In America, all people have an equal right to monetize our rights, put our would-be rulers on notice of our rights; file a Fee Schedule, send a Default and Demand for Payment, and file a lawsuit pursuant to the 7th Amendment for recovery of damages if they are not paid. Check out Musicians4Freedom and GetOutandStayOutofJail.
It is nature that compels us humans to produce our own sustenance, through the use of our minds and through physical labour, not an act of force by employers. A free market of voluntary associations makes it easier for us to sustain ourselves, by allowing each person to specialize in some aspect of production, and to develop tools that make each one more productive. To the extent that the free market has existed, it has led us upward from primitive feudal agriculture to industrial civilization.
OK, so employment is wage slavery? So was it the employer's *choice* that I would be born as a human, requiring a certain daily caloric intake and sufficient shelter and clothing? I don't think so. That's a simple fact of nature, which is not open to anyone's choice, and which we can't magically escape from. So since it's not an employer's choice that such is the case, why is employment on a free market to be considered slavery? In what way was I *forced* by another human being to take the job?
@jonathanaconway because of a lack of options. You can't just grow tomatoes in your backyard, get very good at it, and succeed because you would be competing with Walmart. I think this is a question of regulation or governmental involvement.
@PrecisePuncher What does your question mean? If you're questioning whether an *entirely* free market ever existed, then I agree, it never has. If you're asking whether such a thing is *possible*, I would say yes, but not likely any-time soon.
libertarianism, when pushed to the fringes of it's ideological confines, does not put individual autonomy at the center, but rather the rejection of state power. this is obviously a weak analysis. they don't reject hierarchy or large concentrations of power as such, only in the hands of the state. they fail to see how private property tends to the same essential problem. some even advocate social conservatism in favoring families or churches, failing to see their authoritarian tendencies.
The whole substance of this video is that the economy or the society we live in is a direct product of the discours that have been dominating throughout the years. Namely that of a hierarchical class system where the ruling class wants to keep their power and thus their interests corrupts all knowledge in the society. This makes it impossible for people excluded from the ruling class to "break free", even owners of companies are slaves to the system.
@AccumulatedKnowledge - Your very choice of title betray's your arrogance and (and possibly your ignorance). We are NOT a "democracy" by any means, nor have we EVER BEEN ONE. Many "people" don't know their "slaves" in the first place - so how can you ever free yourself when you don't know your a corporate slave?!
If the premise is, everyone is entitled to their "basic needs," then who provides those basic needs for you? If noone is required to work, then you can't force farmers to work to provide food for the growing populace.
Thanks, I'll go back to reading Lew Rockwell now.
@Luigi84289 You know, I've heard Chomsky complain that libertarianism in the US means different than what it did or does in the world, but never the term liberalism in these two contexts.So that's one conflict of interest I see. I also wonder whether Chomsky will change his mind on democracy if introduced to Public Choice.
Btw, do explain, how exactly does wage slavery work if it's voluntary?
@AccumulatedKnowledge It's not voluntary if you are rooted in a city you have to work for a boss under the threat of starvation with a fixed wage even if your goal is to get out. It's a condition of duress you do not have access to your basic needs. The globalists want everyone to be wage slaves and have all the land controlled by Government allied corporations.
@Luigi84289 Hmm, yes, the old "Untermencsh" argument. The problem with that line is that A) even if that were truly slavery (and it isn't), it would apply to a small minority, at least in the quasi market economies of the developed world, and B) these conditions are so vague, that we are all slaves to the reality to which we live in, thus making the term and its implication meaningless.
Btw, I do agree that the mixing of corporations with government power has been a tragedy for modern times.
@AccumulatedKnowledge No listen to chomsky. To be free is to own your own property and be completely self sufficient. This is what is being done away with. Whoever owns is free. We are moving towards a state in which everyone is dependent on corporations for everything. Being a dependent is a slave, having someone over you.
@Luigi84289 But in the libertarian philosophy, one test of ownership is whether or not you have the right to sell or rent it (among other things). If one may not sell or rent out oneself, it follows that they do not own oneself. But in the libertarian tradition, there exists the concept of self ownership. But honestly, being self sufficient in order to be free seems rather arbitrary, unless what you mean is freedom from reality. True freedom must be freedom to act, up until you harm others.
@AccumulatedKnowledge Wage slavery is very apparent in the economy of China today. How does it work? People are separated from living off the land and are no longer members of self sufficient communities. The are tied to factory jobs, in what were called sweat shops in the U.S. before unions (workers organized to fight for better conditions) forced some improvements. The owners seak and use means to control the workers which are nearly always fear based.
