Bathurst 1000 1992 Ford Sierra vs Nissan GTR

[flickers456]

Nissan GTR is going to change the V8 Supercar's history after almost a 20 year break... Godzilla is back in Australia ;)

[marek0086]

Ah... no. The Nissan will have pretty much the same performance as the Fords/Holdens due to the design rules. Its not gonna be anything like the old days of GTR dominance.

[potaka79]

The GTR & the Sierra pull away from the Commodore up mountain straight like was nothing.....

[malbucks1968]

Yes the racing was better back then. But for Holden & Ford to make a car as good as the GTR, in this country with outdated road laws. Just wouldn't be allowed. There were plans in the 70's for supercars ( as the press called them) & the presure from outside parties killed that idea. So to go with a 2 make series in this country is a lot easier.

[bigerch85]

Big hairy balls back then.

[Suprastar77]

FUCKEN NO WAY A GTR IS A TYPICAL STREET CAR. WTF. THE GTR WAS AIMED AT THE RACING DEPARTMENT AND ALOWED ALOT OF RACING TEAMS TO BUY THEIR GOD DAMN GTR'S SO THEY COULD BE TURNED INTO 600HP MONSTERS MAINLY BECAUSE FIRST NISSAN COULD NOT INCREASE THE POWER OUTPUT OVER 280 FUCKING HP BECAUSE OF THE GENTALMEN'S AGREEMENT. OTHERWISE THEY WOULD HAVE MADE THE GTR WITH ATLEAST 500HP STOCK.!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!­!!!!!!!!.

[spiritbuu]

that ford is one serious bit of kit

[duo4207]

bathurst is shit now all because we couldn't make a car thats better : (

[hitaro47]

2 absolutely fabulous car; one is sadly forgotten and the other continues to reign it's terror

[mrcruzi]

i agree with blitzman64.... it has just turned in to taxi racing,,, it was far more exciting with the diffrent breeds racing...

[asdfghjklkjhgfdsa555]

bring back group A racing, not this, soon to be nascar supercar rubbish. Come on are bogans really as dumb as the yanks?

[timopheliac18]

@johnnyjrotten

You must be a history expert. Idiot. Cortina engine??? The sierras run a purpose designed twin cam 2 l 4 cyl engine designed by cosworth. No cortina pieces of shit under those bonnets, and certainly nothing designed in the 60s. Thanks for wasting everyone's tine with your stupid comment though. 30 seconds of our lives we will never have back

[johnnyjrotten59]

Ford Sierra runs a 1960s ford cortina engine with a turbo straped to the exhaust - Recon a Cortina with a turbo would be scary.

[HouseOfHorsePowerInc]

im a holden man but that GTR was a monster wont deny it and i respect it! wish they didnt ban it the other cars was more exciting back then

[donbrashsux]

Mighty GTR

[MaCcAM40a3]

Im a Holden guy, but I love how the fans where complaining about the GT-R when the Sierra is a European car....

[xrayracer1]

@MaCcAM40a3 i know, all things being equal.......

[MaCcAM40a3]

@xrayracer1 What do you mean?

[xrayracer1]

@MaCcAM40a3 they complained about the GTR being unfair but the sierra was just as unfair as its power to weight ratio was about the same as the GTR. I saw a "fun race" between brocky and his son in his old racing commodore, and dick johnson in his racing ford sierra at surfer's paradise, and the sierra smoked it out of the corners every time. so thats why i said: "all things being equal".

[MaCcAM40a3]

@xrayracer1 Sorry my bad :). I really do hope we see some new manufactorers coming into the V8's after CoTF. It would be awesome to see the likes of BMW, Mercedes, Audi, Toyota and Nissan again.

[thesulo12]

@MaCcAM40a3 they were actually encouraging other manufacturers to join the v8 supercars ford accepted it but holden said that it is a waste of their money and time guess they got scared :P

[rayjaymor85]

@thesulo12 - Nothing to do with being scared -- Toyota don't produce a V8 for sale in Australia, so they don't see the point in being involved in a V8 only race. Same story for Mitsubishi and Mazda. Nissan simply won't enter because they were deliberately shafted in 1993 so I don't personally blame them. (I'm actually a fan of V8s but would like to see Touring Cars make a return because the two-horse race has become quite dull)

[cyz44]

@xrayracer1 believe it or not the GTR was the heaviest car on the track in those days, not many people are aware but due of its early dominance, the GTR was slapped with a 100kg weight penalty.....and they still won.... i agree, everyone wanted to ban the GTRs so bad, they forgot to mention of the sierra's dominance..

