If Wagner knew the Bible like he claims to, he'd have seen through Bentley LONG ago like a lot of other people did. Another case of not knowing the real well enough to recognise the fake. Wagner's a false teacher my friends; please keep away from him.
Please don't think that all charismatics or Pentecostals are like this. I think the Pentecostal movement needs to go back to its scripture based and Spirit based roots. Lots of Pentecostals find this stuff totally weird. John Wimber even severed the Vineyard's relationship with the Toronto church. He said regarding bizarre manifestations "I think if it's fleshly and brought out by some sort of display, or promoted by somebody on stage, that's abysmal." That's exactly what happened in Toronto.
loud mouthed preachers making alliances and alignments. building mega-churches to glorify the organization of some denomination; it goes on and one and on and always, in the end, it rots and collapses. where is the First Love? i've not seen it in the "church" for some time now.
why would you gather with many well known "prophets" to endorse a MAN... not Gods calling on a man.. but a man.. without knowing who this person is or checking into it? If you thought the holy spirit led you, and now you are realizing that in fact.. he did not... what spirit were you following? Why would you stay up on that stage after hearing all the blasphemous statements these men were making by annointing and prophecying a man in the place of our Lord Jesus Christ
I thought only King Jesus does the appointing through the power of the Holy Spirit sound slike manmade ministry seeking human credentials Lets pray for discernment of the Spirit read your Bibles Man should not live on bread alone but by every Word that proceedeth out of the Mouth of the Lord.
i was raised AOG and this is all news to me.Why wd. anyone want to be in this so-called alignment? It's hard for me to comprehend.I was shocked when I discovered Todd on u-tube. It does not seem right to me.There will be ppl; who fall into this trap..not me. for sure! You are doing a good work!
I love Peter Wagner, but he is not an apostle and his organization is not called to set another man's ministry in order by demanding submission. Our Chief Apostle Jesus Christ gave us the pattern, Matthew 23:11 "But the greatest among you shall be your servant." / Mark 9:35, "Sitting down, He called the twelve and said to them, "If anyone wants to be first, he shall be last of all and servant of all."
Forward to .15sec. mark and listen through 58sec. Wagner has twisted and perverted scripture to create his 'apostolic alignment' doctrine. How sickening to suggest that one must submit to man in addition or an unbiblical institution in order to fulfill one's calling and destiny from Christ. We know this is not required by God. Secondly, Wagner uses Galatians 2:9 as the protocol for Todd's alignment and commissioning. Yet, the text only reveals how Paul received the 'right hand of fellowship'!
ARe you somehow implying that we do not need to be submited to God ordained authority? If you are a believer then you know that we must be submitted to authority and the failure to yield to God ordained authority or our elders is to be in rebellion to od Himself. Even Paul laid hands on thise who were his spiritual children and commissioned them to fulfill their ministry and today we need to be under authority before we can be in authority.
Mr.Pastorc, certainly we are to be submitted to God! Furthermore, one can not be submitted to God while rebelling against His appointed shoftim (prophets and judges) or kohen (priest). Romans 13:1-5 is clear on this. The problem with Peter Wagner's (of which I am very familiar), is they fail to understand that submission is mutual! I Peter 5:5, 'Yea, all of you be SUBJECT ONE TO ANOTHER, and be clothed with humility:..." Ephesians 5:21, and be subject to one another in the fear of Christ.'
In the old testament when Israel asks for a king one of the reasons is that they wanted to be like the other nations around them...big mistake...we are not like the world we are different...why are we trying to be squeesed into it's mold...our dealings are to be with the Fahter and one another with in our family...who cares what the world thinks of us...it is Christ who justifies us and it is the Father who we answer to...if we get right with the father the rest will work iself out..
What breaks my heart is why are we airing out our dirty laundry in public. Why don't we deal with this stuff within our Family discretely. It's like we are so scared of what the world's gonna say about us....We are the Family of God...we have the very Creator living in us...we are part of the Kingdom of God...why do we care what this world thinks of us...I'm not talking about the people of this world but the spirit that works through them that are disobeidiant
2 Corinthians 11 For such men are false apostles, deceitful workers, disguising themselves as apostles of Christ. No wonder, for even Satan disguises himself as an angel of light. Therefore it is not surprising if his servants also disguise themselves as servants of righteousness, whose end will be according to their deeds.
