Actually, it's clearly a backdraft. The dark black turbulent smoke and "breathing" that the fire is doing are all telltale signs. It's obvious by looking at it that this fire was starved for oxygen, then when the firefighter puts water on it some of the smoke turns white which indicates water contact with an ignited fuel source that was probably reached by the water stream from the hose breaking a window pain thus giving the fire a new oxygen source.
Clearly a Flashover.Backdraft is an incipient fire starved of o2.Smoke is issuing out of an opening with active fire inside,you just cant see it.The camera vantage point doesnt allow you to see inside of the structure. A flashover is not just the contents of an enclosed container, it also involves smoke emitting out of a structure.When the hoseline was used, it mixed the right amount of o2 and flashed.A smoldering fire does not emit that much turbulent smoke without active burning.
A flashover is the near simultaneous ignition of all combustible material in an enclosed area. A backdraft is a situation which can occur when a fire's product-gases are starved of oxygen; consequently combustion slows but the combustible fuel gases and smoke remain at a temperature above the fire-point of the fuel gases. If oxygen is re-introduced to the fire combustion will restart, often resulting in an 'explosive' effect as the gases are heated by the combustion and expand rapidly.
seems to me when the fire stream hit the glass it rapidly cooled it, causing it to shatter, which introduced oxygen into a deprived environment causing the backdraft. Wicked vid
@somervillefire... did a little Google search and came up with a paper written by ATF Special Agent Steven W Carman about fires referred to as "High Temperature Accelerent Fires"...
in your search box type in: [PDF] Hta Report Oct 1994
@somervillefire... ho-oo, I gotta think back on this one... It had come 2 mind as back then my co-worker and I were following this story through newspapers & magazines. "60 minutes" I think did a couple of spots on it. I'm not xactly sure which insur. carriers' agent broke the method- however, I can recall bits of what he did. US News & World Report comes 2 mind. It was becoming a big thing back then- And suddenly- the fires stopped! Hollywood even did a film over it- now I'm gonna surf 4 this2!
... wayy back in the 80's there was an arsonist(never wz caught) who had a method of creating fires[nationwide] which for a near precise amt of time would burn so hot & fiercely in it's center that when H2O entered that area the H2O became gassified & began a process which caused the H2O to separate in2 hydrogen and oxygen which began a cycle of explosion/gassification/separation/explosion/etc.
This condition lasted for only a short time however, it created incredible fires from 'ordinary' ones
Not to be rude or anything but that was a flashover....there was no "Breathing of the building that I saw...the burst of flame was all the contents in that building or room of building were super heated to the the point of ignition and guess what happens...a flash over..
Since there is visible flame before the stream is introduced, it cannot be called a backdraft. It is a severe flashover caused by the sudden introduction of additional oxygen. Watch it again.
You can tell from the smoke, that the room is about to flash. What happens in this video is the fire stream introduces a fresh supply of oxygen into an environment that's waiting to flash (air pulled in along with the stream). We all know the fire science behind the use of water as an extinguishing agent...expands 1700:1, blah blah blah,...but water doesn't burn...at least not in this neck of the solar system. From backdraft to fully involved - 2 sec. Clearly a backdraft induced FLASHOVER.
Water expands when it is heated. It turns to steam when overheated. So direct a jet into the confined space of a burning building and the water vapourises, expands, and blows back out of the building carrying the hot gases with it. So it's neither flashover or backdraft but a steam 'explosion' for want of a better word.
Hate to dash all of you folks that call this a backdraft, but IT IS NOT A BACKDRAFT!!!! I hate to tell you that this would be a FLASHOVER!!! NOT A BACKDRAFT!!! GO LOOK AT YOUR BOOKS AGAIN!!!! FIREFIGHTER FOR 24 YEARS AND AN INSTRUCTOR FOR FOURTEEN OF THOSE YEARS...
@sgtsmash8158 YA SHOULDNT BE ARGUING OVER THE NAME BUT FIND A CURE TAKE THE 2/0 out OF H20 AND WE MIGHT GET SOMEWHERE WE NEED A BETTER COMPOUND FOR FIRE FIGHTERS TO PUT OUT FIRES AND REDUCE THE RISK OF FLASH OVERS FLASH BACKS BACK DRAFTS AN RECENT GROVENERS FIRE LINTHWAITE SERIOS FIRES LIKE CHEMICAL FIRES SHOULD HAVE AIR SUPPORT IE YORSHIRE FIRE SERVICE HELICOPTOR TO WARN PEOPLE OF DANGER AND TO KEEP AN EYE ON FIREFIGHTERS AND FIRE AT THE SCENE AND FIREFIGHTERS SHOULD BE POSTIONED ON ALL SIDE
deff a backdraft not a very big one but as you can see when the window gets brokeout with the stright stream when slowed down you can clearly see the smoke being sucked in then blown out with force not a lot due to the size and location of the fire but deff not a flash over trust me i have been tought buy the best people that have been in and survived both
@bmxpro021 I'd rather you not teach me, then. As you know, a backdraft is smoke explosion. At no point did I see any inward-sucking of smoke to indicate the conditions of a backdraft. It was a sudden ignition of the superheated gases - textbook flashover.
@nomofica0 this is a backdraft, not a flashover! As the fire fighter on the branch attempts to knock down the fire inside the building he is mixing the air and unburnt fire gasses, once as the mixture becomes a more diluted level the backdraft happens...
Flashover Absolutely!!. Not a backdraft this structure isnt puffing for air but merely reaching ignition temp and perfect air fuel and temp mixture to flash.
This is totally a backdraft caused by the hose stream breaking the front window, introducing fresh air into the smouldering fire. Look at the smoke it's that crap brown color. This is basic Proby stuff.
Backdraft, according to the NFPA definiton: An explosion caused by the admission of fresh air to a closed building containing smouldering fire due to the rapid combustion either of the heated material or the flammable gases therein, or both.
this fire was caused by an individual at the security office putting in too thick of a slice of bread into the toaster. an important safety measure for toast making is to ensure each slice fits comfortably into the grill grip. the HSE recommend using only sliced loaves no thicker cut that a warburton toastie gauge. hovis tin batch are often the cause of many kitchen fires with slices loosely cut to thicknesses that exceed the width of the toasters grill grips. causing wheat ignition.
This is pretty clearly a flashover. The escaping smoke is neither black not puffing. The front of the store didn't exactly look air-tight- the fire was self-ventilating before the flash. My opinion.
the fire was only ventilated seconds before the video starts after the window was put through, prior to that it was starved of oxygen, once the air was introduced, the backdraught occurs.
When the firefighter opened up on the front of the store, the windows broke out intruding a large amount of air to the atmosphere causing a flashover.A very violent one at that!
I agree with graves, I think it's a Backdraft but without enough pressure because the hoseline sucked in fresh air to the heat otherwise it could've have been worst.Anyway thanks god the guys did not go in,we could've been talking about dead firefighters.
its says a shop front so you assume there is a fair amount of glass there. So for the smoke to be pushing out like that the would have already been broken. so offically its a flash over but maybe it was caused by the introduction of more oxygen. But that makes it a backdraft. so i wasent one it was both
Flashover, if it was a backdraft the smoke would have hit they guys across the street with smoke. Instead not even touching the guys with the line on the sidewalk.