[spazo567]

Great times and you cant blame Nissan for building a dominant race car. But that was the problem it wasn't a Ford or Holden.

[billybodybuilder]

The good old days , ,V8's , turbo's !! what a good mix .. now it's BORING AS FUCK !

[blitzman64]

Why didn't the Aussies just build a better car rather than banning the next generation?!!!

[JimdiGris1]

@blitzman64 it wasnt about "building a better car" it was about 1. "unfair" rules and 2. money. group a rules deliberately made large capacity engine cars uncompetetive, the europeans who made the rules did not want the yanks coming in and spoiling the party with big v8s and the obvious power advantage so they made them uncompetitive with weigh penaties. money. it cost 50-80k to build a group c car, gibbos godzilla was reportably the first 1 million group a car. things had to change

[JimdiGris1]

@blitzman64 so lesser than the top five teams had no chance in group a simply because they couldnt afford to build a car to compete. the idea of the new formula was every team could afford to race and be on a level playing field because the cars were all the same and tightly controlled. add this to the meathead aussie fan that didnt like some rice burner blowing off his beloved commodore the series was fast becoming unpopular. so they created v8supercars, mainly to appeal to the meathead fans

[2005blackpearl]

@blitzman64 because the domestic market wasn't (and still isn't) big enough to justify consistly losing money trying to compete with $100,000 (price of an R32 GTR in 1992) cars built by multinational corporations just to win a racing series. Especially when the rules require you to sell 500 of them and the country is in the midst of a recession as a result of an ineffectual politicians (like much has changed there).

It just isn't good business.

[wertpollwert]

@blitzman64

i dont know.but i remember when skafe won bathurst in the GTR fans booed him. then a few years later the same fans were cheering him.

[TheLeggera]

@blitzman64 cause simply, they can't, compare the new HSV to the new GT-R ? the GT-R is still alot faster

[swagonwheels]

@blitzman64

OK, let's see why we stuck with our Ford and Holden dual shall we?

First of all, if your cars were so popular, why is it they weren't able to come up with a series they could race in which was as popular as what we now call V8 Supercars?.

We Aussies have our favourites, it's as simple as that.

[darkfire959]

@blitzman64 Simply because they couldn't, and still can't. Lol

[papapetad]

@blitzman64 Coz they want to sell their oversized pieces of shit... Can't allow mid sized monsters to tarnish the reputation of what essentially are more refined versions of yankee luxo barges. It's all about marketing. The very idea of turning massive sedans into race cars is ridiculous XD

[thekiwicanuck]

@blitzman64 Because a Skyline can't tow your family, camping gear, and boat down to the beach on 4x4 tracks...

[VinuraVinura]

Lol the ae86, was not expecting to see one of those at all.

[dreamseller01]

the GTR was Australian delivered. $110,000 from your local Nissan dealer. The GTRs also didnt run rear steering in race trim.

[sonor1981]

id like to see f1 here someday ?

[Niggle007]

I would like to see the rest of the world cars in there just to bring up the level of racing here.

Not just Aussie ford and GM.

Do you remember the Jags as well.

[TupacX2Pak]

@Niggle007 BMW is negotiating deals now to enter, Nissan and a couple other Jap manufacturers are showing interest too. Won't be anything of it though, as usual when BMW and the Japs start to analy dominate the Aussies again, Ford and Holden'll go have a cry again and they'll find a way to outlaw everyone except them.

[Niggle007]

Those were real races different makes not this 2 horse race.

Bring back real racing.

[shmcmillan]

@Niggle007 Also remeber that the GTr and Sierra were never sold in Australia,we wanted a production car race made of Aussie cars.

[nigelsenchez]

Dammit, it was the little car.

[smuelslice8]

How do the Sierras and GTR's campare tot he modern V8 Holden and Ford supercars of today? Did they have they similar power and speed? Great vid as well mate.

[tjmag2]

@smuelslice8 Sierras were putting out about 410kw. GTR 450kw. Current V8 supercars are about 450-475kw. The V8s are about 5 seconds quicker around Bathurst.

