Thanks for that analysis, one thing to note is that the lake of fire (valley of Gehenna) was meant for the 'second death' not eternal punishment. Just as a landfill fire can last for years, but destroys garbage completely, so will that lake of fire. It's not eternal torture, it is the end of existence for those who reject God's values calling black white, God evil.
David had an understanding that eternal life was possible and asked to not be forgotten (Psalm 16:10).
xu1997. My point is to prove that there is a literal hell that can be escaped by accepting the finished work of Jesus Christ. He saves all who believe on Him for eternal life. John 3:16. John 3:36. John 6:47. Acts 16:31. God bless.
Psalm 9:17 The wicked shall be turned into hell, and all the nations that forget God. Psalm 16:10 For thou wilt not leave my soul in hell; neither wilt thou suffer thine Holy One to see corruption.
John 3:15. That whosoever believeth in Him should not perish, but have eternal life.
Revelations 21:8 But the cowardly, unbelieving, vile, murderers,sexually immoral, those who practice magic arts, idolator, and all liars, there place will be in the fiery lake of burning sulfur. = HELL
13 The sea gave up the dead that were in it, and death and Hades gave up the dead that were in them, and each person was judged according to what they had done. 14 Then death and Hades were thrown into the lake of fire. The lake of fire is the second death. 15 Anyone whose name was not found written in the book of life was thrown into the lake of fire.
You don't know you're bible old man. You are a follower of Charles taze Russell. You are not Christian and are brainwashed wake up and stop following the wrong doctrine.
@CamdenChristadelphia You believe in the KING JAMES BIBLE? You're a liar my friend. The NWT is NOT the the REAL bible, its changed to fit what you believe. You are a follower of CHARLES TAZE RUSSELL, YOU DENY JESUS' DIETY, YOU'RE BRAINWASHED, YOU USE THE WATCHTOWER MORE THAN THE BIBLE. WAKE UP!
Love never fails. God will never fail. If He truly loves people, He wouldn't torture them for all of eternity. Love & eternal torment cannot go together. God is just, yes, but He is not cruel.
1 Tim 4:10- This is why we work hard and continue to struggle, for our hope is in the living God, who is the Savior of all people and particularly of all believers.
1 John 2:2- He himself is the sacrifice that atones for our sins—and not only our sins but the sins of all the world.
Psalm 103:8-10- The Lord is compassionate and merciful, slow to get angry and filled with unfailing love. He will not constantly accuse us, nor remain angry forever. He does not punish us for all our sins; he does not deal harshly with us, as we deserve.
The Bible is a heterogenous collection of books written by mostly ignorant and misogynous tribesmen over thousands of years who claimed the authority of God in order to impose their agenda and will on the people.
@Vierotchka Very good. You have shown your ignorance as to how the Bible came to us.
Go and do some homework on the subject,there's plenty of history recorded on how the word of God has been preserved.
I can understand how you feel. Human nature hates the thought of an authoritarian figure telling us what to do, that's why people like yoursef reject the Bible and therefore reject God.
@CamdenChristadelphia I HAVE done my homework about the origins of the Bible, you obviously haven't. Rejecting the Bible doesn't mean rejecting God, your clumsy post hoc ergo propter hoc logical fallacy notwithstanding. What if the Koran is the Word of God? What if the Upanishads are the Word of God? What if the Vedas are the Word of God? If the Bible is the Word of God, why does God contradict Himself so often? You are the one with a huge problem.
@CamdenChristadelphia The one who is confused is yourself. Just because the Bible says so doesn't mean it is so. Never has Jesus, in any of the Gospels, made the claim that he was the only begotten son of God. Furthermore, the oldest Gospel was written decades after the passing of Jesus. Neither book is "true" - they are both written by men. Did you not know that the whole mythology surrounding Jesus was borrowed verbatim from the mythology surrounding Mithras?
here in india coimbatore there is a small holes not more than one inch from one house toilet room from which the souls are taken under earth several thousands kilometers away please .request you to save every molecule of souls and humans from pains and sufferings
request and pray ---every human every soul either good or bad ,angle or evil ,sinner,demon , god or devil every one want to live as a good humanbeing --please save
instead of killing ,spoiling lives,destroying ,sending under earth ,hells ,if some place is given far away from india .and some thing are done for better to improve the qualities of humans and souls .so that every one can live
Mark 9:43-44 And if thy hand offend thee, cut it off: it is better for thee to enter into life maimed, than having two hands to go into hell, into the fire that never shall be quenched: Where their worm dieth not, and the fire is not quenched.
Hell is the grave, Gehenna is a figurative term for judgement in this life on the house of god. There is no "eternal" punishment or reward for Aion and the plural Aionias have never meant eternal, then what of the plural? Forevers? Eternaties? No, Age & Ages or Eon & Eons. We do not receive eternal life we receive immortality, literally in the Greek "Deathlessness" the inability to die for death and the grave are done away with.
Most people only want to believe there is a heaven,but refuse to admit there is a hell.hell is the opposite to heaven just like Satan is the opposite to God.God created this horrible place that's said to be located under the earth,but it's so deep there's no way to discover this awful place in flesh and blood.
@nostalgiamelancolia1 Do you have Scripture for your statements, "nostalgia"? I don't know that I've seen any of God's Word speak to your statements here.
@nostalgiamelancolia1 Satan is NOT God's opposite! God created Satan so how could he be an opposite. Satan was a "son" of God that fell. NOT an opposite. He may be evil but certainly not the opposite. Study more. Also, Hell is mistranslated from the word Gehena. Gehena was a place that they threw their trash and burning bodies. God Bless and Peace in Jesus name.
The Bible does not teach eternal punishment. God's love and mercy endures forever. Does it really endure forever or only in this life? How can it be Good News if it doesn't translate to the afterlife?
1 Timothy 4:10- This is why we work hard and continue to struggle, for our hope is in the living God, who is the Savior of all people and particularly of all believers.
The Bible does not teach eternal punishment. God's love and mercy endures forever. Does it really endure forever or only in this life? How can it be Good News if it doesn't translate to the afterlife?
1 Timothy 4:10- This is why we work hard and continue to struggle, for our hope is in the living God, who is the Savior of all people and particularly of all believers.
What happens when you die? Have you told lies, stolen, used God's name in vain(10 Commandments)? If yes, then you're a liar, thief, and a blasphemer in the sight of God. When you die & be judged by God, you'll be guilty of sin, & go to Hell! But God sent His Son Jesus to shed His blood & die on a cross for your sins, He was buried & rose again from the dead on the third day. If you'll believe the Gospel(Jesus died for your sins,was buried & resurrected)you'll not perish & have eternal life
Gehennah is also mentioned in Jeremiah. A lot of people don't realize that. A lot of people try to figure out stuff out in the New Testament, that they'd already be familiar with of they'd read the Old Testament. The book of Revelation is a primary example of this. A lot of the stuff written about in Revelation, was already written about in Jeremiah, Isaiah, Ezekiel etc. And is expounded upon in those books. Jesus and John are expecting you to be familiar with what they are talking about.
Gehannah is where they burned the garbage its mentioned 12 times in the new testament. Jesus pointed to Gehennah to warn people thats where they would go, i got my waming from God while taking my garbage out sept of 2008 , watch my video, titled I am the truth the life and the way, youll see my wanring to change my ways. thanx God bless!
The word "hell" doesn't have anything to do with fire!!!
The word "hell" comes from two words. The Hebrew word She'ohl, that means grave or pit and the Greek word Hades, which refers to the common grave of dead mankind.
Jesus was in Hell(grave), but GOD raised him up. Acts.2:27,31
The word "hell" doesn't have anything to do with fire!!!
Jesus says......
Mark.9
[43] And if thy hand offend thee, cut it off: it is better for thee to enter into life maimed, than having two hands to go into hell, into the fire that never shall be quenched:
@adavecdave Oh, you're right "dave," 1st Dave 2:15 says, "That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth an eternal hell and believe in your heart that most will go there, you cannot be saved." Forgot about that one, thanks for reminding me!;)
I once did believe in hell but got saved. Now I don't anymore. For me hell would be not to qualify for eternal life. Not being with my creator. "Hell" was used by the early church to get people to accept christianity out of fear. That it. Do you really think a loving god will punish someone for eternity! lol
@petruscephas Nice, Scriptural refutation "Pete"! And if you are implying that a denial of "hell" is basis for not being resurrected to life and receiving immortality with Jesus, well, you simply don't know God's Word! You should listen again to this well thought out, accurately described, Scripturally accurate and historically enlightening presentation! You may learn a few things.
