Anybody can make up a story that is highly detailed and internally consistent. Do you believe in the historicity of The Lord of the Rings series? The problem would be the fact that the details contradict historical reality. They don't have to contradict themselves, but if there is no evidence in history to back them up (which there isn't), and if they actually contradict what we know from external historical information (which they do), then there is no reason to believe that they are true.
@LDS4Life71 Clearly, you did not read the article from the URL I provided. If you had, you would see that the so-called 11 "witnesses" did not in fact "see" or "handle" the golden plates. The statement was written and they signed it without having actually physically touched the plates. In other words, these "witnesses" are nothing more than big fat LIARS!
@LDS4Life71 How about taking other men's wives as his own? If polygamy wasn't bad enough, he actually had the audacity to marry another man's wife. Not sure if you are married or not, but if your Bishop or President said he received a "revelation" from God stating he had "permission" to marry your wife with or without your consent, I wonder if you'd allow such a thing to happen. Yeah, I'd say that was "evil" and most definitely wrong.
@LDS4Life71 Show me where MRM has lied. The URL I gave previously would be a good starting point. In the lecture Bill McKeever gave, what exactly did he "lie" about? Surely, you are familiar with the story about how Joseph Smith picked up the golden plates and "ran" with them to escape the unknown assailants who, he claims, tried to steal the gold plates from him. Where is the lie in Mr. McKeever's lecture? Or, for that matter, in any of the articles at MRM.org?
@LDS4Life71 I have done the research and I do know the truth about Joseph Smith. That's why I'm responding to you. If I didn't care, I'd simply ignore you and everything "Mormon". Now, regarding the golden plates, here's a very good article about their weight and the unlikely-hood that Joseph Smith "ran" with them as he claimed to have done. mrm. org slash weight-of-plates
@chriscb Jesus Christ said in Rev 22:12 And, behold, I come quickly; and my reward is with me, to give every man according as his work shall be.
So if you are an ignoramus, you'd say that Jesus also has a false prophecy considering it has been at least 2011 years since He said He was coming quickly.
@Bureyeanne It's too bad you feel the need to insult people whom you do not even know. Perhaps you are unaware of the scriptures that say one day with the Lord is like a thousand years, and a thousand years are like one day. From Christ's (God's) perspective He is coming "quickly" however from our perspective it seems like it's taking "forever". Kind of like how children are always asking "are we there yet?" 2 Peter 3:8 and Psalm 90:4. So no, Jesus is not a false prophet like Joseph Smith
@Bureyeanne OH. I see. you missed the word "if". I didn't post you were ignorant. I posted if someone was to not understand the meaning they would get a false understanding. Also I agree that Jesus is like Joseph Smith only the one was without sin the other was not.
@LDS4Life71 Oh, I don't know. . . how about leading people to worship a false god, follow a false christ, and preach a false gospel. I'd say that ranks pretty high on the list of "evil" things done in the name of their god.
@LDS4Life71 "Test all things; hold on to what is good. Stay away from every form of evil." 1 Thessalonians 5:21-22. As for me and my family, we will serve the LORD and not follow after false prophets/teachers like Joseph Smith Jr. and his ilk.
@LDS4Life71 Just like JS, you have a very active imagination. Kudos to you! LOL. The so-called "witnesses" are untrustworthy, just like Joseph Smith's "testimony" about his so-called "First Vision" is untrustworthy. Why would I believe a bunch of liars? Look, I understand why you cling to your mythology, but trying to convince people that it's "true" is simply dishonest. Anyone who wants to know the real truth about Joseph Smith, the witnesses, or the BoM can go to mormonwiki. org and see.
@LDS4Life71 "The Three Witnesses, Oliver Cowdery, Martin Harris and David Whitmer, all initially describe their experience with the angel and the plates as subjective and visionary rather than objective and concrete. Their elaborations on the encounter, their departure from the LDS Church, as well as other 7 events in their lives, raise questions about their level of discernment and their credibility as witnesses." mormonwiki. org slash Book_of_Mormon_witnesses
@LDS4Life71 Yes, JS claimed "he found the plates on September 22, 1823 at a hill near his home in Manchester, New York after an angel directed him to a buried stone box." I didn't say "discovered" as though he just randomly came across them. Besides, I don't believe the plates were real in the first place. Pure fiction. If they were real then we'd have more "evidence" than the so-called "testimony" from the 11 "witnesses".
