It's epee first (you can see the bell guards and handles), then saber (you can hear the announcer say so. Plus it's not actual competitive fencing; it's a staged exhibition.
This is actually without a doubt épée. The bell is the sound of the electric scoring system implemented in 1936; the first of its kind. Sabre did not have electric scoring until, surprisingly, 1988.
for all those debating whether this is epée or sabre, there are actually two different fights. The first one is epée, when the film focuses largely on the shadows rather than the fencers themselves; the second is Sabre.
I'm a fencing coach...I did freeze the frame...they are epees....in those days that was how close they stood. No need to reply...just enjoy that we have these films
@cccanole Actually, if you stop the film it is plain that they have sabres in their hands. They fence more like it is foil, no head cuts at all. Too close for epee. I have to think a while about why sabre would be done this way then.
This is the real way to fence sabre and foil. Think about it. If you actually were going to fight someone with a sharp blade you would not just charge in like a fool stabbing wildly.
Check out the all new 3 weapon scoring box just search youtube for "fencing scoring box" as it won't let me put the complete link but this is the last part - /watch?v=qoxkHLFAVoI
This comment has received too many negative votesshow
if one of these guys went against a new fencer even with old rules... the new fencer would win... just because its too fast for the common spectator doesn't mean they are bad... haha nobody around here thought about rush like they do today... think about it this is before the blitz and the blitz was so radical it overwhelmed everything... fencers today are like the blitz and these people are like trench warfare...
In fenceing you have a judge who calls what happened and who won the point. I am not only learning how to fence but how to judge. It's important that the fencers make their atack clear to show the judge what they intend and that the fencers are honest and have the pide to call a "touchche moi" The old fashion way is great especially when you can't afford the buzzers... ;)
It's that old duelist's mentality of fencing as though the blades were sharp because if you jerk around at practice you could wind up dead in the real thing. I'm a misfit at my studio because of this classical mentality while everyone else plays to the box. To each their own though. I can understand people who like it for the sport and people like me who like it for the martial aspect both enjoy a wonderful pastime.
@rabit8mike yea well modern fencers have the lame technology where as in those times lame technology wasn't available so the right of way rule was really hard to apply.
Watching, maybe... But I can say that actually doing it is as exciting as ever, and that's for any weapon, in fact. You can die of boredom if you watch epee fencing, but it's completely different when you're doing it yourself. Same with baseball I guess.
This comment has received too many negative votesshow
modern are just better... even by these rules modern fencers wud win everytime... one guy was like hey if i/m really fast and hit him then i'll get the point and everyone realized its better... i hate all the people who complain about its not real sword play... cause its not trying to simulate a sword fight... its a sport with rules and the better athlete wins.. if u dont like how its done go away
better compared to what?? almost every sport derived from martial art become worst from martial art's point of view, but better from sport's point of view.
And fencing surely WAS to simulate a sword fight. Since killing other people, even in fair match, prohibited by the law, people keep trying to invent anything to make it safer. And since there's no point to learn how to defend ourself with a sword this days, the martial art's side of fencing is fading and the sport's side now is dominating.
2 different diciplines. I've mentioned it before, one is not better than the other. It comes down to if you want to honor the art of fencing as it was originally erected and in what spirit vs. the "new" version which is simply to hit somebody a split second before you yourself are impaled on the opponents weapon.
i dissagree with hypp. today fencers can fence electric which is a lot easer to see when a touch was made becuase a light goes off when a touch is made unlike back then where you would need to see the blade actully touch your oppent so it was slower and more tecnically
no but its like if u look at hockey in 1930 and hockey today.. today its way faster and more dodgey... at first fencing was a way of practicing how to sword fight and then it started to grow into a sport... and these people are when it wasnt really a true sport... now its a sport.. two people with metal rods trying to hit the other person first using the rules of the sport... if u dont like it do something else
That's like saying that "point karate" is a legitimate sport when it trains people to dive through the air for the sake of a punch that barely scrapes their opponent's chest guard and leaves them vulnerable on the floor. The men in these video are clearly better swordfighters than what is seen in the present day.
You are right...there are 2 completely different diciplines at work in fencing. I personally like the traditional simply because you have to have a much more hightened awareness of self-preservation even though you know you cannot be killed by these weapons. It is more of in the spirit of an actual duel in the traditional school,and more of a new sport in modern sport fencing. It is interesting to fence with the mindset of "what if these were sharp"? To each his own.
The older schools of sabre are much more enjoyable from a spectator's perspective. In top-notch sabre today, there are few if any parries, and each point is so lightening fast!
Well Kwa17, if you start out with sabre, its not easy, i started out with sabre and recently switched to épée, i would recomend you dont do what i did and please start with foil...lol...o and if you want to find a fencing studio close to you, just google fencing studios near blablabla (blablalba equals where you live) comment on my channel if u have any questions!
Oh don't lie to him, starting off with sabre isn't bad it just makes it difficult to switch away. I did foil for a year then went to sabre for 3 and recently picked up epee. Getting used to parry changed, ain't it a bitch?
