Actuatualy, there are christians who support evolution, but traditinal thinking fundies still go along with old world theology..at a time when religious authority had a hold and say on science!
@pbrskater26 lmao...religion is so funny. imagine a group of people going around to disprove gravity or something...we should take it as philosophy, not as doctine.the most important thing is we all get along without killing each other.
21:30 Have those who disbelieved not considered that the heavens and the earth were a joined entity, and We separated them and made from water every living thing? Then will they not believe?
46:3 We did not create the heavens and earth and what is between them except in truth and [for] a specified term.But those who disbelieve, from that of which they are warned, are turning away.
51:47 And the heaven We constructed with strength, and indeed, We are [its] expander.
this is real..before snake has a legs or feet..that is written in the bible..... but when satan go through the body of snake and tempted eve...God curses the snake and God says you will Crawl now... then that is the beginning ...science cannot denie it..... all answer is in the bible...like the one that science discover that the earth stops rotating in one day..that one is written in the book of Joshua 10:12...joshua pray to God to stops the rotating of earth until he had finish attcng enemy
Gen 3:14 the Lord God said onto the serpent, because thou has done this, thou art cursed above all cattle, and above every beast of the field; UPON THY BELLY SHALT THOU GO, & DUST SHALT THOU EAT ALL THE DAYS OF THY LIFE:.." The serpent (annunaki maybe??) did something other than slither (craw) before the intro of disorder (entropy) in other words, before the fall of man
I thought this was about snakes and legs. Never mind.
Humans like almost all animals rely on using fear to control others. Most animals use bullying tac tics. A trait not uncommon in man too. However man has found great ways to keep masses in line. Religion. And lets be honest. No matter what we all believe in, so many 'wrong' religions have done a great job keeping masses of people in line.
Evolution deniers often say how come we never see fossils of fish with legs without putting into perspective that when a species develope legs, the rest of its body will also change correspondingly to accomodate the legs and other features. So there will never be a fish with legs. The simple fact that people inherit traits from their parents is the very basis of evolution.
@PungiFungi "So there will never be a fish with legs"
There's fish alive today that have "legs" - Google image search "ziebell's fish" and look at some of the photos. btw i'm not sure the names of the species...
@PungiFungi Also, when this ancient fish developed their legs, land was almost uninhabited except for insects and crustaceans... so while today a fish with legs would get snatched for food by birds or any other animal the moment it even thinks of getting close to land, in those days it was quite advantageous to come out of water when predators where around.
Yep, perfectly consistent with the passage within the Bible in which God said to the serpent that from that point onward it will crawl about upon its belly.
BTW, the Evolutionary model, suggests that due to the physiological ability to speak & the cognitive ability to correctly execute "analogical reasoning", that Crows are humanity's nearest relatives.
Hey, whataya know... I have Black cousins! Must have been when one of my uncles was young in the 60's & apparently he found himself a groovy, foxy Black "Bird"
@Chuichupachichi "BTW, the Evolutionary model, suggests that due to the physiological ability to speak & the cognitive ability to correctly execute "analogical reasoning", that Crows are humanity's nearest relatives."
It suggestions nothing like that at all. Try to educate yourself please.
It doesn't work! Instead, it ridiculously postulates that you 2 handed Apes are entirely composed of an enormous compilation of nothing but reproductive defects... well, on second thought, maybe that not so ridiculous. But this is... Evo theory claims that when all of the normal individuals will die, only a few defects will survive. Yet, everyone that believes Evo, always has the perception that "only the strongest survive". In fact, that is the view Darwin had with his "continual
@EV0LVING well, the theory of evolution is that an animal will take on new physical adaptations to it's biological makeup, so that the species is better suited to it's changing environment. Such as an african mammoth losing it's fur as the climate no longer calls for it. Im not trying to be sarcastic, i'd genuinely like to talk to you about it.
combative struggle between the races". But simultaneously, his theory also claimed that what the defects survive is environmental change... not combative struggles between organisms. Supposedly single cell organisms existed first. Then, all complex lifeforms are compilations of retained, greater degrees of survivability. Yet, today the Kings of Survival are single celled bacteria??? Reason would have it that 1 cell organisms should have the least survivability. Also, today's existent viruses
would necessarily have a continuous ancestry of single cell organisms, back to the beginning. Viruses mutate very frequently & to great degrees (entire organism) Yet, after billions of years they're still single cell viruses? I still have 3 Brooklyn Bridges in stock... if you & your Ape buddies are interested in any more? This weekend is the "Unscientific Religotard - Mercy On Cranially Bankrupt Apes" Sale
Don't be such a chump... awaken to our corrupt world already.
The environment has changed greatly since they hypno-lulled you to sleep. Politics & its money controls everything in this world. Science has always been plauged with "funding" problems & work security. The authoritarian global rulers want you dumb because intelligent people are difficult to tyrannize. Money is the greatest corrupter & consenting scientists are only human... they're not immune to corruption but lack of funding drives their nightmares
You're not an Ape... take it like a man, I've always been a fan of science myself & it broke my heart when I figured this out. But what are we to do... lie to ourselves? At least be an Ape, not a bitch... face the facts!
They claim ape-like ancestors ate meat & their brain grew. In turn, their intelligence increased & thats why Elephants & Blue Whales have better than Space Shuttles. Eventually their intelligence was capable of language but like all apes, they would have been physiologically
incapable of speaking. Thus, although Evo has no foresight, they eventually evolved the ability to speak. However, Evo-religiously miraculously the birdbrained, non Mammalian Crows can not only speak, but they have proved to possess greater cognitive abilities than all the Great Apes. If you can't see how that brings down the Evo house of cards, then get off the Planet Of The Apes & come back to Earth to reclaim your human intelligence. Believe me, they intentionally punk you for it.
From my many analyzed Evolutionist individuals, & from how you sound, I'd calculate that you're at the state in which you won't be capable of coming to reason from this information unless you first discard your hatred for your Creator
Physicists discover with advanced math. Why is there math in the universe? Cretins, retards, average C students & even smarter intelligences don't understand it. Why would non intelligence understand it? It requires man's brightest
@Chuichupachichi "Evolutionary model suggest that due to the physiological ability to speak & the cognitive ability to correctly execute "analogical reasoning", that crows are humanitys nearest relatives.
Wait, what? The batteries must be dead in my sarcasm detector. If youre being serious in what way specifically are you asserting that crows are our nearest relatives?