@petruscephas Thanks for this Scriptural response, "pete"! Where did you get that from? Oh, that's right "pete," 1st petruscepas 2:15 says, "That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth an eternal hell and believe in your heart that most will go there, you cannot be saved." Forgot about that one, thanks for reminding me!;) "pete" the reality is, people have serious, wellfounded questions about the current teaching on "hell". How r u gonna consign folks to it for asking? I'd be careful if I were u!
@CamdenChristadelphia Ha ha ha ha ha! Hey jackass, do you know you made a very similar comment to me 4 months ago. Why don't you get some new material Forrest.
I just made an observation that the guy looked like the drifter in that movie, what's your over reaction all about?
Sounds like another Christian all pissed off and ready to engage his delusional made up enemies.
@CamdenChristadelphia Well, if you act like a jack ass expect to be treated like one. The photo request is getting disturbing. Oh well, what do you expect from a grown man who believes in talking snakes?
So judgement is carried out on a rubbish tip now? Too many mistranslations/personal views of a primitive fictional book, reality is much more beautiful!
Thank you for that I knew a loving God would not create a place of eternal punishment That Just did not sound true to me. What you have said sound a lot better and true. Thanks
In Scripture it appears that "hell" is a term more referred to either of these two outcomes, both being death of the soul:
1. A person/soul that chose an incredibly evil & destructive life (murderers without remorse etc.) hating everything and unwilling to change~their souls will be destroyed.
2. Those that lived this type of life will not be resurrected and just be dead forever in their sin.
There is no definition of "hell." The base word is "Ghehenna" "hell or hell-fire" is anciently derived from the non-stop fires of the garbage pits. Someone reasoned that if there is a good place after death then there must be a bad place. Jesus effectively described "hell" as a state of the supreme ignorance of heavenliness and that understanding him would destroy the reverse or animal nature that is identified with this turning away from heavenliness or the Godly state of immortal being.
@sjm8890 Not necessarily true some atheist are good and bad and some believers are good and bad. atheist have become believers and some believers have become atheist but both run their lives according to their own hearts. In other words if you bad your gonna be bad if your good your gonna be good. Also some atheist who have changed to believe and also believers have become good not from fear but from feeling the spirit which has changed their lives to believe and to be better people.
Hell is also metaphorically describd as a place of torment for the damned and judged which of extreme anguish for being antichrist in spirit. Simple enough.
Hell is the absence of goodness. Hell is not in the afterlife, but in this one, a state of mind where one is tormented by their own thoughts and desires and greed and hate. Heaven is a state of mind that is the opposite; one's thoughts bring great joy and happiness and love, a desire to improve, and great strength when the external world attempts to harm you in any way.
the day of Judgment is every day. Every day your actions are judged by a law of the universe, Karma. If you do bad, then your actions will cause you suffering, if you do good, then your actions will cause good feeling. Every moment is an opportunity to do something that shall be judged as good, every moment is an opportunity to change yourself into goodness. A person who lives a good and righteous life will be in heaven before he dies.
@CamdenChristadelphia Jesus Christ, the Buddha, to name a couple. Many religions state this. They might not have said "judgment day", but they pretty much taught that every person will be judged by their actions and rewarded accordingly. They both taught that heaven is goodness in one's soul. You might not believe in Jesus or Buddha or any of those holy people, but they seem to have been correct.
@CamdenChristadelphia didn't realize you were the OP, so you do believe in Jesus anyways, but yeah every day is a chance for redemption, every day man's judged and rewarded or punished for what he does, and if a man does much more good than bad, he'll experience heaven. Like Jesus said =)
What about second Peter 2:4 the word there is neither of these but "tartarus" said to be as far below hades as the earth is below heaven! Are you daying Hell isnt really real in the way the western mind thinks of it and no one really goes there??
TRUTH, TRUTH, TRUTH....is music to ears....yet humans are fear based and prefer to listen to fables based on fear..ie being tortured eternally. God said the 'punishment' for eating the fruit was DEATH!! not eternity of torture. Jesus said the truth will set you free...this man in this vid just spoke the TRUTH. Shalom
can you decipher why froto didnt just fly on a dragon over to mount mordore instead of walking? maybe gandolf was a moron.... i think im getting lord of the rings and the bible mixed up.
Twist and turn as much as you like, you are only proving further that the bible is just a load of contradictory myths and legends that can be used to prove anything the reader wants to see in it.
That's why there are so many different christian sects, all with different ideas, all claiming their authority from the bible.
"Lord of the Rings" and "Harry Potter" have more cohesive credibility than the Bible.
@HonestMan395 Religion has actually convinced people that there’s an invisible man, living in the sky, who watches everything you do, every minute of every day.
And this man has a special list of ten things he does not want you to do.
And if you do any of these ten things, he has a special place, full of fire, smoke, burning, torture and anguish, where he will send you to live and suffer and burn and choke and scream and cry forever and ever `til the end of time!
@MrJohanasBilderberg Funny you should accuse me of pride, arrogance, Elitism, lies, and disdain.
A psychologist once told me that we often recognise faults in others, because we have them ourselves.
Like a thief who thinks everyone is dishonest.
I find Arrogance and pride is especially strong among religious people.
Luke. 18:11 The Pharisee stood and prayed thus with himself, God, I thank thee, that I am not as other men [are], extortioners, unjust, adulterers, or even as this publican.
I accuse you of nothing, An accusation requires some level of knowledge about an individual. It also requires making assumptions based on limited evidence I just recognize the fruits of your labor as evident in your posts and point that out for consideration.
Also that verse deals with judging others, I have not judged you I just know your masters work and reject it when I see it.
@MrJohanasBilderberg Pardon the illiteration, but you've just displayed the smug, supercilious self-satisfaction that make religious people like you insufferable.
Not judging me?
Well how about the "The fruits you show the world are pride, arrogance, elitism, lies, and disdain. " Not a judgement?
You should look in a mirror.
If, as you say, I serve my "master" well, he must be a pretty decent guy. After all, he's got me to work for a world charity helping third world children.
@MrJohanasBilderberg .....Cont'd..He's got me, if you are correct, through the whole of my life without knowingly breaking any laws, not even a traffic offence.
I wonder how that could have happened.
Of course, it might be because, as an Atheist, I have a secret weapon. It's called a conscience. Something I've found to be seriously lacking in christians. so sure that they are saved and that, no matter what they do, god will forgive them anything, because they love and worship him.
@MrJohanasBilderberg If you want to make yourself subservient to a mythical, celestial being for which there is no evidence, just subjective feelings, that's up to you, but I prefer to take responsibilty for my own life, and not abbrogate it to some mystical fairy story man.
As far as the writers of the bible are concerned, a modern day school student has more knowledge of the world than they had. Would you follow one of them if they said they were god?
@MrJohanasBilderberg Putting your faith and life into the hands of an imaginary celestial friend is the ultimate cop-out from taking any responsibilty for your own life.
It's the ultimate comfort blanket.
You just wrap yourself in it, sit in a corner of your life, sucking your thumb and crying to daddy to make it better.
@MrJohanasBilderberg I've found it for him (one of the advantages of having been brought up from childhood with the bible):-
Luke. 23:43. (Jesus to the man crucified next to him)
"And Jesus said to him, Truly I say to you, TODAY shall you be with me in paradise."
Or was that just a one off?
I encourage all christians to read their bible all the way through and make notes. Isaac Asimov once said: "Properly read, the Bible is the most potent force for atheism ever conceived."
Ecclesiastes 9:5 For the living know that they die, and the dead know not anything, and there is no more to them a reward, for their remembrance hath been forgotten.
In reference to your previous scripture.
To the criminal it will be as if he moved from death to paradise.
He has no knowledge of what transpired in the time between the two events.
I'm never ceases to amaze me how you religious people even twist the words of your own bible if it doesn't agree with your own views, But that's been happening ever since the bible was first cobbled together by the early church.
Most of the 30 odd gospels were left out completely because they didn't conform with the what the early church wanted it to say and the 4 that did make it in were heavily edited. Cont'd.....
@MrJohanasBilderberg Also, I've looked at a number of different translations of Luke 23:43 and I think in this case, what they all say is pretty unambiguous. They all point to Jesus promising the thief that he will be in Heaven THAT VERY DAY.
Heaven.
Not something that seems like heaven.
The genuine article.
(if it existed of course, which it doesn't, any more than hell does.)
"Time is relative to the position of the observer."
