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From: bobobiggalo
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  • Just a question/observation. I was a free-faller a hundred years ago :-), we had many chute openings with BIG line twists; but, they were always very easy to clear. (these were "round" & "oval" chutes). What is the problem with "today's chutes that line twists are, not only common, (it appears), but are so much harder to clear. Thanks, B-6370 & N-6395T

  • the best decision depend´s of your altitude!

  • Congratulations in getting it back, but personally I think I would have chopped it about 3 seconds earlier. but "Hey Ho" we all make descisions and this one came good for you, Well done!

  • i would agree with newton. body position could have been a factor along with uneven pack. every opening is a little different regardless. most fatalities are low number jumps or high number jumps, just the way it is. If i were flat out in a spin, i probably would just chop, but i have rode spinners before for fun. played with chutes with blown center cells before choppin'. as long as you are aware of your altitude, you're doing o.k.

  • did you scream because it hurt or because you saw the malfunction already when it deployed?

  • @SamuelKroell11 Cause it happened! It didn't hurt at all! Just opened funky,and started spinnin up!

  • fuck that. not that fun to die for

  • @kosmosleha you know from experience?

  • Like a boss brother! LOVE IT LOVE IT LOVE IT! You keep your cool you dont freak out, not even take the time to drop a "shit!" or 'Fuck!" just look up notice the situation and deal with it, no panic, nothing. Like a damn pro. Blue skies!

  • WOW

  • So, as a one time skydiver, and planning to go again, can anyone tell me what causes this and how to get out of it? Is it bad form on the deploy? Bad packing? shitty ass luck? Last resort I guess is pull your reserve? And when you pull your reserve it automatically cuts the main off, right?

  • @Nickodemusodurn Not all systems are set up for the main to cutaway when the reserve is pulled. Make sure you know which one you have. Rigger,or instructor will know what your jumping if you don't.but you will have to.

    I have been told by a know it all.that my body position was bad when i deployed but after doing it 2000 times,i am not likely to believe it. That is usually the cause but other variables are there. Bad packing was to blame on this one i believe. last resort,cutaway,,reserve.

  • @Nickodemusodurn could be lots of things.. worn broken line stows.. deployment bag spinning while deploying, body position.. didn't chop it right away... since it was open.. and open high enough to Think out the situation, you can usually see if you are going to be able to kick out of it or not.. if the spin is causing you to spin in the direction casuing you to put more twists in.. or going on your back.. CHOP it, if you are un-winding, and have the Altitude.. you can usually get out of it.

  • @Nickodemusodurn it can be one of a few things which can cause twisted lines mostly when the canopy opens unevenly on deployment, bad body position eg, spinnning on deployment, bad packing,no disrespect bobbobbiggalo, doesnt matter if you have done 10000 jumps everyone opens badly now and then and everyone whos done a few jumps stuffs there chute in and thinks that will do !! awsome save by the way !!!

  • @Nickodemusodurn

    You're looking at an unstowed brake while the canopy is inflating. Take a look at :35 ... the canopy is flying on one side and not the other, and the canopy spirals. The other brake is quickly removed.

    It happened so quickly because its a velocity.. I've had this happen on my crossfire as well. Anything elliptical, really.

  • Any reason u didnt cut? No desrespect, u did a Great save, but u prob had 2-3sec. Looked like about 1500feet at the end

  • @2handle2hard

    It was about 1800 when i started going straight again. I had time,and i really didn't feel like chopping it. Wasn't my canopy,and i didn't want to go searching for everything later,i had a real job,and i was on my lunch break. Would of if i needed to,but i didn't feel it was necessary yet.

  • Jesus man, I'd have cut that away asap!

  • Bobo- the gentleman who had this rig after me had a similar malfunction to mine, had similar injuries. He lived but unfortunately they had to amputate a leg. That Velo111 is cursed.

  • a knew a skydiver who died in case of similiar malfunction. In His case - he tried to recover from twist.... to the end.

    p.s. - yes - he had AAD - but he was falling "too slow" to make AAD work.

  • had the spin malfunction before, but shit, never went horizontal like that. glad to see you made it brother!

  • why didnt you cutaway?

  • @pmny119 Didn't have too!  It was a perfectly opened canopy! Just with a little annoyance. It happens!

