I've just written a book about Hell & eternity that will be out soon. It talks about what the Scriptures actually say on the subject. Join in the discussion....
It looks like Francis Chans new book gives a truthful/biblical view of Hell, unlike Rob Bells lies.
People, you cannot ignore the Bible and try to explain to a Holy God, you chose to listen to Rob Bell and do not want to believe in Hell... Sorry, it is not up to us if there is a Hell, we just chose to go there or not.
assumption alert! I've assumed for Rev 21, lake of fire = hell, but why? especially as hell (gehenna) goes into the lake of fire to be destroyed... comments?
To expose my heart - I am unsure if I have ever met someone who in their heart believes in a forever torture punishment hell (and for most of the human race). By "belief" i mean, it naturally fuels action and shapes the person continually... Wouldn't believing this create a mental illness? Personally, I am too scared to really go there.. I would like you hear your experience, if you would care to share, how do you hold this? Or do you resist it at a deeper level? thanks for your honesty
@tintinworld Wow I totally agree...I don't go there either, it sounds like Hell. just watched "The hiding Place" with my family last night. Corrie ten Boom servied a concentration camp during WW2, after seeing hollywoods attempt to show the horror, then the real Corrie ten Boom spoke about it, it was twice as awful as hollywood's rendition. The fact that we can create a hell on earth that is so miserable is understandable, becasue we're fallin...So it dose concern me that God created Hell....
@tintinworld But what we read in the bible shows us that God really hates Rebellion / Sin so much that it builds up wrath, that God pours out on the unrepentant rebells...Hell....It just is the way it is...by the way truth4u2c is the channel I'm suppose to be on, I'm at work and forgot to change my login...I run a ski/snowboard shop here in Tahoe...I Hope this ministers to you sincerley Bob
@snowshop I follow my heart - my intuition & there's something about the traditional hell view doesnt fit inside, gut reaction, but I've never had a scripture to back it up, so I have unwillingly believed in it. // Now there's a new understanding & I'm keen to learn & test it! // Ps 30:5, 103:9 - it doesnt say Gods love last for a moment (a life), and his anger lasts forever (hell), nor, Rom 5 - it doesnt say the sin of adam is more influential than the victory of christ.
@tintinworld Since the concept of justice seems to be so clear and true to my experance, no matter how it plays out in the here after, I'm trusting God to be Just. The other issue is, who this side of eternity really knows if our concept of time even applies. I think we step into some kind of a huge realization, are we then in all time at the same time? I think we'll all laugh at how wrong our understanding is, so I just plan trust God. Your grip on how awful hell is has got you judging God.
@snowshop /// Thanks for your insight, I do have a judgement. I am ok with god creating hell... but not ok with god creating a certain version of hell that is "forver" and "tormenting".
My judgement is that God is 2-faced (which is a projection of the splits in my soul) & my feeling about this is fear and distrust, and my request is that god would be more straight forward.
thanks for asking snowshop, I have an understanding of post-modernism, and yes, I see the fit. // Culture does influence our assumptions we bring into reading the bible, for good and for worse. // Do you also see a Dark Ages (pre-modernity), Dualism (Decartes) and a Plato influence on a forever painful view of hell? // Sadly, neither side of any (biblical) argument can be removed from cultural assumptions - even though Modernists may disagree.. but of course they would.... so it goes on.
@tintinworld Well said, but the bible hasn't changed, So a person can see and attempt to see through their worldview baises. Better then that we all have been given a conscience, that convicts us when we do something wrong. if we have a healthly conscience we have a fear, because we know we deserve punishment, but if we remain in rebellion against God we become twisted. Proverbs 28:5
Evil men do not understand justice, But those who seek the LORD understand all. This misunderstanding would,,,
@tintinworld ...motivate a person to re-define hell or completly get rid of it. In either case, that person has lighten the impact of their conscience so they can go on living an unrepentant life. Romans 1:18 For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men, who suppress the truth in unrighteousness, So does the princible of punishment ring true or is it that you, (the law breaker) thinks that the Judges punishment is unjust?
@truth4U2C "princible of punishment" - punishment is the hard corrective judgement of a father // (second part) Yes. A forever hell is unjust, and more - it's evil. It makes no sense of the bible as a whole. It doesnt fit my experience of god. It doesnt fit my experinece of the goodness I see in people or nature // I whole disagree with the initial assumption of Augustines "Original sin" doctrine, so my conclusions are very different.
Maybe we've different definitions for words. I see my conscience is a wholey unreliable source or guage. It's programmed with strange guilts and irrational fears - see child development biology // I think an unhealthy conscience might end up with a forever hell doctrine, as it would connect with it, as a self-punishment // "deserve punishment" = why be so cruel to yourself... just seek forgivness, have integrity & be honest... and when you fail in that, pick yourself up, try again.
@truth4U2C Maybe we have different definitions for words, but I see my conscience is a wholey unreliable source or guage. It's programmed with strange guilts and irrational fears - see child development biology // I think an unhealthy conscience might end up with a forever hell doctrine, as it would connect with it, as a self-punishment // "deserve punishment" = not healthy mental desire, why be so cruel to yourself... seek forgivness, have integrity, be honest, yes.
thanks snowshop, Matthew scripture - if "eternal" doesnt mean "forever" and if "fire" is godly process (purification and transformation - see below), then you have a different take on this verse. I read it as a seperation, but a forever painful experience, no.
Re "Fire" - the H.S comes in fire, we are tested by fire, god is a consuming fire, at pentecost tongues of fire, christs eyes are a flaming fire, a river of fire flows before him, appears to moses as a fire... so many, run out of words!
truth4u2c - It occurs to me that Rob Bell has read about all the scriptures that you have rightlyfully quoted.
What Rob seems to be doing is putting aside individual verses, looking at the bigger picture of the nature of god, then using that to inform the individual verses.
For example, Rob's intrepretation of the word "judgement" is compelling, a force that purges rather than destroys.
@tintinworld yeah I get get, the bigger picture "Love Wins" but even though we know from the bible that God is love, he is also "Just" and justice is a part of his love. Proverbs 28:5 Evil men do not understand justice, but those who seek the LORD understand it fully. Note what your saying "Rob's intrepretation" NO NO NO, please see how your following a man and not the bible. Sure it may be compelling, but is it the truth? Do you know what it means to have a post-modern world view?
assumption alert "truth4u2c" - eternal being = eternal punishment - why link these 2?
also, eternal is now only. there's no such thing as time outside the now moment to experience, that's only memory or an intellectual concept of future.
He denies teaching universalism
I dont think he's teaching universalism from what i've heard, but he's going in that direction.
Do you have a judgement agenda behind your interpretation, his love agenda is more godlike, inspiring and compelling to me
@tintinworld Eternal punishment Jesus taugh : Bell―But when the Son of Man comes in His glory, and all the angels with Him, then He will sit on His glorious throne. ―All the nations will be gathered before Him; and He will separate them from one another, as the shepherd separates the sheep from the goats; and He will put the sheep on His right, and the goats on the left.