It isnt a very violent backdraft but a backdraft non the less. Now what makes this strange is that the fire not only continues burning, but burns very hot. What I feel has taken place, is that the fire progressed until it was right on the verge of flashover. Then it somehow became deprived of oxygen. once the hoseline sucked in fresh air to the heat not only did a minor backdraft occur but flashover occured nearly simultaneously. These are just my thoughts, would love to hear yours.
Either way, a back raft is a backdraft. Thats why they always say check the door, even to little kid's when they go to the school's. You don't know whats on the other side, that's why backdrafts and flash overs are so deadly. Backdraft when the fire is smoldering in a room, a wall, anything really, once you introduce oxygen to it.....BOOM. People don't realize fire is a living thing....it eats, it breathes,
Ok, this is my opinion on this. just an opinion so nobody get their panties in a wad. This is actually a little of both. You can see clearly that yes the fire is venting smoke, you can also see that the smoke is all the way to the floor. It is not pushing hard so that would say that fire progression has slowed for some reason. You can see exactly when the hoseline is sprayed through the door that the smoke curls sucking in fresh air and then wham, fire. (continued)
Not a Backdraft. The smoke is pushing out the front window. Backdraft is caused by a smoldering fire,that lacks O2 to grow. This fire has O2, there is a window already open. Look at the way the smoke is rolling out before the flames, turbulant, heavy, dark. All signs of flashover potential. Once the stream hits the smoke and fire and the thermal layer is disturbed you can see the unburned product of combustion (smoke) ignite. Backdrafts rarely sustain the level of combustion this fire does.
@joek0617 British Fire Appliances actually carry more equipment than american engines. less hose because you have those massive hose beds that we dont have but in general we carry more equipment and enough hose to do our job.
@pyro999maniac yeah, european apparatus work well in the crowded, narrow streets of europe, and our ginormous american apparatus work well in the wide, fairly open streets that we have, and i imagine that britain has denser hydrant coverage, reducing the amount of hose needed
@joek0617 yeah thats true. we can also just plug straigh into the mains, pump from an open water source and if we need more hose we have hose layer trucks.
@EMT667 nothing? we carry more equipment on our Appliances than you......you just have a massive hose bed that takes up space (we roll ours). we are quicker, more mobile etc.
Everyone has to remember the fact that this is 1 viewpoint, 30m away where half the operations is shielded by a firetruck, and one source of audio, so no-one can say for sure what happened or not.
However, if what I am seeing and hearing is correct, this is a Backdraft.
Watch the branch operator test the hose for pressure and nozzle for flowrate and pattern; once they have confirmed the settings, they turn the attention to the building windows and break the glass as they spray water in.
Flashover is the ignition of the flammable vapors emitted from a room's contents via pyrolysis, assuming the fire is not oxygen-restricted.
Backdraft is the explosive increase in a oxygen-restricted fire, due to the increase in oxygen.
From the sounds, when the firefighter sprayed water into the window, it broke the window. This jet pulled fresh oxygen into the fire, which promoted fire growth, size and spread.
no a backdraft is pressure built up wich either blows fire or a heavy cloud of smoke at you. this is a flash over fire went nowhere but up it ran outta fuel they gave it fuel thats called flashing
This was a flash over, not a back draft. Back Draft is self explanatory, the fire sucks air into a confined smoldering fire and explosively turns to flame.
Maybe one of you fire guys can answer this for me. I notice there is no "breathing" fire here (smoke being sucked back into building) or apparent change in the color of smoke before the backdraft, is this not a flashover?
Adamfoley81: As explained to me by a Fire Science major many years ago: Smoke is mostly incompletely burned fuel and very flammable when hot enough. When the water hits the fire some of the water is converted to steam. The expanding steam forces superheated smoke out of the building where it mixes with oxygen and ignites. It is more like a flashover. Backdrafts are driven by convection when a door is opened to an enclosed space where everything is above kindling temperature .
looks like a fire in the room where maIN WINDOW WAS AND ANOTHER IONSIDE THAT WHEN THA COLD WATER HIT IT CAUSING IT TO BREAK then the room that was starved caused that back draft into the main room we could see already burning ....
no now you see, i hate to say it but this is a UK fire service, they where caustious, and staayed well away, all the backdrafts/flashovers ive seen , which where being handled by the US firefighters, at least one of them has been hurt, or come very close
I agree and that's how it should be... get a main ground jet on it first to prevent flashover and then send in BA teams.... which is what they are doing
completely varies on the state of the building, what you mentioned is an agressive technique, used ifthey thik they can salvage the property or if there is people still in there. they could play the defence and contain the fire until it burns out or until they put it out from the outside
Backdraft - you can hear the front window glass shattering from thermal shock as the fire stream touches it. From there, infer enclosed space and a sudden inrush of air through the opened window.
ERROR, eso no es un backdraft, eso es un FLASHOVER, la diferencia es clara, primero poca presencia de humo antes de la llamarada y segundo una llamarada en lugar de una explosión
Looks like the FF knocked the window out with his stream causing the backdraft which was would've happened sooner or later judging on the grey puffing smoke that was coming from that area already.
you guys dont see the pressurized smoke coming from the "a" side? This IS a backdraft, not a flashover. Flashovers may seem explosive, but remember, it is a simultaneous ignition of all combustible materials in a room when they reach their ingnition temp. This looks like that shit has already been burning and got choked out from lack of O2, creating backdraft conditions. When fire crews introduced a positive pressure (a.k.a. the ventilation with the hose stream), this introduced the o2.
it was a backdraught. a probationer spotted the signs and symptoms and warned the oic. it is shown as training at west yorkshire FRS HQ.
i caught a backdraught at the bradford riots with the labour club incident. larger fire larger backdraught. it was a bit of an unknown entity then, scared the sh#t out of me and blew my oppo into the road, riot cops picked us up.
Thats not a Backdraft thats just flashover , thick smoke don't mean Backdraft that smoke was rolling out which means it was vented, a vented fire = NO backdraft. You'll see pressurized puffs of yellow or other dark colored smoke coming from window frames and from doors. not that much.
I agree entirely with firefighter1426. I know what a backdraft is and that had open ventillation on side A of the structure. A backdraft will pull that smoke back in and it didn't here. There were no intervals of yellow-gray smoke. That was simply an induced flashover by the firecrew's attack line.
Wrong I'm afraid. Flashover is he point at which all combustible surfaces within a fire compartment reach auto ignition temperature - it is the last stage before the transiion into a fully developed fire. A backdraught is when fire gases are dilute with oxygen to the point where, given a source of ignition, they will ignite, causing a sudden deflagration through the fire compartment. That is exactly what is shown on this clip. It is the gases which are burning, therefore, this is a backdraught.