  • Shit dude!!! Nice recovery!!!

    I ask that all skydivers reading this post, please take a minute of silence, lost a dear friend to a swooping accident on Sunday 31 July 2011 10h30 am in South Africa.

    Much appricated.

    Blue skies and many safe landings!

  • it happened to me on my AFF but i was really scared to cut away but survived, next time i will cut away with no second thought. ( my instructor gave me the worst slap on my head once she know about it )

  • "Go Piss up a rope" haha great description

  • Gott segne dich mein Sohn....

  • @dimatisfy  Danke!

  • It makes me wonder can you get focused on untwisting your rig and forget how high you are off the ground?

  • @jock150 You def can! You get caught up in getting the twists out and flat splat stuck like that! You have to keep in mind that if you spend to long not paying attention to the ground,it will come up too soon. So if things don't start working for you soon,then it's time to cut that bitch away! Always know your altitude!

  • I just did my first AFF jump today.

  • @mikedamat Congrats and blue skies to you! Have fun and stay safe!

  • Comment removed

  • I seriously cant believe you saved that.Nice job man..I would of choppe

    d it ..:)

  • Comment removed

  • great job man! i hate toggle fires, you only realize them when you're finally out of the twist...

  • After 3 tandem jumps, I have decided to go for my AFF, which I start this Saturday. May 7 2011. It took two tandem jumps for me to decide, The 3rd one was 6 months after the 2nd as I had to feed the monster in my head. While malfunctions are an in inevitable part of skydiving, you shouldn't let that get in your way should you decide to take classes.

  • @Bambadda Good luck man! I hope you make it! lol Sorry. i say that to everyone. I hope you had a good jump! Hopefully you had good weather for it. Jump to live and live to jump,i always said. It is a shame i dont get to jump much anymore,but i sure loved it when i had it. Keep your head on a swivel and have the best time of your life! Blue Skies Always!

  • you are a example

  • I'm not looking foward to using them high-proformance canopies lol.

  • @chris24leyland .Its not a matter of if,its a matter of when. And knowing that there is always a possibilty,means that you are aware,and keeping your head out of your butt,and having a level head,should help you out for the rest of your skydiving life. Have fun and be safe! Blue Skies Always!

  • @bobobiggalo Very true, my friend. You handled it very well :) Thanks for the reply. Blue Skies :)

  • Mad props for getting out of that! I thought I was gonna see you chop! Looked like you were losing a LOT of altitude. After you got out, it didn't look like it recovered very quickly?!! I guess the Velo doesn't have a very fast recovery arc.

  • Looked damned near to low to chop when it finally opened and when it did it seemed to stay diving at the ground for ages.

    Any inexperienced people here ignore the nuisance stuff ....... if you get one anywhere near as violent as this just cut away immediately and argue about it on the ground.

    No instructor is going to be impressed if you almost kill yourself.

    No disrespect to the people here with a lot of experience but getting under canopy fast is more important than a reserve repack.

  • jesus my ass would be flinching like a bitch

  • Wow! Way to kick out of those line twists! I would have cut away without even trying!

  • Well done!

    When I was doing my iniciation course (automatic jumps), in the fourth jump the lines twisted just like yours and I spend aproximatelly the same time as you to solve the problem. I was just about to do the cut-away..!

    Only skydivers knows why birds sing!

  • Nice job in gettin out of that..Most guys would of chopped it...

  • I'd have cut away looks like u were under 2000 when u straightened out...

  • mad props for the save!

  • Read every comment. Still getting views and opinions huh? :) Well, 4 1/4 rotations require a 1310 degree trip one way and another 1310 back. I guess whether people say it's stupid or way to stay are both driven by what isn't a wrong train of thought, but this is one awesome video to watch, learn, fear, admire...and vicariously live through. Blue skies Joe!

  • for sure.... i would have cut away...

  • Dooooooood.......!!

