Bach - Bwv1067 Orchestral Suite - 03 - Sarabande

[MrChibbitt]

Why are they miming?

[Sylvain894]

Mr Koopman remains me two doctors i had in my life, maybe just for similar looks they have ?

[guletkaravela]

dünyanın en güzel müziği Bach'ın müziği

[pokemon9982]

I love classical music, they always calm me down when I'm in a really bad mood.

[spinoza1111]

The flute only SOUNDS like it is being foregrounded. It's playing essentially the same part as the rest of the ensemble. As such, Bach shows how the Enlightenment ruler could be reconciled to the ruled insofar as he, like Frederick the Great or Joseph II later, regarded himself...with all seriousness...as the servant of his people.

Now, I understand that this sounds like bullshit. But Frederick II (the Great) actually thought himself a good guy and a servant of his people.

[wcbroccoli]

Bach was never a subject of Frederick the Great, nor was he ever employed by him, even on a commission basis.

Bach didn't even meet Frederick until 1747.

The score parts for this suite date from 1738/1739, so it must have been composed no later than 1738/1739. Stylistically, it dates from 1717-1723, when Bach was employed at the court of

Leopold, the reigning Prince of Anhalt-Coethen.

So what does this suite have to do with Frederick or the Enlightenment?

[spinoza1111]

This is moronic. Your pedantry has proven an absurdity: that the suite has nothing to do with Frederick or the Enlightenment, and that classical music performers need only practice, read the sports pages, and act like barbarian monks.

[wcbroccoli]

Explain how the conclusion "that the suite has nothing to do with Frederick or the Enlightenment" is an absurdity?

Explain what this suite has to do with the Enlightenment and Frederick.

Put up or shut up.

[spinoza1111]

Cf. Adorno, "Bach rescued from his devotees". Adorno, a serious musicologist but no narrowly specialised pedant, shows how Bach can't be pigeonholed into a "Baroque" category, and his music WAS the enlightenment, since his most advanced work liberated music from God-walloping.

Frederick considered himself an enlightened king and knew Bach's music as a serious amateur musician. You believe he has "nothing to do" with Bach, because you're a child as regards history.

[wcbroccoli]

You digress.

And you are misquoting me.

Of course Frederick (1712-1786) and Bach (1785-1750) knew ABOUT each other, as Bach was famous throughout Germany as a performer and held several professional titles at various princely courts. And his son Carl worked for Frederick from 1738.

Over the years, Frederick repeatedly asked Carl to invite his father to the court so Frederick could meet him.

But that meeting, documented in the press, did not occur until 1747.

[spinoza1111]

Sketchily educated people often fail to see what x has to do with y.

Bach, as I hope you're aware, died in 1750, halfway through the century of the Enlightenment. Although the *philosophes* of the Enlightenment, of whom I hoped you learned in Bonehead 101, did not listen to Bach, Bach was quietly and in some obscurity writing absolute and thus enlightened music which, in being ungrounded in religious needs, anticipated Kant's ethics.

[wcbroccoli]

Speaking of what x has to do with y,

you still have not explained what Frederick, who did not meet Bach until 1747, had to do with the composition of this suite, composed no later than 1739.

Every famous composer could be said to have written "enlightened" music, whether or not he lived in the Age of Enlightenment. Bach's style was "enlightened" by music that predates the Enlightenment, as well as by his own time and the preceding generation.

[spinoza1111]

No, Bach created a space for his music apart from Telemann's and Vivaldi's nonsense.

Small men like to explain great men in terms of homunculi.

[wcbroccoli]

You sound like a cranky old man.

[wcbroccoli]

Speaking of what x has to do with y,

you still have not explained what Frederick, who did not meet Bach until 1747, had to do with the composition of this suite, composed no later than 1739.

[CHOROYAIR]

@spinoza1111 yo creo bueno  q esta muy bueno loco!!!!!!!

[wcbroccoli]

Music "ungrounded in religious needs" is simply secular music.

"Absolute" and "enlightened" music "ungrounded is religious needs" is simply "secular music not written for any occasion, function, program or commission and composed by professional musician."

Give an example of "absolute" music by Bach, and explain how it's "absolute".

[spinoza1111]

Kunst der Fuge: but Adorno's point being that even Bach's "sacred" music was not "sacred". There are indications from the difficulty of performing his work that Bach saw "religion" as merely a pretext for writing absolute music.

Your dull and pedantic categories don't apply. Artists then had to kowtow to religion: today, to money and your ridiculous "expertise". But they don't have to like it and can produce absolute art anyway.

[wcbroccoli]

I agree that Bach spent of lot of his last decade writing for himself. But he actually supervised the preparation Art of the Fugue for publication, even though he didn't complete the task. He intended it to be performed on keyboard. But there's no space to explain that here.

Bach signed secular and sacred works "for the glory of God".

Composers of his day didn't make a big stylistic distinction between sacred and secular music.

[wcbroccoli]

Most musicans in Bach's time worked for a court, a town or a church.

Bach worked for churches and courts, held several professional court titles.

Court positions were the most prestigious, but not always stable.

He did not "kowtow to religion" in his Coethen period (1717-1723) because

employer, Prince Leopold, belonged the reformed church which did not use much music.

And he definitely liked sacred music. Early on his stated goal was to promote "a well ordered church music".

[wcbroccoli]

Adorno has strong opinions, but by no means is he a Bach authority.

I recommend "The New Bach Reader" and "Bach: Essays on His Life and Music", both by Chistopher Wolff (a real Bach authority) and packed with authoritative references.

[manwithemeraldeyes]

ooo this is as baroque as it gets :) i love it.. the affectations really shines through and the piece is as moving as the baroque ideal. good job!

[SPACETIMEBEAUTY]

@manwithemeraldeyes Fetes Gallantes..

[blackberri64]

It's sad that rarely anyone listens to classical music much anymore...excellent work and lovely piece

[StradAmatiViolin]

@blackberri64 I'm just glad I'm one of the few that do listen to music such as this.

[triskiniki]

Wilbert es chachi...

[flutejansson]

Heartmoving...soooo beautiful.

[mysterius21]

Cara, esse flautista toca muito!!!!!