@tonygumbrell22 Ok, what is wage slavery, what are sweat shops? I tried being self sufficient once. I lived in a tent. Didn't like it. I'd rather exercise that Adam Smithian strategy called "Division of Labor"
@AccumulatedKnowledge Proves my point. Work for wages wherever they're hireing or be homeless. A lot of choices are made for you, and little better than Hobson's choice. I am retired. I worked for wages for something like 42 years, and was homeless for a short while, and, for years, destitute, though working. I hung on to jobs desperately, where I was treated like shit. America is full of disgruntled workers. The symptoms of which are manifest in our society.
@tonygumbrell22 Oh, I could live self sufficiently. I just didn't want to. I prefer working with others, trading with others, and cooperating with others, rather than only using what I can make myself.
You still haven't answer my questions-what is wage slavery, and what are sweat shops?
Most people elect to work for others and spend their money on things OTHER than starting their own companies so as to work for themselves alone. Why would I believe people employees are wage slaves if they prefer slavery to freedom (or prefer being a slave to being an owner of oneself if not of other slaves)? This seems logically suspect to me.
@Luigi84289 A child is similar to a slave in certain respects, but not the same thing. A child's right to live and to be protected from physical or sexual abuse is upheld. The child is only 'property' of parents because A) the parents produced him, B) the child is not capable of fully exercising his own individual rights and must therefore be both protected and restricted until he is. If children are to be treated as full adults, would you allow the sale of liquor/drugs to minors?
@Navywxman You negelect to explain what it is about my logic you find suspect, but I will explain what I was getting at in simpler terms if you feel that will help you. While it may be idiotic to give away one's freedoms, it is nevertheless a mark of being free that one is able to exercise the power to do with those freedoms as one sees fit. I hope this helps you. Good luck.
@dantean Interesting point. People often prefer GETTING nurtured than nature. It's not easy to have sought-after skills, have capital and connections, and it is because of a lack of that abundance of that option that people turn to wage slavery. Of course from there, whoever in power can decided it goes. As for me, I will NEVER be able to pay for an apartment and my car and save money to start a business with all the ideas I have.
Title 42, Chapter 21, so-called "civil rights" act says that U.S. Citizens will be subject to punishment, pains, penalties, taxes, licenses, and exactions of every kind; the whole affair was a trick to get people to trade unalienable rights for privileges. Unfortunately, we've been cooperating with the deception voluntarily ever since. Check out my vids, Are You in Jail by Your Own Consent; also, U.S. Citizens and the NWO. peace, Ven, Musicians 4 Freedom.
Everyone is a slave.Tell me.When was the last time you didn't have to pay a wage?When was it that you could insult a cop when he's unfair?When was it you would be givven food cause you were starving to death?Is this fair?Is it free community?Tell me.This world is their playground and they can do whatever we want to us as long as we just stand there and take the hits willingly.Please.Everyone deserves to be free.
if you read chomskys books carefully, you automatically get the impression, that he is bought, too, like all the other known and well-living slashers.
Yes, Luigi, de facto slavery still exists, and most likely will for a long time, (sadly).
Many years ago, I thought Chomsky was a smart man. But over the past three or four years, I've come to realize that though he is certainly well-spoken, (as a linguist should be), he "doesn't get it". As an example, (which I'm sure you noted, Luigi), his comment "the civil war was fought over slavery", is either shockingly ignorant, or is intentionally misleading.
@MrDorkusMaximus I agree a lot of what he says is incorrect and biased. This just seemed like a good vid on the subject. Most people don't realize what slavery really is.
@MrDorkusMaximus You're going to have to come up with something more than to pick holes in a single off-hand reference. If you disagree then say why rather than nitpicking.
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In America, all people have an equal right to monetize our rights, put our would-be rulers on notice of our rights; file a Fee Schedule, send a Default and Demand for Payment, and file a lawsuit pursuant to the 7th Amendment for recovery of damages if they are not paid. Check out Musicians4Freedom and GetOutandStayOutofJail.
sharlenemusiclover 2 days ago
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Everyone is a slave because they can be drafted.
Simple enough.
The USA is no longer a democracy; it's a bureaucracy, because the government is the final ruler.
By law, the people of each state are supreme sovereigns, but since Lincoln it's "government uber alles."
SovereignStatesman 1 week ago
It is nature that compels us humans to produce our own sustenance, through the use of our minds and through physical labour, not an act of force by employers. A free market of voluntary associations makes it easier for us to sustain ourselves, by allowing each person to specialize in some aspect of production, and to develop tools that make each one more productive. To the extent that the free market has existed, it has led us upward from primitive feudal agriculture to industrial civilization.
jonathanaconway 1 week ago
OK, so employment is wage slavery? So was it the employer's *choice* that I would be born as a human, requiring a certain daily caloric intake and sufficient shelter and clothing? I don't think so. That's a simple fact of nature, which is not open to anyone's choice, and which we can't magically escape from. So since it's not an employer's choice that such is the case, why is employment on a free market to be considered slavery? In what way was I *forced* by another human being to take the job?
jonathanaconway 1 week ago
@jonathanaconway because of a lack of options. You can't just grow tomatoes in your backyard, get very good at it, and succeed because you would be competing with Walmart. I think this is a question of regulation or governmental involvement.
paulism1984 1 week ago
@jonathanaconway what free market?
