wait so you're supposed to get insurance in case/before you get sick, but it's "not okay" if you're already sick and expecting insurance to take care of you when you're applying? What a weird system lol.
@kmelfina Because the idea of insurance is not to take care of a problem you already have, but take care of a problem you MIGHT have. Do you think car insurance companies should cover you if you go to them AFTER you get in a wreck? It's really common sense. Unfortunately, the health care system has been viewed as working outside of market principles, which is not true, and that's why it's fucked the way it is now.
@kommisar Thanks. I'm still learning about how these social programs work. Now these same people who "lost" everything expect the government to take care of 'em regardless of their decisions >_<;
@kmelfina I believe underneath it all is a deliberate, covert agenda to control people by making them dependent on government. Many of these health care lobbyists benefit from all these regulations. There's definitely a string puller. The point is though, all these problems weren't around before the government got involved in the health care system.
That is EXACTLY the point here, that government IS the problem, and that people need to realize that before drawing the wrong conclusions and thinking they need government; beureaucrats can't save people.
Doctors, working hard in competition against each other and communicating with their patients to try to give them the better service, do.
For the occasional emergency patient who can't pay, there's always charity.
@decadumb no it's not. If you are spending other people's money you rarely ever care about cost. That's true for ANY situation. I work in a high school cafeteria and if someone is broke and a friend offers to pay for it they almost always get more than they would have if THEY were paying. It's a perfectly valid comparison.
"They'd buy a lot more... because they're spending somebody elses money now." The man must be psychic: he just described about half of the food stamp recipients around here.
This is Bull because the patients are not the ones that go to doctors and tell them to do this or do that. Doctors are always the ones who tell the patient that have to have all these treatments like random x rays just so they can pump the bill up as much as they can to get the most out of the insurance company as they can.
@kommisar The point I'm trying to get across is what do we do about the sick people who cannot afford treatment to their illness? Do we just let them die? It's like holding out a warm bottle of milk in front of a baby and telling him they can't have it because they can't afford it. At least with healthcare people are able to get treatment. Stossel says he wishes less people would have health care because it raises the price but offers no solution.
@Shnimberz There's always a solution. There are charities, hospitals won't deny people, socialized healthcare or no socialized healthcare; they're humans too believe it or not. If they work in a hospital they probably want to help people AT LEAST A LITTLE. A hospital could take on the cost itself. Or the patient could pay off the procedure over time. In any case, liberalizing healthcare would make it AFFORDABLE; that's the key here.
@Spjungen Why, for instance, are computers, iphones and most technology not a problem these days? Or cars...most people can buy a car, because thankfully the government still hasn't quite reached its hand into that sector. In the same way, most people would be able to afford health care if it wasn't so artificially propped up. Also he doesn't say he wishes less people would have it, he says he wishes it would be more AFFORDABLE, SO THAT more people CAN have it. Listen first.
@Shnimberz That's why I was wondering what happened to the rest of the piece. Part 6 ends rather abruptly, and appears to offer no closure for a news piece. However, I think the best solution would involve a gradual scaling back up government involvement in the health care system. People are dependent on welfare health care unfortunately, so it couldn't be done overnight. However, this mess is mostly to be blamed on the government, not insurance companies or doctors.
Even if there were a grocery insurance, that is not what I imagine it would be. Insurance is to protect you if something goes wrong, not to pay for everyday necessities. You need a lot of water to be healthy, yet health insurance companies don't pay for that now do they?
Lol, this Stossel is an arse-hole. When he gets cancer and his insurance company shits on him he will see. There are people who lie to the companies but not all.
It's funny how liberals can brainwash sheepish people into doing what's moral or "right". Fuck them and their bullshit. Give me liberty or give me death.
One counter argument to the "why not buy steak instead of hamburger if you had insurance". Well, what if you wanted to make some Hamburger Helper? Think about it.
so how is it that insurance companies makes sooo much money? (4;20) considering how much they are making there shouldn't be a problem helping people with preexisting conditions. Its bogus cop out to say that the cost goes up for others that pay into the insurance companies when you pay out multi-million dollar bonuses to execs etc...
Stossel's is a Libertarian he does not think the Government should regulate the free market. He thinks the FM will take care of itself by all of us deciding if we want to participate. The problem is Medical insurance company's are not subject to the Anti-trust laws the same way other company's are. This creates a huge problem for all of us. He thinks if we paid for doctor visits out of our pocket the price will go down to where we all could afford doctor office. Insurance pays for catastrophic
You didn't give me a reason for why you were right. You just called me names and thought you won the argument because of it. If you want to have a real discussion about this, then I'll debate you on it. Otherwise, I won't waste my time arguing with someone who sounds like they belong in middle school.
insurance should only cover huge but rare unexpected expenses, like having your car crushed by a bulldozer of having need for a liver transplant operation.
You're right john stossel is biased he works for ABC which has never questioned universal healthcare before or after him. Government regulation would cause the health industry to go Bankrupt if they couldnt put a price $ on an individual. This is not an opinion but a fact. Both medicaid and Medicare are both bankrupt because they did the same thing.
I personally think that healthcare insurance either shouldn't be private, or it should be private but be regulated like there's no tomorrow. They put a dollar value on every person they insure, and decide whether it's worth to insure them or not. They decide whether you should be getting treatment or not. With a gov't run one or a regulated one, that wouldn't happen, because they wouldn't be able to cancel your insurance. Least, that's what I've learned so far.
Stossel is lying about the NY Times poll. The question about satisfaction of insurance coverage was never asked. It asked if you were satisfied with health care and also insurance costs. Health care (not insurance coverage) was 77% very or somewhat satisfied; Insurance costs satisfaction dropped to 50%. I don't know where Stossel got the 87% since this question of coverage satisfaction wasn't asked and there is no 87% anywhere under questions of satisfaction.
ppl please educate yourself ... free enterprise system is the only way to make everything cheaper and better .... it has proven time and time again that free markets are better for the over all well being of a nation ...
ppl please educate yourself ... free enterprise system is the only way to make everything cheaper and better .... it has proven time and time again that free markets are better for the over all well being of a nation ...
I think that people live in fantasy land regarding the cost of healthcare. compare the dentist in the 1920's to the dentist today. compare the cost of the string around the door to that of root canal or a pseudo treatment like leeching to that of heart bypass surgery. sometimes the 'discovery' of new techniques and new medicine bring with them.. wait for it.. NEW COSTS! the fact that a third party pays those new costs makes them invaraibly higher because they are paying with other peoples money
Im sorry but YES I WOULD pay out the ass to my insurance company as a group of people, to make sure that we have healthy americans, if they took care of every single one, not just who they want, turning people down for ANY kind of fucking care, is disgusting, doctors/insurers are saying no we wont help you cause we wont make money off of it, go die alone...i pay for my Police, Fireman, Postal Services, Libraries.. etc cause we NEED them, we NEED Doctors, Nurses, and they need us...
K im from canada and our healthcare sucks. If your sick and go to a clinic you have to wait anywhere between 3-8 hours. And on weekends clinics are closed so you have to go to the hospital with even more wait. I had appendicitis and had to wait 12 hours b4 a doctor saw me, in that time my appendix ruptured and caused even more trouble. Canadian taxes are also so high
John You have a A++++++++++A+++++++ Food chain MY FATHER'S food is always fresh and good and the workers there is also A++++++++++A++++++++ I never have a problem and I love to shop a Whole Foods and your prices are also A++++++++++
so long story short, if u get something like cancer and u have no insurance before hand too bad so sad? this is the " best country in the world" that put a man on the moon and leaves no man/marine behind on the battle field but the health system can't help them? wow scary i am from Canada and yes our system does suck at times long wait times but having a very close family member dying and now dead of breast cancer i thank god we didn't live in the USA when she got sick.
I think everyone should have access to health care but it seems ridiculous to change a whole system when the majority have insurance and are happy with their health care, and a small minority don't.
@Animefan300 People that don't have health insurance either can't afford it or it's not available to them. Is it fair to charge a poor person thousands and thousands of dollars for healthcare? WTF sense does that make? Our poor work, to make money for the rich. Doesn't mean they have any less right to live and receive health care as they do. If anything, it should be income based, we need to start taking care of our own and the brothers and sisters around us. We are all in this together.
@hint0122 The difference is that the rich will demand the best because they can afford it, whereas the government will try to keep costs down. Just like cell phones, plasma TVs, etc... what is exclusive to the rich today will be common among the poor in the future as technology advances. That's why America has the most advanced medical technology. Socialised medicine would destroy that.
hmmm, they seem to be leaving out the fact that there are many doctors that purposely mis-diagnose patients for money. Usually from kickbacks or special incentives by the pharmaceutical companies. Can"t tell you how many times working in a hospital environment i saw pharmacy sales reps bringing free food and free shit for staff members. I think part of the problem is that there are many Dr.'s who are doctors for the wrong reasons.
