look i couldnt do that but these women have chosen this so different strokes for different folks, my only concern would be the kids would be singled out for ridicule
Also the choice would not be unilateral, so it's just me putting my girl through it, it's both of us WILLINGLY putting ourself through that situation assuming that jealousy will be a big problem.
Jealousy is a human emotion but not all jealousy is good. A poly person getting jealous over their partner screwing/loving another SPOUSE is bad jealousy. That's how the relationship is suppose to go assuming that it was done in honesty and the people involved wanted it. I'd say the people need to work on resolving their jealousy although some women in poly say that the benefits of the companionship outweigh the jealousy. They work like best friends and not jealous rivals.
The only way I wouldn't go through polygamy due to jealousy is if I could tell the future and know that my girl would never get over it. Going into polygamy, I would expect that there would be benefits to the whole marriage overall, and that we'll be able to work through problems just like any other couple would have to when confronted with jealousy. I don't make decisions out of insecurity but rather I'm willing to fight it if I want we all want it real bad.
7 billion people are crammed onto this earth, eating, using fossil fuels and destroying the ozone. In 30 years we will be at 20 billion. If you want to have 3 wives, fine, just FUCKING LIMIT the offspring to 1 each or something. These people are more disgusting for recklessly reproducing than having more than one wife.
@gateauxQ Your going off without anything to back you up but that's okay, that is normal for environmental extremists. As for population growth...tell you what, you have no kids and I will post here and urge the polygamists to have an extra two kids to replace you and your genetic code. Simple Darwinian logic, right?
I have nothing against having more than one wife or husband at one time.
i just wonder, for example would vikkis daughter also call valeri mom? or just valeri? just curious the thought never crossed my mind before tonight. i would thing vikkis daughter would call valeri just valeri
@maritsa1992 I think they are comparing it because there is a widely held assumption that most polygamy in the U.S. is happening in the FLDS or similar groups. They are trying to debunk that misconception.
They learn about there emotions? Sounds like they have to repress there emotions more -_- and constantly have to work and do things with there children . Never getting a break to just stop and think
Just because someone has jealousy doesn't mean they dont' want a relationship which is the same for jealousy in monogamy. There's good and bad jealousy, and people need to work on resolving teh bad jealousy in polygamy just as they would in monogamy. Jealousy is in part based on social standards, which is why not everyone gets jealousy for the same reason and frequency/intensity. Swingers are on one spectrum and insecure control freaks are on the other side.
Ironic that the haters of Mitt (he is Mormon) are praising Jesus and telling the flock that despite Newt's questionable past, affairs and his strange dislike of the poor that he is the one to vote for. Heck, I would easily vote for any of these polygamist women over the new "Jesus candidate." PS. I doubt Jesus would endorse Newt.
This is not the only model of North American polygamy. There are many others which are under the "radar" of the mainstream media. Different strokes for different folks..
After it was "officially" stopped the Romney's fled the US to Mexico (illegally) to keep polygamy. Romney's dad was the 1st Mexican-American candidate for POTUS.
Romney is a Mormon bishop, a descendant of 1 of the original Joe Smith apostles and whose g-gramps illegally fled to Mexico to stay ahead of US law (he STILL had cousins in Mexico - look it up!)
One gramps who married his 12th wife got shot dead by the husband of of the last woman he had a "celestial" marriage with.
In 1 Corinthians 7:10-11, Paul says not to divorce but then he mentions an exception of condition of if if the divorce does occur. Paul mentions for the woman to remain unmarried or be reconciled to her husband. If divorce was a sin then Paul wouldn't be telling anyone to remain in a divorced state or unmarried. Jesus elaborates in the Gospels the conditions of where someone can divorce AND remarry. So if divorce is still allowed then why not polygamy IF both weren't in God's original plan?
I hope that you're beginning to realize that you will NOT convince many, if anyone, that you speak truth when you DODGE, lie, and ignore evidence. Would you believe a liar and an unreasonable person? If you can I'd like you to answer my points to you about King David and his poly marriage along with why God still allows divorce when it was not in his original plan.
the scripture; judge not lest you be judges just jumps out at me... More power to folks that can do it and be spiritually correct in accordance to God's word. I could def see how it could be hard and at the same time see the otherside of that coin... Living a Christian life inherently makes life all the harder. Since the world hated Jesus, will the world not hate you for Loving him? In the end its just another piece of tape trying to enact control over person's. the reason its "unlawful"
Actually the only wife of David's that God did not accept was Bethshiba wasn't it?? You know the one Sin that David fell to, lust. But other than that Most biblical person's had multiple wives... and you could even take it further, in the beginning it was only adam and eve, after they had kids how else was the world to be populated? and most marriages within the bible were within a given family, an uncles daughter or having be in relation through a family tree to some extent.
to the death of His son to save us all. at any point in scripture God spoke of ANY change to His plan. and since His will is SOVEREIGN we have no just cause to add our own selfish, emotional, misguided teachings. test what you THINK you know and what you have been told by using scripture and any Greek and Hebrew TRANSLATIONS, not opinions, to help you understand what the English language looses in it's translations. scripture is perfect and complete. God doesn't need added laws for His plan.
to the death of His son to save us all. at any point in scripture God spoke of ANY change to His plan. and since His will is SOVEREIGN we have no just cause to add our own selfish, emotional, misguided teachings. test what you THINK you know and what you have been told by using scripture and any Greek and Hebrew TRANSLATIONS, not opinions, to help you understand what the English language looses in it's translations. scripture is perfect and complete. God doesn't need added laws for His plan.
to the death of His son to save us all. at any point in scripture God spoke of ANY change to His plan. and since His will is SOVEREIGN we have no just cause to add our own selfish, emotional, misguided teachings. test what you THINK you know and what you have been told by using scripture and any Greek and Hebrew TRANSLATIONS, not opinions, to help you understand what the English language looses in it's translations. scripture is perfect and complete. God doesn't need added laws for His plan.
@Indiohue Polypride 3 makes a good point. you like to use God's "original plan" as the foundation for your persecution of polgyny. he pointed out that God's "original plan" for marriage was not divorce, however He made a way for divorce to be possible and still be according to His will. this change of God's plan is one example of God changing His "mind" according to His will. another would be the sacrificing of animals and obedience to the law as means to salvation, cont'd
I emailed Indigo about this point regarding God still allowing divorce and I reposted it here again. I have not gotten a response yet including a response for the King David point that I posted here probably a week ago.
@marcusdhouston I am with you except God does not and never did change his mind on divorce. Paul said remain unmarried! i.e. if U remarry U R committing adultery. the only way out was n still is death. But no one follows that teaching yet they look down on people who practice polygamy. It's all about control of the Masses. If I keep U guity I keep U in my pews for money!!! Mal 2:16; Mat 19:6,9; 1Cor 7:10,11,39; LUKE 16:8. 2Sam 12:8 and Num 23:19. I don't get y people r so angry?
Go brag to your monogamy-only friends about how you ignore and DODGE the King David issue to make your point. No different than a CROOKED detective who hides evidence to hide the truth as it is.
I thought you said you were leaving this issue alone but here you are again. You've come up with no response to my answers to you and still have the same UNproven points. Seeing how much of a mismatch or how STUPID some of your views are compared to other people here, I can only conclude that you like being beaten up (mentally). If you intend on convincing OTHERS (esp. people who test for truth) instead of just yourself, then I hope you can demonstrate more than just UNPROVEN points
"Come out from the OT times where women were like chattel". Last I recall, women were like chattel up until a few centuries ago although in some countries they are STILL like chattel. Only 'recently' has there been a value for equal rights. So saying that polygamy was the cause of woman suppression is FALSE since poly did not exist predominantly in the US and yet we found racial and gender suprresion under a MONOGAMY enforced system.
And that's the problem with a lot of Christians today. They don't think for themselves and TEST what doctrine they're being fed which opens them up to be easily misled. That's what you get when you have a follow-the-crowd mentality.
So Indigohue made the claim that King David repented of polygamy by giving up all of his wives. I've showed her evidence to the contrary and she still has not answered or at least admit that she was wrong. I honestly will only engage with her beyond that topic if I'm bored or as practice in reasoning about biblical polygamy and common objections. Otherwise I'm going to keep reminding her about all of her unanswered points.
And if polygamy is a sin or adultery, then by your logic that's what God did. One tip here is that if God is good and perfect, then seeing how He dealt with people should serve as examples and elaboration on His Law since His acts should carry out His law or be compatible to them. Name one polygamists that God called an adulterer. I can name you one polygamists that he called an adulterer ONLY when that polygamist took another man's wife (King David).
@ Indigohue if you are referring to Mat 5:28 it is all about covetousness and idolatry. How could a single man (everyone who looks at a woman - means everyone, not just a married man) look at a single woman and commit adultery? "with lustful intent" is covetousness, and covetousness is idolatry Eph 5:5 and God considers idolatry to be adultery Eze 23:37. Get it? Mat 5:28 has nothing whatsoever to do with Polygyny. Covetousness=idolatry=adultery.
Jesus is saying a man does not have to commit the "act" to be guilty of adultery, a man is just as guilty when he looks at a woman to lust after her. "Lust" meaning to have a strong desire for , to possess & dominate completely.
A man can admire a woman for her beauty, but to lust with the eyes is adultery of the heart.
@Indigohue please tell me...how is it that a single man looking at a single woman with lustful intent falls into the heathen (or even the biblical) definition of adultery? It doesn't. The passage does NOT specify a married man or a married woman. The church and our pagan Romanized society do not understand adultery from a biblical perspective. If you have other verses to prove what "Jesus is saying" in this verse I would be interested in them, otherwise it seems to only be opinion.
Too bad that you think the words of Jesus Christ are just an opinion Jesus then goes on to say in the next verse that if your eye causes you to sin, gourge it out, for it is better to enter eternal life with one eye, than go into hell with two., where the fire is never quenched.
That's how seriously Jesus takes adultery. You would be wise not to trifle with his commandments.
@Indigohue "Jesus is saying" (your words/interpretation I question...not His) ...so you think mutilating your body will change the heart? Lust is not cured by removing body parts, and that is not what Jesus is saying. A blind man is still capable of lust. These verses are some of the most misunderstood in the bible. I would suggest you do an in-depth study on them.
Hi Scarecrow.. I hope you're doing well. I've been discussing polygamy with Indigohue for days now. She has a hard time admitting when she's wrong and she usually dodges points that she can't answer by changing the subject and hoping that you'll forget about the previous unanswered point. I try to keep her on ONE topic at a timeto make it easier to point out when she's wrong and so she won't dodge.
@PolyPride3 Hello back at ya. Keep in mind that until the Holy Spirit reveals the truth people are usually blind to it. It is very difficult for someone that was taught and believes in the monogamy doctrine to see the truths in the scriptures about marriage/divorce. Keep praying and keep up the good work educating them - sooner or later some of them will get it.
It's an analagy, duh! He's not saying you literally have to cut off limbs. What He is saying is you have to "cut off" the sources of your temptations. He has already said that a man who looks at another women with lust is guilty of adultery, the eyes also lust when they are used to look at pornography.
