Moll ist als Osmin technisch perfekt. Frick hat allerdings die größeren stimmlichen Mittel vor allem bei den voll klingenden tiefen Tönen. Auch im Vortrag überzeugt er am meisten. Insgesamt ist Frick der beste Osmin.
Pinza never sang the lead in Simon Boccanegra. He sang the bass part Fiesco. In one of the strongest low voice casts ever Lawrence Tibbett sang Boccanegra and Leonard Warren sang Paolo.
FINALLY! I've been trying to find operatic bass singer videos on YouTube forever now and all I end up with at best is a baritone because people not classically trained don't recognize the difference, that or they are all bass guitar covers of the "Night of the Opera" or whatever by Iron Maiden. -_-'
I didn't think Pinza's low D would prove the best, since some of the other basses, such as Frick, Szekely, and Talvela, were more obviously bass than the great Italian. Yet Pinza's D does surpass all the others.
die Qualität eines Bassisten auf das tiefe D zu reduzieren wäre etwas flach, interssant zu hören, dass kaum einer den Ton perfekt singt, man muss es natürlich auch im Raum hören um den Klang zu beurteilen Ezio Pinza klingt für meine Ohren am "gekonntesten", er hat ihn technisch im Griff
Moll is the best in my opinion, his low D is the most resonant. That said, Pinza's is also very, very impressive, and of all the basses featured here his is the most beautiful here. Talvela is one of my favourite Osmins, but he could've projected more on the low D. In fact the only one I don't like at all is Rydl's.
Purely vocal, yes, Pinza. Moll, Lloyd and Talvela vocally suit well for the Osmin. A low note should still be `open` not sound to throaty or pressed-it takes a large chest/rib cage to make it sound naturally appealing. You can always tell, just from listing who the singer is `composed`. What Frick is concerned it was probably the darkest tone of all opera basses he had, but sometimes missed some appeal in expression.
I don't know why some people dream or hope they are the lowest bass. If your a low bass that can actually nail this note loud, clear, and deep, than you are either one of the greatest singers of all time, or you will have an extremely tough time finding roles to sing, because all the other basses will be better suited for almost any other role.
And anyone thinking about commenting about their own voice. Nobody, and I mean nobody cares.
And it's worth going ahead and mentioning that everyone else is either singing a very poor quality D or, worst of all, sitting in a nasty grey area sort of in between D and E-flat.
He didn't sing this role in the US. He was 34 yrs old when he came here. The listing of all his roles for here and abroad is in his biography. I'm sure it's correct. If you choose not believe it, then don't.
Yes my friends thit you hear the beauty of them all? For what is this competition? I don ' t understand. When i have a favorite then my favorite is ... Kurt Moll. Now i am going to listen to the full aria and enjoy the music and beaty of all of them. Thank you for the publication.
I definitely agree with baritonoguapo. PINZA wipes the floor with all of them. He wasn't Toscanini's and Bruno Walter's favorite basso for nothing. He was amazing. Hits the low D perfectly!
@thephantom1946 Pinza is in a studio and clearly gets right up to the mic for his D. A lot of baritones could do that. There's a reason he never sang those kind of notes live--he didn't have them in the house.
Note that Pinza is one of my all-time favorite basses, but I have to be fair and say that, compared to the other basses here, he's technically "cheating." :)
@BorisGodunov Pinza did sing those notes live, Osmin was a role he sang abroad before he made his US debut. He could and did, and he had those notes in the house:-) He didn't have to "cheat" and he definitely deserves his legendary status. I have his full repertoire of opera performances for the US and abroad.
@thephantom1946 I will need more than your say-so that Pinza ever sang Osmin on stage. I'm very familiar with his repertoire as well and have pretty much everything he recorded, and there's not a trace of Osmin anywhere outside of the 1946 Bruno Walter studio recording of the aria in Italian that is sampled here. Googling Pinza and Osmin only brings hits on this recording.
Outside of this recording, there aren't any low Ds in Pinza's recordings by which to judge.
@BorisGodunov ThePhantom1946 is correct, and this is not the only recording that Pinza made with a low D.../watch?v=7eGY4h1PtNk. There is also a live recording of the same aria that is seemingly moved up a half-step but he has no trouble with the E-flat.../watch?v=Gxas6J3B_SM.
@76Basso Thanks for those links, I always enjoy hearing Pinza. But that doesn't actually make ThePhantom1946 "correct." I don't deny that Pinza would sing a low D in a studio recording, which is what you provided. But as you yourself point out, the aria was transposed up for a live performance, which actually proves my point! And it certainly doesn't support the assertion that was made that Pinza sang Osmin on stage, which was the overall argument. I can find no evidence he did so.
@BorisGodunov First you said there were no other recordings of Pinza with a low D and now you discount that and a live E-Flat that is seemingly easy. Are you really implying Pinza couldn't have sung half-step lower and still been better than most we hear in this video? Your exact quote was, "There's a reason he never sang those kind of notes live." This would imply you thought he couldn't sing anything near a D live.
I was saying the Phantom was right about the listing of Osmin in the Bio.
@76Basso No, first I said that Pinza did not sing low Ds live on stage, and so far you've completely failed to prove otherwise. You undermine your point by providing a studio recording where he sings a D and then a live (note, not in an opera house!) recording of the exact same aria where he transposes it up! Why do you think it was transposed upwards?
I'll ask you the same I asked Phantom: provide evidence Pinza sang Osmin live. I searched and could not find any.
@76Basso And about that low E flat--It's the same story as the Osmin D. He wasn't singing in an opera house for that song, even if there was a live audience (although even THAT is arguable, since in those days they would frequently add laugh and applause tracks to broadcasts from a studio). Regardless, it is clear he is singing right up at the microphone for it. He certainly does not have the deep bass spread for that note that you get with a Moll, or even Siepi.
@BorisGodunov Obviously there is no evidence that you will accept; the biography lies and the live recording is fake and any other evidence is false no doubt, so it is pointless to continue. Why did he transpose it up? I recently had a piece transposed that normally I would not because of a cold that left my low notes ragged. I also once sang with a orchestra that was tuned to A=515HZ. There are numerous reasons for a pitch discrepancy; we do not know the reasons for the pitch shift.