This breaks my heart! I am simply amazed at the tap dance that this guy has done! BOGUS! This man is a weak leader and should simply step away from leadership for a while. I don't know him, but I certainly have lost respect for him as a leader in the faith.
Wagner was wrong. Why not just say so and apologize for involving others in recognizing Bentl--and encouraging those who trusted them to trust a man involved in deception. First his wife writes a letter, then he tries to explain himself. Is it that hard to admit being wrong?
Shocking. how much more rediculous will all this get. Just watched the commissioning before this. It certainly was clear that Peter Wagner did endorse, did prophesy or at least make proclaimations - I dont have words.
I dont understand how anyone can watch the commissioning and pretend that Wagner did not endorse it all! He couldnt wait to get his foot in the door and now cant wait to get it back out.
What does Wagner mean by "not having a desire to analyze this situtation". He analyzes everything else!! His church growth analysis he did at Fuller seminary was pretty indepth and false. Does everyone know that one of C Peter Wagners graduate students was Apostate Rick Warren. Search it out. More people should analyze Wagner. Watch out though, this man and his apostles are dominionists. They think they will take dominion without Jesus Christ's second coming. --> they may get violent.
I was right!! Yep its official- adultery is involved on Todds part. From his own website this statement has been released "we have discovered new information revealing that Todd Bentley has entered into an unhealthy relationship on an emotional level with a female member of his staff." Nuff said
In the Kool Aid Charismatic movement you are only popular when you are useful. Todd fell from grace so now they will hang him out to dry. The Apostasy will, however, continue at full steam ahead because there are many who have forsaken the true Gospel and embraced falsehoods. This doesn't bother me that much anymore because it is just another sign of the times. Jesus said, "I will build my church and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it." The Lord knows who are His and will keep them.
"Dutch will walk in his call with utmost integrity because he has spent years disciplining his life, his family is in order, and he is cautious in the way he does ministry. He is an apostolic intercessory leader that will lead the Body into the next move of God with great authority. His is an establishing ministry. He will most likely be used to establish the next move of miracles and healing. I am glad the hunger for this has been stirred up in the Body of Christ."
But evil men and seducers shall wax worse and worse, deceiving, and being deceived...
"Since Stephen Strader requested your help and he is in ICA, you did respond to his Macedonian call. Yes, you would have looked like a hero if you had waited and gotten involved now. But just as you wrote recently, you chose to establish the order first and then any spiritual discipline could be brought. That makes you look like a father."
...God chose to use Todd to stir up the hunger in the Body of Christ. Therefore, as I prayed, the Lord took me to the life of Samson...He had a Nazarite vow on his life, yet he had many character flaws. His character flaws did not stop God from using him. I think this is the biggest misunderstanding that the Body has when it comes to the anointing. That is why you see anointed men and women being used so mightily by the Lord, and then falling into sexual sin or monetary impropriety.
Letter to Dr. C. Peter Wagner: Praying for Todd Bentley
Peter Wagner has established a revival council that is reviewing public issues in the Body of Christ related to the move of the Spirit. When the issue of Todd Bentley's divorce came up, he asked me how I felt about it. The following is what I wrote.
The Lakeland revival got swamped in apostasy and error that was so blatant it was an embarrassment....now the RATS are running for high ground. Every Charisma editor Lee Grady is trying to act like an orthodox Christian today.
He showed up at Lakeland because he loves the praises of men and wanted to be seen as someone who is responsible for the "outpouring". Like one said...see how quick they will throw each other under the bus?
Wagner does look somewhat slippery here. When Todd turns to custard, Wagner ducks for cover. Does Wagner consider himself to be an Apostle?? He is just a bible teacher, not an apostle. And a slippery one.
all this movement is just structured by man and man appointed. It is self supporting and self affirming and as such is just a froth . Those christians who get sucked in should know better .
