@Dimitri0809 It's not quite that simple. Are legs target? If so, are they target for both opponents? And do you keep right-of-way? I believe we did away with right-of-way and had target as legs and up for both opponents.
I'm just saying the electronic point system would be better if it were in use because you would be able to tell whether or not who made contact with their sword first.
@Dimitri0809 Ahhh, yes. Very true. We did not have boxes set up at that time. I'm thinking we should do a 2nd video. This vid was done years ago, and we could make it much more interesting. Any suggestions on what rules to follow?
@Egladhon I think you ought to have the Sabre fencer follow sabre rules and have the epee fencer follow epee rules; so the epeeist would be aiming for the Sabre(-ist?)'s whole body, while the Sabre wielder has the advantage of more brute strength and a heavier sword.
@thefearlessT There's no real good way to do it. If I did as you asked, the saber fencer would be forced to defend against an attack to his legs which there's no parry for in sport-saber.
@sjking92 I've actually fenced in the North American Cup where they will say "on guard…ready…fence." But yes, often times it is done in French, which we can say, but oh well. We're not French.
What I want to see most is a fencer facing a viking sword and shield. The shielder would win most every time, for obvious reasons. Still, I'd like to see how the fight plays out. A light stabbing sword vs a shield and heavy hacking blade (there is a difference between hacking and cutting swords, cutting swords are usually curved while hacking are straight, cutting is better against flesh while hacking is better against armor) would be an interesting bout.
@demomanchaos There is no such thing as a "hacking" blade. The power of a cutting weapon is usually dependent on the balance point. Curved weapons worked against different types of armour. As for whether a light stabbing sword (like a rapier) would win against a sword and shield combo, it depends largely on what armour both are wearing but most of all the swordsman. It is the swordsman, not the sword that most likely determines the bout.
@Egladhon Sabers are for cutting flesh, longswords are for hacking into armor and delivering blunt force through it to cause their damage. There is a difference between hacking and cutting. Axes hack, razors cut. You want cutting against softer targets like flesh and light armor, but tougher targets like heavy armor you want to hack. The motions during the swing are far different. You draw the blade across you target when you cut, you hit straight on when you hack.
@demomanchaos Sabers were military weapons that came along after the bastard sword (or longsword). Longswords were not designed to "hack" into armour. I can tell you that as plate armour became more popular, the weapons changed to become more cut-and-thrust. Thus, swords that were most effective against full-body plate mail armour were more conducive to stabbing as well.
@demomanchaos Also, I can tell you as a fencer and swordsman who has used saber, smallsword, dueling swords, two-handers, rapiers and longswords, that you always move straight towards your target. A good saber fencer will tell you that your fist mimics a punching motion as you move straight toward your target for the cut. As for how far through your target you aim, that depends on other factors like armour.
Is this test even necessary? Isn't it obvious that the saber would rape? lol. still a good vid.
btw- somebody needs to tell the guy fencing saber to reduce his arm movements by about 1000%. look at 0:50. even if he's going for a beat, it doesn't need to be *that* strong.
@kevinthemathgeek This test was done years ago. As we've done multiple tests as our skill levels have improved, I can honestly say that the one who usually wins is the one who's the overall better fencer. Sabre can beat epee and vice versa, any day. But this was still fun to do.
can someone please explain to me, which sword was used for what ? i 'm new to this. i can't tell the difference ? which is heavier , what moments are used ? in history who used them ?
@pdannysan13 Both are sport weapons. The epee, however, is balanced to most resemble a dueling sword (for civilians), and the rules of the game (no right of way) reflect that.The weapons can be found in the 17th century up through the 19th depending on region. I should also note that "epee" just means "sword". The cup guard that you see was especially popular with Spanish weapons.
Sabre is military. The ones you see here are lighter than most cavalry sabres. Legs are off-target in that.
Well, in this case, you could have had both fencers with epee and simply limit the target to waist up. I don't believe that there is an advantage of having one of the fencers fencing with saber. Bottom line: the title of this video is misleading.
...Theatrical staged "Rapier"-dueling (i.e. Romeo & Juliet) are Epee/smallswords with Rapier-like Cup and Gavigliano-fake ricasso inside (epee-bladed, triangular). If detailed is requested, they simply add a terminal part/edge as if it were a rapier-like blade (with edges). For example, Zorro fencing is basically Epee fencing with a fashionable Rapier-styled Cup. But the quickness is due to the smallsword construction of the actual steel "blade".