@76Basso That is just bullshit. I'll accept evidence of documentation that Pinza sang Osmin live in an opera house as one of his repertory roles. You mention his biography, and yet I can not find any reference to his doing so in his biographies. Neither you nor Phantom provided such. As it stands, I believe I'm entirely correct that he sang the Osmin aria only as a studio recording for Walter in 1946. There is *zero* evidence I can find to suggest otherwise.
@BorisGodunov The evidence is in the book titled 'Ezio Pinza' an autobiography with Robert Magidoff who did a lot of researching and listed all the roles he performed on stage. I bought the book when I was a youngster in 1959. You can't find a fraction of the information about Pinza anywhere online; only in a book. Online sources provide precious little information, comparatively. It is the first one listed under his roles onstage, and was in Europe. So I'm afraid you're incorrect.
@thephantom1946 Thank you for the citation. I've checked on the Magidoff list, and it is indeed there. However, I remain unconvinced for several reasons. Magidoff was completing Pinza's autobio after his death, so this list was compiled around 1956. There are zero citations, and no mention is given of when/where Pinza supposedly sang it. Pinza himself makes no mention of the role at all. For all we know, he could have been assuming Pinza sang the role based on this very recording. (cont)
@thephantom1946 (cont) Also, there are numerous basic errors in the book which have to be attributable to Magidoff. He labels one of the photographs as Pinza in the "title role" of Simon Boccanegra! That is, of course, absurd. So Magidoff's list is not first-hand documentary evidence (he even has scads of question marks in his list, showing uncertainty). I'd say it's reasonable to doubt its accuracy, although it's also reasonable to accept it, so we'll just have to agree to disagree.
@BorisGodunov Magidoff explains above the list, the question mark on some denotes the roles Pinza sang abroad where no record is kept. Not that he didn't sing it. Magidoff didn't even start working on the book till april of 1957 when he came to Pinza's house every day spending time with him for two months before he wrote the book, going through all his papers and talking with him. It does seem you have a blocked mind, lol.
@thephantom1946 I"m aware of why he used the question marks, the point was that the list is not authoritative, given such omissions (if he compiled that list with Pinza's aid, why would there be question marks at all?) The book was clearly published after Pinza's death, as it is mentioned in the book. Nowhere does Magidoff claim he worked on the list with Pinza, there are no citations and the claim Pinza sang the lead in Simon Bocconegra casts doubt on Magidoff's alleged meticulousness.
@thephantom1946 Finally, I'll reiterate that there is no actual documentation of Pinza singing the role. Magidoff's list is not such, it's the equivalent of hearsay in a legal proceeding. Given the complete omission of the role from Pinza's recordings and that it is a role that is very much outside his typical ones, I'm comfortable being skeptical. The overall point, that Pinza wasn't ripping off low Ds in opera houses, and that THIS D is "strong" due to getting close to the mic, stands.
@BorisGodunov cont. Magidoff did nothing about Pinza until the aforementioned dates of April through May of 1957. Also the roles without question marks are supposed to be the ones that have records that were kept. Osmin's role has no question mark; there was a record of it in Europe. Magidoff makes his list quite clear on that.
@BorisGodunov I don't think anyone was arguing that Pinza had the low notes of Moll, but there are plenty of basses who sing Osmin who don't. It is very possible that Pinza had at least this aria transposed up for live performance. Ghiaurov often moved Seneca's death up a full step to avoid the D, and Pinza may have done the same for this. Anyway, I am more interested in perfecting my own singing than worrying about what Pinza did or didn't sing, so I won't reply again, but best wishes to you.
@gnateoj Hawlata is the ONE whose voice I don't like in this clip - aiee, horrible nasal grating sound! I'll give him the benefit of the doubt that this was an off day for him. But in contrast to Moll, Pinza, and Frick - clearly not in the same league.
@ReyNixz It has been said that if Talvela had been 6 inches shorter, he probably would have been a baritone. I'm not so sure about that, but he was never particularly strongest on the extreme low notes of his range. But he had, in my view, the most astonishingly beautiful of bass voices.
Guys who think that is easy to sing a low D, or that they could sing it best shouldn't forget that a large part of these recordings are made in a theater. Are you so sure your low D could be heard from the first to the last line of a big theater? With the orchestra? Those guys you've just heard have spent a lifetime singing...Don't be presumptuous
@JazzyGiord Thank you for your competent remark, dear JazzyGirod. I completely agree with you. Many baritones and bass-baritones 'reach' a low D and then think, it'd be easy, so what all the fuzz about it... BUT: Mostly they produce vocal fry or 'sit' on the sound and push the note downwards with muscular tension, thus overbreasting and beraving the necessary (even down here!) it of its healthy head voice component... Having to push or having a real deep bass voice = the question.
@JazzyGiord For many it's easy to HIT a low D, it's very very rare to be able to SING a low D. I think any singer understands the difference I'm making here.
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Mihály Székely had certainly the strongest low D of them all: not in this extract, but generally. On youtube, there are two other recordings of his low D ("Non ve rimedio" and "Da lieg ich") and both are amazing. And Székely was also the only operatic bass I know, who just sang double low A (!!!) on stage.
Nevertheless, this time Moll and Pinza were a bit better than him.
For me it's a toss-up between Moll and Pinza. I'd have to say Moll, by a hair, simply because I love the YouTube video of his performance as Osmin. BUT the real winners, as you said, are Mozart and us - for being able to enjoy this!
I'm sorry, but what the hell is this? Except for a select few in this video who can actually sing this aria well (Pinza, for example), every other singer wobbles and has trouble sustaining the D. And to put this in persective, I am 17, an opera STUDENT, and can sustain the D better than almost all of the other singers here (who are full-blown opera singers with supposed years of training)
If ever you`ve sung the whole opera you`ll remark that this aria at the end of the whole thing is VERY difficult, because the voice has become higher during singing the other arias and ensembles. You do NOT sing only this one aria during a performance of the "Entführung". To sing only this low note "D" is ridiculous, every good bass sings even a "C" or lower in the morning without having warmed up the voice.
I agree with you, as the music from this opera is difficult for all characters, Osmin especially. (F4 to an optional C2 is the biggest range I've ever heard needed in opera!) That being said, however, chances are high that these excerpts were not taken from a live performance, therefore the performers just recorded this one song, not the whole opera. And because of that, the poor quality of this aria by these singers is not okay with me.
