I respect penn's opinion as well as others. Having said that, you should all be well to know that the scouts were founded within the grounds of belief in God. Robert Baden-Powell who is the founder of the scouts wrote a book called "Scouting for boys" published in 1908 that states within its pages about duty to God.
The girl scouts have a bunch of issues themselves. The organization has become left leaning with the core ideas being subverted to environmentalism and "green" ideas. It has also increasingly become turned into a machine to divert funds back to the central organization with local troops unable to raise funds without first raising enough for HQ. And don't even get me started on how little the local tropps get from the sale of cookies.
lol, I would guess if I had to Penn was pretty high in this one. See the eyes?
Makes me think how much for the better this world would be if there where no individual countries. Always competing. Always clashing. Why can everyone not live life as a whole and just be happy? Honestly? Why can the whole world not just be ONE organized "machine" working as a whole making life better for all of the People, Plants and Animals living? WHY ARE MOST PEOPLE SO $%@#$%! DUMB! I know you agree.
I was a boy scout and an atheist, I never heard about people getting kicked out until much later and starting at age 5 and finishing at age 17...I feel like everything I learned was lost on the damn higher ups in the organization itself.
No organization is compelled to accept the money. The Boy Scouts have been told by the courts that if they refuse public money, then they can do what they want. The same people who defend the Boy Scouts' status as a private organization are irate over attempts to strip their public funding. You can't have it both ways.
They have a right to as prejudiced as they would like, but they have no right to my tax dollars supporting them in their bigotry.
I hear you. I mean shit, if they want to do as they please, you think the scouts would try and raise funds by themselfs. Sell the hell out of that popcorn.
It wouldn't just be atheists. It would be atheists, Catholics, Jews, Hindus, Buddhists, Scientologists, etc. Also gays. Pretty much all non-Mormons. And why don't they make their own scouts? Because their tax dollars are already paying for the Boy Scouts!!!
A more reasonable question is: Why don't the Boy Scouts either stop taking taxpayer dollars or leave religion out of scouting?
Better question is, why are we giving them dollars if they are religiously biased and an even bigger question is whether or not we should refuse to fund groups based on their religious views. ie. should Atheist, Christian, Muslim, etc groups get funding from government agencies at all? Shouldn't any organization's well-being be determined by the strength of the donors to it and leave that out of government control? Just a thought...
Scouting in England seems to be pretty easy going on religion. I remember 10 or so years ago when i joined i made them change the pledge to "The community and the queen" instead of "God and the queen". And for a ten year old to do that they seemed ok with that. I mean sure it means jack to me now and i still don't care for the queen but do people REALLY take this so seriously? We'll anyone expect the extreme undereducated religious right?
the girl scouts in america also mention god. when i was a kid we had to say "on my honor i will try to serve god and my country, to help people at all times, and to live by the girl scout law" and then we'd recite maybe 20 odd morals that were the girl scout law
I will do my best to be honest and fair, friendly and helpful, considerate and caring, courageous and strong, and responsible for what I say and do, and to respect myself and others, respect authority, use resources wisely, make the world a better place, and be a sister to every Girl Scout. These morals are "odd" to you? Where the hell are you from?
Just because I'm not Canadian doesn't mean I can't or shouldn't comment about something happening in Canada (and the same is true for Canadians commenting on America).
We all have the ability to judge, so as long as we have the interest and relevant information there's no reason we shouldn't (except maybe in respecting the private lives of people in some cases, which isn't so much a matter of not judging as it is respecting their privacy).
As a member of Girl Guides of Canada, I do not say the Promise and believe that I am pledging allegiance in the traditional sense. I see the Promise as a statement that I will choose to do the 'right thing' based on my beliefs/opinions for myself and my country.
The choice to remove god from our Promise is in line with the move to be a secular organization that is inclusive and open to all Canadian girls.
Your wrong about the 1st amendment. It prevents the establishment of an official religion, this is nothing of the sort. The only reason you think there is is because of a secular agenda and the inclusion doctrine which in itself unconstitutional. Look at the actions of the author of the bill of rights, james madison, to see how he felt about the place of religion in government.
I still say the government has no power to fund any of this but your wrong about the 1st amendment.
Yes, please. Look at what James Madison said about religion and government. Also look at what Washington, Jefferson, Franklin and Pain said. Please. This "secular agenda" crap is just your repetition of mistaken, yet respected members in your life. Please, read what they wrote on the subject. For real, this time.
Beyond the issue that there is no separation of church and state in the US by law or by proxy the real problem here isnt mentions of religions, its public funding. Drop all public funding for any of these groups and let them believe what ever they want to believe.
In the US and Canada, where the Boyscouts and Girl Guides exist, churches are NOT publicaly funded.
But if they WERE receiving money from the government (at least in the US), that would be both in violation of their 501(c)(3) terms as well as the establishment clause of the constitution. I'm not sure what laws might be broken in Canada, suffice to say churches aren't governmentally funded there, either.
Regardless, if they were founded on specific beliefs, they DESERVE to stay that way. If you don't want to support it..don't, fine. If the people who run it decide it is in THEIR best interest to change it, fine. But don't FORCE them to, as that is utterly retarded and completely takes away from freedom of *.
If they stay that way they DON'T deserve any public money. It's not in our interest to control what PRIVATE entities can or cannot do, but my tax dollars should not go towards establishing religious doctrine; that's unconstitutional.
I was a Boyscout for 5 years (& almost eagle), only losing interest after moving. The first troop I belonged to was sponsored by a local Catholic Church.
It's a good organization, but the government entanglement is unethical and I can no longer support them.
THEN DON'T. Nobody is saying YOU HAVE TO support them. But if they stand for something, you shouldn't be making them CHANGE IT. They are not MAKING YOU JOIN, or MAKING you support them.
You really don't understand this conversation, do you.
1) "Standing for something" is not a moral axiom.
2) The establishment clause of the constitution means public money can't support religious doctrine.
3) My only beef with the BSA is that they've somehow managed to get government money anyway.
4) I pay my taxes; it's the law.
There'd be no reason to make the BSA change if they stopped taking my tax dollars. Because they take my tax dollars, I'm forced to support indoctrination.
Girl Guides and Girl Scouts exist in 145 countries around the world and are part of a larger organization called WAGGGS (World Association of Girl Guides and Girl Scouts). Girl Guides and Girl Scouts is not limited to North America.
Then I do stand corrected. However, while I did ignorantly insinuate they only exist here, that's beside the main point. The important question is, "Do they exist in North America?" If yes, then they need to abide by North American laws (which include separation of Church and State, ie they can't be religious and get government monies). I do not know if Girl Guides in Canada does this or not. If they don't, then I agree with Penn's "they should" but not the statement "we should make them."
Hey Bob, I agree with your comments. Separate church and state - however Canada made some 'bad' promises some 150 years ago and promised to support religious schools... so in Canada religious schools are funded almost the same as public schools.
It's pretty crazy. Apparently to change the government support of religious schools would involve opening the Constitution Act up for change - which is the thin edge of the wedge for changing all kinds of stuff.
yeah, Ok, but surely you feel more strongly about being an outsider on some issues than others? So geographic areas are conflated with a common culture, maybe that's not perfect, but is it a tragedy? Is it a moral outrage? Meh. People who kick puppies bother me more.
No, I wasn't a member, since they don't take boys. My sister was a member, both parents were leaders, and I was in about 1st grade. So I got to go along. Lots of fun!
Except getting stung on the nose by a wasp in the latrine at night.
Good grief, Penn, Why exactly do you care? You do not want religion "pushed" upon you, so why are you so fervently pushing it away from others? I adore how outspoken and unabashed you are about your thoughts, but where does it stop being your place to comment? They will do as they will regardless of how you feel about it. If they do contact you, be sure to let all of us know.......