Wagner should repent. He is lying. I red that e-mail of Wagner. When things go wrong, he suddenly says he had nothing to do with the commissioning... He didn't lay his hands on Bentley... Wagner is acting like a snake. I'm sorry for the word, but this is how it feels when I see this. This so called aligned Apostle makes a real mess of this. Unbelievable. What about truth?
Nothing but paganism, hedonistic, false doctrine........
Are they worshiping YAWH or their "apostolic calling"?
Den12tribe 9 months ago
Nothing but paganism, hedonistic, false doctrine........
Den12tribe 9 months ago
If Wagner knew the Bible like he claims to, he'd have seen through Bentley LONG ago like a lot of other people did. Another case of not knowing the real well enough to recognise the fake. Wagner's a false teacher my friends; please keep away from him.
Boosteroid 1 year ago
Please don't think that all charismatics or Pentecostals are like this. I think the Pentecostal movement needs to go back to its scripture based and Spirit based roots. Lots of Pentecostals find this stuff totally weird. John Wimber even severed the Vineyard's relationship with the Toronto church. He said regarding bizarre manifestations "I think if it's fleshly and brought out by some sort of display, or promoted by somebody on stage, that's abysmal." That's exactly what happened in Toronto.
paigemarief 1 year ago
loud mouthed preachers making alliances and alignments. building mega-churches to glorify the organization of some denomination; it goes on and one and on and always, in the end, it rots and collapses. where is the First Love? i've not seen it in the "church" for some time now.
skipalidon 1 year ago
why would you gather with many well known "prophets" to endorse a MAN... not Gods calling on a man.. but a man.. without knowing who this person is or checking into it? If you thought the holy spirit led you, and now you are realizing that in fact.. he did not... what spirit were you following? Why would you stay up on that stage after hearing all the blasphemous statements these men were making by annointing and prophecying a man in the place of our Lord Jesus Christ
erindaph7 1 year ago
I thought only King Jesus does the appointing through the power of the Holy Spirit sound slike manmade ministry seeking human credentials Lets pray for discernment of the Spirit read your Bibles Man should not live on bread alone but by every Word that proceedeth out of the Mouth of the Lord.
rickmilford 1 year ago
i was raised AOG and this is all news to me.Why wd. anyone want to be in this so-called alignment? It's hard for me to comprehend.I was shocked when I discovered Todd on u-tube. It does not seem right to me.There will be ppl; who fall into this trap..not me. for sure! You are doing a good work!
estelle715 2 years ago
Thanks for sharing that estelle, it was all quite shocking at the time, it surprises me that so many run into these things.
Ahouseisnotahome 1 year ago
I love Peter Wagner, but he is not an apostle and his organization is not called to set another man's ministry in order by demanding submission. Our Chief Apostle Jesus Christ gave us the pattern, Matthew 23:11 "But the greatest among you shall be your servant." / Mark 9:35, "Sitting down, He called the twelve and said to them, "If anyone wants to be first, he shall be last of all and servant of all."
radicalgrace 2 years ago
Forward to .15sec. mark and listen through 58sec. Wagner has twisted and perverted scripture to create his 'apostolic alignment' doctrine. How sickening to suggest that one must submit to man in addition or an unbiblical institution in order to fulfill one's calling and destiny from Christ. We know this is not required by God. Secondly, Wagner uses Galatians 2:9 as the protocol for Todd's alignment and commissioning. Yet, the text only reveals how Paul received the 'right hand of fellowship'!
radicalgrace 2 years ago
ARe you somehow implying that we do not need to be submited to God ordained authority? If you are a believer then you know that we must be submitted to authority and the failure to yield to God ordained authority or our elders is to be in rebellion to od Himself. Even Paul laid hands on thise who were his spiritual children and commissioned them to fulfill their ministry and today we need to be under authority before we can be in authority.
