Clearly you are afraid to look at the negative side of the tone scale to the point you need to defend it rabidly. You praised Minshull and completely missed that she was so full of shit that the Tone Scale did not work for her. Back to a -40 for you on that made up lie of a control tool.
@Redrider425 The tone scale is not going to work within a cult. Since I'm not in a cult, I have found ways to use it that actually work. My means for identifying my tone is introspection. Having identified my tone, I figure out ways to raise it. One general way is to keep interested in things that are life-enhancing.
Still waiting for you to give the those hard facts about how the mental health community says what great shit this Tone Scale is. As I pointed out before Minshull was full of shit. She could not use this bull to help her choose the right people in her life. The biggest advocates of the Tone Scale are all failures in life and fuck up other people beyond belief. I need to look no further than you to see how badly it messes people up.
@Redrider425 Why are you waiting for something I never said I would deliver? I never asserted that the mental health community has praised the tone scale. What I have asserted is that in broad outline the tone scale is self-evident to me. However, you asserted that the mental health community has debunked it. So, it's you who has documentation to deliver in support of your claims.
@fortheloveofwisdom As I said find it yourself as it is easy to do. So far every thing I posted you act like I never said it to begin with. Very Orwellian like you little Tone Scale. Wow Bigot, another Scientology term to attack its critics. Stomp out efforts of those that do good, another Scientology rant. If you think the Tone Scale does good you should look at those that killed themselves in Scientology. That would make you a sicko for supporting a cult tool that kills,
@Redrider425 You cannot blame everything that has gone bad in Scientology on the tone scale. There is a lot of nonsense in Scientology, and the Co$ is an abusive cult. Although the tone scale can be used for good, it is the nature of a cult to pull people down. Also, a cult discourages honest introspection and independent thinking, which are required to use the tone scale responsibly. So, within a cult, it is going to be next-to-impossible to use the tone scale responsibly and fruitfully.
@Redrider425 Bigot isn't a Scientology term. It dates back to 1590-1600, and it is a well-established word in the English language. I probably learned the word from All in the Family, since Archie Bunker is who comes to mind with the word. It is defined as "a person who is utterly intolerant of any differing creed, belief, or opinion." That seems to fit you, since you are intolerant of the idea that the tone scale can be of any value. You have been dogmatically attacking the idea from the start.
@fortheloveofwisdom I thought I might also add that you are the one taking the time to push this garbage. You try to sound all impartial saying how you are not in Scientology but feel Minshull is trusted bla bla bla. Yeah it is on you to prove fact facts and supporting documentation. But just like a Scientology attitude people just have to take your word for it or they are a bigot.
Also you are full of it when you try to distance yourself from the cult by quoting Ruth as some independent source. Ruth Minshull was a writer of Scientology also. She produced a number of books that were very well received, even sold with the approval of the Founder, Lafayette Ron Hubbard. You know that thug that hated blacks, asians and gays LRH. She was later blacklisted by the cult. I guess she did not know how to choose here people LOL Tone Scale FAIL!
@Redrider425 You're like the people who used to call "Witch!" Only you're calling "Scientologist!" And your reasons for calling it are just as flimsy as those who called "Witch!"
@fortheloveofwisdom If you practice witchcraft I might very well call you a witch but you practice Scientology and don't want to be called out on it. There is nothing wrong with being a witch or a Scientology member just don't lie about it and expect that in a free world people have the right to challenge your ideas even if you don't like it. All of your reactions are ken to Scientology Entheta and PTSP. Funny you talk about the bible because only christians use in in every day applications.
@Redrider425 Yes, isn't it funny that I mention the Bible? Maybe I'm a secret Christian too. In one of my videos, I actually quote the Bible and a Christian writer I agree with. I might also be a secret Objectivist. I've mentioned some of Ayn Rand's ideas favorably in one video. And maybe I'm even a secret Muslim, given some of the things I said in my DMD video. Well, I'll leave it to you to figure out.
Silly silly little cult member. For one I won't be going anyplace. I don't care what you quote. If I have an issue with it I will say something. If you used an idea from the bible or other text as stupid and as refuted as the Tone Scale you would hear about it. I never accused you of being a secret anything. I think it is quite clear what you are. Be a better person, I am because I don't try to push failed ideas of a deranged loon on others as help or a sound idea.
@Redrider425 Actually, you're a lousy person. You're a closed-minded bigot who tries to stomp on the efforts of others to do good. You're also insanely delusional. You keep insisting that I'm a Scientologist and a cult member when I'm clearly not. But instead of looking at the evidence, you try to twist everything to fit your delusion. I suspect you're trying to feel good about yourself by condemning others as worse than you. But that is a shitty and dishonest way to feel better about yourself.
Respond to this video... Again there is no such thing as a Tone Scale. It is made up silly stuff not supported by fact or evidence. It has been relegated to the garbage dump of cult tools. So far the only people you have named are Scientologist and no excepted mental health professionals to back up your claims. I say a rock can help you be a better person, now disprove it. Don't dare say otherwise or I will accuse you of calling me a witch. Just silly.
@Redrider425 I'm well aware that Minshull was a Scientologist. That's why I made the disclaimers in my video about Scientology. I don't doubt that the tone scale can be misused by bigots to promote intolerance. The Nazis misused Nietzsche's idea of the overman, and Christians misused the Bible to justify the inquisition. Even if Hubbard invented the tone scale himself, that doesn't mean he didn't misuse it. I say he did misuse it, and my intention here is to promote responsible use of it.
Nope your lying again, I did answer you very clearly. I suspect a monkey could get it but then a monkey is not messed up on Scientology BS. Oh I have lots of scoks. I block you more HAHAHAAA I win you loose. Notice you you can't agree to disagree but need to block, proof of your fail. Anyone as messed up as you needs to have their head checked. Really man, loose a fight and pout like a little girl. Going to take your ball and go home?
@Redrider425 I blocked you, because I don't want to waste my time on an irrational buffoon such as yourself. Victories aren't won by trolling people with insanity until they weary of you. And you have won nothing. I still do not agree with your truckloads of BS, and you are still not one inch closer to a true understanding of things. I pity you for being such a sorry, irrational SP. Yes, your actions have confirmed that SPs are real. I would help you if I could, but you seem hopeless.
@fortheloveofwisdom Nope you blocked be because you are a looser and a lier and you got caught. Wow for someone who can't get Scientology you know what an SP is huh? And we know what your little Adolph that wrote the Tone Scale said should happen to them. You see your are becoming more like the cult members all the time. Soon you will be brain dead and so proud of yourself. I understand you are a nut hell bent on being stuck in a cult mindset. Free you brain your ass will follow.