Good grief. Why do you care what penn has to say? :) (had to be a smart ass) its cause u have an opinion. and luckly for him, he has the ability to voice it to the masses. And i don't think that he's pushing it away from others, its more the idea that girl guides should be a place to teach young girls of all faith or lack there of. And by even mentioning God, you sagregate.
Notice the name of this set of videos: "Penn Says". It's all about Penn giving his opinions. He doesn't require your permission or approval to discuss any topic.
Neither do I need your permission nor your approval... This is a forum for discussing my/your opinion. No need for the stinging comments that seem to be condecending in nature. I admire Penn for having the courage that most others don't and standing up for what is his opnion. And just because the name is "Penn Says" doesn't translate into "Penn Is Right" or "Penn Never Repeats Himself"...
You told Penn that it might not be his place to comment.
The title of "Penn Says" translates to "Penn comments on things". So this is by definition *his* place to comment.
I never said he was always right. However, people have the right to express their opinion no matter right or wrong. It *never* "stop[s] being [their] place to comment".
No, I did not say it might not be his place to comment. Re-read the statement. I was exasperated (It had been a long day...) and happened to wonder how he manages to have some sort of a comment on everything. (Check out the PennSays: If You Seek Amy) Not a bad thing at all. He is admirable for being so upfront. I did not mean to make it seem as though I were saying that you said he was always right. Hell, having differing opinions is what makes this "debate" a blast!!! Thanks for the fun!!!
i mean i dont agree with the poicy, gays and atheis should be allowed in but its a private organization so legally theres not much you could do. i have friends in the boy scouts that are gay and/or atheist, openly, and no one seems to mind. its just a national rule that no one in my area care about that much
So, country clubs, as private organizations should be able to ban non-whites?
Even without that argument, the problem is that the Boy Scouts receive all sorts of government money and perks. If they're going to be so discriminatory, they shouldn't get that stuff.
legally yes, if they are exclusive private clubs than they can turn away anyone they want for what ever reason. its not morally right but thats the democracy we live in. As for perks, the only perks the BSA get from the gov. is a discount on the space used for the Nat'l Jamboree. that also has just been taken away, next years in Fort Lee Virginia is the last one, it's moving to a private camp ground run by the bsa in WV in 2014.
i'm against the rules to but you cant really take legal action
And in fact, private clubs *have* been successfully sued under Title II of the Civil Rights Act of 1964, for gender & race discrimination. So it's *possible* under the Constitution for religion, it simply hasn't been done.
All of Penn's wealth comes from shilling for Zionist masters like Viacom/CBS owner, uber-Zionist Sumner Redstone.
In all his caterwauling against religion, Penn Jillette has not once mentioned Zionism, genocide of the Palestinians so that white European Jews can take their land, all because the Jews' big book of fairytales says their PSYCHO FATHER IN THE SKY told them to.
Penn is no atheist. His job is to trash any cultural belief that shows Judaism/Zionism as the delusion/scam they are.
The US as a country is strictly Zionist. If you have compassion for the Palestinian people you are smeared as an aintisemite. If you study history and question in any way facts and figures set in stone 60 years ago regarding the holocaust, you are smeared as an antisemite. Believers in cultural beliefs older and more authentic or sensible than Judaism or its Christian sects are branded as cultists or pagans. If you reject the Zionist Hollywood version of reality you're labeled an extremist.
Hi guys! I really like the Penn & Teller's bullshit show therefore I think I gonna like this too, but I don't speak or understand english the good enough so Penn speaks too fast for me.
So please, can you subtitle these Penn's videos in spanish or english?
Y'know toward the end of Houdini's career he became obsessed with debunking anything and everyhting he could. Must be a curse of the great genuises of magic. A real shame Penn feels he has no more great inspiring magic to share instead of this. Their Bullshit show is getting worse each season also. Topless girls to distract from the drop in quality. A shame.
Yep. Boy scouts way too religious, and if they are private I have no problem with that. However, my heathen children will not be a part of that nonsense.
You're right, not all people of faith attempt to cause genocide. But... faith in a god that separates a "chosen people" from a pagan population of infidels endorses it by it's very nature. The fact of the matter is that fundamentalists are not the ones doing the "twisting". They are reading the texts and following the behaviors specifically and methodically. People who pick and choose good lines while discarding lines which endorse all kinds of unethical acts are "twisting" the faith.
It's refreshing to hear someone say that. I've always had a problem with the American "Pledge of Allegiance" but because it is a blatant attempt at nationalizing children... which is underhanded and asinine no matter what country you're from.
I had a student that would not stand for the pledge or take part in it because of religious reasons. She was as patriotic as it came, but because of her background (I think she was Jehovah witness), she could not partake.
So, it isn't just about atheists, what about the other sectors of Christianity or other religions who cannot state the pledge? Single them out? Pleading doesn't mean much now a days.
Thank you for prosthelatizing, but your religious views are based on lies and deception; furthermore, the same type of blind faith in religion that you have has led to blind obedience, which can result in violence and even genocide.
Just let them believe what they want to. Not all people of faith have caused genocide; it's the wacko radicals of religious groups who have done that; the fait in and of itself does not cause genocide, it's the crazy people who twist it to their own crazy beliefs that are the problem.
But what if there is no God of hope? In that case, your statement becomes similar to: May the leprechaun of merriment fill you all with happiness. It would certainly be nice if there was a God of hope and a leprechaun of merriment, but maybe there isn't.
I have a daughter in GSA and I am very glad they changed their policies in 94. I've talked to parents who have sons and are religious and do not want their sons in the BSA because of the ridiculous policies they have made.
I also agree that pledging allegiance does not make an automatic patriot or is the best way to show you care about your fellow citizen. Especially our pledge to a flag, regardless of what it represents, pledging to an object is draconian and does not support each other at all.
While any organization has a legal right to pledge to anything, I feel that the members of the girl scouts of canada who do not associate with the christian faith could simply not say god when pledging, if pledging at all. Simple solutions could solve this issue instead of blowing out of proportion. If this is not reasonable then they should find another organization that does not impose upon their ideology.
That is reasonable, but I'm sure you can see how it would make people uncomfortable who are nonbelievers that the standard for their pledge involves contradicting your own beliefs. What you just said is probably the solution Christians propose: "If you don't like God in the pledge, then just don't say it!" same thing with our pledge of allegiance. It's a nonstate regulated organization so I guess they can do what they want, but things like this just show their intolerance in my humble opinion
Joshbuckler brings an excellent issue to the table. Do you guys find yourselves more passionate about this topic only if you have children or does it rub you a certain way no matter what?
Hmm, an interesting way to put it. I care about the topic and I don't have any children (I'd hope not, being 16). I've never been in the boyscouts, never been near any kind of forced social group, I just care about the rights of my fellow humans. When you take them away - especially on the topic of religion and homosexuality - I get angry no matter the situation.
Have no children, never will (unless you count my ferrets) and it still rubs me the wrong way. The best explanation is the one that Dawkins put forth in The God Delusion, there are no Christian/Muslim/etc children, there are only children of Christian/Muslim/etc parents. Children haven't yet developed the faculties to decide for themselves if there is or is not a god. Having social structures outside their parents is good. Enforced religion therein is bad.
Still rubs me the wrong way. Things like this are battles over language, like you said you could replace the word with faith and I doubt Atheist and other religions who don't call anyone "God" would take much issue with it, although if it were up to me I would just take that part out all together and maybe replace it with something that people could universally get behind. This is identical to you, Penn, talkin bout how when people force you to pray like when you got that award it's wrong. same
I don't have children, but I was in Cub and Boy Scouts for 10 years. Over all, I liked it. Fortunately the "God" stuff I ran into was minimal. As P&T showed in the BS episode, this changes from troop to troop. Personally I always took "A scout is reverent" to mean "Be mindful of religion; stand by your convictions."