@hawyang I think this was taken from "Life of Mammals" by David Attenborough. Check to be sure but i think i used the full clip on snakes and the evidence of legs.
The overwhelming majority of evolution deniers don't know what evolution is or how it works. In fact, i'd go as far as to say that NONE of them know what it is! Their emotional attachment to god keeps them ignorant of the facts. Sad and pathetic people if you ask me!!
I have recently emersed myself with evolution trying to get as much information as I can. Lol yeah I Know. They just deny any science that doesn't support their biblical interpretations of the world. I personally know
@EV0LVING Who created the very first existence of the universe? Dont tell it just existed out of nothing or it just existed eternally/without beginning
@EV0LVING That's why im asking you, Who do you think created the very first existence of the universe? Dont tell it just existed out of nothing or it just existed eternally/without beginning
@EV0LVING If you believe in Stephen Hawking then you can`t chirp people who believe in god cuz no matter what all you know is told to you by someone else. I believe in evolution only untill someone can come up with a better explanation...
@React24 You might want to learn the value of EVIDENCE!!!
If you use the word "believe" when describing evolution then you know very little about the subject. It's not word of mouth or guess work... Evolution by natural selection is a FACT which is backed up by millions of pieces of evidence. It has never been disproved.
@EV0LVING My point is that just cuz its the best current answer to how life came to be doesn`t mean it will always be the best answer. Stephen Hawking is a Legend but just cuz he says something doesnt suddenly mean his statements will stand the test of time...Look how much of einsteins work has been revised over the past 50 years...
@EV0LVING this is real..before snake has a legs or feet..that is written in the bible..... but when satan go through the body of snake and tempted eve...God curses the snake and God says you will Crawl now... then that is the beginning ...science cannot denie it.all answer is in the bible.like the one that science discover that the earth stops rotating in one day..that one is written in the book of Joshua 10:12...joshua pray to God to stops the rotating of earth until he had finish attcng enemy
@spinalglacier Evolution by natural selection explains the whole history of life. Life doesn't make sense without it... Knowing our evolutionary past helps us to "understand" and create drugs to fight diseases, we can manipulate vegitables, plants and animals to aid our own survival. Understanding our past helps to eradicate racism - because to hate a black person is to hate yourself. It helps to eradicate religious extremism and their arrogance. It helps to treat other animals with more respect
@BEAST636 Well the racism thing is a bit of a stretch. C'mon, same earth, same air, same bodies, same matter, the fact that we are all equal should be a given. If anything, evolution makes racism worse. I've met a man who uses the fact that whites have much better immune system than any other race to prove that they are superior to all, even he completely disregards the fact that my people are impervious to diseases foreign to him, black people can stand the sun MUCH better than he can, etc
@BEAST636 He was basically trying to say that whites are superior because of their genetics. That their evolution is superior. It's stupid, I know. But I don't believe EVERYONE has to necessarily believe in it. C'mon. Not everyone's a scientist, a doctor. SOME people are better off being mildly diluded (just a little religious) who have good will, I've met them. They don't oppose evolution, but they don't believe in it. As for the animal thing, it should already be a given, in my opinion.
@BEAST636 It's good for a lot of things, I agree with you. But I don't think people who don't believe in it are stupid. Some people just don't care. They'd rather pay attention to more important (or more personal things) in life.
I thought your last comment was disgusting. The thought that i'm chatting to someone who thinks animals were created for US to use and abuse boils my blood!
I cannot engage in anymore of your ignorance. I detest your world view.
Dude - My comment was asking a creationist to tell me what evolution is! Everytime i debate with such people, they never know what evolution is or how it works...
YECs will say that god made us in his image, as a perfect creation, but god does not have a body. he is transcendent of time and matter, so the image he is speaking of must be spiritual and emotional, compassion, love, sacrifice, etc.
thanks for that clip but i am already very familiar with everything in that video. I told you i am not unfamiliar with these things, but there still are people who claim its 6,000 yrs old
i know what evolution is, i have studied it. I am not a young earth creationist. But i am not an evolutionist either. I know evolution took place, but i do not accept it happened just as the text books tell us. I see good evidence for it but also holes. i am a christian and contrary to what many christians say (especially republicans, right wing etc.) Evolution does not mean no god/christianity.
Well i have a problem with whale evolution, and the evolution of sexual reproduction. I know these are taught and spoken of regularly, but these are a few things that i cannot accept that easily by their explanation. Contrary to what some YEC's will say, the bible does not say the earth is 6,000years old and never did. Even old school guys like Jack van Impe are saying its billions of years old. (granted hes still a creationist), it depends how you interpert it.
You dont know any creationists that say its 6,000 years old? are you serious? i can list a few right now, that are here on Youtube, venomfangx, nephilim free, and anyone that follows kent hovind.
just type in nephilimfree age of the universe. should be one of the first to come up. Either way, whats the difference? i dont believe that and neither do you so whats the issue?
i think a stubborness, and being close minded. I even had a small discussion with nephilim free about the age of the universe. He said that i have been brainwashed by secular science and i think god is a liar. i think this mentality gives christians a bad name. I think that many people are influenced by people like kent hovind and other YECs. It is a matter of interpertation, and many republican type christians in the U.S. have this view. i dont.
i do believe genesis is divinely inspired, but its not supposed to be interperted literally. I believe the "6 days of creation" were a metaphor for god creating the concept of "time", demonstrated by the use of "days".
snakes losing their legs, dust to man, sin entering the world, ive heard people even say that these are metaphors for evolution. i dont know if i believe that, but atleast people are open for different interpertations
please explain my cherry picking. keep in mind i didnt say i know what happened, or that the 6 days are for sure about that, but its a concept im open to.
Your belief is based on cherry picking what parts of the bible are literally true and those that are not. If you believe that EVERYTHING in the bible is a metaphor then you're not a christian. If you believe that some things are but others really happened then you clearly cherry pick.
Not knowing enough about nature, psychology and science leads you to your belief system. It's based on ignorance!
dont try and pull that atheist superior intelligence bullshit. Do you think guys like alistair mcgrath and william lane craig are also lacking knowledge in those fields? they are not ignorant. in fact dr. craig would make you look like a complete ignoramus, especially in philosophy. Hitchens looked foolish, so what would happen to you.
you just hate god, even though you think he doesnt exist...
wow i thought we may be having a mature discussion, but i see now you are too arrogant and condescending for that to take place. you just want to banter and name call.