  • Hi there, I'm thinking of doing an AFF with my father. But seeing this i get a bit frightened...so could you please answer me some questions: What does it depend on if your lines twist? Is there maybe a certain posture or a position to the wind you have to take in to decrease the risk to a minimum? sry for the english, i can't put it better :P

    Max :)

  • @musicbymax

    unless your father is the aff instructor,i would personally never advise anyone to go aff.Mostly because if you have never jumped before,your spending alot of money,alot of time,and you have to try to remember everything you learned in 6 or 8 hours,in a minute and then you have to land! Tandem is the best way to start for the simple fact that you may never want to do it again.

    Line twist is an annoyance,thats all. Due to bad posture,or pack job mostly.kick and twist!

  • @bobobiggalo

    thanks for your answer. i will do a tandem jump at any rate before attempting an aff course....so do you recommend a conventional course (if it still exists) instead of aff? or no skydiving at all :( ?...but then...why do you do it? :P

    your reply is much appreciated :))

    greets,

    Max

  • @musicbymax Most of the dropzones have a progression course,and it just consists of starting tandem,or aff or static line,then they progress you on to jumping by yourself. At any rate,it is worth it. I personally would recommend the tandem,but others may not. Too each their own. It just seems to me that if you want to jump once,let them do all the work,and after that,uyou decide if you want to keep doing it. I love to skydive! It is the best thing going! Good luck! and Blue Skies to you!

  • @bobobiggalo

    Blue Skies and thank you very very much :))

    Max

  • @musicbymax yes do a tandem first it will let you know what your getting yourself in for while having a very expierenced pilot in control. i done 2 tandems in august and am doing my aff course at the moment. i got line twists on my first jump but lucky for me i wasnt spinning and the canopy was in control and flying straight all i had to do was pull apart the risers and kick out. hope you go for it because it's the best thing i have ever done just remember to relax and not panic

  • you have bigger balls than me !! I would of cut away for sure

  • that was fucking awesome dude! bad ass!

  • I've just graduated AFF and can categorically say that based on best practice teaching, this was NOT a nuisance, it was a cut away- clear and simple. There was no guarantee control was going to be regained, & the spin could have serious disorientated the guy. The one thing to remember with cutting away is NOT to hesitate, which is exactly what happened here. When you're under a stable canopy vertical & have a few twists, it's no biggie. But spinning like this is a different situation altogether.

  • did you stop the spin by kicking or were you pulling the rissers apart? I dont understand how you could have kicked out of that due to the centrifical force

  • Can I ask a serious question from you qualified divers, please? I'm 39 and I've done over a dozen SSL jumps (last one over five years ago) and I'm seriously thinking about jumping the AFF course in a few months.

    One thing I distinctly remember from my SSL training (when under canopy): twists are ALAYS classed as 'nuisances factors' and you should never cutaway if you're canopy is square.

    A lot of you guys are, however, saying the guy in this vid SHOULD have cutaway.

    WTF?

    Confused...

  • A nuisance is all it was! Just a long nuisance! Alot of people don't wanna spend the time to get through it,but i had faith in my spinning technique,that i would be fine! lol No really i just thought i had time,and i did,thats all. You will prolly get 10 answers from ten people and they will all be different. Have fun and do whatever it is you wanna cause we ain't gonna be here forever!

    Blue SKies!

  • A nuisance is all it was! Just a long nuisance! Alot of people don't wanna spend the time to get through it,but i had faith in my spinning technique,that i would be fine! lol No really i just thought i had time,and i did,thats all. You will prolly get 10 answers from ten people and they will all be different. Have fun and do whatever it is you wanna cause we ain't gonna be here forever!

    Blue SKies!

  • @gravitygrabber Line twists on a 280 sq/ft canopy that barely turns even in normal flight is a "nuisance factor". Line twists on a 100 sq/ft canopy that's spinning and diving at the ground = chop or hit the ground at 70mph. If that was me on that video, I would have been hitting the handles lol

  • @gravitygrabber, you do what you can IF you have altitude. If there is any doubt that you will not have full control of your canopy by your hard deck(lowest reserve deployment altitude), chop chop chop.

  • @gravitygrabber Well, there are many "square" canopies. The one in this video is a high performance, fully eliptical, very highly loaded, crossbraced canopy. A twist is NOT a nuisance, but a very real cutaway situation.