It seems to be no contest, Pinza definitely sings the note with the least effort. Most have a difficult time, or you can hardly hear it. To think Pinza was a basso cantante not just a profundo, too.
No comparto tu opinion de Pinza, ese RE final le viene muy justo, quien deberia estar en esa lista y no estan, son: Henry Medus y Ludwig Weber. Un saludo
Pinza sang it excellently and powerfully. But I think the opera has a different feeling when sung in Italian, I prefer it in the original German. Frick handled it well, too. The other singers more or less suppressed the low not. Hawlata, for example, almost omitted it!
Some of the singers sing "Ruh vor Euch" instead of the original version by Mozart "vor Euch Ruh`". This is not correct. The version with Hauptmann/Gardiner is sung in 430 Hertz which is a quarter tone lower than the other versions. Of course the quality of this low note depends a lot from the mic-position and the recording technique.
@cross147 Sounds more like something in between the two pitches, perhaps a flat D. It might have been the recording (tape speed) or in a very unlikely scenario, the tuning of the orchestra.
Well, just evaluating what is given here- Kurt Moll in first and Lloyd in second- even though Frick is probably the darkest in general and popular for his potrayal of Osmin. Greindl and Weber should be heared.
I like Kurt Moll's the best, because he is very clear and he enunciates. Most of the time, they don't even say the words correctly. Those last 2 singers sounded awful. Robert Lloyd is amazing, but he needed a better microphone. Talvela is great, but he is missing something. Frick's is only good at that point, the rest of the aria he sounds awful.
Well. It is hard to compare those low D-s. It all depends on the recording; where the microphone was positioned, was it a concert or opera, or maybe in a studio.
Usually Osmin has to run around before singing his low note and that makes it harder.
Pinza, Szekeley, Lloyd are the better ones. Some aren't a low D as they have been transcribed up, including Rydl who has the worst note. Certainly an interesting compilation.
I have to disagree, I think he's starting at a D3, and accordingly to wiki, Die Entführung aus dem Serail has the lowest demanded and commonly performed note, D2, in the classical repertoire.
Watch some other videos with deep notes, and this won't sound so low, like /watch?v=D8cviwNdnQI
The Baron Ochs in the "Rosenkavalier" by Strauss has to sing the low C in the aria "Da geht er hin". Ok, now we can discuss if this is romantic repertoire! ;D
Well, Talvela is really amazing, but he has this style that I can only call step singing. I say that because, he just drops down each note. Most people should glide down, but he drops down.
well i listened to this through a different pair of speakers and to be totally honest, when i heard fricks, i thought it sounded way better. i still think molls is really strong though haha.
I agree with Jpmadore1, Henri Medus is really amazing. To listen his voice just type: "site des basses" medus in the search box of google, and hit Enter.
Has anyone ever heard of Herbert Ahlsen? I just heard him in a vienna philharmonic recording and his low d's are HUGE. But I cant find any info or other recordings w/him
Why? Baritone-voices have its own problems; they can´t sing nether low nor high!?
I´m also bass and have low C and a pretty good high F - boy, train your voice, than you could have very good chances to sing at great opera houses; they search for us!!! We have the advantage of not much competitives so we have to use it!
baritons can sing high do with the proper training on the other hand i m not a profondo although i have very loud and thick low notes but my middle voice is not so dark and when i sing sol and la i do not seem lke a bass at all but unfortunately for me i cannot sing baritone arias easily because reach but cannot keep sol & la
imagine that i could hit the low notes before having lessons at all but this dark voice does not match with the idea i had about singing!i was thinking my self singing ''eri tu', ''di provenza il mar'' now i have to deal with a middle voice and low notes from hell that makes me so sad!!!!my teacher argues with me all the time and says''you ll destroy your voice trying to hit high notes'' i do not know i m too sad to think clearly
then don´t sing above C; Perhaps Sarastro would be the perfect start for you as it was for me! Start with "O Isis", the notes aren´t to hard and you learn how to sing legato; thats a very good aria!
thats not true. im a baritone but my lowest audible note is about this d note, but my highest is about the b flat above middle c, so thats a mid tenor note, so i sing bass to tenor, and a baritone is also one of the strongest, most prominent voices in opera.
Well, that is also a very strong range if you´re able to sing from low F to high H, my congrats! So you can choose of beeing Baritone or Tenor, Bravo! Not much singers can say that from themselves. For me there are not much variabilities; I have a quite good low C and a respectable high F, so I will be a bass for all days in my life- but there was always the dream of singing Nessun Dorma for example. I´m good at low bass roles, Heinrich from Lohengrin is to hard at the moment...
Keep in mind that Giacomo Meyerbeer wrote an F#5 in one of his solo tenor arias. And by the way, I once sang-without falsetto-a tenor high C about 3 months ago and was amazed, because I'm the lowest bass singer in my choir! The question isn't whether you have it, it's whether you're comfortable singing that note or not.
cmon man I am a bass too and I sing in a choir also but I am pretty happy with my deep voice if this cheers you up; let me tell you that chicks looooves basses and deep voices they say that it sounds so manly... thats why I am proud of my voice :)
train your range and you will be able to sing higher, i can sing pretty high and i'm a bass-baritone, i also have good low range and i'm only 18 it doesnt take forever, you just have to keep at it
so that means you might become a tenor ! lol... but seriously, when I was 13, I sang bass in choir and I could hit a low E flat, but now I'm 17 and I'm a leggiero tenor ! Only time can tell.
I didnt realise your voice gets way lower the older your get. my voice has newly broke and i can hit low just about E above doouble low c. not bad. i dont really have a clue to be honest.
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bassofin 3 days ago
I don't have any trouble hitting that note myself. It's just a D2.
TurtleFL 6 days ago
SIEPI!!!
1993MGB 3 weeks ago
great collection! Thankyou!
spiderstex 3 weeks ago
Moll ist als Osmin technisch perfekt. Frick hat allerdings die größeren stimmlichen Mittel vor allem bei den voll klingenden tiefen Tönen. Auch im Vortrag überzeugt er am meisten. Insgesamt ist Frick der beste Osmin.