I guess my point is, if your not willing to do the job with little to no pay, Than you are obviously not passionate enough about helping people and doing that job. It seems in America they want the fancy living and Prestige more than they want to do their job. Not all doctors are like this, a lot of those that i worked with in the military were not. Just seems to have been a growing trend. Some of them started out with good intentions i'm sure, but than became corrupted, or burnt out.
ya 2 of my doctors gave me a speech saying i should go to college, and i was there because i was in pain and i couldnt do those type of things, they dont even listen to you when you talk.
look around regulation is everywhere anyway. we dont complain about 99% of it because we are used to it... we want packaged food to be regulated so nutritional value is accurate.. we want regulation of marketed meet so we dont get salmonella... we want society regulated by the removal of criminals... & our streets regulated so we dont have accidents due to others negligent behaviour... society is based on regulation & rules so that we can live in a way that benefits as many people as possible
insurance by definition is a precautionary measure for unplaned problems or events. take car insurance, travel insurance for luggage on planes, house insurance for buglary or flood or fire. its NOT A CREDIT CARD. i agree with the other points he makes coz it does seem like theres a lot of wasted funds.. maybe medical procedures & doctors activities should be regulated by a code to prevent excessivness (of course with allowances for review & amendment so they dont discriminate)
But the way john here describes grocery insurance, it is food stamps. We all pay into food stamps like we do with insurance, only with food stamps, we don't have a choice. Food stamps are payed for by our taxes. Then government doles out that money to people who are on food stamps. Just like insurance some of these people truly do need it and others are just ripping off the system. Though unlike insurance companies the government doesn't investigate.
@Kamidake83 If that were true then we could choose not to pay for them. And if we did pay for them then we would all get food stamps, but we are forced to pay for them whether we want to or not and only the poor receive food stamps. Also food stamps are limited, food insurance (if modeled after health insurance) would be for the individuals need for food, not a formula for each household like food stamps.
@Kamidake83 Sorry, but you cannot get onto it unless you are poor. Also, you have a limited budget on food stamps. But yeah, I know what you mean. I was shocked when my friend on food stamps bought me a steak dinner. I was like..... "i thought you were on food stamps"... apparently it works for buying top of the line steak at 20 bucks a pound when hamburger is only 1.50 a pound.
@bluefootedpig You have a point about $20/lb steak on food stamps, but there is a limit on what you get per month, so if someone spends that much, they don't have money for other groceries, so it all balances out really. It's easy to get upset at someone on food stamps when you see that they buy really expensive steaks, but it's not like they get more than let's say $150 a month (just a figure, as it varies).
@jmelkis True, but imagine that the same person bought bulk goods. The food goes X further. So now instead of spending 150 on WIC, and 200 in cash, you spend maybe 150 on wic, and 50 in cash. Now that is 150 more a month you can save and invest, and get yourself out of the situation. I wouldn't be upset with WIC, if everyone got it. But as only a select few get it, it means we are support those few, and bad choices means they stay on it longer.
@Kamidake83 Well, but Food Stamps has a limit. You can buy almost anything that is food with a few exceptions, but there is a cost limit per month. Plus, people aren't paying for the food stamps they receive. People pay insurance premiums, so they feel entitled to the best health care, regardless of what it might cost the insurance companies. Since people pay premiums, they feel like they are paying for what they receive. That's the difference.
@jmelkis They dont want the best possible health care because they feel entitled to because they payed for it. They want it for two reasons. One because they want to live. Two its because they aren't paying for it directly. The insurance company is covering the cost and is spreading it across everyone who pays a premium. Just like how taxes are used to pay for food stamps!
@Kamidake83 and its a good thing not everyone has a 40,000 dollar job u want to know what my parents make 20,000 dollars between the both of them its for the common good its in the constitution
This episode argues quiet effectively against Stossel's ridiculous argument. 1 of 33 claims are denied? Lots of paperwork? Incentive to deny sick people?
Going to the doctor often and early is one of the reaons people think that women live longer than men. Men don't go to the doctor as early.
@Jimmypop97 The comparison into the medical world would be, I don't want the generic equivalent, I want the brand name pill. And if it was universally covered and single payer, we could do that easily.
@supercrazylegs1 You don't care if your neighbor gets life saving treatment. Are you a Christian? If so, you are a hypocrite. Actually, I would say, you're not really Christian. You're a CINO. Now, go fuck yourself in your individualized world, you fucking retard.
@SirDamienQFox Okay, first of all, I am not a Christian and am not religious in anyway. Why do you assume that there are only two view-points in the world; either believing in an almighty god or believing in an almighty government? And second, government control over any industry ALWAYS makes it worse. You think everyone will die if the government doesn't pay for healthcare? That's like saying that everyone will starve to death if the government didn't control the food industry.
@SirDamienQFox I'm the retard? You really don't know that the US Postal Service is broke? It lost almost 3 billion dollars last year. And you've never heard of UPS or FedEx? If they lost a billion dollars in one year, they would go out of business.
And for god's sake, calling me "retard" doesn't make you sound like the smart one.
@supercrazylegs1 It's subsidized you dumb fuck, it can't be "broke." That's a plus actually, when you use a brain. Doesn't have to worry about bottom lines; provides a good service. Although, you are against that.
You're a retard.
Fedex and UPS don't offer the same services dickface. You scumbag. I caught your strawman lie, you faggot. You can't mail a fucking blank envelop through those companies. Give me one product they sell at less than a dollar? I'm not joking. Give me one. You retard.
@supercrazylegs1 Well, this just goes to show, when someone tells you something you said is wrong and gives reason, you back down and have nothing on your side. You're a weak ignoramus with your head so far up your ass, you thinking it smells almost decent. Fuck you and your ignorant ilk.
@SirDamienQFox Fedex and UPS don't offer the same services? What they both deliver items to different locations. Care to elaborate? You mean USPS instead of UPS?
" Give me one product they sell at less than a dollar? I'm not joking. Give me one." Is this sarcasm? They're literally thousands of items that individually sell for less that a dollar. Again you want to explain what you mean?
And why all the personal attacks of supercrazylegs, can you not remain civil while in a debate?
@supercrazylegs1 nonesense! People are not all born the same, some are born ill or disabled, if you don't look after them when you can you are scam that should have never been born at first place!!
@tinarett No, government is an entity. The problem with people looking at healthcare as a moral obligation that the government has to be involved in is that government involvement makes things worse. The road to hell is paved with good intentions. If the government controlled the healthcare industry, it would be a monopoly, there would be shortages, and the government would not have incentive to improve anything.
@supercrazylegs1 Government is voted in by people. If people wouldn't want this entity they wouldn't have it at first place. Of course there is incentive for government to look after it's people health. If they won't they won't be voted in. I am not against private healthcare but I am also for national healthcare for those that can't afford to go private. You don't have to have monopoly private healthcare can run alongside with national healthcare.
@tinarett No, government programs are monopolies because unlike private businesses, government industries don't have to raise their own money. They just use taxpayer dollars and its impossible to compete with them because they'll never go out of business. And there's no incentive for improvement in government programs because there's no profit incentive like there is in private companies.
@tinarett Where does the Federal Government get the authority to do the types of things liberals speak of? Not in the constitution that is for damn sure. Gov't may be voted in by the people, but gov't does not work for the people. Even when they do, they are inefficient. You and I are not powerful enough to influence politicians. You have more power voting with your dollar than with any political vote in gov't. You have more power over a corporation than you do over the Gov't!
@shadowsfall74 yeah, the whole thing just clearly doesn't work, of course people are going to want the best treatment and check for everything, they would be dumb not to...
so if the healthy insured pay for the sick insured and sometime the uninsured...wouldnt it be easier to implement a national health care system so that everyone pays a reasonable amount... it would eliminate all that useless insurance paperwork shown in the clip at 4:55......
stossil assumes the majority of Americans don't understand, or care to understand, basic economic principles. he may be right, but that's where primary prevention and health education come in. it would be cheaper in the long run. some power needs to be put into the hands of the provider with a gaurantee that if they don't approve a costly procedure or test they deem unnecessry they will be backed by careful investigations.
it really doesn't matter what the ppl want as one of the top contributors to both parties is the drug and insurance industry and as such no universal health care will be inacted in the usa so really the discussion is pointless
I dont think universal healthcare should be implemented. However, if the governement eliminates welfare and replaces it with universal healthcare, then I would be happy with that. The reason? If the governement has welfare and universal healthcare, then stupid people will begin to demand for free college education. Then it will shift to, free oil chages to free gasoline.
