Hydrolators freaked me out when I was younger, I didnt do well with enclosed spaces and still cant- I actaully havent been on the nemo ride. I'm one of the few people that dislikes finding nemo and thinks its boring and i can still remember going in here with my mom and dad in 04 and my little brother.
I miss the Hydrolators...that was one of the best parts of the Living Seas pavillion. It really made me feel like we were descending miles and miles beneath the ocean's surface.
who does the narration? It sounds like Kathleen Turner....I miss all of the EPCOT pre-shows. EPCOT has lost it's magic. I'm fortunate to have experienced the golden age of EPCOT back in the late 80s....at it's prime. Thanks for the post.
I really did like this attraction but their seemed to be a problem with controlling the flow of guests. Every time I think of this version I think of that crowded theater and a long wait. I don't know it might just be me....
I always enjoyed this movie prior to taking the elevators (also removed now). I really thought we were going down into the sea with those elevators when I was a kid. :)
This movie was so short, yet captured a sense of amazement so brilliantly...truly a unique film and I remember when you first entered Seabase Alpha, exactly like you just watched, it truly was like walking INTO the future.
The sonar beeps that begin at 5:24 still make me shiver. And combined with the rhythmic fade outs of the photography. Amazing stuff. Mourerj is right, 4:41 is seriously trippy. So imaginative this film was.
Nowadays we just pander to the mind, instead of expanding the mind.
She has the best 80s "Disney serious" voice -- I LOVE this pre-show -- Disney canned so many awesome pre-shows in Epcot ...Univ. of Energy, ...Shrunk the Audience...btw, the best part is at 4:41. Yes, "and it rained" is great, too -- w/ "try to imagine...."
How on EARTH could they get rid of this for a clown fish?Wow... I mean Pixar is great, but it's apples and oranges. This film is EPIC. All of the docs on the History, Science, Discovery channel and elsewhere owe a great debt of gratitude to EPCOT because of the manner in which it presented complex scientific concepts... always with a sense of wonder and awe. Thanks to youtube, though, this stuff lives on.
There was a day where there was an Experimental Prototype Community of Tomorrow, now its an Epcot full of lost great attractions where a great ride is scaled down to a cheap average ruthless attraction.
You and me both man, I liked the old one better. Sure they need to update and all, but all those classices that are now gone: The boat ride and Gandela ride at Disnyland where ones that I missed alot. I guess I missed the ride down into the elevtor, that made the whole thing better.
I think they should have a theater within the updated pavilion to show this film, maybe add some scenes to it with updates from the discoveries that happened since then. It is sad to lose it to clown fish
Wow... thank you so much for posting that. Getting to see it one more time is truly great. I am painfully disappointed that they took this away and replaced it with meaningless fluff.
"...and it rained, and rained, and rained. The Deluge." my favorite part.
I'm depressed now. Spaceship Earth, Mission: Space, The Land, and Test Track are the only pavilions that don't suck anymore. Imagination, Universe of Energy, and Seas need some serious help.
I went to Epcot today and was amazed at how they've Ruined the Living Seas. All educational value has gone out the window and there is no longer any sense of wonder and amazement at the power of the ocean. I loved the premovie, the fake elevator and the tunnel ride. I loved how when the movie was over it was like you were there. Epcot has slowly been butchering its rides. That's why I uploaded so many of the original lost songs so these won't be forgotten. Thank you for sharing this.
I liked this attraction the way it was. Sure, it could have used a little updating, but this Nemo idea is terrible. I was heartbroken to take my kids on something that taught them NOTHING about our world, our oceans that need cared for so desperately.
I miss the feeling of adventure when we walked into the Living Seas. You felt as though the sea was mysterious and you were going to uncover the mysteries of the ocean.
absolutely. I totally agree. It's so sad that they have to go and ruin things like this. They could have just tweaked it a bit, but they completely canned the entire thing. EPCOT isn't supposed to be all about disney characters, it's supposed to appeal to adults, too. That's what this ride WAS. So sad.
It certainly is good business...but the fact remains that it's still a very poor attraction that's just had Nemo bumper stickers slapped on it. It could have been a lot better. It just needed a bit more...what's the word...ah, imagination!