OperusSuper 1 month ago
Pinza never sang the lead in Simon Boccanegra. He sang the bass part Fiesco. In one of the strongest low voice casts ever Lawrence Tibbett sang Boccanegra and Leonard Warren sang Paolo.
johnlaniganokeeffe 1 month ago
The first four (Pinza, Székely, Frick, Moll), and long, long silent.
Trianon1920juny4 2 months ago
Kurt Moll by far, clear and sustained, no visible effort to keep the low D.
tudor4360 2 months ago
After hearing it two times, my favorite is Kurt Moll. But in the end I think a lot of them are very good.
SchallundWahn 2 months ago
PINZA reigns supreme! What a voice!!
dnettles 2 months ago
Pinza seems to have the only decent low D on this video!
tenorbasse 2 months ago
kurt moll is the best osmin ever!!! not only for this notes, but for the entire aria and opera! this part is the easiest of the entire aria!
surreal45 3 months ago
Ezio Pinza is one of my favorite bass singers, he has such solid voice and clarity!
LightMare7 3 months ago
@Jouwl you fucking try to sing a low D like they do.
OohhPajjelloo 3 months ago
None of them sings it with mentionable power. Is it because they are forced to sing high D's so much the minutes leading up to it?
... most of the them go flat here and there, too.
Jouwl 3 months ago
what a great video...!!! LOVE IT
Nibelungenfrau 3 months ago
now how about bass part of Chesterfield? the whole song is practically a low D xD
Zilerrezko 3 months ago
What about the D-FLAT during Jesus Must Die in Jesus Christ Superstar?
WilltheTowelie 3 months ago
Also, you should do one for that Rachmaninov low Bb I think it was? Isn't that the lowest scored note for a bass singer ever? I can't remember...
trooubermensch 4 months ago
FINALLY! I've been trying to find operatic bass singer videos on YouTube forever now and all I end up with at best is a baritone because people not classically trained don't recognize the difference, that or they are all bass guitar covers of the "Night of the Opera" or whatever by Iron Maiden. -_-'
trooubermensch 4 months ago
I love Szekely! Primus inter pares (first between equals).
MisterPapageno 4 months ago
I didn't think Pinza's low D would prove the best, since some of the other basses, such as Frick, Szekely, and Talvela, were more obviously bass than the great Italian. Yet Pinza's D does surpass all the others.
odnoforpb 4 months ago 3
die Qualität eines Bassisten auf das tiefe D zu reduzieren wäre etwas flach, interssant zu hören, dass kaum einer den Ton perfekt singt, man muss es natürlich auch im Raum hören um den Klang zu beurteilen Ezio Pinza klingt für meine Ohren am "gekonntesten", er hat ihn technisch im Griff
sebarobissengo 5 months ago
Moll is the best in my opinion, his low D is the most resonant. That said, Pinza's is also very, very impressive, and of all the basses featured here his is the most beautiful here. Talvela is one of my favourite Osmins, but he could've projected more on the low D. In fact the only one I don't like at all is Rydl's.
Beth29252 6 months ago
ascolta giulio neri in favorita
quagliaro 6 months ago
Pinza was the deepest
Rawr17000 7 months ago
I really like Szekely and Moll.
suicunewolf 7 months ago
Am I the only one who is not impressed at all by Pinza?
Gandalf930 7 months ago
Am I the only one hearing that Moll is the only one taking the D with a adequate vibrato??
SnuggeP 7 months ago 3
First of all - Well Done and thank you for the wonderful post!
This is what internet sharing is all about.
I heard last week in Berlin Staatsoper Bjarni Thor Kristinsson and he was Very good.
The whole production of stage director Thalheimer was best taste and very inspirational. Best wishes!
Also of course, acoustics in live hall affect very much the resonance.
gilad1arnon 8 months ago
First of all - Well Done and thank you for the wonderful post!
This is what internet sharing is all about.
I heard last week in Berlin Staatsoper Bjarni Thor Kristinsson and he was Very good.
The whole production of stage director Thalheimer was best taste and very inspirational. Best wishes!
gilad1arnon 8 months ago
Purely vocal, yes, Pinza. Moll, Lloyd and Talvela vocally suit well for the Osmin. A low note should still be `open` not sound to throaty or pressed-it takes a large chest/rib cage to make it sound naturally appealing. You can always tell, just from listing who the singer is `composed`. What Frick is concerned it was probably the darkest tone of all opera basses he had, but sometimes missed some appeal in expression.
reviewsvoiceontube 9 months ago
I don't know why some people dream or hope they are the lowest bass. If your a low bass that can actually nail this note loud, clear, and deep, than you are either one of the greatest singers of all time, or you will have an extremely tough time finding roles to sing, because all the other basses will be better suited for almost any other role.
And anyone thinking about commenting about their own voice. Nobody, and I mean nobody cares.
snoopyflick 9 months ago
I can hit a low d and I'm only 13...
MrEaseondowntheroad 9 months ago
ha i can sing lower than that actually xD
kachufalav 9 months ago
Kurt Rydl, couldn't hold his low D that well lol. I like Szekely much better.
Angierocksification 10 months ago 3
Moll. Not only spot on, but doesn't appear to "shift" volume, quality, or clarity when going for the D.
mrj60706 10 months ago
believe me or not i can take this note...if i find this midi i will post this party here
NizamiShikhmammadov 11 months ago
And it's worth going ahead and mentioning that everyone else is either singing a very poor quality D or, worst of all, sitting in a nasty grey area sort of in between D and E-flat.
AkhmedSync 11 months ago
Moll and Szekely are really the only two who are satisfying in my opinion.
AkhmedSync 11 months ago
He didn't sing this role in the US. He was 34 yrs old when he came here. The listing of all his roles for here and abroad is in his biography. I'm sure it's correct. If you choose not believe it, then don't.
thephantom1946 11 months ago 7
moll's D is definitely the best. talvela's d is the worst
alecs1976 1 year ago
Kurt Moll FTW,
vigwig 1 year ago
MOLL! Nuff said, :-) Pinza was pretty good too.
ktrum492 1 year ago
Yes my friends thit you hear the beauty of them all? For what is this competition? I don ' t understand. When i have a favorite then my favorite is ... Kurt Moll. Now i am going to listen to the full aria and enjoy the music and beaty of all of them. Thank you for the publication.
Ramakrishnademeester 1 year ago
Im 15 and can rech the low D YEAH! im a man^!