As the observer is stone dead he has no view of the passage of time.
As God is not bound by dimensional reality, time in essence is meaningless
Also as Christ was dead and did not ascend to the Father until the third day your argument is invalid, The criminal is still dead and when the Day of Judgement arrives he will be resurrected.
@HonestMan395 If it's what I was saying to MrJohanasBilderburg, Then what I said was that There is no Hell, or heaven, or god. There really isn't any evidence for jesus either. at least not from anyone who was around in his supposed lifetime.
It just blows my mind that someone who goes to hell is burned forever, I can't imagine being burned for 1 year let alone eternity, and of course hell fire is much hotter than regular fire and I would think that the pain will increase for every minute that passes by meaning the pain experienced the first day is not like 10,000 years later, I pray to God that I will be saved.
I find it rather amusing how theists try to talk about the Physical pleasures or suffering of an afterlife and yet when asked for Proof that this afterlife exists they say it is Spiritual.
If this afterlife is a Spiritual place then Physical pleasures or suffering would be impossible since pleasure and suffering are Physical conditions.
All of this shit is fantasy thinking and when looked at with logic it falls appart.
Hell means the grave. That is it. No devil no torture.
What about second Peter 2:4 the word there is neither of these but "tartarus" said to be as far below hades as the earth is below heaven! Are you daying Hell isnt really real in the way the western mind thinks of it and no one really goes there??
2Peter 2:4 "For if God did not spare angels when they SINNED, but CAST THEM INTO HELL and committed them to chains of gloomy darkness to be kept UNTILL THE JUDGEMENT..."
Matt 23:33 "You serpents, you brood of vipers, how are you to ESCAPE BEING SENTENCED TO HELL?" (Jesus speaking to Pharisees)
Matt 5:22 "...whoever says, ‘You fool!’ will be liable to the HELL OF FIRE."
Hell is a REAL place of REAL torment. Dont believe the twisting of the truth
@portaadonai Hell? Don't make me laugh. Any atheist who has thought about death and has come face to face with their own mortality would not fear this place even if it did exist. Tell me, can you imagine NOT EXISTING? It goes against everything the human mind knows and invokes a feeling of fear so strong that if I could I would have believed anything if it could save me from the all consuming dark. But I cant believe in an afterlife so I came to terms with the end instead of clinging to belief.
@cpu46 Honestly I am the exact opposite. I used to be an atheist and extremely suicidal. I wasn't scared in the least of dying. I purposely overdosed on drugs 3 times and wound up in the hospital. I had a supernatural experience and became convinced that God exists.
There have been many times since believing in God where I wanted to give up. Instead of wanting to die (I now know, Hell exists) I wished I were never born or that I could vanish from existence so I didn't have to deal with life.
Sorry to hear about the overdoses, all I can say is I've dealt with some heavy depression myself, as has most of my family. All i can say is that everyone copes in their own way. However if only the fear of Hell is keeping you from trying again I recommend some therapy. Those feelings are a freaking pain to live with, faith or no faith. If you don't want to try therapy, try writing some fiction, poetry, anything.It really helps me let go of at least some of those feelings.
@cpu46 My comment isn't meant to draw sympathy. Its simply my life story that happened 10 years ago. I am a changed man now by the grace of God. I didn't need therapy, I simply needed God. When I sincerely turned to Him for help He answered. I couldn't do it on my own.
@portaadonai Being suicidal has nothing to do with being an atheist. I am a 66yr old atheist, and I have never considered suicide. Because I know that this is the only life I have, it makes it all the more precious. I'm not afraid of death, just a dying nastily. If fear of Hell is the only thing keeping you alive, you need help.
I prefer to think of the Mark Twain quote.
"I have no fear of death. I was dead for thousands of years before I was born. It never did me any harm." cont'd......
@portaadonai There is a quote by Richard Dawkins that he wants to have read at his funeral. I totally agree with it. It's too big for one of these 500 word boxes, so I'll split it up.
"We are going to die, and that makes us the lucky ones.
Most people are never going to die because they are never going to be born.
The potential people who could have been here in my place, but who will, in fact, never see the light of day, outnumber the sand grains of Sahara. Cont'd.........
@portaadonai Certainly those unborn ghosts include greater poets than Keats, scientists greater than Newton.
We know this, because the set of possible people allowed by our DNA, so massively outnumbers the set of actual people.In the teeth of these stupefying odds it is you and I, in our ordinariness, that are here.
We privileged few, who won the lottery of birth against all odds.
How dare we whine at our inevitable return to that prior state from which the vast majority have never stirred.”
@portaadonai If it's what I said to you about needing help if the thought of hell is the only thing preventing you from committing suicide, then What's to explain.
Surely it's obvious that you need more than that to build a life on.
@HonestMan395 Well I guess it's my fault for not explaining what I meant. The thought of Hell is not the only thing preventing me from committing suicide. When I was on drugs and living for myself, seeking after pure pleasure, I ironically became more and more miserable. The more pleasure I attained, the more I wanted. It was like a drug actually.
Since turning my life to God, my life has transformed from the inside out. Transformed in ways I never could seem to accomplish on my own.
@portaadonai That's where we differ. I'm lucky, I was never on drugs.
I was brought up in a very religious household and although I was never unhappy, I always thought something wasn't right.
It was only when I started searching for something and realised that there was no god that my life really took off.
I'm 66 and I'm happier now than I've ever been. Knowing that there is nothing to look forward to after death makes me appreciate life even more and determined to make the most of it.
@MrJohanasBilderberg This may surprise you, but, even though I'm an atheist, I'm not sure that I am in favour of total separation of church and state.
Considering the effort the founding fathers, some of whom were at least agnostic if not atheist, went to to separate church and state. The US has real problem regarding organised religion.
In the UK it's quite different. Even our Head of State (The Queen) is also Head of the Church of England. Cont’d…..
@MrJohanasBilderberg It's bishops, along with senior representatives of all the major religions sit in the House of Lords, yet we don't have the problems with religion that the US has.
Even in UK politics, religion is irrelevant. Between our Prime minister, Deputy Prime minister and Opposition Leader, 2 are atheist and I believe one is a Deist. Which is which, I'm not certain, but only because I don't consider it important enough to find out.
@MrJohanasBilderberg In UK politics, we have politicians of all and no religious affiliations, but in the US, The land of free speech, it would be political suicide, for any politician not to declare themselves christian. Statistically, some must be closet atheists.
I think the reason we don't have the US religion problem in the UK is because, historically and quite unintentionally, we have adopted the old advice of Machiavelli.
"Keep you friends close, but keep your enemies closer." :)
"You cannot take a single verse out of context and claim it supports any thing." Exactly, but the bible is such an ambiguous book which contradicts itself over and over again, such that it lends itself to that sort of use.
How can anyone build their whole life on what is basically a jumble of myths and legends passed down by word of mouth for generations, by ignorant, superstitious, bronze age goatherders.
@MrJohanasBilderberg How do you know what Jesus said. No-one involved in the writing of the new testament, ever met him. It's all second and third hand information from people who had a vested interest in putting accross their message.
Some of whom even admitted in their own writings that they lied for the good of the cause.
Now as for your hatred of religion I find that understandable.
The only thing that set me free was the realization that Faith and Religion were mutually exclusive ideas. One is natural and present in every one of us, the other was created by man as a tool for money and power.
Understanding the difference is the only way to find real peace.
As for my life...I have no concern for it. I spend it in the comfort that each day brings me closer to God. :)
@MrJohanasBilderberg It's know that i only have one life that gives me my zest for living.
And no, I don't hate religion. It gives comfort to some people and I'm happy for adults to believe any fairy tale they want, as long as they keep it to themselves.
No, what I object to, is the cruel brainwashing of little children with stories of god watching their every move and that he will send them to burn in hell if they are not good.
That is Mental child abuse and should be a criminal offence.
@MrJohanasBilderberg o yea sorry bout thet i didnt realize who he was, i dislike him, im a Christian, but some of the things in the video i think is true
HAHA. Are you trying to say there is no real place of torment for sinners after we die? That is an absolute lie. Jesus told a story (not a parable) of the rich man and Lazurus. Lazurus the poor man died and went to a place of safety, but the rich man died and went to a place of FIRE AND TORMENT! He asked for REAL water to cool his REAL tounge! Don't be deceived! These earthly examples of Gehenna where the worm dies not, nor the fire are examples of a spiritual reality! I will post more verses..