Not really. Some people want a break from the manufactured non-stop imagination and want to enjoy something interesting like the Living Seas. Turtle Talk with Crush was fine; at least the people who wanted to enjoy The Living Seas had the rest of the pavilion, and the kids had a kids' ride. Now it's just a big kids' ride. Nothing left for people that enjoyed not being bombarded by Nemo every second they are there. Oh, and no more awesome preshow.
If people were actually interested in Epcot and all it offered, none of the major changes would have happened. Look at Magic Kingdom, more than 25 years and remains barely fixed. Epcot on the other hand needed a change, people weren't going, kids were getting bored.
I miss the Living Seas as much as the next guy, but from a business standpoint Disney was extremely smart in using the Finding Nemo franchise to change The Living Seas.
Well, for every kid they gained, they probably got a ton of Epcot veterans to not go to the park. I honestly find myself hard pressed to enjoy the park anymore because the only good rides left are really Soarin and Test Track. Even Spaceship Earth took a hit.
I agree from the business standpoint. But, EPCOT was also very educational without advertising as such. I credit EPCOT with shaping part of my decision process on what I wanted to do when I got older. Seriously. But it seems young people today are a different breed.....attention spans are shorter...and well I'll stop there.
Total shame, they got rid of the Nautilus model from 20,000 Leagues Under the Sea too. That was another reminder of a great past attraction torn to pieces.
I have been to the Living Seas many times myself and really hate to see it go it is surely one of my favorites, especially the pre show movie, the new opening show is really great, and they did an excellent job on the effects. The real ride that needed no changing is Spaceship Earth, the new ride is terrible.
They've had to dumb everything down so today's average moron will be entertained. Going with something they saw recently at the movies is the best route. Audiences aren't too keen on "edgamacation". Especially on vacation. This Nemo stuff probably helps keep fights from breaking out. I too weep for the old Living Seas.Five years from now they'll most likely show a film showcasing a 3D P Diddy cussing and firing a pistol much to the crowd's delight.
I loved the old Seabase Alpha theme. I wish they'd kept it. Nemo is okay, but I liked Seabase Alpha better. This just continues the trend of Disney "dumbing-up" attractions to disguise that you might actually be learning something.
I just loved the surreal, mysterious theme to the original version of the Living Seas- preshow, hydrolaters, and all. I visited the new version, the Seas with Nemo, earlier this year, and it pretty much blows. Very babyish.
The submersible you see towards the end of the show is called the Johnson Sea Link and is owned by Harbor Branch Oceanographic (now part of Florida Atlantic University) in Fort Pierce, Florida. I work there now. The ocean is truly amazing. It is videos like this show us what otherwise we and our children may never see. Shame on EPCOT for falling for the lil kiddie trend of Finding Nemo.
Man, I miss this... it's a shame that they decided to destroy the legacy of such an amazing pavillion by vandalizing it with the stupid "Fad of the Year" crap of Finding Nemo. They've done it on other rides with Lilo & Stitch before, and then with High School Musical.
The problem is lack of imagination and the fear of finding someone with it in abundance. Let's hope and pray that the New Guard of Jobs/Lasseter will change all of that.
I can't believe the LS changed. I've been to Disney 14 times, the first when I was 2. I still remember my first trip to the LS 15 years later. It became my fav thing in all DW, and I knew my love of the LS would never end and its spot as my fav would never change.
Some things at Epcot changed, but I knew the LS would never leave. I even named my old swimming pool Sea Base Alpha. Screw you, whosever idea it was to change this great attraction.
In a way, it's our fault as a society. We've gotten away from learning; from being interested in being shown a new way. The excitement of learning has been turned into a lust for thrills and transient highs.
It's also The Disney Corporation's fault for neglecting Walt's philosophy of teaching while tickling the imagination. For ignoring the vision for EPCOT as a laboratory for effective urban planning.
You're so right. That's exactly what's been happening. I've had a lot of doubt about the company aknowledging Walt's EPCOT dream lately. Until now...Spaceship Earth is going to have some new innovations and the new Project: Tomorrow (the name says it all) presented by Siemens is a new source of hope to everyone who actually knows what EPCOT is about. The wand is down off of Spaceship Earth and new things besides the Nemo monstrosity are coming into play. At least there's some new hope.
When you consider the reason for the development of things like the monorail and Peoplemover, it becomes apparent that they were part of an overall plan. That plan was to use these things to show possibilities of a better existence. To try and fulfill a practical need. Walt's passion for transportation and need to move people throughout the original park gave birth to those particular innovations (ie; Omnimover technology, hub layout for the park).