ItsMadeBySambi 1 year ago
I definitely agree with baritonoguapo. PINZA wipes the floor with all of them. He wasn't Toscanini's and Bruno Walter's favorite basso for nothing. He was amazing. Hits the low D perfectly!
thephantom1946 1 year ago
@thephantom1946 Pinza is in a studio and clearly gets right up to the mic for his D. A lot of baritones could do that. There's a reason he never sang those kind of notes live--he didn't have them in the house.
Note that Pinza is one of my all-time favorite basses, but I have to be fair and say that, compared to the other basses here, he's technically "cheating." :)
BorisGodunov 11 months ago
@BorisGodunov Pinza did sing those notes live, Osmin was a role he sang abroad before he made his US debut. He could and did, and he had those notes in the house:-) He didn't have to "cheat" and he definitely deserves his legendary status. I have his full repertoire of opera performances for the US and abroad.
thephantom1946 11 months ago 3
@thephantom1946 I will need more than your say-so that Pinza ever sang Osmin on stage. I'm very familiar with his repertoire as well and have pretty much everything he recorded, and there's not a trace of Osmin anywhere outside of the 1946 Bruno Walter studio recording of the aria in Italian that is sampled here. Googling Pinza and Osmin only brings hits on this recording.
Outside of this recording, there aren't any low Ds in Pinza's recordings by which to judge.
BorisGodunov 11 months ago
@BorisGodunov ThePhantom1946 is correct, and this is not the only recording that Pinza made with a low D.../watch?v=7eGY4h1PtNk. There is also a live recording of the same aria that is seemingly moved up a half-step but he has no trouble with the E-flat.../watch?v=Gxas6J3B_SM.
76Basso 11 months ago 2
@76Basso Thanks for those links, I always enjoy hearing Pinza. But that doesn't actually make ThePhantom1946 "correct." I don't deny that Pinza would sing a low D in a studio recording, which is what you provided. But as you yourself point out, the aria was transposed up for a live performance, which actually proves my point! And it certainly doesn't support the assertion that was made that Pinza sang Osmin on stage, which was the overall argument. I can find no evidence he did so.
BorisGodunov 11 months ago
@BorisGodunov First you said there were no other recordings of Pinza with a low D and now you discount that and a live E-Flat that is seemingly easy. Are you really implying Pinza couldn't have sung half-step lower and still been better than most we hear in this video? Your exact quote was, "There's a reason he never sang those kind of notes live." This would imply you thought he couldn't sing anything near a D live.
I was saying the Phantom was right about the listing of Osmin in the Bio.
76Basso 11 months ago
@76Basso No, first I said that Pinza did not sing low Ds live on stage, and so far you've completely failed to prove otherwise. You undermine your point by providing a studio recording where he sings a D and then a live (note, not in an opera house!) recording of the exact same aria where he transposes it up! Why do you think it was transposed upwards?
I'll ask you the same I asked Phantom: provide evidence Pinza sang Osmin live. I searched and could not find any.
BorisGodunov 11 months ago
@76Basso And about that low E flat--It's the same story as the Osmin D. He wasn't singing in an opera house for that song, even if there was a live audience (although even THAT is arguable, since in those days they would frequently add laugh and applause tracks to broadcasts from a studio). Regardless, it is clear he is singing right up at the microphone for it. He certainly does not have the deep bass spread for that note that you get with a Moll, or even Siepi.
BorisGodunov 11 months ago
@BorisGodunov Obviously there is no evidence that you will accept; the biography lies and the live recording is fake and any other evidence is false no doubt, so it is pointless to continue. Why did he transpose it up? I recently had a piece transposed that normally I would not because of a cold that left my low notes ragged. I also once sang with a orchestra that was tuned to A=515HZ. There are numerous reasons for a pitch discrepancy; we do not know the reasons for the pitch shift.
76Basso 11 months ago
@76Basso That is just bullshit. I'll accept evidence of documentation that Pinza sang Osmin live in an opera house as one of his repertory roles. You mention his biography, and yet I can not find any reference to his doing so in his biographies. Neither you nor Phantom provided such. As it stands, I believe I'm entirely correct that he sang the Osmin aria only as a studio recording for Walter in 1946. There is *zero* evidence I can find to suggest otherwise.
BorisGodunov 11 months ago
@BorisGodunov The evidence is in the book titled 'Ezio Pinza' an autobiography with Robert Magidoff who did a lot of researching and listed all the roles he performed on stage. I bought the book when I was a youngster in 1959. You can't find a fraction of the information about Pinza anywhere online; only in a book. Online sources provide precious little information, comparatively. It is the first one listed under his roles onstage, and was in Europe. So I'm afraid you're incorrect.
thephantom1946 4 months ago
@thephantom1946 Thank you for the citation. I've checked on the Magidoff list, and it is indeed there. However, I remain unconvinced for several reasons. Magidoff was completing Pinza's autobio after his death, so this list was compiled around 1956. There are zero citations, and no mention is given of when/where Pinza supposedly sang it. Pinza himself makes no mention of the role at all. For all we know, he could have been assuming Pinza sang the role based on this very recording. (cont)
BorisGodunov 4 months ago
@thephantom1946 (cont) Also, there are numerous basic errors in the book which have to be attributable to Magidoff. He labels one of the photographs as Pinza in the "title role" of Simon Boccanegra! That is, of course, absurd. So Magidoff's list is not first-hand documentary evidence (he even has scads of question marks in his list, showing uncertainty). I'd say it's reasonable to doubt its accuracy, although it's also reasonable to accept it, so we'll just have to agree to disagree.
BorisGodunov 4 months ago
@BorisGodunov Magidoff explains above the list, the question mark on some denotes the roles Pinza sang abroad where no record is kept. Not that he didn't sing it. Magidoff didn't even start working on the book till april of 1957 when he came to Pinza's house every day spending time with him for two months before he wrote the book, going through all his papers and talking with him. It does seem you have a blocked mind, lol.
thephantom1946 4 months ago 2
@thephantom1946 I"m aware of why he used the question marks, the point was that the list is not authoritative, given such omissions (if he compiled that list with Pinza's aid, why would there be question marks at all?) The book was clearly published after Pinza's death, as it is mentioned in the book. Nowhere does Magidoff claim he worked on the list with Pinza, there are no citations and the claim Pinza sang the lead in Simon Bocconegra casts doubt on Magidoff's alleged meticulousness.