As for the whole ritualistic pledging of loyalty, well, that IS kinda what attracted me to it, and to joining a lodge as an adult. I'm an atheist but I love symbols and ceremony.
I don't have any daughters, so I guess I'm not really allowed an opinion on this either, but if they were to ask, I'd just have to say my standard answer is no organization should have a pledge to God as a requirement, but I am in favor of supporting any faith or non-faith that the girls might happen to have.
As for pledging to Canada, I guess a strict interpretation would be that it's intended to be a pledge to the government, which is another way of pledging to Elizabeth II.
I have to disagree, any organization that wants to have a pledge to God should be allowed as it's public and any atheist would know going in that they would have to make the pledge. True libertarians allow organizations to make their own decisions whether they agree with the decision or not. That being said, the Girl Guides made their decision and that's that.
The ignorant animals calling themselves a human race are collectively too stupid to understand why they need religion to keep from fucking imploding completely, so arrogant pinheads will keep pushing to get rid of religion until -- yes -- western society will implode completely. Then the Muslims or whoever else will be free to take us over.
I'm with Penn. I'm against all these pledges of allegiance.
But in response to the question below, a private organisation can require any oath they want. If they want the girls to pledge to cannibalism, genocide, and raping babies, they can do so.
The girl scouts (in America) have nothing to do with god, now? When I was in, about ten years ago, I remember one of our pledges went 'to honor god, and our country' etc. They take that out?
A funny thing about the Pledge of Allegiance: In the military, we're not allowed to say it. If other people are saying it, we're supposed to remain silent.
I'm assuming most people out there won't be against removing god from the pledge. But is there anyone out there that feels that as a private organization these groups can put whatever phrasing they want into their charters? In the never ending freedom of speech argument are we any different asking them to remove such wording then they are asking us to use those words?
Well... The factual status is weird a bit: They are private organization with an educational goal and, somehow, open to the public. So, I would considered them as a kind of private school basically.
So, they can't put every think they want in their charters... To avoid some kind of indoctrination. They have stipulate that this is an adherence to spiritual principles... And like any regard on humankind's nature is tolerate, it pass... But it would be less cheesy to get rid of this part.
"But is there anyone out there that feels that as a private organization these groups can put whatever phrasing they want into their charters?"
As a libertarian, I think it's axiomatic that a private organization can have any charter they desire. Me "asking" them to remove references to god is no infringement either. If either party uses the force of government, it is an insult to liberty.
They can't put anything they want to, but of course they can put god in their charters. Should churches be allowed to put god in their charters? What about any other group that wants to have god believers as members?
Yes, it is a private organization. They can pledge to eat fudge and jump rope. The real question is whether or not people would want their kids involved, in which case parents should do their research before throwing their kids in with any group activity (and pay attention to what their kids say when they get home). In reality, there is no freedom of speech or religion in the private sector outside of what society (consumers) allow.
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Pledge Allegiance never had God in it until the 1950's. The reason Godless Commie Reds called Russia and Atheist hangout. When we had God in our school systems our country thrived and prospered. When we took out God from Schools and our Government. We are now in brink of economic disaster. We need God back in schools and our Government. Or, we will end up like Russia in the late 1980's completely bankrupt. Bring back God.
Yeah, I'm sure taking God out of school is the primary reason the country fell. Not, corruption from both political parties. Not corporate greed. Not the so called 'Neo-Cons' spending billions on two wars. Not sending all the well paying jobs overseas and destroying industry in this counrty. Nope. The only reason is God was taken out of schools, because the separation between church and state only applies to the Govt. no sticking it's nose in churches, not churches sticking their noses in Govt.
God was never taken out of public schools, students are even allowed to pray in school. what is not allowed is a teacher leading a class in prayer, due to conflicts that are to arrise from diffrent faiths.
I am against a pledge. I won't pledge an alligence to any country. You should do a bull shit episode on movies like zeitgeist, fashism to freedom, and all these bullshit conspiarcy movies that are flooding the internet that people throw at me almost at a daily basis making atheism look bad with false facts. At least you have a good research team. Thanks for all your effort Penn.
Yes I agree that "as a private organization" these groups can phrase the charter however they want. We should just make sure that these organizations are indeed private (as P&T showed on "Bullshit", the BSA is not as privately-funded as it seems). Furthermore, unless the organization has a specific religious purpose, then from a business standpoint I think they're just shooting themselves in the foot if they don't keep the wordings secular.
We're different if we demand that we shouldn't be enforced to recite the pledge of allegiance altogether. Because seriously, just because you are a U.S. citizen doesn't mean you have allegiance to God or the U.S. at all. I just live here. I don't have to be loyal to this country.
I'm a canuck, and I don't care eityher way if they keep it or don't but you don't have to be Canadian to comment. I think that line of reasoning wherein you have to belong to the group to criticize it is in and of itself bullshit. We can't all be all things, but we can voice our opinoons and others can accept or dismiss those at their own choosing.
Satanism rejects the very idea of bowing down to anyone. Satan is the symbol of independence and indulgence - the opposite to the Christian ideal world of abstinence and eternal servitude. This is why a Satanist may "hail Satan", but will not bow down to him - there are no gods, and everyone is his own master.
I'd love to see Peter H. Gilmore run for Congress.. :)
Does anyone know if Bullshit will ever be available on DVD in the UK and Ireland? It's never broadcast over here, except at really obscure times, and I'd love to own it on DVD.
You can, but then they'd be Region 1, and you'd have to have a multiregion player, which not everyone has. It would be much easier to release the DVDs in the UK.
yeah, amazon does not sell most of the items. companys put their items on amazon - so if the company ships to you, then yes you can get it in the uk bro.
I don't know what your issue is Penn. The purpose of the boy scouts/girl scouts it to inspire nationalism and militarism.
Now if you are opposed to 'scouts' on a fundamental level that's fine, but why criticise an organization for carrying out the exact purpose it was created for?
WRONG... The whole and sole purpose of Scouting is to have a good time and learning stuff.
Nationalism is fine to a point but teaching respect for others and other cultures is better.
Also Scouting has nothing to do with militarism. Its just that most outdoors activities like hiking, wall climbing etc. are also practiced by the army/police.
He has a problem with the boyscouts taking public funds for private practices (enjoying private exclusion while taking funds from the very people they might wish to exclude)
That was not the exact purpose it was created for. It was added after the church took over.
What realy bugs me about this video is nothing that Penn said, i totaly agree with him.
What realy bugs me, is that although i concider myself an atheist, when reading the Title "Godless Girl Guides" i thought he would talk about Guides for being a naughty / 'bad' Girl.
That for me reading godless, could be associated with being 'bad' / naughty realy disturbes me....
You know what is really bullshit Penn, uploading these videos in HD, even though most people don''t have High Speed connections.That is fucking bullshit. Please just upload these how you used too.
Awesome Penn! I been saying this for quite a while. Patriotism is great but nationalism sucks. A person should have a lot of respect for the Constitution and the principles of America. But I really do not think United States is #1, as many people who like to say. I go so far to say that burning the United States flag is the highest form of patiortism. Thus, there should not no pledge, it sounds to nationalistic to me.
I pledge Allegiance to the Constitution of the United States of America and to the values for which it stand One Nation, indivisible, with Liberty and Justice for All.
That's my pledge! Because the flag is just a symbol of the country, the Constitution is the affirmation of our freedom and my allegiance lies in that, regardless of which country I live in.
Umm... The Constitution is a piece of paper, just as the flag is a piece of fabric! How about "I pledge allegiance to the values of the United States..."