@YUMMYngbird I think the soul is eternal. The Bible constantly refers to everlasting torment, the smoke rises forever [REV 14:11] (what ever is burning never is consumed or ends), where the worm dies not [MARK 9:44+48], etc.
Matthew 10:28 "...Rather, fear him who is able to destroy both soul and body in Gehenna."
I think this is the second death because both the body and the soul are united (resurrection at the judgment) before thrown into Hell. Look up the "23 Minutes in Hell" video!
What about the story of the rich man with lazarus at his gate who after he died was in torment and also what about the ones who take the mark of the beast who's smoke of torment rises up forever?? I am genuine i want to know your answer?Rev 14:11
Thanks for that analysis, one thing to note is that the lake of fire (valley of Gehenna) was meant for the 'second death' not eternal punishment. Just as a landfill fire can last for years, but destroys garbage completely, so will that lake of fire. It's not eternal torture, it is the end of existence for those who reject God's values calling black white, God evil.
David had an understanding that eternal life was possible and asked to not be forgotten (Psalm 16:10).
Testeraccount123 5 days ago
xu1997. My point is to prove that there is a literal hell that can be escaped by accepting the finished work of Jesus Christ. He saves all who believe on Him for eternal life. John 3:16. John 3:36. John 6:47. Acts 16:31. God bless.
jacksmack77 1 week ago
Psalm 9:17 The wicked shall be turned into hell, and all the nations that forget God. Psalm 16:10 For thou wilt not leave my soul in hell; neither wilt thou suffer thine Holy One to see corruption.
John 3:15. That whosoever believeth in Him should not perish, but have eternal life.
jacksmack77 1 week ago
@jacksmack77 Hi Jack, thanks for your comment.What is the point you are trying to make with the verses?
xu1997 1 week ago
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Revelations 21:8 But the cowardly, unbelieving, vile, murderers,sexually immoral, those who practice magic arts, idolator, and all liars, there place will be in the fiery lake of burning sulfur. = HELL
Rotorcop12a 4 weeks ago
This man does not look well. Is he still alive?
kernkurtz 1 month ago
Hell and Heaven are beleived by stupid people.
Killer0fTheSun 1 month ago
@Killer0fTheSun
You are obviously more intelligent than anyone here so tell us ,what is your belief on the subject.
CamdenChristadelphia 1 month ago
@CamdenChristadelphia
If you couldnt understand the comment then your retarded as well
Killer0fTheSun 1 month ago
@Killer0fTheSun I'll bet your young
bellhairrat1 2 weeks ago
@bellhairrat1
You a priest?
Killer0fTheSun 2 weeks ago
"Love me..or go to hell"..is certainly not the gospel.
If hell exists...Divine Love is a travesty!
microvantastic 1 month ago 2
18 thumbs down? 18 fundies want to see nonbelievers burn in eternal hell. Sorry evangelical/fundy LOSERS it won't happen like this man says.
99minerkc 1 month ago
a place where the fires never go out eh>..and the worms crawl in and out of ya all the time? Yup..sounds like a Hell to me..
hquehe 1 month ago
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REVELATION: 20 15 Anyone whose name was not found written in the book of life was thrown into the lake of fire.
mas03 2 months ago
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13 The sea gave up the dead that were in it, and death and Hades gave up the dead that were in them, and each person was judged according to what they had done. 14 Then death and Hades were thrown into the lake of fire. The lake of fire is the second death. 15 Anyone whose name was not found written in the book of life was thrown into the lake of fire.
mas03 2 months ago
n Matthew 23:33, Jesus even warned the religious leaders of His day that they were in danger of hell.....
"You snakes! You brood of vipers! How will you escape being condemned to hell?"
Perhaps this seems way too harsh to you so you JEHOVA WTINESSES change the Scriptures.
mas03 2 months ago
@mas03 You seem to have trouble comprehending detail.Watch the video again to see what the meaning of hell is.
Also look up the difference between Christadelphians and JW's
CamdenChristadelphia 1 month ago
You don't know you're bible old man. You are a follower of Charles taze Russell. You are not Christian and are brainwashed wake up and stop following the wrong doctrine.
mas03 2 months ago
@mas03 Please show me what you believe is the truth of the matter.
CamdenChristadelphia 1 month ago
@CamdenChristadelphia I believe in the Bible, the King James Bible, something you dont.
mas03 1 month ago
@mas03 Wrong again. You make assumptions about things you have no knowledge of.
CamdenChristadelphia 1 month ago
@CamdenChristadelphia You believe in the KING JAMES BIBLE? You're a liar my friend. The NWT is NOT the the REAL bible, its changed to fit what you believe. You are a follower of CHARLES TAZE RUSSELL, YOU DENY JESUS' DIETY, YOU'RE BRAINWASHED, YOU USE THE WATCHTOWER MORE THAN THE BIBLE. WAKE UP!
mas03 1 month ago
Love never fails. God will never fail. If He truly loves people, He wouldn't torture them for all of eternity. Love & eternal torment cannot go together. God is just, yes, but He is not cruel.
1 Tim 4:10- This is why we work hard and continue to struggle, for our hope is in the living God, who is the Savior of all people and particularly of all believers.
1 John 2:2- He himself is the sacrifice that atones for our sins—and not only our sins but the sins of all the world.
whatthehellbook . com
whatthehellbook 2 months ago
@whatthehellbook You seem to leave out the part where the ungodly of this world will perish.
Psa 1:6 For the LORD knoweth the way of the righteous: but the way of the ungodly shall perish.
Tell the whole story not just the nice bit.
CamdenChristadelphia 1 month ago
@CamdenChristadelphia You seem to have stopped reading in the Psalms:
Psalm 103:8-10- The Lord is compassionate and merciful, slow to get angry and filled with unfailing love. He will not constantly accuse us, nor remain angry forever. He does not punish us for all our sins; he does not deal harshly with us, as we deserve.
So, will God remain angry forever or not?
whatthehellbook 1 month ago
The Bible is a heterogenous collection of books written by mostly ignorant and misogynous tribesmen over thousands of years who claimed the authority of God in order to impose their agenda and will on the people.
Vierotchka 3 months ago
@Vierotchka Very good. You have shown your ignorance as to how the Bible came to us.
Go and do some homework on the subject,there's plenty of history recorded on how the word of God has been preserved.
I can understand how you feel. Human nature hates the thought of an authoritarian figure telling us what to do, that's why people like yoursef reject the Bible and therefore reject God.
But what if the Bible is the word of God ?
Then you have a problem.
CamdenChristadelphia 1 month ago
@CamdenChristadelphia I HAVE done my homework about the origins of the Bible, you obviously haven't. Rejecting the Bible doesn't mean rejecting God, your clumsy post hoc ergo propter hoc logical fallacy notwithstanding. What if the Koran is the Word of God? What if the Upanishads are the Word of God? What if the Vedas are the Word of God? If the Bible is the Word of God, why does God contradict Himself so often? You are the one with a huge problem.
Vierotchka 1 month ago
@Vierotchka You sound very confused.What's it to be the Koran or the Bible,which book is the word of God? Do you know?
The Koran says Allah is God and that Jesus is not his son but a prophet.
The Bible says Yahweh is the creator of Heaven and earth and Jesus Christ is his ONLY BEGOTTEN SON.
One book is TRUE and the other is a LIE.
Which is it Vierotchka?? Your call.
Please show us all your proof.
CamdenChristadelphia 1 month ago
@CamdenChristadelphia The one who is confused is yourself. Just because the Bible says so doesn't mean it is so. Never has Jesus, in any of the Gospels, made the claim that he was the only begotten son of God. Furthermore, the oldest Gospel was written decades after the passing of Jesus. Neither book is "true" - they are both written by men. Did you not know that the whole mythology surrounding Jesus was borrowed verbatim from the mythology surrounding Mithras?
Vierotchka 1 month ago
@CamdenChristadelphia For your edification: watch?v=SF6I5VSZVqc
Vierotchka 1 month ago
@CamdenChristadelphia watch?v=MeSSwKffj9o
Vierotchka 1 month ago
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here in india coimbatore there is a small holes not more than one inch from one house toilet room from which the souls are taken under earth several thousands kilometers away please .request you to save every molecule of souls and humans from pains and sufferings
bgupta2001 3 months ago
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request and pray ---every human every soul either good or bad ,angle or evil ,sinner,demon , god or devil every one want to live as a good humanbeing --please save
instead of killing ,spoiling lives,destroying ,sending under earth ,hells ,if some place is given far away from india .and some thing are done for better to improve the qualities of humans and souls .so that every one can live
bgupta2001 3 months ago
Religion sucks
hempartist420 3 months ago
Mark 9:43-44 And if thy hand offend thee, cut it off: it is better for thee to enter into life maimed, than having two hands to go into hell, into the fire that never shall be quenched: Where their worm dieth not, and the fire is not quenched.