There was an attraction at Disneyland called "Adventures Through Inner Space" that Walt oversaw. It was an entertaining dark ride that taught basic principles of molecules and atoms. It had a huge impact on kids of that time.
I LOVE the Living Seas when I was two back in 1995. It was my favortie place in Epcot. Now its all about Nemo!! I HATE NEMO!! They ruined Walt's creations!! ugh!!
Anybody know who the narrator was? She had an awesome voice. I really miss the old living seas setup. The new format is way too cheesy and meant for kids. Just another example of how Disney is slowly ruining Epcot Center!
I totally agree. I grew up going to Disney World and I always loved Epcot. When I was little I really hated all the movies but as I got older I grew to love them, and now that I haven't been there in six years, I miss them! And they're all gone! It's so sad!
They are ruining EPCOT Center. They're taking all the education and magic out of it, replacing the wonderful family-oriented World Fair style with fluffy childrens' crap.
The least they could have done was to keep the hydrolators and to re-theme them for the new ride. The way they have the Living Seas now is almost a joke. At least they got Mission Space done right, finally.
That vision was basically an attempt to meet the needs of society in practical and creative ways. To meet the needs of human beings that would improve the Human Condition. These days, such a notion is not respected. Research and development are dirty words to the bean counters.
"Searching these seas for the knowledge they conceal and the resources they hold"
Yeah, water and seaweed!
CaptainHollyShort 2 weeks ago
the old school rides @ Epcot from the 90s was some of the best writen rides @ Disney World compare to days Epcot any one agree with me?
CaptainViral84 5 months ago
Hydrolators freaked me out when I was younger, I didnt do well with enclosed spaces and still cant- I actaully havent been on the nemo ride. I'm one of the few people that dislikes finding nemo and thinks its boring and i can still remember going in here with my mom and dad in 04 and my little brother.
SinnerForgotten 6 months ago
The Nemo re-do really stinks.
RickLowerboy84 10 months ago
@RickLowerboy84 Just another attempt by Disney to really piss people off and to baby-fy EVERYTHING...
Angie2343 10 months ago
I miss the Hydrolators...that was one of the best parts of the Living Seas pavillion. It really made me feel like we were descending miles and miles beneath the ocean's surface.
johntheechidna1 11 months ago
who does the narration? It sounds like Kathleen Turner....I miss all of the EPCOT pre-shows. EPCOT has lost it's magic. I'm fortunate to have experienced the golden age of EPCOT back in the late 80s....at it's prime. Thanks for the post.
eraufool 11 months ago
I totally forget that part.
Hallamfoebell 1 year ago
I love the Nemo theme they have now cause it makes it more fun to enjoy
SmileyV07 1 year ago
I miss this pre-show as well...sigh. I love the sound when the camera scrolls up to show the ocean...man I love that part.
archaea771 1 year ago
I miss this pre-show as well...sigh.
archaea771 1 year ago
I really did like this attraction but their seemed to be a problem with controlling the flow of guests. Every time I think of this version I think of that crowded theater and a long wait. I don't know it might just be me....
elcanatureboy 1 year ago
I always enjoyed this movie prior to taking the elevators (also removed now). I really thought we were going down into the sea with those elevators when I was a kid. :)
MikesMethods 1 year ago
This movie was so short, yet captured a sense of amazement so brilliantly...truly a unique film and I remember when you first entered Seabase Alpha, exactly like you just watched, it truly was like walking INTO the future.
Sad what it has become :(
techno9991 1 year ago
The sonar beeps that begin at 5:24 still make me shiver. And combined with the rhythmic fade outs of the photography. Amazing stuff. Mourerj is right, 4:41 is seriously trippy. So imaginative this film was.
Nowadays we just pander to the mind, instead of expanding the mind.
onedollarphilistine 1 year ago
She has the best 80s "Disney serious" voice -- I LOVE this pre-show -- Disney canned so many awesome pre-shows in Epcot ...Univ. of Energy, ...Shrunk the Audience...btw, the best part is at 4:41. Yes, "and it rained" is great, too -- w/ "try to imagine...."
mourerj 1 year ago
Disney would rather feed us stale candy than meat and potatoes.