I cannot have a mature conversation with someone that does not know the difference between fact and fiction. I find it embarrassing "debating" if Noah really did live for 950 years or if it has some "other" meaning!?
Believe what you want i don't care but don't expect me to take you or any other religious person seriously.
you are going to have to take us seriously. Because of people like dr.craig who are WINNING debates on the existence of god. If there were no good reason to believe in our "invisible sky daddy" then why and how is craig winning these debates? pure rhetoric?
What i do is press ctrl and "a" then ctrl and "c" then post your comment. Press F5 to refresh the page and see if your comment is posted. If it isn't then paste your comment back (ctrl and "v") and edit it by taking out some of the quotes. Then repost.
Youtube must think we're writing some kind of script or URLs etc and blocks them.
what i was saying was on a poll done shortly after the craig/hitchens debate, among pure atheists, 74% voted that craig won by a clear margin. This can only mean that he won, period. of course this does not prove our position is right, but i suggest you watch the debate. if hitchens cannot defeat craigs position, i clearly doubt you could even come close
There were 4 options to vote on. Hitchens won by a clear margin, hitchens barely won, Craig won by a clear margin, craig barely won. Also you had to be a member of the site and forum to vote. just accept it, craig worked him
How do you know WHO voted? How do you know what percentage of voters were Atheist and Christian?
The success of the "win" is controlled by the amount of CHRISTIANS or ATHEISTS who voted. There are FAR more Christians in the world than Atheists, this is all the poll showed!
so do you understand why it is widely accepted that craig won? i have given you legit reasons to show that he won, and since you wont watch it, you must accept what i tell u
What reasons are these then? That something is highly improbable therefore a god must have done it? Is that it? Is that all you people have as "proof"?
Dr craig has an emotional attachment to something that he "thinks" is real. A security blanket in the sky...
It's all very pathetic, that grown-ups need to believe in something other than themselves in order to function.
I'm still waiting for you to give me the link for this debate...
so you are admitting its an ego thing then? you dont want to have to believe in anything. I can tell you some of the strongest people mentally i know are christians. It is not weakness, its being humble.
i dont have the link, you'll have to download it off of pirate bay
I don't need to believe in something that "loves me" as i experience the real thing from family and friends. Why would i believe in something when there's no evidence for it?
Approx 99% of all species that have ever evolved on this earth have gone extinct and you expect me to believe that god has a plan and that he created us for a reason?
If you want to believe in god then fine, but i want real answers where a conflict of interests doesn't get in the way!
how does 99% of species dying pose a problem? Is every species suppsoed to stick around forever? animals live and die, this is life. How is this a problem. Ive hear hitchens try to use this but it just doesnt cut it. I dont believe in god because i want him to love me. I believe in him because i believe its the best explanation for the origins of the universe and life. Abiogenesis to me is so far fetched, from an atheist point of view. We cant re-create it now, but it happened on its own?
Life might seem nice and rosy for you but you're not putting yourself in other less fortunate people's shoes.
"animals live and die, this is life. How is this a problem."
It's HOW they die which is a problem. The unessacerry cruel way in which they die... Prey targeting the young and weak, ripping their throats out whilst its parents watch in the distance... Sharks that HAVE TO eat their siblings in the womb in order to be born... This is not a good design and strongly suggests no god.
one of them? but we cannot create the kind of cells that needed to be present at the time of abiogenesis. You say we believe in fairy tales, to me, abiogenesis is the most far fetched fairy tales for adults.
so survival of the fittest means no god? wow i just cant get on your level of thinking. We are intended to be above the animals. this is why we have morals, societies, emotions. Animals do not feel emotions on the level that we do. You suggesting "whilst its parents watch". You are likening it to a human brain experiencing that. its not even close to the same thing. Not a good design? please, thats just the opposite of ID, which i assume you dont take seriously
...wow i just cant get on your level of thinking....
Because you've been brainwashed!
....We are intended to be above the animals....
No, morals and emotions are the product of evolution by natural selection. Many other animals display this behaviour.
...."whilst its parents watch".....
I agree that we have evolved a higher sense of emotion but that does NOT mean that animals do not have it. Elephant calfs get targeted by a predator which eats them alive. It's parents mourn them. Google it
It is laughable to hear creationists compare evolution or abiogenisis to be akin to fairy tales.
you believe that their is a magic man in that created the universe in 7 days, knows everything we all do or think, is all powerful, sent his son down to be a human sacrifice, that sons mother was a virgin, he walked on water, when he died he came back to life and ascended into heaven, when people die they either live on in paradise or are tortured in hell WITH ABSOLUTELY ZERO PROOF OF ANY OF THIS
For anyone to say they truly know how the world was created would be a lie. Science says the theory must be tested and repeatable in order to become a law. Neither creationist or evolutionist can do this. Still, to deny the existence of God because of an evolutionary belief is silly. For the big bang to have started you would need that energy to have come from somewhere... you always get back to a creator from which the energy source came. Some call that source God.
creationism is on no where near the same level as actual science. proponents of creationism do not seem to understand that if you want an idea to be accepted as a viable hypothesis in science you need to actually have a testable concept and have to have facts to back it up.
The body of work in evolutionary biology is huge, 100's of thousands of peer reviewed papers, the geological, fossil and molecular records.
Creationism is at best a smear campaign with no actual idea beyond 'god did it'
i will watch some derren brown videos, but i suggest you watch a video called, "everything is spiritual." it is about the intricacies of the universe and the fine tuning. Yeah i thought the same thing, more fine tuning irreducible complexity stuff, but its different and better than anything ive seen.
Imagine the vastness of the universe and then times this by the highest number anyone can think of or... imagine that it's infinite. Now imagine the endless possibilities within that vastness. The "fine tuning" will happen as you increase the vastness of the universe. It's called probability.
oh yeah, i know derren brown, i watched his part on religion, where he "converts" people. watch the video responding to that, explaining how he uses basic hypnosis and suggestion to do this. I have never been to anything like this. I have never been told i have to believe in god, and certainly have never been tricked into beliveing it. You only say this because you are already at the predisposition that it cant possibly be true
please, i am a devout christian, i read it often. I do not believe that it is meant to be interpreted literally as many YECs will tell you. In Job, god even says to him, "where were you, when i laid the foundations of the earth. Tell me if you understand?"
I believe we are not meant (or think) to know everything. I think the evolution vs creation thing got out of hand when it became a power struggle.