PrecisePuncher 11 hours ago
@PrecisePuncher What does your question mean? If you're questioning whether an *entirely* free market ever existed, then I agree, it never has. If you're asking whether such a thing is *possible*, I would say yes, but not likely any-time soon.
jonathanaconway 10 hours ago
libertarianism, when pushed to the fringes of it's ideological confines, does not put individual autonomy at the center, but rather the rejection of state power. this is obviously a weak analysis. they don't reject hierarchy or large concentrations of power as such, only in the hands of the state. they fail to see how private property tends to the same essential problem. some even advocate social conservatism in favoring families or churches, failing to see their authoritarian tendencies.
fede2 1 week ago
The whole substance of this video is that the economy or the society we live in is a direct product of the discours that have been dominating throughout the years. Namely that of a hierarchical class system where the ruling class wants to keep their power and thus their interests corrupts all knowledge in the society. This makes it impossible for people excluded from the ruling class to "break free", even owners of companies are slaves to the system.
Basram 1 week ago
@AccumulatedKnowledge - Your very choice of title betray's your arrogance and (and possibly your ignorance). We are NOT a "democracy" by any means, nor have we EVER BEEN ONE. Many "people" don't know their "slaves" in the first place - so how can you ever free yourself when you don't know your a corporate slave?!
LucifersLapdog 2 weeks ago
If the premise is, everyone is entitled to their "basic needs," then who provides those basic needs for you? If noone is required to work, then you can't force farmers to work to provide food for the growing populace.
Thanks, I'll go back to reading Lew Rockwell now.
VotePaineJefferson 2 weeks ago
Comment removed
mehp1244 2 weeks ago
United states is a corporation owned by britian
giroyagetme 2 weeks ago
@Luigi84289 You know, I've heard Chomsky complain that libertarianism in the US means different than what it did or does in the world, but never the term liberalism in these two contexts.So that's one conflict of interest I see. I also wonder whether Chomsky will change his mind on democracy if introduced to Public Choice.
Btw, do explain, how exactly does wage slavery work if it's voluntary?
AccumulatedKnowledge 2 months ago
@AccumulatedKnowledge It's not voluntary if you are rooted in a city you have to work for a boss under the threat of starvation with a fixed wage even if your goal is to get out. It's a condition of duress you do not have access to your basic needs. The globalists want everyone to be wage slaves and have all the land controlled by Government allied corporations.
Luigi84289 2 months ago
@Luigi84289 Hmm, yes, the old "Untermencsh" argument. The problem with that line is that A) even if that were truly slavery (and it isn't), it would apply to a small minority, at least in the quasi market economies of the developed world, and B) these conditions are so vague, that we are all slaves to the reality to which we live in, thus making the term and its implication meaningless.
Btw, I do agree that the mixing of corporations with government power has been a tragedy for modern times.
AccumulatedKnowledge 2 months ago
@AccumulatedKnowledge No listen to chomsky. To be free is to own your own property and be completely self sufficient. This is what is being done away with. Whoever owns is free. We are moving towards a state in which everyone is dependent on corporations for everything. Being a dependent is a slave, having someone over you.
Luigi84289 2 months ago
@Luigi84289 But in the libertarian philosophy, one test of ownership is whether or not you have the right to sell or rent it (among other things). If one may not sell or rent out oneself, it follows that they do not own oneself. But in the libertarian tradition, there exists the concept of self ownership. But honestly, being self sufficient in order to be free seems rather arbitrary, unless what you mean is freedom from reality. True freedom must be freedom to act, up until you harm others.
AccumulatedKnowledge 1 month ago
@AccumulatedKnowledge Wage slavery is very apparent in the economy of China today. How does it work? People are separated from living off the land and are no longer members of self sufficient communities. The are tied to factory jobs, in what were called sweat shops in the U.S. before unions (workers organized to fight for better conditions) forced some improvements. The owners seak and use means to control the workers which are nearly always fear based.
tonygumbrell22 1 month ago
@tonygumbrell22 Ok, what is wage slavery, what are sweat shops? I tried being self sufficient once. I lived in a tent. Didn't like it. I'd rather exercise that Adam Smithian strategy called "Division of Labor"
AccumulatedKnowledge 1 month ago
@AccumulatedKnowledge Proves my point. Work for wages wherever they're hireing or be homeless. A lot of choices are made for you, and little better than Hobson's choice. I am retired. I worked for wages for something like 42 years, and was homeless for a short while, and, for years, destitute, though working. I hung on to jobs desperately, where I was treated like shit. America is full of disgruntled workers. The symptoms of which are manifest in our society.
tonygumbrell22 1 month ago
@tonygumbrell22 Oh, I could live self sufficiently. I just didn't want to. I prefer working with others, trading with others, and cooperating with others, rather than only using what I can make myself.