His clear message is, if you don't stop sinning you are in danger of eternal hellfire.
Eph 5:5 For you may be sure of this, that everyone who is sexually immoral or impure, or who is covetous (that is, an idolater), has no inheritance in the kingdom of Christ and God.
Eze 23:37 For they have committed adultery, and blood is on their hands. With their idols they have committed adultery, and they have even offered up to them for food the children whom they had borne to me.
@Indigohue Show me the chapter and verse to prove that polygyny is a sin? If you can then all the men including Abraham, David, Gideon, etc... are sinful and sexually immoral. If that is the case then none of them are in heaven:
1Co 6:9-10 Or do you not know that the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived: neither the sexually immoral, etc...will inherit the kingdom of God.
Either you are right and they are in hell...or you are wrong - you are wrong.
I've already spent too much time debating this subject.I'm not being drawn into any more discussion.
Christianity does not recognize polygamy as legal. It is considered highly immoral and wholly incompatible with Christ's teaching. You will not find a single verse where Jesus condones polygamy.
If you can't and won't accept that then it's your risk. Don't keep trying to justify yourself to me, it's God you have to face on Judgment Day.
@Indigohue Western Civilization does not recognize polygamy as 'legal' but some countries recognize gay marriage and even prostitution as being okay. So much for legalities. You will not find a single verse of God CONDEMNING bestiality and rape in the NT because those are already covered in the law, just like polygamy. This is how silly the monogamy-ONLY believers are to me if you're the best they've got.
Do you have a response to your claim about King David and polygamy that takes into account the evidence I presented to you some days ago? This reflects a dishonest character in you when you sit there and lie about Scripture despite being shown evidence. There's no way I will put much credibility or stock in people who are of your type.
Just what part of goodbye don't you understand? You may have vast amounts of time to spend discussing something that is both illegal and immoral, but I don't.
You're still here aren't you? I frequent this video and other videos when I'm on Youtube. If you have nothing reasonable to contribute then perhaps you should consider not responding.
@Indigohue You will not find one verse where He condemns it either. How does that by default then make it sinful? Since it was commonly practiced at the time I think Jesus would have addressed it if it were sinful in any way. The false monogamy doctrine of the church developed from 200 to 600 AD and is the result of Satan's influence on the church.
@Indigohue the RELIGION OF CHRISTIANITY doesn't recognize polygamy. you appear to have trouble showing any scripture outlawing polygyny specifically. the only form of polygamy i have found to be sinful in the EYES OF GOD is the woman having more than one husband. there are several references of a man having more than one wife yet there are none showing a woman having more than one husband. this is called ADULTERY in plain text.
If making claims you can't back up, and DODGING points, and not admitting points were a sin, you'd be in Hell by now. But fortunately, all you get from that is just making yourself look stupid. Which is why if you were bold enough to debate me in a FORMAL debate or in court, you wouldn't get away with half the BS you've been telling me here. Do you have anything to answer for King David or explain why an UNrepentant polygamists can get away with being blessed?
@Indigohue Biblically speaking spoken vows have never been a part of marriage. once the one flesh bond has occurred the two have entered a covenant with God and are held by HIS requirements. can you site scripture explaining where "marriage vows" are required under God. the vows you speak of uphold the eternal bond of husband and wife according to God's will. it doesn't forbid polygyny. if you understand marriage you understand it is eternal without the need for spoken vows.
Your point to Scarecrow still doesn't touch on the point of what adultery is. Yes, the passage talks about adultery but what is adultery according to what the BIBLE writers (not your modern-day lawmakers) meant. To NOT commit adultery stretches across BOTH OT and NT so you can't isolate this as just an NT issue, anyways (Romans 7:7). Wouldn't it be uncharacteristic of God to describe himself as an adulterer esp. to make a point about someone else committing adultery on him?
You men on here are spiritually lost. I'm not wasting anymore time on this subject. Suffice to say, polygamy has never been recognized as legitimate by the Church since it’s earliest Father’s.
If you disagree with me that's fine, you can take all your excuses and put them before God on Judgment Day. If you are willing to gamble your eternal security on this matter, then it's entirely your choice.
Throughout history some Christians (not necessarily everyone) disagreed with polygamy but sometimes it was for PERSONAL reasons. It's clear that the Bible is the authoritative source for Christians and it's clear that the Apostles nor Jesus mentioned STOP engaging in polygamy. So if anyone is going to tell me that polygamy is wrong, they're going to have to show me going by the authoritative source rather than expecting me to believe them just because they say so. cont'd
@Indigohue if you carefully look at the Greek definition, which the NT was written before being translated to English, it says lust is a FORBIDDEN desire. i see that is was also accurately and plainly spelled out by Scarecrow to include covetousness (10th commandment) and idolatry (2nd & 3rd commandment). you refuse to accept the Biblical definition of adultery as being involved with, coveting, and/or lusting for another man's wife. this is in balance with every OT law concerning adultery.
You need to re-read the words that came out of the mouth of Jesus Himself. It's quite simple to understand and he makes it crystal clear. Jesus raised the moral standard by which ALL men must live.
You can play this dangerous game of opposing the clear message from Christ, but you do so at your own risk.
Narrow is the way that leads to eternal life and broad is the path that leads to destruction.
@Indigohue umm...Jesus never married. is this the moral standard you speak of. it is clear Jesus never spoke out against polygyny, however he did speak out against divorcing your wife for other than sexual immorality and lusting for another man's wife. you appear to be following the "broad" belief of monogamy only and we are following the "narrow" path of truth. When in Rome, do as the Romans do.
Jesus speaks to us by virtue of our conscience, which is why polygamy is so morally repulsive to all of humanity except a fringe group of men who cannot control their fallen carnal nature
I don't have to justify monogamy, no one does, but that is what God ordained from the beginning.
This is a battle you are fighting with your Creator, your're just to blind to see it, that's why you can't let it drop.
@Indigohue Good to know you have God's twitter account. Come on man, are you saying that truth is statistical? if so, what do you think would have been the results of an opinion poll in ancient Judea if the people have been asked if Jesus should have been crucified? Monogamy is the norm because of a variety of factors, but the Bible should not be one of them since it does not condemn polygamy.
Monogamy is the norm because it is not only what God ordained in his orginal directive, it also harmonizes with people's conscience. The 10 Commandments are God's moral laws that He wrote on our hearts and to which our conscience bears witness. .
THAT is why polygamy is repulsive to all true Christians.
Come out of OT times when women were mere chattel and step into the Truth of the Gospel of Jesus Christ who NEVER gave his blessing or approval for polygamy.
Monogamy is not the norm but rather 2 people per marriage is the norm. You have yet to refute me on this point and many other points which shows how cowardly and dishonest you are and why I have NO pity for you when you make yourself look STUPID. You say polygamy is repulsive to ALL Christians, and I ask for a CREDIBLE source to that esp. considering that you have a few Christians here who disagree with you.
@Indigohue Jews only gave up practicing polygamy in Europe due to persecution from Christians. So it seems they kept polygamy t´for thousands of years without the benefit of your "enlightened" analysis. If you support women being free are they not free to choose polygamy if they like?
@Indigohue please site specifically where God "ORDAINED' monogamy as his "ORIGINAL" directive. this "ORIGINAL" and "ORDAINED" directive appears to be missing from my Bible. maybe i can borrow yours. what we are telling you is CONGRUENT with everything in scripture according to GODS will. and "TRUE" Christians understand the completeness of scripture and WILL NOT add personal opinions and blasphemously call it the "ORDAINED ORIGINAL DIRECTIVE". you continue, as a majority of so-called cont'd
@Indigohue Christians do, is ASSUME God made a mistake and accepted a man having more than one wife as good and lawful according to His will. according to your logic and other so-called Christians God turned a blind eye to polygyny and gave wives to David, accepted Jacob's wives, Abraham's wives, and it wasn't until what we now call modern times was polygamy of any sort was outlawed; BY MAN. what is REPULSIVE to God is Harlotry, Prostitution, and Sodomy. scripture outlaws such acts. cont's
@Indigohue cont'd...however, i did not find polygynist on the list of those who would not inherit the kingdom of God. from what i have gathered from you logic, a man can only have one mate during his life time. by your logic, if he married again that would make him a sinful polygamist. would not your logic uphold this? only the woman is commanded to only have one husband during her lifetime barring death or a lawful Godly divorce. i've found nothing similar for the man. CHRISTIANS know this.
There are actually BOTH men and woman out there who agree with polygamy. They are a fringe group in WESTERN civilization. You're really exaggerating and are only resorting to statsistics from your opinion. If Jesus speaks to EVERYONE in their conscience, then why do nearly 50% of Americans agree with gay marriage?
@Indigohue monogamy only is a Greco-Roman practice and law, however these were some of the most adulterous people around at the time. not only were they guilty of adultery but sodomy as well. if you read Paul's letters you will see exactly what can be proven through scripture and history books. today's society is a perfect picture of what the "monogamy only" brought about by Roman Catholic doctrine has done to every culture throughout history. God never COMMANDED any man to be with only 1 wife.
While polygamy may have been “legal” in the Mosaic civil law, there was no provision for it in the ‘original’ helpmate directive (Genesis 2:18-24) which demonstrated that God’s original “idea” & intent for humanity was clearly monogamy.
What's wrong with you anyway? Why isn't one woman enough?
Truth is you just want to engage in sexual relations with mutliple women & do it under an umbrella of respectability. Thank God it's illegal, men like you need therapy.
@Indigohue So the mosaic Law, which in some instances carried the death penalty for certain statutes, was imperfect in showing what God intended for mankind? Who was at fault then, Moses or God?
Also, in today's society aman can legally have sex with any woman of legal age. If a man wanted to do that he would not need polygamy. In fact, with polygamy he has to assume responsibility over a very large number of children as well as keep up with all his wives for all their lives.
Your point about the helpmate directive of Genesis 2:18-23 assumes monogamy when the directive is more general than that since it leaves room for PLURAL marriage. You also assume that God's plan for marriage was FULLY revealed at that time for Adam and Eve when that is not the case. If you keep reading your Bible, even before the law was given we find people engaging in polygamy and God even intervening to improve polygamy like with Jacob in Genesis 29:30-32.
God's original plan for marriage involved no divorce and now divorce is allowed. His original plan also involved egalitarianism where there was equality between hubby and wife but that changed to patriarchy and it's still allowed. The NT reinforces the man being the head. So we see all of these deviations from God original plan, some of which God changed himself, so why wouldn't polygamy be allowed just as divorce and patriarchal marriage are still allowed?
@Indigohue so now i see what the problem is."why isn't one woman enough" is a feminist view of marriage not a SCRIPTURAL ACCEPTANCE. the monogamy only doctrine plays to your "emotions" and not the CONTENT of scripture. monogamy only preachers are taking it upon themselves to outlaw a form of marriage never spoken against in scripture. these same people have exalted monogamy to worship and do so in the name of God. we've been warned to not do this.