This comment has received too many negative votesshow
"Explanations that are not consistent with empirical evidence or cannot be tested empirically are not a part of science" National Science Teachers Association
This 'lost leg' video is 100% non-consistent with empirical evidence (there is no evidence of 100 million year old ancestor that lsot legs, ears and then returned to a surface life) and cannot be tested empirically. Snakes are thought to have been aquatic in origin by many scientists, thereby eliminating every 'lost leg' as fables.
oh really? u do know that this guy has made breakthroughs in many scientific investigations, and if snakes didn't have legs plz explain to me about the 'Anal spurs' they are bone and in the exact place that the legs were, i personally believe that snakes at one stage did have front legs, i can't remember its name but there is a creature alive today that the only way to describe it is a snake with 2 front legs, it is even related to snakes (lizard) so why is snakes havin legs hard 2 believe?
Snakes (phylogenetically tetrapods) are known to have lost their legs, descending from squamates in the Mesozoic. We can see this (like cetaceans) in the fossil record, embryology, and atavistic mutations. Also, we can trace the loss of limbs through transitional forms like Pachyrhachis, comparing the rate of limb-loss in relation to environmental change to the many examples of similar loss occurring today. This is empirical as it gets. I guess it counts for nothing, though. Go read the Bible.
Excellent Presentation !!!
1softkiss 2 days ago
You're so right. There's so much proof for evolution of reptiles.
lanearthur21 2 days ago
STOP BRINGING YOUR RELIGION HERE.
chesleycareystar 1 month ago
then god said..let there be evolution...lol.
chrisviolet13 4 months ago
@chrisviolet13
Actuatualy, there are christians who support evolution, but traditinal thinking fundies still go along with old world theology..at a time when religious authority had a hold and say on science!
pbrskater26 1 month ago
@pbrskater26 lmao...religion is so funny. imagine a group of people going around to disprove gravity or something...we should take it as philosophy, not as doctine.the most important thing is we all get along without killing each other.
chrisviolet13 1 month ago
Evolution is a bad fariy tale. Stop scaring the kids.
darkfur35 4 months ago
@darkfur35 good one..
DDazzle1 2 months ago
@darkfur35 my christian uncle told me that once explained the book of revelation. Tell me which is scarier.
natesdevices 2 months ago
He's joking.
earlysda 4 months ago
BIG BANG - SPACE in Quran:
21:30 Have those who disbelieved not considered that the heavens and the earth were a joined entity, and We separated them and made from water every living thing? Then will they not believe?
46:3 We did not create the heavens and earth and what is between them except in truth and [for] a specified term.But those who disbelieve, from that of which they are warned, are turning away.
51:47 And the heaven We constructed with strength, and indeed, We are [its] expander.
tamerakk 4 months ago
huh....seems like god missed a few, dont worry god ill take care of it.
116gaara 6 months ago
if you took all the "evidence" of evolution that is an actual fossil, you could put it in the back of a small car!
aguyfromalabama 7 months ago
@aguyfromalabama and thats based on...
Thats still more evidence then christianity has.
natesdevices 2 months ago
this is real..before snake has a legs or feet..that is written in the bible..... but when satan go through the body of snake and tempted eve...God curses the snake and God says you will Crawl now... then that is the beginning ...science cannot denie it..... all answer is in the bible...like the one that science discover that the earth stops rotating in one day..that one is written in the book of Joshua 10:12...joshua pray to God to stops the rotating of earth until he had finish attcng enemy
ericsantiago011 9 months ago
@ericsantiago011 you are sick.
chesleycareystar 1 month ago
This has been flagged as spam show
Gen 3:14 the Lord God said onto the serpent, because thou has done this, thou art cursed above all cattle, and above every beast of the field; UPON THY BELLY SHALT THOU GO, & DUST SHALT THOU EAT ALL THE DAYS OF THY LIFE:.." The serpent (annunaki maybe??) did something other than slither (craw) before the intro of disorder (entropy) in other words, before the fall of man
From6to7 10 months ago
“Religion is what keeps the poor man from murdering the rich”
-Napoleon Bonaparte
CuestasV 11 months ago
crap
greenhornet123 11 months ago
I thought this was about snakes and legs. Never mind.
Humans like almost all animals rely on using fear to control others. Most animals use bullying tac tics. A trait not uncommon in man too. However man has found great ways to keep masses in line. Religion. And lets be honest. No matter what we all believe in, so many 'wrong' religions have done a great job keeping masses of people in line.
stufaman 1 year ago
Evolution deniers often say how come we never see fossils of fish with legs without putting into perspective that when a species develope legs, the rest of its body will also change correspondingly to accomodate the legs and other features. So there will never be a fish with legs. The simple fact that people inherit traits from their parents is the very basis of evolution.
PungiFungi 1 year ago
@PungiFungi "So there will never be a fish with legs"
There's fish alive today that have "legs" - Google image search "ziebell's fish" and look at some of the photos. btw i'm not sure the names of the species...
EV0LVING 1 year ago
@EV0LVING , I can see those are modified fins, not the kind of legs that the deniers often refer to.
PungiFungi 1 year ago
@PungiFungi Also, when this ancient fish developed their legs, land was almost uninhabited except for insects and crustaceans... so while today a fish with legs would get snatched for food by birds or any other animal the moment it even thinks of getting close to land, in those days it was quite advantageous to come out of water when predators where around.
larrycpo 9 months ago
Yep, perfectly consistent with the passage within the Bible in which God said to the serpent that from that point onward it will crawl about upon its belly.
God obviously eliminated its legs!
Chuichupachichi 1 year ago
LMAO!
EV0LVING 1 year ago
@Chuichupachichi we dont know if god did because satan was a snake and then god started saying that so .
genli1 1 year ago
@Chuichupachichi God --> #Myth #Fiction
chesleycareystar 1 month ago
@Chuichupachichi God was made by human....
chesleycareystar 1 month ago
BTW, the Evolutionary model, suggests that due to the physiological ability to speak & the cognitive ability to correctly execute "analogical reasoning", that Crows are humanity's nearest relatives.
Hey, whataya know... I have Black cousins! Must have been when one of my uncles was young in the 60's & apparently he found himself a groovy, foxy Black "Bird"
Chuichupachichi 1 year ago
This has been flagged as spam show
@Chuichupachichi "BTW, the Evolutionary model, suggests that due to the physiological ability to speak & the cognitive ability to correctly execute "analogical reasoning", that Crows are humanity's nearest relatives."