@tintinworld ―Then the King will say to those on His right, ‗Come, you who are blessed of My Father, inherit the kingdom prepared for you from the foundation of the world. . . . Then He will also say to those on His left, ‗Depart from Me, accursed ones, into the eternal fire which has been prepared for the devil and his angels . . . These will go away into eternal punishment, but the righteous into eternal life.‖(Matthew 25:31-34, 41, 46)
Bell is an example of someone who is making it up as they go along.
His view of the Christian god and his message to humanity is as likely to be as true as the Christian message, but the point is it is not the Christian message, it is Bell's message.
Jesus said "whatever you do, even to the least among you, you do to me." So are there people who are not Christians who clothe Christ, feed Christ, visit him in prison, and love him. Yet Christians teach us Jesus will then turn his back on those who fed him, clothed him, saved HIM. From any outside perspective it is impossible to see any theology that involves hell as not being about naked power. About existing to support a hierarchy.
Great points. Romans 10 begins with the ideal that they had a zeal for God but not with knowledge. In that very chapter in the first verses-self righteousness which they establish is against the righteousness of God. What does this all mean? If we do something so good that everyone admires us and do it apart from Christ-it is self righteousness which never saves. There is your righteousness and the righteousness from Christ. You cannot have both. Christ is God or you are-I vote for Christ
If we look at Jesus, as a man, its plain to see that he died for his beliefs,he was willing to die for his beliefs. I've often wondered how he feels about this theology that says his teaching, the things he died for are less important than this neo greco theology.
@gtrfurby Watch it again, I address all the confusion that Rob atempts to create so can can sell his book. show that the Bible clearly answers all of Robs questions. I then refer to other book reviews. So here is a better concern to have, is how Rob Bell represents "Hell" true? or is how the bible says it to be True?
In other words has the Church got it worng all these years, by trusting what the bible says or in 2011 out of the blue this guy Rob Bell gets it right, "love wins" we're all going to Heaven
@truth4U2C well in response to your future comments according to what other people have posted here and than take what there opinion was of this video and then post judgment..
"I THINK PEOPLE WHO HAVE STUPID HATS ARE GOING TO HELL"
@gtrfurby Dude your right my hat is a false idol, it has a Volcom stone on it.... so all is realitive, no such thing as truth... good luck with that world view.....funny thing, if there is no truth, why did you even care to post a comment? is there a chance you fear hell? you should, because your conscience is telling you so, that's why your putting hope in Rob Bells book that says we all go to heaven, even people with bad hats
Page 95: that says it enough. He thinks he has a new revelation from God that the 99.9% of us didn't get for 2,000 years. Sounds like a cult leader to me if I ever seen one.
I disagree, Rob Bell is making good points. Protestant Christianity repeats Protestant theology without protesting to test that theology. Case in point, Protestant salvation theology revolves around individual salvation through a personal relationship with Jesus, hence, Romans 9-11 is regularly misunderstood.
@StormTrek Anyone can check the reformers work in light of scripture, I personally think that they did a great job. For the record, the "Personal relationship" terminology, although true, didn't come from the reformers, the term became popular in the last 50 years. Who misunderstands romans 9-11? the reformers understood it. Can you point out how you think Rob bell did a better job with Romans 9-11?
@truth4U2C The original reformers did a great job with what they had, but they didn't have the depth of research we have today on 1st century second temple Judaism, modern techniques of textual analysis, or even our knowledge of ancient Greek and Hebrew. Today, Protestants emphasize heaven and hell over resurrection. Protestants (Reformed) teach Romans 9-11 as though it regards God's monergistic decision of individual election rather than God's corporate election of the Jews as his chosen people
@truth4U2C Hey Truth, I agree. Romans 9-11 is totally misinterpreted by most ministers today. There are other EXTRA-biblical things the church had begun to do about 50 years or so ago that are very unbiblical. I will name a few - The Altar Call, The Sinner's Prayer, no preaching on repentance, no preaching on counting the cost before making a covenant-relationship with the Almighty.
@gtrfurby I don't apply to my christianity what the Roman Catholic Church did. I left Roman Catholicism 27 years ago before I even knew what they did. They are the false church - the mystery babylon written in scripture. People like to attribute what the Popes and catholicism did to what Christianity is. You cannot do that. Christianity was around 300 years before Catholicism even though they will deny that statement.
@gtrfurby The reformers weren't perfect by any means but at least they saw some of the blatant hyocrisy of the Catholic Church. I consider myself to just be a Christian. I don't follow everything there is to Calvinism because onyl about half squares with scripture and the same goes with arminianism. we need to follow what Jesus said and what His prophets and apostles gave us.
@gtrfurby Just like most prejudiced black ministers that say it was the white man that sold African blacks into slavery. Slightly true. It was black Muslims that sold many of their own brethren. I guess you can call it pimping the brethren for money.
You posted a review of a book you hadn't read based on the video and other people's reviews? Maybe I'll post a video response to yours just from the title...
@gigremlin Rob Bell has for years been off base with how he claims scripture to be, your welcome to check my work against scripture, I've posted bible passages next to most everything I've said. Either how what I've shown from scripture is true or Rob's new view on hell is true, we both can't be right, pick one, read his book if you must, but be fair with what the Bible says, don't suppress the truth based on what you want it to be, let the Bible speak to you...Peace
@truth4U2C I just finished his book and I am not defending it in any way or his theology. I just think you should read it to give us a more accurate critique. More to follow as soon as I can collect my thoughts.
@gigremlin I did trust Tim Challies work, He did do a complete read and book review, my work was to show this video to be easliy answered from scripture. Rob's questions have a way of casting doubt on the bibles clearity....kind of like how the serpent questioned God's word in the garden, "did God really say?" We can trust the bible it is clear, if we don't like what it says, then we pretent its not clear...more food for thought...Peace
I have been studying the original text in the Bible for years aside from church influence and have come to the same points as Rob Bell before knowing about him. I am a historian and can also see many churches today follow erroneous medieval interpretations rather than the original church orthodoxy. I am ready to stand for truth and so are many. And the truth shall set you free. In love.
@agente180 "erroneous medieval interpretations rather than the original church orthodoxy" So if you watch the vid I posted, did I once quoate from a medieval interprelation? No look I give Bible referances to every thing I say...if you find I've misrepresented God in this vid, show me from his word the bible....because to just say I off base without doing the work shows me that its only your opinion, not back by scripture, the truth is found in the bible not Church History...Peace
@Shoots1978 go ahead call "Beep Talk" tell todd about this vid, may-be he'll put it on his T.V Show...yes I listen to wretched....I didn't know anyone else did....Peace
What a sad life we all lead. I have been told that God knows all. He knows what has happened, what is happening, and what will happen. If that's the case, then He must know who all make it in to heaven and who all are burning in hell. What's the point then? If this is true... there is absolutely zero point for us to be here. However, if as Christians we have been given power through the love of Jesus Christ to aid Him in bringing His kingdom to His creation, THAT is a life worth living.