I'm a Canadian Girl Guide, and even though the promise does state; God(faith) and Canada,
I have always said I promise to be true to myself, and Canada,
because I don't believe in religion, an do not think i should be required to make a reference to a belief I do not have, and no one has a probblem with it. (:
there's this adult at my school that tries to guilt me and my class mates for not standing, putting our hands on our hearts, and repeating the pledge everyday.
yes, people did die for our safety and security, but this isn't the Fascist States of America
Actually the Girl Scouts do make a reference to God. Here's a quote from their website:
The Girl Scout Promise
On my honor, I will try: To serve God* and my country, To help people at all times, And to live by the Girl Scout Law.
* The word "God" can be interpreted in a number of ways, depending on one's spiritual beliefs. When reciting the Girl Scout Promise, it is okay to replace the word "God" with whatever word your spiritual beliefs dictate.
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Love ya Penn - but I gotta go against you on this one......
On my honor, I will do my best, to do my duty, to God and my country, and to obey the Scout Law, to help other people at all times; to keep myself physically fit; mentally awake; and morally strait.
If you are an atheist, you can't be a boy scout. So obviously you aren't atheist. If you aren't atheist you are DEFINATLY not "mentally awake." The scout law is self-defeating.
"If you aren't atheist you are DEFINATLY not 'mentally awake.'"
Come on, there are plenty of people who aren't religious but do believe in god, a higher power, or some sort of universal spirit whom I have no qualms with at all. To say that only atheists can be considered "metally awake" is very untrue.
Wish there were more groups that did not require God. It's the people that walks beside other people. Wish we all knew.
KrazyAssMerci 2 years ago
Dang dude I had no idea how much control the mormons had over the BSA.
grassmaster180 2 years ago
LOL, what's left of their "pledge" there Penn?/
jeffpog 2 years ago
I respect penn's opinion as well as others. Having said that, you should all be well to know that the scouts were founded within the grounds of belief in God. Robert Baden-Powell who is the founder of the scouts wrote a book called "Scouting for boys" published in 1908 that states within its pages about duty to God.
joshuasoper 2 years ago
The girl scouts have a bunch of issues themselves. The organization has become left leaning with the core ideas being subverted to environmentalism and "green" ideas. It has also increasingly become turned into a machine to divert funds back to the central organization with local troops unable to raise funds without first raising enough for HQ. And don't even get me started on how little the local tropps get from the sale of cookies.
dickson37055 2 years ago
lol, I would guess if I had to Penn was pretty high in this one. See the eyes?
Makes me think how much for the better this world would be if there where no individual countries. Always competing. Always clashing. Why can everyone not live life as a whole and just be happy? Honestly? Why can the whole world not just be ONE organized "machine" working as a whole making life better for all of the People, Plants and Animals living? WHY ARE MOST PEOPLE SO $%@#$%! DUMB! I know you agree.
llbarllcodell 2 years ago
I was a boy scout and an atheist, I never heard about people getting kicked out until much later and starting at age 5 and finishing at age 17...I feel like everything I learned was lost on the damn higher ups in the organization itself.
airslaughter 2 years ago
The Boy Scouts are a private organization, right? Well, they should be able to throw out anyone for any reason, no matter how stupid the reason is.
seanThree16 2 years ago
"The Boy Scouts are a private organization, right?"
They receive government funds, so they are not private. If they didn't get government backing, you'd have a point.
xTRUExHATEx 2 years ago 4
Yeah, but what/who doesn't recieve government money these days? The government pretty much has a hand in everything. Depressing...
seanThree16 2 years ago 3
No organization is compelled to accept the money. The Boy Scouts have been told by the courts that if they refuse public money, then they can do what they want. The same people who defend the Boy Scouts' status as a private organization are irate over attempts to strip their public funding. You can't have it both ways.
They have a right to as prejudiced as they would like, but they have no right to my tax dollars supporting them in their bigotry.
xTRUExHATEx 2 years ago 2
I hear you. I mean shit, if they want to do as they please, you think the scouts would try and raise funds by themselfs. Sell the hell out of that popcorn.
seanThree16 2 years ago
Why doesn't Atheist make their own Scouts that does not believe in God?
juanvelez75 2 years ago
It wouldn't just be atheists. It would be atheists, Catholics, Jews, Hindus, Buddhists, Scientologists, etc. Also gays. Pretty much all non-Mormons. And why don't they make their own scouts? Because their tax dollars are already paying for the Boy Scouts!!!
A more reasonable question is: Why don't the Boy Scouts either stop taking taxpayer dollars or leave religion out of scouting?
xTRUExHATEx 2 years ago
Better question is, why are we giving them dollars if they are religiously biased and an even bigger question is whether or not we should refuse to fund groups based on their religious views. ie. should Atheist, Christian, Muslim, etc groups get funding from government agencies at all? Shouldn't any organization's well-being be determined by the strength of the donors to it and leave that out of government control? Just a thought...
dannyboydwp 2 years ago
you sound like seth rogan XD
crazedrac0on 2 years ago
I used "pancakes" for every noun in the pledge of allegiance in school, lol.
s00pcan 2 years ago
I like waffles much better...
Bunifilth 2 years ago
hahahahaha! Brilliant.
VonBrewskie 2 years ago
Scouting in England seems to be pretty easy going on religion. I remember 10 or so years ago when i joined i made them change the pledge to "The community and the queen" instead of "God and the queen". And for a ten year old to do that they seemed ok with that. I mean sure it means jack to me now and i still don't care for the queen but do people REALLY take this so seriously? We'll anyone expect the extreme undereducated religious right?
Murumasa1 2 years ago
the girl scouts in america also mention god. when i was a kid we had to say "on my honor i will try to serve god and my country, to help people at all times, and to live by the girl scout law" and then we'd recite maybe 20 odd morals that were the girl scout law
sunshinetomato 2 years ago
lexopposite 2 years ago
20-odd means 'around 20 or so, loosely'
sunshinetomato 2 years ago
EVERYTHING is EVERYONE's place to comment.
Just because I'm not Canadian doesn't mean I can't or shouldn't comment about something happening in Canada (and the same is true for Canadians commenting on America).
We all have the ability to judge, so as long as we have the interest and relevant information there's no reason we shouldn't (except maybe in respecting the private lives of people in some cases, which isn't so much a matter of not judging as it is respecting their privacy).
RobertPFreeman 2 years ago 2
By judge I don't necessarily mean to criticize, but rather to analyze and form conclusions (whether positive or negative).
RobertPFreeman 2 years ago
In fact I think canadians probably have more right o judge us than ourselves, at least they have real news
ajthewonder 2 years ago
This is all great stuff gang. Thanks for sharing your thoughts with us on this one.
pennsays 2 years ago
As a member of Girl Guides of Canada, I do not say the Promise and believe that I am pledging allegiance in the traditional sense. I see the Promise as a statement that I will choose to do the 'right thing' based on my beliefs/opinions for myself and my country.
The choice to remove god from our Promise is in line with the move to be a secular organization that is inclusive and open to all Canadian girls.
As a paying member - I support this decision.
lct7111980 2 years ago
Leaving a short message in the pack of all these big messages.
JustinPayton 2 years ago
Why is faith an inherently good thing? What if your faith is in Jim Jones, Charlie Manson, or the Pope or Rick Warren for that matter?
TheClassicalLiberal 2 years ago
Your wrong about the 1st amendment. It prevents the establishment of an official religion, this is nothing of the sort. The only reason you think there is is because of a secular agenda and the inclusion doctrine which in itself unconstitutional. Look at the actions of the author of the bill of rights, james madison, to see how he felt about the place of religion in government.
I still say the government has no power to fund any of this but your wrong about the 1st amendment.