@LDS4Life71 "an impossible deduction"? LOL. No, not "impossible" and not a "deduction" either. Seriously, look at Joseph Smith's history. He was a treasure seeker. He conned people into believing he could see where "treasure" was located by looking into his "peep" stone. It's not a far leap in logic to conclude that he used his "con artist" skills to dupe religiously minded people into believing he found "golden" plates of ancient "scriptures". LOL.
@LDS4Life71 I've read the article at shields-research regarding "Tumbaga". In that same article it also describes the box the plates were sealed in as well as the dimensions of the plates and the speculated weight of the plates. From that article, I've concluded that it's full of speculation and was less than convincing that the plates were actually real and more the product of Joseph Smith's imagination.
I'm amazed that an intelligent person like Kerry Shirts would be so gullible as to believe the Book of Mormon were anything other than a 19th century work of fiction.
How often do you read the book of Ether? I read it whenever I have trouble falling to sleep. It's better than Unisom. Seriously, have you ever tried writing on metal plates? Joseph Smith's story would have been much more believeable had he claimed to have found the Book of Mormon written on vellum. Gold plates sounds more like treasure hunting.
Anybody can make up a story that is highly detailed and internally consistent. Do you believe in the historicity of The Lord of the Rings series? The problem would be the fact that the details contradict historical reality. They don't have to contradict themselves, but if there is no evidence in history to back them up (which there isn't), and if they actually contradict what we know from external historical information (which they do), then there is no reason to believe that they are true.
xxpowwowbluexx 8 months ago
@LDS4Life71 Clearly, you did not read the article from the URL I provided. If you had, you would see that the so-called 11 "witnesses" did not in fact "see" or "handle" the golden plates. The statement was written and they signed it without having actually physically touched the plates. In other words, these "witnesses" are nothing more than big fat LIARS!
chriscb 11 months ago
@LDS4Life71 How about taking other men's wives as his own? If polygamy wasn't bad enough, he actually had the audacity to marry another man's wife. Not sure if you are married or not, but if your Bishop or President said he received a "revelation" from God stating he had "permission" to marry your wife with or without your consent, I wonder if you'd allow such a thing to happen. Yeah, I'd say that was "evil" and most definitely wrong.
chriscb 11 months ago
I appreciate how Elder Shirts breaks the wars and families and eras down in this video.
I also enjoy the rambling nonsense of Antichrist comments below try to disprove the Holy Ghost. AINT NEVAH GONNAH HAPPEN!
How come LDS spell God with a Capital "G", but anti's nearly always spell GOD with a lowercase "g".
Always bothered me.
Sephuskal 11 months ago
Fantastic job Backyard professor.
wtalady 11 months ago
@LDS4Life71 Show me where MRM has lied. The URL I gave previously would be a good starting point. In the lecture Bill McKeever gave, what exactly did he "lie" about? Surely, you are familiar with the story about how Joseph Smith picked up the golden plates and "ran" with them to escape the unknown assailants who, he claims, tried to steal the gold plates from him. Where is the lie in Mr. McKeever's lecture? Or, for that matter, in any of the articles at MRM.org?
chriscb 1 year ago
@LDS4Life71 I have done the research and I do know the truth about Joseph Smith. That's why I'm responding to you. If I didn't care, I'd simply ignore you and everything "Mormon". Now, regarding the golden plates, here's a very good article about their weight and the unlikely-hood that Joseph Smith "ran" with them as he claimed to have done. mrm. org slash weight-of-plates
chriscb 1 year ago
@LDS4Life71 Here's a list of false prophecies made my joseph smith jr. mormonwiki. org slash False_prophecies_of_Joseph_Smith
chriscb 1 year ago
@chriscb Jesus Christ said in Rev 22:12 And, behold, I come quickly; and my reward is with me, to give every man according as his work shall be.
So if you are an ignoramus, you'd say that Jesus also has a false prophecy considering it has been at least 2011 years since He said He was coming quickly.