@Redrider425 No, I blocked you out of impatience. I caught you in bald-faced lies. You were evasive about almost every question I asked you. And you kept on using logical fallacies. As your previous comment reveals, you don't understand the purpose of a discussion. You treat a discussion as a game with a winner and a loser. But the purpose of a discussion is to share knowledge and come closer to the truth. When this happens, both sides win. When it doesn't, both sides lose.
@fortheloveofwisdom Naaa your just a lier and you have been proven wrong on every half argument you made. You blocked me because you had no intelligent agreements to make and lied at every corner and got exposed. You did not need to block but like most people stuck on Scientology tech you have an obsessive personality. I give you a -40.0 Total failure on your made up, non scientific, non respected cult Tone scale. You treat a discussions as something you can dictate but you can't FAIL
@fortheloveofwisdom I have given you facts that you could not refute and validated what I said. I will say it again. No where can you find respected mental health support for the Tone Scale. In fact there are very critical reviews of it as a control tool made up by a cult leader and that is the only real place it has found a lasting home. You can't change that can you? All of this can be validated with just a few clicks of a mouse. Blocking people is -30.0 Can't hide on the Tone Scale LOL
Hubbard tells clearly how they should be dealt with in his opinion: "…any person from 2.0 down on the tone scale should not have, in any thinking society, any civil rights of any kind, because by abusing those rights they bring into being arduous and strenuous laws which are oppressive to those who need no such restraints. You can dispose of them quietly and without sorrow. Per the founder of your Tone Scale. Congrats you support a NAZI! That is what the Scale is for.
@RadioPaul1 Belief in the tone scale does not imply that I support any agenda of Hubbard's for depriving people of civil rights. I do not support fascism of any kind.
@fortheloveofwisdom No it does imply its support. It was written by a nut for one reason, to serve a purpose and the results have been horrific. People end up dead, disconnected from families, less sympathetic and you start to label people. It has proven itself by those that use it to help them have an excuse to numb their minds against real emotions. So when its creator concluded exterminating those that don't fit in it it should be no surprise. That is why it was created, CONTROL!
@RadioPaul1 As I asked you before, and you never answered, do you make a distinction between controlling others and self-control? I do make this distinction. Hubbard may have been a sociopath who sought to control others, and he may have created the tone scale as part of his arsenal for doing this, BUT none of that implies that the tone scale does not have legitimate and responsible uses in enabling self-control. The same tool can be used for both good and evil.
@fortheloveofwisdom Feel free to go back and re read because clearly you are out of it. Using your own insults, you are delusional if you say I have not answered you. As far as providing with with links debunking it by the mental health community I won't. Not because I cant but being you will just say I don't answer your questions when I in fact do. Tell you what, you show me where in the 60 years since the Tone Scale has been out where they went WOW, this thing is the shit! 60 years of fail!
@RadioPaul1 You haven't answered me, and you are lying when you say you have. You are also lying when you say that you could provide links, and the explanation you give for this is also a lie. Because of your constant stream of lies, evasions, and fallacies, discussing things with you gets nowhere. I have better things to do. So I am blocking you.
Beside emotions, Hubbard gives in Science of Survival for each level other characteristics such as health state, sexual activities, dealing with truth, activity level, and also worth to society. These descriptions are very detailed, e.g. persons at tone level 1.5 (chronic anger) are said to be prone to arthritis, people at tone level 1.1 (covert hostility) are said to be inclined to sexual perversity and homosexuality.
@RadioPaul1 This is where critical thinking needs to be applied. In broad outline, the tone scale is self-evident to me, but detailed claims about each tone, such as these, require some skepticism. Just because Hubbard started with one good idea doesn't mean he was an expert at spelling it out in detail.
@fortheloveofwisdom Hubbard started shit, not a good idea and as I have said the Tone Scale has beed roundly rejected as crap by the mental health world. Your tone scale is what it is, a hate filled documents that is homophobic and designed to devalue people that don't fit in it. Or did you mean Hubbard had a good idea about exterminating people below a 2.0 on your phony made up scale?
@RadioPaul1 If the tone scale has been roundly rejected as crap by the mental health world, please provide some documentation of this, preferably in the form of links to research done on it.
Author L. Ron Hubbard spelled the idea out saying, "just draw a horizontal line on the page. Put the people who are less alive on the bottom and the people who are more alive on the top."
Nice how a uneducated non mental health expert and con man tells you where you fit as a person and you lap it up as fact.
@RadioPaul1 Again, you are making an argumentum ad hominem. This is the logical fallacy of attacking what someone has said by attacking the person who has said it. Facts about a person who has said something do not pertain to whether it is true or false.
@fortheloveofwisdom Nope it is you making the rgumentum ad hominem but feel free to keep smoking what ever it is that you are. You asked you facts and you got them but like the broken record robot you are you just keep ranting in circles, pretty much some up a tone scale mentality LOL. Yes critical thinking does need to be applied and the tone scale is all about pigeonholing thought. Have you seen people that have used it for years. They are zombies. Real daaar dddde aaaa dah dar types.
@RadioPaul1 Just because a cult misuses something for the sake of messing with people does not mean it cannot be used responsibly. What I would be interested to know here is whether the Free Zone people are also turning people into zombies. Do you know anything about Free Zone results verses Co$ results?
@fortheloveofwisdom Have you heard the folks from the Free Zone? Yes they are fruitcakes, all you have to do is listen to their Youtube videos to know that. Only lady was talking about how she had an out of body experience and floated off to Mars. Don't ask me for the link, find it your self, it is not hard to do. Haaaaaa so you are a FreeZoner LOL That would explain a lot. Just don't like DM but the Tech still works HUH?
@fortheloveofwisdom It is not that they misused the Tone Scale, it is what L Ron Crazy made it up for. It is a control element made for a cult. It has no medical or mental health value and is not nor has ever been used by respected mental heath experts.
@RadioPaul1 The thing is I'm not a Scientologist. I have described Scientology as a dangerous cult, and I have warned people away from it. And if you look at my channel, it's clearly not a Scientology channel. It's about philosophy and critical thinking. To continue to call me a Scientologist in spite of all this just shows how delusional you are. It seems as though there is no room in your mind for a non-Scientologist who can find some value in the Scientology literature.
@fortheloveofwisdom The thing is, it does not matter that you say you are not in Scientology. What matters is you promote it and the nuttery that comes along with it. Scientology says It's about philosophy and critical thinking. I guess you will pat yourself on the back as you sell this poison. Say you are not pushing Scientology a 1000 times and guess what? You are. Again feel free to find value in a debunked sudo science. Feel free to sit in a tub of yogurt if it makes you happy.
@RadioPaul1 You need to distinguish between Scientology and the Emotional Tone Scale. They are not the same thing. I suppose Scientology did such a number on you that you are now venomously anti-Scientology. I am untouched by Scientology. This has left me free to find the value in Ruth Minshull's writings without getting pulled down by the exploitation and brain-washing of the Co$. On my own, I have found it can be used responsibly, apart from any Co$ tech, for managing my own emotional tones.