BorisGodunov 4 months ago
@thephantom1946 Finally, I'll reiterate that there is no actual documentation of Pinza singing the role. Magidoff's list is not such, it's the equivalent of hearsay in a legal proceeding. Given the complete omission of the role from Pinza's recordings and that it is a role that is very much outside his typical ones, I'm comfortable being skeptical. The overall point, that Pinza wasn't ripping off low Ds in opera houses, and that THIS D is "strong" due to getting close to the mic, stands.
BorisGodunov 4 months ago
@BorisGodunov cont. Magidoff did nothing about Pinza until the aforementioned dates of April through May of 1957. Also the roles without question marks are supposed to be the ones that have records that were kept. Osmin's role has no question mark; there was a record of it in Europe. Magidoff makes his list quite clear on that.
thephantom1946 4 months ago 2
@BorisGodunov I don't think anyone was arguing that Pinza had the low notes of Moll, but there are plenty of basses who sing Osmin who don't. It is very possible that Pinza had at least this aria transposed up for live performance. Ghiaurov often moved Seneca's death up a full step to avoid the D, and Pinza may have done the same for this. Anyway, I am more interested in perfecting my own singing than worrying about what Pinza did or didn't sing, so I won't reply again, but best wishes to you.
76Basso 11 months ago
@BorisGodunov I was saying Phantom was right about the listing of Osmin in Pinza's biography.
76Basso 11 months ago
For the love, Kurt Moll. His voice is like a warm red velvet cake all the way down to the low D.
Pinza doesn't even get all the way down to the D!
And now for the Razzies: Tie between Robert Lloyd and Franz Hawlata for best rendition of Mozart via Mongolian Throat-singing.
gnateoj 1 year ago
@gnateoj Hawlata is the ONE whose voice I don't like in this clip - aiee, horrible nasal grating sound! I'll give him the benefit of the doubt that this was an off day for him. But in contrast to Moll, Pinza, and Frick - clearly not in the same league.
LittleMissMafdet 11 months ago
Talvela sang D#... or maybe an E.. O_O
ReyNixz 1 year ago
@ReyNixz It has been said that if Talvela had been 6 inches shorter, he probably would have been a baritone. I'm not so sure about that, but he was never particularly strongest on the extreme low notes of his range. But he had, in my view, the most astonishingly beautiful of bass voices.
BorisGodunov 11 months ago
@zepto: there is the rosenkavalier too.
Pacuvio25 1 year ago
Guys who think that is easy to sing a low D, or that they could sing it best shouldn't forget that a large part of these recordings are made in a theater. Are you so sure your low D could be heard from the first to the last line of a big theater? With the orchestra? Those guys you've just heard have spent a lifetime singing...Don't be presumptuous
JazzyGiord 1 year ago 9
@JazzyGiord Thank you for your competent remark, dear JazzyGirod. I completely agree with you. Many baritones and bass-baritones 'reach' a low D and then think, it'd be easy, so what all the fuzz about it... BUT: Mostly they produce vocal fry or 'sit' on the sound and push the note downwards with muscular tension, thus overbreasting and beraving the necessary (even down here!) it of its healthy head voice component... Having to push or having a real deep bass voice = the question.
ONeirda 1 month ago
@JazzyGiord Yes, I agree 100% I'm a bass and I can hit that note but it's so weak, these men are really really great.
andrewizz 1 month ago
@JazzyGiord For many it's easy to HIT a low D, it's very very rare to be able to SING a low D. I think any singer understands the difference I'm making here.
GoblinInventor 1 month ago
This has been flagged as spam show
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skierdude345 1 year ago
I think I'll go with Pinza then Moll. The Pinza recording is amazing, but I do so love Kurt Moll as well.
FractureFire 1 year ago 3
I preferred Mihaly Szekely and Marti Talvela
MisterPapageno 1 year ago
Matti Salminen definitely has the best D4 belt at 1:57. xD
OliverKahnNr1 1 year ago
Mihály Székely had certainly the strongest low D of them all: not in this extract, but generally. On youtube, there are two other recordings of his low D ("Non ve rimedio" and "Da lieg ich") and both are amazing. And Székely was also the only operatic bass I know, who just sang double low A (!!!) on stage.
Nevertheless, this time Moll and Pinza were a bit better than him.
hugodraslik 1 year ago
Ezio Pinza wins. But I think the only winner is Mozart. And us.
Lassannn 1 year ago 24
@Lassannn And Pinza doesn't take a breath either. One of those other guys had to breathe right before the low note!
ivelosthewilltolive 11 months ago
@Lassannn
For me it's a toss-up between Moll and Pinza. I'd have to say Moll, by a hair, simply because I love the YouTube video of his performance as Osmin. BUT the real winners, as you said, are Mozart and us - for being able to enjoy this!
LittleMissMafdet 11 months ago
@Lassannn Donizetti - La Favorita - Giulio Neri - splendon più belle in ciel le Stelle
quagliaro 6 months ago
Josef Greindle, pardon
fpogg 1 year ago
Avete dimenticato Joseph Greindl !!!
fpogg 1 year ago
No Samuel Ramey?
rv8dvd 1 year ago
PInza
Frick
Moll
Szekely
Salminen
Talvela
mongemark 1 year ago 2
I'm sorry, but what the hell is this? Except for a select few in this video who can actually sing this aria well (Pinza, for example), every other singer wobbles and has trouble sustaining the D. And to put this in persective, I am 17, an opera STUDENT, and can sustain the D better than almost all of the other singers here (who are full-blown opera singers with supposed years of training)
Jpmadore1 1 year ago
@Jpmadore1
If ever you`ve sung the whole opera you`ll remark that this aria at the end of the whole thing is VERY difficult, because the voice has become higher during singing the other arias and ensembles. You do NOT sing only this one aria during a performance of the "Entführung". To sing only this low note "D" is ridiculous, every good bass sings even a "C" or lower in the morning without having warmed up the voice.
sarastrosmin 1 year ago
@sarastrosmin-
I agree with you, as the music from this opera is difficult for all characters, Osmin especially. (F4 to an optional C2 is the biggest range I've ever heard needed in opera!) That being said, however, chances are high that these excerpts were not taken from a live performance, therefore the performers just recorded this one song, not the whole opera. And because of that, the poor quality of this aria by these singers is not okay with me.