I wasnt trying to make it sound negative but, you must agree starting with sabre and going to épée isnt the easiest thing! Alot of people start out with foil...épée is very fun...really gets rid of all those confusing rules...very fun to watch i must add...
It's sabre. The weapons are totally different. The coquille (the guard) is one that covers the hand. The epee (which appears at the beginning of this clip) is a different, round coquille. The epee is the original duelling sword for hits with the point. Sabre is more of a cutting weapon, though you can also use the point, if so desired.
you can tell its sabre and not epee cause the hand gaurd look at it when he solutes. you can tell also because his mask is white not black, white mask's are only used for sabre
im about to go to college and hopefully start fencing (for fun peoples!!)
but whats the difference between foil, sabre and epee? and between modern and classical? coz i was reading the comments and just started wondering!! =)
foil, sabre, and epee involve different types of swords, and different target areas. I'm sure you'll learn about it when you join fencing, which by the way is amazing. I fence at college, and love it. Best of luck to you.
cheers, but it turns out im doing "historical fencing" like the original stuff from italy 1409-1900 i think....? mostly the rapier from italian fencing master capo ferro!
It's epee for the first 45 seconds. Who the hell fences sabre (especially in the olympics) in an en garde position with the tip of the blade pointing straight forward?
That's the problem, really. They SHOULD expect this kind of fencing. The use of electrical apparati and the removal of line judges, not to mention being able to argue the director's decision has really weakened the art, IMO
the rules have changed...nowadays the time span where both could score is much shorter, so its more effective to score by a fast action. if you fidget like that its really easy for the enemy to score by a "tempo"
Now this is the kind of fencing I want to see. Fencing that takes actual skill to win. I agree with the rest of you. Todays sabre requires very little actual skill. My father, if his leg wasn't busted, would probably kill at the sabre competitions, because he has real skill in it. He doesn't disregard parries, and dad also uses mind games. He has actual skill combined with speed, which you rarely see anymore.
A lot of the hits might just be edited out, but they would also have been using steam sabre back then, so I would've thought that some hits would go unnoticed and it would just continue.
fantastic filming...i understand now why L.R. is an important footnote in film history...even if.... The film angles make me think "Fencing" would be a PERFECT sport for this "Short Attention Span " viewrship we enjoy today...
The french screwed up fencing big time. Sabre needed to be different from foil; No more cross-overs with the rear leg. Then the visor mask. Then the wireless nonsense that makes you light up like a bulb.
Now they're doing it to foil with visored masks.
Classically speaking, the french (and italians) was great (and so was Bonaparte) but this modern excuse for a fencing council is just terrible.
Word ... I used to be a foil fencer and it's very hard to make the transition to sabre because of those annoying rules. Basically it all comes down to who has the most stamina and is able to jump around the most, 'cause then apparently you initiated the attack :\
AMEN!!! Like I have stated ad-nauseum, sport fencing as it is executed in modern competition has changed into basically a completely different dicipline. I personally like the esoteric value of "thinking of this as a real weapon". What is the point of striking your opponent a milli-second before he hits you? You both are taking damage! I have no problem per say with the modern fencing game, but there really should be two different schools of thought that are clearly seperated.
in the 30's 40's and 50's alot of cinematographers(filmers) did those kinda shots, they thought they would become big, but as you can tell not alot of companies film like that anymore!
lol, i dont know much about the days of old for fencing. so their box made a phone sound whenever someone sored a touch? imagine that today, but with a common ringtone lol. half the ppl in the audience would check the cell's at every point.
The touch is at 1:18-19 but I cannot understand how it was made, seems to follow the outside parry. We don't get to see it, but any educated experienced guesses?
I hate that this a hero pic with the beauty-boy winning, not a record of a bout. I love the real sound and no overdub "music" crap, thank you for that.
wow.. it took 'em forever to get a touch... still a nice vid to watch... takes ya waaayyyyyy back in the day!! back before i was even born... ahh.. i love fencing.
yeah its amazing how much more methodical it was back then. Now it seems like the emphasis is on athleticism and speed whereas tecnique was important then
High-level sabre, on the other hand, is totally awesome. It seems to be all very high-speed attacks and quick parry/ripostes but occasionally you see these brilliant flashes of amazing intuition, looking three tempi ahead or multi-feint attacks executed at perfect distance.
I actually like it this way because it defies all those showy fencers who use odd parries and arcane footwork combinations just to look cool - the top level sabreurs only deploy their extended skill set as it is required.
Very neat! Interesting to see how the sport has evolved. The competitors are younger, and faster today. Saw a former JR. French champ in L.A., he was amazing. No one scored more than 3 touches on him. I doubt these guy could have taken him. But, that is how it is supposed to be. Perhaps the men in the video have trained current champions?
