolf66]

Indeed, ralpius is right! In April of 1940, the RAF's Air Fighter Development Unit found the high-altitude performance of the original Allison unit to be "unsatisfactory" and, led by Sir W.R. Freeman, lobbied for the use of the proven Rolls-Royce Merlin. North American (the company) began using the Packard-built variation in 1943 with the P-51B. The one you see here is a P-51D.

[EddieHfromBottom]

The Merlin was fitted to Mustang to replace the Allison V12 that was originally fitted. It made a mediocre aircraft come alive. Lets just get one thing straight. Noone will ever convince an Englishman that the Mustang is better than the Spitfire. It cannot happen, so rooted in our history and culture is that aircraft. So please America, just leave it out!

[RudoIphVaseIino]

The mustang also had another sound as well as the delicious merlin roar. That was the whistle across it gun ports when in a low level turn. Listen next time you see one at an airshows.

I am off to the former RAF base at Duxford, Cambridgeshire next week. Here the Merlin was first wedded to the Mustang's aircrame. The rest is history

Mike, London, England

[NickSayle]

The mustang is a good plane, But to hear a Merlin while watching a Spitfire in flight is a whole different thing

[cvfd305]

the merlin was it the mustang too. the sounds aren't any different. and to be honest, the Mustang would beat a Spitfire

1 on 1 hands down. the reason, maneuverability

[minenu11]

Absolutely incorrect. A mustang has an aerofoil designed for high speed and good cruise efficiency. The spit has an older aerofoil that bestows much better maneuverability. The mustang however will beat a spit hands down in a dive, again because of the laminar flow wing

[bozonono]

rolls provided the basis and packard the improvements and mass production in record numbers and time. bothe companies had a history of working together from WW1 packard didnt just make the merlin it made it better!

[69adrummer]

I agree too. I got a bit of a chubby watching it! Those must have been the days!

[GERMANOPHILE]

such a beautiful engine sound the ole Merlin! in the spitfire and this beautiful aircraft the P51 almost sexual eh?! ok, I agree, I'm sad!!!!

[shimon174b]

Sweet, sweet sound.

[tpvalley]

Just cant beat british engineering! although the americans did invent oxygen. They never developed the Allison engines enough to compete with the merlin, supercharging etc.

[thejackal9mm]

That engine's note is pure sonic sex.

[mrspivvy]

I couldnt agree more. It sends shivers down my spine

[sxakj]

Nice video and the Merlin sound is unique, but I would slightly prefer the Griffon sound!

[AIRANORAK]

nice vid, in the first segment where's the P51 taking off from the scenary is fantastic!

[Vitesse1971]

The Rolls~Royce Merlin engine changed the P51 Mustang from a mediocre fighter to one of the best, which strangely enough gave it the nick-name 'Cadillac of the Skies'. The plane could fly higher, faster and more efficiently. Rolls!Royce engines reign supreme!

[ledge61]

But Packard made 'em better !!

[Vitesse1971]

ledge61 - you must be an American to have made such a remark! Remember that Packard used R~R expertise.

[ledge61]

Go and talk to v12 engine builders and see what they say !!

[dairwin2000]

Packard's genius was mass production, consistent high quality and simplification of many production aspects. They even duplicated the UK screw thread systems to maintain frontline compatibility. The Merlin was the highest HP/weight piston engine for its physical size until well after the war. Its power doubled during its development, making it highly flexible for many aircraft type. The genius of the Merlin was a blessing for all the allies.

[psychosis80]

why is it some of you guys cant give credit where credit is due..i used to be a bit of an odd job boy on the week ends for a company that overhauled ww2 era piston engines...(mostly for air racers)in their opinion the rr merlin was a better engine than the packard equivalent...btw most of the engineers were yanks and the company was under american ownership

[spencermcgrew]

my ears are bleeding! (in a good way)

[Elliot8752]

same

i love the sound of the merlin engine