The definitions are correct, but occasionally flashover is sudden. Not usually. I've witnessed sudden flashover once. That was exactly what it looked like. There were one or two signs of a backdraft in this shot, but not enough to conclude one. This went from dark smoke to fire, signature of flashover.
Backdraft does not 'delay'. It can't. Otherwise, it wouldn't be a backdraft, it would simply be ventilating in the fire's favor. Backdraft is explosive. This is simply a flare up.
I disagree. A backdraft's intensity is dictated by the fuel/oxygen ration at the point of ignition. With an ideal mixture, the result is explosive. If the mixture is too rich, a slow, lazy burn of the fire gaeses occurs, too lean, it will flare up with no real force.
Backdrafts certainly can delay. In 1996 two firefighters were killed in a backdraft in Blaina, South Wales. They had rescued one child, gone back in for a second, when a backdraft killed them - 15 minutes after initial entry.
OK, here's my take on it. As a CFBT it appears from the video that the fire was already vented as fire gases were issuing. A backdraft is a ventilation induced event, the power of which depends on many variables, gas temperature being one not just the fuel:oxygen ratio. Some comments below which refer to 'waiting for an ignition source' are fire gas explosions not backdrafts. I believe the jet of water caused hot fire gases to exit the building due to expansion which ignited in the air.
I agree, initially. Yellow or dark smoke will appear pressurized from gaps in doors and windows BEFORE an entry is made. Once entry has been establsihed, you will see fire gases exactly as shown in this video. A fire cannot backdraft without a vent, by definition. If you look at floor level, oxygen is drawn in prior to the flare up. That constituets a backdraft.
anyone heard about a cold backdraft? look at the smoke: I agree it is not thick and black and it is not being sucked in as in a hot backdraft! but you can see the smoke "breathing" and forming dense grey clouds... due to the extra oxygen it ignited and thus forming the explosion
whoever said it cant be a flash over is wrong. if the smoke outside of the building autoignites it is still a flashover a smoke explosion is really a flashover
Flashover is when everything within the the compartment of the fire ignites. Backdraft is when the fire loses oxygen and it smolders while creating intense heat. Once sufficient oxygen is introduced, it explodes because the smoke, which is particles of incomplete combustion, ignites bc it had reached its ignition point.
Flashover, not backdraft. Turbulant, heavy smoke with heavy heat ready for ignition. Smoke is combustible when it gets hot enough. The introduction of oxygen via the handline helped the gases reach the proper flammable limit. One of the main signs of backdraft events is lack of turbulant smoke since the fire has progressed past the free burning phase and is only smoldering. This fire was well oxigenated and free burning. Smoke explosions are not common, and do not result in flame expansion.
niether backdraft, nor flashover ( when the contents of a room autoignite due to high temps) What that is, is a smoke explosion. The supper heated gases and smoke ignite upon contact with fresh air outside the building. If it were a backdraft we would have seen some of the signs beforehand such as smoke turbulence that is incongrous with the conditions.
I'm with jayshantz on this one, flashover is when the room/whatever reaches a point at which the firegasses will combust without a direct source of ignition, and a backdraft is where an oxygen staved fire explosivley re-ignites with the introduction of a fresh source of O2. We maybe having a UK/US difference of terminology here, but let's remember we're all on the same side :)
Every proby, rookie, or vet who has been through and successfully completed the NFPA Fire Fighter 1 and 2 course (which includes the 1403 classes) KNOWS the difference.....
Please don't come to my firestation... we want to live... Quit watching fire movies and thinking you know everything... when you SEE with your own eyes in real life a brick building BREATH smoke in and out of the mortar... come see me then we will talk...
Definition: a sweep of air backwards; also, a condition in a fire where oxygen is depleted and the fire dies down until a door is opened and the fire flares violently from the intake of oxygen
American Heritage Dictionary - flash•o•ver (flāsh'ō'vər) Pronunciation Key
n.
The temperature point at which the heat in an area or region is high enough to ignite all flammable material simultaneously.
Thank you akeila, I'm currently in the 1001 course and thats exactly what we learned but it seems like the dumbasses don't know the difference. They will find out the hard way that flashover and backdraft recognition are totally different, and unfortunately firefighters get killed that way!
That is in fact, a flashover: heavy smoke rich in unburned hydrocarbons gets heavier and then every reaches flashpoint and you get a big ball of flame and heat.
A hot rich flashover occurs when the hot smoke with flammable gas ratio above the upper limit of flammability range and temperature higher than the ignition temperature leaves the compartment. Upon dilution with air it spontaneously ignites and the resultant flame can propagate back into the compartment, resulting in an event similar to a rich flashover. The internationally accepted definition of this process is known as auto-ignition which is another form of fire gas ignition.
Ok, so I'm a volunteer. Who cares. That is a suden ignition, the air just came back to that. Thats a flashover. I'm not the only one who comments, yet you insist on harrasing me.
That IS a backdraft. It happens when the fire loses oxygen, and is at the smoldering phase..then, when oxygen is introduced it explodes or backdrafts, which is what we see here! A flashover is inside a building when the room reaches a compustible temperature and everything ignites at the same time. Camaroson, I suggest you get your facts straight cause you will need to know how to recognize them. IT IS NOT THE SAME THING. Get it together and stop acting like you know it all!!!! Dumbass
Flashover - As fire progression occurs, but prior to self ventilation, less efficient combustion builds both heat and combustion gases. These gases can super heat, and spontaneously combust. I tell my probies to be aware of the "hells angels" flying overhead. The time when you start to see streaks of flame in the superheated smoke just prior to flashover. Backdraft occurs only after the freeburn stage and oxygen starvation, clearly not the case by this video with the amount of smoke present.
Exactly what I was going to say.. Aside from this there are certain behaviors to look for as the fire ,dare I say, "breathes" Pretty much you can see and hear the air ( see it by the smoke retreating back to the fire before the explosion) rushing in prior to a backdraft. I saw No indication of these.. But that coulda just been my own eyes.
This was most likely a flashover. Backdraft wasnt possible as there was adequate ventialtion prior to this event as can be seen by the amount of smoke showing. Plus backdraft occurs in the decay stage of the fire which this was not. Fire was visible in the window prior to this. It appears that turbulent smoke can be seen issuing from the front of the building from which was already an opening created since the attack lines were operating in.
You could see the 'puffy smoke' pulsing in and out round the window before it was smashed, just before this vid starts, textbook backdraft! Backdraft is ventilation driven, flashover is temp driven, the breaking of the window brings it on.
This was defo a Backdraft, the video doesn't show roller doors bein lifted and window being broken, these were starving the fire of oxygen and you could see the smoke pulseing and breathing before. Once the jet starts to pull oxygen in with the venturi principle, the thick smoke and gases are ignited causing a deflagration out of the opening. Americans and Brits have different definitions of backdraft and flashover, but in Britain this is definately a backdraft.