I think much of confusion is emerging just because of definition of term "Rapier". Early rapier were heavy, deriving in blacksmiths art from broadswords. But re-introduced after long-dagger/Roman gladius era the basic idea of Thrusting. Later "Rapiers", lighter and quick, were of course evolution to the smallsword, light and quick. Modern Epee is as long as Old Rapier, as light as Neo-Classic Smallsword.
Are you saying that an epee is slower than an actual duelling weapon, or slower than a foil?
I trained in foil before switching to epee because my coach insisted. That broke my habit of always trying to stop hit. Later, I did epee in tournaments but sometimes trained with foil. I noticed how foilists leave their heads and legs open when they lunge.
IMO foil trains bad fencing. This is due to both the target areas and the rules of right-of-way. I've found that my foil training has done damage to my rapier fencing. That's why I've switched primarily to epee. Still, I think simultaneous hits should not count in epee (as in kendo). In real fighting simultaneous hits can mean two dead idiots.
Foil fencing with post-2005 time settings became neat and truly swordplay-ish. You underestimate what modern sport fencing is - it's the essentials of fencing with sharp blades turned into sport. Epee is the essence of duelling - drawing the first blood. Foil, on the contrary is about the delivery of a safe, lethal thrust. That's not bad at all. Ignoring double hits leads nowhere, there are many ways to use it to ones advantage.
The sport sabre is a toy that could not inflict meaningful damage on an opponent with the blade.
My understanding is that the epee developed as a duelling weapon where the object was to draw first blood. A well-placed thrust could kill a man, but the sport developed out of this less-lethal duelling convention.
As a matter of geometry, the point has a better reach than the blade. Additionally, a man pointing a sabre will present a target along the radius because there is a smaller guard.
If the distance is closed, a slashing weapon becomes more useful and a dagger of some sort is particularly useful. With an epee, you would either beat a hasty retreat in defence, or attack by moving corps-a-corps and then dropping low to the ground thrusting upwards or reaching as high as possible and thrusting downwards.
Chopping weapons need weight to do damage, but heavy weapons are slow. In a one-on-one confrontation without armour, a light thrusting weapon is superior.
With olympic fencing weapons? Sabre wins all the time, it's the lightest and the fastest weapon of all three. With historical weapons - rapier owns all ;)
perhaps because this sabreur fences like it was his first time with a sabre in his hand? Oh c'mon, his footwork sucks donkey balls and he moves his sword wielding arm just as if he had tetanus or something.. I know that they were just having fun but this bout is hardly reliable as a source of oppinion about the sabre so... SABRE!
Well jbujko, I fence both weapons, and we've had bouts in our club with coaches fencing sabre vs. epee. The one who wins tends to be the one who understands both weapons best.
Oh, and as for rapier, I fence rapier, but if you give me a dagger and buckler, beating a rapier fencer isn't too difficult.
As always - the fastest one wins. However the olympic sabre gives the advantage of speed because its almost half the weight of an olympic epee. With the possibility to perform quick slashes that count as a point and without the accuracy that an epee demands, the sabre allows even a mediocre fencer with a sabre to beat a skilled fencer wit an epee. And about what you've written about rapiers - I see that you've had contact only with, I don't know, legless rapier fencers?
Legless rapier fencers. No. I'm just speaking from experience in our club. Both my coach and I do well if we have daggers and if our opponents have rapiers. It's not that difficult as long as the quillons allow a good bind.
When it comes to olympic sabre versus olympic epee, if the epeeist is using a french grip and has good reaction (which epee does tend to instill in its practitioners) the sabreur is at a disadvantage due to the epeeist's longer reach, plus the epeeist can also attack the leg and hand. or fleche. but i don't think any epeeist really wants to fleche against a sabreur...
First of all - the sabre has the same reach as the epee, the blades are of the same lenght. Secondly - If You're mixing weapons then the valid target area should be the same and so should be the rules of the bout (permission to perform a fleche for a sabreur). Besides - sabre is lighter and faster than the epee
The big difference is not just in the target areas but also in the right-of-way rules. That totally changes the flavour of the contest. Sabre and foil have essentially the same rules in that respect. A foilist can pick up a sabre and give a good showing using only the point.