ReesiePuffs64 1 year ago
How on EARTH could they get rid of this for a clown fish?Wow... I mean Pixar is great, but it's apples and oranges. This film is EPIC. All of the docs on the History, Science, Discovery channel and elsewhere owe a great debt of gratitude to EPCOT because of the manner in which it presented complex scientific concepts... always with a sense of wonder and awe. Thanks to youtube, though, this stuff lives on.
FrankPerrotto 1 year ago 4
There was a day where there was an Experimental Prototype Community of Tomorrow, now its an Epcot full of lost great attractions where a great ride is scaled down to a cheap average ruthless attraction.
omg122448 1 year ago
it raind and it raind and it raind man now that was the liveing seas not feel good and bright colours Disney
CaptainViral84 2 years ago
Thank you so much for posting this! I have missed it. It used to be my favorite pavilion!
AndromedaStar 2 years ago
Comment removed
NASH317 2 years ago
I miss this. EPCOT is dead.
rohirrim11rider 2 years ago
You and me both man, I liked the old one better. Sure they need to update and all, but all those classices that are now gone: The boat ride and Gandela ride at Disnyland where ones that I missed alot. I guess I missed the ride down into the elevtor, that made the whole thing better.
MercenaryX21 2 years ago
I think they should have a theater within the updated pavilion to show this film, maybe add some scenes to it with updates from the discoveries that happened since then. It is sad to lose it to clown fish
techno9991 2 years ago
Yeah, as good as that movie was, I want that old show and design back. Those where the best.
MercenaryX21 2 years ago
Wow... thank you so much for posting that. Getting to see it one more time is truly great. I am painfully disappointed that they took this away and replaced it with meaningless fluff.
"...and it rained, and rained, and rained. The Deluge." my favorite part.
sockmonkeyhead 2 years ago
Everyone here, please write letters to Disney about what needs to be fixed...We need some change, even if it's slow and gradual...
rohirrim11rider 2 years ago
I'm depressed now. Spaceship Earth, Mission: Space, The Land, and Test Track are the only pavilions that don't suck anymore. Imagination, Universe of Energy, and Seas need some serious help.
rohirrim11rider 2 years ago
I went to Epcot today and was amazed at how they've Ruined the Living Seas. All educational value has gone out the window and there is no longer any sense of wonder and amazement at the power of the ocean. I loved the premovie, the fake elevator and the tunnel ride. I loved how when the movie was over it was like you were there. Epcot has slowly been butchering its rides. That's why I uploaded so many of the original lost songs so these won't be forgotten. Thank you for sharing this.
destroyahdes 2 years ago
I liked this attraction the way it was. Sure, it could have used a little updating, but this Nemo idea is terrible. I was heartbroken to take my kids on something that taught them NOTHING about our world, our oceans that need cared for so desperately.
Lilidarkstar 2 years ago 2
this is awesome!
masterj345 2 years ago
i wonder who the narrator is... i always digged the voice...lol
~BMW art car
bmdoublesyou 2 years ago
It's Sally Kellerman, I believe.
shadowfaqs 2 years ago
And it rained and rained and rained... and rained.
SheltonSEmmaS 3 years ago 11
...the deluge.
photogeek05 2 years ago 2
...that even people from Seattle were impressed.
SCE2AUX 2 years ago
lol
therealsimmer3 2 years ago
@SheltonSEmmaS ...the deluge
MissPickles1 11 months ago
one my favorite disney attractions..
RoundTableGroup 3 years ago
We welcome you to the Living Seas. We welcome you, to Sea Base Alpha.
CaptainHollyShort 3 years ago 3
Class rides disney has gotten rid of or changed=(
Horizons
That Mexican ride at Epcot not sure the name
The Living Seas
Space Ship Eearth
whats next that greenhouse ride featuring a bugs life LOL
taurenspwn 3 years ago
I miss the feeling of adventure when we walked into the Living Seas. You felt as though the sea was mysterious and you were going to uncover the mysteries of the ocean.
greenhat16 4 years ago 8
absolutely. I totally agree. It's so sad that they have to go and ruin things like this. They could have just tweaked it a bit, but they completely canned the entire thing. EPCOT isn't supposed to be all about disney characters, it's supposed to appeal to adults, too. That's what this ride WAS. So sad.
trueblue1217 3 years ago 3
I agree as well.