Ok first of all this is a flashover, not a backdraft. Reasons; backdraft occurs when fire is in its last stage which is decay and it occurs when oxygen is quickly introduced to that enviornment. Flashover is a stage of fire itself, this occurs when all of the contents of a room catch fire and have explosive force so it looks like a backdraft but they are totally different.
the problem here is that in the UK, their fire text books define a "fire gas ignition" as a "delayed backdraft".."delayed backdraft" isnt used in north america because IFSTA and NFPA publications say that these events can happen at anytime during fire operations so there is no need for the term delayed..this is a fire gas ignition
check out the visible flame and smoke billowing out at the first of the vid...not backdraft conditions..its confusing yes...but its all in the manual..also i'm shocked no one mentioned the guy doing the hose dance at the first....almost ended up on his ass
A flashover is simply when everything in the romm gets so hot it all ignites. What happened there is that the intro of o2 somewhere caused the fire to increase therefore raising the temperature of the unburnt gases to igition temp and therefor it burns, expands and pushes out of the shop and up the building. Call it a backdraught or whatever.
Actually, it's clearly a backdraft. The dark black turbulent smoke and "breathing" that the fire is doing are all telltale signs. It's obvious by looking at it that this fire was starved for oxygen, then when the firefighter puts water on it some of the smoke turns white which indicates water contact with an ignited fuel source that was probably reached by the water stream from the hose breaking a window pain thus giving the fire a new oxygen source.
Rdsborobtr 1 month ago
Clearly a Flashover.Backdraft is an incipient fire starved of o2.Smoke is issuing out of an opening with active fire inside,you just cant see it.The camera vantage point doesnt allow you to see inside of the structure. A flashover is not just the contents of an enclosed container, it also involves smoke emitting out of a structure.When the hoseline was used, it mixed the right amount of o2 and flashed.A smoldering fire does not emit that much turbulent smoke without active burning.
Lieutenant7b 1 month ago
TO STOP THE ARGUEMENTS: this video is shown in fire training here in the UK as a Backdraft.
pyro999maniac 3 months ago
Did you see any of them hardly move, no, well trained and knew this was possibly going to happen so keep a safe distance
FIREMARK1965 7 months ago
A flashover is the near simultaneous ignition of all combustible material in an enclosed area. A backdraft is a situation which can occur when a fire's product-gases are starved of oxygen; consequently combustion slows but the combustible fuel gases and smoke remain at a temperature above the fire-point of the fuel gases. If oxygen is re-introduced to the fire combustion will restart, often resulting in an 'explosive' effect as the gases are heated by the combustion and expand rapidly.
justcorylee 8 months ago
seems to me when the fire stream hit the glass it rapidly cooled it, causing it to shatter, which introduced oxygen into a deprived environment causing the backdraft. Wicked vid
Darbalarb1 8 months ago
Flashover!!!
firefighter1084 8 months ago
flashover...
mikej2004 11 months ago
The guy stayed on the knob!
TheBoatbottom 11 months ago
@somervillefire... did a little Google search and came up with a paper written by ATF Special Agent Steven W Carman about fires referred to as "High Temperature Accelerent Fires"...
in your search box type in: [PDF] Hta Report Oct 1994
Hope it helps some.
SittingMooseShaman 11 months ago
@somervillefire... ho-oo, I gotta think back on this one... It had come 2 mind as back then my co-worker and I were following this story through newspapers & magazines. "60 minutes" I think did a couple of spots on it. I'm not xactly sure which insur. carriers' agent broke the method- however, I can recall bits of what he did. US News & World Report comes 2 mind. It was becoming a big thing back then- And suddenly- the fires stopped! Hollywood even did a film over it- now I'm gonna surf 4 this2!
SittingMooseShaman 11 months ago
... wayy back in the 80's there was an arsonist(never wz caught) who had a method of creating fires[nationwide] which for a near precise amt of time would burn so hot & fiercely in it's center that when H2O entered that area the H2O became gassified & began a process which caused the H2O to separate in2 hydrogen and oxygen which began a cycle of explosion/gassification/separation/explosion/etc.
This condition lasted for only a short time however, it created incredible fires from 'ordinary' ones
SittingMooseShaman 1 year ago
@SittingMooseShaman where can i find information about this?
somervillefire 11 months ago
Not to be rude or anything but that was a flashover....there was no "Breathing of the building that I saw...the burst of flame was all the contents in that building or room of building were super heated to the the point of ignition and guess what happens...a flash over..
alteredegodave 1 year ago
Hell no, no way is this a Backdraft, its a flashover yo!
MegaMantim 1 year ago
This is definitely NOT a back-draft. Flash-over- absolutely. Back-draft- absolutely not!
BCFSXCYYJ2010 1 year ago
That didn't look like a backdraft, that looked more like a flashover.
ThySaint 1 year ago
OK GUYS .....WE ARE ALL IN THE SAME BROTHERHOOD .....EASY !!!!
truck501 1 year ago 3
Since there is visible flame before the stream is introduced, it cannot be called a backdraft. It is a severe flashover caused by the sudden introduction of additional oxygen. Watch it again.
joemac356 1 year ago
why is everyone goin on about Dennis fire appliances when that is a Volvo
joelwhitaker 1 year ago
any one watching the smoke puff signs of a back draft maybe?
ilovecopenhagen09 1 year ago
You can tell from the smoke, that the room is about to flash. What happens in this video is the fire stream introduces a fresh supply of oxygen into an environment that's waiting to flash (air pulled in along with the stream). We all know the fire science behind the use of water as an extinguishing agent...expands 1700:1, blah blah blah,...but water doesn't burn...at least not in this neck of the solar system. From backdraft to fully involved - 2 sec. Clearly a backdraft induced FLASHOVER.
Imustfly 1 year ago
Thats a flashover it blows smoke out right before you see fire, on a backdraft you will see it suck the smoke in before you get the boom.
SILVERBACK418 1 year ago
That is a flashover... Not a backdraft!!!!!!!
22tony00 1 year ago
Flashover seen this at the YFA!
KidCoolThe 1 year ago
Water expands when it is heated. It turns to steam when overheated. So direct a jet into the confined space of a burning building and the water vapourises, expands, and blows back out of the building carrying the hot gases with it. So it's neither flashover or backdraft but a steam 'explosion' for want of a better word.