It suggestions nothing like that at all. Try to educate yourself please.
SiriusMined 1 year ago
@Chuichupachichi According to evolutionary biologists, what is the theory of evolution and how does it work?
EV0LVING 1 year ago
@EV0LVING
It doesn't work! Instead, it ridiculously postulates that you 2 handed Apes are entirely composed of an enormous compilation of nothing but reproductive defects... well, on second thought, maybe that not so ridiculous. But this is... Evo theory claims that when all of the normal individuals will die, only a few defects will survive. Yet, everyone that believes Evo, always has the perception that "only the strongest survive". In fact, that is the view Darwin had with his "continual
Chuichupachichi 1 year ago
@Chuichupachichi Thanks for that little rant but i asked you a question:
"According to evolutionary biologists, what is the theory of evolution and how does it work?"
I'm waiting...
EV0LVING 1 year ago
@EV0LVING well, the theory of evolution is that an animal will take on new physical adaptations to it's biological makeup, so that the species is better suited to it's changing environment. Such as an african mammoth losing it's fur as the climate no longer calls for it. Im not trying to be sarcastic, i'd genuinely like to talk to you about it.
natesdevices 2 months ago
combative struggle between the races". But simultaneously, his theory also claimed that what the defects survive is environmental change... not combative struggles between organisms. Supposedly single cell organisms existed first. Then, all complex lifeforms are compilations of retained, greater degrees of survivability. Yet, today the Kings of Survival are single celled bacteria??? Reason would have it that 1 cell organisms should have the least survivability. Also, today's existent viruses
Chuichupachichi 1 year ago
would necessarily have a continuous ancestry of single cell organisms, back to the beginning. Viruses mutate very frequently & to great degrees (entire organism) Yet, after billions of years they're still single cell viruses? I still have 3 Brooklyn Bridges in stock... if you & your Ape buddies are interested in any more? This weekend is the "Unscientific Religotard - Mercy On Cranially Bankrupt Apes" Sale
Don't be such a chump... awaken to our corrupt world already.
Chuichupachichi 1 year ago
The environment has changed greatly since they hypno-lulled you to sleep. Politics & its money controls everything in this world. Science has always been plauged with "funding" problems & work security. The authoritarian global rulers want you dumb because intelligent people are difficult to tyrannize. Money is the greatest corrupter & consenting scientists are only human... they're not immune to corruption but lack of funding drives their nightmares
Chuichupachichi 1 year ago
You're not an Ape... take it like a man, I've always been a fan of science myself & it broke my heart when I figured this out. But what are we to do... lie to ourselves? At least be an Ape, not a bitch... face the facts!
They claim ape-like ancestors ate meat & their brain grew. In turn, their intelligence increased & thats why Elephants & Blue Whales have better than Space Shuttles. Eventually their intelligence was capable of language but like all apes, they would have been physiologically
Chuichupachichi 1 year ago
incapable of speaking. Thus, although Evo has no foresight, they eventually evolved the ability to speak. However, Evo-religiously miraculously the birdbrained, non Mammalian Crows can not only speak, but they have proved to possess greater cognitive abilities than all the Great Apes. If you can't see how that brings down the Evo house of cards, then get off the Planet Of The Apes & come back to Earth to reclaim your human intelligence. Believe me, they intentionally punk you for it.
Chuichupachichi 1 year ago
From my many analyzed Evolutionist individuals, & from how you sound, I'd calculate that you're at the state in which you won't be capable of coming to reason from this information unless you first discard your hatred for your Creator
Physicists discover with advanced math. Why is there math in the universe? Cretins, retards, average C students & even smarter intelligences don't understand it. Why would non intelligence understand it? It requires man's brightest
Chuichupachichi 1 year ago
@Chuichupachichi "Evolutionary model suggest that due to the physiological ability to speak & the cognitive ability to correctly execute "analogical reasoning", that crows are humanitys nearest relatives.
Wait, what? The batteries must be dead in my sarcasm detector. If youre being serious in what way specifically are you asserting that crows are our nearest relatives?
SidewaysGts 1 year ago
is there a full episode on this?
hawyang 1 year ago
@hawyang I think this was taken from "Life of Mammals" by David Attenborough. Check to be sure but i think i used the full clip on snakes and the evidence of legs.
EV0LVING 1 year ago
1:18 look like a worm
GrandNecro 1 year ago
what if moles became like nakes.
BeamSurfer 1 year ago
Ya, satan is a snake cause snakes are good at slipping into a shadow.
BeamSurfer 1 year ago
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SimKoning 1 year ago
How can anybody deny evolution with evidence such as this!
At first I was appaled by evolution saying that I was related to a monkey.
But look at the similarities we have in our behavior.
questionsamson 2 years ago
The overwhelming majority of evolution deniers don't know what evolution is or how it works. In fact, i'd go as far as to say that NONE of them know what it is! Their emotional attachment to god keeps them ignorant of the facts. Sad and pathetic people if you ask me!!
EV0LVING 2 years ago 6
I have recently emersed myself with evolution trying to get as much information as I can. Lol yeah I Know. They just deny any science that doesn't support their biblical interpretations of the world. I personally know
questionsamson 2 years ago
And facts keep you ignorant from God.
(sorry just had to say that xD)
soldier4670 1 year ago
@EV0LVING Who created the very first existence of the universe? Dont tell it just existed out of nothing or it just existed eternally/without beginning
JakeHustle2 1 year ago
@JakeHustle2 This video is about snakes and the evidence for evolution, not the big bang!
Google search for "Stephen Hawking: God did not create Universe"
EV0LVING 1 year ago 5
This has been flagged as spam show
@EV0LVING That's why im asking you, Who do you think created the very first existence of the universe? Dont tell it just existed out of nothing or it just existed eternally/without beginning
JakeHustle2 1 year ago
@EV0LVING If you believe in Stephen Hawking then you can`t chirp people who believe in god cuz no matter what all you know is told to you by someone else. I believe in evolution only untill someone can come up with a better explanation...
React24 1 year ago
@React24 You might want to learn the value of EVIDENCE!!!
If you use the word "believe" when describing evolution then you know very little about the subject. It's not word of mouth or guess work... Evolution by natural selection is a FACT which is backed up by millions of pieces of evidence. It has never been disproved.