@fortheloveofwisdom 1. You are not untouched by Scientology because you are pushing it. Repackage it any way you like but Tone Scale is an invention of Scientology and is their domain. There are no emotional tones, no proof, not respected by the medical community and it was made up by a mad man as a part of brainwashing people.
@RadioPaul1 You are making an argumentum ad hominem. You are saying the tone scale is false because it was invented by a mad man as part of brainwashing people. But even if that is true, and I'm not saying it isn't, it doesn't imply that the tone scale is false. If you want to criticize the tone scale, you need to focus on the facts about the tone scale. Since you say there are no emotional tones, let me ask you what you think an emotional tone is and why there is no such thing.
@fortheloveofwisdom It is you making the ad hominem argument, just look at your insults and attacks. There is nothing you can do to change where the Tone Scale came from. You can not change that the mental health community has rejected it. I can't disprove or tell you what something that does not exist in the first place, so you are out of luck on that one. As I said it is total rubbish with made up words and ideas by a loon.
really sounding like a Scientology member now. It is their crux for everything, IT HELPED ME. So what that it hurts other people it helped me. Uh huh. If you can not tell what the difference is between an emotion and a made up tone scale that has been debunked as sudo science that is on you. I have no intentions of changing your mind. But I will challenge you on the quackery you are pushing.
@RadioPaul1 Are you unable to answer my questions? Are you more into protesting than thinking? Are you just going to act like a dog who has been trained to bark at anything smelling of Scientology? Please use your brain and have a civil discussion with me. Protesting me as though I'm part of something I'm not will not accomplish anything except waste my time.
@fortheloveofwisdom I have answered your questions but you are to brain washed in circular thinking to listen. You live in a nice little world where a debunked chart tells you how to feel and the value of that feeling. If even it is a real feeling. "No Sympathy" IS NOT AN EMOTION. Antagonism is an act! What a diluted individual you are. For someone not in Scientology you sound just like one. That should scare the hell out of you but I doubt it.
@RadioPaul1 Now you're just lying or confused. You have not answered my questions. Well, you have answered one of them further into this message, but you have not answered the others. I disagree with you on no sympathy and antagonism. Here are the questions you have not answered. 1. Do you understand the difference between an emotion and an emotional tone? 2. Do you make a distinction between pigeon-holing and classifying? 3. Do you make a distinction between controlling others and self-control?
@fortheloveofwisdom Nope, you are full of it. I answered them, Hey look, there is that robotic circular thing again LOL There is no emotional tone, it is made up loony stuff but a nutcase. I don't care if you agree with me or not, that are not emotions and no place outside of the loony Scientology world will you find anyone saying so. But feel free to keep ranting :)
@RadioPaul1 You are a liar or extremely deluded. All I have to do is review the comments here to tell you have not answered my questions. There isn't even a response from you following the comment I first asked the questions in.
@fortheloveofwisdom Broken record robot Scientology circular rant LOL Keep going robot. All of your questions have been answered and you are to robotic to see past your own loony tech.
@RadioPaul1 I'm really sorry to see you self-destructing like this. You seem to be wound up in hostility and delusion. I had hoped we could have a civil discussion, but you seem to be obstinately unable to participate in one. You seem to define yourself in terms of what you are against, not in terms of what you are for. You need to change that for your own sake before you self-destruct further.
Spoken like a diehard anti-Scientology activist, which, judging from your channel, is what you are. I see that your main interest is in fighting Scientology. I applaud this when you are actually fighting Scientology. But I am not a Scientologist, and I am not promoting this cult. Your antagonism here is misguided. But let's discuss the claims you are making.
Spoken like a member of Scientology. Wow, good job. But it is you that are missing the points. 1. Much of what you covered are not emotions. 2. You do, as the tone scale, pigeon hole emotions. 3 This is a control chart, meant to and used by Scientology to tell people there is something wrong with them and guess what? They or you have the answers LOL
@RadioPaul1 These numbers refer to the claims you numbered in your comment. 1. Do you understand the difference between an emotion and an emotional tone? That aside, what do you think are not emotions? 2. Do you make any distinction between pigeon-holing, which is an emotionally loaded term, and classifying? 3. Do you make any distinction between controlling others, which is what cults are all about, and self-control?
You make a very bad analogy. Here's a better one. This video no more promotes Scientology than my videos on the Seven Deadly Sins promote Roman Catholicism. Sometimes, a kernel of truth can be found amidst religious beliefs. Both Catholicism and Scientology are filled with nonsense, but they are not entirely devoid of value. I'm trying here to salvage something good from what is otherwise garbage.
You are pushing Scientology but you are not a member, huh? Emotions are all valid and tone classify them can cause real harm to people if they feel guilty or conflicted for having a real natural response because a chat written by a quack says they should. If you want proof of how fail this chat is just watch members of Scientology who use it the most. They hit people, stalk, curse and more. The higher they go the worse it gets. This crap does not work.
@RadioPaul1 No, I am not pushing Scientology at all. Didn't you pay attention to the disclaimers I included in this video? I detest Scientology, but I also recognize that it is the fallacy of division to conclude that every single detail of Scientology is bunk just because Scientology as a whole is bunk. Nor am I questioning the validity of emotions. But there is a difference between an emotional tone and a passing emotion, and it is good to keep the emotional tone high.
@fortheloveofwisdom Yes I did pay attention. Watched the whole thing and now I am dumber for it. Yes you are pushing Scientology. You say you don't but your actions prove you do. The argument could be made that some one does not support the KKK but come on folks are not black people stupid? You distance your self from a controversial group then push their ideas as basically good. The tone scale is not real, it is made up and many of the things you cover in it are not even emotions.
@RadioPaul1 You misunderstand how I recommend using the tone scale. I am not familiar with how Scientologists have used it, but judging by your comments, it is not how I have used it. First, I do not feel guilty for having certain emotions, and I do not judge any of my emotions to be unnatural. Sometimes, grief, fear, or anger can be the appropriate response to a situation. But it is unhealthy to get stuck in the lower tones, and the tone scale is a tool I use to get unstuck.
@RadioPaul1 Since using the tone scale works for me, you are going to have a hard time convincing me it is not real. I trust my own experience with it. If Scientologists are getting bad results with it, I'm assuming it's because being in a cult is detrimental to mental health, and it takes independent thinking, not blind obedience to authority, to use the tone scale properly.
The "tone scale" is totally invented and arbitary and look at the $cientologists- they are meant to be examples of this "tech" and they are deeply- "low toned"!
There is something a thousand times better than the "tone scale"- it is your intuition!