My first fencing tutor in 1991 was about 80. He had learned his swordsmanship through sabre in a cavalry regiment. He also learned his foil and epee in the classic way. The whole method worked around good balance, not necessarily athleticism, and endless drills of the french parry system. Defend oneself before any attack. Actually how what is in effect a knife fight works. I would do badly in olympic, but I think French grip and theory hold so much more romance.
wow...I don't think I have ever seen someone attacking a blade like that rather than their opponent. This is so much more similar to what real fencing would've been like
its always so much nicer when people fighting with sword simulators actually try real hard not to get hit by the other guys sword simulator. ya know. kinda like how you would try real hard not to get hit with a real sword. dont see much of that now a days in sport fencing.
it seems like old fencing was much more about a sustained duel than it is today; am I right in guessing this is because of the accursed flicking technique I've heard so much about?
I totally agree. Nowadays it is all about charging against the opponent and hoping to score. Back in the 1930's there was a lot more technique envolved.
people like you piss me off. do you even fence sabre? don't even comment it if you don't know how to fence. sabre involves planning, just any other sword does; however, it involves quicker reaction time (parries, disengages, etc) than the other two swords. It's just randomly charging "hoping to score". oh, the ignorance..
I sabre fenced for years, that's why i know what i'm talking about. If someone here is ignorant, that's you. If you think modern fencing envolves the same amount of technique and skill that the 1930's did, you are either blind or stupid.
To add on to edpjunior's statement. Have you ever seen a phrase d'arms in sabre going beyond the third or fourth intention? Fencing is a lot better back then compared to today.
Nice observation. Fencing used to draw huge crowds in the Olympics because there really was this sustained action of blade on blade contact. Now they don't even show the fencing. Fencing did not evolve, it changed into something completely different than worrying about being stabbed or cut. Now its just hope to hit a milli-second before the other guy, look at a light, throw your helmet off and scream really loud, as if no-one saw you and you need attention. Then maybe a handshake.
yuou still need that skill in foil because of priorities and such but it is all about speed nowadays but it is on tv sometimes just really really late
We actually operate in the right of way with Sabre as well. I love Epee, but in the school Maestro Evangelista teaches, we have lots of parries and back and forth action even in it. We practice HEAVILY the object of defense and a self-preservation mind set that supercedes just trying to get a touch before your opponent. IT is all what you go for, really. I love the thought of a blade sport that puts the honus on "what if these were sharp"? That thinking really enhances the experience for me
Eletric sabre as is today stinks. Something should be devised to force sabrists to perform clear cutting hits instead of anything that manages to touch the conductive part of the opponent's suit and then screaming like a retard to the referee.
of course, you need to do more research of fencing history before posting... (This is one fencing myth that needs to die!)
As mentioned above, Italian dueling sabres were meant specifically for non-mounted duels. The Hungarians also dueled sabres on foot in the 17th century (google for "hungarian sabre manuscript", first link). However, modern sabre's rules are more based on 18th century singlestick than anything else, which itself comes from the practice of backsword and dueling sabres.
It's epee first (you can see the bell guards and handles), then saber (you can hear the announcer say so. Plus it's not actual competitive fencing; it's a staged exhibition.
Ysbadadden 8 months ago 2
VadersEyesAreRed is absolutely right. It's epee and then sabre.
elikohlenberg 9 months ago
This is actually without a doubt épée. The bell is the sound of the electric scoring system implemented in 1936; the first of its kind. Sabre did not have electric scoring until, surprisingly, 1988.
nemesisjoe 10 months ago
@nemesisjoe i'd say sabre, look at the hand guard, as well as the slashing style.
CollingwoodsCreation 10 months ago
they look exacly the same
0mriphone0 1 year ago
the handguards looked like they were sabers....so what is it?
kusarifundo 1 year ago
@kusarifundo the title says sabre.
saberwing505 1 year ago
for all those debating whether this is epée or sabre, there are actually two different fights. The first one is epée, when the film focuses largely on the shadows rather than the fencers themselves; the second is Sabre.
VadersEyesAreRed 1 year ago 2
The bad news it this is epee not sabre. The good news is this is footage used on a Rammstein video (stripped) :)
antleredzen 1 year ago
Is this a heavy sabre?
0mriphone0 1 year ago
I'm a fencing coach...I did freeze the frame...they are epees....in those days that was how close they stood. No need to reply...just enjoy that we have these films
cccanole 1 year ago
This is epee not sabre
cccanole 1 year ago
@cccanole Actually, if you stop the film it is plain that they have sabres in their hands. They fence more like it is foil, no head cuts at all. Too close for epee. I have to think a while about why sabre would be done this way then.
deaddoc 1 year ago
I have a foil. I did see a teenage girl. So fast.
82abnoff 1 year ago
insannnne bladeworkkkk
ejlahti 1 year ago
This is the real way to fence sabre and foil. Think about it. If you actually were going to fight someone with a sharp blade you would not just charge in like a fool stabbing wildly.
MrMEOWNICK7 1 year ago 3
@MrMEOWNICK7 Too bad its like a race nowadays in sabre too get points.
yihd 1 year ago
Check out the all new 3 weapon scoring box just search youtube for "fencing scoring box" as it won't let me put the complete link but this is the last part - /watch?v=qoxkHLFAVoI
bodylanguageman 1 year ago
So cordial.