@Indigohue okay, here again we have a case of eisegesis. You cannot tell me that as you read that you saw one man one woman! Furthermore, God took the effort to layout the law to Moses in maticulous detail as well as the provisions for the place of worship. He gave everything about husband wife relationships. Why did he leave out the number of wives? Why does God tell David I gave you your masters wives (Plural) 2Sam 12:8? Why is it always about sex for those against the practice?
God did NOT call David an 'adulterer' when he was taking concubines and multiple wives. He only called David an adulterer after he took Bathsheba and it is because she was a MARRIED woman. Also please explain why would God choose to describe Himself as an adulterer when he mentions being in a 'polygamous' marriage with Israel.
The way I know biblical adultery only relates to a MARRIED woman going outside of her ONE spouse is because that's how it's described in the law. Another way I know is by looking up the word "adultery" in the Hebrew language which sets what the writers of the Bible meant. The Hebrew word is "na aph" so please look it up. You'll see that it means "a woman that breaks wedlock" or "sleeping with another man's wife." God's dealings with polygamists supports this.
I've already covered this point with you. If what you were saying was correct then a married man looking at his wife lustfully would be committing adultery? This is why logically and based on precedenet which we find in the OT, we have to understand that Jesus was talking about a SPECIFIC type of woman and not just any woman. ANd that woman would be another man's wife. So if a man lust after a MARRIED woman or another man's wife, then he's committing adultery
A man can look at his wife( singular) lustfully. Within the framework of a monogamous marriage that is normal.
Now if that married man looks lustfully at another woman other than his wife, he has committed adultery in his heart. A polygamist is an adulterer AND a liar because he breaks his marriage vows to his first wife and actively lusts after other women.
Jesus said "If you love me, you will keep my commandments".
Your comment, "a man can look at his wife (singular) lustfully" is NOT mentioned in Matthew 5:28. Unless you can show me where Jesus mentioned the word "wife" let alone the singular form of it in Matthew 5:28. The verse as it stands by itself is vague unless you take it in light of what adultery is according TO GOD and it's clear that it is when a man sleeps with a MARRIED woman. Otherwise, can you show me an example of God calling adultery a MARRIED man sleeping with a woman?
There's already almost 50% of the US population who approve of gay marriage. So I'm sure it won't be too long more before people start also becoming more open to adult CONSENSUAL polygamy.
Also, laws aren't based on Christianity, otherwise laws like race-based slavery would've never made it into law. Did you know in the US, interracial marriages used to be illegal? So please, consider what you're saying before you insult Christianity any further. And lets not forget, all laws are subject to change and there are some coming to see polygamy as a good option since it can be practiced without harm so EVENTUALLY we may be in the majority.
why do some people(law makers fer example) tend to think they have a right to tell me whom i can and can not love? i was BORN a bisexual polygamist. my brain is wired that way. oh, and i'm not a fundamintalist mormon, i'm a roman catholic. Jesus Christ loves EVERYONE and died for everyone's salvation. merry christmas. hugz! :) xoxoxoxo
@sweetguy410 if you believe that then you know that repentance of sin is a requirement. YES, Jesus loves us all, however to knowingly engage in bisexual lifestyle is sinful. God said this is an ABOMINATION in His eyes. Jesus loves me yet if i continue to live a lifestyle contrary to scripture I will not receive salvation. Romans 1:26-32. this is not a judgement just an observation. be well and merry Christmas to you as well.
The fact is that you tried to use societal laws as a basis to dismiss Marcus' using the Bible to justify polygamy as if societal laws were always moral in God's eyes. The reality is they are NOT. And it seems you have a real crappy way of admitting that you were wrong on that when you follow YOUR OWN logic which led to gay marriage and prostitution.
By the way, prostitution is legal in Brazil, does that mean prostitution is okay in God's eyes? I know these things are legal but that doesn't mean we have to engage in them. But when you say they are also 'moral' esp. in God's eyes, you're saying that Christians can engage in prostitution and gay marriage. ANd of course you are VERY wrong here and you obviously want to use ANY PETTY argument to preserve your monogamy-ONLY view at all cost. That's sad.
None of those things are morally right, but the world is increasing in wickedness as predicted in the bible during the end times, so it's hardly surprising. However we were discussing polygamy and it has no place in Christianity today. The fact remains that it's illegal. So I'll guess you'll just have to put that in your pipe and smoke it.
@Indigohue the argument has not be whether it was illegal or not. We all no man laws forbid a man from having more than one wife yet allows gay marriage and men to not be responsible for their many sexual encounters. man's idea of morality is based upon his laws alone. however God has given us a PERFECT blueprint to live by. when CHRISTIANS abide by God's law we are held to a much higher standard. please understand, man's law is flawed and will ultimately lead all who follow to ruin.
@Indigohue what Jesus said is that a man can not divorce his wife without JUST cause. he never specifically establishes whether said man has one or more wives.what i can and will show you is a verse from the OT which Jesus himself help orchestrate (John 1:1-4) Deut. 22:28-29 tells the story. it never says whether this man is married or unmarried. it doesn't have to. either way a man is responsible for any woman he bonds himself with. polygamy or monogamy are not used in scripture only MARRIAGE.
Now you are just embarrassing yourself with flawed hermeneutics. John 1 1-4 is stating that Jesus has always existed right from the beginning of Creation. It has nothing to do with marriage.
Talk to pastor about this, & not one from the emergent church either. You are spiritually lost on this matter.
Polygamy is illegal, adulterous & immoral, so why are you wasting all your time on this matter?
Forget about it and spend your time more productively serving God.
@Indigohue laughable. you know exactly the point i was making yet you continue to duck and dodge. adultery is laying with a WOMAN WHO IS EITHER BETROTHED OR MARRIED TO A HUSBAND. this is not illegal in mans law because no one ever receives any punishment for this SIN against God. so please, try to pull that on someone who doesn't understand scripture. a Godly marriage is not immoral yet the laws of man which you covet allow Gay marriage to be moral and legal. i will continue to speak the truth.
To go by what adultery is to God you need to go by what He revealed in the Bible. Look up the word adultery in the 'ORIGINAL" language that the writers wrote in and you'll see that adultery is when a woman sleeps with someone other than her husband. They way modern-day society defines things do NOT always reflect God's perspective unless you mean to tell me that defining marriage as a guy and a guy would be a meaning God would also accept.
Are you going to admit that you were wrong in your claims about King David and polygamy? Are you at least working on a response that takes into account the evidence that I've presented? If you can't be honest on a matter as easy as this, why should I trust taking our conversation to other aspects of polygamy? It seems you're nothing but a PUPPET for the UNREASONABLE thinking leaders at the top who spoon feed the "CROWD" or "majority" what to believe.
@Indigohue last time i checked scripture, adultery was defined and widely accepted as being having sex or coveting the wife of another man or a wife having sex with someone other than her husband. no where does it mention a husband and a virgin woman. i can give you the scripture to back my claim. can you? please prove me wrong on my definition. i grow tired of you using man's secular definitions and doctrines to defend your beliefs. once again, bring hard evidence to prove your claim.
@Indigohue check yourself. continue allowing man made laws and religious doctrines to lead you by the nose. these LAWS continue to blind you to things GOD has deemed moral and immoral according to HIS WILL. every example of adultery in scripture involves a MARRIED woman. one last scripture and you can have the last word (1Corinthians 10:23-32) i will not continue to point out scriptural truths if you will not acknowledge them. live by your own convictions.
@Indigohue please understand, marriage is both monogamous and polygynous as both require the man to be responsible and uphold the covenant he has entered. this is the reason for Exodus 21:10 and Deut 22:28. no specifics need to be made since the ONE FLESH BOND is what is important to God and not the number of women involved. just as we all bond ourselves with one God as our head, women may do the same with a husband. as we all come together to be one with the body of Christ and it's members.
@Indigohue our arguments have been based on MORALITY not LEGALITY. and you have continued on your crusade to use MAN'S flawed concept of law and morals to refute and deny scriptural integrity. since the world has put marriage in the incapable hands of man, gay marriages are okay. man's laws have made abortion legal as well. how long will we allow Satan to penetrate and destroy the sanctity of God's word.
@Indigohue Just because jesus chose a monogamous marriage as an example 4 if you spell to marriage doesn't mean everyone else have to do the same. Just as god chose a polygamous marriage as an example of his marriage to Israel does not mean everyone else had to marry in polygamy. Both marriages were examples and not instructions for marriage
Please look up the video "Sexual revolution and alternative lifestyles in the future" to see that polygamy will gain ground in the western world due more to economic realities than to religion.
In fact in 1 Kings 1:28-31 we see David having encounters with Bathsheeba still which means he did not put away all of his wives. According to 1 Chronicles 3:1-9, David had 7 wives if you count and it also mentions his concubines as being separate when it mentions the word "besides" in 1 Chronicles 3:9. David is just one person because people like Jacob never divorced any of his wives neither nor do I recall reading anything about him putting away his concubines.
David put his concubines into seclusion but that doesn't necessarily mean divorce but can just mean separated from them. Also, there is a difference between a woman called a wife and a woman called a 'concubine'. Concubines are more like unoffical wives or some may say a mistress and some were supported just as much as a wife. That's why wives are often labelled separate from concubines. Solomon had 700 wives and 300 concubines, and it's written just like that in 1 Kings 11:2-3 and other areas
God says he'd take David's wives because of that sin which was ADULTERY. That's why it mentions you did it in "SECRET" in 2 Samuel 12:12. So what did David do in secret if you read the context, IN SECRET he slept with another man's wife, so in the OPEN someone will sleep with David's wives. Notice that David was married polygamously before he met Bathsheeba and God never mentioned punishing him then, and it was only after he took Bathsheeba becuz of the way he took her.
You say God's original plan was for one man and one woman in a monogamous marriage. The word "monogamous" is not in the text and the Bible does not mention how many marriages a person can have. So that just means that there's 2 people in a marriage or PER marriage and therefore polygamy has to be practiced as more than one marriage.
When are you going STICK to ONE topic? Please answer for your claim. Prove where God took away David's wives and for POLYGAMY. I've been asking for proof of this ONE topic for days and you thought you could slip out of it but I'm bringing it right back in your face till you answer it or admit you were full of you know what.
When are you going to own up to having a sex addiction?
God took David's wives away for Adultery. (2 Samuel 12:11). But David repented of his sins against the Almighty after this and never practised polygamy again either.. Notice that repentance is always followed by a change of heart. He also put away his concubines. Jesus called the Jews of the day an “adulterous generation” who chose to live outside of God’s rules and, instead, made their own.
You use 2 Samuel 12:11 to say that God punished David for polygamy. God did mention letting someone sleep with David's wives but it was NOT for polygamy. If you read the context which starts from 2 Samuel 11:2-5, 14, 15, 26, and 27 you'll notice David's sin was sleeping with another man's wife (Uriah's wife, Bathsheeba) and how David conspired to have Uriah killed so he can have Bathsheeba for himself. Notice right after that Incident that's when God sent a prophet to talk to David
@PolyPride3 she can't prove it because her thoughts are based on religion and not the teachings of the Bible. she will always be incorrect in her assessment because she speaks from emotion and not logic. scripture is not broken or contradictory. but, let her tell it, God made a mistake somewhere.