Norfolkscot 1 year ago 2
Hate to dash all of you folks that call this a backdraft, but IT IS NOT A BACKDRAFT!!!! I hate to tell you that this would be a FLASHOVER!!! NOT A BACKDRAFT!!! GO LOOK AT YOUR BOOKS AGAIN!!!! FIREFIGHTER FOR 24 YEARS AND AN INSTRUCTOR FOR FOURTEEN OF THOSE YEARS...
sgtsmash8158 1 year ago 2
then you're one lousy example of a firefighter, theres no use for the yelling words, its a mistake so deal with it like a one, not as an issue
tanniela123 1 year ago
@sgtsmash8158 i know the diff between the 2 but how can u tell flashover goes acrossed the top right? backdraft shoots out the door
timberland1108 1 year ago
@sgtsmash8158 YA SHOULDNT BE ARGUING OVER THE NAME BUT FIND A CURE TAKE THE 2/0 out OF H20 AND WE MIGHT GET SOMEWHERE WE NEED A BETTER COMPOUND FOR FIRE FIGHTERS TO PUT OUT FIRES AND REDUCE THE RISK OF FLASH OVERS FLASH BACKS BACK DRAFTS AN RECENT GROVENERS FIRE LINTHWAITE SERIOS FIRES LIKE CHEMICAL FIRES SHOULD HAVE AIR SUPPORT IE YORSHIRE FIRE SERVICE HELICOPTOR TO WARN PEOPLE OF DANGER AND TO KEEP AN EYE ON FIREFIGHTERS AND FIRE AT THE SCENE AND FIREFIGHTERS SHOULD BE POSTIONED ON ALL SIDE
GRIFFELLIS1 1 year ago
Damn, soon as I see the smoke drop and start pushing im gonna high tail it out of there.
Gizzy4u 1 year ago
deff a backdraft not a very big one but as you can see when the window gets brokeout with the stright stream when slowed down you can clearly see the smoke being sucked in then blown out with force not a lot due to the size and location of the fire but deff not a flash over trust me i have been tought buy the best people that have been in and survived both
bmxpro021 1 year ago
@bmxpro021 I'd rather you not teach me, then. As you know, a backdraft is smoke explosion. At no point did I see any inward-sucking of smoke to indicate the conditions of a backdraft. It was a sudden ignition of the superheated gases - textbook flashover.
nomofica0 1 year ago 9
@nomofica0 Yeah, I agree. Definitely a flashover.
rmryder88 1 year ago
@nomofica0 this is a backdraft, not a flashover! As the fire fighter on the branch attempts to knock down the fire inside the building he is mixing the air and unburnt fire gasses, once as the mixture becomes a more diluted level the backdraft happens...
jonner3013 3 months ago
Is deffo a backdraught.............trust me......am an instructor at fire school....teach this stuff for a living!!!!
Freshman1504 1 year ago
@Freshman1504 Then surely you'd know its called a backdraft not a backdraught... those who can, do. those who can't, teach
Cityside90 1 year ago
Comment removed
Freshman1504 1 year ago
Flashover Absolutely!!. Not a backdraft this structure isnt puffing for air but merely reaching ignition temp and perfect air fuel and temp mixture to flash.
Firefightr1 1 year ago 2
Yes that was a backdraft, the fire got added oxygen from outside through that window!
EMT630 2 years ago
That was not a backdraft, That was due to the hose line breaking out the window and letting the fire escape from within
Firecar380 2 years ago
That looked more like a Flashover to me.
lightpaws25 2 years ago
This is totally a backdraft caused by the hose stream breaking the front window, introducing fresh air into the smouldering fire. Look at the smoke it's that crap brown color. This is basic Proby stuff.
cgyfyrefyter 2 years ago
Backdraft, according to the NFPA definiton: An explosion caused by the admission of fresh air to a closed building containing smouldering fire due to the rapid combustion either of the heated material or the flammable gases therein, or both.
cgyfyrefyter 2 years ago
this fire was caused by an individual at the security office putting in too thick of a slice of bread into the toaster. an important safety measure for toast making is to ensure each slice fits comfortably into the grill grip. the HSE recommend using only sliced loaves no thicker cut that a warburton toastie gauge. hovis tin batch are often the cause of many kitchen fires with slices loosely cut to thicknesses that exceed the width of the toasters grill grips. causing wheat ignition.
ianupton 2 years ago
This is pretty clearly a flashover. The escaping smoke is neither black not puffing. The front of the store didn't exactly look air-tight- the fire was self-ventilating before the flash. My opinion.
scafativ 2 years ago
the fire was only ventilated seconds before the video starts after the window was put through, prior to that it was starved of oxygen, once the air was introduced, the backdraught occurs.
jonny4274 2 years ago
When the firefighter opened up on the front of the store, the windows broke out intruding a large amount of air to the atmosphere causing a flashover.A very violent one at that!
Bombero152 2 years ago
It is a TOTALLY BACKDRAFT
U698 2 years ago
No - it's a FLASHOVER.
melevy 2 years ago
I agree with graves, I think it's a Backdraft but without enough pressure because the hoseline sucked in fresh air to the heat otherwise it could've have been worst.Anyway thanks god the guys did not go in,we could've been talking about dead firefighters.
U698 2 years ago
DEF A FLASHOVER!!! If it had of backdrafted, it prolly would have blew the whole front of the building down!!! ALOT OF PRESSURE!!!!
darrellfi 2 years ago
@darrellfi exactly, a backdraft is much more violent than this
amateurpyrotech 2 years ago
its says a shop front so you assume there is a fair amount of glass there. So for the smoke to be pushing out like that the would have already been broken. so offically its a flash over but maybe it was caused by the introduction of more oxygen. But that makes it a backdraft. so i wasent one it was both
Callumnsc33 2 years ago
everyone is right this is deff a flash
011NAVY 2 years ago
def flashover the smoke ignited backdraft the smoke wont ignite
sledneckzl600 2 years ago
ofcourse the smoke ignites on a backdraft.
revvin1000 2 years ago
no the smoke ignites on flashover not backdraft basic firefighter 1 stuff
sledneckzl600 2 years ago
Not a backdraft. Want to see a real backdraft and see the difference, search Backdraft in Vermont. That's a BACKDRAFT.
ffworrell26 2 years ago
This is not a backdraft. This is a FLASHOVER.
ffworrell26 2 years ago 2
Flashover, if it was a backdraft the smoke would have hit they guys across the street with smoke. Instead not even touching the guys with the line on the sidewalk.
GrizzRingLI 2 years ago
I think they need a bigger line
SIG220C 2 years ago
almost sounds like they broke another window when they turned the hose on... is kind of a flashdraft...
ITS420PAT 2 years ago
this is a flashover
psp310 2 years ago 2
flashover
tornadoguy2006 2 years ago 2
Flashdraft.
Adambrew 2 years ago 2
Learn the difference....this is obviously a flashover
20TRUCK0206 2 years ago 2
i thought flashover too
gunnerman22 2 years ago 2
It isnt a very violent backdraft but a backdraft non the less. Now what makes this strange is that the fire not only continues burning, but burns very hot. What I feel has taken place, is that the fire progressed until it was right on the verge of flashover. Then it somehow became deprived of oxygen. once the hoseline sucked in fresh air to the heat not only did a minor backdraft occur but flashover occured nearly simultaneously. These are just my thoughts, would love to hear yours.
graves420fire 2 years ago
Either way, a back raft is a backdraft. Thats why they always say check the door, even to little kid's when they go to the school's. You don't know whats on the other side, that's why backdrafts and flash overs are so deadly. Backdraft when the fire is smoldering in a room, a wall, anything really, once you introduce oxygen to it.....BOOM. People don't realize fire is a living thing....it eats, it breathes,
XSXGhostXSX 2 years ago
Ok, this is my opinion on this. just an opinion so nobody get their panties in a wad. This is actually a little of both. You can see clearly that yes the fire is venting smoke, you can also see that the smoke is all the way to the floor. It is not pushing hard so that would say that fire progression has slowed for some reason. You can see exactly when the hoseline is sprayed through the door that the smoke curls sucking in fresh air and then wham, fire. (continued)
graves420fire 2 years ago
That is a flashover
SILVERBACK418 2 years ago
Not a Backdraft. The smoke is pushing out the front window. Backdraft is caused by a smoldering fire,that lacks O2 to grow. This fire has O2, there is a window already open. Look at the way the smoke is rolling out before the flames, turbulant, heavy, dark. All signs of flashover potential. Once the stream hits the smoke and fire and the thermal layer is disturbed you can see the unburned product of combustion (smoke) ignite. Backdrafts rarely sustain the level of combustion this fire does.