1611bloodbought 4 months ago
Hell is the grave, Gehenna is a figurative term for judgement in this life on the house of god. There is no "eternal" punishment or reward for Aion and the plural Aionias have never meant eternal, then what of the plural? Forevers? Eternaties? No, Age & Ages or Eon & Eons. We do not receive eternal life we receive immortality, literally in the Greek "Deathlessness" the inability to die for death and the grave are done away with.
KlonoaDreamer 4 months ago
Most people only want to believe there is a heaven,but refuse to admit there is a hell.hell is the opposite to heaven just like Satan is the opposite to God.God created this horrible place that's said to be located under the earth,but it's so deep there's no way to discover this awful place in flesh and blood.
nostalgiamelancolia1 4 months ago
@nostalgiamelancolia1 Do you have Scripture for your statements, "nostalgia"? I don't know that I've seen any of God's Word speak to your statements here.
n8branim 4 months ago
@nostalgiamelancolia1 Satan is NOT God's opposite! God created Satan so how could he be an opposite. Satan was a "son" of God that fell. NOT an opposite. He may be evil but certainly not the opposite. Study more. Also, Hell is mistranslated from the word Gehena. Gehena was a place that they threw their trash and burning bodies. God Bless and Peace in Jesus name.
xXXBOBLOBLAWXXx 3 months ago
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The Bible does not teach eternal punishment. God's love and mercy endures forever. Does it really endure forever or only in this life? How can it be Good News if it doesn't translate to the afterlife?
1 Timothy 4:10- This is why we work hard and continue to struggle, for our hope is in the living God, who is the Savior of all people and particularly of all believers.
whatthehellbook . com
whatthehellbook 4 months ago
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The Bible does not teach eternal punishment. God's love and mercy endures forever. Does it really endure forever or only in this life? How can it be Good News if it doesn't translate to the afterlife?
1 Timothy 4:10- This is why we work hard and continue to struggle, for our hope is in the living God, who is the Savior of all people and particularly of all believers.
whatthehellbook . com
whatthehellbook 4 months ago
Here is another truth about the word hell. The old norse and germanic belief of the underworld was ruled by the pagan goddess hel.
SwordofManticorE 4 months ago
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What happens when you die? Have you told lies, stolen, used God's name in vain(10 Commandments)? If yes, then you're a liar, thief, and a blasphemer in the sight of God. When you die & be judged by God, you'll be guilty of sin, & go to Hell! But God sent His Son Jesus to shed His blood & die on a cross for your sins, He was buried & rose again from the dead on the third day. If you'll believe the Gospel(Jesus died for your sins,was buried & resurrected)you'll not perish & have eternal life
gramosjr7 5 months ago
i would say that this man needs to do the same!!
landenhar 5 months ago
in mark9:43 the word hell is translated from ge henna. this was a rubish dump where fire was used to burn the rubbish
smokeybirdman 5 months ago
Gehennah is also mentioned in Jeremiah. A lot of people don't realize that. A lot of people try to figure out stuff out in the New Testament, that they'd already be familiar with of they'd read the Old Testament. The book of Revelation is a primary example of this. A lot of the stuff written about in Revelation, was already written about in Jeremiah, Isaiah, Ezekiel etc. And is expounded upon in those books. Jesus and John are expecting you to be familiar with what they are talking about.
Metaphoid 5 months ago
Gehannah is where they burned the garbage its mentioned 12 times in the new testament. Jesus pointed to Gehennah to warn people thats where they would go, i got my waming from God while taking my garbage out sept of 2008 , watch my video, titled I am the truth the life and the way, youll see my wanring to change my ways. thanx God bless!
MrSlippin22 6 months ago
hell is indeed a real place, and unless you repent and follow Jesus, thats where you'll end up,
adavecdave 6 months ago
@adavecdave Thanks dave. Just one question, what do you mean by the word HELL?
xu1997 6 months ago
@xu1997 hell, fire and eternal burning torment.
adavecdave 6 months ago
@adavecdave
The word "hell" doesn't have anything to do with fire!!!
The word "hell" comes from two words. The Hebrew word She'ohl, that means grave or pit and the Greek word Hades, which refers to the common grave of dead mankind.
Jesus was in Hell(grave), but GOD raised him up. Acts.2:27,31
epic103 6 months ago
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@epic103 you say.....
The word "hell" doesn't have anything to do with fire!!!
Jesus says......
Mark.9
[43] And if thy hand offend thee, cut it off: it is better for thee to enter into life maimed, than having two hands to go into hell, into the fire that never shall be quenched:
i'm going with Jesus on this one!!!
adavecdave 6 months ago
@adavecdave Oh, you're right "dave," 1st Dave 2:15 says, "That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth an eternal hell and believe in your heart that most will go there, you cannot be saved." Forgot about that one, thanks for reminding me!;)
n8branim 4 months ago
I once did believe in hell but got saved. Now I don't anymore. For me hell would be not to qualify for eternal life. Not being with my creator. "Hell" was used by the early church to get people to accept christianity out of fear. That it. Do you really think a loving god will punish someone for eternity! lol
journeyofhope100 6 months ago
It's funny how so many folks who are headed to Hell spend so much of their time trying to deny its reality.
The ultimate denial that soon becomes the ultimate and final bad news for them.
petruscephas 7 months ago
@petruscephas Nice, Scriptural refutation "Pete"! And if you are implying that a denial of "hell" is basis for not being resurrected to life and receiving immortality with Jesus, well, you simply don't know God's Word! You should listen again to this well thought out, accurately described, Scripturally accurate and historically enlightening presentation! You may learn a few things.
n8branim 5 months ago
@n8branim
Christadelphianism is a heresy so utterly riddled with error that it doesn't even qualify as Christian.
Also don't tell me what is "Scripturally accurate" when all you are really referring to is your personal interpretation of Scripture.
petruscephas 5 months ago
@petruscephas Thanks for this Scriptural response, "pete"! Where did you get that from? Oh, that's right "pete," 1st petruscepas 2:15 says, "That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth an eternal hell and believe in your heart that most will go there, you cannot be saved." Forgot about that one, thanks for reminding me!;) "pete" the reality is, people have serious, wellfounded questions about the current teaching on "hell". How r u gonna consign folks to it for asking? I'd be careful if I were u!
n8branim 4 months ago
great explanation!
superlynn27 7 months ago
@CamdenChristadelphia Ha ha ha ha ha! Hey jackass, do you know you made a very similar comment to me 4 months ago. Why don't you get some new material Forrest.
I just made an observation that the guy looked like the drifter in that movie, what's your over reaction all about?
Sounds like another Christian all pissed off and ready to engage his delusional made up enemies.
metalsusa1 7 months ago
@metalsusa1 You sound like such a nice person.Im still waiting for your photo
CamdenChristadelphia 6 months ago
@CamdenChristadelphia Well, if you act like a jack ass expect to be treated like one. The photo request is getting disturbing. Oh well, what do you expect from a grown man who believes in talking snakes?
metalsusa1 6 months ago
@metalsusa1
Try and show some class, don't be a moron!!!
epic103 6 months ago
Gehenna was the city garbage dump.
timsh6 7 months ago
So judgement is carried out on a rubbish tip now? Too many mistranslations/personal views of a primitive fictional book, reality is much more beautiful!
rccaulfield 8 months ago
God bless, this video was helpful language is important to our of scripture, but what is your stance on hell
JDLekocevic 8 months ago
Thank you for that I knew a loving God would not create a place of eternal punishment That Just did not sound true to me. What you have said sound a lot better and true. Thanks
ZeusHelios 8 months ago
In Scripture it appears that "hell" is a term more referred to either of these two outcomes, both being death of the soul:
1. A person/soul that chose an incredibly evil & destructive life (murderers without remorse etc.) hating everything and unwilling to change~their souls will be destroyed.
2. Those that lived this type of life will not be resurrected and just be dead forever in their sin.
kub73158 8 months ago
A master fuckwit
Blackgeoff1 9 months ago
There is no definition of "hell." The base word is "Ghehenna" "hell or hell-fire" is anciently derived from the non-stop fires of the garbage pits. Someone reasoned that if there is a good place after death then there must be a bad place. Jesus effectively described "hell" as a state of the supreme ignorance of heavenliness and that understanding him would destroy the reverse or animal nature that is identified with this turning away from heavenliness or the Godly state of immortal being.