This man Rob Bell is taking an antichrist position, mocking the gospel and trying to create confusion around it. The Gospel is clear: Repent of your sins (be willing to forsake them) and put your trust in Jesus Christ alone for your salvation from your sins. Amen.
Mr. Truth 4U2C, if "truth" is so obvious, why is it so obscure? Are you so certain you have "truth?" Do you believe the same way you did 20 years ago? If truth is so easy to find and understand then why are there literally 10's of 1000's of seperate Christian movements?
I am a follower of Jesus but I don't believe in a literal, eternal hell nor do I believe the Bible teaches it. I changed my view after 100's of hours of study and research and I feel I'm now closer to truth.
@clothman57 Sure my understanding of God through his word has changed in the last 20 years, but what Rob teaches is not from the scriptures. Hell is defined and mentioned in the bible: 2 Peter 2:4
For if God did not spare angels when they sinned, but sent them to hell, putting them in chains of darkness to be held for judgment; Matthew 23:33 “You snakes! You brood of vipers! How will you escape being condemned to hell?
Matthew 10:28 28 Do not be afraid of those who kill the body but cannot kill the soul. Rather, be afraid of the One who can destroy both soul and body in hell. Matthew 23:15 “Woe to you, teachers of the law and Pharisees, you hypocrites! You travel over land and sea to win a single convert, and when you have succeeded, you make them twice as much a child of hell as you are. HELL IS REAL
Lastly i just can't stand the way people are ripping him apart. it doesn't show the love of Christ, and it won't turn him back to the truth. the proper thing to do is pray for him and encourage others to do so. If we say we really care about the souls of others then we should care about his as well. he is no less deserving of the love of Christ than anyone else on this planet :)
The only problem i had with this was when he says Jesus saves us from God you said he was framing the questions to where either we have all misunderstood romans or paints God in a poor light. What i understood him to be saying was that what has been focused on was Jesus saving us from God and that paints God out to be bad to the people who aren't Christians yet. And makes them weary to become one.
@joshundead In order for the good news to be truly good, we must have a clear understanding of our position in light of a pure and holy God...when we see how we are all fallen, and deserve death, not life, then the good news seems to be greater then we could imagine. Rob and many like him preach a gospel that lifts man up as not that bad, by doing this people will never come to the cross because they don't correctly see the need for Christ. Why repent, I'm not that bad...
@TabernaSubcultura Ephesians 6:17 "Take the helmet of salvation and the sword of the Spirit, which is the word of God." it is a weapon to show false doctrines.
You people must read between lines, you cannot interpret the scriptures literally,the Bible is a inspired text, it was not made by dictation as the Koran, so please read and think,, do not read and become a fanatical sheep.
Robe Bell thank you for being a true Christians who continues the Martin Luther idea of Reform.Bible must be interpreted as Jesus intepreted the old scrptures in his way.
You people must read between lines, you cannot interpret the scriptures literally,the Bible is a inspired text, it was not made by dictation as the Koran, so please read and thing,, do not read and become a fanatical sheep.
Robe Bell thank you for being a true Christians who continues the Martin Luther idea of Reform.Bible must be interpreted as Jesus intepreted the old scrptures in his way.
What's prideful is the gospel you seem to adhere to truth4u2c. You come from a perspective that seeks to say, "I'm in and you're out." Who are you to judge the eternal fate of other human beings? Are you the Creator? The "love" you share with others is an exclusionistic love, not inclusivistic. Jesus dealt with this theology with the pharisees. Why are you and other fundys so upset that God might have a different plan than your interpretation? Let God be God my friend, you are not Him.
@emerysdaddy9107 I supported what I've said with scripture, please read in context my work, if I'm off base I'll edit or completly delete this video. I think I clearly warn and do not judge, I'm wretched like the rest of the world, but I'm known by a Holy God who loves me...is that prideful? or is it giving glory to God? please read the bible its not how Rob Bell teaches it...Peace
@truth4U2C I have and continue to read the Bible. But thanks for assuming I don't. The Jesus you exemplify doesn't exist, you need to RE-read your Bible.
@emerysdaddy9107 This isn't about you or me its about the truth, I asked you to read the passages I post to support what I said about who God is, either I did it correctly or Rob did, we both can't be right. So do the work, use scripture to support who you think God is...you can't just say the Jesus I exemplify doesn't exist without showing from scripture how I got it wrong...this is important, you should do the work...peace
@SkjernoySon I've read the bible, and most of what I do in this vid is answer his questions...his questions seem to want to confuse what the bible clearly says...his motive to confuse...to sell books? instead of buying his book, read the bible...peace
The law of Moses was unable to save us because of the weakness of our sinful nature. So God did what the law could not do. He sent his own Son in a body like the bodies we sinners have. And in that body God declared an end to sin’s control over us by giving his Son as a sacrifice for our sins. Romans 8:3
Righteouness comes from Christ, not obeying the 10 C's.
@gregfarmer1980 I agree, all righteousness comes from God. I was trying to use an economy of words, Galatians 3:24 So then, the law was our guardian until Christ came, in order that we might be justified by faith.
I hope the mis use of the term dosn't confuse, I think I do clearly rely the gospel, no one could watch this and think I'm telling them they have to work to earn heaven? thank-you for your concern, peace
The 10 commandments are Gods standard which righteousness flows from????? That is not tue. God Found fault with his old covenant so made a new one. Righteousness does not flow from the 10 commandment but s found in He who became sin who knew no sin that we who where unrighteouss could become rightousness. The y 10 commandments are there to show you your failng and CAN NOT make you righteous!
I read the book. It's simply Karl Barth with a little bit of Lewis and Timothy Keller thrown in. It's well within the realm of orthodoxy, and promotes the supremacy of Christ in a staggering way. I was pretty surprised, being reformed, that the prejudice got it so wrong. Read a book, THEN critique it... That's the lesson to be learned here.
@preson777 Read the Bible, the Jesus Rob has invented in his book is not the Jesus of he Bible. Watch the MSNBC interview, He has made a more likeable Jesus for the post modern person...
@truth4U2C You, sir, like many other online "discerners" are prideful. You haven't read the book, therefor anything you say about it's content is rooted in gossip. I am perfectly capable of reading and exegeting the scriptures in Greek and Hebrew.
"Love wins" is proposing the same thing that Luther proposed to Hans von Rechenberg in 1522. It is nothing new, and falls well within the bounds of orthodoxy. Calvin wasn't Jesus ya know. You Calvinists are becoming increasingly difficult.
make it plain sir make it plain people need to hear this. I thank God for you sir. at the same time the way that guy put the note was kinda rude but the dude is totally right :)
An excellent call to discernment. May God keep using watchmen such as yourself and others to sound the alarm on Bell's dangerous, cancerous teachings. Your statement-by-statement rebuttal of Bell's promotional video was especially appreciated, bringing in God's Word like a sword to counter and puncture Bell's touchy-feely emotional appeal.