MrPastorc 2 years ago
Mr.Pastorc, certainly we are to be submitted to God! Furthermore, one can not be submitted to God while rebelling against His appointed shoftim (prophets and judges) or kohen (priest). Romans 13:1-5 is clear on this. The problem with Peter Wagner's (of which I am very familiar), is they fail to understand that submission is mutual! I Peter 5:5, 'Yea, all of you be SUBJECT ONE TO ANOTHER, and be clothed with humility:..." Ephesians 5:21, and be subject to one another in the fear of Christ.'
radicalgrace 2 years ago
In the old testament when Israel asks for a king one of the reasons is that they wanted to be like the other nations around them...big mistake...we are not like the world we are different...why are we trying to be squeesed into it's mold...our dealings are to be with the Fahter and one another with in our family...who cares what the world thinks of us...it is Christ who justifies us and it is the Father who we answer to...if we get right with the father the rest will work iself out..
osocali 2 years ago
What breaks my heart is why are we airing out our dirty laundry in public. Why don't we deal with this stuff within our Family discretely. It's like we are so scared of what the world's gonna say about us....We are the Family of God...we have the very Creator living in us...we are part of the Kingdom of God...why do we care what this world thinks of us...I'm not talking about the people of this world but the spirit that works through them that are disobeidiant
osocali 2 years ago
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2 Corinthians 11 For such men are false apostles, deceitful workers, disguising themselves as apostles of Christ. No wonder, for even Satan disguises himself as an angel of light. Therefore it is not surprising if his servants also disguise themselves as servants of righteousness, whose end will be according to their deeds.
MyGodIsEternal 2 years ago
This breaks my heart! I am simply amazed at the tap dance that this guy has done! BOGUS! This man is a weak leader and should simply step away from leadership for a while. I don't know him, but I certainly have lost respect for him as a leader in the faith.
Thanks for posting this.
conspiracy777 3 years ago
Wagner was wrong. Why not just say so and apologize for involving others in recognizing Bentl--and encouraging those who trusted them to trust a man involved in deception. First his wife writes a letter, then he tries to explain himself. Is it that hard to admit being wrong?
Ziggy0006 3 years ago
C. Peter Wagner...another one that is seriously lacking in discernment!
Endorses Todd Bentley one minute and the next he is trying to distance himself from the whole situation. So typical of this Third Wave False Revival.
Hommersen 3 years ago
There is no honor among thieves, they are all the same.
maxtube22 3 years ago 3
Talk about damage control or 'back-pedaling'. If he didn't 'commission' him, why was he there in the first place?
ozricus 3 years ago
Shocking. how much more rediculous will all this get. Just watched the commissioning before this. It certainly was clear that Peter Wagner did endorse, did prophesy or at least make proclaimations - I dont have words.
soceuro 3 years ago
I dont understand how anyone can watch the commissioning and pretend that Wagner did not endorse it all! He couldnt wait to get his foot in the door and now cant wait to get it back out.
Ahouseisnotahome 3 years ago
So, it was the Holy Spirit's Fault? Talk about passing the buck!
jmdearras 3 years ago
You are right, at the end of the day he totally blames the Holy Spirit.
Ahouseisnotahome 3 years ago
His letter contradicts Bently's commisioning ceremony. Compare them.
FleeFROMItchingEARS 3 years ago 2
Wagner is sneaky. What a deceiver. And many follow this man. They follow this man and not the Lord.
FleeFROMItchingEARS 3 years ago
What does Wagner mean by "not having a desire to analyze this situtation". He analyzes everything else!! His church growth analysis he did at Fuller seminary was pretty indepth and false. Does everyone know that one of C Peter Wagners graduate students was Apostate Rick Warren. Search it out. More people should analyze Wagner. Watch out though, this man and his apostles are dominionists. They think they will take dominion without Jesus Christ's second coming. --> they may get violent.
FleeFROMItchingEARS 3 years ago
violence is their doctrine. Thanks for the info.
Ahouseisnotahome 3 years ago
I was right!! Yep its official- adultery is involved on Todds part. From his own website this statement has been released "we have discovered new information revealing that Todd Bentley has entered into an unhealthy relationship on an emotional level with a female member of his staff." Nuff said
sandtoscana 3 years ago
This furious back pedalling suggests that we have yet to hear the real truth behind Bentleys marriage difficulties. Methinks it will be ugly.
sandtoscana 3 years ago
In the Kool Aid Charismatic movement you are only popular when you are useful. Todd fell from grace so now they will hang him out to dry. The Apostasy will, however, continue at full steam ahead because there are many who have forsaken the true Gospel and embraced falsehoods. This doesn't bother me that much anymore because it is just another sign of the times. Jesus said, "I will build my church and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it." The Lord knows who are His and will keep them.
power2theq 3 years ago
BENTLEY'S REPLACEMENT?