Jpmadore1 1 year ago
if i could get accompaniment, would it be alright if i posted myself doing this as a response?
LordAroyeum 1 year ago
Kurt Moll only hits Eb
leporello56 1 year ago
@leporello56 Definitely. It's basically a little sharp.
outtaker 1 year ago
It seems to be no contest, Pinza definitely sings the note with the least effort. Most have a difficult time, or you can hardly hear it. To think Pinza was a basso cantante not just a profundo, too.
thephantom1946 1 year ago 2
1.Moll
2.Pinza
3.Frick
The fact is that is not enough reach that note, notes must be musically valid, most of this great basses don't produces a "musical" note.
Kurt Moll performance is simply amazing, listening well.
MrJudas11 1 year ago
Thomas McNichols is one of the best ive heard, but still not as good as moll
webbna10 1 year ago
No comparto tu opinion de Pinza, ese RE final le viene muy justo, quien deberia estar en esa lista y no estan, son: Henry Medus y Ludwig Weber. Un saludo
sarastrone 1 year ago
Pinza sang it excellently and powerfully. But I think the opera has a different feeling when sung in Italian, I prefer it in the original German. Frick handled it well, too. The other singers more or less suppressed the low not. Hawlata, for example, almost omitted it!
prorokini 1 year ago 2
@Jouwl These guys are not equipped with Elephant tunks to lift the sound up...
However they will vibrate a message through the earth!
Low notes are the most difficult to sing and project - and these guys are doing extremely well.
My like Kurt Moll holds it beautifully and of course Ezio Pinzo...
SoulNotes1 1 year ago
These are opera singers for crying out loud! Why are they singing things they can't handle?!
More than half of the singers here wobble up to a D#, and if they don't the tone is so weak you can barely hear it over the orchestra...
... what's up with that? These people are supposed to be the singer elite, right?
Jouwl 1 year ago
Rdyl...you fail big time
djslimz1 1 year ago
Some of the singers sing "Ruh vor Euch" instead of the original version by Mozart "vor Euch Ruh`". This is not correct. The version with Hauptmann/Gardiner is sung in 430 Hertz which is a quarter tone lower than the other versions. Of course the quality of this low note depends a lot from the mic-position and the recording technique.
sarastrosmin 1 year ago 14
cornelius hauptman has C#
cross147 1 year ago 2
@cross147 Sounds more like something in between the two pitches, perhaps a flat D. It might have been the recording (tape speed) or in a very unlikely scenario, the tuning of the orchestra.
OliverKahnNr1 1 year ago
@OliverKahnNr1 could be :)
cross147 1 year ago
Well, just evaluating what is given here- Kurt Moll in first and Lloyd in second- even though Frick is probably the darkest in general and popular for his potrayal of Osmin. Greindl and Weber should be heared.
reviewsvoiceontube 1 year ago
Too bad there isn't much of a record of Nicola Moscona.
MsCryptoknight 1 year ago
Rydl is awfuk!
rv8dvd 1 year ago
superbe! LifeJuice90 à raison c'est kurt moll le plus fort!!! j'espère que justino diaz pourra le faire mais il est baryton-basse...
clown84700 1 year ago
I like Kurt Moll's the best, because he is very clear and he enunciates. Most of the time, they don't even say the words correctly. Those last 2 singers sounded awful. Robert Lloyd is amazing, but he needed a better microphone. Talvela is great, but he is missing something. Frick's is only good at that point, the rest of the aria he sounds awful.
LifeJuice90 1 year ago
Well. It is hard to compare those low D-s. It all depends on the recording; where the microphone was positioned, was it a concert or opera, or maybe in a studio.
Usually Osmin has to run around before singing his low note and that makes it harder.
Nevertheless, this Video is fun.
iceuploader 2 years ago 2
Kurt Moll sounds the best here. Half of these basses sound like they're just dragging their feet through gravel. The last guy sounds HORRIBLE.
mulcunry 2 years ago
Low D is so difficult to sing under these conditions. Their voices are so taxed by this point by all the high singing required for basses in opera's.
pavelkostov 2 years ago 3
Pinza, Szekeley, Lloyd are the better ones. Some aren't a low D as they have been transcribed up, including Rydl who has the worst note. Certainly an interesting compilation.
phatphace 2 years ago
excellent video
BucaManTV 2 years ago
It's D0, right?
tweekin001 2 years ago
D2 actually....
zepto3600 2 years ago 3
It must be D1. D2 is the starting root note.
tweekin001 2 years ago
I have to disagree, I think he's starting at a D3, and accordingly to wiki, Die Entführung aus dem Serail has the lowest demanded and commonly performed note, D2, in the classical repertoire.
Watch some other videos with deep notes, and this won't sound so low, like /watch?v=D8cviwNdnQI
zepto3600 2 years ago 5
@zepto3600 what about Baron Ochs' exit at the end of act I of Rosenkavelir -- a low C...
alocksley 1 year ago
@zepto3600 I have also to disagree!
The Baron Ochs in the "Rosenkavalier" by Strauss has to sing the low C in the aria "Da geht er hin". Ok, now we can discuss if this is romantic repertoire! ;D
sarastro1791 1 year ago
@sarastro1791 ...and in the Ugonotti, Meyerbeer use a low C too
Pacuvio25 1 year ago
Then jumps to D3.
tweekin001 2 years ago
D4, actually.
pannicatack 2 years ago
J'adore le timbre de Frick et sa diction, mais il me semble que Moll sort gagnant de la comparaison de ces enregistrements (malgré Talvela).
TheAnssiAnssi 2 years ago
Comment removed
TheAnssiAnssi 2 years ago
Well, Talvela is really amazing, but he has this style that I can only call step singing. I say that because, he just drops down each note. Most people should glide down, but he drops down.