I need a college education? I think you need the college education. First, what I am saying is true. You sound like a communications major, since only those morons use the slipery slope for every argument they don't agree with.
Common snesnse, if there is a give away then people will go back for more and continue to get more. Then, once universal healthcare is implemented in this country, then people will want free education. In fact, hillary clinton spoke about free education in her campaign. Once free education is implemented, then people will demand other universal proposals.
sorry for the late post, I was in class. ( really)....you must be an English major with your fantastic grammar but hey thats called an ad hominem and dont want to be guilty of it. In any case there's a simple way to check your common sense...how about you apply your typing skills to a google search and re-read your arguement not that you've had time to cool off.
micheal moore is a fat fuck who is a shame to his country. editing interviews and pasting and slicing footage doesnt make a "dcoumentary", its manipulating facts to make them say what he wants!
I can't believe some of you Americans ridicule a guy who cares. Ask any Canadian and we would never trade our system for the shit you have. 46 million uninsured? That's more than 1.5 Canada's population, I couldn't even dream of that. Expand your horizons and you'll realize that you should in fact question stuff.
just cause i happen to have a different opinion than you doesnt mean I dont "question stuff." I've watched multiple Moore films and have come to this conclusion after watching his crapumentaries
You've completely got it right. If people would do their homework instead of just swallowing Michael Moore's "crock-umentaries" they'd know that his methods are more than questionable and a great deal of the people he has interviewed take issue with how he presents their words. He ambushed Charlton Heston and is known for cutting/pasting/slicing up interviews to spin things in his favor. I used to be one of the folks who believed what he said until I actually looked it up and did my homework!
not only that but STRESS is a very serious problem to your health and worrying about paying for it but thats ok america needs more military they spend money on killing not saving
46 million uninsured, yet the majority of the population has insurance. So, if you take in perspective that more than 80% of the population is insured, then that nust neab that the system is working better than most people think.
Did you just say that seriously? You mean to tell me that 80% being insured means that 46 million is miniscule? That means for every 5 of your friends, one cannot afford to keep themselves healthy. That isn't a problem to you? I understand that probably isn't the case for you since the people who think the system works are of course those who have insurance, but you honestly it sound like that many people isn't a big deal. And Folsumgurl, thats not an opinion you called him a "fat fuck."
No, it isn't a problem to me- it's a problem to them (the ones who aren't insured). I've been without insurance before. And if something happened (which it did)? It was my responsibility to take care of the cost, or suffer without it. That's just reality. The costs of healthcare, especially catastrophic considtions, are too high without insurance, so the truth is, you can't afford NOT to have it.
I do have a friend that is uninsured, but he is not unhealthy. You seem to think that having no insurance means your automatically unhealthy. I have great insurance, but I go to the doctor once or twice a year.
Uhh, the Canadian I spoke with ABHORS the Canadian system, and she is a health care provider so I think she would know what she's talking about. She moved to the US because she knows it's better. The best doctors and facilities, education, research etc in the world are in the US. We pay better. And why shouldn't we pay for what we get? Expand our horizons? Michael Moore cares... about money and food. If he really "cared" maybe he'd donate his huge profits to health care for the uninsured.
Paolung buddy.. you embody the notion of American ignorance. Your friend is a "health care provider." What information does that give? Sure, certain medical professions make a lot more money in the USA, but should uninsured people with disease die because they're not able to contribute to some doctor's pocket? Countries with universal healthcare do just fine in R&D... Sick Kids Hospital in Toronto anyone? Try to give me an opinion when mommy and daddy don't pay your insurance.
Look doggiestyle, mommy and daddy haven't paid my insurance in 20 years so don't act all high and mighty with me.
Who gives a crap what her profession is? If you must know, she's an RN, and she has worked in the business for long enough to know what she's talking about. Should uninsured people with disease die because they're not able to contribute to some doctor's pocket? Absolutely, unless the doctor takes pity on them or someone (i.e. charity) does. You don't OWN anyone else's work!!!
That's the stupidest part of the thing. Health is NOT a product like others. You don't CONSUME it, you try to keep it good. You don't choose to get sick you just DO ! Ask a patient if he goes to see his doctor because it's free, he won't say that : he'll say "I go to see him when I HAVE to". Health is a basic need, like food or sleep. No one should have to make the choice between going bankrupted or being healthy, that's not a NORMAL thing to have to do.
Around here, people go to the emergency room for the most ridiculous things: colds, cuts, scrapes, heart-burn, etc.
Most of the time the doctors give them some Advil and send them home. The still take up time, and cost money all the way around.The also call ambulances for the same things. It will only get worse and more costly when the morons see it ass being "free".
In France people to that too ... but a lot less than in the US because people in France are better informed. That's not about price, that's about information.
And as you should know, in France, healtcare is totally free ... only when you're rich enough to pay insurance premiums. The difference is that in France those premiums are and stay affordable and that if you're not rich enough you pay only a part of it (wich can be important, sometimes it's actually 100%)
@Jimmypop97 Maybe you would look at it that way, most people wouldn't though. And btw, Stossel is extremely biased on this report, it hardly resembles journalistic integrity. So don't let his attitude sway your views.
@Jimmypop97 So, because a few idiots called an ambulance for cuts and scrapes... mom with a heart attack can't call one because she can't pay for it? I hope you realize people will ALWAYS abuse some things. But does that mean we should get rid of them? If some kid gets into an accident riding a bike to school, do we ban bikes for all students? If some kid overdoses on advil, do we ban all underage consumption of drugs? We can't throw away the basket because of a few bad fruits.
@dragonofthedarknight The ambulance comes and treats you regardless of your ability to pay for it if you call 911. Now, regarding your tirade about banning certain things, it is irrelevant. Nowhere do I mention anything about banning anything. I am the last person you will see calling for a ban on anything, or for more government control over anything.
@Jimmypop97 Anyway, I wouldn't want to be in your proximity if I get sick. Yeah the ambulance will take you round the corner to the hospital and then sent you 600 dollar bill. It's obscene to do this to a person in a desperate need!! This just proves how mankind can become indifferent to a living being of their own kind. Perhaps if I was a dog you would at least put me out of misery by killing me eh?
@Jimmypop97 yes the ambulance will come get you whenever you need it, so will helicopters if you need an air lift to the hospital but it does come out in your biil, you still have to pay extra for it.
@Jimmypop97 Then it's poorly managed. Not my fault. Need to fire the manager. That's what you have a receptionist for to advice patients to go get some advil in pharmacy if cold is all they have. Simples!!
you are wrong on that. Health care is a product since you are paying someone to use their knowledge to look at your problems or doing something. It’s the same as paying to get an education. If you want higher taxes, by my guest.
I live in a country where government took care of health care. Bilions are wasted thanks to that. And People DO go to doctor when they're for example bored at home.
healthcare is another business just like any other business, why do people think its any different.
Govt is the last thing you want to control healthcare. Govt runs almost everything into the ground the last thing you want is the govt telling you what kind of treatment you can and cant receive. They are literally controlling your wellbeing because they control the bills and money
The grocery insurance argument is completely false. For one, the doctor does your shopping for you just as your auto repairer does. Secondly health care has what economists call "negative utility of consumption" a person who spends 0.5 percent of their life needing healthcare is not ten time worse off than someone spending 5 per cent of their lofe needing healthcare. Stossel, you should be ashamed of yourself.
What a ridiculous argument by this idiot (the tv show host/anchor). First of all, people pay for their insurance monthly for most of their life (think- taxes) and how often do they actually get to use it compared to how much and for how long they are paying for it. Secondly, WHO LIKES GOING TO THE DOCTOR'S?! Who likes being sick!?
The law states that hospital emergency rooms MUST keep you from dying, and that's a long way from curing you. They MUST stablize your condition; beyond THAT, it's open-ended. This issue requires one to actually think about aspects of it, not just defend the status quo/traditional way of adminstering health care in America simply because that's the way its always done.
Government cannot solve every problem, but neither can the free market. Universal health care is no more "Socialism" than the idea of free public (and compulsory) education that we have now.
3% denial rate is wayyy too high in my opinion! I am not for socialized medicine. If you research Canada's socialized medicine, you'll see that they have a looooong waiting list just for specialized tests for long-term illnesses, AND, they can't afford their maintanence medications for illnesses like high blood pressure, etc.
It's funny. I always hear about people pointing out the problems with the Canadian and other "Socialist" countries approach to dealing with universal health care. But I have yet to hear anyone from these other countries willing to trade what THEY have for the American way of doing things--risking bankruptcy due to the inability to pay for the highest medical costs in the world (the biggest reason for bankruptcy in America).