@Indigohue how blind. what i will do is tell you that MARRIAGE is blessed and is a reflection of God's relationship with All of us. We, who accept, are all ONE SPIRIT with Jesus. the body(church) of Christ has MANY members Now, show me in the NT where Jesus or anyone says having more than one wife is a sin. CAUTION: DO NOT attempt to READ INTO THE TEXT WHAT IS NOT THERE. or maybe God/Jesus forgot to tell us specifically what was sinful and what was righteous.
Neither Christ nor the apostles ever gave their approval of polygamy, while both approved monogamy.
Christ does not marry two churches, nor does the Church marry two Christs. The Church is set apart for Christ and no one else. Jesus Himself said there will ony be ONE church.
A Christian means to "follow Christ". Jesus never condoned polygamy ONLY monogamy, therefore if you love Him you will keep His commandments.
@Indigohue you continue to fail to show proof of any mention of MONOGAMY in scripture. my study of scripture has only found the mention of the ONE FLESH bond of MARRIAGE. maybe you don't understand what ONE FLESH or MARRIAGE means. and please site the scripture where Jesus or His Disciples VERBALLY condone MONOGAMY ONLY. Christians follow Christ so-called Christians such as yourself and others read into and add and take away from scripture to fit a religious agenda.
You Sir are NO Christian, otherwise you would know that polygamy is illegal in almost all of the industralized world, bar Utah, where a few Mormons, who are a cult anyway may still practise it.
We are commanded to follow the laws of our country (Rom 13:1). Therefore from a Christian standpoint your argument has no validity.
@Indigohue who cares about what Mormons do. Mormons are lost souls as well. and wow finally a scriptural reference. and you are using the law of MAN to regulate what GOD created. did you bother to read the entire scripture where Paul gives scriptural examples of what he is referencing. and are you going to ignore Jesus's answer in Mark 12:13-17 and i quote "And Jesus answering said unto them, Render to Caesar the things that are Caesar's, and to God the things that are God's.
God never created polygamy . Lamach was the first man to practise it,but it was never God's intention or will. Did you not read the pm I sent you?
Other than that all I can suggest is you get some much needed therapy and counselling for your sex addiction. And may the Lord have mercy on your soul!
Before you jump to Lamach practising polygamy, can you stick to the King David. Are you working on providing a response that takes into account the evidence that I've presented or will you ADMIT that you were wrong. And then you can also explain why God blessed UNREPENTANT polygamists starting with Jacob to King David.
If it's a non-issue then why bring it up to begin with. And when or if the Laws do change, I expect your opinion of polygamy being wrong to also change with it. Gay marriage is legal in Canada and some parts of the US, so is gay marriage 'moral" to God?
@Indigohue in the eys of GOD by HIS words, not mine. your logic continues to be flawed and idiotic at best. you are hung up on "sex addiction" as another lousy defense. if you've entertained more than one man wouldn't that make you a sex addict by your logic. sex is a responsibility not something you do for fun. having sex with some brings about a ONE FLESH BOND that requires a man to be responsible for the woman he has humbled. GOD holds us responsible for our actions.
@Indigohue marriage belongs to GOD as it is HIS image that it represents. not Caesar's or in this case MAN'S LAW. from a CHRISTIAN STANDPOINT. will you refute the words of Christ our Lord and Saviour? i'm almost certain you will claim scripture twisting here, yet it is obvious what Jesus is telling us. well, obvious to most.
Indigohue recent PMs to me have mostly centered around trying to 'convert' me to Monogamy-only view so to her I guess it's a salvation issue. I've handled her by sticking to ONLY one point at a time until she admits she's wrong and by showing her how to think. It hasn't worked , YET ; )
Marcus is not saying that he's breaking the law or practicing polygamy, he's only saying that polygamy is 'moral' going by GOD"S Law. Polygamy being illegal in SOME countries does not mean it's 'immoral' because polygamiy is legal in many Arab and African countries. So does that mean polygamy is both moral and immoral depending on where you live by your logic? I go by God's law to ultimately determine what's 'moral' and I try to CHALLENGE societal laws when they conflict with God
@PolyPride3 AMEN to that. are we insane in our attempt to show the truth of scripture and the flaws and confusion man has used in it's selfish and idolatrous agendas to cause God's lambs to stray from the voice of their shepherd?
No we are being very bold on an issue that many don't see how they're suppressing their truth. That's the problem when man-made tradition creeps into how people follow God's word. I asked Indigohue about gay marriage being legal in some countries so lets say if she thinks that that there'fore is moral to God
@PolyPride3 she does appear to be leaning on MAN'S LAW as a defense for all things moral or immoral. and since man's law makes gay marriage legal i presume by her logic it is okay. or on this issue will she turn to scripture?
In the same way God could've very well had it in his plan for polygamy to be a form of marriage but it did not play out yet at the point of Genesis 2:18-24. And like I said, polygamy is OPTIONAL so God did NOT have to give Adam two wives in order to show that polygamy was right. ANd besides that, by YOUR logic, if God made 2 wives for Adam then you'd be left with saying that ONLY polygamy is right when that aint the case. Please prove me wrong.
God stated His plan for marriage was one man and one woman. in a monogamous marriage.. That's it!
98% of the Christian population and church leaders from all denominations excluding Mormons have no difficulty understanding this.
It's so simple a child could understand it. God is not the author of confusion, but you are so desperate to indulge in sex with multiple women your brain has been addled. Sorry to be rude, but that's it.
Do you watch the 1st 2 minutes of a scary movie and say that the movie wasn't scary? My previous response to you already accounts for God creating only one wife for Adam. Did you not see that? You're basing your view of God's plan based ONLY on what He's done and ONLY on one passage. If you factored in my point which you have NOT addressed you would know that some of God's plan is not played out and not played out YET. cont'd
look i couldnt do that but these women have chosen this so different strokes for different folks, my only concern would be the kids would be singled out for ridicule
lilprpmami1 5 hours ago
Also the choice would not be unilateral, so it's just me putting my girl through it, it's both of us WILLINGLY putting ourself through that situation assuming that jealousy will be a big problem.
PolyPride3 1 week ago
it's not selfish to get jealous of your spouse fucking/loving someone else - it's human.
TheBgoz 1 week ago
@TheBgoz
Jealousy is a human emotion but not all jealousy is good. A poly person getting jealous over their partner screwing/loving another SPOUSE is bad jealousy. That's how the relationship is suppose to go assuming that it was done in honesty and the people involved wanted it. I'd say the people need to work on resolving their jealousy although some women in poly say that the benefits of the companionship outweigh the jealousy. They work like best friends and not jealous rivals.
PolyPride3 1 week ago
@PolyPride3 but y put a spouse (who u supposedly love) through that, knowing that they may go through that emotional torture?
& women may say that - but i wonder if it would be reversed when it comes to mens wives having multiple husbands...
TheBgoz 1 week ago
@TheBgoz
The only way I wouldn't go through polygamy due to jealousy is if I could tell the future and know that my girl would never get over it. Going into polygamy, I would expect that there would be benefits to the whole marriage overall, and that we'll be able to work through problems just like any other couple would have to when confronted with jealousy. I don't make decisions out of insecurity but rather I'm willing to fight it if I want we all want it real bad.
PolyPride3 1 week ago
eeeewwww. could you imagine fucking the same guy that your sister fucks? that's fucked up...
TheBgoz 1 week ago
7 billion people are crammed onto this earth, eating, using fossil fuels and destroying the ozone. In 30 years we will be at 20 billion. If you want to have 3 wives, fine, just FUCKING LIMIT the offspring to 1 each or something. These people are more disgusting for recklessly reproducing than having more than one wife.
gateauxQ 1 week ago
@gateauxQ Your going off without anything to back you up but that's okay, that is normal for environmental extremists. As for population growth...tell you what, you have no kids and I will post here and urge the polygamists to have an extra two kids to replace you and your genetic code. Simple Darwinian logic, right?
edwardsson777 1 week ago
do what works for you.
DrLsw 2 weeks ago
I have nothing against having more than one wife or husband at one time.
i just wonder, for example would vikkis daughter also call valeri mom? or just valeri? just curious the thought never crossed my mind before tonight. i would thing vikkis daughter would call valeri just valeri
DrLsw 2 weeks ago
4:06 There is a stigma associated with it. DUH.
millertas 2 weeks ago
Why are they comparing these people to the FLDS. The FLDS are totally different. I was an FLDS and I KNOW it it totally different
maritsa1992 3 weeks ago
@maritsa1992 I think they are comparing it because there is a widely held assumption that most polygamy in the U.S. is happening in the FLDS or similar groups. They are trying to debunk that misconception.
abigword 2 weeks ago
They learn about there emotions? Sounds like they have to repress there emotions more -_- and constantly have to work and do things with there children . Never getting a break to just stop and think
partystarta1 1 month ago
@partystarta1
Just because someone has jealousy doesn't mean they dont' want a relationship which is the same for jealousy in monogamy. There's good and bad jealousy, and people need to work on resolving teh bad jealousy in polygamy just as they would in monogamy. Jealousy is in part based on social standards, which is why not everyone gets jealousy for the same reason and frequency/intensity. Swingers are on one spectrum and insecure control freaks are on the other side.
PolyPride3 1 month ago
FLDS is the group that still practices polygamy, not the LDS
lily2420 1 month ago
Ironic that the haters of Mitt (he is Mormon) are praising Jesus and telling the flock that despite Newt's questionable past, affairs and his strange dislike of the poor that he is the one to vote for. Heck, I would easily vote for any of these polygamist women over the new "Jesus candidate." PS. I doubt Jesus would endorse Newt.
edwardsson777 1 month ago in playlist Liked videos
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it's Christine Brown! but sister wives (the show) only went public in 2010.... I'm confused.
123kittykittylicklic 1 month ago
its a shame they can't enjoy group sex together lol
LeelaDebris 1 month ago
This is not the only model of North American polygamy. There are many others which are under the "radar" of the mainstream media. Different strokes for different folks..
GreenRad2012 1 month ago
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After it was "officially" stopped the Romney's fled the US to Mexico (illegally) to keep polygamy. Romney's dad was the 1st Mexican-American candidate for POTUS.
Romney is a Mormon bishop, a descendant of 1 of the original Joe Smith apostles and whose g-gramps illegally fled to Mexico to stay ahead of US law (he STILL had cousins in Mexico - look it up!)
One gramps who married his 12th wife got shot dead by the husband of of the last woman he had a "celestial" marriage with.
American values!
dleechristy 1 month ago
If people are liking this, then why do they strongly dislike polygamy in islam (which is with marriage)
shiney94 1 month ago 2
22 Children !
Klaudiosable 1 month ago
they can do whatever the hell they want, if no one is making anyone else do something they don't want, I don't see what's wrong...