Imputis 2 years ago
Yes, please. Look at what James Madison said about religion and government. Also look at what Washington, Jefferson, Franklin and Pain said. Please. This "secular agenda" crap is just your repetition of mistaken, yet respected members in your life. Please, read what they wrote on the subject. For real, this time.
BobPaul 2 years ago
Beyond the issue that there is no separation of church and state in the US by law or by proxy the real problem here isnt mentions of religions, its public funding. Drop all public funding for any of these groups and let them believe what ever they want to believe.
Imputis 2 years ago
I was thrown out of the boyscouts for eating a brownie :)
upplsuckimcool16 2 years ago
Well, since brownie scouts are ages 7- 9 and boyscouts start at age 11/12, I should seriously hope so!
BobPaul 2 years ago
If an organization was founded on specific beliefs, it can stay that way.
Guitarrassdeamor 2 years ago
If an organization gets public funding, it's no longer a private organization. I don't know about the Girl Guides, but the Boy Scouts certainly does.
BobPaul 2 years ago
It doesn't MATTER. If the organization was FOUNDED on these beliefs, it deserves to STAY that way and not have any resistance.
Does this mean churches have to now adhere to every kind of faith because they are publicly funded?
Guitarrassdeamor 2 years ago
In the US and Canada, where the Boyscouts and Girl Guides exist, churches are NOT publicaly funded.
But if they WERE receiving money from the government (at least in the US), that would be both in violation of their 501(c)(3) terms as well as the establishment clause of the constitution. I'm not sure what laws might be broken in Canada, suffice to say churches aren't governmentally funded there, either.
BobPaul 2 years ago
Regardless, if they were founded on specific beliefs, they DESERVE to stay that way. If you don't want to support it..don't, fine. If the people who run it decide it is in THEIR best interest to change it, fine. But don't FORCE them to, as that is utterly retarded and completely takes away from freedom of *.
Guitarrassdeamor 2 years ago
If they stay that way they DON'T deserve any public money. It's not in our interest to control what PRIVATE entities can or cannot do, but my tax dollars should not go towards establishing religious doctrine; that's unconstitutional.
I was a Boyscout for 5 years (& almost eagle), only losing interest after moving. The first troop I belonged to was sponsored by a local Catholic Church.
It's a good organization, but the government entanglement is unethical and I can no longer support them.
BobPaul 2 years ago
THEN DON'T. Nobody is saying YOU HAVE TO support them. But if they stand for something, you shouldn't be making them CHANGE IT. They are not MAKING YOU JOIN, or MAKING you support them.
Guitarrassdeamor 2 years ago
You really don't understand this conversation, do you.
1) "Standing for something" is not a moral axiom.
2) The establishment clause of the constitution means public money can't support religious doctrine.
3) My only beef with the BSA is that they've somehow managed to get government money anyway.
4) I pay my taxes; it's the law.
There'd be no reason to make the BSA change if they stopped taking my tax dollars. Because they take my tax dollars, I'm forced to support indoctrination.
BobPaul 2 years ago
You're not FORCED to do anything.
Civil disobedience
And if you don't agree with it, and it is so wrong, take it to court.
Guitarrassdeamor 2 years ago
"You're not forced to do this, you can just gho to prison instead."
Seriously, are you fucking retarded?
ApesAmongUs 2 years ago
Girl Guides and Girl Scouts exist in 145 countries around the world and are part of a larger organization called WAGGGS (World Association of Girl Guides and Girl Scouts). Girl Guides and Girl Scouts is not limited to North America.
lct7111980 2 years ago
Then I do stand corrected. However, while I did ignorantly insinuate they only exist here, that's beside the main point. The important question is, "Do they exist in North America?" If yes, then they need to abide by North American laws (which include separation of Church and State, ie they can't be religious and get government monies). I do not know if Girl Guides in Canada does this or not. If they don't, then I agree with Penn's "they should" but not the statement "we should make them."
BobPaul 2 years ago
Hey Bob, I agree with your comments. Separate church and state - however Canada made some 'bad' promises some 150 years ago and promised to support religious schools... so in Canada religious schools are funded almost the same as public schools.
It's pretty crazy. Apparently to change the government support of religious schools would involve opening the Constitution Act up for change - which is the thin edge of the wedge for changing all kinds of stuff.
*big sigh*
lct7111980 2 years ago
this gave me a total flash back.
when I was a kid I remember wanting to join the boy scouts.
I had the uniform and went to the sing up "ceremony" and everything.
I just remember walking out when we all expected to do a pledge that had god in it.
I just couldn't do it.
thanks Penn for stirring up this dormant memory.
axobeauvi 2 years ago 2
yeah, Ok, but surely you feel more strongly about being an outsider on some issues than others? So geographic areas are conflated with a common culture, maybe that's not perfect, but is it a tragedy? Is it a moral outrage? Meh. People who kick puppies bother me more.
GBanville 2 years ago
I had a lot of fun at Girl Scout camp.
No, I wasn't a member, since they don't take boys. My sister was a member, both parents were leaders, and I was in about 1st grade. So I got to go along. Lots of fun!
Except getting stung on the nose by a wasp in the latrine at night.
jursamaj 2 years ago
it really doesnt matter if you have such a problem with it then dont put your young girl in the girl scouts
BDT8 2 years ago
Good grief, Penn, Why exactly do you care? You do not want religion "pushed" upon you, so why are you so fervently pushing it away from others? I adore how outspoken and unabashed you are about your thoughts, but where does it stop being your place to comment? They will do as they will regardless of how you feel about it. If they do contact you, be sure to let all of us know.......
DEADisBEAUTIFUL 2 years ago
so right. i agree completly
BDT8 2 years ago
Good grief. Why do you care what penn has to say? :) (had to be a smart ass) its cause u have an opinion. and luckly for him, he has the ability to voice it to the masses. And i don't think that he's pushing it away from others, its more the idea that girl guides should be a place to teach young girls of all faith or lack there of. And by even mentioning God, you sagregate.
hutch876 2 years ago
do you live in hutchinson?
Bloodwolf291 2 years ago
Of course, you are right. I had been watching many of these posts, and this one just seemed redundant of what had already been said.
DEADisBEAUTIFUL 2 years ago
Notice the name of this set of videos: "Penn Says". It's all about Penn giving his opinions. He doesn't require your permission or approval to discuss any topic.
jursamaj 2 years ago
Neither do I need your permission nor your approval... This is a forum for discussing my/your opinion. No need for the stinging comments that seem to be condecending in nature. I admire Penn for having the courage that most others don't and standing up for what is his opnion. And just because the name is "Penn Says" doesn't translate into "Penn Is Right" or "Penn Never Repeats Himself"...
DEADisBEAUTIFUL 2 years ago
You told Penn that it might not be his place to comment.
The title of "Penn Says" translates to "Penn comments on things". So this is by definition *his* place to comment.
I never said he was always right. However, people have the right to express their opinion no matter right or wrong. It *never* "stop[s] being [their] place to comment".
jursamaj 2 years ago
No, I did not say it might not be his place to comment. Re-read the statement. I was exasperated (It had been a long day...) and happened to wonder how he manages to have some sort of a comment on everything. (Check out the PennSays: If You Seek Amy) Not a bad thing at all. He is admirable for being so upfront. I did not mean to make it seem as though I were saying that you said he was always right. Hell, having differing opinions is what makes this "debate" a blast!!! Thanks for the fun!!!