Believe it or not, I have personal friends in Canada who have said all my life that they'd take the current healthcare system over theirs any day. One of my closest friends died from cancer because she was forced to wait three years for an operation. Tell me that you'd like that here in the US! Because that's what the Socialist Healthcare system is all about. Waiting periods, and long ones, no matter what the problem is. Canadians who have pets can get better veterinarian care for pets.
What's the difference? In America, if you have no health insurance and you have a diagnosis of a catastrophic illness like cancer, chances are, you're not going to even be seen (why do you think 7-11's always have penny jars on their counters asking patrons to donate to little Sally who needs a bone marrow transplant?). And have you been to an inner-city hospital? Trust me, you wait anyway. Any solution is going to cost money under a capitalist system, so we may as well bit the bullet.
I like this debate. I apologize if my last reply seemed a little rude. That wasn't my intention. Yes, I've been to an innercity hospital (usually county hospitals take indigent patients)because I have been without insurance. I don't like it anymore than anyone else. But, at the same time, in many states there are laws place that say that no state or county hospital shall deny a patient health care based on their inability to pay.
They don't want to change it for the American system. The governments would lose millions. Mexico is the perfect example and I am from Mexico...so I know.
(continued): If a visit to the doctor only cost $20, and surgery ran for $200, as opposed to $20,000, then there would be no need for health insurance, we could pay for it out of pocket. The same goes for (legal) drugs, cancer medications don't cost $2 a pill, they cost hundreds of dollars. Until someone figures out a way to bring down the prices to where a normal person can afford a trip to the doctor and any related drugs/surgeries, we'll never be able to live without insurance.
You do realize that surgeons usually have 12+ years as well as hundreds of thousands of dollars invested in their educations, right? Why go through all that trouble to work for spend hours preforming a surgery, all while assuming massive liability, to make a couple hundred bucks. You can get a job as a mechanic with no education and make that much...
Cost is driven up by cost of research, cost of doctors liability insurance due to frivolous lawsuits, and many other factors. If a company spend 10 years researching and creating a drug, and have hundreds of millions invested in the pill, they do have to make their money back from it. They can't just afford to spend so much and sell the pills for the 20 cents apiece it costs to make them on the production line.
Here's my take on the groceries vs healthcare debate: can't compare the two because food is much cheaper than healthcare; you don't spend thousands of dollars on one trip to the grocery store. A doctor's visit, however, can cost that much. A visit to the dentist for a routine cleaning can cost $200 to $300, can't ever remember a bag of groceries going for that much...that's why expensive things (health care, cars) are insured as opposed to cheap things (groceries).
Thhis video was rediculous, I mean, no American can convince me that he has better health insurance than us in Europe. We pay higher taxes, but NEVER EVEN THINK that the government would REFUSE our treatment, like the stupid insurance companies do in the US. The US is a gr8 country, but the health care is shit there, and yes, universal health care does show that its better, after all, we European live much longer then u Americans.
Also, Michael Moore is one of the UGLIEST motherfuckers on the planet.
Just saying.
Spjungen 1 week ago
wait so you're supposed to get insurance in case/before you get sick, but it's "not okay" if you're already sick and expecting insurance to take care of you when you're applying? What a weird system lol.
kmelfina 1 week ago in playlist More videos from Jimmypop97
@kmelfina Because the idea of insurance is not to take care of a problem you already have, but take care of a problem you MIGHT have. Do you think car insurance companies should cover you if you go to them AFTER you get in a wreck? It's really common sense. Unfortunately, the health care system has been viewed as working outside of market principles, which is not true, and that's why it's fucked the way it is now.
kommisar 1 week ago
@kommisar Thanks. I'm still learning about how these social programs work. Now these same people who "lost" everything expect the government to take care of 'em regardless of their decisions >_<;
kmelfina 1 week ago
@kmelfina I believe underneath it all is a deliberate, covert agenda to control people by making them dependent on government. Many of these health care lobbyists benefit from all these regulations. There's definitely a string puller. The point is though, all these problems weren't around before the government got involved in the health care system.
kommisar 1 week ago
@kommisar PRECISELY
That is EXACTLY the point here, that government IS the problem, and that people need to realize that before drawing the wrong conclusions and thinking they need government; beureaucrats can't save people.
Doctors, working hard in competition against each other and communicating with their patients to try to give them the better service, do.
For the occasional emergency patient who can't pay, there's always charity.
Or he could pay off the procedure over time.
Spjungen 1 week ago
I wonder why John Stossel, the pro-business guy, wasn't stopped.
darkhawk123 2 months ago
this whole grocery comparison is straight up fucking stupid.
decadumb 2 months ago
@decadumb no it's not. If you are spending other people's money you rarely ever care about cost. That's true for ANY situation. I work in a high school cafeteria and if someone is broke and a friend offers to pay for it they almost always get more than they would have if THEY were paying. It's a perfectly valid comparison.
gamingeagle19 1 month ago
@decadumb why, because it is exactly right? LOLOL, silly liberal.
svvmichael1 1 week ago
"They'd buy a lot more... because they're spending somebody elses money now." The man must be psychic: he just described about half of the food stamp recipients around here.
Davito2000 3 months ago
@Davito2000 and they are spending a lot of our money
littleolge 2 months ago in playlist John Stossel 20/20
Every single person in America should read "100 Years of US Medical Fascism" by Mises . org to know why their healthcare costs so much.
Prinnycakes 3 months ago
This is Bull because the patients are not the ones that go to doctors and tell them to do this or do that. Doctors are always the ones who tell the patient that have to have all these treatments like random x rays just so they can pump the bill up as much as they can to get the most out of the insurance company as they can.
Shnimberz 3 months ago
@Shnimberz Actually, they do that to avoid malpractice lawsuits.
kommisar 2 weeks ago
@kommisar The point I'm trying to get across is what do we do about the sick people who cannot afford treatment to their illness? Do we just let them die? It's like holding out a warm bottle of milk in front of a baby and telling him they can't have it because they can't afford it. At least with healthcare people are able to get treatment. Stossel says he wishes less people would have health care because it raises the price but offers no solution.
Shnimberz 1 week ago
@Shnimberz There's always a solution. There are charities, hospitals won't deny people, socialized healthcare or no socialized healthcare; they're humans too believe it or not. If they work in a hospital they probably want to help people AT LEAST A LITTLE. A hospital could take on the cost itself. Or the patient could pay off the procedure over time. In any case, liberalizing healthcare would make it AFFORDABLE; that's the key here.
Spjungen 1 week ago
@Spjungen Why, for instance, are computers, iphones and most technology not a problem these days? Or cars...most people can buy a car, because thankfully the government still hasn't quite reached its hand into that sector. In the same way, most people would be able to afford health care if it wasn't so artificially propped up. Also he doesn't say he wishes less people would have it, he says he wishes it would be more AFFORDABLE, SO THAT more people CAN have it. Listen first.
Spjungen 1 week ago
@Shnimberz That's why I was wondering what happened to the rest of the piece. Part 6 ends rather abruptly, and appears to offer no closure for a news piece. However, I think the best solution would involve a gradual scaling back up government involvement in the health care system. People are dependent on welfare health care unfortunately, so it couldn't be done overnight. However, this mess is mostly to be blamed on the government, not insurance companies or doctors.
kommisar 1 week ago
Even if there were a grocery insurance, that is not what I imagine it would be. Insurance is to protect you if something goes wrong, not to pay for everyday necessities. You need a lot of water to be healthy, yet health insurance companies don't pay for that now do they?
travmanbw43 5 months ago
Lol, this Stossel is an arse-hole. When he gets cancer and his insurance company shits on him he will see. There are people who lie to the companies but not all.
WasGibtsLeute 5 months ago
@WasGibtsLeute Moron. You really are a true follower of Moore. You listen blindly to what that tub of lard has to say and denounce everyone else.
DrStrangebomb1993 4 months ago
@DrStrangebomb1993
I do not follow anybody. Not even God. lol.
Maybe you are the one who follows Stossl or others blindly. Who knows, but actually I don't care about you. So stop spamming plz!
WasGibtsLeute 4 months ago
I do not understand because I thought that Stossl wanted to prove that Moore is wrong. The fist two parts seem to back him up.
WasGibtsLeute 5 months ago
It's funny how liberals can brainwash sheepish people into doing what's moral or "right". Fuck them and their bullshit. Give me liberty or give me death.