ArturoStojanoff 1 month ago
This is a lie they are not part of flds
Framerstevie89 2 months ago
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KadanSeren 1 month ago
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KadanSeren 1 month ago
@Framerstevie89 They said they were not part of the FLDS....
KadanSeren 1 month ago
In 1 Corinthians 7:10-11, Paul says not to divorce but then he mentions an exception of condition of if if the divorce does occur. Paul mentions for the woman to remain unmarried or be reconciled to her husband. If divorce was a sin then Paul wouldn't be telling anyone to remain in a divorced state or unmarried. Jesus elaborates in the Gospels the conditions of where someone can divorce AND remarry. So if divorce is still allowed then why not polygamy IF both weren't in God's original plan?
PolyPride3 2 months ago
Indigohue,
I hope that you're beginning to realize that you will NOT convince many, if anyone, that you speak truth when you DODGE, lie, and ignore evidence. Would you believe a liar and an unreasonable person? If you can I'd like you to answer my points to you about King David and his poly marriage along with why God still allows divorce when it was not in his original plan.
PolyPride3 2 months ago
@PolyPride3 just as them to read 2SAM 12:8
ajfsSr31 1 month ago
the scripture; judge not lest you be judges just jumps out at me... More power to folks that can do it and be spiritually correct in accordance to God's word. I could def see how it could be hard and at the same time see the otherside of that coin... Living a Christian life inherently makes life all the harder. Since the world hated Jesus, will the world not hate you for Loving him? In the end its just another piece of tape trying to enact control over person's. the reason its "unlawful"
AgainstAllOdds3188 2 months ago
Actually the only wife of David's that God did not accept was Bethshiba wasn't it?? You know the one Sin that David fell to, lust. But other than that Most biblical person's had multiple wives... and you could even take it further, in the beginning it was only adam and eve, after they had kids how else was the world to be populated? and most marriages within the bible were within a given family, an uncles daughter or having be in relation through a family tree to some extent.
AgainstAllOdds3188 2 months ago
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to the death of His son to save us all. at any point in scripture God spoke of ANY change to His plan. and since His will is SOVEREIGN we have no just cause to add our own selfish, emotional, misguided teachings. test what you THINK you know and what you have been told by using scripture and any Greek and Hebrew TRANSLATIONS, not opinions, to help you understand what the English language looses in it's translations. scripture is perfect and complete. God doesn't need added laws for His plan.
marcusdhouston 2 months ago
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to the death of His son to save us all. at any point in scripture God spoke of ANY change to His plan. and since His will is SOVEREIGN we have no just cause to add our own selfish, emotional, misguided teachings. test what you THINK you know and what you have been told by using scripture and any Greek and Hebrew TRANSLATIONS, not opinions, to help you understand what the English language looses in it's translations. scripture is perfect and complete. God doesn't need added laws for His plan.
marcusdhouston 2 months ago
to the death of His son to save us all. at any point in scripture God spoke of ANY change to His plan. and since His will is SOVEREIGN we have no just cause to add our own selfish, emotional, misguided teachings. test what you THINK you know and what you have been told by using scripture and any Greek and Hebrew TRANSLATIONS, not opinions, to help you understand what the English language looses in it's translations. scripture is perfect and complete. God doesn't need added laws for His plan.
marcusdhouston 2 months ago
@Indiohue Polypride 3 makes a good point. you like to use God's "original plan" as the foundation for your persecution of polgyny. he pointed out that God's "original plan" for marriage was not divorce, however He made a way for divorce to be possible and still be according to His will. this change of God's plan is one example of God changing His "mind" according to His will. another would be the sacrificing of animals and obedience to the law as means to salvation, cont'd
marcusdhouston 2 months ago
@marcusdhouston
I emailed Indigo about this point regarding God still allowing divorce and I reposted it here again. I have not gotten a response yet including a response for the King David point that I posted here probably a week ago.
PolyPride3 2 months ago
@marcusdhouston I am with you except God does not and never did change his mind on divorce. Paul said remain unmarried! i.e. if U remarry U R committing adultery. the only way out was n still is death. But no one follows that teaching yet they look down on people who practice polygamy. It's all about control of the Masses. If I keep U guity I keep U in my pews for money!!! Mal 2:16; Mat 19:6,9; 1Cor 7:10,11,39; LUKE 16:8. 2Sam 12:8 and Num 23:19. I don't get y people r so angry?
ajfsSr31 1 month ago
Go brag to your monogamy-only friends about how you ignore and DODGE the King David issue to make your point. No different than a CROOKED detective who hides evidence to hide the truth as it is.
PolyPride3 2 months ago
Indigohue,
I thought you said you were leaving this issue alone but here you are again. You've come up with no response to my answers to you and still have the same UNproven points. Seeing how much of a mismatch or how STUPID some of your views are compared to other people here, I can only conclude that you like being beaten up (mentally). If you intend on convincing OTHERS (esp. people who test for truth) instead of just yourself, then I hope you can demonstrate more than just UNPROVEN points
PolyPride3 2 months ago
Indigohue mentions,
"Come out from the OT times where women were like chattel". Last I recall, women were like chattel up until a few centuries ago although in some countries they are STILL like chattel. Only 'recently' has there been a value for equal rights. So saying that polygamy was the cause of woman suppression is FALSE since poly did not exist predominantly in the US and yet we found racial and gender suprresion under a MONOGAMY enforced system.
PolyPride3 2 months ago
cont'd from my last comment to Indigohue,
And that's the problem with a lot of Christians today. They don't think for themselves and TEST what doctrine they're being fed which opens them up to be easily misled. That's what you get when you have a follow-the-crowd mentality.
PolyPride3 2 months ago
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So Indigohue made the claim that King David repented of polygamy by giving up all of his wives. I've showed her evidence to the contrary and she still has not answered or at least admit that she was wrong. I honestly will only engage with her beyond that topic if I'm bored or as practice in reasoning about biblical polygamy and common objections. Otherwise I'm going to keep reminding her about all of her unanswered points.
PolyPride3 2 months ago
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PolyPride3 2 months ago
cont'd from my last comment..
And if polygamy is a sin or adultery, then by your logic that's what God did. One tip here is that if God is good and perfect, then seeing how He dealt with people should serve as examples and elaboration on His Law since His acts should carry out His law or be compatible to them. Name one polygamists that God called an adulterer. I can name you one polygamists that he called an adulterer ONLY when that polygamist took another man's wife (King David).
PolyPride3 2 months ago
@ Indigohue if you are referring to Mat 5:28 it is all about covetousness and idolatry. How could a single man (everyone who looks at a woman - means everyone, not just a married man) look at a single woman and commit adultery? "with lustful intent" is covetousness, and covetousness is idolatry Eph 5:5 and God considers idolatry to be adultery Eze 23:37. Get it? Mat 5:28 has nothing whatsoever to do with Polygyny. Covetousness=idolatry=adultery.
Scarecrow3710 2 months ago
@Scarecrow3710
Jesus is saying a man does not have to commit the "act" to be guilty of adultery, a man is just as guilty when he looks at a woman to lust after her. "Lust" meaning to have a strong desire for , to possess & dominate completely.
A man can admire a woman for her beauty, but to lust with the eyes is adultery of the heart.
Indigohue 2 months ago
@Indigohue please tell me...how is it that a single man looking at a single woman with lustful intent falls into the heathen (or even the biblical) definition of adultery? It doesn't. The passage does NOT specify a married man or a married woman. The church and our pagan Romanized society do not understand adultery from a biblical perspective. If you have other verses to prove what "Jesus is saying" in this verse I would be interested in them, otherwise it seems to only be opinion.
Scarecrow3710 2 months ago
@Scarecrow3710
Too bad that you think the words of Jesus Christ are just an opinion Jesus then goes on to say in the next verse that if your eye causes you to sin, gourge it out, for it is better to enter eternal life with one eye, than go into hell with two., where the fire is never quenched.
That's how seriously Jesus takes adultery. You would be wise not to trifle with his commandments.
Indigohue 2 months ago
@Indigohue "Jesus is saying" (your words/interpretation I question...not His) ...so you think mutilating your body will change the heart? Lust is not cured by removing body parts, and that is not what Jesus is saying. A blind man is still capable of lust. These verses are some of the most misunderstood in the bible. I would suggest you do an in-depth study on them.
Scarecrow3710 2 months ago
@Scarecrow3710
Hi Scarecrow.. I hope you're doing well. I've been discussing polygamy with Indigohue for days now. She has a hard time admitting when she's wrong and she usually dodges points that she can't answer by changing the subject and hoping that you'll forget about the previous unanswered point. I try to keep her on ONE topic at a timeto make it easier to point out when she's wrong and so she won't dodge.
PolyPride3 2 months ago
@PolyPride3 Hello back at ya. Keep in mind that until the Holy Spirit reveals the truth people are usually blind to it. It is very difficult for someone that was taught and believes in the monogamy doctrine to see the truths in the scriptures about marriage/divorce. Keep praying and keep up the good work educating them - sooner or later some of them will get it.
Scarecrow3710 2 months ago
@Scarecrow3710
It's an analagy, duh! He's not saying you literally have to cut off limbs. What He is saying is you have to "cut off" the sources of your temptations. He has already said that a man who looks at another women with lust is guilty of adultery, the eyes also lust when they are used to look at pornography.
His clear message is, if you don't stop sinning you are in danger of eternal hellfire.
Indigohue 2 months ago
@Indigohue Pro 6:25 Lust (Strongs H2530) not after her beauty in thine heart; neither let her take thee with her eyelids.
H2530 חמד châmad khaw-mad'
A primitive root; to delight in: - beauty, greatly beloved, [u]covet[/u], delectable thing, ( X great) delight, desire, goodly, lust, (be) pleasant (thing), precious (thing).
To lust after something is the act of covetousness.
Scarecrow3710 2 months ago
@Scarecrow3710 ...cont...
Eph 5:5 For you may be sure of this, that everyone who is sexually immoral or impure, or who is covetous (that is, an idolater), has no inheritance in the kingdom of Christ and God.
Eze 23:37 For they have committed adultery, and blood is on their hands. With their idols they have committed adultery, and they have even offered up to them for food the children whom they had borne to me.
See it yet?
Scarecrow3710 2 months ago
@Scarecrow3710
."For lust is a shameful sin, a crime that should be punished. It is a devastating fire that destroys to hell. "Job 31 11-12
A polygamist is not guilty of just adultery, but he is also a deceitful liar, by breaking all of the marriage vows.
If you are willing to risk Hell because of what you believe that is up to you.
It is appointed unto man to die once and then the Judgment. There is NO chance to repent after death.
Indigohue 2 months ago
@Indigohue Show me the chapter and verse to prove that polygyny is a sin? If you can then all the men including Abraham, David, Gideon, etc... are sinful and sexually immoral. If that is the case then none of them are in heaven:
1Co 6:9-10 Or do you not know that the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived: neither the sexually immoral, etc...will inherit the kingdom of God.