It would seem that he is only asking the questions that people pose to him. I would hope that he uses Scripture to answer these questions in his book, if he does not, then he is nothing but a heretic.
We need to pray that Rob Bell opens his Bible and searches for the answers from Scripture.
I do find the tone of a person's comments to say a lot about the commentor. I'm not sure that your comments necessarily lacked empathy, kindness or charity, but some comments on this debate have (that's true on all sides). Warm regards and thanks for your edification.
We can gage the spiritually maturity of the commentor by the lack of empathy, kindness and charity in the comment. This is true on all sides of the debate.
@esl821 If I lack charity towards Rob please forgive me, I do regularly pray for him. My compassion is for those who are mislead by his universal theology that comforts his followers into a false sense of peace with God without true repentance.
@esl821 please read your bible, its not about Rob or myself its about what is true from God's word, both of us can't be right, If you prove, from the bible where i have mis-spoke I will recant by statement in obedience to His word. Do the work, and stop worrying about my maturity. Peace
Evidently Rob Bell doesn't have a personal relationship with Jesus Christ. If he did then he would also know who God the Father is. Rob Bell is part of the the overall apostasy now growing worldwide. The faithful in Jesus Christ laugh at Rob Bell, the weak in Christ need to put on the full armor of God or else they'll get hammered.
@Postoasted I was shocked when he mentioned "who you know" to list that with "take a class" as if the bible isn't clear on this point, that was so is leading. Lets pray for Rob if he repents, that would be so awsome for the kingdom....peace
work of the fallen angels we willl be able to judge and see that these angels deserved to be cast into hell and that the unrighteous also deserved their part.
hell right now are heaven. All the antients sleep except for those who was brought up captive by Jesus such as Moses, Enoch, Esiah and such men. All others sleep in the grave and so will we alll until God returns. Nowhere in the bible does it say man wil burn forever and ever. It says that death and hell(1st death) will be cast into the lake of fire. And their will be no memory of them. We shall also Judge angels so that we can see that God was rigtheous in his decision. so that when we see the
Jesus came that we may have life again. Adam sinned in the penalty was death. If Jesus did not die God would have been a liar. Whats more compelling is that the same Jesus who died is also God. This man is full of deception and should be eyed with suspicion. Defining God's character according to our standards is not the place of man. If he is trying to be sympathetic to the world let him base his ideas on his personal view, but dont pass them off as being supported by scripture, no one is in
Outstanding, Bob! Great video, great job! Point for point is the way to go in battling this, I agree. God bless you. Check out my video, and let us pray for this guy, since he needs our prayers. He is well-intentioned, it seems clear, but like Apollos, though fervent and ready to preach, he needs a instruction. He must humble himself before The Church, which is Christ, on the matter of theology.
Does it not bother you that a peacemaker like Gandhi goes to hell while a mass-murderer who repents on his deathbed goes to heaven? Or that Adolf Hitler (who was raised a Christian Catholic) goes to heaven, while the millions of Jews he killed go to hell? What about the cruel, racist men who imported slaves from Africa to America in the colonial era--they as Christians go to heaven while the largely Muslim slaves go to hell. How could this possibly be the work of a just, benevolent god?
@vulpix If we believe that the Bible is the word of God, we must then imbrace what it says about our position. we all deserve hell, so God is mercful and full of grace for saving any of us. Hitler although being an alter boy could have been forgiven, but from all we know about his life, he lived in rebellion agaisnt God, in other words we see no sign that he ever repented from his sinful ways...Peace
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I've just written a book about Hell & eternity that will be out soon. It talks about what the Scriptures actually say on the subject. Join in the discussion....
whatthehellbook . com
alyssafaithbaer 6 months ago
It looks like Francis Chans new book gives a truthful/biblical view of Hell, unlike Rob Bells lies.
People, you cannot ignore the Bible and try to explain to a Holy God, you chose to listen to Rob Bell and do not want to believe in Hell... Sorry, it is not up to us if there is a Hell, we just chose to go there or not.
rickgigliotti 7 months ago
assumption alert! I've assumed for Rev 21, lake of fire = hell, but why? especially as hell (gehenna) goes into the lake of fire to be destroyed... comments?
tintinworld 9 months ago
To expose my heart - I am unsure if I have ever met someone who in their heart believes in a forever torture punishment hell (and for most of the human race). By "belief" i mean, it naturally fuels action and shapes the person continually... Wouldn't believing this create a mental illness? Personally, I am too scared to really go there.. I would like you hear your experience, if you would care to share, how do you hold this? Or do you resist it at a deeper level? thanks for your honesty
tintinworld 9 months ago
@tintinworld Wow I totally agree...I don't go there either, it sounds like Hell. just watched "The hiding Place" with my family last night. Corrie ten Boom servied a concentration camp during WW2, after seeing hollywoods attempt to show the horror, then the real Corrie ten Boom spoke about it, it was twice as awful as hollywood's rendition. The fact that we can create a hell on earth that is so miserable is understandable, becasue we're fallin...So it dose concern me that God created Hell....
snowshop 9 months ago
@tintinworld But what we read in the bible shows us that God really hates Rebellion / Sin so much that it builds up wrath, that God pours out on the unrepentant rebells...Hell....It just is the way it is...by the way truth4u2c is the channel I'm suppose to be on, I'm at work and forgot to change my login...I run a ski/snowboard shop here in Tahoe...I Hope this ministers to you sincerley Bob
snowshop 9 months ago
@snowshop thanks bob, it really does help. particularly listening to your thoughts on corrie ten boom, i am moved by it
tintinworld 9 months ago
@snowshop I follow my heart - my intuition & there's something about the traditional hell view doesnt fit inside, gut reaction, but I've never had a scripture to back it up, so I have unwillingly believed in it. // Now there's a new understanding & I'm keen to learn & test it! // Ps 30:5, 103:9 - it doesnt say Gods love last for a moment (a life), and his anger lasts forever (hell), nor, Rom 5 - it doesnt say the sin of adam is more influential than the victory of christ.
tintinworld 9 months ago
I want to add, I do believe in Sin - making wrong moral choices. It's something that I do and am doing.
But, for this, I'll experience being tortured?!
And it goes on forever?!
And the same god that sent jesus to die for the world is actively involved?!
It's not a paradox of gods love/justice.. it's a contradiction... and one that we've made.
tintinworld 9 months ago
@tintinworld Since the concept of justice seems to be so clear and true to my experance, no matter how it plays out in the here after, I'm trusting God to be Just. The other issue is, who this side of eternity really knows if our concept of time even applies. I think we step into some kind of a huge realization, are we then in all time at the same time? I think we'll all laugh at how wrong our understanding is, so I just plan trust God. Your grip on how awful hell is has got you judging God.
snowshop 9 months ago
@snowshop /// Thanks for your insight, I do have a judgement. I am ok with god creating hell... but not ok with god creating a certain version of hell that is "forver" and "tormenting".