Cinnamonbuns13 6 months ago
This guy is an idiot. Please, someone shoot him. He misses the point entirely and spews out bullcrap.
joelandmore 6 months ago
actually, the more people a company has, the cheaper it gets. johns wrong here
guineapiggyman 8 months ago
@guineapiggyman you are distorting what was said. the more SICK people a company has the more expensive it gets.
187Unseen 7 months ago
I love Stossel. :D
MrUnicorn1995 10 months ago
So is it being suggested that ppl have surgery for fun?
Andybaby 10 months ago
@Andybaby yep. alot of people do it
guineapiggyman 8 months ago
One counter argument to the "why not buy steak instead of hamburger if you had insurance". Well, what if you wanted to make some Hamburger Helper? Think about it.
MrGrevy 10 months ago
3 houses?? Huh? Sounds like he was doing pretty well. Should everything be free?
MrGrevy 10 months ago
In America they value money above human life. So it seems!
tinarett 11 months ago
so how is it that insurance companies makes sooo much money? (4;20) considering how much they are making there shouldn't be a problem helping people with preexisting conditions. Its bogus cop out to say that the cost goes up for others that pay into the insurance companies when you pay out multi-million dollar bonuses to execs etc...
sirbongalong 11 months ago
Stossel's is a Libertarian he does not think the Government should regulate the free market. He thinks the FM will take care of itself by all of us deciding if we want to participate. The problem is Medical insurance company's are not subject to the Anti-trust laws the same way other company's are. This creates a huge problem for all of us. He thinks if we paid for doctor visits out of our pocket the price will go down to where we all could afford doctor office. Insurance pays for catastrophic
jrwilson98 11 months ago
You didn't give me a reason for why you were right. You just called me names and thought you won the argument because of it. If you want to have a real discussion about this, then I'll debate you on it. Otherwise, I won't waste my time arguing with someone who sounds like they belong in middle school.
supercrazylegs1 1 year ago
I'm from the UK. I seriously can't understand how you Americans put up with this shit. Healthcare is such a headache for you heh
dpayO2 1 year ago
insurance should only cover huge but rare unexpected expenses, like having your car crushed by a bulldozer of having need for a liver transplant operation.
coturnix19 1 year ago
You're right john stossel is biased he works for ABC which has never questioned universal healthcare before or after him. Government regulation would cause the health industry to go Bankrupt if they couldnt put a price $ on an individual. This is not an opinion but a fact. Both medicaid and Medicare are both bankrupt because they did the same thing.
eathis12 1 year ago
I personally think that healthcare insurance either shouldn't be private, or it should be private but be regulated like there's no tomorrow. They put a dollar value on every person they insure, and decide whether it's worth to insure them or not. They decide whether you should be getting treatment or not. With a gov't run one or a regulated one, that wouldn't happen, because they wouldn't be able to cancel your insurance. Least, that's what I've learned so far.
dragonofthedarknight 1 year ago
@dragonofthedarknight The already overly-regulated medical industry is the reason why health care is so expensive. The answer isn't more regulation.
supercrazylegs1 1 year ago
HAHAHA Moore the Controlled Opposition 20min standing Ovations rofl^^
Ur new System is better now? ^^
autdelux 1 year ago
Stossel is lying about the NY Times poll. The question about satisfaction of insurance coverage was never asked. It asked if you were satisfied with health care and also insurance costs. Health care (not insurance coverage) was 77% very or somewhat satisfied; Insurance costs satisfaction dropped to 50%. I don't know where Stossel got the 87% since this question of coverage satisfaction wasn't asked and there is no 87% anywhere under questions of satisfaction.
indoctus41 1 year ago
This has been flagged as spam show
ppl please educate yourself ... free enterprise system is the only way to make everything cheaper and better .... it has proven time and time again that free markets are better for the over all well being of a nation ...
holmes328 1 year ago
ppl please educate yourself ... free enterprise system is the only way to make everything cheaper and better .... it has proven time and time again that free markets are better for the over all well being of a nation ...
holmes328 1 year ago
That cracks me up that Micheal Moore professes to know health care.
He has at most 5 years left due to obeseity.
When I first saw the "Sicko" movie poster I thought it was an autobiography.
charlesvan13 1 year ago 3
@charlesvan13 Grow the fuck up. Learn to criticize someone for their views and arguments, not a disease or medical condition.
You sound like a 6 year old.
LaughingMage 1 year ago
Everyone should be able to receive health care.
1newg 1 year ago
I think that people live in fantasy land regarding the cost of healthcare. compare the dentist in the 1920's to the dentist today. compare the cost of the string around the door to that of root canal or a pseudo treatment like leeching to that of heart bypass surgery. sometimes the 'discovery' of new techniques and new medicine bring with them.. wait for it.. NEW COSTS! the fact that a third party pays those new costs makes them invaraibly higher because they are paying with other peoples money
aussieconservative 1 year ago
Im sorry but YES I WOULD pay out the ass to my insurance company as a group of people, to make sure that we have healthy americans, if they took care of every single one, not just who they want, turning people down for ANY kind of fucking care, is disgusting, doctors/insurers are saying no we wont help you cause we wont make money off of it, go die alone...i pay for my Police, Fireman, Postal Services, Libraries.. etc cause we NEED them, we NEED Doctors, Nurses, and they need us...
KidPunkStar101 1 year ago
K im from canada and our healthcare sucks. If your sick and go to a clinic you have to wait anywhere between 3-8 hours. And on weekends clinics are closed so you have to go to the hospital with even more wait. I had appendicitis and had to wait 12 hours b4 a doctor saw me, in that time my appendix ruptured and caused even more trouble. Canadian taxes are also so high
rootbeer9000 1 year ago
John You have a A++++++++++A+++++++ Food chain MY FATHER'S food is always fresh and good and the workers there is also A++++++++++A++++++++ I never have a problem and I love to shop a Whole Foods and your prices are also A++++++++++
iamisrael777 2 years ago
so long story short, if u get something like cancer and u have no insurance before hand too bad so sad? this is the " best country in the world" that put a man on the moon and leaves no man/marine behind on the battle field but the health system can't help them? wow scary i am from Canada and yes our system does suck at times long wait times but having a very close family member dying and now dead of breast cancer i thank god we didn't live in the USA when she got sick.
rage9424 2 years ago 2
unlike your country, we are not socialists.
hint0122 1 year ago
I think everyone should have access to health care but it seems ridiculous to change a whole system when the majority have insurance and are happy with their health care, and a small minority don't.
Animefan300 2 years ago
@Animefan300 People that don't have health insurance either can't afford it or it's not available to them. Is it fair to charge a poor person thousands and thousands of dollars for healthcare? WTF sense does that make? Our poor work, to make money for the rich. Doesn't mean they have any less right to live and receive health care as they do. If anything, it should be income based, we need to start taking care of our own and the brothers and sisters around us. We are all in this together.
CluppHead 2 years ago
so what would be the difference between working for the rich, or working to give it to the government sop they can give it away?
hint0122 1 year ago
@hint0122 The difference is that the rich will demand the best because they can afford it, whereas the government will try to keep costs down. Just like cell phones, plasma TVs, etc... what is exclusive to the rich today will be common among the poor in the future as technology advances. That's why America has the most advanced medical technology. Socialised medicine would destroy that.
BelieversinThings 1 year ago
@Animefan300 ummmmm......... a majority of people do hate their hmo's........... idiot
jivetime2 1 year ago 2
hmmm, they seem to be leaving out the fact that there are many doctors that purposely mis-diagnose patients for money. Usually from kickbacks or special incentives by the pharmaceutical companies. Can"t tell you how many times working in a hospital environment i saw pharmacy sales reps bringing free food and free shit for staff members. I think part of the problem is that there are many Dr.'s who are doctors for the wrong reasons.
CluppHead 2 years ago
I guess my point is, if your not willing to do the job with little to no pay, Than you are obviously not passionate enough about helping people and doing that job. It seems in America they want the fancy living and Prestige more than they want to do their job. Not all doctors are like this, a lot of those that i worked with in the military were not. Just seems to have been a growing trend. Some of them started out with good intentions i'm sure, but than became corrupted, or burnt out.
CluppHead 2 years ago
you can be passionate, but you need to be able to live.
hint0122 2 years ago
ya 2 of my doctors gave me a speech saying i should go to college, and i was there because i was in pain and i couldnt do those type of things, they dont even listen to you when you talk.