Bureyeanne 1 year ago
@Bureyeanne It's too bad you feel the need to insult people whom you do not even know. Perhaps you are unaware of the scriptures that say one day with the Lord is like a thousand years, and a thousand years are like one day. From Christ's (God's) perspective He is coming "quickly" however from our perspective it seems like it's taking "forever". Kind of like how children are always asking "are we there yet?" 2 Peter 3:8 and Psalm 90:4. So no, Jesus is not a false prophet like Joseph Smith
chriscb 11 months ago
@chriscb I don't know when I was insulting anyone. If you think I insulted you I am sorry.
Bureyeanne 11 months ago
@Bureyeanne OH. I see. you missed the word "if". I didn't post you were ignorant. I posted if someone was to not understand the meaning they would get a false understanding. Also I agree that Jesus is like Joseph Smith only the one was without sin the other was not.
Bureyeanne 11 months ago
@LDS4Life71 Oh, I don't know. . . how about leading people to worship a false god, follow a false christ, and preach a false gospel. I'd say that ranks pretty high on the list of "evil" things done in the name of their god.
chriscb 1 year ago
@LDS4Life71 "Test all things; hold on to what is good. Stay away from every form of evil." 1 Thessalonians 5:21-22. As for me and my family, we will serve the LORD and not follow after false prophets/teachers like Joseph Smith Jr. and his ilk.
chriscb 1 year ago
@LDS4Life71 Just like JS, you have a very active imagination. Kudos to you! LOL. The so-called "witnesses" are untrustworthy, just like Joseph Smith's "testimony" about his so-called "First Vision" is untrustworthy. Why would I believe a bunch of liars? Look, I understand why you cling to your mythology, but trying to convince people that it's "true" is simply dishonest. Anyone who wants to know the real truth about Joseph Smith, the witnesses, or the BoM can go to mormonwiki. org and see.
chriscb 1 year ago
@LDS4Life71 "The Three Witnesses, Oliver Cowdery, Martin Harris and David Whitmer, all initially describe their experience with the angel and the plates as subjective and visionary rather than objective and concrete. Their elaborations on the encounter, their departure from the LDS Church, as well as other 7 events in their lives, raise questions about their level of discernment and their credibility as witnesses." mormonwiki. org slash Book_of_Mormon_witnesses
chriscb 1 year ago
@LDS4Life71 Yes, JS claimed "he found the plates on September 22, 1823 at a hill near his home in Manchester, New York after an angel directed him to a buried stone box." I didn't say "discovered" as though he just randomly came across them. Besides, I don't believe the plates were real in the first place. Pure fiction. If they were real then we'd have more "evidence" than the so-called "testimony" from the 11 "witnesses".
chriscb 1 year ago
@LDS4Life71 "an impossible deduction"? LOL. No, not "impossible" and not a "deduction" either. Seriously, look at Joseph Smith's history. He was a treasure seeker. He conned people into believing he could see where "treasure" was located by looking into his "peep" stone. It's not a far leap in logic to conclude that he used his "con artist" skills to dupe religiously minded people into believing he found "golden" plates of ancient "scriptures". LOL.
chriscb 1 year ago
@LDS4Life71 I've read the article at shields-research regarding "Tumbaga". In that same article it also describes the box the plates were sealed in as well as the dimensions of the plates and the speculated weight of the plates. From that article, I've concluded that it's full of speculation and was less than convincing that the plates were actually real and more the product of Joseph Smith's imagination.
chriscb 1 year ago
I'm amazed that an intelligent person like Kerry Shirts would be so gullible as to believe the Book of Mormon were anything other than a 19th century work of fiction.
chriscb 3 years ago
Oh you ain't seen duh nuthin yet - GRIN! Intelligence, obviously has little to do with it. It's a true book, and a delight to read.
TheBackyardProfessor 3 years ago 2
How often do you read the book of Ether? I read it whenever I have trouble falling to sleep. It's better than Unisom. Seriously, have you ever tried writing on metal plates? Joseph Smith's story would have been much more believeable had he claimed to have found the Book of Mormon written on vellum. Gold plates sounds more like treasure hunting.
chriscb 3 years ago
Solomon Spaulding was an amazing theorist wasn't he.
utahpirateradio 3 years ago
You're a great teacher !
skyaglow 3 years ago