Strange thing is though, I really like the way EPCOT is today but at the same time, I miss the way it was setup up back then.
CAPTSCRU33Y 3 years ago
It certainly is good business...but the fact remains that it's still a very poor attraction that's just had Nemo bumper stickers slapped on it. It could have been a lot better. It just needed a bit more...what's the word...ah, imagination!
rhynobeast 4 years ago
Not really. Some people want a break from the manufactured non-stop imagination and want to enjoy something interesting like the Living Seas. Turtle Talk with Crush was fine; at least the people who wanted to enjoy The Living Seas had the rest of the pavilion, and the kids had a kids' ride. Now it's just a big kids' ride. Nothing left for people that enjoyed not being bombarded by Nemo every second they are there. Oh, and no more awesome preshow.
CaptainHollyShort 3 years ago
If people were actually interested in Epcot and all it offered, none of the major changes would have happened. Look at Magic Kingdom, more than 25 years and remains barely fixed. Epcot on the other hand needed a change, people weren't going, kids were getting bored.
I miss the Living Seas as much as the next guy, but from a business standpoint Disney was extremely smart in using the Finding Nemo franchise to change The Living Seas.
ARodYankFan 4 years ago
Well, for every kid they gained, they probably got a ton of Epcot veterans to not go to the park. I honestly find myself hard pressed to enjoy the park anymore because the only good rides left are really Soarin and Test Track. Even Spaceship Earth took a hit.
CaptainHollyShort 3 years ago
A HUGE hit.
TheNilvarg 3 years ago
I agree from the business standpoint. But, EPCOT was also very educational without advertising as such. I credit EPCOT with shaping part of my decision process on what I wanted to do when I got older. Seriously. But it seems young people today are a different breed.....attention spans are shorter...and well I'll stop there.
eraufool 11 months ago
It's such a monstrosity what they've done with this great attraction.
trueblue1217 4 years ago 2
Total shame, they got rid of the Nautilus model from 20,000 Leagues Under the Sea too. That was another reminder of a great past attraction torn to pieces.
rhynobeast 4 years ago
I have been to the Living Seas many times myself and really hate to see it go it is surely one of my favorites, especially the pre show movie, the new opening show is really great, and they did an excellent job on the effects. The real ride that needed no changing is Spaceship Earth, the new ride is terrible.
bobbafett666ta 4 years ago
They've had to dumb everything down so today's average moron will be entertained. Going with something they saw recently at the movies is the best route. Audiences aren't too keen on "edgamacation". Especially on vacation. This Nemo stuff probably helps keep fights from breaking out. I too weep for the old Living Seas.Five years from now they'll most likely show a film showcasing a 3D P Diddy cussing and firing a pistol much to the crowd's delight.
slobinski 4 years ago 2
The Living Seas was legendary. The Seas with Nemo and Friends...what were they thinking?!? No, seriously, what the hell was that?
I miss the old EPCOT. Living Seas, Horizons, Journey into Imagination, World in Motion, Wonders of Life...
rhynobeast 4 years ago
Nemo sucks!
I want my Living Seas back!
brunodale 4 years ago
I loved the old Seabase Alpha theme. I wish they'd kept it. Nemo is okay, but I liked Seabase Alpha better. This just continues the trend of Disney "dumbing-up" attractions to disguise that you might actually be learning something.
Sorria86 4 years ago
I just loved the surreal, mysterious theme to the original version of the Living Seas- preshow, hydrolaters, and all. I visited the new version, the Seas with Nemo, earlier this year, and it pretty much blows. Very babyish.
abkdisney 4 years ago
The submersible you see towards the end of the show is called the Johnson Sea Link and is owned by Harbor Branch Oceanographic (now part of Florida Atlantic University) in Fort Pierce, Florida. I work there now. The ocean is truly amazing. It is videos like this show us what otherwise we and our children may never see. Shame on EPCOT for falling for the lil kiddie trend of Finding Nemo.
coralthesquirrel 4 years ago
i love fish.