    I would have cut away: dude, you either love that canopy too much or you have balls of steel

  • @gravitygrabber He was not under a "square." He was under an elpitical canopy in which line twists can and will cause a diving spinning parachute. If left under a spinning canopy it is possible for the pilot to increase G-force to the point of losing consciousness or so much pressure can be put on the three-ring system that a cutaway is impossible. Line twists however, are fixable even on an elliptical as you can see in the video. I like how the pilot kept his shit together. I would've chop

  • @gravitygrabber Line twist are a nuisance, until you reach your hard deck (the altitude in which you will go through emergency procedures). Sometimes, line twists are so bad, that you can't get out of them, and have no choice but to cutaway.

  • @gravitygrabber There is a lot of difference between a big, slow student canopy and a small crossbraced canopy with, I guess, a high wingload. A student canopy would rarely spin itself into a linetwist like this and if it had it would never spin as fast as this canopy unless there were some other error as well.

  • @gravitygrabber Student canopies tend to be very stable in line twists, and it is no big deal. As you can see, his high performance canopy was not at all stable. What you might not have been able to see or tell from this video is that he likely lost well over 1000ft in altitude while the canopy was spinning. He also was pulling considerable G forces which can get worse as time goes on and make things that much more difficult.

  • it depends how high you are, having 2-3000 feet to go, i would enjoy to fight it like you did until your feet get jam-packed of blood, it was probably exhausting. you just avoid yourself a canopy hunt in the forest!

  • YeeHaw!! It spun you up higher than the chute :-D. You held it longer than I would've. Time for Plan-B.

  • damn way to stay with it!! i would've chopped that for sure.

  • Kudos to you for staying with it. I´d have cut and run after about 3secs of spinning.

  • my palms are all sweaty now, great job correcting that

  • Damn, that thing spun up like crazy! It seemed to open on heading, then spun itself. Good save!

  • I would of chooped that shit...

  • it was borrowed gear. i think 111 or something smaller. I agree that you should chop too.I had over 2000 jumps and really thought that i had it taken care of.Never doubted it much. lol Be safe and have fun! Blue Skies!

  • It looks like well after you had cleared the twists your canopy was still diving. What size do you fly? Great save by the way, but at my level (33 jumps and no license) I would have chopped.

  • did you kick out or pull risers apart to get out of that?

  • a little of everything i could!

  • Nice!!!

  • Good job however any newbies out there, dont work the problem below your hard deck as you may need your reserve and be to late keep altitude aware through out your recovery attempts.

  • due to an add firing right??

  • Nice ! No panic. Cool bro. Blue skies.

  • Damn! I gotta say......I'm just starting out, 6 jumps away from my A license and my last jump last weekend, I had some major line twists cuz I pulled slightly unstable. Took a good 1500ft to untangle it but I pulled so high I was still around 3500 when all was said and done and I could do a full canopy control check. And I thought *I* almost died!!! LOL! This is nuts! Kudos to you for stickin with it!!!!!!!!!!! BLUE SKIES!

  • Nice! Congrats to you and keep it up! Not the worst thing you will ever do in your life. Just remember to always keep your head out of your ass,and have the confidence that you can take care of things when you need! Thanx for watchin,and Blue Skies to you!

  • I was taught line twist are just a nuscience you just reach up and pull the risers apart. I can see you didnt have stability. Why was it you were spiraling downward...just trying to learn.

  • It is just a nuisance and not much of a malfuntion as taught,i agree.Good on you to recognize that. The reason that i was spinning to the ground in a very fast speed was that the size of my canopy was alot smaller and the line twists put it in an angle that was simialer to a turn as if i was pulling a toggle. Good luck to you and have a blast! It's a great thing as long as you can always remember to keep your head out of your butt.

    Blue SKies to you!

  • all true what you're saying good job ;)

  • Thanx!

    Blue Skies!

    and thanx for watchin!

  • i know this doesnt really relate to this vid. butt why dont jumpers carry a knife incase they cant release their main. im going to jump some day but i want to know as much as possible before i go. if someone with exp could answere it would be much appreciated. thx

    and congrats on being allive to this guy.

  • Simply put,there are 2 handles.one to get rid of the main parachute,and the second to deploy your reserve parachute. The training you will go through will be sufficeint for you to live everytime. No worries! I just held on because i was sure i could regain flight before impact. Peace and blue skies!