My judgement is that God is 2-faced (which is a projection of the splits in my soul) & my feeling about this is fear and distrust, and my request is that god would be more straight forward.
tintinworld 9 months ago
@tintinworld "It's not a paradox of gods love/justice.. it's a contradiction... and one that we've made" JUSTICE IS LOVING
truth4U2C 9 months ago
thanks for asking snowshop, I have an understanding of post-modernism, and yes, I see the fit. // Culture does influence our assumptions we bring into reading the bible, for good and for worse. // Do you also see a Dark Ages (pre-modernity), Dualism (Decartes) and a Plato influence on a forever painful view of hell? // Sadly, neither side of any (biblical) argument can be removed from cultural assumptions - even though Modernists may disagree.. but of course they would.... so it goes on.
tintinworld 9 months ago
@tintinworld Well said, but the bible hasn't changed, So a person can see and attempt to see through their worldview baises. Better then that we all have been given a conscience, that convicts us when we do something wrong. if we have a healthly conscience we have a fear, because we know we deserve punishment, but if we remain in rebellion against God we become twisted. Proverbs 28:5
Evil men do not understand justice, But those who seek the LORD understand all. This misunderstanding would,,,
truth4U2C 9 months ago
@tintinworld ...motivate a person to re-define hell or completly get rid of it. In either case, that person has lighten the impact of their conscience so they can go on living an unrepentant life. Romans 1:18 For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men, who suppress the truth in unrighteousness, So does the princible of punishment ring true or is it that you, (the law breaker) thinks that the Judges punishment is unjust?
truth4U2C 9 months ago
@truth4U2C "princible of punishment" - punishment is the hard corrective judgement of a father // (second part) Yes. A forever hell is unjust, and more - it's evil. It makes no sense of the bible as a whole. It doesnt fit my experience of god. It doesnt fit my experinece of the goodness I see in people or nature // I whole disagree with the initial assumption of Augustines "Original sin" doctrine, so my conclusions are very different.
tintinworld 9 months ago
Maybe we've different definitions for words. I see my conscience is a wholey unreliable source or guage. It's programmed with strange guilts and irrational fears - see child development biology // I think an unhealthy conscience might end up with a forever hell doctrine, as it would connect with it, as a self-punishment // "deserve punishment" = why be so cruel to yourself... just seek forgivness, have integrity & be honest... and when you fail in that, pick yourself up, try again.
tintinworld 9 months ago
@truth4U2C Maybe we have different definitions for words, but I see my conscience is a wholey unreliable source or guage. It's programmed with strange guilts and irrational fears - see child development biology // I think an unhealthy conscience might end up with a forever hell doctrine, as it would connect with it, as a self-punishment // "deserve punishment" = not healthy mental desire, why be so cruel to yourself... seek forgivness, have integrity, be honest, yes.
tintinworld 9 months ago
thanks snowshop, Matthew scripture - if "eternal" doesnt mean "forever" and if "fire" is godly process (purification and transformation - see below), then you have a different take on this verse. I read it as a seperation, but a forever painful experience, no.
Re "Fire" - the H.S comes in fire, we are tested by fire, god is a consuming fire, at pentecost tongues of fire, christs eyes are a flaming fire, a river of fire flows before him, appears to moses as a fire... so many, run out of words!
tintinworld 9 months ago
truth4u2c - It occurs to me that Rob Bell has read about all the scriptures that you have rightlyfully quoted.
What Rob seems to be doing is putting aside individual verses, looking at the bigger picture of the nature of god, then using that to inform the individual verses.
For example, Rob's intrepretation of the word "judgement" is compelling, a force that purges rather than destroys.
tintinworld 9 months ago
@tintinworld yeah I get get, the bigger picture "Love Wins" but even though we know from the bible that God is love, he is also "Just" and justice is a part of his love. Proverbs 28:5 Evil men do not understand justice, but those who seek the LORD understand it fully. Note what your saying "Rob's intrepretation" NO NO NO, please see how your following a man and not the bible. Sure it may be compelling, but is it the truth? Do you know what it means to have a post-modern world view?
snowshop 9 months ago
assumption alert "truth4u2c" - eternal being = eternal punishment - why link these 2?
also, eternal is now only. there's no such thing as time outside the now moment to experience, that's only memory or an intellectual concept of future.
He denies teaching universalism
I dont think he's teaching universalism from what i've heard, but he's going in that direction.
Do you have a judgement agenda behind your interpretation, his love agenda is more godlike, inspiring and compelling to me
tintinworld 9 months ago
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@tintinworld Eternal punishment Jesus taugh : Bell―But when the Son of Man comes in His glory, and all the angels with Him, then He will sit on His glorious throne. ―All the nations will be gathered before Him; and He will separate them from one another, as the shepherd separates the sheep from the goats; and He will put the sheep on His right, and the goats on the left.
snowshop 9 months ago
@tintinworld ―Then the King will say to those on His right, ‗Come, you who are blessed of My Father, inherit the kingdom prepared for you from the foundation of the world. . . . Then He will also say to those on His left, ‗Depart from Me, accursed ones, into the eternal fire which has been prepared for the devil and his angels . . . These will go away into eternal punishment, but the righteous into eternal life.‖(Matthew 25:31-34, 41, 46)
snowshop 9 months ago
I hope Rob turns it all to Christ before he sends himself and even others to hell.
Trappyhands 10 months ago
@Trappyhands Amen, lets keep him and his followers in our prayers.....Peace
truth4U2C 10 months ago 2
Bell is an example of someone who is making it up as they go along.
His view of the Christian god and his message to humanity is as likely to be as true as the Christian message, but the point is it is not the Christian message, it is Bell's message.
SamWiseGingy 10 months ago
if Lev 20:10 the adulterer and the adulteress shall surely be put to death. than explain :)
john 8:11?
gtrfurby 10 months ago
Jesus said "whatever you do, even to the least among you, you do to me." So are there people who are not Christians who clothe Christ, feed Christ, visit him in prison, and love him. Yet Christians teach us Jesus will then turn his back on those who fed him, clothed him, saved HIM. From any outside perspective it is impossible to see any theology that involves hell as not being about naked power. About existing to support a hierarchy.
mrjdgibbs 10 months ago
Great points. Romans 10 begins with the ideal that they had a zeal for God but not with knowledge. In that very chapter in the first verses-self righteousness which they establish is against the righteousness of God. What does this all mean? If we do something so good that everyone admires us and do it apart from Christ-it is self righteousness which never saves. There is your righteousness and the righteousness from Christ. You cannot have both. Christ is God or you are-I vote for Christ
daveme7 10 months ago
If we look at Jesus, as a man, its plain to see that he died for his beliefs,he was willing to die for his beliefs. I've often wondered how he feels about this theology that says his teaching, the things he died for are less important than this neo greco theology.
mrjdgibbs 10 months ago
wow were going to talk about book reviews from people who are writing a book review about a book that hasn't even been released yet?
funny are you psychic?
gtrfurby 10 months ago
@gtrfurby Watch it again, I address all the confusion that Rob atempts to create so can can sell his book. show that the Bible clearly answers all of Robs questions. I then refer to other book reviews. So here is a better concern to have, is how Rob Bell represents "Hell" true? or is how the bible says it to be True?
truth4U2C 10 months ago
In other words has the Church got it worng all these years, by trusting what the bible says or in 2011 out of the blue this guy Rob Bell gets it right, "love wins" we're all going to Heaven
truth4U2C 10 months ago
@truth4U2C well in response to your future comments according to what other people have posted here and than take what there opinion was of this video and then post judgment..