DEADisBEAUTIFUL 2 years ago
I just don't like when they go after impressionable children.
axobeauvi 2 years ago
If it's a private organization who cares what their values are?
furyofbongos 2 years ago
On a segway note, there is a really creepy ass AD for The Athiest's Riddle .
gwagblade 2 years ago
i;m in the BSA and i dont like the policy of athiest or gays. but i have good friends in the boy scouts who are both and their doing fine.
nowhereman136 2 years ago
You mean you don't like the atheists or gays, or don't like the way the BSA handles the atheists and gays?
saxmachine123 2 years ago
i mean i dont agree with the poicy, gays and atheis should be allowed in but its a private organization so legally theres not much you could do. i have friends in the boy scouts that are gay and/or atheist, openly, and no one seems to mind. its just a national rule that no one in my area care about that much
nowhereman136 2 years ago
So, country clubs, as private organizations should be able to ban non-whites?
Even without that argument, the problem is that the Boy Scouts receive all sorts of government money and perks. If they're going to be so discriminatory, they shouldn't get that stuff.
jursamaj 2 years ago
legally yes, if they are exclusive private clubs than they can turn away anyone they want for what ever reason. its not morally right but thats the democracy we live in. As for perks, the only perks the BSA get from the gov. is a discount on the space used for the Nat'l Jamboree. that also has just been taken away, next years in Fort Lee Virginia is the last one, it's moving to a private camp ground run by the bsa in WV in 2014.
i'm against the rules to but you cant really take legal action
nowhereman136 2 years ago
Actually, the BSA get a lot more perks than that.
And in fact, private clubs *have* been successfully sued under Title II of the Civil Rights Act of 1964, for gender & race discrimination. So it's *possible* under the Constitution for religion, it simply hasn't been done.
jursamaj 2 years ago
All of Penn's wealth comes from shilling for Zionist masters like Viacom/CBS owner, uber-Zionist Sumner Redstone.
In all his caterwauling against religion, Penn Jillette has not once mentioned Zionism, genocide of the Palestinians so that white European Jews can take their land, all because the Jews' big book of fairytales says their PSYCHO FATHER IN THE SKY told them to.
Penn is no atheist. His job is to trash any cultural belief that shows Judaism/Zionism as the delusion/scam they are.
bumpyjjeans 2 years ago
The US as a country is strictly Zionist. If you have compassion for the Palestinian people you are smeared as an aintisemite. If you study history and question in any way facts and figures set in stone 60 years ago regarding the holocaust, you are smeared as an antisemite. Believers in cultural beliefs older and more authentic or sensible than Judaism or its Christian sects are branded as cultists or pagans. If you reject the Zionist Hollywood version of reality you're labeled an extremist.
bumpyjjeans 2 years ago
Hi guys! I really like the Penn & Teller's bullshit show therefore I think I gonna like this too, but I don't speak or understand english the good enough so Penn speaks too fast for me.
So please, can you subtitle these Penn's videos in spanish or english?
Thank you and bye!
NITZFilchtinsky 2 years ago
Y'know toward the end of Houdini's career he became obsessed with debunking anything and everyhting he could. Must be a curse of the great genuises of magic. A real shame Penn feels he has no more great inspiring magic to share instead of this. Their Bullshit show is getting worse each season also. Topless girls to distract from the drop in quality. A shame.
jbsouthpaw2009 2 years ago
Yep. Boy scouts way too religious, and if they are private I have no problem with that. However, my heathen children will not be a part of that nonsense.
pitbull103 2 years ago 3
So Penn doesn't like pledging allegiance to a country, and the root of the problem, for him as an American, is...the Girl Guides of Canada.
EuchridEucrow1 2 years ago
I nominate Penn Jillette for PM of Canada
culwin 2 years ago 4
No thanks. I like my health care.
spiderzer0 2 years ago
P0mt3,
You're right, not all people of faith attempt to cause genocide. But... faith in a god that separates a "chosen people" from a pagan population of infidels endorses it by it's very nature. The fact of the matter is that fundamentalists are not the ones doing the "twisting". They are reading the texts and following the behaviors specifically and methodically. People who pick and choose good lines while discarding lines which endorse all kinds of unethical acts are "twisting" the faith.
Natselected 2 years ago
It's refreshing to hear someone say that. I've always had a problem with the American "Pledge of Allegiance" but because it is a blatant attempt at nationalizing children... which is underhanded and asinine no matter what country you're from.
Natselected 2 years ago 3
I had a student that would not stand for the pledge or take part in it because of religious reasons. She was as patriotic as it came, but because of her background (I think she was Jehovah witness), she could not partake.
So, it isn't just about atheists, what about the other sectors of Christianity or other religions who cannot state the pledge? Single them out? Pleading doesn't mean much now a days.
steffiphill 2 years ago 2
This comment has received too many negative votes show
May the God of hope fill you with all joy.
Akulahous 2 years ago
Thank you for prosthelatizing, but your religious views are based on lies and deception; furthermore, the same type of blind faith in religion that you have has led to blind obedience, which can result in violence and even genocide.
jamesjohnsonjunior 2 years ago
Just let them believe what they want to. Not all people of faith have caused genocide; it's the wacko radicals of religious groups who have done that; the fait in and of itself does not cause genocide, it's the crazy people who twist it to their own crazy beliefs that are the problem.
P0mt3 2 years ago
But what if there is no God of hope? In that case, your statement becomes similar to: May the leprechaun of merriment fill you all with happiness. It would certainly be nice if there was a God of hope and a leprechaun of merriment, but maybe there isn't.
culwin 2 years ago 2
★★★★★
Katalyzt 2 years ago
Kinda weird, I didn't expect Penn to have this attitude (I'm neutral on the issue). Are the Girl Guides a public or private institution?
TKnightcrawler 2 years ago
I have a daughter in GSA and I am very glad they changed their policies in 94. I've talked to parents who have sons and are religious and do not want their sons in the BSA because of the ridiculous policies they have made.
I also agree that pledging allegiance does not make an automatic patriot or is the best way to show you care about your fellow citizen. Especially our pledge to a flag, regardless of what it represents, pledging to an object is draconian and does not support each other at all.
CyberDraco 2 years ago
While any organization has a legal right to pledge to anything, I feel that the members of the girl scouts of canada who do not associate with the christian faith could simply not say god when pledging, if pledging at all. Simple solutions could solve this issue instead of blowing out of proportion. If this is not reasonable then they should find another organization that does not impose upon their ideology.
11pinecone 2 years ago
That is reasonable, but I'm sure you can see how it would make people uncomfortable who are nonbelievers that the standard for their pledge involves contradicting your own beliefs. What you just said is probably the solution Christians propose: "If you don't like God in the pledge, then just don't say it!" same thing with our pledge of allegiance. It's a nonstate regulated organization so I guess they can do what they want, but things like this just show their intolerance in my humble opinion
seestickglue232 2 years ago
Joshbuckler brings an excellent issue to the table. Do you guys find yourselves more passionate about this topic only if you have children or does it rub you a certain way no matter what?
pennsays 2 years ago
it's sooo weird religion is such a small private thing in Canada. I guess i'm pissed because I thought my country had a little more respect..
maman666 2 years ago
Had more respect for what, maman666? Respect for religion? Why should we have respect for religion or faith?