@laserofjustice I would agree that the expanded tone scale, which goes below 0.0 and above 4.0, is arbitrary, but the one described by Minshull here, which only covers the 0.0 to 4.0 range does not seem so arbitrary to me. Yes, the particular numbers may be arbitrary, but I do agree with the general ranking of grief, fear, hostility, and enthusiasm in terms of survival-orientation, and I do agree that expressed forms are more survival-oriented than repressed forms.
@laserofjustice I would also distinguish between the intelligent uses I have made of this scale and the misuses deranged cult members have made of it. Even when a cult includes something useful, the cult-mentality is liable to lead members to misuse it. So, if anyone wants to use the tone scale profitably, I would recommend staying far away from Scientology.
@laserofjustice I consider it hyperbole to say that my intuition is 1000 times better than the tone scale. Each has its place and is useful to me without competing with the other.
@fortheloveofwisdom Similarly it's hyperbole to suggest that the tone scale has any validity! If you think it helps you, fine. Closer inspection reveals that moods don't follow a linear path, neither do they simply have an arbitary value. Enthusiasm is neither good nor bad in itself- enthusiasm for what?
Excuse my Godwin, but wasn't Hitler very enthusiastic? A mood needs a context for it to have any meaning and this is not part of the "tone scale".
@laserofjustice I have never seen an enthusiastic Hitler. When I have seen clips of Hitler, he has normally appeared angry. Even passionate and over-the-top anger is still anger, not enthusiasm. Also, it is important to distinguish between emotions and emotional tones. They are not the same thing. An emotional tone is like a setting on a thermostat. It is where you naturally settle during ordinary circumstances. Hitler seems to have settled somewhere in the fear/anger range.
@fortheloveofwisdom I sort of see what you're saying, however, there are scientifically validated ways to evaluate someone's general mood (tone, if you prefer). But to suggest that moods/ tones are linear and generally fixed is oversimplification and over generalisation.
Re Hitler, this displays the complexity, Hitler could appear enthusiastic whilst being angry and fearful. Again, ethusiasm on it's own is meaningless.
@laserofjustice I'm not sure it's saying that moods/tones are linear and generally fixed. It's a map, and like any map, it's an abstraction that focuses on certain details. It ranks tones on a scale of survival-orientation. This becomes useful in recovery from the lower tones. The lower tones have a greater tendency to trap a person, and the tone scale provides a way to climb out of them. As I use it, it is mainly a tool that enables resiliency.
@laserofjustice Re: enthusiasm, my understanding of it is informed by a distinction philosopher Michael Gelven makes between joy and glee. Joy is genuine satisfaction with life, while glee is a sham form of happiness or excitement that accompanies indulgence in guilty behavior, such as playing tricks on people. I associate joy with enthusiasm and glee with covert hostility. Hitler may have felt glee in hurting others, but I've seen no indication that he ever felt joy.
@fortheloveofwisdom You're indulging in "mind reading" - you cannot use your subjective judgement, especially with no personal contact to accurately evaluate someone's mood/ tone. You can guess, but that's all it is and trying to then base that guess on an untested "tone scale" distorts the guess further.
Further more- not everyone feels happiness, fear etc at the same thing. Even then, emotion is deeply affected by interpreatation of experience.
@laserofjustice Instead of making assumptions about what I'm doing, go watch my new video on this subject, "Ladder to Happiness: Emotional Resiliency."
@fortheloveofwisdom I love the irony of your comment! Judging the intentions of others without sufficient evidence IS a cognitive distortion- I suggest you study cognitive behavioral psychology- an evidence-based and clinically tested psychology.
CBT will enable better emotional resliency, too. With added benefits in that it is clinically proven to be effective.
@laserofjustice Who's judging others without sufficient evidence? The ETS is useless for judging others without additional evidence. So I rarely use it for that purpose. I find it more useful for emotional resiliency, as described in the video I mentioned. If CBT works for people, fine. What I'm describing also works, as I have verified myself through introspection and personal experience. As these methods have not been tested side-by-side, you lack sufficient evidence to say which is better.
@fortheloveofwisdom Thanks for clarifying- I was under the impression that the tone scale was used to define the mood/ tone of others in a way that simply was not accurate or provable. If you find it useful for yourself, that's a different matter. I'd be very happy to see a clincal testing of the tone scale, but I feel that it is very unlikely. CBT, has, however, been clinically tested and is the speaking therapy of choice funded by the NHS in the UK, simply because it works so well.
L. Ron Hubbard invented this ridiculous "tone scale" and he pegs homosexuals as 1.1. Do you think that's OK? Like the previous commenter stated, if you need an instruction guide to rank and choose who you associate with there is something wrong with you, not them.
@quentinkrisp I would distinguish between theory and application. Hubbard's opinion on homosexuals is an application he has made of this theory, and it could very well be a misapplication. But a misapplication of a theory does not mean the theory itself is false. My own opinion is that homosexuality does not make people 1.1, but homosexuals do face social factors that can lead them to 1.1, particularly widespread prejudice and the need to stay in the closet to avoid violence and condemnation.
@Rainez667 That's not the main use I make of it, and I have not suggested that anyone needs to use it to decide who to hang out with. I principally recommend a more introspective use of it for personal development.
Clearly you are afraid to look at the negative side of the tone scale to the point you need to defend it rabidly. You praised Minshull and completely missed that she was so full of shit that the Tone Scale did not work for her. Back to a -40 for you on that made up lie of a control tool.
Redrider425 7 months ago
@Redrider425 The tone scale is not going to work within a cult. Since I'm not in a cult, I have found ways to use it that actually work. My means for identifying my tone is introspection. Having identified my tone, I figure out ways to raise it. One general way is to keep interested in things that are life-enhancing.
fortheloveofwisdom 7 months ago
Still waiting for you to give the those hard facts about how the mental health community says what great shit this Tone Scale is. As I pointed out before Minshull was full of shit. She could not use this bull to help her choose the right people in her life. The biggest advocates of the Tone Scale are all failures in life and fuck up other people beyond belief. I need to look no further than you to see how badly it messes people up.