Firebrother343 2 years ago
Ja wenn der honk da mit Vollstrahl reiballert, ist dieses Ergebnis bei weitem kein Wunder...
steffenstromitzky 2 years ago
sprühstrahl?
chiller45674 2 years ago
british engines. nothing compared to the us engines. sorry to say. but yea, thats not a flashover.
EMT667 2 years ago
your an idiot. european engines have the same water flow rate as american engines, they are just built smaller so they can fit on the smaller streets
jsncrso 2 years ago 14
@jsncrso so they don't carry as much hose and equipment, right?
joek0617 5 months ago
@joek0617 British Fire Appliances actually carry more equipment than american engines. less hose because you have those massive hose beds that we dont have but in general we carry more equipment and enough hose to do our job.
pyro999maniac 3 months ago
@pyro999maniac yeah, european apparatus work well in the crowded, narrow streets of europe, and our ginormous american apparatus work well in the wide, fairly open streets that we have, and i imagine that britain has denser hydrant coverage, reducing the amount of hose needed
joek0617 3 months ago
@joek0617 yeah thats true. we can also just plug straigh into the mains, pump from an open water source and if we need more hose we have hose layer trucks.
pyro999maniac 3 months ago
@pyro999maniac we collapse mains if we plug into them, or so i've heard.... north america is unlike anywhere else
joek0617 3 months ago
its a backdraft...
vlaup 2 years ago
@EMT667 nothing? we carry more equipment on our Appliances than you......you just have a massive hose bed that takes up space (we roll ours). we are quicker, more mobile etc.
pyro999maniac 3 months ago
Everyone has to remember the fact that this is 1 viewpoint, 30m away where half the operations is shielded by a firetruck, and one source of audio, so no-one can say for sure what happened or not.
However, if what I am seeing and hearing is correct, this is a Backdraft.
Watch the branch operator test the hose for pressure and nozzle for flowrate and pattern; once they have confirmed the settings, they turn the attention to the building windows and break the glass as they spray water in.
Imptx10 2 years ago
People have to understand:
Flashover is the ignition of the flammable vapors emitted from a room's contents via pyrolysis, assuming the fire is not oxygen-restricted.
Backdraft is the explosive increase in a oxygen-restricted fire, due to the increase in oxygen.
From the sounds, when the firefighter sprayed water into the window, it broke the window. This jet pulled fresh oxygen into the fire, which promoted fire growth, size and spread.
This is a backdraft, not a flashover.
Imptx10 2 years ago
no a backdraft is pressure built up wich either blows fire or a heavy cloud of smoke at you. this is a flash over fire went nowhere but up it ran outta fuel they gave it fuel thats called flashing
benoff767 2 years ago
You need to get your facts right before commenting mate.
yeatsey25 2 years ago
no that is a backdraft, the water pushed clean air into the compartment... which they should've known.
JayDawg22121986 2 years ago
flashover not a backdraft!!!!
arffII 2 years ago
This was not a Backdraft it was an Flash Over
Deutsch: Das ist kein Backdraft das war ein Flash Over
Eschersheim2444 2 years ago
"4th alarm fire" = GAS 4 in Deutschland?
krassersmudda 2 years ago
that hose was like pouring fuel on a fire once he open it up
elvisfire1 2 years ago
This was a flash over, not a back draft. Back Draft is self explanatory, the fire sucks air into a confined smoldering fire and explosively turns to flame.
Polaris30144 2 years ago
Maybe one of you fire guys can answer this for me. I notice there is no "breathing" fire here (smoke being sucked back into building) or apparent change in the color of smoke before the backdraft, is this not a flashover?
adamfoley81 2 years ago
Adamfoley81: As explained to me by a Fire Science major many years ago: Smoke is mostly incompletely burned fuel and very flammable when hot enough. When the water hits the fire some of the water is converted to steam. The expanding steam forces superheated smoke out of the building where it mixes with oxygen and ignites. It is more like a flashover. Backdrafts are driven by convection when a door is opened to an enclosed space where everything is above kindling temperature .
grayswandir47 2 years ago
Confined area, smoke and gases build up, doesn't ignite, oxygen added, big ol' backdraft.. nice
smarch1337 2 years ago
looks like a fire in the room where maIN WINDOW WAS AND ANOTHER IONSIDE THAT WHEN THA COLD WATER HIT IT CAUSING IT TO BREAK then the room that was starved caused that back draft into the main room we could see already burning ....
PearlFF2 3 years ago
Привет из России коллеги,приму в дар боёвку
Miffanya 3 years ago
no now you see, i hate to say it but this is a UK fire service, they where caustious, and staayed well away, all the backdrafts/flashovers ive seen , which where being handled by the US firefighters, at least one of them has been hurt, or come very close
xxjordiGSYxx 3 years ago
I agree and that's how it should be... get a main ground jet on it first to prevent flashover and then send in BA teams.... which is what they are doing
joelwhitaker 3 years ago
completely varies on the state of the building, what you mentioned is an agressive technique, used ifthey thik they can salvage the property or if there is people still in there. they could play the defence and contain the fire until it burns out or until they put it out from the outside
xxjordiGSYxx 3 years ago
Backdraft - you can hear the front window glass shattering from thermal shock as the fire stream touches it. From there, infer enclosed space and a sudden inrush of air through the opened window.
dafydd2277 3 years ago
Lean backdraught.