SPUNKdeFUNKay 4 years ago
When this attraction was good. The Preshow inspired me to study marine biology.
coralthesquirrel 4 years ago
I wish the folks at Disney could receive a document with stories like this one.
poodyglitz 4 years ago
I always liked that the last scene in the film, with the hydrolators) was actually in the next room
greenhat16 4 years ago
Man, I miss this... it's a shame that they decided to destroy the legacy of such an amazing pavillion by vandalizing it with the stupid "Fad of the Year" crap of Finding Nemo. They've done it on other rides with Lilo & Stitch before, and then with High School Musical.
It makes me sick.
TheNilvarg 5 years ago
The problem is lack of imagination and the fear of finding someone with it in abundance. Let's hope and pray that the New Guard of Jobs/Lasseter will change all of that.
poodyglitz 4 years ago
I can't believe the LS changed. I've been to Disney 14 times, the first when I was 2. I still remember my first trip to the LS 15 years later. It became my fav thing in all DW, and I knew my love of the LS would never end and its spot as my fav would never change.
Some things at Epcot changed, but I knew the LS would never leave. I even named my old swimming pool Sea Base Alpha. Screw you, whosever idea it was to change this great attraction.
netterg 5 years ago 2
In a way, it's our fault as a society. We've gotten away from learning; from being interested in being shown a new way. The excitement of learning has been turned into a lust for thrills and transient highs.
It's also The Disney Corporation's fault for neglecting Walt's philosophy of teaching while tickling the imagination. For ignoring the vision for EPCOT as a laboratory for effective urban planning.
poodyglitz 4 years ago
Exactly. You're absolutely right.
agravlin 4 years ago
You're so right. That's exactly what's been happening. I've had a lot of doubt about the company aknowledging Walt's EPCOT dream lately. Until now...Spaceship Earth is going to have some new innovations and the new Project: Tomorrow (the name says it all) presented by Siemens is a new source of hope to everyone who actually knows what EPCOT is about. The wand is down off of Spaceship Earth and new things besides the Nemo monstrosity are coming into play. At least there's some new hope.
rohirrim11rider 4 years ago
When you consider the reason for the development of things like the monorail and Peoplemover, it becomes apparent that they were part of an overall plan. That plan was to use these things to show possibilities of a better existence. To try and fulfill a practical need. Walt's passion for transportation and need to move people throughout the original park gave birth to those particular innovations (ie; Omnimover technology, hub layout for the park).
poodyglitz 4 years ago
There was an attraction at Disneyland called "Adventures Through Inner Space" that Walt oversaw. It was an entertaining dark ride that taught basic principles of molecules and atoms. It had a huge impact on kids of that time.
poodyglitz 4 years ago
I LOVE the Living Seas when I was two back in 1995. It was my favortie place in Epcot. Now its all about Nemo!! I HATE NEMO!! They ruined Walt's creations!! ugh!!
teenangel93 4 years ago
Anybody know who the narrator was? She had an awesome voice. I really miss the old living seas setup. The new format is way too cheesy and meant for kids. Just another example of how Disney is slowly ruining Epcot Center!
darthgrady 5 years ago
I totally agree. I grew up going to Disney World and I always loved Epcot. When I was little I really hated all the movies but as I got older I grew to love them, and now that I haven't been there in six years, I miss them! And they're all gone! It's so sad!
WhiteLadyoftheRing 5 years ago
They are ruining EPCOT Center. They're taking all the education and magic out of it, replacing the wonderful family-oriented World Fair style with fluffy childrens' crap.
TheNilvarg 5 years ago 2
The least they could have done was to keep the hydrolators and to re-theme them for the new ride. The way they have the Living Seas now is almost a joke. At least they got Mission Space done right, finally.
Azusa109 4 years ago
Yep, it sure is a joke. So much for Walt's vision.
agravlin 4 years ago
That vision was basically an attempt to meet the needs of society in practical and creative ways. To meet the needs of human beings that would improve the Human Condition. These days, such a notion is not respected. Research and development are dirty words to the bean counters.
poodyglitz 4 years ago
I'm starting to believe that it will eventually become Pixar Center.
poodyglitz 3 years ago
Yep. Spaceship Earth - FEATURING BUZZ LIGHTYEAR!
TheNilvarg 3 years ago
Well said
luisrox94 3 years ago
I don't think it will come to that because they still have the countries.
mcog2006 3 years ago
...for now.
poodyglitz 3 years ago
She sounds like Sally Kellerman.
poodyglitz 4 years ago
i miss this movie. i miss all the movies at epcot.
747pictures 5 years ago