Garboth 1 year ago
this is terrible, the perspective is complete crap, I can;t see a damn thing. why bother filming fencing in a way that it cannot be seen properly.
useless
stirfriedsushi 1 year ago
this is not an instructional video, dummy. this is cinema arte.
willfullyobscure 1 year ago
@stirfriedsushi Shut the fuck up and watch Transformers then.
skrikesomengris 1 year ago
tronsformirz is t3h b3st moive evar dont dis it u nuub
Joking! I fence for the Icelandic team of Fencers! :D
There are ten of us, in the whole of Iceland.
:(
Warewolf943 1 year ago
This has been flagged as spam show
@stirfriedsushi Shut the fuck up and watch Transformers then.
skrikesomengris 1 year ago
Ist das ein wunderschönes Fechten! Herrlich!
Jenseits von dem heutigen, hektischen Punktefechten um jeden Preis! DAS war noch Technik!
Von Leni R. hervorragend in Bild und Ton eingefangen!
5 Sterne!
leuchtfeuer1 2 years ago
je trouve qu ils font plus de parade qu aujourd hui , donc plus apreciable en therme visuel , et surement plus technique ,
FGEGSFG 2 years ago
I thought someones head was going to get cut off for a moment. =)
SinisterAppleJuice 2 years ago 2
This comment has received too many negative votes show
if one of these guys went against a new fencer even with old rules... the new fencer would win... just because its too fast for the common spectator doesn't mean they are bad... haha nobody around here thought about rush like they do today... think about it this is before the blitz and the blitz was so radical it overwhelmed everything... fencers today are like the blitz and these people are like trench warfare...
mianniach 2 years ago
but a mutual hit seperated by half a second doesnt happen half of the time
wrsatm 2 years ago
how could they tell who struck the opponent first without the electronics they use today?
guitar2adam 2 years ago
Each bout had 4 persons watching for hits (2 per fencer) and one director. Some hits were unnoticeable so they weren't counted
jbujko 2 years ago
In fenceing you have a judge who calls what happened and who won the point. I am not only learning how to fence but how to judge. It's important that the fencers make their atack clear to show the judge what they intend and that the fencers are honest and have the pide to call a "touchche moi" The old fashion way is great especially when you can't afford the buzzers... ;)
akualtekefan 2 years ago
Charcoal tips in epee marked on the vest. Otherwise, they have many people watching very closely :P
limescout 2 years ago
Leni, for Gods sake move the camera back and let the action speak for itself!
aardvaark069 2 years ago
That is some beautiful fencing!
wetmelon 2 years ago
It's that old duelist's mentality of fencing as though the blades were sharp because if you jerk around at practice you could wind up dead in the real thing. I'm a misfit at my studio because of this classical mentality while everyone else plays to the box. To each their own though. I can understand people who like it for the sport and people like me who like it for the martial aspect both enjoy a wonderful pastime.
Neale88 2 years ago
Why not look into Shinkendo? Not only do you get to spar, you also work on developing your cutting skills using a live blade.
TangomanX2008 2 years ago
thats some great swordplay
Dilliboy63 2 years ago 11
i like the way they hold there ground. modern fencers dive in ending up both stabbed . so in theory if it was real this seems way better..
rabit8mike 2 years ago 23
@rabit8mike
That is exactly right. They are essentially two completely different diciplines at this time.....
jasonjmj 1 year ago
@rabit8mike yea well modern fencers have the lame technology where as in those times lame technology wasn't available so the right of way rule was really hard to apply.
Matadancer 10 months ago
This is the kind of fencing I enjoy. Modern fencing is just crap. There's too much lunging.
mayleman0 2 years ago
Why do they do it? Just exploiting the rules?
AMcGrath82 2 years ago
As a matter of geometry, the point has a longer reach than a slash, unless you are slashing at the wrist while your opponent thrusts at your torso.
66Scorpio 2 years ago
Watching, maybe... But I can say that actually doing it is as exciting as ever, and that's for any weapon, in fact. You can die of boredom if you watch epee fencing, but it's completely different when you're doing it yourself. Same with baseball I guess.
Shumeshi 2 years ago 2
I like watching Epee and foil :[
Haven't really got to watch a sabre fight though, except for youtube.
ForeverDorian 2 years ago
To someone new to fencing isn't this more akin to real fighting or are modern day fencers just better?
almond7862 2 years ago
This comment has received too many negative votes show
modern are just better... even by these rules modern fencers wud win everytime... one guy was like hey if i/m really fast and hit him then i'll get the point and everyone realized its better... i hate all the people who complain about its not real sword play... cause its not trying to simulate a sword fight... its a sport with rules and the better athlete wins.. if u dont like how its done go away
mianniach 2 years ago
better compared to what?? almost every sport derived from martial art become worst from martial art's point of view, but better from sport's point of view.
And fencing surely WAS to simulate a sword fight. Since killing other people, even in fair match, prohibited by the law, people keep trying to invent anything to make it safer. And since there's no point to learn how to defend ourself with a sword this days, the martial art's side of fencing is fading and the sport's side now is dominating.