EV0LVING 1 year ago
@EV0LVING My point is that just cuz its the best current answer to how life came to be doesn`t mean it will always be the best answer. Stephen Hawking is a Legend but just cuz he says something doesnt suddenly mean his statements will stand the test of time...Look how much of einsteins work has been revised over the past 50 years...
React24 1 year ago
@React24 "My point is that just cuz its the best current answer to how life came to be doesn`t mean it will always be the best answer"
That's because you don't know what the evidence is or how a theory is established in science.
Check out the series "Foundational Falsehood of Creationism" by ARONRA
EV0LVING 1 year ago
@React24
{Stephen Hawking is a Legend but just cuz he says something doesnt suddenly mean his statements will stand the test of time}
Oh no, his theory will indeed stand the "test of time"
Thats because his theory is dependant upon "imaginary" time... that kind of time is invinsible because it can do anything you wish to imagine it to do
Chuichupachichi 1 year ago
@React24
And Darwin's work has been expanded, revised, and change. All becausse that's what the evidence showed.
So no, no scientists "believes in" Darwin, or Hawking or Einstein or any other.
SiriusMined 1 year ago
@EV0LVING this is real..before snake has a legs or feet..that is written in the bible..... but when satan go through the body of snake and tempted eve...God curses the snake and God says you will Crawl now... then that is the beginning ...science cannot denie it.all answer is in the bible.like the one that science discover that the earth stops rotating in one day..that one is written in the book of Joshua 10:12...joshua pray to God to stops the rotating of earth until he had finish attcng enemy
ericsantiago011 9 months ago
@JakeHustle2 idiot.
colalight71 1 year ago
@colalight71 Idiot
JakeHustle2 1 year ago
@JakeHustle2
@colalight71
Idiots. jk.
iQualify 1 year ago
@EV0LVING Well I believe in evolution, but is it really an important thing to know?
spinalglacier 1 year ago
@spinalglacier Evolution by natural selection explains the whole history of life. Life doesn't make sense without it... Knowing our evolutionary past helps us to "understand" and create drugs to fight diseases, we can manipulate vegitables, plants and animals to aid our own survival. Understanding our past helps to eradicate racism - because to hate a black person is to hate yourself. It helps to eradicate religious extremism and their arrogance. It helps to treat other animals with more respect
BEAST636 1 year ago
@BEAST636 Well the racism thing is a bit of a stretch. C'mon, same earth, same air, same bodies, same matter, the fact that we are all equal should be a given. If anything, evolution makes racism worse. I've met a man who uses the fact that whites have much better immune system than any other race to prove that they are superior to all, even he completely disregards the fact that my people are impervious to diseases foreign to him, black people can stand the sun MUCH better than he can, etc
spinalglacier 1 year ago
@BEAST636 He was basically trying to say that whites are superior because of their genetics. That their evolution is superior. It's stupid, I know. But I don't believe EVERYONE has to necessarily believe in it. C'mon. Not everyone's a scientist, a doctor. SOME people are better off being mildly diluded (just a little religious) who have good will, I've met them. They don't oppose evolution, but they don't believe in it. As for the animal thing, it should already be a given, in my opinion.
spinalglacier 1 year ago
@BEAST636 It's good for a lot of things, I agree with you. But I don't think people who don't believe in it are stupid. Some people just don't care. They'd rather pay attention to more important (or more personal things) in life.
spinalglacier 1 year ago
Comment removed
SimKoning 1 year ago
I thought your last comment was disgusting. The thought that i'm chatting to someone who thinks animals were created for US to use and abuse boils my blood!
I cannot engage in anymore of your ignorance. I detest your world view.
EV0LVING 2 years ago
Dude - My comment was asking a creationist to tell me what evolution is! Everytime i debate with such people, they never know what evolution is or how it works...
Awesome video btw - The best on youtube imo
EV0LVING 2 years ago
btw - I am BEAST636 too lol
EV0LVING 2 years ago
YECs will say that god made us in his image, as a perfect creation, but god does not have a body. he is transcendent of time and matter, so the image he is speaking of must be spiritual and emotional, compassion, love, sacrifice, etc.
ronhudsonjr 2 years ago
thanks for that clip but i am already very familiar with everything in that video. I told you i am not unfamiliar with these things, but there still are people who claim its 6,000 yrs old
ronhudsonjr 2 years ago
i know what evolution is, i have studied it. I am not a young earth creationist. But i am not an evolutionist either. I know evolution took place, but i do not accept it happened just as the text books tell us. I see good evidence for it but also holes. i am a christian and contrary to what many christians say (especially republicans, right wing etc.) Evolution does not mean no god/christianity.
just puttin in my 2 cents
ronhudsonjr 2 years ago
What are those holes?
How is christianity compatible with evolution?
Have you read the bible?
BEAST636 2 years ago
Well i have a problem with whale evolution, and the evolution of sexual reproduction. I know these are taught and spoken of regularly, but these are a few things that i cannot accept that easily by their explanation. Contrary to what some YEC's will say, the bible does not say the earth is 6,000years old and never did. Even old school guys like Jack van Impe are saying its billions of years old. (granted hes still a creationist), it depends how you interpert it.
ronhudsonjr 2 years ago
Take a look at the clip: watch?v=SaaDpYGmnE8 regarding Whale Evolution.
But why just whale evolution? Why not Seals, Sea Lions, Manatees etc? Do you have a problem with their evolution too?
I don't know any creationists that say that the bible says the earth is 6000 years old.
Here's how we know it's not 6000 years old and how Christians came to that conclusion.
watch?v=w5369-OobM4
BEAST636 2 years ago
You dont know any creationists that say its 6,000 years old? are you serious? i can list a few right now, that are here on Youtube, venomfangx, nephilim free, and anyone that follows kent hovind.
ronhudsonjr 2 years ago
No, you never read my comment properly. I said, "I don't know any creationists that say that the BIBLE SAYS the earth is 6000 years old."
Show me a creationist video where they say that the BIBLE SAYS it's 6000 years old.
BEAST636 2 years ago
just type in nephilimfree age of the universe. should be one of the first to come up. Either way, whats the difference? i dont believe that and neither do you so whats the issue?
ronhudsonjr 2 years ago
The issue is that the book of genesis is NOT devinely inspired. THEY believe it is and we don't. They're delusional and we're not.
So what makes them believe it is literally true and not you?