Lovingvictory1 9 months ago
Lol Gehenna is not Greek it is Hebrew :). I agree, but you should get your facts correct.
jeroenvankooten 9 months ago
@jeroenvankooten Gehenna is the Greek word for it. In Hebrew it's (phonetically) Gehinnom, or Geh Ben Hinnom. "Valley of the sons of Hinnom".
TheVoidist 7 months ago
the big difference between atheists and believers is that atheists are good people naturally and believers have to be scared into being good
sjm8890 10 months ago
@sjm8890 Not necessarily true some atheist are good and bad and some believers are good and bad. atheist have become believers and some believers have become atheist but both run their lives according to their own hearts. In other words if you bad your gonna be bad if your good your gonna be good. Also some atheist who have changed to believe and also believers have become good not from fear but from feeling the spirit which has changed their lives to believe and to be better people.
ZeusHelios 8 months ago
hell is located in the center of the earth and yes its covered by the water of the ocean
Littlefoot3559 10 months ago
is it religion which makes one look like an old bum? Or is it genetic? I'm sorry you look good for 119 years old. See you in imaginary Heaven.
bigboy45454545 11 months ago
@aTrueHybrid The saints are judged constantly, the wicked are judged constantly. Look around.
stfwho 11 months ago
He looks like the old drifter in Friday The 13th that warns the kids to stay out of Crystal Lake because Jason was there.
metalsusa1 11 months ago 2
@metalsusa1 Put up a photo of yourself and i'Il make a comment.
CamdenChristadelphia 11 months ago 13
@CamdenChristadelphia I don't want to make you envious, it's one of the deadly sins.
metalsusa1 11 months ago
@metalsusa1 Yeah I remember him. He got killed in Part II.
JohnathanPozzi 4 months ago
Hell is also metaphorically describd as a place of torment for the damned and judged which of extreme anguish for being antichrist in spirit. Simple enough.
zobcity01 11 months ago
Hell is the absence of goodness. Hell is not in the afterlife, but in this one, a state of mind where one is tormented by their own thoughts and desires and greed and hate. Heaven is a state of mind that is the opposite; one's thoughts bring great joy and happiness and love, a desire to improve, and great strength when the external world attempts to harm you in any way.
stfwho 1 year ago
the day of Judgment is every day. Every day your actions are judged by a law of the universe, Karma. If you do bad, then your actions will cause you suffering, if you do good, then your actions will cause good feeling. Every moment is an opportunity to do something that shall be judged as good, every moment is an opportunity to change yourself into goodness. A person who lives a good and righteous life will be in heaven before he dies.
stfwho 1 year ago
@stfwho
Says who?
CamdenChristadelphia 1 year ago
@CamdenChristadelphia Jesus Christ, the Buddha, to name a couple. Many religions state this. They might not have said "judgment day", but they pretty much taught that every person will be judged by their actions and rewarded accordingly. They both taught that heaven is goodness in one's soul. You might not believe in Jesus or Buddha or any of those holy people, but they seem to have been correct.
stfwho 1 year ago
@CamdenChristadelphia didn't realize you were the OP, so you do believe in Jesus anyways, but yeah every day is a chance for redemption, every day man's judged and rewarded or punished for what he does, and if a man does much more good than bad, he'll experience heaven. Like Jesus said =)
stfwho 1 year ago
@stfwho the day of judgement hasn,t come yet read your bible. The wicked are reserved til the day of judgement to be punished read (peter 2:9.)
timsh6 7 months ago
What about second Peter 2:4 the word there is neither of these but "tartarus" said to be as far below hades as the earth is below heaven! Are you daying Hell isnt really real in the way the western mind thinks of it and no one really goes there??
wallymano 1 year ago
The truth about hell is that it is all a load of bollocks.
UrukEngineer 1 year ago
TRUTH, TRUTH, TRUTH....is music to ears....yet humans are fear based and prefer to listen to fables based on fear..ie being tortured eternally. God said the 'punishment' for eating the fruit was DEATH!! not eternity of torture. Jesus said the truth will set you free...this man in this vid just spoke the TRUTH. Shalom
smokeybirdman 1 year ago
can you decipher why froto didnt just fly on a dragon over to mount mordore instead of walking? maybe gandolf was a moron.... i think im getting lord of the rings and the bible mixed up.
mikematij2 1 year ago
@mikematij2 Ho Ho Ho, absolutely side splitting, champagne humour.
I hope you got something out of your comment because I didnt.
CamdenChristadelphia 1 year ago
Primates often have trouble imagining a universe not run by an angry alpha male.
newfagscanttrif0rce 1 year ago 10
@newfagscanttrif0rce
Yes and monkeys only believe monkeys run the world.
Lucky we know better!
CamdenChristadelphia 11 months ago 5
@CamdenChristadelphia not all primates are monkeys you know? humans are apes
hempartist420 3 months ago
Twist and turn as much as you like, you are only proving further that the bible is just a load of contradictory myths and legends that can be used to prove anything the reader wants to see in it.
That's why there are so many different christian sects, all with different ideas, all claiming their authority from the bible.
"Lord of the Rings" and "Harry Potter" have more cohesive credibility than the Bible.
HonestMan395 1 year ago
@HonestMan395 Yes I can see your point,From your perspective and narrow point of view, the only thing that you can proove to exist is yourself.
Im not sure you do exist, you say you do but what proof is that.
God claims in Isaiah 43, that the proof he exists is the Nation of Israel.
CamdenChristadelphia 1 year ago
@HonestMan395 dude.. you do know that Tolkien -the writer of Lord of the rings- is a Christian.?
Devotedone901 1 year ago
@Devotedone901 So was CS Lewis. What has that got to do with anything.
Are you suggesting that The Chronicles of Narnia are true?
HonestMan395 1 year ago
@HonestMan395 The plot of the story yes.. But not the Whole thing the wardrobe and stuffs... but I think it can be a symbol or something
Devotedone901 11 months ago
@Devotedone901 Well, the plot of the story is the story of Jesus, so that makes it fiction.
HonestMan395 11 months ago
Hell is to hot and too long
SONSofVENDETTA 1 year ago
When we die we are dead.
On the Day of Judgement the dead will be resurrected,
Until then no man has ascended to heaven.
MrJohanasBilderberg 1 year ago
@MrJohanasBilderberg Go to the top of the class son! So simple why cant people see it? Because its too hard to accept.
CamdenChristadelphia 1 year ago
@CamdenChristadelphia
People choose not to believe the Word of God and instead cling to words about God,
Also the master of this world works very hard to keep humans blind to the plain and simple truths of the Bible.
MrJohanasBilderberg 1 year ago
@MrJohanasBilderberg There are no "words of god", just the imaginings of superstitious and ignorant Bronze age goat herders.
HonestMan395 1 year ago
@HonestMan395
And that idea is some of your masters finest work.
MrJohanasBilderberg 1 year ago
@MrJohanasBilderberg He's not my Master.
HonestMan395 1 year ago
@HonestMan395 Religion has actually convinced people that there’s an invisible man, living in the sky, who watches everything you do, every minute of every day.
And this man has a special list of ten things he does not want you to do.
And if you do any of these ten things, he has a special place, full of fire, smoke, burning, torture and anguish, where he will send you to live and suffer and burn and choke and scream and cry forever and ever `til the end of time!
...But He loves you.
HonestMan395 1 year ago
@HonestMan395
A man is known by the fruits of his labors.
The fruits you show the world are pride, arrogance, elitism, lies, and disdain.
And you claim you have no master.
Actually it appears you have learned quite well.
MrJohanasBilderberg 1 year ago
@MrJohanasBilderberg Funny you should accuse me of pride, arrogance, Elitism, lies, and disdain.
A psychologist once told me that we often recognise faults in others, because we have them ourselves.
Like a thief who thinks everyone is dishonest.
I find Arrogance and pride is especially strong among religious people.
Luke. 18:11 The Pharisee stood and prayed thus with himself, God, I thank thee, that I am not as other men [are], extortioners, unjust, adulterers, or even as this publican.
HonestMan395 1 year ago
@HonestMan395
I accuse you of nothing, An accusation requires some level of knowledge about an individual. It also requires making assumptions based on limited evidence I just recognize the fruits of your labor as evident in your posts and point that out for consideration.
Also that verse deals with judging others, I have not judged you I just know your masters work and reject it when I see it.