Redrider425 7 months ago
@Redrider425 Why are you waiting for something I never said I would deliver? I never asserted that the mental health community has praised the tone scale. What I have asserted is that in broad outline the tone scale is self-evident to me. However, you asserted that the mental health community has debunked it. So, it's you who has documentation to deliver in support of your claims.
fortheloveofwisdom 7 months ago
@fortheloveofwisdom As I said find it yourself as it is easy to do. So far every thing I posted you act like I never said it to begin with. Very Orwellian like you little Tone Scale. Wow Bigot, another Scientology term to attack its critics. Stomp out efforts of those that do good, another Scientology rant. If you think the Tone Scale does good you should look at those that killed themselves in Scientology. That would make you a sicko for supporting a cult tool that kills,
Redrider425 7 months ago
@Redrider425 You cannot blame everything that has gone bad in Scientology on the tone scale. There is a lot of nonsense in Scientology, and the Co$ is an abusive cult. Although the tone scale can be used for good, it is the nature of a cult to pull people down. Also, a cult discourages honest introspection and independent thinking, which are required to use the tone scale responsibly. So, within a cult, it is going to be next-to-impossible to use the tone scale responsibly and fruitfully.
fortheloveofwisdom 7 months ago
@Redrider425 Bigot isn't a Scientology term. It dates back to 1590-1600, and it is a well-established word in the English language. I probably learned the word from All in the Family, since Archie Bunker is who comes to mind with the word. It is defined as "a person who is utterly intolerant of any differing creed, belief, or opinion." That seems to fit you, since you are intolerant of the idea that the tone scale can be of any value. You have been dogmatically attacking the idea from the start.
fortheloveofwisdom 7 months ago
@fortheloveofwisdom I thought I might also add that you are the one taking the time to push this garbage. You try to sound all impartial saying how you are not in Scientology but feel Minshull is trusted bla bla bla. Yeah it is on you to prove fact facts and supporting documentation. But just like a Scientology attitude people just have to take your word for it or they are a bigot.
Redrider425 7 months ago
Also you are full of it when you try to distance yourself from the cult by quoting Ruth as some independent source. Ruth Minshull was a writer of Scientology also. She produced a number of books that were very well received, even sold with the approval of the Founder, Lafayette Ron Hubbard. You know that thug that hated blacks, asians and gays LRH. She was later blacklisted by the cult. I guess she did not know how to choose here people LOL Tone Scale FAIL!
Redrider425 7 months ago
@Redrider425 You're like the people who used to call "Witch!" Only you're calling "Scientologist!" And your reasons for calling it are just as flimsy as those who called "Witch!"
fortheloveofwisdom 7 months ago
@fortheloveofwisdom If you practice witchcraft I might very well call you a witch but you practice Scientology and don't want to be called out on it. There is nothing wrong with being a witch or a Scientology member just don't lie about it and expect that in a free world people have the right to challenge your ideas even if you don't like it. All of your reactions are ken to Scientology Entheta and PTSP. Funny you talk about the bible because only christians use in in every day applications.
Redrider425 7 months ago
@Redrider425 Yes, isn't it funny that I mention the Bible? Maybe I'm a secret Christian too. In one of my videos, I actually quote the Bible and a Christian writer I agree with. I might also be a secret Objectivist. I've mentioned some of Ayn Rand's ideas favorably in one video. And maybe I'm even a secret Muslim, given some of the things I said in my DMD video. Well, I'll leave it to you to figure out.
fortheloveofwisdom 7 months ago
Silly silly little cult member. For one I won't be going anyplace. I don't care what you quote. If I have an issue with it I will say something. If you used an idea from the bible or other text as stupid and as refuted as the Tone Scale you would hear about it. I never accused you of being a secret anything. I think it is quite clear what you are. Be a better person, I am because I don't try to push failed ideas of a deranged loon on others as help or a sound idea.
Redrider425 7 months ago
@Redrider425 Actually, you're a lousy person. You're a closed-minded bigot who tries to stomp on the efforts of others to do good. You're also insanely delusional. You keep insisting that I'm a Scientologist and a cult member when I'm clearly not. But instead of looking at the evidence, you try to twist everything to fit your delusion. I suspect you're trying to feel good about yourself by condemning others as worse than you. But that is a shitty and dishonest way to feel better about yourself.
fortheloveofwisdom 7 months ago
Respond to this video... Again there is no such thing as a Tone Scale. It is made up silly stuff not supported by fact or evidence. It has been relegated to the garbage dump of cult tools. So far the only people you have named are Scientologist and no excepted mental health professionals to back up your claims. I say a rock can help you be a better person, now disprove it. Don't dare say otherwise or I will accuse you of calling me a witch. Just silly.
Redrider425 7 months ago
@Redrider425 Go use your rock to become a better person, then come back and tell others how to do the same.
fortheloveofwisdom 7 months ago
@Redrider425 I'm well aware that Minshull was a Scientologist. That's why I made the disclaimers in my video about Scientology. I don't doubt that the tone scale can be misused by bigots to promote intolerance. The Nazis misused Nietzsche's idea of the overman, and Christians misused the Bible to justify the inquisition. Even if Hubbard invented the tone scale himself, that doesn't mean he didn't misuse it. I say he did misuse it, and my intention here is to promote responsible use of it.
fortheloveofwisdom 7 months ago
Nope your lying again, I did answer you very clearly. I suspect a monkey could get it but then a monkey is not messed up on Scientology BS. Oh I have lots of scoks. I block you more HAHAHAAA I win you loose. Notice you you can't agree to disagree but need to block, proof of your fail. Anyone as messed up as you needs to have their head checked. Really man, loose a fight and pout like a little girl. Going to take your ball and go home?
Redrider425 8 months ago
@Redrider425 I blocked you, because I don't want to waste my time on an irrational buffoon such as yourself. Victories aren't won by trolling people with insanity until they weary of you. And you have won nothing. I still do not agree with your truckloads of BS, and you are still not one inch closer to a true understanding of things. I pity you for being such a sorry, irrational SP. Yes, your actions have confirmed that SPs are real. I would help you if I could, but you seem hopeless.
fortheloveofwisdom 8 months ago
@fortheloveofwisdom Nope you blocked be because you are a looser and a lier and you got caught. Wow for someone who can't get Scientology you know what an SP is huh? And we know what your little Adolph that wrote the Tone Scale said should happen to them. You see your are becoming more like the cult members all the time. Soon you will be brain dead and so proud of yourself. I understand you are a nut hell bent on being stuck in a cult mindset. Free you brain your ass will follow.
Redrider425 8 months ago
@Redrider425 No, I blocked you out of impatience. I caught you in bald-faced lies. You were evasive about almost every question I asked you. And you kept on using logical fallacies. As your previous comment reveals, you don't understand the purpose of a discussion. You treat a discussion as a game with a winner and a loser. But the purpose of a discussion is to share knowledge and come closer to the truth. When this happens, both sides win. When it doesn't, both sides lose.
fortheloveofwisdom 7 months ago
@fortheloveofwisdom Naaa your just a lier and you have been proven wrong on every half argument you made. You blocked me because you had no intelligent agreements to make and lied at every corner and got exposed. You did not need to block but like most people stuck on Scientology tech you have an obsessive personality. I give you a -40.0 Total failure on your made up, non scientific, non respected cult Tone scale. You treat a discussions as something you can dictate but you can't FAIL
Redrider425 7 months ago
@fortheloveofwisdom I have given you facts that you could not refute and validated what I said. I will say it again. No where can you find respected mental health support for the Tone Scale. In fact there are very critical reviews of it as a control tool made up by a cult leader and that is the only real place it has found a lasting home. You can't change that can you? All of this can be validated with just a few clicks of a mouse. Blocking people is -30.0 Can't hide on the Tone Scale LOL
Redrider425 7 months ago
Hubbard tells clearly how they should be dealt with in his opinion: "…any person from 2.0 down on the tone scale should not have, in any thinking society, any civil rights of any kind, because by abusing those rights they bring into being arduous and strenuous laws which are oppressive to those who need no such restraints. You can dispose of them quietly and without sorrow. Per the founder of your Tone Scale. Congrats you support a NAZI! That is what the Scale is for.