"I THINK PEOPLE WHO HAVE STUPID HATS ARE GOING TO HELL"
gtrfurby 10 months ago
@gtrfurby that was bullhorn style, for those who need to repent of wearing stupid hats and fuzzy blue screens.
since we know for certain who is in hell and whose not!.
so therefore turn from your wicked ways
gtrfurby 10 months ago
@gtrfurby Dude your right my hat is a false idol, it has a Volcom stone on it.... so all is realitive, no such thing as truth... good luck with that world view.....funny thing, if there is no truth, why did you even care to post a comment? is there a chance you fear hell? you should, because your conscience is telling you so, that's why your putting hope in Rob Bells book that says we all go to heaven, even people with bad hats
truth4U2C 10 months ago
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@truth4U2C again pure speculation!
so you have read the book?
does your bible say go "ye into the world and speculate"?
gtrfurby 10 months ago
@truth4U2C no again your missing the whole point.
and as far as the reformers go they sure did do a great job of showing the jews Gods love didnt they?
gtrfurby 10 months ago
Page 95: that says it enough. He thinks he has a new revelation from God that the 99.9% of us didn't get for 2,000 years. Sounds like a cult leader to me if I ever seen one.
thesacredcowtipper 10 months ago
Amen brother. There's some out there that still beleive the scriptures.
thesacredcowtipper 10 months ago
I disagree, Rob Bell is making good points. Protestant Christianity repeats Protestant theology without protesting to test that theology. Case in point, Protestant salvation theology revolves around individual salvation through a personal relationship with Jesus, hence, Romans 9-11 is regularly misunderstood.
StormTrek 10 months ago
@StormTrek Anyone can check the reformers work in light of scripture, I personally think that they did a great job. For the record, the "Personal relationship" terminology, although true, didn't come from the reformers, the term became popular in the last 50 years. Who misunderstands romans 9-11? the reformers understood it. Can you point out how you think Rob bell did a better job with Romans 9-11?
truth4U2C 10 months ago
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@truth4U2C The original reformers did a great job with what they had, but they didn't have the depth of research we have today on 1st century second temple Judaism, modern techniques of textual analysis, or even our knowledge of ancient Greek and Hebrew. Today, Protestants emphasize heaven and hell over resurrection. Protestants (Reformed) teach Romans 9-11 as though it regards God's monergistic decision of individual election rather than God's corporate election of the Jews as his chosen people
StormTrek 10 months ago
@truth4U2C Hey Truth, I agree. Romans 9-11 is totally misinterpreted by most ministers today. There are other EXTRA-biblical things the church had begun to do about 50 years or so ago that are very unbiblical. I will name a few - The Altar Call, The Sinner's Prayer, no preaching on repentance, no preaching on counting the cost before making a covenant-relationship with the Almighty.
thesacredcowtipper 10 months ago
@thesacredcowtipper you forgot burning down synagogues, witch trials, the inquisition, oh wait you said in only fifty years.sorry.
gtrfurby 10 months ago
@gtrfurby I don't apply to my christianity what the Roman Catholic Church did. I left Roman Catholicism 27 years ago before I even knew what they did. They are the false church - the mystery babylon written in scripture. People like to attribute what the Popes and catholicism did to what Christianity is. You cannot do that. Christianity was around 300 years before Catholicism even though they will deny that statement.
thesacredcowtipper 10 months ago
@thesacredcowtipper well how about the reformers? they did a great job too you know.
yeah but the thing is everything gets corrupted.
gtrfurby 10 months ago
@gtrfurby The reformers weren't perfect by any means but at least they saw some of the blatant hyocrisy of the Catholic Church. I consider myself to just be a Christian. I don't follow everything there is to Calvinism because onyl about half squares with scripture and the same goes with arminianism. we need to follow what Jesus said and what His prophets and apostles gave us.
thesacredcowtipper 10 months ago
@gtrfurby Just like most prejudiced black ministers that say it was the white man that sold African blacks into slavery. Slightly true. It was black Muslims that sold many of their own brethren. I guess you can call it pimping the brethren for money.
thesacredcowtipper 10 months ago
Reality check: you're not in an early 90's boy band, or homeless; don't dress like it.
lettertoapriest 10 months ago
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God wins, Rob Bell looses!
rickgigliotti 10 months ago
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rickgigliotti 10 months ago
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gigremlin 11 months ago
You posted a review of a book you hadn't read based on the video and other people's reviews? Maybe I'll post a video response to yours just from the title...
gigremlin 11 months ago
@gigremlin Rob Bell has for years been off base with how he claims scripture to be, your welcome to check my work against scripture, I've posted bible passages next to most everything I've said. Either how what I've shown from scripture is true or Rob's new view on hell is true, we both can't be right, pick one, read his book if you must, but be fair with what the Bible says, don't suppress the truth based on what you want it to be, let the Bible speak to you...Peace
truth4U2C 11 months ago
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gigremlin 11 months ago
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gigremlin 11 months ago
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gigremlin 11 months ago
@truth4U2C I just finished his book and I am not defending it in any way or his theology. I just think you should read it to give us a more accurate critique. More to follow as soon as I can collect my thoughts.
gigremlin 11 months ago
@gigremlin I did trust Tim Challies work, He did do a complete read and book review, my work was to show this video to be easliy answered from scripture. Rob's questions have a way of casting doubt on the bibles clearity....kind of like how the serpent questioned God's word in the garden, "did God really say?" We can trust the bible it is clear, if we don't like what it says, then we pretent its not clear...more food for thought...Peace
snowshop 10 months ago
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@gigremlin God wins, Rob Bell looses!
rickgigliotti 10 months ago
i liked this vid very much. I'm doing my homework too. God bless
farisa2020 11 months ago
I have been studying the original text in the Bible for years aside from church influence and have come to the same points as Rob Bell before knowing about him. I am a historian and can also see many churches today follow erroneous medieval interpretations rather than the original church orthodoxy. I am ready to stand for truth and so are many. And the truth shall set you free. In love.
agente180 11 months ago
@agente180 "erroneous medieval interpretations rather than the original church orthodoxy" So if you watch the vid I posted, did I once quoate from a medieval interprelation? No look I give Bible referances to every thing I say...if you find I've misrepresented God in this vid, show me from his word the bible....because to just say I off base without doing the work shows me that its only your opinion, not back by scripture, the truth is found in the bible not Church History...Peace
truth4U2C 11 months ago
@truth4U2C So do you study the new testemant in greek?