I actually feel great pity for you as a person.
MrJohanasBilderberg 1 year ago
@MrJohanasBilderberg Pardon the illiteration, but you've just displayed the smug, supercilious self-satisfaction that make religious people like you insufferable.
Not judging me?
Well how about the "The fruits you show the world are pride, arrogance, elitism, lies, and disdain. " Not a judgement?
You should look in a mirror.
If, as you say, I serve my "master" well, he must be a pretty decent guy. After all, he's got me to work for a world charity helping third world children.
cont'd...
HonestMan395 1 year ago
@MrJohanasBilderberg .....Cont'd..He's got me, if you are correct, through the whole of my life without knowingly breaking any laws, not even a traffic offence.
I wonder how that could have happened.
Of course, it might be because, as an Atheist, I have a secret weapon. It's called a conscience. Something I've found to be seriously lacking in christians. so sure that they are saved and that, no matter what they do, god will forgive them anything, because they love and worship him.
HonestMan395 1 year ago
@MrJohanasBilderberg If you want to make yourself subservient to a mythical, celestial being for which there is no evidence, just subjective feelings, that's up to you, but I prefer to take responsibilty for my own life, and not abbrogate it to some mystical fairy story man.
As far as the writers of the bible are concerned, a modern day school student has more knowledge of the world than they had. Would you follow one of them if they said they were god?
HonestMan395 1 year ago
@MrJohanasBilderberg Putting your faith and life into the hands of an imaginary celestial friend is the ultimate cop-out from taking any responsibilty for your own life.
It's the ultimate comfort blanket.
You just wrap yourself in it, sit in a corner of your life, sucking your thumb and crying to daddy to make it better.
HonestMan395 1 year ago
@MrJohanasBilderberg no when u die u go to heaven immediately or hell we don't just chill in a sleep until Jesus judges us
SONSofVENDETTA 1 year ago
@SONSofVENDETTA
Read your bible and find the verse that states that.
When you find it please let me know.
MrJohanasBilderberg 1 year ago
@MrJohanasBilderberg I've found it for him (one of the advantages of having been brought up from childhood with the bible):-
Luke. 23:43. (Jesus to the man crucified next to him)
"And Jesus said to him, Truly I say to you, TODAY shall you be with me in paradise."
Or was that just a one off?
I encourage all christians to read their bible all the way through and make notes. Isaac Asimov once said: "Properly read, the Bible is the most potent force for atheism ever conceived."
That is so true.
HonestMan395 1 year ago
@HonestMan395
Ecclesiastes 9:5 For the living know that they die, and the dead know not anything, and there is no more to them a reward, for their remembrance hath been forgotten.
In reference to your previous scripture.
To the criminal it will be as if he moved from death to paradise.
He has no knowledge of what transpired in the time between the two events.
MrJohanasBilderberg 1 year ago
@MrJohanasBilderberg Aw! nice semantics.
I'm never ceases to amaze me how you religious people even twist the words of your own bible if it doesn't agree with your own views, But that's been happening ever since the bible was first cobbled together by the early church.
Most of the 30 odd gospels were left out completely because they didn't conform with the what the early church wanted it to say and the 4 that did make it in were heavily edited. Cont'd.....
HonestMan395 1 year ago
@MrJohanasBilderberg Eusebius, of Caesarea, who is known as the Father of Church History, even admitted as much in his own writings.
“I have repeated whatever may rebound to the glory and suppressed all that could tend to the disgrace of our religion.”
“It will sometimes be necessary to use falsehood for the benefit of those who need such a treatment.”
“We shall introduce into this history in general only those events That may be useful, first to ourselves and afterwards to posterity..”
HonestMan395 1 year ago
@MrJohanasBilderberg Also, I've looked at a number of different translations of Luke 23:43 and I think in this case, what they all say is pretty unambiguous. They all point to Jesus promising the thief that he will be in Heaven THAT VERY DAY.
Heaven.
Not something that seems like heaven.
The genuine article.
(if it existed of course, which it doesn't, any more than hell does.)
HonestMan395 1 year ago
@HonestMan395
Allow me to quote another source.
"Time is relative to the position of the observer."
As the observer is stone dead he has no view of the passage of time.
As God is not bound by dimensional reality, time in essence is meaningless
Also as Christ was dead and did not ascend to the Father until the third day your argument is invalid, The criminal is still dead and when the Day of Judgement arrives he will be resurrected.
MrJohanasBilderberg 1 year ago
@MrJohanasBilderberg Sorry, my last comment went in the wrong box. i hope you see it.
But in the end, "The truth about Hell" is, It just doesn't exist.
HonestMan395 1 year ago
@HonestMan395 If it's what I was saying to MrJohanasBilderburg, Then what I said was that There is no Hell, or heaven, or god. There really isn't any evidence for jesus either. at least not from anyone who was around in his supposed lifetime.
HonestMan395 1 year ago
@MrJohanasBilderberg amen brother it,s time the christians church lays aside the evil fables!
timsh6 1 year ago
It just blows my mind that someone who goes to hell is burned forever, I can't imagine being burned for 1 year let alone eternity, and of course hell fire is much hotter than regular fire and I would think that the pain will increase for every minute that passes by meaning the pain experienced the first day is not like 10,000 years later, I pray to God that I will be saved.
ubluff 1 year ago
The truth about hell is written in God's word(the bible).
vrghiks 1 year ago
UR EYES LOOK CREEPY
omaradeloar 1 year ago
I find it rather amusing how theists try to talk about the Physical pleasures or suffering of an afterlife and yet when asked for Proof that this afterlife exists they say it is Spiritual.
If this afterlife is a Spiritual place then Physical pleasures or suffering would be impossible since pleasure and suffering are Physical conditions.
All of this shit is fantasy thinking and when looked at with logic it falls appart.
Hell means the grave. That is it. No devil no torture.
PastorIblis 1 year ago
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What about second Peter 2:4 the word there is neither of these but "tartarus" said to be as far below hades as the earth is below heaven! Are you daying Hell isnt really real in the way the western mind thinks of it and no one really goes there??
wallymano 1 year ago
OK here are some more verses to prove my point!
2Peter 2:4 "For if God did not spare angels when they SINNED, but CAST THEM INTO HELL and committed them to chains of gloomy darkness to be kept UNTILL THE JUDGEMENT..."
Matt 23:33 "You serpents, you brood of vipers, how are you to ESCAPE BEING SENTENCED TO HELL?" (Jesus speaking to Pharisees)
Matt 5:22 "...whoever says, ‘You fool!’ will be liable to the HELL OF FIRE."
Hell is a REAL place of REAL torment. Dont believe the twisting of the truth
portaadonai 1 year ago
@portaadonai Hell? Don't make me laugh. Any atheist who has thought about death and has come face to face with their own mortality would not fear this place even if it did exist. Tell me, can you imagine NOT EXISTING? It goes against everything the human mind knows and invokes a feeling of fear so strong that if I could I would have believed anything if it could save me from the all consuming dark. But I cant believe in an afterlife so I came to terms with the end instead of clinging to belief.
cpu46 1 year ago
@cpu46 Honestly I am the exact opposite. I used to be an atheist and extremely suicidal. I wasn't scared in the least of dying. I purposely overdosed on drugs 3 times and wound up in the hospital. I had a supernatural experience and became convinced that God exists.
There have been many times since believing in God where I wanted to give up. Instead of wanting to die (I now know, Hell exists) I wished I were never born or that I could vanish from existence so I didn't have to deal with life.
portaadonai 1 year ago
@portaadonai
Sorry to hear about the overdoses, all I can say is I've dealt with some heavy depression myself, as has most of my family. All i can say is that everyone copes in their own way. However if only the fear of Hell is keeping you from trying again I recommend some therapy. Those feelings are a freaking pain to live with, faith or no faith. If you don't want to try therapy, try writing some fiction, poetry, anything.It really helps me let go of at least some of those feelings.
cpu46 1 year ago
@cpu46 My comment isn't meant to draw sympathy. Its simply my life story that happened 10 years ago. I am a changed man now by the grace of God. I didn't need therapy, I simply needed God. When I sincerely turned to Him for help He answered. I couldn't do it on my own.
portaadonai 1 year ago
@portaadonai Being suicidal has nothing to do with being an atheist. I am a 66yr old atheist, and I have never considered suicide. Because I know that this is the only life I have, it makes it all the more precious. I'm not afraid of death, just a dying nastily. If fear of Hell is the only thing keeping you alive, you need help.