[MRJARDIM]

@tjmag2 Yeah, but the V8 supercars are purpose built race machines...GT-Rs and Sierra were everyday cars with 600hp slapped on them. More exiting racing with touring cars...

[freestyle6699]

@MRJARDIM

Mate sorry to say this, GTR actually stands for Grand Turismo Racer!

That means they are a purpose built RACING car!

Your V8 is merely a TAXI or family car.

[MRJARDIM]

@freestyle6699

You didnt understand what i was trying to say

The sierras and GT-Rs were everyday homoglated cars prepped for racing. There were 48,000 Skyline GT-Rs (R32) built. Those V8 supercars are purpose built, meaning they never were ment to be a road car. Group A is defined as modified production cars. What the GT-R is even though nismo developed it for racing...they still had to make street versions.

[freestyle6699]

@MRJARDIM -

Oh ok but V8's also come in street versions, you see them in everyday family cars.

Group A is for racing, NISMO is for racing.

[ph33x]

@MRJARDIM Actually, the GTR was a purpose built race car. They only made it to win races. It wasn't until they did the 400 homologation cars and demand was so huge they decided to keep pumping them out. Even the exhaust manifolds are ported for the 700hp turbos that were used on the comp GTR's. Pistons, cams, turbos, etc were downgraded for emissions + driveability.

When in fact a V8 supercar was originally an everyday car design, with 600+hp (and obviously major modification) slapped on them.

[JBofBrisbane]

@ph33x - Actually, there had to be 5000 2.6-litre turbo Nissan Skylines sold, then the 500 "sporting evolution" versions (i.e. the Skyline GTR) with all the hot bits before such a car could be raced in Group A. The R32 Skyline GTR was no more a purpose-built race car than a Sierra RS500 Cosworth or a Walkinshaw Group A Commodore.

[ph33x]

@JBofBrisbane I had the number wrong, it was 500. If you can show evidence of 5000 cars being produced before the 500 homogation run, I'd accept that. But when you read both Wiki, and the race history of the GTR on thegodzilla(.)com, they both mention 500 in homologation run. The R32 was available before that, but not the GT-R or any RB26 powered Skylines. THEY were road cars. Perhaps that's where you've read something about the number 5000. Not arguing, just pointing out my sources. Cheers.

[swagonwheels]

@MRJARDIM Do you seriously believe what you've written? The GTR was a purpose built race car in every meaning of the words, and so were the Sierra's. Back then, the Holden was just a Modified family sedan in comparison. If you're going to try to mouth off, at least get your facts straight. WE, us Australians, stopped going to the races, we saw what was happening with the competition as cheating, this is where V8 Super-cars came from. They didn't exist back then..

[MRJARDIM]

@swagonwheels

Group A referred to production-derived vehicles limited in terms of power, weight, allowed technology and overall cost. Meaning Group A cars are modified street cars.

The V8 Supercars are purpose built, not derived off the street models like GT-Rs were.

I'm not mouthing off, but you seem to have your defenition of "Purpose built" twisted.

[swagonwheels]

@MRJARDIM Hi, Actually, you may have confused my critics comments with mine. I completely agree with you. The critic was trying to compare apples with oranges when he tried to compare Godzilla type vehicles with Holdens at the time. The critic obviously isn't aware of the facts or our motor sports history, or he was just being too one eyed. Regardless, Holden has the runs on the board, end of story, lol.

[tanoAE86]

@swagonwheels

haha, do YOU seriously believe what you have written????

let me get this straight.... you claim the opposition to be "cheating"... by entering "race built" vehicles.... into a race?

do you understand what you are saying?

cheating by entering race cars.... into a race. What a load of garbage!

i guess the birth of the V8 supertaxi's makes a lot more sense to me now.

thanks for clarifying.

[swagonwheels]

@tanoAE86

You don't seem to have comprehended my actual words, as a result, I'm having trouble understanding the point you're trying to make.

There are different categories, we had a mixture of categories within each race, but the fans didn't like that concept, they wanted their Holden's and Ford Falcons, the Buzz Boxes didn't impress, that's just the way it was.

It's true, there was cheating, two Sierra's were disqualified at Bathurst, as a result Brock was handed that win.