Britzilius 11 months ago
@Britzilius I've looked up words from time to time, but I wouldn't say I've studied it in greek the way you asked the question....
truth4U2C 11 months ago
Hey you said "wretched" sinner, oh wait that's not trademarked. :) Now, it will be, I will have to be calling Todd Friel and let him know, (hehe).
Shoots1978 11 months ago
@Shoots1978 go ahead call "Beep Talk" tell todd about this vid, may-be he'll put it on his T.V Show...yes I listen to wretched....I didn't know anyone else did....Peace
truth4U2C 11 months ago
Rob bell is a humanist, and an unbeliever.
FillTheirVoid 11 months ago
What a sad life we all lead. I have been told that God knows all. He knows what has happened, what is happening, and what will happen. If that's the case, then He must know who all make it in to heaven and who all are burning in hell. What's the point then? If this is true... there is absolutely zero point for us to be here. However, if as Christians we have been given power through the love of Jesus Christ to aid Him in bringing His kingdom to His creation, THAT is a life worth living.
Hawkeye92391 11 months ago
This man Rob Bell is taking an antichrist position, mocking the gospel and trying to create confusion around it. The Gospel is clear: Repent of your sins (be willing to forsake them) and put your trust in Jesus Christ alone for your salvation from your sins. Amen.
RobertMOdell 11 months ago
@RobertMOdell Well Said my friend...
truth4U2C 11 months ago
@RobertMOdell
Mr. Truth 4U2C, if "truth" is so obvious, why is it so obscure? Are you so certain you have "truth?" Do you believe the same way you did 20 years ago? If truth is so easy to find and understand then why are there literally 10's of 1000's of seperate Christian movements?
I am a follower of Jesus but I don't believe in a literal, eternal hell nor do I believe the Bible teaches it. I changed my view after 100's of hours of study and research and I feel I'm now closer to truth.
clothman57 11 months ago
@clothman57 Sure my understanding of God through his word has changed in the last 20 years, but what Rob teaches is not from the scriptures. Hell is defined and mentioned in the bible: 2 Peter 2:4
For if God did not spare angels when they sinned, but sent them to hell, putting them in chains of darkness to be held for judgment; Matthew 23:33 “You snakes! You brood of vipers! How will you escape being condemned to hell?
truth4U2C 11 months ago
Matthew 10:28 28 Do not be afraid of those who kill the body but cannot kill the soul. Rather, be afraid of the One who can destroy both soul and body in hell. Matthew 23:15 “Woe to you, teachers of the law and Pharisees, you hypocrites! You travel over land and sea to win a single convert, and when you have succeeded, you make them twice as much a child of hell as you are. HELL IS REAL
truth4U2C 11 months ago
Lastly i just can't stand the way people are ripping him apart. it doesn't show the love of Christ, and it won't turn him back to the truth. the proper thing to do is pray for him and encourage others to do so. If we say we really care about the souls of others then we should care about his as well. he is no less deserving of the love of Christ than anyone else on this planet :)
joshundead 11 months ago
@joshundead Thank you thank you thank you, an honest kind voice in the midst of angry confused uneducated opinions... This comment made my day!!!
dohboy3000 11 months ago
he also never said it was not good news, he asked how can this be good news?
joshundead 11 months ago
The only problem i had with this was when he says Jesus saves us from God you said he was framing the questions to where either we have all misunderstood romans or paints God in a poor light. What i understood him to be saying was that what has been focused on was Jesus saving us from God and that paints God out to be bad to the people who aren't Christians yet. And makes them weary to become one.
joshundead 11 months ago
@joshundead In order for the good news to be truly good, we must have a clear understanding of our position in light of a pure and holy God...when we see how we are all fallen, and deserve death, not life, then the good news seems to be greater then we could imagine. Rob and many like him preach a gospel that lifts man up as not that bad, by doing this people will never come to the cross because they don't correctly see the need for Christ. Why repent, I'm not that bad...
truth4U2C 11 months ago
@joshundead listen to a message called Hell's best secret by Ray Compfort
truth4U2C 11 months ago
You use the Bible as a weapon
TabernaSubcultura 11 months ago
@TabernaSubcultura Ephesians 6:17 "Take the helmet of salvation and the sword of the Spirit, which is the word of God." it is a weapon to show false doctrines.
truth4U2C 11 months ago
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You people must read between lines, you cannot interpret the scriptures literally,the Bible is a inspired text, it was not made by dictation as the Koran, so please read and think,, do not read and become a fanatical sheep.
Robe Bell thank you for being a true Christians who continues the Martin Luther idea of Reform.Bible must be interpreted as Jesus intepreted the old scrptures in his way.
TabernaSubcultura 11 months ago
You people must read between lines, you cannot interpret the scriptures literally,the Bible is a inspired text, it was not made by dictation as the Koran, so please read and thing,, do not read and become a fanatical sheep.
Robe Bell thank you for being a true Christians who continues the Martin Luther idea of Reform.Bible must be interpreted as Jesus intepreted the old scrptures in his way.
TabernaSubcultura 11 months ago
What's prideful is the gospel you seem to adhere to truth4u2c. You come from a perspective that seeks to say, "I'm in and you're out." Who are you to judge the eternal fate of other human beings? Are you the Creator? The "love" you share with others is an exclusionistic love, not inclusivistic. Jesus dealt with this theology with the pharisees. Why are you and other fundys so upset that God might have a different plan than your interpretation? Let God be God my friend, you are not Him.
emerysdaddy9107 11 months ago
@emerysdaddy9107 I supported what I've said with scripture, please read in context my work, if I'm off base I'll edit or completly delete this video. I think I clearly warn and do not judge, I'm wretched like the rest of the world, but I'm known by a Holy God who loves me...is that prideful? or is it giving glory to God? please read the bible its not how Rob Bell teaches it...Peace
truth4U2C 11 months ago
@truth4U2C I have and continue to read the Bible. But thanks for assuming I don't. The Jesus you exemplify doesn't exist, you need to RE-read your Bible.
emerysdaddy9107 11 months ago
@emerysdaddy9107 This isn't about you or me its about the truth, I asked you to read the passages I post to support what I said about who God is, either I did it correctly or Rob did, we both can't be right. So do the work, use scripture to support who you think God is...you can't just say the Jesus I exemplify doesn't exist without showing from scripture how I got it wrong...this is important, you should do the work...peace
truth4U2C 11 months ago
Ignorant. Simply ignorant. Read the book first. You are precisely who this book was written for.
SkjernoySon 11 months ago
@SkjernoySon I've read the bible, and most of what I do in this vid is answer his questions...his questions seem to want to confuse what the bible clearly says...his motive to confuse...to sell books? instead of buying his book, read the bible...peace
truth4U2C 11 months ago
GREAT response, Brother!!! Thank you, Thank you, THANK YOU!!!!