BEAST636 2 years ago
i think a stubborness, and being close minded. I even had a small discussion with nephilim free about the age of the universe. He said that i have been brainwashed by secular science and i think god is a liar. i think this mentality gives christians a bad name. I think that many people are influenced by people like kent hovind and other YECs. It is a matter of interpertation, and many republican type christians in the U.S. have this view. i dont.
ronhudsonjr 2 years ago
i do believe genesis is divinely inspired, but its not supposed to be interperted literally. I believe the "6 days of creation" were a metaphor for god creating the concept of "time", demonstrated by the use of "days".
snakes losing their legs, dust to man, sin entering the world, ive heard people even say that these are metaphors for evolution. i dont know if i believe that, but atleast people are open for different interpertations
ronhudsonjr 2 years ago
LMAO! Sorry, but that is ridiculously funny!
You're even more delusional than the Young Eathers!
I have more respect for the YECs as they do less cherry picking than you do.
BEAST636 2 years ago
please explain my cherry picking. keep in mind i didnt say i know what happened, or that the 6 days are for sure about that, but its a concept im open to.
ronhudsonjr 2 years ago
Your belief is based on cherry picking what parts of the bible are literally true and those that are not. If you believe that EVERYTHING in the bible is a metaphor then you're not a christian. If you believe that some things are but others really happened then you clearly cherry pick.
Not knowing enough about nature, psychology and science leads you to your belief system. It's based on ignorance!
BEAST636 2 years ago
no,
dont try and pull that atheist superior intelligence bullshit. Do you think guys like alistair mcgrath and william lane craig are also lacking knowledge in those fields? they are not ignorant. in fact dr. craig would make you look like a complete ignoramus, especially in philosophy. Hitchens looked foolish, so what would happen to you.
you just hate god, even though you think he doesnt exist...
ronhudsonjr 2 years ago
wow i thought we may be having a mature discussion, but i see now you are too arrogant and condescending for that to take place. you just want to banter and name call.
ronhudsonjr 2 years ago
I cannot have a mature conversation with someone that does not know the difference between fact and fiction. I find it embarrassing "debating" if Noah really did live for 950 years or if it has some "other" meaning!?
Believe what you want i don't care but don't expect me to take you or any other religious person seriously.
BEAST636 2 years ago
was this comment a response to the one that starts with
no, ?
if not then please respond to that. regarding mcgrath and craig. they are both christians with a similar worldview as me
ronhudsonjr 2 years ago
you are going to have to take us seriously. Because of people like dr.craig who are WINNING debates on the existence of god. If there were no good reason to believe in our "invisible sky daddy" then why and how is craig winning these debates? pure rhetoric?
ronhudsonjr 2 years ago
A christian comes away thinking that he won the debate and an Atheist comes away thinking that he won the debate... So, WHO won it?
The burden of proof is on the believer. If they cannot supply this proof then they LOST the debate.
BEAST636 2 years ago
are u censoring comments? why did my last comment not come up?
ronhudsonjr 2 years ago
No, it happens to me all the time.
What i do is press ctrl and "a" then ctrl and "c" then post your comment. Press F5 to refresh the page and see if your comment is posted. If it isn't then paste your comment back (ctrl and "v") and edit it by taking out some of the quotes. Then repost.
Youtube must think we're writing some kind of script or URLs etc and blocks them.
BEAST636 2 years ago
oh ok. well then,
what i was saying was on a poll done shortly after the craig/hitchens debate, among pure atheists, 74% voted that craig won by a clear margin. This can only mean that he won, period. of course this does not prove our position is right, but i suggest you watch the debate. if hitchens cannot defeat craigs position, i clearly doubt you could even come close
ronhudsonjr 2 years ago
Amongst pure Atheists???? Via the interenet???? Where no one can see the Atheist???? and there's no proof that they're an Atheist????
Show me the poll and explain how people vote please!
BEAST636 2 years ago
There were 4 options to vote on. Hitchens won by a clear margin, hitchens barely won, Craig won by a clear margin, craig barely won. Also you had to be a member of the site and forum to vote. just accept it, craig worked him
ronhudsonjr 2 years ago
....just accept it, craig worked him....
How do you know WHO voted? How do you know what percentage of voters were Atheist and Christian?
The success of the "win" is controlled by the amount of CHRISTIANS or ATHEISTS who voted. There are FAR more Christians in the world than Atheists, this is all the poll showed!
BEAST636 2 years ago
so do you understand why it is widely accepted that craig won? i have given you legit reasons to show that he won, and since you wont watch it, you must accept what i tell u
ronhudsonjr 2 years ago
What reasons are these then? That something is highly improbable therefore a god must have done it? Is that it? Is that all you people have as "proof"?
Dr craig has an emotional attachment to something that he "thinks" is real. A security blanket in the sky...
It's all very pathetic, that grown-ups need to believe in something other than themselves in order to function.
I'm still waiting for you to give me the link for this debate...
BEAST636 2 years ago
so you are admitting its an ego thing then? you dont want to have to believe in anything. I can tell you some of the strongest people mentally i know are christians. It is not weakness, its being humble.
i dont have the link, you'll have to download it off of pirate bay
ronhudsonjr 2 years ago
I don't need to believe in something that "loves me" as i experience the real thing from family and friends. Why would i believe in something when there's no evidence for it?
Approx 99% of all species that have ever evolved on this earth have gone extinct and you expect me to believe that god has a plan and that he created us for a reason?
If you want to believe in god then fine, but i want real answers where a conflict of interests doesn't get in the way!
BEAST636 2 years ago
how does 99% of species dying pose a problem? Is every species suppsoed to stick around forever? animals live and die, this is life. How is this a problem. Ive hear hitchens try to use this but it just doesnt cut it. I dont believe in god because i want him to love me. I believe in him because i believe its the best explanation for the origins of the universe and life. Abiogenesis to me is so far fetched, from an atheist point of view. We cant re-create it now, but it happened on its own?
ronhudsonjr 2 years ago
Life might seem nice and rosy for you but you're not putting yourself in other less fortunate people's shoes.
"animals live and die, this is life. How is this a problem."
It's HOW they die which is a problem. The unessacerry cruel way in which they die... Prey targeting the young and weak, ripping their throats out whilst its parents watch in the distance... Sharks that HAVE TO eat their siblings in the womb in order to be born... This is not a good design and strongly suggests no god.
BEAST636 2 years ago
....We cant re-create it now, but it happened on its own? .....
The proteins that make up DNA are found in nature. One of them was created under lab conditions too.