[fstylezkrNNN]

@MRJARDIM LOL GTR is a race car :S... so is supra an rx7 :| ... just cause there not a v8 ohjheez

[rayjaymor85]

@fstylezkrNNN -- Dude, your missing his point.. The cars here (including the RX-7 and GTR) can be bought and driven by regular joe. The V8 Supercars are purpose built for racing and nothing else - you will never own a V8 Supercar on the road. (Which means the whole Ford v Holden argument is just stupid - they have no relation to their on-road counterparts)

[OpeiGrafikka]

@MRJARDIM It only became V8 supercars after Ford and Holden pushed other classes out when it got too embarrassing to lose to cars far less powerful. How many times did non-V8's take the outright win? Leyland / Mini took a few, as did Mazda, Nissan, Toyota...

And the cars were spec'd to the same standards then, they were all purpose built or stripped and rebuilt, you can't just 'slap' 600hp into a car.

[MRJARDIM]

@OpeiGrafikka for the last time people

The GTR, Sierra, Corolla, etc. were homologated street cars that were bought originally as street cars and then converted to race cars retaining the basic structure and outside appearance. V8 Supercars were never road going, therefore PURPOSE BUILT. Just because you can make a road car into a race car does not mean its PURPOSE BUILT. The original plan for the road car was for it to be a road car! 500 lucky ones got the racing treatment.

[swagonwheels]

@MRJARDIM

Holden and Ford were touring cars. Sierra's were absolutely purpose built race cars.

There was a massive Muscle car scare here in the 1970's, it took decades for the local producers to eventually admit they were building performance vehicles, they used the likes of Perkins, Johnson and Brock to pretend they were the ones modifying the cars the Factories actually homologated. To make anything like a Sierra or Nissan locally, was considered PR suicide for the brands.

[fstylezkrNNN]

@MRJARDIM Skyline is a race breed car is just not australian like saying v8 super cars you can buy there models the SS & XR8 for street use .. just like you can buy the normal 280bhp skylines. the base model of v8 super cars have always been to promote there street model :) no such thing as a race only breed car unless its GT300 / 500 lemans an f1 series anything else has a regally car built up :)

[RustyStallioNZ]

@fstylezkrNNN V8supercars are completely built up. No parts from the road cars are used. The Fords and the Holdens are just the same car with a different body that is 'based' on the actual road car.

[Suprastar77]

@MRJARDIM Are you nuts? The GTR's are mainly built for racing dude. where the hell did you hear they were for everyday driving. they CAN BE driven everyday but its main purpose was at the track. and due to the gay ass Gentalmens agreement the GTR's were only limited to 280HP other wise the GTR's and the supras would be rolling out over 500HP stock from the factory.

[MRJARDIM]

@Suprastar77 You telling me 48,000 PRODUCTION GT-Rs mainly built for racing? that means Nismo shoulda built 48,000 Evolution GT-Rs rather than 500....... 1 last time. GROUP A MEANS MODIFIED PRODUCTION CARS WHAT DONT YOU PEOPLE GET?!?!?!?!?!

[kaychikybabexo]

@MRJARDIM nissan knew the group a rules thats why they built that many

[MRJARDIM]

@kaychikybabexo Group A rules:

2500 out of 10000 "Skylines" had to be GT-Rs

500 out of the 2500 GT-Rs had to be "Evolution" models for homologation

Nisaan built 570 "Evolution" models

Nissan also Built 48,000 GT-R models, 45,500 more than they needed.

[marek0086]

@Suprastar77~ They dont come out of the factory as "race" cars!

They're high performance street cars. They didnt come with fuel surge tanks or gated oil sumps. 

[marek0086]

@Suprastar77~ 280hp was BS. They were actually pushing out around 320hp.

[JimdiGris1]

@tjmag2 this is mainly due to a better chasis, better downforce and tyre technology rather than brute horsepower. the v8supercars may look like a falcon and commodore, but the chassis is nothing like one

[TasmanProductions]

Damn two different cars with strengths and weaknesses - the Skyline with its awesome four wheel steer but not the highest top speed and the Sierra with its awesome straight line speed and reasonable handling, but not as good as the GTR.

[grinaldo666]

@TasmanProductions just remember the winfield's had to be de-tuned twice to make it more even

[Genukie]

@TasmanProductions id like to see the r32 gtr and sierra back in the bathurst taking on the super v8s with no limiters

[rotorg33k]

awesome to see the ford take on the skyline!! bot monsters back in there day!

cheers