Minnesota Population

[MrGman13131]

Do you know why the population of the world has risen so quickly? It's because more babies and old people are surviving. So to fix this "problem" which one of these two things do you want to stop?

[ZaneRokklyn]

You're just quoting two aspects of the death rate. The growth rate (ignoring immigration for the moment) is the birth rate minus the death rate. The death rate (of both young and old people) can remain low if the birth rate also decreases. And that is what has been happening for the past 100 years, all over the world; it's just not happening fast enough to prevent impending crises of resource scarcity. The most effective way to reduce the birth rate is to educate children, especially girls.

[gravelandgrain100]

You wanna know why the Minnesota population is expanding so rapidly. It's two-fold, and the weather has nothing to do with it. We are an extremely progressive welfare state-you can come here with nothing but the clothes on your back and receive healthcare, food, and shelter. We also have a lower than average unemployment rate. BUT this is good because once you are able to find a job you become more self-sufficient(by the progressive states theory).

in other words-Minnesota is pretty awesome.

[ZaneRokklyn]

That's great to hear! If and when WPB makes a new video, we'll be sure to research it again. The erosion data for this video were based on sediment accumulation at Lake Pepin, which had to come from somewhere upstream -- if not from your neighbors' farms, than from somewhere else in Minnesota.

[farmforever]

Nice way to show population growth but riddled with inaccurate statements. As a farmer, I can assure you that the vast majority of Minnesota's fertile farm fields are NOT losing top soil as is stated in the video. Productivity continues to increase, even as farmers reduce fertilizer and pesticide inputs.

[estoylocos]

This is a fascinating video and I appreciate you all making it. As a Minnesotan myself I understand how important it is to preserve our natural resources (and simply nature in general) for future generations to enjoy as well. However, increased population growth seems to be all but inevitable. Instead of stopping population growth, shouldn't we be looking at ways to sustain these higher populations levers rather than trying to stop them? We should have denser cities with taller buildings IMO.

[ZaneRokklyn]

Thank you for your comments! Growth is not inevitable, in fact the UN predicts it will stop by 2060 at the latest. Unfortunately that's not soon enough to save our environment at current rates of consumption. Many people are looking at ways to sustain the population, but it's kind of like betting that someone will finish building a bridge before your train gets to the river -- if you slow down, they'll have more time to finish the bridge!

[TippmannHawk]

HOLLLLLLY CRAP 140 every minnet?

[buferdt]

are these 2 girls never gonna have kids then?ya know to do there part?

[ZaneRokklyn]

That's up to them. But we don't need everyone to stop having kids in order to stop growth; we just need to average 2 or fewer children per woman. So one of them could have three kids and the other one, and they would still be doing their part.

[anyopenname]

Holy crap, I don't even know where to start with how sloppy and inaccurate this video. Granted, there is a valid point, population growth is a concern, but come on... What good is iron being left in the ground in the first place. This video makes it seem like Minnesotans need iron in the ground to live. Minnesota's economy has more than proven we don't need to use iron to prop up our economy anymore. You have a point, but it is poorly presented.

[ZaneRokklyn]

You're right, there's room for improvement -- it was our first video! But the reason for including iron as one of the resources is that iron has been EXTREMELY important in the history of northern Minnesota -- it is the reason so many people moved there, and its depletion is the reason for their economy's collapse in recent decades. So the history of iron mining is directly connected to the history of the population in that area.

[ZaneRokklyn]

Does Nike tell you how to "just do it?" This video is an advertisement for a Web site, intended to get you interested in the topic. I'm sorry that it made you assume the worst.

[mrhobs]

Good point, I was sort of thinking the same thing about them not saying how. (The website probably has more info.) I think it's possible for the world to live relatively responsibly... but it won't happen. Jesus will have to return to save us.

[ChevRcr454]

i see the north is still relitivly untouched by people. you know we do actualy have alot of land untouched by the plow?. the north and northeast have alot of woodlands, and the hills make it difficult for farmers so they go to the RRV and the south

[ZaneRokklyn]

It's not an accident that land hasn't been plowed: it's not suitable for cultivation. The same goes for most of Canada and Alaska!