420chronmasta 2 years ago
look around regulation is everywhere anyway. we dont complain about 99% of it because we are used to it... we want packaged food to be regulated so nutritional value is accurate.. we want regulation of marketed meet so we dont get salmonella... we want society regulated by the removal of criminals... & our streets regulated so we dont have accidents due to others negligent behaviour... society is based on regulation & rules so that we can live in a way that benefits as many people as possible
juliefodor 2 years ago
insurance by definition is a precautionary measure for unplaned problems or events. take car insurance, travel insurance for luggage on planes, house insurance for buglary or flood or fire. its NOT A CREDIT CARD. i agree with the other points he makes coz it does seem like theres a lot of wasted funds.. maybe medical procedures & doctors activities should be regulated by a code to prevent excessivness (of course with allowances for review & amendment so they dont discriminate)
juliefodor 2 years ago
good argument
zpseab 2 years ago 2
Grocery Insurance? Yeah we have that already, its called Food Stamps.
Kamidake83 2 years ago 43
@Kamidake83 Food stamps is not grocery insurance not by a long shot.
mikeyboy236 11 months ago
@mikeyboy236
But the way john here describes grocery insurance, it is food stamps. We all pay into food stamps like we do with insurance, only with food stamps, we don't have a choice. Food stamps are payed for by our taxes. Then government doles out that money to people who are on food stamps. Just like insurance some of these people truly do need it and others are just ripping off the system. Though unlike insurance companies the government doesn't investigate.
Kamidake83 11 months ago
@Kamidake83 If that were true then we could choose not to pay for them. And if we did pay for them then we would all get food stamps, but we are forced to pay for them whether we want to or not and only the poor receive food stamps. Also food stamps are limited, food insurance (if modeled after health insurance) would be for the individuals need for food, not a formula for each household like food stamps.
It's similar, but not the same.
mikeyboy236 11 months ago
@Kamidake83 Sorry, but you cannot get onto it unless you are poor. Also, you have a limited budget on food stamps. But yeah, I know what you mean. I was shocked when my friend on food stamps bought me a steak dinner. I was like..... "i thought you were on food stamps"... apparently it works for buying top of the line steak at 20 bucks a pound when hamburger is only 1.50 a pound.
bluefootedpig 11 months ago
@bluefootedpig Or a hundred dollars worth of Whoopers Malted Chocolate balls.
Kamidake83 10 months ago
@bluefootedpig You have a point about $20/lb steak on food stamps, but there is a limit on what you get per month, so if someone spends that much, they don't have money for other groceries, so it all balances out really. It's easy to get upset at someone on food stamps when you see that they buy really expensive steaks, but it's not like they get more than let's say $150 a month (just a figure, as it varies).
jmelkis 8 months ago
@jmelkis True, but imagine that the same person bought bulk goods. The food goes X further. So now instead of spending 150 on WIC, and 200 in cash, you spend maybe 150 on wic, and 50 in cash. Now that is 150 more a month you can save and invest, and get yourself out of the situation. I wouldn't be upset with WIC, if everyone got it. But as only a select few get it, it means we are support those few, and bad choices means they stay on it longer.
bluefootedpig 8 months ago
@Kamidake83 You mean like they used in world war 2?
theshadowbehindme 10 months ago
@Kamidake83 Well, but Food Stamps has a limit. You can buy almost anything that is food with a few exceptions, but there is a cost limit per month. Plus, people aren't paying for the food stamps they receive. People pay insurance premiums, so they feel entitled to the best health care, regardless of what it might cost the insurance companies. Since people pay premiums, they feel like they are paying for what they receive. That's the difference.
jmelkis 8 months ago
@jmelkis They dont want the best possible health care because they feel entitled to because they payed for it. They want it for two reasons. One because they want to live. Two its because they aren't paying for it directly. The insurance company is covering the cost and is spreading it across everyone who pays a premium. Just like how taxes are used to pay for food stamps!
Kamidake83 8 months ago
@Kamidake83 not the same
guineapiggyman 8 months ago
@Kamidake83 that makes me wonder, can someone on foodstamps buy expensive excessive shit? and if thats a yes then that is fucked up
audiofunkdialect 7 months ago
@audiofunkdialect That depends, do you consider 100$ worth of whoopers to be excessive?
Kamidake83 7 months ago 2
@Kamidake83 Goddamn right.In one of the fattest and most prosperous countries in the world too.
Christian121y 6 months ago
@Kamidake83 and its a good thing not everyone has a 40,000 dollar job u want to know what my parents make 20,000 dollars between the both of them its for the common good its in the constitution
chicanokid101 5 months ago
Wow the more i see this, the more i think the reporter is bias.
boguslife 2 years ago
No wonder Moore never graduated from college. He's so full of shit.
travitheMuffinMan 2 years ago 3
This has been flagged as spam show
Sometimes one must go overboard to make a point. Facts are facts and if you want to see them then check out my channel.
jeangrey65 2 years ago
This episode argues quiet effectively against Stossel's ridiculous argument. 1 of 33 claims are denied? Lots of paperwork? Incentive to deny sick people?
Going to the doctor often and early is one of the reaons people think that women live longer than men. Men don't go to the doctor as early.
funkor 2 years ago
god bless all these poor people
curvaciousMammi 2 years ago
This comment has received too many negative votes show
In Stossel's world then we should take the shittiest of treatments because someone else is paying for it.
shadowsfall74 2 years ago
I am all but unemployeed, so I must demand that I eat at the Texas Roadhouse on YOUR dime 7 nights a week.
Jimmypop97 2 years ago 21
@Jimmypop97 The comparison into the medical world would be, I don't want the generic equivalent, I want the brand name pill. And if it was universally covered and single payer, we could do that easily.
SirDamienQFox 1 year ago
@SirDamienQFox If you want the brand name pill, then buy the brand name pill with your own money.
supercrazylegs1 1 year ago
@supercrazylegs1 Fuck you, you hypocritical moron. Are you a Christian or completely cynical?
SirDamienQFox 1 year ago
@SirDamienQFox How am I being hypocritical? People should be responsible for their own healthcare, not the government.
supercrazylegs1 1 year ago
@supercrazylegs1 You don't care if your neighbor gets life saving treatment. Are you a Christian? If so, you are a hypocrite. Actually, I would say, you're not really Christian. You're a CINO. Now, go fuck yourself in your individualized world, you fucking retard.
SirDamienQFox 1 year ago
@SirDamienQFox Okay, first of all, I am not a Christian and am not religious in anyway. Why do you assume that there are only two view-points in the world; either believing in an almighty god or believing in an almighty government? And second, government control over any industry ALWAYS makes it worse. You think everyone will die if the government doesn't pay for healthcare? That's like saying that everyone will starve to death if the government didn't control the food industry.
supercrazylegs1 1 year ago
@supercrazylegs1 You're putting way too much thought into your posts.
"Why do you assume that there are only two view-points in the world; either believing in an almighty god or believing in an almighty government?"
I don't, retard; you just assumed I did.
"And second, government control over any industry ALWAYS makes it worse."
You're a retard. Try to find a private company that does mail like the federal government does, oh wait, there isn't a company even trying to.
You're a retard.
SirDamienQFox 1 year ago
@SirDamienQFox I'm the retard? You really don't know that the US Postal Service is broke? It lost almost 3 billion dollars last year. And you've never heard of UPS or FedEx? If they lost a billion dollars in one year, they would go out of business.
And for god's sake, calling me "retard" doesn't make you sound like the smart one.
supercrazylegs1 1 year ago
@supercrazylegs1 It's subsidized you dumb fuck, it can't be "broke." That's a plus actually, when you use a brain. Doesn't have to worry about bottom lines; provides a good service. Although, you are against that.
You're a retard.
Fedex and UPS don't offer the same services dickface. You scumbag. I caught your strawman lie, you faggot. You can't mail a fucking blank envelop through those companies. Give me one product they sell at less than a dollar? I'm not joking. Give me one. You retard.
SirDamienQFox 1 year ago
@SirDamienQFox Jesus, you're hopeless.
supercrazylegs1 1 year ago
@supercrazylegs1 Well, this just goes to show, when someone tells you something you said is wrong and gives reason, you back down and have nothing on your side. You're a weak ignoramus with your head so far up your ass, you thinking it smells almost decent. Fuck you and your ignorant ilk.
SirDamienQFox 1 year ago
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@SirDamienQFox Fedex and UPS don't offer the same services? What they both deliver items to different locations. Care to elaborate? You mean USPS instead of UPS?
" Give me one product they sell at less than a dollar? I'm not joking. Give me one." Is this sarcasm? They're literally thousands of items that individually sell for less that a dollar. Again you want to explain what you mean?