LifeJuice90 2 years ago
i cant seem to find a good cd of this opera with moll...any one have a link...or any other bass, rydl...
adamskyb 2 years ago
ill redo that comment, id say pinza, moll and lloyd have the best ones. i think molls is the strongest though..
dbikeguy 2 years ago
moll is the best one
dbikeguy 2 years ago
Pinza and Frick in my opinion
crow66693 2 years ago
well i listened to this through a different pair of speakers and to be totally honest, when i heard fricks, i thought it sounded way better. i still think molls is really strong though haha.
dbikeguy 2 years ago
Kurt Moll is the man. Always sounds as if "Theres plenty more where that came from." He never struggles.
Fistwagon 2 years ago 3
Kurt Moll enunciates the best of them all, and he hits the note clearly weather it be Euch or Ruh.
LifeJuice90 2 years ago 3
the last guy.. sounded almost like he fried it.. havin some trouble there
dbikeguy 2 years ago
very easy to imitate
georgesunable 2 years ago
I think Henri Medus' recording of this song in the mid-1940's is the best I've heard.
Jpmadore1 2 years ago
Comment removed
TheAnssiAnssi 2 years ago
This has been flagged as spam show
I agree with Jpmadore1, Henri Medus is really amazing. To listen his voice just type: "site des basses" medus in the search box of google, and hit Enter.
3 mp3 are in the bottom of the Medus' page.
TheAnssiAnssi 2 years ago
I found anotherone, search in youtube "Osmin's aria JÓZSEF GREGOR Ha! Will ich triumphieren (sung in Hungarian)"
mouthmouse 2 years ago
Has anyone ever heard of Herbert Ahlsen? I just heard him in a vienna philharmonic recording and his low d's are HUGE. But I cant find any info or other recordings w/him
adamskyb 2 years ago
i m a bass too i hit this notes easily but being a bass makes me so sad!!!
inlovewithmuscles 2 years ago
Why?
reydogoloyugo23 2 years ago
because i do not like to have such a deep dark voice i d like to be a baritone but it s impossible for me!!!!
inlovewithmuscles 2 years ago
Why? Baritone-voices have its own problems; they can´t sing nether low nor high!?
I´m also bass and have low C and a pretty good high F - boy, train your voice, than you could have very good chances to sing at great opera houses; they search for us!!! We have the advantage of not much competitives so we have to use it!
WhiteProfondo 2 years ago
baritons can sing high do with the proper training on the other hand i m not a profondo although i have very loud and thick low notes but my middle voice is not so dark and when i sing sol and la i do not seem lke a bass at all but unfortunately for me i cannot sing baritone arias easily because reach but cannot keep sol & la
inlovewithmuscles 2 years ago
imagine that i could hit the low notes before having lessons at all but this dark voice does not match with the idea i had about singing!i was thinking my self singing ''eri tu', ''di provenza il mar'' now i have to deal with a middle voice and low notes from hell that makes me so sad!!!!my teacher argues with me all the time and says''you ll destroy your voice trying to hit high notes'' i do not know i m too sad to think clearly
inlovewithmuscles 2 years ago
then don´t sing above C; Perhaps Sarastro would be the perfect start for you as it was for me! Start with "O Isis", the notes aren´t to hard and you learn how to sing legato; thats a very good aria!
WhiteProfondo 2 years ago
thats not true. im a baritone but my lowest audible note is about this d note, but my highest is about the b flat above middle c, so thats a mid tenor note, so i sing bass to tenor, and a baritone is also one of the strongest, most prominent voices in opera.
dbikeguy 2 years ago
Sorry, but I highly doubt that you can hit a powerful low D and a high H/C as well-.-
WhiteProfondo 2 years ago
i said audible note smart one. about speaking level. i wouldnt call that powerful. my g or f is my strongest low notes.
dbikeguy 2 years ago
Well, that is also a very strong range if you´re able to sing from low F to high H, my congrats! So you can choose of beeing Baritone or Tenor, Bravo! Not much singers can say that from themselves. For me there are not much variabilities; I have a quite good low C and a respectable high F, so I will be a bass for all days in my life- but there was always the dream of singing Nessun Dorma for example. I´m good at low bass roles, Heinrich from Lohengrin is to hard at the moment...
WhiteProfondo 2 years ago
im not gonna lie i want to be a bass very much. i practice everyday. if by the time im 18 i can nail a low b i will be happy.
dbikeguy 2 years ago
a b flat above middle c is one of the highest notes in opera repertory for tenors. if you have that b flat, you're not a baritone.
4PlagalCadence1 2 years ago
Comment removed
crwv 2 years ago
just because the greatest baritones of all time have it doesn't mean it's in the repertory.
4PlagalCadence1 2 years ago
@4PlagalCadence1-
Keep in mind that Giacomo Meyerbeer wrote an F#5 in one of his solo tenor arias. And by the way, I once sang-without falsetto-a tenor high C about 3 months ago and was amazed, because I'm the lowest bass singer in my choir! The question isn't whether you have it, it's whether you're comfortable singing that note or not.
Jpmadore1 2 years ago
cmon man I am a bass too and I sing in a choir also but I am pretty happy with my deep voice if this cheers you up; let me tell you that chicks looooves basses and deep voices they say that it sounds so manly... thats why I am proud of my voice :)
wubarahona 2 years ago
Being a bass is awesome, I'm jealous.
Jouwl 2 years ago
train your range and you will be able to sing higher, i can sing pretty high and i'm a bass-baritone, i also have good low range and i'm only 18 it doesnt take forever, you just have to keep at it
jaythesaxman 2 years ago
the opera tehnique makes it very hard to hit such low notes... I experienced this on myself:)
shmuckfane 2 years ago
ooohhh mozart... this is the first opera i listened to.
happyman 2 years ago
not very powerful all this D
alexanderliver 2 years ago
im 17 and can hit the second lowest D on the piano
allaroundamazing 2 years ago
i'm 13 and i can hit the low D
SweeneyStyles 2 years ago
so that means you might become a tenor ! lol... but seriously, when I was 13, I sang bass in choir and I could hit a low E flat, but now I'm 17 and I'm a leggiero tenor ! Only time can tell.
tenor9216 2 years ago
hey :) thanks for that =)
i'd love to be a tenor :) but how long will it be untill i can tell what i'll be?
thanks a lot
SweeneyStyles 2 years ago
I didnt realise your voice gets way lower the older your get. my voice has newly broke and i can hit low just about E above doouble low c. not bad. i dont really have a clue to be honest.
TheOnlyStroud 2 years ago