  • Just out of interest, what height were you at by the time you had it all sorted?

  • Was about 1800 ft. And not enough time to get back to the Landing area. Long walk is always better than a short carry! Thanx for wathcin! Blue SKies !

  • that is a good point, last time we see your altimeter it was 4,500 would guess you deployed around 4,000 and it took until 1800 to get it flying right.... since it was a tandem video and he opened nice and high.. he had time to work on the problem, if it had been a regular jump with an opening of 2,500 or 2,000 feet... his option to try to correct this would have been much shorter, and would have resulted in a reserve ride.. great job bobo

  • I love all these people who comment on what they would have done, or what you should have done. ITS NOT YOUR JUMP, YOU WERE NOT THERE, SO SHUT THE FUC* UP. Way to handle a shitty situation dude.

  • I thought the same thing but you know how people are. And everyone has to have an opinion. Be well brother,and Ble SKies to you!!

    Joe

  • Glad you're still with us bro!

  • Thanx man! I appreciate it! Theres a couple of people that wouldnt agree with you,but joke em if they cant take a *@*@.

    Blue SKies Brother! Be well and have fun!

  • hey dude... you´re stupid , i had it cut away

  • Wow! Thanx man! I am surprised your even able to write,let alone decide what other people should do with their own lives. Thanx for watching!

  • Not cool at all ..... didnt see any cheking of alti and f**k high speed mal would chopped that as soon as i tried to kick outta it and it didnt work

  • I beg to differ with ya. It was pretty cool! You can obviously see where the ground was the whole time. I still had time! And it all worked out so whos to say. Blue SKies and thanx for watchin!

  • good thing you were altitude aware. OOps I forgot you never look at your altimeter

  • I was plenty aware of my altitude! The ground is a not an easy thing to miss. But thanx for watching!

    Blue Skies!

  • dude amazing thats a how many cell canopy? and are line twists caused by ppacking or bad body position?

  • Comment removed

  • Very nice video, amazing how you fixxed the twist with the spin..

  • It was either spin or cut.And i just wasn't able to make myself cutaway from a perfectly square canopy.lol I just didnt want to chase the main.

    Thanx for watchin!

    Blue Skies!

  • MAXIMUM RESPECT!

  • Dude! It was a pretty stupid move,and i would not advise anyone to ride it out.(but man,what an awesome ride!) lol

    Thanx man! Blue Skies!

  • Great save! I had a similar situation this weekend. Line twists to a spinning mal. Like you, once I cleared the twists, I kept spinning. I checked by brakes and with no toggle fire, I chopped. I wonder how you stopped the spin. Did releasing your brakes and pumping them straighten you out? I didn't feel I had time to do that without knowing for sure. Great Job! Blue Skies!!!

  • Right after the twists were out,i unstowed.I think i probably thought for a second about pulling the slider down,because that is usually first thing,but thought better of it because of altitude.But as soon as the spin was done,and i unstwoed the brakes,the spin stopped.I will tell you that body position in the harness has alot of effect on openings,and i was off center along with bod packjob, But looking back again,i prolly made a stupid decision but it worked. Congrats to you and blue skies!

  • Interesting video. It's quite an executive decision whether or not to chop it in a situation like that, and I'm not sure if I would have kept or chopped that one. I'm guessing you saw a normal rectangular canopy and figured it was worth trying to salvage it, and if it didn't look right you would have chopped it, is that right? Good judgement call on your part.

  • In my opinion, Im sure I would of chopped that cock sucker.

  • Really nice save.. did you think of pulling your reserve at one moment?

  • no! i had other things on my mind.lol i had to go back to work and didnt want to chase the main.

    thanx for watching! Blue Skies!

  • Comment removed

  • CRAZY man nice job though

  • very nice action, stay calm, watch altitude, survive :)

  • lol nice save bro. way to not poon out and go for handles...lol jk. if you knew you didnt have it, cou would have chopped. could you see your alti when trying to kick out?

  • I wasn't paying attention to the altimeter. I knew i had plenty of time just by where the ground was spinning at.I would say i had plenty of time,but it really wasn't i just wasn't too worried about it.I had faith in my ability to do one or the other.Thanx for stoppin by. Blue SKies!