Either you are right and they are in hell...or you are wrong - you are wrong.
Scarecrow3710 2 months ago
@Scarecrow3710
I've already spent too much time debating this subject.I'm not being drawn into any more discussion.
Christianity does not recognize polygamy as legal. It is considered highly immoral and wholly incompatible with Christ's teaching. You will not find a single verse where Jesus condones polygamy.
If you can't and won't accept that then it's your risk. Don't keep trying to justify yourself to me, it's God you have to face on Judgment Day.
Indigohue 2 months ago
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PolyPride3 2 months ago
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@Indigohue Western Civilization does not recognize polygamy as 'legal' but some countries recognize gay marriage and even prostitution as being okay. So much for legalities. You will not find a single verse of God CONDEMNING bestiality and rape in the NT because those are already covered in the law, just like polygamy. This is how silly the monogamy-ONLY believers are to me if you're the best they've got.
PolyPride3 2 months ago
@Indigohue
Do you have a response to your claim about King David and polygamy that takes into account the evidence I presented to you some days ago? This reflects a dishonest character in you when you sit there and lie about Scripture despite being shown evidence. There's no way I will put much credibility or stock in people who are of your type.
PolyPride3 2 months ago
@PolyPride3
Just what part of goodbye don't you understand? You may have vast amounts of time to spend discussing something that is both illegal and immoral, but I don't.
Nice talking to you, au revoir.
Indigohue 2 months ago
@Indigohue
You're still here aren't you? I frequent this video and other videos when I'm on Youtube. If you have nothing reasonable to contribute then perhaps you should consider not responding.
PolyPride3 2 months ago
@Indigohue You will not find one verse where He condemns it either. How does that by default then make it sinful? Since it was commonly practiced at the time I think Jesus would have addressed it if it were sinful in any way. The false monogamy doctrine of the church developed from 200 to 600 AD and is the result of Satan's influence on the church.
Scarecrow3710 2 months ago
@Indigohue the RELIGION OF CHRISTIANITY doesn't recognize polygamy. you appear to have trouble showing any scripture outlawing polygyny specifically. the only form of polygamy i have found to be sinful in the EYES OF GOD is the woman having more than one husband. there are several references of a man having more than one wife yet there are none showing a woman having more than one husband. this is called ADULTERY in plain text.
marcusdhouston 2 months ago
@Indigohue
If making claims you can't back up, and DODGING points, and not admitting points were a sin, you'd be in Hell by now. But fortunately, all you get from that is just making yourself look stupid. Which is why if you were bold enough to debate me in a FORMAL debate or in court, you wouldn't get away with half the BS you've been telling me here. Do you have anything to answer for King David or explain why an UNrepentant polygamists can get away with being blessed?
PolyPride3 2 months ago
@Indigohue Biblically speaking spoken vows have never been a part of marriage. once the one flesh bond has occurred the two have entered a covenant with God and are held by HIS requirements. can you site scripture explaining where "marriage vows" are required under God. the vows you speak of uphold the eternal bond of husband and wife according to God's will. it doesn't forbid polygyny. if you understand marriage you understand it is eternal without the need for spoken vows.
marcusdhouston 2 months ago
@Indigohue
Your point to Scarecrow still doesn't touch on the point of what adultery is. Yes, the passage talks about adultery but what is adultery according to what the BIBLE writers (not your modern-day lawmakers) meant. To NOT commit adultery stretches across BOTH OT and NT so you can't isolate this as just an NT issue, anyways (Romans 7:7). Wouldn't it be uncharacteristic of God to describe himself as an adulterer esp. to make a point about someone else committing adultery on him?
PolyPride3 2 months ago
@PolyPride3
You men on here are spiritually lost. I'm not wasting anymore time on this subject. Suffice to say, polygamy has never been recognized as legitimate by the Church since it’s earliest Father’s.
If you disagree with me that's fine, you can take all your excuses and put them before God on Judgment Day. If you are willing to gamble your eternal security on this matter, then it's entirely your choice.
With that, I'll bid you goodbye.
Indigohue 2 months ago
@Indigohue
Throughout history some Christians (not necessarily everyone) disagreed with polygamy but sometimes it was for PERSONAL reasons. It's clear that the Bible is the authoritative source for Christians and it's clear that the Apostles nor Jesus mentioned STOP engaging in polygamy. So if anyone is going to tell me that polygamy is wrong, they're going to have to show me going by the authoritative source rather than expecting me to believe them just because they say so. cont'd
PolyPride3 2 months ago
@Indigohue if you carefully look at the Greek definition, which the NT was written before being translated to English, it says lust is a FORBIDDEN desire. i see that is was also accurately and plainly spelled out by Scarecrow to include covetousness (10th commandment) and idolatry (2nd & 3rd commandment). you refuse to accept the Biblical definition of adultery as being involved with, coveting, and/or lusting for another man's wife. this is in balance with every OT law concerning adultery.
marcusdhouston 2 months ago
@marcusdhouston
You need to re-read the words that came out of the mouth of Jesus Himself. It's quite simple to understand and he makes it crystal clear. Jesus raised the moral standard by which ALL men must live.
You can play this dangerous game of opposing the clear message from Christ, but you do so at your own risk.
Narrow is the way that leads to eternal life and broad is the path that leads to destruction.
Indigohue 2 months ago
@Indigohue umm...Jesus never married. is this the moral standard you speak of. it is clear Jesus never spoke out against polygyny, however he did speak out against divorcing your wife for other than sexual immorality and lusting for another man's wife. you appear to be following the "broad" belief of monogamy only and we are following the "narrow" path of truth. When in Rome, do as the Romans do.
marcusdhouston 2 months ago
@marcusdhouston
Fine, whatever!
Jesus speaks to us by virtue of our conscience, which is why polygamy is so morally repulsive to all of humanity except a fringe group of men who cannot control their fallen carnal nature
I don't have to justify monogamy, no one does, but that is what God ordained from the beginning.
This is a battle you are fighting with your Creator, your're just to blind to see it, that's why you can't let it drop.
Indigohue 2 months ago
@Indigohue Good to know you have God's twitter account. Come on man, are you saying that truth is statistical? if so, what do you think would have been the results of an opinion poll in ancient Judea if the people have been asked if Jesus should have been crucified? Monogamy is the norm because of a variety of factors, but the Bible should not be one of them since it does not condemn polygamy.
edwardsson777 2 months ago
@edwardsson777
Monogamy is the norm because it is not only what God ordained in his orginal directive, it also harmonizes with people's conscience. The 10 Commandments are God's moral laws that He wrote on our hearts and to which our conscience bears witness. .
THAT is why polygamy is repulsive to all true Christians.
Come out of OT times when women were mere chattel and step into the Truth of the Gospel of Jesus Christ who NEVER gave his blessing or approval for polygamy.
Indigohue 2 months ago
@Indigohue
Monogamy is not the norm but rather 2 people per marriage is the norm. You have yet to refute me on this point and many other points which shows how cowardly and dishonest you are and why I have NO pity for you when you make yourself look STUPID. You say polygamy is repulsive to ALL Christians, and I ask for a CREDIBLE source to that esp. considering that you have a few Christians here who disagree with you.
PolyPride3 2 months ago
@Indigohue Jews only gave up practicing polygamy in Europe due to persecution from Christians. So it seems they kept polygamy t´for thousands of years without the benefit of your "enlightened" analysis. If you support women being free are they not free to choose polygamy if they like?
edwardsson777 2 months ago
@Indigohue please site specifically where God "ORDAINED' monogamy as his "ORIGINAL" directive. this "ORIGINAL" and "ORDAINED" directive appears to be missing from my Bible. maybe i can borrow yours. what we are telling you is CONGRUENT with everything in scripture according to GODS will. and "TRUE" Christians understand the completeness of scripture and WILL NOT add personal opinions and blasphemously call it the "ORDAINED ORIGINAL DIRECTIVE". you continue, as a majority of so-called cont'd
marcusdhouston 2 months ago
@Indigohue Christians do, is ASSUME God made a mistake and accepted a man having more than one wife as good and lawful according to His will. according to your logic and other so-called Christians God turned a blind eye to polygyny and gave wives to David, accepted Jacob's wives, Abraham's wives, and it wasn't until what we now call modern times was polygamy of any sort was outlawed; BY MAN. what is REPULSIVE to God is Harlotry, Prostitution, and Sodomy. scripture outlaws such acts. cont's
marcusdhouston 2 months ago
@Indigohue cont'd...however, i did not find polygynist on the list of those who would not inherit the kingdom of God. from what i have gathered from you logic, a man can only have one mate during his life time. by your logic, if he married again that would make him a sinful polygamist. would not your logic uphold this? only the woman is commanded to only have one husband during her lifetime barring death or a lawful Godly divorce. i've found nothing similar for the man. CHRISTIANS know this.
marcusdhouston 2 months ago
@Indigohue
There are actually BOTH men and woman out there who agree with polygamy. They are a fringe group in WESTERN civilization. You're really exaggerating and are only resorting to statsistics from your opinion. If Jesus speaks to EVERYONE in their conscience, then why do nearly 50% of Americans agree with gay marriage?
PolyPride3 2 months ago
@Indigohue monogamy only is a Greco-Roman practice and law, however these were some of the most adulterous people around at the time. not only were they guilty of adultery but sodomy as well. if you read Paul's letters you will see exactly what can be proven through scripture and history books. today's society is a perfect picture of what the "monogamy only" brought about by Roman Catholic doctrine has done to every culture throughout history. God never COMMANDED any man to be with only 1 wife.
marcusdhouston 2 months ago
@marcusdhouston
While polygamy may have been “legal” in the Mosaic civil law, there was no provision for it in the ‘original’ helpmate directive (Genesis 2:18-24) which demonstrated that God’s original “idea” & intent for humanity was clearly monogamy.
What's wrong with you anyway? Why isn't one woman enough?
Truth is you just want to engage in sexual relations with mutliple women & do it under an umbrella of respectability. Thank God it's illegal, men like you need therapy.
Indigohue 2 months ago
@Indigohue So the mosaic Law, which in some instances carried the death penalty for certain statutes, was imperfect in showing what God intended for mankind? Who was at fault then, Moses or God?
Also, in today's society aman can legally have sex with any woman of legal age. If a man wanted to do that he would not need polygamy. In fact, with polygamy he has to assume responsibility over a very large number of children as well as keep up with all his wives for all their lives.
edwardsson777 2 months ago
@Indigohue
Your point about the helpmate directive of Genesis 2:18-23 assumes monogamy when the directive is more general than that since it leaves room for PLURAL marriage. You also assume that God's plan for marriage was FULLY revealed at that time for Adam and Eve when that is not the case. If you keep reading your Bible, even before the law was given we find people engaging in polygamy and God even intervening to improve polygamy like with Jacob in Genesis 29:30-32.