Ardian1899 2 years ago
2 different diciplines. I've mentioned it before, one is not better than the other. It comes down to if you want to honor the art of fencing as it was originally erected and in what spirit vs. the "new" version which is simply to hit somebody a split second before you yourself are impaled on the opponents weapon.
jasonjmj 2 years ago 2
Comment removed
rabit8mike 2 years ago
Not necessarily... they were more cautious but that does not translate directly to more skill.
ifwere1021 2 years ago
Comment removed
rabit8mike 2 years ago
wasn't this epee?
jumperboy1976 2 years ago
No, it's sabre
pinquifrustri 2 years ago
The beginning weapon is epee, the final is sabre.
marycolettaburns 2 years ago
You're right, I thought he meant the final match. Thanks for correction.
pinquifrustri 2 years ago
Großartige Kamera-Einstellungen! Ein Genuss für's Auge!
Wenn man bedenkt, dass die Aufnahmen jetzt schon weit über 70 Jahre alt sind, kann man nur sagen: Hut ab!
Wunderschönes Fechten übrigens! Kein Vergleich zum heutigen, todlangweiligen Überschall-Hightech-Gehopse!
5 Sterne!
leuchtfeuer1 2 years ago
This was a better fencing as its rythm was slower, making it more technically challenging.
pinquifrustri 2 years ago
c'est fou comme le sabre d'aujourd'hui est différent de celui des années 1930!
Oxxident 2 years ago
Why don't fencers fence like this today? In the other videos, the combat happens within a few milliseconds. I like this way better.
xUobteXx 3 years ago
fencers today fence for themselves, not for your amusement.
hyppolitoocho 2 years ago 3
So you're saying this type of fencing was for show?
xUobteXx 2 years ago
i dissagree with hypp. today fencers can fence electric which is a lot easer to see when a touch was made becuase a light goes off when a touch is made unlike back then where you would need to see the blade actully touch your oppent so it was slower and more tecnically
xlsniper50000 2 years ago
no but its like if u look at hockey in 1930 and hockey today.. today its way faster and more dodgey... at first fencing was a way of practicing how to sword fight and then it started to grow into a sport... and these people are when it wasnt really a true sport... now its a sport.. two people with metal rods trying to hit the other person first using the rules of the sport... if u dont like it do something else
mianniach 2 years ago
That's like saying that "point karate" is a legitimate sport when it trains people to dive through the air for the sake of a punch that barely scrapes their opponent's chest guard and leaves them vulnerable on the floor. The men in these video are clearly better swordfighters than what is seen in the present day.
Forteverum 2 years ago 2
You are right...there are 2 completely different diciplines at work in fencing. I personally like the traditional simply because you have to have a much more hightened awareness of self-preservation even though you know you cannot be killed by these weapons. It is more of in the spirit of an actual duel in the traditional school,and more of a new sport in modern sport fencing. It is interesting to fence with the mindset of "what if these were sharp"? To each his own.
jasonjmj 2 years ago
sounds like the phone rings...and they have to stop to answer...
xpez 3 years ago
The older schools of sabre are much more enjoyable from a spectator's perspective. In top-notch sabre today, there are few if any parries, and each point is so lightening fast!
cth1729 3 years ago
i agree this is far better then any modern day fencing..watching this makes me want to try it...
rabit8mike 3 years ago
fencing aside. i can't help but think of Adolf Hitler and Jesse Owens when it comes to the 1936 Olympics.
stevenc08 3 years ago
This match is far superior to most of the matches I have seen on You Tube, most especially the video entitled Fencing Saber Torinto.
That video has to have been the WORST!
This video however was MASTERFUL!
MrTerrificII 3 years ago
dumbass
mianniach 2 years ago
Indeed you are!
MrTerrificII 2 years ago
steel contact sorry
greatbosun 3 years ago
so much stell contact. guess this is the old convention.
greatbosun 3 years ago
mossey7-
Do your 'original Pro's like it AGAINST the fencing as well? Or is that not original enough for them?
reggie18b 3 years ago
The original Pro's like it is down at fencing gear com
mossey7 3 years ago
bloody hell they just show shadows fighting ...
ybother55 3 years ago
I've never done fencing before is it difficult to start? There's nowhere around where I live which does it.
Kwa17 3 years ago
Well Kwa17, if you start out with sabre, its not easy, i started out with sabre and recently switched to épée, i would recomend you dont do what i did and please start with foil...lol...o and if you want to find a fencing studio close to you, just google fencing studios near blablabla (blablalba equals where you live) comment on my channel if u have any questions!
sabrefilms 3 years ago
Oh don't lie to him, starting off with sabre isn't bad it just makes it difficult to switch away. I did foil for a year then went to sabre for 3 and recently picked up epee. Getting used to parry changed, ain't it a bitch?
throkrigar 3 years ago
I wasnt trying to make it sound negative but, you must agree starting with sabre and going to épée isnt the easiest thing! Alot of people start out with foil...épée is very fun...really gets rid of all those confusing rules...very fun to watch i must add...