[nerd0decoder]

The thing is, those countries don't have unsustainable populations. India and China, maybe Japan. Each of those countries can sustain its own population by choosing the best crops, recycling, and managing its forests wisely. Russian in particular could product probably ten times the food it does now.

[ZaneRokklyn]

Why stop there? If we were all an inch high, we could live in the Astrodome! What does that prove? Ecology is not based on wishful thinking about what a species' impact would be if it were different from the way it is. Every country in the world is overpopulated because we are using resources faster than they regenerate. That's the definition of overpopulation, and of unsustainability.

[nerd0decoder]

People aren't starving in Italy, Japan, Russia, and France. But their pension systems are going to go bankrupt without enough people to support the retirees. Each of those countries has been trying to increase reproduction without success. Some are actually seeing their populations shrink, which is a disaster for them.

[ZaneRokklyn]

The thing about an UNSUSTAINABLE population is that it HAS to shrink, one way or another, sooner or later. Countries like Italy are extremely fortunate to be able to do it in a controlled fashion. Pension systems will just have to be reinvented so that they are not based on a pyramid scheme.

[nerd0decoder]

If it was education that was reducing reproduction in developed countries, then those countries that are in a panic over population loss would be able to "educate" people into having more kids. They can't. Instead governments are having to pay premiums to young people to have more kids.

[ZaneRokklyn]

The UN's conclusion is that education (regardless of the subject) causes people to have fewer kids, not more. The politicians who are paying people to have more kids are mistaken -- their populations are still unsustainably large and must decrease one way or another.

[nerd0decoder]

Worldwide, the most effective form of birth control has been demonstrated to be selfishness. Yep, in developed countries, young people don't want to have kids because kids interfere with their fun. See how the populations of Europe and Japan are stagnated, even shrinking.

[ZaneRokklyn]

Do you really think selfishness is the only factor that distinguishes Europe and Japan from the developing world? Or that it is even *a* point of distinction between those countries? The UN has determined that the factor you've identified is education, not selfishness. If you have the evidence to prove that the UN is wrong and you are right, then more power to you.

[Depotmaster]

Maybe the immigration will stop when the USA will not be attractive anymore. You really want that instead?

[Depotmaster]

My theory is that population can regulate itself in developed countries, but I bet you wouldn't believe. When the economy hits tho bottom of the possible productivity, the social pressure and unemployment makes the people stop having kids like in Japan or Germany.

[ZaneRokklyn]

You're not alone in that theory, and the birth rate of the US is below replacement levels, but the US is growing more like a developing country than a developed one due to its extraordinarily high immigration rates -- higher than all the other developed countries combined. That is problematic because Americans (including recent immigrants) consume far more resources per capita than any other country.

[ZaneRokklyn]

On the contrary, Minneapolis was the flour milling capital of the world for 50 years, and that was a major cause of its population growth. Admittedly, not all of that wheat came from Minnesota, but much of it did. And according to my research for the video, the rate of soil erosion is increasing, not decreasing, but in any case *any* net loss of topsoil is unsustainable over time.

[chukmaty]

wheat... wtf... we grow corn... you almost never have seen wheat in Minnesota... corn and soy beans is the primary crop and wheat is not... wrong climate period.

[ZaneRokklyn]

We grow corn *now*, yes. But I needed historical data for the film, and historically Minnesota grew wheat for much longer than it has grown corn. The rise and fall of wheat production was not because of a change in the climate; it rose because farmers put thousands of acres into production of a single crop and then could not sustain that level of production. Corn has been on the rise for the last 60 years but may well follow the same path.

[chukmaty]

that is not the way the vid gave information... Minnesota never was a prime area for wheat crops. also updated methods are doing a better job maintaining ground soil.

[savepenguintrees]

So are there many native species left in minnesota ?

What exactly are you trying to achieve.

Surely your ultimate goal is more than the goal of bacteria and cancer: i.e multiply forever

Do you enjoy living on top of each other ? with no green spaces, or other animals and plants ?

What is the point ?.

Economies and technology can grow without exponential population growth.