  • nicely done man...ive had the same and its pretty sketchy for a while,best feeling ever not having to chop though

  • I know it was over 2000,i'm just not sure sure how much over it was. I stopped counting,or at least,writing them down,around 2000.I would guess it at 2020.But its all relative right? Thanx for watching brother! Blue Skies Always!

  • very nice save, you must have ice for blood.what jump number was that for you? Sweet vid once more great save and blue skies man!!

  • I'm definitely feeling the "cut away, pull reserve" route!!! Only 18 jumps tho so prob explains it - amazing!

  • "Don't worry about a malfunction. You've got the rest of your life to fix it."

    Great save, Dude. Balls of ICE! I would have cut away at 2500 since I'm only still a student. That's the "decision time" for inexperienced skydivers. I'm doing my AFF 8 this Sunday, can't wait 'til I'm experienced like you. Blue Skyz from Skydive Elsinore!

  • what did your alt read right after you regained control? nice save.

  • I was maybe a TAD under 1800. I had plenty of time and plenty of space to land in,even thought i was off the dz,it was all good! Thanx for watchin!

    Blue Skies!

  • holy crap that was crazy, i would have chopped :) Gj on getting down safe buddy!

    (beer)

  • Iron balls is right! I usually pull at 3500 all these videos make me want to pull at 12k now!

  • Iron Balls.

  • Wow nice landing... nice recovery, Today I passed training for the first time, and I thing I would have cut off in your situation. respect and congrats

  • I have one cutaway in my carreer,and didnt want another if i didnt have to,and i didnt think i had to.lol. i had plenty of time. i certainly would not suggest for anyone else to do that,it is a personal preference,so when you find yourself ever in that circumstance,just go with your heart,and keep your head out of your butt. be safe congrats,and blue skies!

  • Well recovered my friend! You dont see many recoveries with a down plane with that many twists! I would have got off it for sure. How much altitude did you lose during that?

  • I only lost about 4000! lol. i was under it by about 1800.and i only had a short walk before getting a ride at the end of the runway.Thanx for watching brother.Have fun and Blue Skies to you!

  • WTF!!! holy shit men, thats NOT WANTING TO WALK TO GET THAT MAIN, ICE BALLS MEN!

  • Well done for sticking with it. I would've chopped for sure. Good job not passing out too. Must've been a nice bit of G-force!

    Stay safe and don't talk to stangers!

  • i think i would have stuck with it to if i was making really good progress once he started kicking out, sometimes you kick but dont get !$%&*.. i think ill count that gain.

  • Cutting away wasn't even an option. I deployed at 5500 at least,and even though i wasn't out of it until about 1800,i never even considered getting rid of it.Borrowed gear and i had to gt back to my other job,i didn't want to waste any time. Thanx for watching and commenting. Blue Skies Brother!

  • FUCK YEA MAN! I love how you stuck with that! Most people would have cut that away but HOLY FUCK!

  • I just didn't want to mess with trying to find it,truth be told. I had faith in my legs.lol

    Blue Skies brother and thanx for commenting!

  • Damn brother glad you made it. Got my heartrate up just watching your crazy ass, I would've dumped that thing for sure!! Blue Skies!

  • Blue Skies to you too my friend!

    Thanx for watching and commenting!

  • That canopy holds its dive for AGES after the twists finished!

    Well done I guess!

  • It did like to dive,thats for sure. It wasn't mine,so i really had no idea what it would do but it sure was fun,well for the little bit i was under it. Thanx for watchin! Blue Skies!

  • I agree with droznig 100%.. You did a great job of kicking out but DAMNED I would have cut 10 seconds earlier.. No gear is worth a divit.. IMHO

  • Jesus dude, you totally should have cut away, damn dude your nuts for staying under that. You're lucky you got it under control before your AAD kicked in...

  • I was under it and going straight by 1800. And i really didnt want to have to go chasing canopies in corn,and be later than i was,getting back to work.oh,and it was borrowed gear. lol

  • lol thats fair enough, all the right conditions for disaster :P but good job on kicking out when your canopy was going straight down, i didn't even know that was possible! :P

  • Just please dont think can kick them out again on that canopy when your not filming a tandem with the xtra height :P

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