Sabre6708 3 years ago
ERROR, eso no es un backdraft, eso es un FLASHOVER, la diferencia es clara, primero poca presencia de humo antes de la llamarada y segundo una llamarada en lugar de una explosión
FireLordB28 3 years ago 2
Looks like the FF knocked the window out with his stream causing the backdraft which was would've happened sooner or later judging on the grey puffing smoke that was coming from that area already.
talon19822006 3 years ago
Check out the art of reading smoke. You might learn something......
michiganfireman 3 years ago
Looks like a very interesting lecture series.Don't think they offer it in Canada. What is your take on the video brother?
talon19822006 3 years ago
The turbulent smoke is a sure sign of a flashover
ntfd125 3 years ago
Not a backdraft
Frman263 3 years ago
its a smokeexplosion/flashover..
mxfrmbarsspbdsrtrver 3 years ago
you guys dont see the pressurized smoke coming from the "a" side? This IS a backdraft, not a flashover. Flashovers may seem explosive, but remember, it is a simultaneous ignition of all combustible materials in a room when they reach their ingnition temp. This looks like that shit has already been burning and got choked out from lack of O2, creating backdraft conditions. When fire crews introduced a positive pressure (a.k.a. the ventilation with the hose stream), this introduced the o2.
mikej2004 3 years ago
it was a backdraught. a probationer spotted the signs and symptoms and warned the oic. it is shown as training at west yorkshire FRS HQ.
i caught a backdraught at the bradford riots with the labour club incident. larger fire larger backdraught. it was a bit of an unknown entity then, scared the sh#t out of me and blew my oppo into the road, riot cops picked us up.
jc170 3 years ago
not a backdraft.. its a flashover
fireguye4 3 years ago
Thats not a Backdraft thats just flashover , thick smoke don't mean Backdraft that smoke was rolling out which means it was vented, a vented fire = NO backdraft. You'll see pressurized puffs of yellow or other dark colored smoke coming from window frames and from doors. not that much.
firefighter1426 3 years ago
I agree entirely with firefighter1426. I know what a backdraft is and that had open ventillation on side A of the structure. A backdraft will pull that smoke back in and it didn't here. There were no intervals of yellow-gray smoke. That was simply an induced flashover by the firecrew's attack line.
BombMusicIndstry 3 years ago
Wrong I'm afraid. Flashover is he point at which all combustible surfaces within a fire compartment reach auto ignition temperature - it is the last stage before the transiion into a fully developed fire. A backdraught is when fire gases are dilute with oxygen to the point where, given a source of ignition, they will ignite, causing a sudden deflagration through the fire compartment. That is exactly what is shown on this clip. It is the gases which are burning, therefore, this is a backdraught.
UKFireBandit 3 years ago
The definitions are correct, but occasionally flashover is sudden. Not usually. I've witnessed sudden flashover once. That was exactly what it looked like. There were one or two signs of a backdraft in this shot, but not enough to conclude one. This went from dark smoke to fire, signature of flashover.
BombMusicIndstry 3 years ago
Backdraft does not 'delay'. It can't. Otherwise, it wouldn't be a backdraft, it would simply be ventilating in the fire's favor. Backdraft is explosive. This is simply a flare up.
BombMusicIndstry 3 years ago
I disagree. A backdraft's intensity is dictated by the fuel/oxygen ration at the point of ignition. With an ideal mixture, the result is explosive. If the mixture is too rich, a slow, lazy burn of the fire gaeses occurs, too lean, it will flare up with no real force.
Backdrafts certainly can delay. In 1996 two firefighters were killed in a backdraft in Blaina, South Wales. They had rescued one child, gone back in for a second, when a backdraft killed them - 15 minutes after initial entry.
UKFireBandit 3 years ago
OK, here's my take on it. As a CFBT it appears from the video that the fire was already vented as fire gases were issuing. A backdraft is a ventilation induced event, the power of which depends on many variables, gas temperature being one not just the fuel:oxygen ratio. Some comments below which refer to 'waiting for an ignition source' are fire gas explosions not backdrafts. I believe the jet of water caused hot fire gases to exit the building due to expansion which ignited in the air.
j13ffp 3 years ago
Thats what i meant thx.
firefighter1426 3 years ago
Agreed.
Spencerw21 3 years ago
the news is really never correct so if they say backdraft it doesnt mean so.
mxfrmbarsspbdsrtrver 3 years ago
I agree, initially. Yellow or dark smoke will appear pressurized from gaps in doors and windows BEFORE an entry is made. Once entry has been establsihed, you will see fire gases exactly as shown in this video. A fire cannot backdraft without a vent, by definition. If you look at floor level, oxygen is drawn in prior to the flare up. That constituets a backdraft.
UKFireBandit 3 years ago
but there is one thing: i can still bright flames, but merely of the symptoms tell me it is a backdraft... nice discussion though
rwnlof 3 years ago
anyone heard about a cold backdraft? look at the smoke: I agree it is not thick and black and it is not being sucked in as in a hot backdraft! but you can see the smoke "breathing" and forming dense grey clouds... due to the extra oxygen it ignited and thus forming the explosion
rwnlof 3 years ago
this fire was not hungry looking for food (air) this is a flashover
racefanstevel 3 years ago
Its a Flash fire.
Was already auto exposed and none of the smoke was sucked back into the building in which is common for a backdraft.
firefighter6539 3 years ago
whoever said it cant be a flash over is wrong. if the smoke outside of the building autoignites it is still a flashover a smoke explosion is really a flashover
sfpd17 3 years ago
Flashover is when everything within the the compartment of the fire ignites. Backdraft is when the fire loses oxygen and it smolders while creating intense heat. Once sufficient oxygen is introduced, it explodes because the smoke, which is particles of incomplete combustion, ignites bc it had reached its ignition point.
bdfire29 3 years ago
It Flashed
opt10opt 3 years ago
This has been flagged as spam show
Don't want to p$a$y for an online dating site? meetyourfling(.Com) kurdziel
052160
l4m4rk3s40n3 3 years ago
Flashover, not backdraft. Turbulant, heavy smoke with heavy heat ready for ignition. Smoke is combustible when it gets hot enough. The introduction of oxygen via the handline helped the gases reach the proper flammable limit. One of the main signs of backdraft events is lack of turbulant smoke since the fire has progressed past the free burning phase and is only smoldering. This fire was well oxigenated and free burning. Smoke explosions are not common, and do not result in flame expansion.
firedawg73 3 years ago
It could be backdraft if the window broke by the force of the water.
jelzo 3 years ago
I am ok with calling this a flashover but I also was not there I just do not see anything in the tape to change my mind.
learpilot1 3 years ago
niether backdraft, nor flashover ( when the contents of a room autoignite due to high temps) What that is, is a smoke explosion. The supper heated gases and smoke ignite upon contact with fresh air outside the building. If it were a backdraft we would have seen some of the signs beforehand such as smoke turbulence that is incongrous with the conditions.
fyrfyterx 3 years ago
flashover
gotgank 3 years ago
I'm with jayshantz on this one, flashover is when the room/whatever reaches a point at which the firegasses will combust without a direct source of ignition, and a backdraft is where an oxygen staved fire explosivley re-ignites with the introduction of a fresh source of O2. We maybe having a UK/US difference of terminology here, but let's remember we're all on the same side :)
domgeth 3 years ago
It´s the same terminology in Europe than in the US.
MarkusC12345 3 years ago
its not a backdraft ,the flames came in this moment , as the firemen took the water in the room maybe oil ...
cmon89Jarhead89cmon 3 years ago
It is pretty obvious that this fire was NOT a backdraft.
eastendsmokeeater 3 years ago
LOL
be a fireman then you can say that shit
muugre22 3 years ago
ME? I am a fireman. 6 yrs in the fdny. I have seen more than I would of liked to.
eastendsmokeeater 3 years ago
Every proby, rookie, or vet who has been through and successfully completed the NFPA Fire Fighter 1 and 2 course (which includes the 1403 classes) KNOWS the difference.....