[CrazyBikeMan]

How are we suppose to just "stop" the population groath? Is someone going to ask everyone to just stop having sex, or are we going to let everyone die off slowly? If we try to get all of our rescources from in-state, there will eventually not be enough food and cloathing for people, and everyone will start dying younger. So I guess I just don't know how we can humanely stop it.

[ZaneRokklyn]

In 1994, the UN held a population summit in Cairo (Google "Cairo Programme Action") which made the case that education, not any sort of demographic targets or arbitrary "stop having sex" agenda, was the key to stopping population growth. The education need not be specifically about population growth, but it doesn't hurt! Most of the nations on Earth signed the Cairo Programme of Action, including the Vatican, but the US has not honored its financial obligations.

[zath68]

They have the Iron Ore Data very wrong. On the Iron Range, the mining of taconite is just scratching the surface of very large deposits. The mining companies consider it a nearly limit less supply. There Iron data could be correct if they are strictly speaking of the Red Ore that used to be on the surface. Though we ran out of that a long time ago.

[ZaneRokklyn]

Resources don't "run out," they just get scarce. The three resources shown are examples of consumption over time, three examples for which we have very good, complete data for a long period of time, and which have had a big impact on Minnesota culture and history. Consumption of any other resource will follow the same pattern if demand continues to grow without limits.

[thetupacmakavelifan]

Im not worried about it. It may be lookin bad, but we really aint in the red quite yet. I mean, I havent noticed these problems all that much yet.

[Rotgut42]

I live in minnesota i know were fine be cause were i live theres tons of fram land.

[ZaneRokklyn]

That means that land is already in use feeding the people we have today. So if there are more people tomorrow, they will need more food which will have to come from someplace else!

[aresmars2003]

It would be interesting to graph wood production and energy usage as well. The clearcutting of the northern forests would have been astounding to see graphically, and the "recovery" in the last 100 years. But more importantly I want to see energy consumption bargraph over time, wood, coal, oil, gas. Cheap energy drives our consumption and population growth. I think a debate on population is meaningless without asking what resources sustain us.

[ZaneRokklyn]

I agree! Unfortunately I was not able to find statistics about either wood or energy consumption over a long enough time span to be useful in the video. The information that is available is indeed astounding, but there were not enough data points to suit the animators.

[jackelprince1988]

actually only the southern half of minnesota is mostly farmland, because that is the best and most ariable place for things to grow. The reason we are running out of resources so quickly is the fact that we live such comfortable lives and waste so much. We dont scrutinize the every resource we use. The united states is less populated than asia yet we use more resources as i remember reading in a textbook,  maybe the issue isnt overpopulation, maybe its the way we are becoming wasteful

[jackelprince1988]

im making a point! that there is enough room and then some in Minnesota alone. the people of minnesota are vigorous and strong, i know because i have family there, they would make due. this video is just trying to scare them about overpopulation, ive been there and there is actually underpopulation. this video isnt very accurate about all of its facts, they dont take into consideration the death tole, that every minute someone dies.

[ZaneRokklyn]

The metronome sound on the video is the global *net* growth rate, births MINUS DEATHS. The birth rate by itself is much faster. And if, as you say, you've been to Minnesota, you know that most of it is farmland. Who do you suppose that farmland is feeding, if the state is underpopulated? Space is not the issue, resources are the issue, which is why the video talks about resources.

[jackelprince1988]

this is ridiculous, there are many recources and land masses to sustain human life on this earth. you could take everyone in the world stand them side by side in orange county and everyone would fit. They dont take into count all the land that noone has done anything with and the recources left to harvest; alternate energies etc. also There is starvation in lower end countries due to lack of supervision and leadership. none of which has to do with "world overpopulation".

[ZaneRokklyn]

What would be the point of standing everyone in Orange County? What would we eat, each other? The point this video is making, if you watched it, is that we use far more land than we physically occupy. I won't address your other points as they do not relate to this particular video. Thanks!

[QueenieAlexander2000]

So, how come they aren't standing side by side in Orange county if it's so doable? And, why would you want to take MORE land from other creatures in order to have MORE humans?

[janno3b]

how do you stop population growth?

[ZaneRokklyn]

That's a larger topic than a 7-minute video can address. Make that your homework assignment. :-)

[LetsBfriends]

whoaaa

[spazyk]

interesting...