"Dutch will walk in his call with utmost integrity because he has spent years disciplining his life, his family is in order, and he is cautious in the way he does ministry. He is an apostolic intercessory leader that will lead the Body into the next move of God with great authority. His is an establishing ministry. He will most likely be used to establish the next move of miracles and healing. I am glad the hunger for this has been stirred up in the Body of Christ."
paulnsilas 3 years ago
....I am glad the hunger for this has been stirred up in the Body of Christ...."
barf bags anyone?
paulnsilas 3 years ago
Disgraceful.
Thanks for posting these.
God Bless
Ahouseisnotahome 3 years ago
PIERCE COVERING FOR WAGNER....
2 Timothy 3:13
But evil men and seducers shall wax worse and worse, deceiving, and being deceived...
"Since Stephen Strader requested your help and he is in ICA, you did respond to his Macedonian call. Yes, you would have looked like a hero if you had waited and gotten involved now. But just as you wrote recently, you chose to establish the order first and then any spiritual discipline could be brought. That makes you look like a father."
paulnsilas 3 years ago
Amen
paulnsilas 3 years ago
Google Pierce's letter to Wagner re: Todd Bentley.
see how Pierce seems to lay the blame on God, much like Adam did.
Genesis 3
12 And the man said, The woman whom thou gavest to be with me, she gave me of the tree, and I did eat.
cont...
paulnsilas 3 years ago
...God chose to use Todd to stir up the hunger in the Body of Christ. Therefore, as I prayed, the Lord took me to the life of Samson...He had a Nazarite vow on his life, yet he had many character flaws. His character flaws did not stop God from using him. I think this is the biggest misunderstanding that the Body has when it comes to the anointing. That is why you see anointed men and women being used so mightily by the Lord, and then falling into sexual sin or monetary impropriety.
paulnsilas 3 years ago
find Pierce's letter by Googling:
Letter to Dr. C. Peter Wagner: Praying for Todd Bentley
Peter Wagner has established a revival council that is reviewing public issues in the Body of Christ related to the move of the Spirit. When the issue of Todd Bentley's divorce came up, he asked me how I felt about it. The following is what I wrote.
Blessings, Chuck D. Pierce
paulnsilas 3 years ago
The Lakeland revival got swamped in apostasy and error that was so blatant it was an embarrassment....now the RATS are running for high ground. Every Charisma editor Lee Grady is trying to act like an orthodox Christian today.
JimQualls 3 years ago
He showed up at Lakeland because he loves the praises of men and wanted to be seen as someone who is responsible for the "outpouring". Like one said...see how quick they will throw each other under the bus?
YouThoughtYouKnew 3 years ago
thank You Lord for answered prayers!
keep up the pressure on the devil's work, saints! the house of these vipers is crumbling!
look at how they will throw each other under the bus...watch them scurry back into the shadows! keep shining the light upon them!
GREAT VIDEO!this is what we need: their words expose them!
1 Corinthians 11:19
For there must be also heresies among you, that they which are approved may be made
paulnsilas 3 years ago 4
oops....
1 Corinthians 11:19
For there must be also heresies among you, that they which are approved may be made manifest among you.
paulnsilas 3 years ago
Wagner does look somewhat slippery here. When Todd turns to custard, Wagner ducks for cover. Does Wagner consider himself to be an Apostle?? He is just a bible teacher, not an apostle. And a slippery one.
wollep1 3 years ago
all this movement is just structured by man and man appointed. It is self supporting and self affirming and as such is just a froth . Those christians who get sucked in should know better .
alamo11 3 years ago
Wagner should repent. He is lying. I red that e-mail of Wagner. When things go wrong, he suddenly says he had nothing to do with the commissioning... He didn't lay his hands on Bentley... Wagner is acting like a snake. I'm sorry for the word, but this is how it feels when I see this. This so called aligned Apostle makes a real mess of this. Unbelievable. What about truth?
wachteropdemuur 3 years ago