Please don't come to my firestation... we want to live... Quit watching fire movies and thinking you know everything... when you SEE with your own eyes in real life a brick building BREATH smoke in and out of the mortar... come see me then we will talk...
akeila77 3 years ago
Webster's New Millennium™ Dictionary of English -
backdraft
Part of Speech: n
Definition: a sweep of air backwards; also, a condition in a fire where oxygen is depleted and the fire dies down until a door is opened and the fire flares violently from the intake of oxygen
American Heritage Dictionary - flash•o•ver (flāsh'ō'vər) Pronunciation Key
n.
The temperature point at which the heat in an area or region is high enough to ignite all flammable material simultaneously.
akeila77 3 years ago 2
akiela.... youve made my day
mxfrmbarsspbdsrtrver 3 years ago
Thank you akeila, I'm currently in the 1001 course and thats exactly what we learned but it seems like the dumbasses don't know the difference. They will find out the hard way that flashover and backdraft recognition are totally different, and unfortunately firefighters get killed that way!
jayshantz 3 years ago
That is in fact, a flashover: heavy smoke rich in unburned hydrocarbons gets heavier and then every reaches flashpoint and you get a big ball of flame and heat.
1075atTheBox 3 years ago
this miet be mean but it gos in than out.;)
EC5534 3 years ago
A hot rich flashover occurs when the hot smoke with flammable gas ratio above the upper limit of flammability range and temperature higher than the ignition temperature leaves the compartment. Upon dilution with air it spontaneously ignites and the resultant flame can propagate back into the compartment, resulting in an event similar to a rich flashover. The internationally accepted definition of this process is known as auto-ignition which is another form of fire gas ignition.
straytrons 3 years ago
Get your facts strait Its a flashover not a backdraft.
Camaroson2008 3 years ago
Get your facts straight, it's a backdraft you part time amateur.
thijs3001 3 years ago 2
Ok, so I'm a volunteer. Who cares. That is a suden ignition, the air just came back to that. Thats a flashover. I'm not the only one who comments, yet you insist on harrasing me.
Camaroson2008 3 years ago
That IS a backdraft. It happens when the fire loses oxygen, and is at the smoldering phase..then, when oxygen is introduced it explodes or backdrafts, which is what we see here! A flashover is inside a building when the room reaches a compustible temperature and everything ignites at the same time. Camaroson, I suggest you get your facts straight cause you will need to know how to recognize them. IT IS NOT THE SAME THING. Get it together and stop acting like you know it all!!!! Dumbass
jayshantz 3 years ago
Flashover - As fire progression occurs, but prior to self ventilation, less efficient combustion builds both heat and combustion gases. These gases can super heat, and spontaneously combust. I tell my probies to be aware of the "hells angels" flying overhead. The time when you start to see streaks of flame in the superheated smoke just prior to flashover. Backdraft occurs only after the freeburn stage and oxygen starvation, clearly not the case by this video with the amount of smoke present.
firebuff134 3 years ago
Exactly what I was going to say.. Aside from this there are certain behaviors to look for as the fire ,dare I say, "breathes" Pretty much you can see and hear the air ( see it by the smoke retreating back to the fire before the explosion) rushing in prior to a backdraft. I saw No indication of these.. But that coulda just been my own eyes.
somerandomcrazy 3 years ago
in portugal we call that a flashover!
manuelantonio24 3 years ago
flashover, not backdraft.
jackson1jmj 3 years ago 2
Definately looks like a flashover. It looks like an instant ignition of the superheated smoke but not a exposive ignition.
emtgregg 3 years ago
This was most likely a flashover. Backdraft wasnt possible as there was adequate ventialtion prior to this event as can be seen by the amount of smoke showing. Plus backdraft occurs in the decay stage of the fire which this was not. Fire was visible in the window prior to this. It appears that turbulent smoke can be seen issuing from the front of the building from which was already an opening created since the attack lines were operating in.
roofgoof120 3 years ago
That is a flashover no question about it.
crazykid32jc 3 years ago
If you'd have been there like me, you'd agree it's a backdraft no question about it.
thijs3001 3 years ago
i agree that this is no backdraft this is a flashover or a smoke explosion you cant see puffy smoke come in and out of the building.
A smoke explosion happens when the gasses in smoke get to a high temp causing ignition.
tjonfire100 3 years ago
You could see the 'puffy smoke' pulsing in and out round the window before it was smashed, just before this vid starts, textbook backdraft! Backdraft is ventilation driven, flashover is temp driven, the breaking of the window brings it on.
thijs3001 3 years ago
In the Moment when the Glass broke and the Flames going high somebody in the background says "Oh-ohh !" :)
Zugvogel1 4 years ago
This was defo a Backdraft, the video doesn't show roller doors bein lifted and window being broken, these were starving the fire of oxygen and you could see the smoke pulseing and breathing before. Once the jet starts to pull oxygen in with the venturi principle, the thick smoke and gases are ignited causing a deflagration out of the opening. Americans and Brits have different definitions of backdraft and flashover, but in Britain this is definately a backdraft.
thijs3001 4 years ago
I agree this is either a flash over or a release of gas from a cylinder inside, NOT A BACKDRAFT. Great video though.
Charleston9
wspointman 4 years ago
its a flashover
i deal with em
cause im a firefighter
scotlandthebrave012 4 years ago
I dont see the tell tale brown smoke but the vid qual is poor.
eviscero 4 years ago
True and true.
longboarder838 4 years ago
The original Video is excellent quality, just thought I'd point that out
firescene1 4 years ago
Ok first of all this is a flashover, not a backdraft. Reasons; backdraft occurs when fire is in its last stage which is decay and it occurs when oxygen is quickly introduced to that enviornment. Flashover is a stage of fire itself, this occurs when all of the contents of a room catch fire and have explosive force so it looks like a backdraft but they are totally different.
longboarder838 4 years ago 2
the problem here is that in the UK, their fire text books define a "fire gas ignition" as a "delayed backdraft".."delayed backdraft" isnt used in north america because IFSTA and NFPA publications say that these events can happen at anytime during fire operations so there is no need for the term delayed..this is a fire gas ignition
lees58 4 years ago
check out the visible flame and smoke billowing out at the first of the vid...not backdraft conditions..its confusing yes...but its all in the manual..also i'm shocked no one mentioned the guy doing the hose dance at the first....almost ended up on his ass
lees58 4 years ago
was defo a backdraught the jet simply excelerates the rate at which oxygen reaches the ignition source
mozzer7177 4 years ago
A flashover is simply when everything in the romm gets so hot it all ignites. What happened there is that the intro of o2 somewhere caused the fire to increase therefore raising the temperature of the unburnt gases to igition temp and therefor it burns, expands and pushes out of the shop and up the building. Call it a backdraught or whatever.
AceAndyman 4 years ago