RadioPaul1 8 months ago
@RadioPaul1 Belief in the tone scale does not imply that I support any agenda of Hubbard's for depriving people of civil rights. I do not support fascism of any kind.
fortheloveofwisdom 8 months ago
@fortheloveofwisdom No it does imply its support. It was written by a nut for one reason, to serve a purpose and the results have been horrific. People end up dead, disconnected from families, less sympathetic and you start to label people. It has proven itself by those that use it to help them have an excuse to numb their minds against real emotions. So when its creator concluded exterminating those that don't fit in it it should be no surprise. That is why it was created, CONTROL!
RadioPaul1 8 months ago
@RadioPaul1 As I asked you before, and you never answered, do you make a distinction between controlling others and self-control? I do make this distinction. Hubbard may have been a sociopath who sought to control others, and he may have created the tone scale as part of his arsenal for doing this, BUT none of that implies that the tone scale does not have legitimate and responsible uses in enabling self-control. The same tool can be used for both good and evil.
fortheloveofwisdom 8 months ago
@fortheloveofwisdom Feel free to go back and re read because clearly you are out of it. Using your own insults, you are delusional if you say I have not answered you. As far as providing with with links debunking it by the mental health community I won't. Not because I cant but being you will just say I don't answer your questions when I in fact do. Tell you what, you show me where in the 60 years since the Tone Scale has been out where they went WOW, this thing is the shit! 60 years of fail!
RadioPaul1 8 months ago
@RadioPaul1 You haven't answered me, and you are lying when you say you have. You are also lying when you say that you could provide links, and the explanation you give for this is also a lie. Because of your constant stream of lies, evasions, and fallacies, discussing things with you gets nowhere. I have better things to do. So I am blocking you.
fortheloveofwisdom 8 months ago
Beside emotions, Hubbard gives in Science of Survival for each level other characteristics such as health state, sexual activities, dealing with truth, activity level, and also worth to society. These descriptions are very detailed, e.g. persons at tone level 1.5 (chronic anger) are said to be prone to arthritis, people at tone level 1.1 (covert hostility) are said to be inclined to sexual perversity and homosexuality.
RadioPaul1 8 months ago
@RadioPaul1 This is where critical thinking needs to be applied. In broad outline, the tone scale is self-evident to me, but detailed claims about each tone, such as these, require some skepticism. Just because Hubbard started with one good idea doesn't mean he was an expert at spelling it out in detail.
fortheloveofwisdom 8 months ago
@fortheloveofwisdom Hubbard started shit, not a good idea and as I have said the Tone Scale has beed roundly rejected as crap by the mental health world. Your tone scale is what it is, a hate filled documents that is homophobic and designed to devalue people that don't fit in it. Or did you mean Hubbard had a good idea about exterminating people below a 2.0 on your phony made up scale?
RadioPaul1 8 months ago
@RadioPaul1 If the tone scale has been roundly rejected as crap by the mental health world, please provide some documentation of this, preferably in the form of links to research done on it.
fortheloveofwisdom 8 months ago
Back to my pigeonhole comment
Author L. Ron Hubbard spelled the idea out saying, "just draw a horizontal line on the page. Put the people who are less alive on the bottom and the people who are more alive on the top."
Nice how a uneducated non mental health expert and con man tells you where you fit as a person and you lap it up as fact.
RadioPaul1 8 months ago
@RadioPaul1 Again, you are making an argumentum ad hominem. This is the logical fallacy of attacking what someone has said by attacking the person who has said it. Facts about a person who has said something do not pertain to whether it is true or false.
fortheloveofwisdom 8 months ago
@fortheloveofwisdom Nope it is you making the rgumentum ad hominem but feel free to keep smoking what ever it is that you are. You asked you facts and you got them but like the broken record robot you are you just keep ranting in circles, pretty much some up a tone scale mentality LOL. Yes critical thinking does need to be applied and the tone scale is all about pigeonholing thought. Have you seen people that have used it for years. They are zombies. Real daaar dddde aaaa dah dar types.
RadioPaul1 8 months ago
@RadioPaul1 Just because a cult misuses something for the sake of messing with people does not mean it cannot be used responsibly. What I would be interested to know here is whether the Free Zone people are also turning people into zombies. Do you know anything about Free Zone results verses Co$ results?
fortheloveofwisdom 8 months ago
@fortheloveofwisdom Have you heard the folks from the Free Zone? Yes they are fruitcakes, all you have to do is listen to their Youtube videos to know that. Only lady was talking about how she had an out of body experience and floated off to Mars. Don't ask me for the link, find it your self, it is not hard to do. Haaaaaa so you are a FreeZoner LOL That would explain a lot. Just don't like DM but the Tech still works HUH?
RadioPaul1 8 months ago
@fortheloveofwisdom It is not that they misused the Tone Scale, it is what L Ron Crazy made it up for. It is a control element made for a cult. It has no medical or mental health value and is not nor has ever been used by respected mental heath experts.
RadioPaul1 8 months ago
Spoken like a true delusional Scientology nut. How sad :(
RadioPaul1 8 months ago
@RadioPaul1 The thing is I'm not a Scientologist. I have described Scientology as a dangerous cult, and I have warned people away from it. And if you look at my channel, it's clearly not a Scientology channel. It's about philosophy and critical thinking. To continue to call me a Scientologist in spite of all this just shows how delusional you are. It seems as though there is no room in your mind for a non-Scientologist who can find some value in the Scientology literature.
fortheloveofwisdom 8 months ago
@fortheloveofwisdom The thing is, it does not matter that you say you are not in Scientology. What matters is you promote it and the nuttery that comes along with it. Scientology says It's about philosophy and critical thinking. I guess you will pat yourself on the back as you sell this poison. Say you are not pushing Scientology a 1000 times and guess what? You are. Again feel free to find value in a debunked sudo science. Feel free to sit in a tub of yogurt if it makes you happy.