KemaTheAtheist 2 years ago 2
b/c uhh.. religion killed alot of heretics lol... or something
AtrixAlpha 2 years ago
hardly, I meant respect for everybody who isn't religious.
maman666 2 years ago
Hmm, an interesting way to put it. I care about the topic and I don't have any children (I'd hope not, being 16). I've never been in the boyscouts, never been near any kind of forced social group, I just care about the rights of my fellow humans. When you take them away - especially on the topic of religion and homosexuality - I get angry no matter the situation.
withthebirdillshare 2 years ago
Have no children, never will (unless you count my ferrets) and it still rubs me the wrong way. The best explanation is the one that Dawkins put forth in The God Delusion, there are no Christian/Muslim/etc children, there are only children of Christian/Muslim/etc parents. Children haven't yet developed the faculties to decide for themselves if there is or is not a god. Having social structures outside their parents is good. Enforced religion therein is bad.
greyed 2 years ago
Still rubs me the wrong way. Things like this are battles over language, like you said you could replace the word with faith and I doubt Atheist and other religions who don't call anyone "God" would take much issue with it, although if it were up to me I would just take that part out all together and maybe replace it with something that people could universally get behind. This is identical to you, Penn, talkin bout how when people force you to pray like when you got that award it's wrong. same
seestickglue232 2 years ago
I don't have children, but I was in Cub and Boy Scouts for 10 years. Over all, I liked it. Fortunately the "God" stuff I ran into was minimal. As P&T showed in the BS episode, this changes from troop to troop. Personally I always took "A scout is reverent" to mean "Be mindful of religion; stand by your convictions."
As for the whole ritualistic pledging of loyalty, well, that IS kinda what attracted me to it, and to joining a lodge as an adult. I'm an atheist but I love symbols and ceremony.
geezerbill 2 years ago 2
I don't have any daughters, so I guess I'm not really allowed an opinion on this either, but if they were to ask, I'd just have to say my standard answer is no organization should have a pledge to God as a requirement, but I am in favor of supporting any faith or non-faith that the girls might happen to have.
As for pledging to Canada, I guess a strict interpretation would be that it's intended to be a pledge to the government, which is another way of pledging to Elizabeth II.
Joshbuckler 2 years ago
I have to disagree, any organization that wants to have a pledge to God should be allowed as it's public and any atheist would know going in that they would have to make the pledge. True libertarians allow organizations to make their own decisions whether they agree with the decision or not. That being said, the Girl Guides made their decision and that's that.
AwakenedSamus 2 years ago
God rocks
suprimo1surmano 2 years ago
Nothing like this in the UK we're laid back, at least where I went.
Nashy119 2 years ago
The ignorant animals calling themselves a human race are collectively too stupid to understand why they need religion to keep from fucking imploding completely, so arrogant pinheads will keep pushing to get rid of religion until -- yes -- western society will implode completely. Then the Muslims or whoever else will be free to take us over.
MazeleyFanClub 2 years ago
I'm with Penn. I'm against all these pledges of allegiance.
But in response to the question below, a private organisation can require any oath they want. If they want the girls to pledge to cannibalism, genocide, and raping babies, they can do so.
kittyprydekissme 2 years ago
The girl scouts (in America) have nothing to do with god, now? When I was in, about ten years ago, I remember one of our pledges went 'to honor god, and our country' etc. They take that out?
Preosmo 2 years ago
it's weird cause in Canada it's our favorite thing to bitch aboot our shitty government
maman666 2 years ago
aboot! LOL!
MysteryManoLove 2 years ago
Are religious people more likely to leave their children in the care of boy scouts, girl scouts, etc ,like they do with bible camps?
MetalMasquerade 2 years ago
A funny thing about the Pledge of Allegiance: In the military, we're not allowed to say it. If other people are saying it, we're supposed to remain silent.
Fat7926 2 years ago
I'm assuming most people out there won't be against removing god from the pledge. But is there anyone out there that feels that as a private organization these groups can put whatever phrasing they want into their charters? In the never ending freedom of speech argument are we any different asking them to remove such wording then they are asking us to use those words?
pennsays 2 years ago
Well... The factual status is weird a bit: They are private organization with an educational goal and, somehow, open to the public. So, I would considered them as a kind of private school basically.
So, they can't put every think they want in their charters... To avoid some kind of indoctrination. They have stipulate that this is an adherence to spiritual principles... And like any regard on humankind's nature is tolerate, it pass... But it would be less cheesy to get rid of this part.
therrydicule 2 years ago
"But is there anyone out there that feels that as a private organization these groups can put whatever phrasing they want into their charters?"
As a libertarian, I think it's axiomatic that a private organization can have any charter they desire. Me "asking" them to remove references to god is no infringement either. If either party uses the force of government, it is an insult to liberty.
yegreskin 2 years ago
They can't put anything they want to, but of course they can put god in their charters. Should churches be allowed to put god in their charters? What about any other group that wants to have god believers as members?
arccotangent 2 years ago
Yes, it is a private organization. They can pledge to eat fudge and jump rope. The real question is whether or not people would want their kids involved, in which case parents should do their research before throwing their kids in with any group activity (and pay attention to what their kids say when they get home). In reality, there is no freedom of speech or religion in the private sector outside of what society (consumers) allow.
yoda87960 2 years ago
This comment has received too many negative votes show
Pledge Allegiance never had God in it until the 1950's. The reason Godless Commie Reds called Russia and Atheist hangout. When we had God in our school systems our country thrived and prospered. When we took out God from Schools and our Government. We are now in brink of economic disaster. We need God back in schools and our Government. Or, we will end up like Russia in the late 1980's completely bankrupt. Bring back God.
TheStormchaser1 2 years ago
Yeah, I'm sure taking God out of school is the primary reason the country fell. Not, corruption from both political parties. Not corporate greed. Not the so called 'Neo-Cons' spending billions on two wars. Not sending all the well paying jobs overseas and destroying industry in this counrty. Nope. The only reason is God was taken out of schools, because the separation between church and state only applies to the Govt. no sticking it's nose in churches, not churches sticking their noses in Govt.
MegaVolcano 2 years ago
God was never taken out of public schools, students are even allowed to pray in school. what is not allowed is a teacher leading a class in prayer, due to conflicts that are to arrise from diffrent faiths.
avengemm9dog 2 years ago 3
Preachin' to the choir, brother.
MegaVolcano 2 years ago
I am against a pledge. I won't pledge an alligence to any country. You should do a bull shit episode on movies like zeitgeist, fashism to freedom, and all these bullshit conspiarcy movies that are flooding the internet that people throw at me almost at a daily basis making atheism look bad with false facts. At least you have a good research team. Thanks for all your effort Penn.
FortWaltonBeachSux 2 years ago
Yes I agree that "as a private organization" these groups can phrase the charter however they want. We should just make sure that these organizations are indeed private (as P&T showed on "Bullshit", the BSA is not as privately-funded as it seems). Furthermore, unless the organization has a specific religious purpose, then from a business standpoint I think they're just shooting themselves in the foot if they don't keep the wordings secular.
geezerbill 2 years ago
We're different if we demand that we shouldn't be enforced to recite the pledge of allegiance altogether. Because seriously, just because you are a U.S. citizen doesn't mean you have allegiance to God or the U.S. at all. I just live here. I don't have to be loyal to this country.
cosmosofinfinity 2 years ago
This comment has received too many negative votes show
Lets hope that we end up an atheist world but not end up like you.
MORON !!!
holdontoyourwig 2 years ago
With you 100%.
CannabisHeals 2 years ago
I'm a canuck, and I don't care eityher way if they keep it or don't but you don't have to be Canadian to comment. I think that line of reasoning wherein you have to belong to the group to criticize it is in and of itself bullshit. We can't all be all things, but we can voice our opinoons and others can accept or dismiss those at their own choosing.
LeGioNoFZioN 2 years ago 3
I'm not sure I like the idea of a pledge of allegiance at all. Unless it's to Satan.
Mastikator 2 years ago 2
Satanism rejects the very idea of bowing down to anyone. Satan is the symbol of independence and indulgence - the opposite to the Christian ideal world of abstinence and eternal servitude. This is why a Satanist may "hail Satan", but will not bow down to him - there are no gods, and everyone is his own master.
I'd love to see Peter H. Gilmore run for Congress.. :)
int3rl0per 2 years ago 3
Imaginary bad guys, Spooky invisible parents.