sabrefilms 3 years ago
well it takes about 6 months to get the footwork and all tht you should search for it or call your local operater from al
mihary from all the way in the middle east qatar
mishary1993 3 years ago
great video and great fencing! Go epee and sabre!
sabrefilms 3 years ago
you guys argue I'm going fencing.
bbwbb2 3 years ago
It's sabre. The weapons are totally different. The coquille (the guard) is one that covers the hand. The epee (which appears at the beginning of this clip) is a different, round coquille. The epee is the original duelling sword for hits with the point. Sabre is more of a cutting weapon, though you can also use the point, if so desired.
oxenfoord 3 years ago
you can tell its sabre and not epee cause the hand gaurd look at it when he solutes. you can tell also because his mask is white not black, white mask's are only used for sabre
tyandrichie 3 years ago
im about to go to college and hopefully start fencing (for fun peoples!!)
but whats the difference between foil, sabre and epee? and between modern and classical? coz i was reading the comments and just started wondering!! =)
Rosewrayth 3 years ago
to rosewrayth.
foil, sabre, and epee involve different types of swords, and different target areas. I'm sure you'll learn about it when you join fencing, which by the way is amazing. I fence at college, and love it. Best of luck to you.
xocandyxo33 3 years ago
cheers, but it turns out im doing "historical fencing" like the original stuff from italy 1409-1900 i think....? mostly the rapier from italian fencing master capo ferro!
anyway thanks! =D
Rosewrayth 3 years ago 2
the first part is foil, not sabre.
jtofgc 3 years ago
what r u talking about...it is sabre
chrisp1111 3 years ago
it's epee, sabre runs up and down the strip, and plus if you look at the shadows the bell guards are completely different
nightmuse11 3 years ago
Nope, it's epee.
MacDragard 3 years ago
No, it's sabre. You can tell by the handles... Don't try to act as if you know what you're talking about when really, you have no idea.
ShortMonkey1 3 years ago
It's epee for the first 45 seconds. Who the hell fences sabre (especially in the olympics) in an en garde position with the tip of the blade pointing straight forward?
MacDragard 3 years ago
Is this real fencing? They are damn fast!
ratzefuj 3 years ago 3
Of course it is real. There are three types of fencing-this one happens to be saber.
CarnaticConnection 3 years ago
But now fencing sabre is nothing like it used to be.... It was very elegant.
MauricioOspinaDiago 3 years ago
So who won?
mihaile 3 years ago
The Hungarian.
wibba 3 years ago
@wibba Adam Sors?
djdomusic 1 year ago
Woah! This is so old! It's amazing to see how much the weapon has changed over time!
I think many people who don't fence expect this kind of fencing.
vikingflower 3 years ago 5
That's the problem, really. They SHOULD expect this kind of fencing. The use of electrical apparati and the removal of line judges, not to mention being able to argue the director's decision has really weakened the art, IMO
RumRunner2008 3 years ago
by the way it does actually takes a lot of skill to fence nowadays...its just barely to see for observers which are not close to fencing
thoughter 3 years ago 3
the rules have changed...nowadays the time span where both could score is much shorter, so its more effective to score by a fast action. if you fidget like that its really easy for the enemy to score by a "tempo"
thoughter 3 years ago
does anyone teach fencing like this anymore i would love to learn it
sassysmarts123 3 years ago 3
There are teachers out there that teach classical fencing, check your local college or fencing school!
vectorb 3 years ago
That's what real sebre fencing is supposed to be, fencing that takes actual skill, not like these days with electric crap...
ketat10250 3 years ago
i fence
assassins08 3 years ago
nice
Monica15N 3 years ago
skill
chhavslayer 3 years ago 2
Now this is the kind of fencing I want to see. Fencing that takes actual skill to win. I agree with the rest of you. Todays sabre requires very little actual skill. My father, if his leg wasn't busted, would probably kill at the sabre competitions, because he has real skill in it. He doesn't disregard parries, and dad also uses mind games. He has actual skill combined with speed, which you rarely see anymore.
QueenNilstria 3 years ago
its suprising to see how much slower sabre was then, in terms of fight duration not specific movement or player speed.
funkyfreshjuice 3 years ago 3
A lot of the hits might just be edited out, but they would also have been using steam sabre back then, so I would've thought that some hits would go unnoticed and it would just continue.
lolzomfgmen 3 years ago
fantastic filming...i understand now why L.R. is an important footnote in film history...even if.... The film angles make me think "Fencing" would be a PERFECT sport for this "Short Attention Span " viewrship we enjoy today...
AlexMackinum 3 years ago
The fencing in this film (particularly at 49 seconds) is amazing.
Mortarbug 3 years ago
The french screwed up fencing big time. Sabre needed to be different from foil; No more cross-overs with the rear leg. Then the visor mask. Then the wireless nonsense that makes you light up like a bulb.
Now they're doing it to foil with visored masks.
Classically speaking, the french (and italians) was great (and so was Bonaparte) but this modern excuse for a fencing council is just terrible.