I prefer to think of the Mark Twain quote.
"I have no fear of death. I was dead for thousands of years before I was born. It never did me any harm." cont'd......
HonestMan395 1 year ago
@portaadonai There is a quote by Richard Dawkins that he wants to have read at his funeral. I totally agree with it. It's too big for one of these 500 word boxes, so I'll split it up.
"We are going to die, and that makes us the lucky ones.
Most people are never going to die because they are never going to be born.
The potential people who could have been here in my place, but who will, in fact, never see the light of day, outnumber the sand grains of Sahara. Cont'd.........
HonestMan395 1 year ago
@portaadonai Certainly those unborn ghosts include greater poets than Keats, scientists greater than Newton.
We know this, because the set of possible people allowed by our DNA, so massively outnumbers the set of actual people.In the teeth of these stupefying odds it is you and I, in our ordinariness, that are here.
We privileged few, who won the lottery of birth against all odds.
How dare we whine at our inevitable return to that prior state from which the vast majority have never stirred.”
HonestMan395 1 year ago
@HonestMan395 What?
portaadonai 1 year ago
@portaadonai What do you mean, What?
HonestMan395 1 year ago
@HonestMan395 I dont understand what your trying to say.
portaadonai 1 year ago
@portaadonai If it's what I said to you about needing help if the thought of hell is the only thing preventing you from committing suicide, then What's to explain.
Surely it's obvious that you need more than that to build a life on.
HonestMan395 1 year ago
@HonestMan395 Well I guess it's my fault for not explaining what I meant. The thought of Hell is not the only thing preventing me from committing suicide. When I was on drugs and living for myself, seeking after pure pleasure, I ironically became more and more miserable. The more pleasure I attained, the more I wanted. It was like a drug actually.
Since turning my life to God, my life has transformed from the inside out. Transformed in ways I never could seem to accomplish on my own.
portaadonai 1 year ago
@portaadonai That's where we differ. I'm lucky, I was never on drugs.
I was brought up in a very religious household and although I was never unhappy, I always thought something wasn't right.
It was only when I started searching for something and realised that there was no god that my life really took off.
I'm 66 and I'm happier now than I've ever been. Knowing that there is nothing to look forward to after death makes me appreciate life even more and determined to make the most of it.
HonestMan395 1 year ago
@HonestMan395 I hope you are right and I am wrong for your sake, and many of my friends.
portaadonai 1 year ago
@portaadonai I can honestly say that my release from religion was like being let out of jail and given the keys to the kingdom.
I like to think I'm a good person. I never knowingly hurt anyone. Heck, I've never even smacked my children.
I don't get drunk or mess around.
I like Dan Barkers definition of a moral life. " Go through life doing the least possible harm you can." I try to follow that.
HonestMan395 1 year ago
@HonestMan395
Instead of joy from the sake of arguing something that neither will win and neither will change the others mind....let us find common ground.
I believe that organized religion is a scam and has little or nothing to do with God.
It is about money and power. That is the reason we have so many denominations and it has nothing to do with the word of God.
I believe in the separation of Church and National government. Neither has any place interfering in the others business.
MrJohanasBilderberg 1 year ago
@MrJohanasBilderberg This may surprise you, but, even though I'm an atheist, I'm not sure that I am in favour of total separation of church and state.
Considering the effort the founding fathers, some of whom were at least agnostic if not atheist, went to to separate church and state. The US has real problem regarding organised religion.
In the UK it's quite different. Even our Head of State (The Queen) is also Head of the Church of England. Cont’d…..
HonestMan395 1 year ago
@MrJohanasBilderberg It's bishops, along with senior representatives of all the major religions sit in the House of Lords, yet we don't have the problems with religion that the US has.
Even in UK politics, religion is irrelevant. Between our Prime minister, Deputy Prime minister and Opposition Leader, 2 are atheist and I believe one is a Deist. Which is which, I'm not certain, but only because I don't consider it important enough to find out.
HonestMan395 1 year ago
@MrJohanasBilderberg In UK politics, we have politicians of all and no religious affiliations, but in the US, The land of free speech, it would be political suicide, for any politician not to declare themselves christian. Statistically, some must be closet atheists.
I think the reason we don't have the US religion problem in the UK is because, historically and quite unintentionally, we have adopted the old advice of Machiavelli.
"Keep you friends close, but keep your enemies closer." :)
HonestMan395 1 year ago
@HonestMan395
Having said that I strongly support your right to be completely and totally wrong.
I will do as Christ directed us to do and tell you of the Gospel.
Repent for the Kingdom of God is at hand.
Now back to the argument.
You cannot take a single verse out of context and claim it supports any thing. .
The Word is built line upon line, and precept upon precept.
MrJohanasBilderberg 1 year ago
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@MrJohanasBilderberg To quote you:-
"You cannot take a single verse out of context and claim it supports any thing." Exactly, but the bible is such an ambiguous book which contradicts itself over and over again, such that it lends itself to that sort of use.
How can anyone build their whole life on what is basically a jumble of myths and legends passed down by word of mouth for generations, by ignorant, superstitious, bronze age goatherders.
HonestMan395 1 year ago
@MrJohanasBilderberg How do you know what Jesus said. No-one involved in the writing of the new testament, ever met him. It's all second and third hand information from people who had a vested interest in putting accross their message.
Some of whom even admitted in their own writings that they lied for the good of the cause.
HonestMan395 1 year ago
@HonestMan395
Now as for your hatred of religion I find that understandable.
The only thing that set me free was the realization that Faith and Religion were mutually exclusive ideas. One is natural and present in every one of us, the other was created by man as a tool for money and power.
Understanding the difference is the only way to find real peace.
As for my life...I have no concern for it. I spend it in the comfort that each day brings me closer to God. :)
MrJohanasBilderberg 1 year ago
@MrJohanasBilderberg It's know that i only have one life that gives me my zest for living.
And no, I don't hate religion. It gives comfort to some people and I'm happy for adults to believe any fairy tale they want, as long as they keep it to themselves.
No, what I object to, is the cruel brainwashing of little children with stories of god watching their every move and that he will send them to burn in hell if they are not good.
That is Mental child abuse and should be a criminal offence.
HonestMan395 1 year ago
@HonestMan395
Now having spammed enough I promise not to fill more than one box again.
MrJohanasBilderberg 1 year ago
@MrJohanasBilderberg o yea sorry bout thet i didnt realize who he was, i dislike him, im a Christian, but some of the things in the video i think is true
aell0111 1 year ago
@portaadonai sorry, that last one was supposed to be addressed to you as well. I'm still finding my way around this U-Tube posting system.
HonestMan395 1 year ago
HAHA. Are you trying to say there is no real place of torment for sinners after we die? That is an absolute lie. Jesus told a story (not a parable) of the rich man and Lazurus. Lazurus the poor man died and went to a place of safety, but the rich man died and went to a place of FIRE AND TORMENT! He asked for REAL water to cool his REAL tounge! Don't be deceived! These earthly examples of Gehenna where the worm dies not, nor the fire are examples of a spiritual reality! I will post more verses..
portaadonai 1 year ago
So how do you interpret Gehennom? Like in annihilationism, where the soul simply vanishes?
YUMMYngbird 1 year ago
@YUMMYngbird I think the soul is eternal. The Bible constantly refers to everlasting torment, the smoke rises forever [REV 14:11] (what ever is burning never is consumed or ends), where the worm dies not [MARK 9:44+48], etc.
Matthew 10:28 "...Rather, fear him who is able to destroy both soul and body in Gehenna."
I think this is the second death because both the body and the soul are united (resurrection at the judgment) before thrown into Hell. Look up the "23 Minutes in Hell" video!
portaadonai 1 year ago
type in in utube search "Who Created God? Where Did God Come From? Proof of God" and watch the one by LetsTalkChrist
aell0111 1 year ago
@aell0111 You're not serious about this "who created God" video, are you?
It's by venonfangX. He's the biggest idiot on U-tube. Other creationists think he's an embarrassment.
Even his parents have tried to stop him.
If you want U-tube credibility, you won't get it by supporting this jerk.This guy thinks that the Grand Canyon was created in 5 mins.
Check him out. By the way, you won't see any adverse comments on this video. He doesn't allow it. So much for his confidence in his beliefs.
HonestMan395 1 year ago
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What about the story of the rich man with lazarus at his gate who after he died was in torment and also what about the ones who take the mark of the beast who's smoke of torment rises up forever?? I am genuine i want to know your answer?Rev 14:11
wallymano 1 year ago