And why all the personal attacks of supercrazylegs, can you not remain civil while in a debate?
mikeyboy236 11 months ago
@supercrazylegs1 nonesense! People are not all born the same, some are born ill or disabled, if you don't look after them when you can you are scam that should have never been born at first place!!
tinarett 11 months ago
@tinarett People should be compassionate. Government should not.
supercrazylegs1 11 months ago
@supercrazylegs1 Government is people and vice versa.
tinarett 11 months ago
@tinarett No, government is an entity. The problem with people looking at healthcare as a moral obligation that the government has to be involved in is that government involvement makes things worse. The road to hell is paved with good intentions. If the government controlled the healthcare industry, it would be a monopoly, there would be shortages, and the government would not have incentive to improve anything.
supercrazylegs1 11 months ago
@supercrazylegs1 Government is voted in by people. If people wouldn't want this entity they wouldn't have it at first place. Of course there is incentive for government to look after it's people health. If they won't they won't be voted in. I am not against private healthcare but I am also for national healthcare for those that can't afford to go private. You don't have to have monopoly private healthcare can run alongside with national healthcare.
tinarett 11 months ago
@tinarett No, government programs are monopolies because unlike private businesses, government industries don't have to raise their own money. They just use taxpayer dollars and its impossible to compete with them because they'll never go out of business. And there's no incentive for improvement in government programs because there's no profit incentive like there is in private companies.
supercrazylegs1 10 months ago
@tinarett Where does the Federal Government get the authority to do the types of things liberals speak of? Not in the constitution that is for damn sure. Gov't may be voted in by the people, but gov't does not work for the people. Even when they do, they are inefficient. You and I are not powerful enough to influence politicians. You have more power voting with your dollar than with any political vote in gov't. You have more power over a corporation than you do over the Gov't!
AroundSun 10 months ago
if I am paying for someone else,I should dicate what they get.
hint0122 1 year ago
@shadowsfall74 yeah, the whole thing just clearly doesn't work, of course people are going to want the best treatment and check for everything, they would be dumb not to...
audiofunkdialect 7 months ago
so if the healthy insured pay for the sick insured and sometime the uninsured...wouldnt it be easier to implement a national health care system so that everyone pays a reasonable amount... it would eliminate all that useless insurance paperwork shown in the clip at 4:55......
huhnball 2 years ago
stossil assumes the majority of Americans don't understand, or care to understand, basic economic principles. he may be right, but that's where primary prevention and health education come in. it would be cheaper in the long run. some power needs to be put into the hands of the provider with a gaurantee that if they don't approve a costly procedure or test they deem unnecessry they will be backed by careful investigations.
monkeeboots2000 2 years ago
butt people aren't cars you fucking moron -_-'
nickisschoot 2 years ago
it really doesn't matter what the ppl want as one of the top contributors to both parties is the drug and insurance industry and as such no universal health care will be inacted in the usa so really the discussion is pointless
bam6956 2 years ago
I dont think universal healthcare should be implemented. However, if the governement eliminates welfare and replaces it with universal healthcare, then I would be happy with that. The reason? If the governement has welfare and universal healthcare, then stupid people will begin to demand for free college education. Then it will shift to, free oil chages to free gasoline.
hooliganism49 2 years ago
You need the college education if your going toapply that slippery slope...
hans1989fernandez 2 years ago
I need a college education? I think you need the college education. First, what I am saying is true. You sound like a communications major, since only those morons use the slipery slope for every argument they don't agree with.
hooliganism49 2 years ago
Common snesnse, if there is a give away then people will go back for more and continue to get more. Then, once universal healthcare is implemented in this country, then people will want free education. In fact, hillary clinton spoke about free education in her campaign. Once free education is implemented, then people will demand other universal proposals.
hooliganism49 2 years ago
And whats wrong in that, oh sorry i forgot youre dept to china and other countries
KleopatraLtd 2 years ago
sorry for the late post, I was in class. ( really)....you must be an English major with your fantastic grammar but hey thats called an ad hominem and dont want to be guilty of it. In any case there's a simple way to check your common sense...how about you apply your typing skills to a google search and re-read your arguement not that you've had time to cool off.
hans1989fernandez 2 years ago
micheal moore is a fat fuck who is a shame to his country. editing interviews and pasting and slicing footage doesnt make a "dcoumentary", its manipulating facts to make them say what he wants!
folsomgurl87 2 years ago
I can't believe some of you Americans ridicule a guy who cares. Ask any Canadian and we would never trade our system for the shit you have. 46 million uninsured? That's more than 1.5 Canada's population, I couldn't even dream of that. Expand your horizons and you'll realize that you should in fact question stuff.
doggietown 2 years ago
just cause i happen to have a different opinion than you doesnt mean I dont "question stuff." I've watched multiple Moore films and have come to this conclusion after watching his crapumentaries
folsomgurl87 2 years ago
You've completely got it right. If people would do their homework instead of just swallowing Michael Moore's "crock-umentaries" they'd know that his methods are more than questionable and a great deal of the people he has interviewed take issue with how he presents their words. He ambushed Charlton Heston and is known for cutting/pasting/slicing up interviews to spin things in his favor. I used to be one of the folks who believed what he said until I actually looked it up and did my homework!
paolung 2 years ago 4
not only that but STRESS is a very serious problem to your health and worrying about paying for it but thats ok america needs more military they spend money on killing not saving
bam6956 2 years ago
46 million uninsured, yet the majority of the population has insurance. So, if you take in perspective that more than 80% of the population is insured, then that nust neab that the system is working better than most people think.
hooliganism49 2 years ago
Did you just say that seriously? You mean to tell me that 80% being insured means that 46 million is miniscule? That means for every 5 of your friends, one cannot afford to keep themselves healthy. That isn't a problem to you? I understand that probably isn't the case for you since the people who think the system works are of course those who have insurance, but you honestly it sound like that many people isn't a big deal. And Folsumgurl, thats not an opinion you called him a "fat fuck."
doggietown 2 years ago
No, it isn't a problem to me- it's a problem to them (the ones who aren't insured). I've been without insurance before. And if something happened (which it did)? It was my responsibility to take care of the cost, or suffer without it. That's just reality. The costs of healthcare, especially catastrophic considtions, are too high without insurance, so the truth is, you can't afford NOT to have it.
paolung 2 years ago
I do have a friend that is uninsured, but he is not unhealthy. You seem to think that having no insurance means your automatically unhealthy. I have great insurance, but I go to the doctor once or twice a year.
hooliganism49 2 years ago
Uhh, the Canadian I spoke with ABHORS the Canadian system, and she is a health care provider so I think she would know what she's talking about. She moved to the US because she knows it's better. The best doctors and facilities, education, research etc in the world are in the US. We pay better. And why shouldn't we pay for what we get? Expand our horizons? Michael Moore cares... about money and food. If he really "cared" maybe he'd donate his huge profits to health care for the uninsured.
paolung 2 years ago 2
Paolung buddy.. you embody the notion of American ignorance. Your friend is a "health care provider." What information does that give? Sure, certain medical professions make a lot more money in the USA, but should uninsured people with disease die because they're not able to contribute to some doctor's pocket? Countries with universal healthcare do just fine in R&D... Sick Kids Hospital in Toronto anyone? Try to give me an opinion when mommy and daddy don't pay your insurance.
doggietown 2 years ago
out of curisoity, do you know the number of how many people really die from not having insurance in USA?
mttmtmtm 2 years ago
Nope do you?
doggietown 2 years ago
Look doggiestyle, mommy and daddy haven't paid my insurance in 20 years so don't act all high and mighty with me.
Who gives a crap what her profession is? If you must know, she's an RN, and she has worked in the business for long enough to know what she's talking about. Should uninsured people with disease die because they're not able to contribute to some doctor's pocket? Absolutely, unless the doctor takes pity on them or someone (i.e. charity) does. You don't OWN anyone else's work!!!
paolung 2 years ago
Your so-called "American ignorance" is also known as taking responsibility for yourself and not expecting handouts from others if things go wrong.
paolung 2 years ago 10
Somehow I think this jerk has never been seriously ill or had to actually have his insurance cover something significant.
avilameon 2 years ago
That's the stupidest part of the thing. Health is NOT a product like others. You don't CONSUME it, you try to keep it good. You don't choose to get sick you just DO ! Ask a patient if he goes to see his doctor because it's free, he won't say that : he'll say "I go to see him when I HAVE to". Health is a basic need, like food or sleep. No one should have to make the choice between going bankrupted or being healthy, that's not a NORMAL thing to have to do.
redguard12 2 years ago
Around here, people go to the emergency room for the most ridiculous things: colds, cuts, scrapes, heart-burn, etc.
Most of the time the doctors give them some Advil and send them home. The still take up time, and cost money all the way around.The also call ambulances for the same things. It will only get worse and more costly when the morons see it ass being "free".
Jimmypop97 2 years ago 11
In France people to that too ... but a lot less than in the US because people in France are better informed. That's not about price, that's about information.