You can keep them. Ill rely on logic and truth you can read a conglomerate book, and feel safe with your imaginary friends.
VictorphoenixDMvault 2 years ago 5
Logic is no match for the magic of Satan.
Mastikator 2 years ago
Have you ever seen the flames of immortal power?
Mastikator 2 years ago
Have you ever danced with the devil in the pale moonlight?
int3rl0per 2 years ago 2
No but I got crabs in the pale moonlight from a she-devil
mediametalhead 2 years ago 2
Not bad, but the one I woke up beside one hung-over morning scared the devil right out of me.
int3rl0per 2 years ago
All I heard was "Girl Guides... Touch... Me..."
Man Penn I I'm with ya all the WAY!
makaisenki 2 years ago
ah, Penn, changing the world one tube atta time. gotta love it : )
HammerQQ 2 years ago 3
Does anyone know if Bullshit will ever be available on DVD in the UK and Ireland? It's never broadcast over here, except at really obscure times, and I'd love to own it on DVD.
padraic2001eire 2 years ago
Don't laugh if this is a stupid suggestion, but can you purchase things from Amazon in the UK?
tylerjamesstephens 2 years ago
You can, but then they'd be Region 1, and you'd have to have a multiregion player, which not everyone has. It would be much easier to release the DVDs in the UK.
padraic2001eire 2 years ago
I see. I had no idea there was a regional difference in DVDs.
You learn something new every day.
tylerjamesstephens 2 years ago
yeah, amazon does not sell most of the items. companys put their items on amazon - so if the company ships to you, then yes you can get it in the uk bro.
ProtoRyu 2 years ago
Did you see the NYT story "Scouts Train to Fight Terrorists, and More" on the Boy scouts explorer programs training with homeland security?
sharpsteve2003 2 years ago
I don't know what your issue is Penn. The purpose of the boy scouts/girl scouts it to inspire nationalism and militarism.
Now if you are opposed to 'scouts' on a fundamental level that's fine, but why criticise an organization for carrying out the exact purpose it was created for?
Cailwyn 2 years ago
WRONG... The whole and sole purpose of Scouting is to have a good time and learning stuff.
Nationalism is fine to a point but teaching respect for others and other cultures is better.
Also Scouting has nothing to do with militarism. Its just that most outdoors activities like hiking, wall climbing etc. are also practiced by the army/police.
Smertopia 2 years ago 3
He has a problem with the boyscouts taking public funds for private practices (enjoying private exclusion while taking funds from the very people they might wish to exclude)
That was not the exact purpose it was created for. It was added after the church took over.
Girl Scouts he likes.
makaisenki 2 years ago
What realy bugs me about this video is nothing that Penn said, i totaly agree with him.
What realy bugs me, is that although i concider myself an atheist, when reading the Title "Godless Girl Guides" i thought he would talk about Guides for being a naughty / 'bad' Girl.
That for me reading godless, could be associated with being 'bad' / naughty realy disturbes me....
0ptimismPrime 2 years ago
You had the option of substituting in "faith" instead of "God" when I was a Girl Guide. The girls that had neither were screwed though.
HappyOrangeGnome 2 years ago
Why do athiests have such a problem with private religious groups that aren't churches? Noone has to be a boy scout, or a girl guide.
thereal87 2 years ago
But they're getting funding from the government, and excluding homosexuals, who are actually kind of paying the boy scouts, is bullshit
thebishopoffunk 2 years ago
Are you sure there's no compulsion? Somebody should have told me.
MartinJWillett 2 years ago
Speaking as a Canadian woman, thanks. That always bugged me about the girl guides. That and ugly uniform.
littleoutrage 2 years ago
You know what is really bullshit Penn, uploading these videos in HD, even though most people don''t have High Speed connections.That is fucking bullshit. Please just upload these how you used too.
tfh962 2 years ago
Go to your account in "Account Settings/Playback Setup" and select a playback setting that suits your speed.
NoDeity 2 years ago
thanks man. I did not know about this. Cheers.
tfh962 2 years ago
You're welcome.
NoDeity 2 years ago
You have the option of watching it in lower quility. Hit the "HQ" button.
HappyOrangeGnome 2 years ago
Awesome Penn! I been saying this for quite a while. Patriotism is great but nationalism sucks. A person should have a lot of respect for the Constitution and the principles of America. But I really do not think United States is #1, as many people who like to say. I go so far to say that burning the United States flag is the highest form of patiortism. Thus, there should not no pledge, it sounds to nationalistic to me.
ArtinEmil 2 years ago
I pledge Allegiance to the Constitution of the United States of America and to the values for which it stand One Nation, indivisible, with Liberty and Justice for All.
That's my pledge! Because the flag is just a symbol of the country, the Constitution is the affirmation of our freedom and my allegiance lies in that, regardless of which country I live in.
FraggedMind 2 years ago
Umm... The Constitution is a piece of paper, just as the flag is a piece of fabric! How about "I pledge allegiance to the values of the United States..."
labmut11891 2 years ago
I quit Boy Scouts cause I was a lazy fat nerd lolz.
GermanGangrel 2 years ago 2
I'm a Canadian Girl Guide, and even though the promise does state; God(faith) and Canada,
I have always said I promise to be true to myself, and Canada,
because I don't believe in religion, an do not think i should be required to make a reference to a belief I do not have, and no one has a probblem with it. (:
woahhmaya 2 years ago
woohoo!
Napstrpsx 2 years ago
I totally agree with the pledge of allegiance
there's this adult at my school that tries to guilt me and my class mates for not standing, putting our hands on our hearts, and repeating the pledge everyday.
yes, people did die for our safety and security, but this isn't the Fascist States of America
AtheriasLeader 2 years ago
i dont say it
i put my hand on my heart ans stand up because were forced, but i dont say anything, i just fake saying it
killblade99 2 years ago
I don't do anything.
I mutter to myself when she says "I am so disappointied"
AtheriasLeader 2 years ago
i say one nation under Satan(or greed, plastic, or the dollar)
Petethegreat36 2 years ago
Actually the Girl Scouts do make a reference to God. Here's a quote from their website:
The Girl Scout Promise
On my honor, I will try: To serve God* and my country, To help people at all times, And to live by the Girl Scout Law.
* The word "God" can be interpreted in a number of ways, depending on one's spiritual beliefs. When reciting the Girl Scout Promise, it is okay to replace the word "God" with whatever word your spiritual beliefs dictate.
chemgirlie 2 years ago
When I was actively in girl scouts, I always substituted the word "humanity" if place of "God", and that was good.
I've always thought it was wonderful that the Girl Scouts decided to become more inclusive.
Britt3x3 2 years ago
yeah another victory for logical moral atheists!!!!!
suck it christfags ur god is fake and ur faith is 2!!!!!
Emmzeepwnzor 2 years ago
Comment removed
Icharys 2 years ago
This comment has received too many negative votes show
Love ya Penn - but I gotta go against you on this one......
On my honor, I will do my best, to do my duty, to God and my country, and to obey the Scout Law, to help other people at all times; to keep myself physically fit; mentally awake; and morally strait.
avermillion 2 years ago
If you are an atheist, you can't be a boy scout. So obviously you aren't atheist. If you aren't atheist you are DEFINATLY not "mentally awake." The scout law is self-defeating.
Solar2 2 years ago
I disagree.
avermillion 2 years ago
"If you aren't atheist you are DEFINATLY not 'mentally awake.'"
Come on, there are plenty of people who aren't religious but do believe in god, a higher power, or some sort of universal spirit whom I have no qualms with at all. To say that only atheists can be considered "metally awake" is very untrue.
I'm an atheist myself, so don't worry. : )
MagnusIan 2 years ago
Good points!
avermillion 2 years ago