RadioPaul1 8 months ago
@RadioPaul1 You need to distinguish between Scientology and the Emotional Tone Scale. They are not the same thing. I suppose Scientology did such a number on you that you are now venomously anti-Scientology. I am untouched by Scientology. This has left me free to find the value in Ruth Minshull's writings without getting pulled down by the exploitation and brain-washing of the Co$. On my own, I have found it can be used responsibly, apart from any Co$ tech, for managing my own emotional tones.
fortheloveofwisdom 8 months ago
@fortheloveofwisdom 1. You are not untouched by Scientology because you are pushing it. Repackage it any way you like but Tone Scale is an invention of Scientology and is their domain. There are no emotional tones, no proof, not respected by the medical community and it was made up by a mad man as a part of brainwashing people.
RadioPaul1 8 months ago
@RadioPaul1 You are making an argumentum ad hominem. You are saying the tone scale is false because it was invented by a mad man as part of brainwashing people. But even if that is true, and I'm not saying it isn't, it doesn't imply that the tone scale is false. If you want to criticize the tone scale, you need to focus on the facts about the tone scale. Since you say there are no emotional tones, let me ask you what you think an emotional tone is and why there is no such thing.
fortheloveofwisdom 8 months ago
@fortheloveofwisdom It is you making the ad hominem argument, just look at your insults and attacks. There is nothing you can do to change where the Tone Scale came from. You can not change that the mental health community has rejected it. I can't disprove or tell you what something that does not exist in the first place, so you are out of luck on that one. As I said it is total rubbish with made up words and ideas by a loon.
Livin in your own world :)
RadioPaul1 8 months ago
really sounding like a Scientology member now. It is their crux for everything, IT HELPED ME. So what that it hurts other people it helped me. Uh huh. If you can not tell what the difference is between an emotion and a made up tone scale that has been debunked as sudo science that is on you. I have no intentions of changing your mind. But I will challenge you on the quackery you are pushing.
RadioPaul1 8 months ago
@RadioPaul1 Are you unable to answer my questions? Are you more into protesting than thinking? Are you just going to act like a dog who has been trained to bark at anything smelling of Scientology? Please use your brain and have a civil discussion with me. Protesting me as though I'm part of something I'm not will not accomplish anything except waste my time.
fortheloveofwisdom 8 months ago
@fortheloveofwisdom I have answered your questions but you are to brain washed in circular thinking to listen. You live in a nice little world where a debunked chart tells you how to feel and the value of that feeling. If even it is a real feeling. "No Sympathy" IS NOT AN EMOTION. Antagonism is an act! What a diluted individual you are. For someone not in Scientology you sound just like one. That should scare the hell out of you but I doubt it.
RadioPaul1 8 months ago
@RadioPaul1 Now you're just lying or confused. You have not answered my questions. Well, you have answered one of them further into this message, but you have not answered the others. I disagree with you on no sympathy and antagonism. Here are the questions you have not answered. 1. Do you understand the difference between an emotion and an emotional tone? 2. Do you make a distinction between pigeon-holing and classifying? 3. Do you make a distinction between controlling others and self-control?
fortheloveofwisdom 8 months ago
@fortheloveofwisdom Nope, you are full of it. I answered them, Hey look, there is that robotic circular thing again LOL There is no emotional tone, it is made up loony stuff but a nutcase. I don't care if you agree with me or not, that are not emotions and no place outside of the loony Scientology world will you find anyone saying so. But feel free to keep ranting :)
RadioPaul1 8 months ago
@RadioPaul1 You are a liar or extremely deluded. All I have to do is review the comments here to tell you have not answered my questions. There isn't even a response from you following the comment I first asked the questions in.
fortheloveofwisdom 8 months ago
@fortheloveofwisdom Broken record robot Scientology circular rant LOL Keep going robot. All of your questions have been answered and you are to robotic to see past your own loony tech.
RadioPaul1 8 months ago
@RadioPaul1 I'm really sorry to see you self-destructing like this. You seem to be wound up in hostility and delusion. I had hoped we could have a civil discussion, but you seem to be obstinately unable to participate in one. You seem to define yourself in terms of what you are against, not in terms of what you are for. You need to change that for your own sake before you self-destruct further.
fortheloveofwisdom 8 months ago
Spoken like a diehard anti-Scientology activist, which, judging from your channel, is what you are. I see that your main interest is in fighting Scientology. I applaud this when you are actually fighting Scientology. But I am not a Scientologist, and I am not promoting this cult. Your antagonism here is misguided. But let's discuss the claims you are making.
fortheloveofwisdom 8 months ago
Spoken like a member of Scientology. Wow, good job. But it is you that are missing the points. 1. Much of what you covered are not emotions. 2. You do, as the tone scale, pigeon hole emotions. 3 This is a control chart, meant to and used by Scientology to tell people there is something wrong with them and guess what? They or you have the answers LOL
RadioPaul1 8 months ago
@RadioPaul1 These numbers refer to the claims you numbered in your comment. 1. Do you understand the difference between an emotion and an emotional tone? That aside, what do you think are not emotions? 2. Do you make any distinction between pigeon-holing, which is an emotionally loaded term, and classifying? 3. Do you make any distinction between controlling others, which is what cults are all about, and self-control?
fortheloveofwisdom 8 months ago
You make a very bad analogy. Here's a better one. This video no more promotes Scientology than my videos on the Seven Deadly Sins promote Roman Catholicism. Sometimes, a kernel of truth can be found amidst religious beliefs. Both Catholicism and Scientology are filled with nonsense, but they are not entirely devoid of value. I'm trying here to salvage something good from what is otherwise garbage.
fortheloveofwisdom 8 months ago
You are pushing Scientology but you are not a member, huh? Emotions are all valid and tone classify them can cause real harm to people if they feel guilty or conflicted for having a real natural response because a chat written by a quack says they should. If you want proof of how fail this chat is just watch members of Scientology who use it the most. They hit people, stalk, curse and more. The higher they go the worse it gets. This crap does not work.
RadioPaul1 8 months ago
@RadioPaul1 No, I am not pushing Scientology at all. Didn't you pay attention to the disclaimers I included in this video? I detest Scientology, but I also recognize that it is the fallacy of division to conclude that every single detail of Scientology is bunk just because Scientology as a whole is bunk. Nor am I questioning the validity of emotions. But there is a difference between an emotional tone and a passing emotion, and it is good to keep the emotional tone high.
fortheloveofwisdom 8 months ago
@fortheloveofwisdom Yes I did pay attention. Watched the whole thing and now I am dumber for it. Yes you are pushing Scientology. You say you don't but your actions prove you do. The argument could be made that some one does not support the KKK but come on folks are not black people stupid? You distance your self from a controversial group then push their ideas as basically good. The tone scale is not real, it is made up and many of the things you cover in it are not even emotions.