And as you should know, in France, healtcare is totally free ... only when you're rich enough to pay insurance premiums. The difference is that in France those premiums are and stay affordable and that if you're not rich enough you pay only a part of it (wich can be important, sometimes it's actually 100%)
redguard12 2 years ago
@Jimmypop97 Maybe you would look at it that way, most people wouldn't though. And btw, Stossel is extremely biased on this report, it hardly resembles journalistic integrity. So don't let his attitude sway your views.
SirDamienQFox 1 year ago
@Jimmypop97 So, because a few idiots called an ambulance for cuts and scrapes... mom with a heart attack can't call one because she can't pay for it? I hope you realize people will ALWAYS abuse some things. But does that mean we should get rid of them? If some kid gets into an accident riding a bike to school, do we ban bikes for all students? If some kid overdoses on advil, do we ban all underage consumption of drugs? We can't throw away the basket because of a few bad fruits.
dragonofthedarknight 1 year ago
@dragonofthedarknight The ambulance comes and treats you regardless of your ability to pay for it if you call 911. Now, regarding your tirade about banning certain things, it is irrelevant. Nowhere do I mention anything about banning anything. I am the last person you will see calling for a ban on anything, or for more government control over anything.
Jimmypop97 1 year ago 6
@Jimmypop97 I'm just saying that you pointed out that people abuse the ambulance thing, and was wondering how you would deal with it.
dragonofthedarknight 1 year ago
@Jimmypop97 Anyway, I wouldn't want to be in your proximity if I get sick. Yeah the ambulance will take you round the corner to the hospital and then sent you 600 dollar bill. It's obscene to do this to a person in a desperate need!! This just proves how mankind can become indifferent to a living being of their own kind. Perhaps if I was a dog you would at least put me out of misery by killing me eh?
tinarett 11 months ago
@Jimmypop97 yes the ambulance will come get you whenever you need it, so will helicopters if you need an air lift to the hospital but it does come out in your biil, you still have to pay extra for it.
ShadowMesiona 2 months ago
@Jimmypop97 Then it's poorly managed. Not my fault. Need to fire the manager. That's what you have a receptionist for to advice patients to go get some advil in pharmacy if cold is all they have. Simples!!
tinarett 11 months ago
you are wrong on that. Health care is a product since you are paying someone to use their knowledge to look at your problems or doing something. It’s the same as paying to get an education. If you want higher taxes, by my guest.
hint0122 1 year ago
@redguard12
I live in a country where government took care of health care. Bilions are wasted thanks to that. And People DO go to doctor when they're for example bored at home.
haken44 1 year ago
@haken44 What country do you live in?
biaten 1 year ago
@biaten Poland
haken44 1 year ago
healthcare is another business just like any other business, why do people think its any different.
Govt is the last thing you want to control healthcare. Govt runs almost everything into the ground the last thing you want is the govt telling you what kind of treatment you can and cant receive. They are literally controlling your wellbeing because they control the bills and money
ForTehNguyen 3 years ago 3
The grocery insurance argument is completely false. For one, the doctor does your shopping for you just as your auto repairer does. Secondly health care has what economists call "negative utility of consumption" a person who spends 0.5 percent of their life needing healthcare is not ten time worse off than someone spending 5 per cent of their lofe needing healthcare. Stossel, you should be ashamed of yourself.
hauskalainen 3 years ago 4
What a ridiculous argument by this idiot (the tv show host/anchor). First of all, people pay for their insurance monthly for most of their life (think- taxes) and how often do they actually get to use it compared to how much and for how long they are paying for it. Secondly, WHO LIKES GOING TO THE DOCTOR'S?! Who likes being sick!?
Ainsiquenon23 3 years ago 3
Interesting...abc was the only MSM to not air Obama's "infomercials".
Coincidence that this is the same chanel where John Stossel can air these types of documentaries.
BTW Obama.....I am still waiting for my free Ginzu Knives.
SxyLilFluffyBuni 3 years ago
The law states that hospital emergency rooms MUST keep you from dying, and that's a long way from curing you. They MUST stablize your condition; beyond THAT, it's open-ended. This issue requires one to actually think about aspects of it, not just defend the status quo/traditional way of adminstering health care in America simply because that's the way its always done.
BeyondTheSpectrum08 3 years ago
Government cannot solve every problem, but neither can the free market. Universal health care is no more "Socialism" than the idea of free public (and compulsory) education that we have now.
beyond-the-political-spectrum.blogspot(dot)com/
BeyondTheSpectrum08 3 years ago
3% denial rate is wayyy too high in my opinion! I am not for socialized medicine. If you research Canada's socialized medicine, you'll see that they have a looooong waiting list just for specialized tests for long-term illnesses, AND, they can't afford their maintanence medications for illnesses like high blood pressure, etc.
bunnyluv41 3 years ago
It's funny. I always hear about people pointing out the problems with the Canadian and other "Socialist" countries approach to dealing with universal health care. But I have yet to hear anyone from these other countries willing to trade what THEY have for the American way of doing things--risking bankruptcy due to the inability to pay for the highest medical costs in the world (the biggest reason for bankruptcy in America).
BeyondTheSpectrum08 3 years ago 2
Believe it or not, I have personal friends in Canada who have said all my life that they'd take the current healthcare system over theirs any day. One of my closest friends died from cancer because she was forced to wait three years for an operation. Tell me that you'd like that here in the US! Because that's what the Socialist Healthcare system is all about. Waiting periods, and long ones, no matter what the problem is. Canadians who have pets can get better veterinarian care for pets.
bunnyluv41 3 years ago
What's the difference? In America, if you have no health insurance and you have a diagnosis of a catastrophic illness like cancer, chances are, you're not going to even be seen (why do you think 7-11's always have penny jars on their counters asking patrons to donate to little Sally who needs a bone marrow transplant?). And have you been to an inner-city hospital? Trust me, you wait anyway. Any solution is going to cost money under a capitalist system, so we may as well bit the bullet.
BeyondTheSpectrum08 3 years ago
I like this debate. I apologize if my last reply seemed a little rude. That wasn't my intention. Yes, I've been to an innercity hospital (usually county hospitals take indigent patients)because I have been without insurance. I don't like it anymore than anyone else. But, at the same time, in many states there are laws place that say that no state or county hospital shall deny a patient health care based on their inability to pay.
bunnyluv41 3 years ago
They don't want to change it for the American system. The governments would lose millions. Mexico is the perfect example and I am from Mexico...so I know.
Trust me...the PEOPLE wish they had it like here.
The Government is just another "company".
SxyLilFluffyBuni 3 years ago
(continued): If a visit to the doctor only cost $20, and surgery ran for $200, as opposed to $20,000, then there would be no need for health insurance, we could pay for it out of pocket. The same goes for (legal) drugs, cancer medications don't cost $2 a pill, they cost hundreds of dollars. Until someone figures out a way to bring down the prices to where a normal person can afford a trip to the doctor and any related drugs/surgeries, we'll never be able to live without insurance.
xxpehbcemm 3 years ago
You do realize that surgeons usually have 12+ years as well as hundreds of thousands of dollars invested in their educations, right? Why go through all that trouble to work for spend hours preforming a surgery, all while assuming massive liability, to make a couple hundred bucks. You can get a job as a mechanic with no education and make that much...
Jimmypop97 3 years ago
Cost is driven up by cost of research, cost of doctors liability insurance due to frivolous lawsuits, and many other factors. If a company spend 10 years researching and creating a drug, and have hundreds of millions invested in the pill, they do have to make their money back from it. They can't just afford to spend so much and sell the pills for the 20 cents apiece it costs to make them on the production line.
Jimmypop97 3 years ago
And yet in Europe and Canada, drugs are far more affordable
xxpehbcemm 3 years ago
Just proves my point that you can't compare groceries to health care.
xxpehbcemm 3 years ago
Here's my take on the groceries vs healthcare debate: can't compare the two because food is much cheaper than healthcare; you don't spend thousands of dollars on one trip to the grocery store. A doctor's visit, however, can cost that much. A visit to the dentist for a routine cleaning can cost $200 to $300, can't ever remember a bag of groceries going for that much...that's why expensive things (health care, cars) are insured as opposed to cheap things (groceries).
xxpehbcemm 3 years ago
Thhis video was rediculous, I mean, no American can convince me that he has better health insurance than us in Europe. We pay higher taxes, but NEVER EVEN THINK that the government would REFUSE our treatment, like the stupid insurance companies do in the US. The US is a gr8 country, but the health care is shit there, and yes, universal health care does show that its better, after all, we European live much longer then u Americans.
cyberJamilonc 3 years ago 2