PolyPride3 2 months ago
@Indigohue
God's original plan for marriage involved no divorce and now divorce is allowed. His original plan also involved egalitarianism where there was equality between hubby and wife but that changed to patriarchy and it's still allowed. The NT reinforces the man being the head. So we see all of these deviations from God original plan, some of which God changed himself, so why wouldn't polygamy be allowed just as divorce and patriarchal marriage are still allowed?
PolyPride3 2 months ago
@Indigohue so now i see what the problem is."why isn't one woman enough" is a feminist view of marriage not a SCRIPTURAL ACCEPTANCE. the monogamy only doctrine plays to your "emotions" and not the CONTENT of scripture. monogamy only preachers are taking it upon themselves to outlaw a form of marriage never spoken against in scripture. these same people have exalted monogamy to worship and do so in the name of God. we've been warned to not do this.
marcusdhouston 2 months ago
@Indigohue okay, here again we have a case of eisegesis. You cannot tell me that as you read that you saw one man one woman! Furthermore, God took the effort to layout the law to Moses in maticulous detail as well as the provisions for the place of worship. He gave everything about husband wife relationships. Why did he leave out the number of wives? Why does God tell David I gave you your masters wives (Plural) 2Sam 12:8? Why is it always about sex for those against the practice?
ajfsSr31 1 month ago
@Indigohue this is man made law and doctrine based upon a pagan society.
marcusdhouston 2 months ago
Cont'd from my last response...
God did NOT call David an 'adulterer' when he was taking concubines and multiple wives. He only called David an adulterer after he took Bathsheba and it is because she was a MARRIED woman. Also please explain why would God choose to describe Himself as an adulterer when he mentions being in a 'polygamous' marriage with Israel.
PolyPride3 2 months ago
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PolyPride3 2 months ago
cont'd from my last comment..
The way I know biblical adultery only relates to a MARRIED woman going outside of her ONE spouse is because that's how it's described in the law. Another way I know is by looking up the word "adultery" in the Hebrew language which sets what the writers of the Bible meant. The Hebrew word is "na aph" so please look it up. You'll see that it means "a woman that breaks wedlock" or "sleeping with another man's wife." God's dealings with polygamists supports this.
PolyPride3 2 months ago
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@Indigohue
I've already covered this point with you. If what you were saying was correct then a married man looking at his wife lustfully would be committing adultery? This is why logically and based on precedenet which we find in the OT, we have to understand that Jesus was talking about a SPECIFIC type of woman and not just any woman. ANd that woman would be another man's wife. So if a man lust after a MARRIED woman or another man's wife, then he's committing adultery
PolyPride3 2 months ago
@PolyPride3
A man can look at his wife( singular) lustfully. Within the framework of a monogamous marriage that is normal.
Now if that married man looks lustfully at another woman other than his wife, he has committed adultery in his heart. A polygamist is an adulterer AND a liar because he breaks his marriage vows to his first wife and actively lusts after other women.
Jesus said "If you love me, you will keep my commandments".
Indigohue 2 months ago
@Indigohue
Your comment, "a man can look at his wife (singular) lustfully" is NOT mentioned in Matthew 5:28. Unless you can show me where Jesus mentioned the word "wife" let alone the singular form of it in Matthew 5:28. The verse as it stands by itself is vague unless you take it in light of what adultery is according TO GOD and it's clear that it is when a man sleeps with a MARRIED woman. Otherwise, can you show me an example of God calling adultery a MARRIED man sleeping with a woman?
PolyPride3 2 months ago
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PolyPride3 2 months ago
There's already almost 50% of the US population who approve of gay marriage. So I'm sure it won't be too long more before people start also becoming more open to adult CONSENSUAL polygamy.
PolyPride3 2 months ago
Also, laws aren't based on Christianity, otherwise laws like race-based slavery would've never made it into law. Did you know in the US, interracial marriages used to be illegal? So please, consider what you're saying before you insult Christianity any further. And lets not forget, all laws are subject to change and there are some coming to see polygamy as a good option since it can be practiced without harm so EVENTUALLY we may be in the majority.
PolyPride3 2 months ago
bisexuality and polygamists are not in abomination. people are BORN that way.
sweetguy410 2 months ago
why do some people(law makers fer example) tend to think they have a right to tell me whom i can and can not love? i was BORN a bisexual polygamist. my brain is wired that way. oh, and i'm not a fundamintalist mormon, i'm a roman catholic. Jesus Christ loves EVERYONE and died for everyone's salvation. merry christmas. hugz! :) xoxoxoxo
sweetguy410 2 months ago
@sweetguy410 if you believe that then you know that repentance of sin is a requirement. YES, Jesus loves us all, however to knowingly engage in bisexual lifestyle is sinful. God said this is an ABOMINATION in His eyes. Jesus loves me yet if i continue to live a lifestyle contrary to scripture I will not receive salvation. Romans 1:26-32. this is not a judgement just an observation. be well and merry Christmas to you as well.
marcusdhouston 2 months ago
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@Indigohue
The fact is that you tried to use societal laws as a basis to dismiss Marcus' using the Bible to justify polygamy as if societal laws were always moral in God's eyes. The reality is they are NOT. And it seems you have a real crappy way of admitting that you were wrong on that when you follow YOUR OWN logic which led to gay marriage and prostitution.
PolyPride3 2 months ago
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PolyPride3 2 months ago
Indigohue,
By the way, prostitution is legal in Brazil, does that mean prostitution is okay in God's eyes? I know these things are legal but that doesn't mean we have to engage in them. But when you say they are also 'moral' esp. in God's eyes, you're saying that Christians can engage in prostitution and gay marriage. ANd of course you are VERY wrong here and you obviously want to use ANY PETTY argument to preserve your monogamy-ONLY view at all cost. That's sad.
PolyPride3 2 months ago
@PolyPride3
None of those things are morally right, but the world is increasing in wickedness as predicted in the bible during the end times, so it's hardly surprising. However we were discussing polygamy and it has no place in Christianity today. The fact remains that it's illegal. So I'll guess you'll just have to put that in your pipe and smoke it.
Indigohue 2 months ago
@Indigohue
You have a lot to learn and you need 'correction'. I am taking off to go eat but I will pray for you. : )
PolyPride3 2 months ago
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Indigohue 2 months ago
@Indigohue the argument has not be whether it was illegal or not. We all no man laws forbid a man from having more than one wife yet allows gay marriage and men to not be responsible for their many sexual encounters. man's idea of morality is based upon his laws alone. however God has given us a PERFECT blueprint to live by. when CHRISTIANS abide by God's law we are held to a much higher standard. please understand, man's law is flawed and will ultimately lead all who follow to ruin.
marcusdhouston 2 months ago
@marcusdhouston
Show me a verse where Jesus commands us to commit polygamy?
Indigohue 2 months ago
@Indigohue what Jesus said is that a man can not divorce his wife without JUST cause. he never specifically establishes whether said man has one or more wives.what i can and will show you is a verse from the OT which Jesus himself help orchestrate (John 1:1-4) Deut. 22:28-29 tells the story. it never says whether this man is married or unmarried. it doesn't have to. either way a man is responsible for any woman he bonds himself with. polygamy or monogamy are not used in scripture only MARRIAGE.
marcusdhouston 2 months ago
@marcusdhouston
Now you are just embarrassing yourself with flawed hermeneutics. John 1 1-4 is stating that Jesus has always existed right from the beginning of Creation. It has nothing to do with marriage.
Talk to pastor about this, & not one from the emergent church either. You are spiritually lost on this matter.
Polygamy is illegal, adulterous & immoral, so why are you wasting all your time on this matter?
Forget about it and spend your time more productively serving God.
Indigohue 2 months ago
@Indigohue laughable. you know exactly the point i was making yet you continue to duck and dodge. adultery is laying with a WOMAN WHO IS EITHER BETROTHED OR MARRIED TO A HUSBAND. this is not illegal in mans law because no one ever receives any punishment for this SIN against God. so please, try to pull that on someone who doesn't understand scripture. a Godly marriage is not immoral yet the laws of man which you covet allow Gay marriage to be moral and legal. i will continue to speak the truth.
marcusdhouston 2 months ago
@marcusdhouston
Adultery is having sex with anyone besides your lawful wife/husband. (Singular)
99% of Christianiy takes this view - hence the reason polygamy is illegal.
If you carry on wilfully disregarding Christ's word so you can indulge in your carnal lusts, then you risk a wrathful God on Judgment Day.
But if your addiction is worth more to you than your eternal security then it's your call.
Indigohue 2 months ago
@Indigohue
To go by what adultery is to God you need to go by what He revealed in the Bible. Look up the word adultery in the 'ORIGINAL" language that the writers wrote in and you'll see that adultery is when a woman sleeps with someone other than her husband. They way modern-day society defines things do NOT always reflect God's perspective unless you mean to tell me that defining marriage as a guy and a guy would be a meaning God would also accept.
PolyPride3 2 months ago
@Indigohue
Are you going to admit that you were wrong in your claims about King David and polygamy? Are you at least working on a response that takes into account the evidence that I've presented? If you can't be honest on a matter as easy as this, why should I trust taking our conversation to other aspects of polygamy? It seems you're nothing but a PUPPET for the UNREASONABLE thinking leaders at the top who spoon feed the "CROWD" or "majority" what to believe.
PolyPride3 2 months ago
@Indigohue last time i checked scripture, adultery was defined and widely accepted as being having sex or coveting the wife of another man or a wife having sex with someone other than her husband. no where does it mention a husband and a virgin woman. i can give you the scripture to back my claim. can you? please prove me wrong on my definition. i grow tired of you using man's secular definitions and doctrines to defend your beliefs. once again, bring hard evidence to prove your claim.
marcusdhouston 2 months ago
@Indigohue check yourself. continue allowing man made laws and religious doctrines to lead you by the nose. these LAWS continue to blind you to things GOD has deemed moral and immoral according to HIS WILL. every example of adultery in scripture involves a MARRIED woman. one last scripture and you can have the last word (1Corinthians 10:23-32) i will not continue to point out scriptural truths if you will not acknowledge them. live by your own convictions.
marcusdhouston 2 months ago
@Indigohue please understand, marriage is both monogamous and polygynous as both require the man to be responsible and uphold the covenant he has entered. this is the reason for Exodus 21:10 and Deut 22:28. no specifics need to be made since the ONE FLESH BOND is what is important to God and not the number of women involved. just as we all bond ourselves with one God as our head, women may do the same with a husband. as we all come together to be one with the body of Christ and it's members.
marcusdhouston 2 months ago
@Indigohue our arguments have been based on MORALITY not LEGALITY. and you have continued on your crusade to use MAN'S flawed concept of law and morals to refute and deny scriptural integrity. since the world has put marriage in the incapable hands of man, gay marriages are okay. man's laws have made abortion legal as well. how long will we allow Satan to penetrate and destroy the sanctity of God's word.
marcusdhouston 2 months ago
Indigo.. do you have a res ponse to king david and his poly marriages? It should also be a response that takes into account the evidence I presented
PolyPride3 2 months ago
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PolyPride3 2 months ago
Correction for my last comment ...Not 4 if...i meant to say 'for his spiritual marriage'
PolyPride3 2 months ago
@Indigohue Just because jesus chose a monogamous marriage as an example 4 if you spell to marriage doesn't mean everyone else have to do the same. Just as god chose a polygamous marriage as an example of his marriage to Israel does not mean everyone else had to marry in polygamy. Both marriages were examples and not instructions for marriage
PolyPride3 2 months ago
Please look up the video "Sexual revolution and alternative lifestyles in the future" to see that polygamy will gain ground in the western world due more to economic realities than to religion.
edwardsson777 2 months ago
Americans are not just crazy they're plain stupid.