BEAST636 2 years ago
one of them? but we cannot create the kind of cells that needed to be present at the time of abiogenesis. You say we believe in fairy tales, to me, abiogenesis is the most far fetched fairy tales for adults.
ronhudsonjr 2 years ago
....abiogenesis is the most far fetched fairy tales for adults. ....
Only because abiogenesis doesn't hold your hand, doesn't care for you, doesn't promise life after death!
Your emotions have guided you rather than unbias rational thinking.
BEAST636 2 years ago
"your emotions have guided your rather then unbias rational thinking."
i was going to say the same about you! ego!
ronhudsonjr 2 years ago
so survival of the fittest means no god? wow i just cant get on your level of thinking. We are intended to be above the animals. this is why we have morals, societies, emotions. Animals do not feel emotions on the level that we do. You suggesting "whilst its parents watch". You are likening it to a human brain experiencing that. its not even close to the same thing. Not a good design? please, thats just the opposite of ID, which i assume you dont take seriously
ronhudsonjr 2 years ago
...wow i just cant get on your level of thinking....
Because you've been brainwashed!
....We are intended to be above the animals....
No, morals and emotions are the product of evolution by natural selection. Many other animals display this behaviour.
...."whilst its parents watch".....
I agree that we have evolved a higher sense of emotion but that does NOT mean that animals do not have it. Elephant calfs get targeted by a predator which eats them alive. It's parents mourn them. Google it
BEAST636 2 years ago
It is laughable to hear creationists compare evolution or abiogenisis to be akin to fairy tales.
you believe that their is a magic man in that created the universe in 7 days, knows everything we all do or think, is all powerful, sent his son down to be a human sacrifice, that sons mother was a virgin, he walked on water, when he died he came back to life and ascended into heaven, when people die they either live on in paradise or are tortured in hell WITH ABSOLUTELY ZERO PROOF OF ANY OF THIS
chobochotch 2 years ago 3
For anyone to say they truly know how the world was created would be a lie. Science says the theory must be tested and repeatable in order to become a law. Neither creationist or evolutionist can do this. Still, to deny the existence of God because of an evolutionary belief is silly. For the big bang to have started you would need that energy to have come from somewhere... you always get back to a creator from which the energy source came. Some call that source God.
freezyfreaky 2 years ago
creationism is on no where near the same level as actual science. proponents of creationism do not seem to understand that if you want an idea to be accepted as a viable hypothesis in science you need to actually have a testable concept and have to have facts to back it up.
The body of work in evolutionary biology is huge, 100's of thousands of peer reviewed papers, the geological, fossil and molecular records.
Creationism is at best a smear campaign with no actual idea beyond 'god did it'
chobochotch 2 years ago
"i *seriously doubt you could even come close"
ronhudsonjr 2 years ago
This is YOUR perspeption as a bias christian...
People all around the world have been convinced that their religion is the truth. All these people have fallen for the same psychological trick.
Watch videos on here of "Derren Brown". Then come back and tell me that you haven't fallen for the same trick!?
BEAST636 2 years ago
i will watch some derren brown videos, but i suggest you watch a video called, "everything is spiritual." it is about the intricacies of the universe and the fine tuning. Yeah i thought the same thing, more fine tuning irreducible complexity stuff, but its different and better than anything ive seen.
ronhudsonjr 2 years ago
...Fine tuning of the universe...
Imagine the vastness of the universe and then times this by the highest number anyone can think of or... imagine that it's infinite. Now imagine the endless possibilities within that vastness. The "fine tuning" will happen as you increase the vastness of the universe. It's called probability.
BEAST636 2 years ago
yes i understand that.
but imagine a casino. If you had 100,000machines, and to permit life, you had to win 100,000 royal flush's in a row. (the machines are poker machines)
i dont care how many years and chances you had, some things are just logically and mathematically not possible!
ronhudsonjr 2 years ago
also this was a debate on whether god exists, not what religion is true.
ronhudsonjr 2 years ago
oh yeah, i know derren brown, i watched his part on religion, where he "converts" people. watch the video responding to that, explaining how he uses basic hypnosis and suggestion to do this. I have never been to anything like this. I have never been told i have to believe in god, and certainly have never been tricked into beliveing it. You only say this because you are already at the predisposition that it cant possibly be true
ronhudsonjr 2 years ago
I know how he does it! That's the point...
You and all other believers go through a similar process but over a longer time period.
Similar to the development of your accent. You don't talk with the same accent as me because we were influenced by different people.
BEAST636 2 years ago
have i read the bible?
please, i am a devout christian, i read it often. I do not believe that it is meant to be interpreted literally as many YECs will tell you. In Job, god even says to him, "where were you, when i laid the foundations of the earth. Tell me if you understand?"
I believe we are not meant (or think) to know everything. I think the evolution vs creation thing got out of hand when it became a power struggle.
ronhudsonjr 2 years ago
As you know so much about evolution, can you let us all know exactly what it is please.
Thanks.
BEAST636 3 years ago
This comment has received too many negative votes show
"Explanations that are not consistent with empirical evidence or cannot be tested empirically are not a part of science" National Science Teachers Association
This 'lost leg' video is 100% non-consistent with empirical evidence (there is no evidence of 100 million year old ancestor that lsot legs, ears and then returned to a surface life) and cannot be tested empirically. Snakes are thought to have been aquatic in origin by many scientists, thereby eliminating every 'lost leg' as fables.
driver1100 3 years ago
oh really? u do know that this guy has made breakthroughs in many scientific investigations, and if snakes didn't have legs plz explain to me about the 'Anal spurs' they are bone and in the exact place that the legs were, i personally believe that snakes at one stage did have front legs, i can't remember its name but there is a creature alive today that the only way to describe it is a snake with 2 front legs, it is even related to snakes (lizard) so why is snakes havin legs hard 2 believe?
reitifoh 3 years ago
Snakes (phylogenetically tetrapods) are known to have lost their legs, descending from squamates in the Mesozoic. We can see this (like cetaceans) in the fossil record, embryology, and atavistic mutations. Also, we can trace the loss of limbs through transitional forms like Pachyrhachis, comparing the rate of limb-loss in relation to environmental change to the many examples of similar loss occurring today. This is empirical as it gets. I guess it counts for nothing, though. Go read the Bible.
hippocampuszosterae 3 years ago 3
Not to mention there have been snakes found with leg atavisms
argetfalcon 2 years ago