D04S02B04 3 years ago
Endre Kabos
Olympia 3xGold,
Europe 6xGold,
nice.
lordanaxagoras 3 years ago 2
Endre Kabos
Olympia 3xGold,
Europe 6xGold,
nice.
lordanaxagoras 3 years ago
That's what sabre fencing should be, not this running at your opponent and swinging nonsense.
ROCKINjew 3 years ago 2
Word ... I used to be a foil fencer and it's very hard to make the transition to sabre because of those annoying rules. Basically it all comes down to who has the most stamina and is able to jump around the most, 'cause then apparently you initiated the attack :\
Mujave 3 years ago
AMEN!!! Like I have stated ad-nauseum, sport fencing as it is executed in modern competition has changed into basically a completely different dicipline. I personally like the esoteric value of "thinking of this as a real weapon". What is the point of striking your opponent a milli-second before he hits you? You both are taking damage! I have no problem per say with the modern fencing game, but there really should be two different schools of thought that are clearly seperated.
jasonjmj 3 years ago
wow its a lot different to sabre of today
UKSlayerX5 3 years ago
in the 30's 40's and 50's alot of cinematographers(filmers) did those kinda shots, they thought they would become big, but as you can tell not alot of companies film like that anymore!
JackJones1234567 3 years ago
Ahhh. Sabre as it should be... with bladework and parries and all!
Mergandevinasander 3 years ago 4
does anybody else feel that the first bit of footage is like watching peter pan? with all the shadows i mean...
roguebeliever 3 years ago 4
Yeah lol
LordKratosofpwn 3 years ago
ummmm. nope. just you.
Zombieeatface 3 years ago
lol, i dont know much about the days of old for fencing. so their box made a phone sound whenever someone sored a touch? imagine that today, but with a common ringtone lol. half the ppl in the audience would check the cell's at every point.
t4l2l2z4n 3 years ago
The touch is at 1:18-19 but I cannot understand how it was made, seems to follow the outside parry. We don't get to see it, but any educated experienced guesses?
I hate that this a hero pic with the beauty-boy winning, not a record of a bout. I love the real sound and no overdub "music" crap, thank you for that.
proobu 3 years ago
yeah... you see so many fencers now who just make a stab in the dark. They're so ridiculously annoying to fence against! Especially when they're tall.
My mum fenced as well, and we've still got a really old foil and helmet in the basement somewhere. I feel much safer with the modern equipment ^^
kelda123123 3 years ago
wow.. it took 'em forever to get a touch... still a nice vid to watch... takes ya waaayyyyyy back in the day!! back before i was even born... ahh.. i love fencing.
lamill21 3 years ago
Nadia Riefenstahl (The dicrectrice of this film) was so gorgeous looking.She can be a screen goddess. She ie more beautiful then Marlene Dietrich.
canman5060 4 years ago
What's that got to do with fencing? Lmao ;)
Fencing's awesome
Ibarrasxgirl 3 years ago
Well... SOOOO much has changed/evolved in the world of fencing over the years.
Also--this is a promotional video as you can see, so... some things were "made dramatic" as you see it here...
greytale 4 years ago 2
Agree
wibba 4 years ago
this fencing in this video is so much better than the others
KatzBeatles 4 years ago 4
Sabre was so much better back then when there was actually some bladework. And each touch lasted for more than 2 seconds.
NCFencer 4 years ago 6
yeah its amazing how much more methodical it was back then. Now it seems like the emphasis is on athleticism and speed whereas tecnique was important then
jeffmcharlton 4 years ago 6
hehe i might get yelled at this but i like to think as most lower level saber as:
run. smack. yell. repeat.
and then of course there are the minority who can parry.
xxVispilloxx 4 years ago
High-level sabre, on the other hand, is totally awesome. It seems to be all very high-speed attacks and quick parry/ripostes but occasionally you see these brilliant flashes of amazing intuition, looking three tempi ahead or multi-feint attacks executed at perfect distance.
I actually like it this way because it defies all those showy fencers who use odd parries and arcane footwork combinations just to look cool - the top level sabreurs only deploy their extended skill set as it is required.
questionch 4 years ago 4
Very neat! Interesting to see how the sport has evolved. The competitors are younger, and faster today. Saw a former JR. French champ in L.A., he was amazing. No one scored more than 3 touches on him. I doubt these guy could have taken him. But, that is how it is supposed to be. Perhaps the men in the video have trained current champions?
DigiDM 4 years ago
those damn nazis. they were good at making short films, have to give them that.
lifeonthisplanet 4 years ago 2
Nadia Reifenstahl was very gorgeous looking German blonde. Not some kind of Nazi.
canman5060 4 years ago
Do you mean (Helene Bertha Amalie) "Leni" Riefenstahl?
The director of the film...
Well she was a fantastic director - but she sure was a Nazi.
LenaKronberg 3 years ago
This was suppose to be a reply to canman5060...