GaolisVideoLog 2 months ago
cont'd from my last comment.
In fact in 1 Kings 1:28-31 we see David having encounters with Bathsheeba still which means he did not put away all of his wives. According to 1 Chronicles 3:1-9, David had 7 wives if you count and it also mentions his concubines as being separate when it mentions the word "besides" in 1 Chronicles 3:9. David is just one person because people like Jacob never divorced any of his wives neither nor do I recall reading anything about him putting away his concubines.
PolyPride3 2 months ago
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David put his concubines into seclusion but that doesn't necessarily mean divorce but can just mean separated from them. Also, there is a difference between a woman called a wife and a woman called a 'concubine'. Concubines are more like unoffical wives or some may say a mistress and some were supported just as much as a wife. That's why wives are often labelled separate from concubines. Solomon had 700 wives and 300 concubines, and it's written just like that in 1 Kings 11:2-3 and other areas
PolyPride3 2 months ago
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PolyPride3 2 months ago
con't frm last comment
God says he'd take David's wives because of that sin which was ADULTERY. That's why it mentions you did it in "SECRET" in 2 Samuel 12:12. So what did David do in secret if you read the context, IN SECRET he slept with another man's wife, so in the OPEN someone will sleep with David's wives. Notice that David was married polygamously before he met Bathsheeba and God never mentioned punishing him then, and it was only after he took Bathsheeba becuz of the way he took her.
PolyPride3 2 months ago
cont'd from my last comment to Indigohue,
You say God's original plan was for one man and one woman in a monogamous marriage. The word "monogamous" is not in the text and the Bible does not mention how many marriages a person can have. So that just means that there's 2 people in a marriage or PER marriage and therefore polygamy has to be practiced as more than one marriage.
PolyPride3 2 months ago
Indigohue,
When are you going STICK to ONE topic? Please answer for your claim. Prove where God took away David's wives and for POLYGAMY. I've been asking for proof of this ONE topic for days and you thought you could slip out of it but I'm bringing it right back in your face till you answer it or admit you were full of you know what.
PolyPride3 2 months ago
@PolyPride3
When are you going to own up to having a sex addiction?
God took David's wives away for Adultery. (2 Samuel 12:11). But David repented of his sins against the Almighty after this and never practised polygamy again either.. Notice that repentance is always followed by a change of heart. He also put away his concubines. Jesus called the Jews of the day an “adulterous generation” who chose to live outside of God’s rules and, instead, made their own.
Indigohue 2 months ago
@Indigohue
You use 2 Samuel 12:11 to say that God punished David for polygamy. God did mention letting someone sleep with David's wives but it was NOT for polygamy. If you read the context which starts from 2 Samuel 11:2-5, 14, 15, 26, and 27 you'll notice David's sin was sleeping with another man's wife (Uriah's wife, Bathsheeba) and how David conspired to have Uriah killed so he can have Bathsheeba for himself. Notice right after that Incident that's when God sent a prophet to talk to David
PolyPride3 2 months ago
@PolyPride3 she can't prove it because her thoughts are based on religion and not the teachings of the Bible. she will always be incorrect in her assessment because she speaks from emotion and not logic. scripture is not broken or contradictory. but, let her tell it, God made a mistake somewhere.
marcusdhouston 2 months ago
@marcusdhouston
Please show me a verse in the NT where Jesus gives his blessing and stamp of approval for polygamy.
Indigohue 2 months ago
@Indigohue how blind. what i will do is tell you that MARRIAGE is blessed and is a reflection of God's relationship with All of us. We, who accept, are all ONE SPIRIT with Jesus. the body(church) of Christ has MANY members Now, show me in the NT where Jesus or anyone says having more than one wife is a sin. CAUTION: DO NOT attempt to READ INTO THE TEXT WHAT IS NOT THERE. or maybe God/Jesus forgot to tell us specifically what was sinful and what was righteous.
marcusdhouston 2 months ago
@marcusdhouston
Neither Christ nor the apostles ever gave their approval of polygamy, while both approved monogamy.
Christ does not marry two churches, nor does the Church marry two Christs. The Church is set apart for Christ and no one else. Jesus Himself said there will ony be ONE church.
A Christian means to "follow Christ". Jesus never condoned polygamy ONLY monogamy, therefore if you love Him you will keep His commandments.
Indigohue 2 months ago
@Indigohue you continue to fail to show proof of any mention of MONOGAMY in scripture. my study of scripture has only found the mention of the ONE FLESH bond of MARRIAGE. maybe you don't understand what ONE FLESH or MARRIAGE means. and please site the scripture where Jesus or His Disciples VERBALLY condone MONOGAMY ONLY. Christians follow Christ so-called Christians such as yourself and others read into and add and take away from scripture to fit a religious agenda.
marcusdhouston 2 months ago
@marcusdhouston
You Sir are NO Christian, otherwise you would know that polygamy is illegal in almost all of the industralized world, bar Utah, where a few Mormons, who are a cult anyway may still practise it.
We are commanded to follow the laws of our country (Rom 13:1). Therefore from a Christian standpoint your argument has no validity.
Indigohue 2 months ago
@Indigohue who cares about what Mormons do. Mormons are lost souls as well. and wow finally a scriptural reference. and you are using the law of MAN to regulate what GOD created. did you bother to read the entire scripture where Paul gives scriptural examples of what he is referencing. and are you going to ignore Jesus's answer in Mark 12:13-17 and i quote "And Jesus answering said unto them, Render to Caesar the things that are Caesar's, and to God the things that are God's.
marcusdhouston 2 months ago
@marcusdhouston
God never created polygamy . Lamach was the first man to practise it,but it was never God's intention or will. Did you not read the pm I sent you?
Other than that all I can suggest is you get some much needed therapy and counselling for your sex addiction. And may the Lord have mercy on your soul!
Indigohue 2 months ago
@Indigohue
Before you jump to Lamach practising polygamy, can you stick to the King David. Are you working on providing a response that takes into account the evidence that I've presented or will you ADMIT that you were wrong. And then you can also explain why God blessed UNREPENTANT polygamists starting with Jacob to King David.
PolyPride3 2 months ago
@PolyPride3
No, Polygamy is illegal in the USA and UK, except for Utah, so it's a non issue.
Indigohue 2 months ago
@Indigohue
If it's a non-issue then why bring it up to begin with. And when or if the Laws do change, I expect your opinion of polygamy being wrong to also change with it. Gay marriage is legal in Canada and some parts of the US, so is gay marriage 'moral" to God?
PolyPride3 2 months ago
@Indigohue in the eys of GOD by HIS words, not mine. your logic continues to be flawed and idiotic at best. you are hung up on "sex addiction" as another lousy defense. if you've entertained more than one man wouldn't that make you a sex addict by your logic. sex is a responsibility not something you do for fun. having sex with some brings about a ONE FLESH BOND that requires a man to be responsible for the woman he has humbled. GOD holds us responsible for our actions.
marcusdhouston 2 months ago
@marcusdhouston
You don't know what loyalty or real love is. You think and reason with your penis.
You're just a fringe minority of carnally minded fruitcakes who filter the scripture through their senses and not the spirit.
Polygamy is illegal. Get over it.
Indigohue 2 months ago
Comment removed
marcusdhouston 2 months ago
@Indigohue marriage belongs to GOD as it is HIS image that it represents. not Caesar's or in this case MAN'S LAW. from a CHRISTIAN STANDPOINT. will you refute the words of Christ our Lord and Saviour? i'm almost certain you will claim scripture twisting here, yet it is obvious what Jesus is telling us. well, obvious to most.
marcusdhouston 2 months ago
@marcusdhouston
Indigohue recent PMs to me have mostly centered around trying to 'convert' me to Monogamy-only view so to her I guess it's a salvation issue. I've handled her by sticking to ONLY one point at a time until she admits she's wrong and by showing her how to think. It hasn't worked , YET ; )
PolyPride3 2 months ago
@Indigohue
Marcus is not saying that he's breaking the law or practicing polygamy, he's only saying that polygamy is 'moral' going by GOD"S Law. Polygamy being illegal in SOME countries does not mean it's 'immoral' because polygamiy is legal in many Arab and African countries. So does that mean polygamy is both moral and immoral depending on where you live by your logic? I go by God's law to ultimately determine what's 'moral' and I try to CHALLENGE societal laws when they conflict with God
PolyPride3 2 months ago
@PolyPride3 AMEN to that. are we insane in our attempt to show the truth of scripture and the flaws and confusion man has used in it's selfish and idolatrous agendas to cause God's lambs to stray from the voice of their shepherd?
marcusdhouston 2 months ago
@marcusdhouston
No we are being very bold on an issue that many don't see how they're suppressing their truth. That's the problem when man-made tradition creeps into how people follow God's word. I asked Indigohue about gay marriage being legal in some countries so lets say if she thinks that that there'fore is moral to God
PolyPride3 2 months ago
@PolyPride3 she does appear to be leaning on MAN'S LAW as a defense for all things moral or immoral. and since man's law makes gay marriage legal i presume by her logic it is okay. or on this issue will she turn to scripture?
marcusdhouston 2 months ago
cont'd from my last comment to Indigohue,
In the same way God could've very well had it in his plan for polygamy to be a form of marriage but it did not play out yet at the point of Genesis 2:18-24. And like I said, polygamy is OPTIONAL so God did NOT have to give Adam two wives in order to show that polygamy was right. ANd besides that, by YOUR logic, if God made 2 wives for Adam then you'd be left with saying that ONLY polygamy is right when that aint the case. Please prove me wrong.
PolyPride3 2 months ago
@PolyPride3
But God DIDN'T create 2 wives for Adam!
God stated His plan for marriage was one man and one woman. in a monogamous marriage.. That's it!
98% of the Christian population and church leaders from all denominations excluding Mormons have no difficulty understanding this.
It's so simple a child could understand it. God is not the author of confusion, but you are so desperate to indulge in sex with multiple women your brain has been addled. Sorry to be rude, but that's it.
Indigohue 2 months ago
@Indigohue
Do you watch the 1st 2 minutes of a scary movie and say that the movie wasn't scary? My previous response to you already accounts for God creating only one wife for Adam. Did you not see that? You're basing your view of God's plan based ONLY on what He's done and ONLY on one passage. If you factored in my point which you have NOT addressed you would know that some of God's plan is not played out and not played out YET. cont'd
PolyPride3 2 months ago