“The most important thing about a man is what he thinks about God.” — A.W. Tozer
MeInTheCornfield 11 months ago
The law of Moses was unable to save us because of the weakness of our sinful nature. So God did what the law could not do. He sent his own Son in a body like the bodies we sinners have. And in that body God declared an end to sin’s control over us by giving his Son as a sacrifice for our sins. Romans 8:3
Righteouness comes from Christ, not obeying the 10 C's.
gregfarmer1980 11 months ago
@gregfarmer1980 I agree, all righteousness comes from God. I was trying to use an economy of words, Galatians 3:24 So then, the law was our guardian until Christ came, in order that we might be justified by faith.
I hope the mis use of the term dosn't confuse, I think I do clearly rely the gospel, no one could watch this and think I'm telling them they have to work to earn heaven? thank-you for your concern, peace
truth4U2C 11 months ago
The 10 commandments are Gods standard which righteousness flows from????? That is not tue. God Found fault with his old covenant so made a new one. Righteousness does not flow from the 10 commandment but s found in He who became sin who knew no sin that we who where unrighteouss could become rightousness. The y 10 commandments are there to show you your failng and CAN NOT make you righteous!
gregfarmer1980 11 months ago
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snowshop 11 months ago
I read the book. It's simply Karl Barth with a little bit of Lewis and Timothy Keller thrown in. It's well within the realm of orthodoxy, and promotes the supremacy of Christ in a staggering way. I was pretty surprised, being reformed, that the prejudice got it so wrong. Read a book, THEN critique it... That's the lesson to be learned here.
preson777 11 months ago
@preson777 Read the Bible, the Jesus Rob has invented in his book is not the Jesus of he Bible. Watch the MSNBC interview, He has made a more likeable Jesus for the post modern person...
truth4U2C 11 months ago
@truth4U2C You, sir, like many other online "discerners" are prideful. You haven't read the book, therefor anything you say about it's content is rooted in gossip. I am perfectly capable of reading and exegeting the scriptures in Greek and Hebrew.
"Love wins" is proposing the same thing that Luther proposed to Hans von Rechenberg in 1522. It is nothing new, and falls well within the bounds of orthodoxy. Calvin wasn't Jesus ya know. You Calvinists are becoming increasingly difficult.
preson777 11 months ago
Rob bell is the antichrist
Herpasyphillaids 11 months ago
make it plain sir make it plain people need to hear this. I thank God for you sir. at the same time the way that guy put the note was kinda rude but the dude is totally right :)
songwriter093 11 months ago
An excellent call to discernment. May God keep using watchmen such as yourself and others to sound the alarm on Bell's dangerous, cancerous teachings. Your statement-by-statement rebuttal of Bell's promotional video was especially appreciated, bringing in God's Word like a sword to counter and puncture Bell's touchy-feely emotional appeal.
GaryPeterson67 11 months ago
@GaryPeterson67 Thanks for he Encouragement...battle on brother
truth4U2C 11 months ago
It would seem that he is only asking the questions that people pose to him. I would hope that he uses Scripture to answer these questions in his book, if he does not, then he is nothing but a heretic.
We need to pray that Rob Bell opens his Bible and searches for the answers from Scripture.
AcaiBunch 11 months ago
@AcaiBunch Amen
truth4U2C 11 months ago
I do find the tone of a person's comments to say a lot about the commentor. I'm not sure that your comments necessarily lacked empathy, kindness or charity, but some comments on this debate have (that's true on all sides). Warm regards and thanks for your edification.
esl821 11 months ago
We can gage the spiritually maturity of the commentor by the lack of empathy, kindness and charity in the comment. This is true on all sides of the debate.
esl821 11 months ago
@esl821 If I lack charity towards Rob please forgive me, I do regularly pray for him. My compassion is for those who are mislead by his universal theology that comforts his followers into a false sense of peace with God without true repentance.
truth4U2C 11 months ago
@esl821 please read your bible, its not about Rob or myself its about what is true from God's word, both of us can't be right, If you prove, from the bible where i have mis-spoke I will recant by statement in obedience to His word. Do the work, and stop worrying about my maturity. Peace
truth4U2C 11 months ago
The end is nearing false profits gonna come out of the woodwork.....
BrenL58 11 months ago
Great job mate! Nice response.
preachercam 11 months ago
Evidently Rob Bell doesn't have a personal relationship with Jesus Christ. If he did then he would also know who God the Father is. Rob Bell is part of the the overall apostasy now growing worldwide. The faithful in Jesus Christ laugh at Rob Bell, the weak in Christ need to put on the full armor of God or else they'll get hammered.
Postoasted 1 year ago
@Postoasted I was shocked when he mentioned "who you know" to list that with "take a class" as if the bible isn't clear on this point, that was so is leading. Lets pray for Rob if he repents, that would be so awsome for the kingdom....peace
truth4U2C 11 months ago
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work of the fallen angels we willl be able to judge and see that these angels deserved to be cast into hell and that the unrighteous also deserved their part.
Adriangrosvenor 1 year ago
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Adriangrosvenor 1 year ago
hell right now are heaven. All the antients sleep except for those who was brought up captive by Jesus such as Moses, Enoch, Esiah and such men. All others sleep in the grave and so will we alll until God returns. Nowhere in the bible does it say man wil burn forever and ever. It says that death and hell(1st death) will be cast into the lake of fire. And their will be no memory of them. We shall also Judge angels so that we can see that God was rigtheous in his decision. so that when we see the
Adriangrosvenor 1 year ago
Jesus came that we may have life again. Adam sinned in the penalty was death. If Jesus did not die God would have been a liar. Whats more compelling is that the same Jesus who died is also God. This man is full of deception and should be eyed with suspicion. Defining God's character according to our standards is not the place of man. If he is trying to be sympathetic to the world let him base his ideas on his personal view, but dont pass them off as being supported by scripture, no one is in
Adriangrosvenor 1 year ago
Outstanding, Bob! Great video, great job! Point for point is the way to go in battling this, I agree. God bless you. Check out my video, and let us pray for this guy, since he needs our prayers. He is well-intentioned, it seems clear, but like Apollos, though fervent and ready to preach, he needs a instruction. He must humble himself before The Church, which is Christ, on the matter of theology.
1Kings18 1 year ago
@1Kings18 yes we need to pray, no one will have perfect understanding, but we can lift up scripture an know more about God...peace
truth4U2C 11 months ago
Does it not bother you that a peacemaker like Gandhi goes to hell while a mass-murderer who repents on his deathbed goes to heaven? Or that Adolf Hitler (who was raised a Christian Catholic) goes to heaven, while the millions of Jews he killed go to hell? What about the cruel, racist men who imported slaves from Africa to America in the colonial era--they as Christians go to heaven while the largely Muslim slaves go to hell. How could this possibly be the work of a just, benevolent god?
vulpix 1 year ago
@vulpix If we believe that the Bible is the word of God, we must then imbrace what it says about our position. we all deserve hell, so God is mercful and full of grace for saving any of us. Hitler although being an alter boy could have been forgiven, but from all we know about his life, he lived in rebellion agaisnt God, in other words we see no sign that he ever repented from his sinful ways...Peace
truth4U2C 1 year ago 2
i loved this.
ghettomelody 1 year ago