Christopher Hitchens on Charlie Rose 13-Dec-02 (Part 4)

[yatter1]

Monotheism has had 2000 years to prove it´s case and it has failed, time to shut the fuck up.

[metanosis]

@yatter1

or..monotheism has mitigated man's natural inclination for empire building and violence for centuries, and when it is abandoned by civilzations(Nazi Germany(Dawinistic Nietscheanism), Soviet Russia(Marxism), then violence,death and terrorism that makes the inquisition and crusades look like sunday tea parties is the inevitable result!!!

[yatter1]

@metanosis are you blind, deaf, dumb or just plain fucking deluded? There is no god, end of fucking story, if you think that there is, you have a screw loose. It´s much worse if you think that a particular religion is true. That would make you a serious wanker. I hope you´re not. I´ll pray for you...to Joe pesci

[metanosis]

@yatter1

well, you didn't address the point about the excesses of atheism. Would be glad to hear your proof for the naturalistic worldview(atheism) you seem to be supporting, if it's airtight I think a Nobel prize would be in order. :) ....on prayer, you should try it, it works! you have an innate power, an agency, your thoughts have a reality beyond the firing of neurons....and advances in physics and information theory point more and more to a higher plane of existence.....

[yatter1]

@metanosis you´re an arrogant tosspot and worse, you don´t even know it.

[metanosis]

@yatter1 well, am not sure what a tosspot is, so guess you've got me there,

QED.

[crush3r63]

Harold Hongju Koh was very clever to keep his eyes closed through the whole debate so that the others couldn't read his thoughts.

[blahblahhuh1]

'20,000 new jihadis' DIDN'T HAPPEN

'strengthening Sharon government' DIDN'T HAPPEN

Reiff said these were 'certain'.

[blahblahhuh1]

That point at the end was very important.

(Also, fyi Iran wanted the bomb to PROTECT itself from Saddam. The Iranian 'street' was PRO-regime change in Iraq. The question remaining: why does the Iranian Theocracy that beats and kills people on said street, still want the bomb with Saddam gone..?)

[thorsgade26]

Christopher Hitchens is pretty cool, but unfortunately he´s a bit of a bully in discussions not letting the other guests/hosts respond to what he has said. And that sucks.

[skatebawd]

hitch is awesome, he gets life

[alivonal]

Hitch took em all on, and won

[skedaddleMLS]

and yet he lost. He is a wannabe thomas paine. he had wet dreams of being this generations Paine and ended up fucking us big time.

[alivonal]

How did he fuck us? Was it his fault the US hasn't the will or the brains to contain Iraq? He believed in the war for all the right reasons.

[skedaddleMLS]

it was a impossible task to achieve and its going to bankrupt the country. They thought it was going to be a easy two week affair and it turned into a unending fuck up of mass distruction.

[Maverician]

Hitchens stated on hundreds if not thousands of occasions saying that it will not be, could not be, "a 2 week affair".

The country is no where near bankrupt at the moment and is infact getting better and better.

What has fucked it up is that people have not seen the war for what it is, something good, something that needs support. The only way in which it could be seen as an impossible task is if you choose it to be, like too many people have continued to do.

[skedaddleMLS]

LOL actually I wrote that 7 months ago and the country is even closer to bankruptcy. The outcome of iraq doesn't even matter. The U.S gets nothing out of the war except a big fat bill and a nuclear armed Iran.

[Maverician]

Iraq is not closer to bankruptcy now, considering the global market decline in fact it is in a better place than many other countries in that region in terms of the future.

Are you saying that without the war in Iraq, that Iran would NOT become armed Nuclear-wise?

The outcome of Iraq doesn't even matter, well that just proves that you have no concern for human life. I fail to see why anyone should therefore regard your opinion as anything.

[skedaddleMLS]

1. Iraq isn't close to bankruptcy, the U.S is.

2. I'm saying Iraq was a non threat country with a tin pot dictator while Iran is the real player with bad intentions. War with Iran instead of Iraq would most definatly stopped a nuclear armed Iran.

3. the outcome in Iraq on the U.S.A is bad from every angle no matter what. It was a horrible strategic blunder.

[Maverician]

1) The only reason the US is close to bankruptcy is because of it utterly idiotic bailout plan. Not because of the war in Iraq.

2) The war in Iraq was to transform a country long been in need of transformation, more than Iran, Hussein needed to go, way before he did go. Again, you miss my point altogether though, which is that blaming Hitchens is idiotic, early on he was for action against Iran, though now obviously the US has blundered and it is not the way to go.

3) How can you believe that?

[KUNGFOOLERY00000]

@Maverician Surely you meant to write, 'because of its* utterly idiotic bailout plan'.

[InterludetoPeace]

Read the book written by Michael Scheuer, titled "Marching Toward Hell- America and Islam after Iraq". Michael Scheuer was the director of the Bin Laden Unit in the CIA for over 20 years, and one of the foremost authorities on the so-called "War on Terror". Scheuer insightfully demonstrates that invading Iraq allowed the spread of militant islamist ideology and fighters across the middle east. A fundamental problem stated in this book is the time chosen by America to invade Iraq.

[Maverician]

Copypasta?

[InterludetoPeace]

?????????? lol

[Maverician]

Meaning, you copied and pasted your answer from another vid, I've read it before.

[InterludetoPeace]

Nope, I am pretty sure that I have only posted this messge once.

[Maverician]

Oh, man, youtube is weird. Sorry about that.

Not sure how it looks to you, but for some reason my comments made RECENTLY show up above yours, which makes it look like you just recently replied to me. I didn't look at that it said "3 months ago"

My fault, sorry.

[kingsvenomnorr]

This was a really interesting discussion. I'd always wanted to see how Christopher justified the invasion before it happened, because so far, all I'd seen was him debating with George Galloway on 2 occasions in 2005, and a couple short discussions on CNN with some terrible interviewer like Paula Zahn or somebody. Of all people arguing for the War in Iraq, he's come the closest to convincing me.

[nyomythus]

*Koh -- what is he practicing for? Hillary's Press Secretary? Heh, my god (in the transcendental use of the word) And: "Change should come from within the working class?" Who would have freed the slaves? Powerless people need the help of other people.

[WholeDarnShow]

The slaves did want to be freed (...I'd speculate) & accepted the help of those in power, unlike in Iraq where there was plenty of issues w Saddam but not enough to cry out for America to be the ones to save them from him.