You still haven't answer my questions-what is wage slavery, and what are sweat shops?
AccumulatedKnowledge 1 month ago
@AccumulatedKnowledge Get a discreet man to explain to you what sweat shops are.
tonygumbrell22 1 month ago
@tonygumbrell22 So you don't know. Fair enough.
Word of advice-don't get so bogged down in emotion.
AccumulatedKnowledge 1 month ago
Your the one who evidently doesn't know,or were you just asking to be cute.
tonygumbrell22 1 month ago
@tonygumbrell22 Oh I know that there is no objective definition of wage slavery or sweatshops. You had a chance to prove me wrong. You failed.
AccumulatedKnowledge 1 month ago
Most people elect to work for others and spend their money on things OTHER than starting their own companies so as to work for themselves alone. Why would I believe people employees are wage slaves if they prefer slavery to freedom (or prefer being a slave to being an owner of oneself if not of other slaves)? This seems logically suspect to me.
dantean 2 months ago
@dantean Slavery is slavery. A child is a slave by definition.
Luigi84289 2 months ago
@Luigi84289 A child is similar to a slave in certain respects, but not the same thing. A child's right to live and to be protected from physical or sexual abuse is upheld. The child is only 'property' of parents because A) the parents produced him, B) the child is not capable of fully exercising his own individual rights and must therefore be both protected and restricted until he is. If children are to be treated as full adults, would you allow the sale of liquor/drugs to minors?
jonathanaconway 1 week ago
@dantean It seems more like what you call logic is what is suspect
Navywxman 3 weeks ago
@Navywxman You negelect to explain what it is about my logic you find suspect, but I will explain what I was getting at in simpler terms if you feel that will help you. While it may be idiotic to give away one's freedoms, it is nevertheless a mark of being free that one is able to exercise the power to do with those freedoms as one sees fit. I hope this helps you. Good luck.
dantean 3 weeks ago
@dantean Interesting point. People often prefer GETTING nurtured than nature. It's not easy to have sought-after skills, have capital and connections, and it is because of a lack of that abundance of that option that people turn to wage slavery. Of course from there, whoever in power can decided it goes. As for me, I will NEVER be able to pay for an apartment and my car and save money to start a business with all the ideas I have.
paulism1984 1 week ago
@dantean because if you run away from the farm you'll never see your friends again
elysianfury 1 week ago
Title 42, Chapter 21, so-called "civil rights" act says that U.S. Citizens will be subject to punishment, pains, penalties, taxes, licenses, and exactions of every kind; the whole affair was a trick to get people to trade unalienable rights for privileges. Unfortunately, we've been cooperating with the deception voluntarily ever since. Check out my vids, Are You in Jail by Your Own Consent; also, U.S. Citizens and the NWO. peace, Ven, Musicians 4 Freedom.
sharlenemusiclover 4 months ago
Everyone is a slave.Tell me.When was the last time you didn't have to pay a wage?When was it that you could insult a cop when he's unfair?When was it you would be givven food cause you were starving to death?Is this fair?Is it free community?Tell me.This world is their playground and they can do whatever we want to us as long as we just stand there and take the hits willingly.Please.Everyone deserves to be free.
flamesdemon19 10 months ago
Yeah slavery exists alright, it's called religion. Slavery to stupidity is a god given right.
riverlioness 1 year ago
Lincoln was all about Burgouis slavery, using Proletarian Marxism and hypocrisy.
ThomasKrypton 1 year ago
if you read chomskys books carefully, you automatically get the impression, that he is bought, too, like all the other known and well-living slashers.
bataleonhero 2 years ago
Yes, Luigi, de facto slavery still exists, and most likely will for a long time, (sadly).
Many years ago, I thought Chomsky was a smart man. But over the past three or four years, I've come to realize that though he is certainly well-spoken, (as a linguist should be), he "doesn't get it". As an example, (which I'm sure you noted, Luigi), his comment "the civil war was fought over slavery", is either shockingly ignorant, or is intentionally misleading.
MrDorkusMaximus 2 years ago 2
@MrDorkusMaximus I agree a lot of what he says is incorrect and biased. This just seemed like a good vid on the subject. Most people don't realize what slavery really is.
Luigi84289 2 years ago
@MrDorkusMaximus
You have to realize that this was the thinking c. 2002.
ThomasKrypton 1 year ago
@MrDorkusMaximus You're going to have to come up with something more than to pick holes in a single off-hand reference. If you disagree then say why rather than nitpicking.
antiochus87 6 months ago