RadioPaul1 8 months ago
@RadioPaul1 You misunderstand how I recommend using the tone scale. I am not familiar with how Scientologists have used it, but judging by your comments, it is not how I have used it. First, I do not feel guilty for having certain emotions, and I do not judge any of my emotions to be unnatural. Sometimes, grief, fear, or anger can be the appropriate response to a situation. But it is unhealthy to get stuck in the lower tones, and the tone scale is a tool I use to get unstuck.
fortheloveofwisdom 8 months ago
@RadioPaul1 Since using the tone scale works for me, you are going to have a hard time convincing me it is not real. I trust my own experience with it. If Scientologists are getting bad results with it, I'm assuming it's because being in a cult is detrimental to mental health, and it takes independent thinking, not blind obedience to authority, to use the tone scale properly.
fortheloveofwisdom 8 months ago
The "tone scale" is totally invented and arbitary and look at the $cientologists- they are meant to be examples of this "tech" and they are deeply- "low toned"!
There is something a thousand times better than the "tone scale"- it is your intuition!
laserofjustice 8 months ago
@laserofjustice I would agree that the expanded tone scale, which goes below 0.0 and above 4.0, is arbitrary, but the one described by Minshull here, which only covers the 0.0 to 4.0 range does not seem so arbitrary to me. Yes, the particular numbers may be arbitrary, but I do agree with the general ranking of grief, fear, hostility, and enthusiasm in terms of survival-orientation, and I do agree that expressed forms are more survival-oriented than repressed forms.
fortheloveofwisdom 8 months ago
@laserofjustice I would also distinguish between the intelligent uses I have made of this scale and the misuses deranged cult members have made of it. Even when a cult includes something useful, the cult-mentality is liable to lead members to misuse it. So, if anyone wants to use the tone scale profitably, I would recommend staying far away from Scientology.
fortheloveofwisdom 8 months ago
@laserofjustice I consider it hyperbole to say that my intuition is 1000 times better than the tone scale. Each has its place and is useful to me without competing with the other.
fortheloveofwisdom 8 months ago
@fortheloveofwisdom Similarly it's hyperbole to suggest that the tone scale has any validity! If you think it helps you, fine. Closer inspection reveals that moods don't follow a linear path, neither do they simply have an arbitary value. Enthusiasm is neither good nor bad in itself- enthusiasm for what?
Excuse my Godwin, but wasn't Hitler very enthusiastic? A mood needs a context for it to have any meaning and this is not part of the "tone scale".
laserofjustice 8 months ago
@laserofjustice I have never seen an enthusiastic Hitler. When I have seen clips of Hitler, he has normally appeared angry. Even passionate and over-the-top anger is still anger, not enthusiasm. Also, it is important to distinguish between emotions and emotional tones. They are not the same thing. An emotional tone is like a setting on a thermostat. It is where you naturally settle during ordinary circumstances. Hitler seems to have settled somewhere in the fear/anger range.
fortheloveofwisdom 8 months ago
@fortheloveofwisdom I sort of see what you're saying, however, there are scientifically validated ways to evaluate someone's general mood (tone, if you prefer). But to suggest that moods/ tones are linear and generally fixed is oversimplification and over generalisation.
Re Hitler, this displays the complexity, Hitler could appear enthusiastic whilst being angry and fearful. Again, ethusiasm on it's own is meaningless.
laserofjustice 7 months ago
@laserofjustice I'm not sure it's saying that moods/tones are linear and generally fixed. It's a map, and like any map, it's an abstraction that focuses on certain details. It ranks tones on a scale of survival-orientation. This becomes useful in recovery from the lower tones. The lower tones have a greater tendency to trap a person, and the tone scale provides a way to climb out of them. As I use it, it is mainly a tool that enables resiliency.
fortheloveofwisdom 7 months ago
@laserofjustice Re: enthusiasm, my understanding of it is informed by a distinction philosopher Michael Gelven makes between joy and glee. Joy is genuine satisfaction with life, while glee is a sham form of happiness or excitement that accompanies indulgence in guilty behavior, such as playing tricks on people. I associate joy with enthusiasm and glee with covert hostility. Hitler may have felt glee in hurting others, but I've seen no indication that he ever felt joy.
fortheloveofwisdom 7 months ago
@fortheloveofwisdom You're indulging in "mind reading" - you cannot use your subjective judgement, especially with no personal contact to accurately evaluate someone's mood/ tone. You can guess, but that's all it is and trying to then base that guess on an untested "tone scale" distorts the guess further.
Further more- not everyone feels happiness, fear etc at the same thing. Even then, emotion is deeply affected by interpreatation of experience.
laserofjustice 7 months ago
@laserofjustice Instead of making assumptions about what I'm doing, go watch my new video on this subject, "Ladder to Happiness: Emotional Resiliency."
fortheloveofwisdom 7 months ago
@fortheloveofwisdom I love the irony of your comment! Judging the intentions of others without sufficient evidence IS a cognitive distortion- I suggest you study cognitive behavioral psychology- an evidence-based and clinically tested psychology.
CBT will enable better emotional resliency, too. With added benefits in that it is clinically proven to be effective.
laserofjustice 7 months ago
@laserofjustice Who's judging others without sufficient evidence? The ETS is useless for judging others without additional evidence. So I rarely use it for that purpose. I find it more useful for emotional resiliency, as described in the video I mentioned. If CBT works for people, fine. What I'm describing also works, as I have verified myself through introspection and personal experience. As these methods have not been tested side-by-side, you lack sufficient evidence to say which is better.
fortheloveofwisdom 7 months ago
@fortheloveofwisdom Thanks for clarifying- I was under the impression that the tone scale was used to define the mood/ tone of others in a way that simply was not accurate or provable. If you find it useful for yourself, that's a different matter. I'd be very happy to see a clincal testing of the tone scale, but I feel that it is very unlikely. CBT, has, however, been clinically tested and is the speaking therapy of choice funded by the NHS in the UK, simply because it works so well.
laserofjustice 7 months ago
L. Ron Hubbard invented this ridiculous "tone scale" and he pegs homosexuals as 1.1. Do you think that's OK? Like the previous commenter stated, if you need an instruction guide to rank and choose who you associate with there is something wrong with you, not them.
quentinkrisp 8 months ago
@quentinkrisp I would distinguish between theory and application. Hubbard's opinion on homosexuals is an application he has made of this theory, and it could very well be a misapplication. But a misapplication of a theory does not mean the theory itself is false. My own opinion is that homosexuality does not make people 1.1, but homosexuals do face social factors that can lead them to 1.1, particularly widespread prejudice and the need to stay in the closet to avoid violence and condemnation.
fortheloveofwisdom 8 months ago
If you need a scale to determine "who you should hang out with", etc., you're a computer, not a real person.
Rainez667 8 months ago
@Rainez667 That's not the main use I make of it, and I have not suggested that anyone needs to use it to decide who to hang out with. I principally recommend a more introspective use of it for personal development.
fortheloveofwisdom 8 months ago