LenaKronberg 3 years ago
I'm glad that they introduced the S2000 stiffer blades. At least now a days you can parry and repost.
rollyz2000 4 years ago
My first fencing tutor in 1991 was about 80. He had learned his swordsmanship through sabre in a cavalry regiment. He also learned his foil and epee in the classic way. The whole method worked around good balance, not necessarily athleticism, and endless drills of the french parry system. Defend oneself before any attack. Actually how what is in effect a knife fight works. I would do badly in olympic, but I think French grip and theory hold so much more romance.
jamesmccubbin 4 years ago 2
wow...I don't think I have ever seen someone attacking a blade like that rather than their opponent. This is so much more similar to what real fencing would've been like
PianistandFencer 4 years ago
That's fencing! That's the real skill ! And one of is hungarian ^^
patrikkatona 4 years ago
holy shit that is so cool
kurrshing 4 years ago 2
Now that is Fencing! Not this new shit where they only try to hit you.
Ace8off 4 years ago
:O
they never make em like they used to :P
HardmanEntertainment 4 years ago
its always so much nicer when people fighting with sword simulators actually try real hard not to get hit by the other guys sword simulator. ya know. kinda like how you would try real hard not to get hit with a real sword. dont see much of that now a days in sport fencing.
jammerwock 4 years ago
The guy on the right is fully sweet at parrying.
tulsylgu 4 years ago
This comment has received too many negative votes show
TECHNIQUE?!?!?!!?
these guys suck.
they barely move and parry too much.
wasup109 4 years ago
Oh wow, you're amazing.
NanashiiKnight 4 years ago
Nice clip. Looks like it comes from a movie though.
Andrinor44 4 years ago
it seems like old fencing was much more about a sustained duel than it is today; am I right in guessing this is because of the accursed flicking technique I've heard so much about?
Surells 4 years ago
way cool - more skill and much more engaging than modern sabre fencing IMHO.
MarkHolgate 4 years ago
I totally agree. Nowadays it is all about charging against the opponent and hoping to score. Back in the 1930's there was a lot more technique envolved.
edpjunior 4 years ago 2
too true. modern saber = run at them screaming.
Eidlones 4 years ago 2
people like you piss me off. do you even fence sabre? don't even comment it if you don't know how to fence. sabre involves planning, just any other sword does; however, it involves quicker reaction time (parries, disengages, etc) than the other two swords. It's just randomly charging "hoping to score". oh, the ignorance..
ryokubaka 4 years ago
I was generalizing. I have done sabre, and it just goes too fast for my liking. I prefer foil
Eidlones 4 years ago
I sabre fenced for years, that's why i know what i'm talking about. If someone here is ignorant, that's you. If you think modern fencing envolves the same amount of technique and skill that the 1930's did, you are either blind or stupid.
edpjunior 4 years ago 4
To add on to edpjunior's statement. Have you ever seen a phrase d'arms in sabre going beyond the third or fourth intention? Fencing is a lot better back then compared to today.
D04S02B04 4 years ago 3
because the fought with swords back than, sadly not anymore.
ijzer1 4 years ago
This fencing is so much cooler than modern olympic fencing! The rock!
xamb 4 years ago
Nice observation. Fencing used to draw huge crowds in the Olympics because there really was this sustained action of blade on blade contact. Now they don't even show the fencing. Fencing did not evolve, it changed into something completely different than worrying about being stabbed or cut. Now its just hope to hit a milli-second before the other guy, look at a light, throw your helmet off and scream really loud, as if no-one saw you and you need attention. Then maybe a handshake.
jasonjmj 3 years ago 6
well maybe in saber and epee
yuou still need that skill in foil because of priorities and such but it is all about speed nowadays but it is on tv sometimes just really really late
zalphizzy 3 years ago
We actually operate in the right of way with Sabre as well. I love Epee, but in the school Maestro Evangelista teaches, we have lots of parries and back and forth action even in it. We practice HEAVILY the object of defense and a self-preservation mind set that supercedes just trying to get a touch before your opponent. IT is all what you go for, really. I love the thought of a blade sport that puts the honus on "what if these were sharp"? That thinking really enhances the experience for me
waGiE5fW 3 years ago 2
Eletric sabre as is today stinks. Something should be devised to force sabrists to perform clear cutting hits instead of anything that manages to touch the conductive part of the opponent's suit and then screaming like a retard to the referee.
hermitcleric 3 years ago 2
amazing!!
martinobaro 4 years ago
of course, sabre was never meant as a weapon for dueling, since it was conceived for use by cavalry troops...
i'd call this better than modern sabre fencing; this is all bladework. none of that stupid peter westbrook charging and screaming crap.
perdidopunk 4 years ago
You've obviously never heard of Italian dueling sabre, which was developed specifically for dueling.
kmoser 4 years ago
of course, you need to do more research of fencing history before posting... (This is one fencing myth that needs to die!)
As mentioned above, Italian dueling sabres were meant specifically for non-mounted duels. The Hungarians also dueled sabres on foot in the 17th century (google for "hungarian sabre manuscript", first link). However, modern sabre's rules are more based on 18th century singlestick than anything else, which itself comes from the practice of backsword and dueling sabres.
Desco911 3 years ago