I'm just speculating but, it seems to me that the right-of-way rules were developed for two reasons: 1) to instill a parry-riposte mentality and 2) as a method to judge the hits because the weapons are so damn fast.
But you are aware that with a french grip on epee you can hold it at the pommel end, giving you an inch or two extra length compared to pistol grip wich gives you the same reach as a sabre?
the lengths of the blades depend on what size blade your using and the pommel grip can have advantages except its its very easy to beat attack or parry the blade
What good is speed if you have bad timing or sense of distance, sloppy footwork, and ignorance of strategy and tactics? Don't get me wrong, speed is not unimportant. There are a large number of factors involved and emphasizing just one is folly.
that's why I love my fencing class, because my instructors emphasize things like footwork, accuracy, and basically everything else that people seem to ignore during bouts. I fence saber BTW
Dude, have You ever had a rapier in Your hand before? The rapier, employed with a main gauche, has both the superior distance advantage and the close range advantage. There is no hand held blade that is more devastating in a duel without any armour. Only pole-arms are superior to rapier but they're not side-arms
Yes i have two, one Hanwei and an old spanish 17'th century rapier. I also have several small swords (the swords closest to Epee fencing swords) one new from cold steel two old Englis swords. I also have done Epee fencing for more than 20 years. I used to believe that the longer the rapier/pointed sword is, the better it is. But as your fencing skills improve having a lightweight balanced high quality epee with awerage length, is to preffer. However it needs more skills.
There is no close range advantage with a rapier and a gauche. If an epee (Small sword) or saber fencer gets behind the rapier, youre finished.
The rapier can have advantages agianst swords of it time. However as smithing skilles improved, the rapiers wanished and got replaced by small swords, and one hand sabers.
Sorry mate but what You've written here showed me that Your knowledge abut fencing is almost non-existent. Post some vids, prove Your skill and then we'll talk. Geez.. To get behind a fencer with a rapier and a main gauche.. It's a hoot
The final period of the rapier is called the 'transitional' period, which lasted from about 1650 to 1680. This marked the shift into fighting in double time. Rapiers became shorter and lighter; the off hand weapon was abandoned in favor of the parry-riposte; and the cup-hilt became common.
The rapier was replaced by the smallsword, a very light weapon designed for fast double time fighting. Double time = parry-riposte,
I am not saying that the small sword is superior in anyway. Just that longer is better and that a dagger/gauche is a superior defence, is a myth. Many of the old masters points this out. "New Method of Fencing", c.1708, by Sir William Hope and
"Comprehnsion of destreza", by De la Vega.
Remember the rapier fencer might have is blade grabbed or pushed aside by the epee/small sword/saber fencer (with he's free hand or blade). The gauche/dagger is a bad deffence against a small sword.
I am not saying that the small sword is superior in anyway. Just that longer is better and that a dagger / gauche is a superior deffence, is a myth. Many of the old masters points this out. "New method of fencing" 1708 by Sir William Hope and "Comprehnsion of destreza" by De la Vega. Remember the rapier fencer might have he's blade grabbed or pushed aside by the small sword/ court sword or saber fencer (With he's free hand or a parry). The gauche dagger is a bad deffence against a small sword.
I have a significant amount of respect for epeeists. I see the bruises and the mind games that take place on the strip (that has a timer), so don't think I hate on it when I say that sabretakes an amazing amount of skill, as well. Any epeeist could get on the strip and "flail," but making split-second decisions while keeping the offensive with a crapload of right of way rules takes talent. People who say "EPEE!" should make it a point to have a few bouts with an experienced sabreist first.
Just use the electronic system to tell whether or not these two swordsman have made contact with their swords..
Dimitri0809 3 months ago
@Dimitri0809 It's not quite that simple. Are legs target? If so, are they target for both opponents? And do you keep right-of-way? I believe we did away with right-of-way and had target as legs and up for both opponents.
Egladhon 3 months ago
@Egladhon
I'm just saying the electronic point system would be better if it were in use because you would be able to tell whether or not who made contact with their sword first.
Dimitri0809 3 months ago
@Dimitri0809 Ahhh, yes. Very true. We did not have boxes set up at that time. I'm thinking we should do a 2nd video. This vid was done years ago, and we could make it much more interesting. Any suggestions on what rules to follow?
Egladhon 3 months ago
@Egladhon I think you ought to have the Sabre fencer follow sabre rules and have the epee fencer follow epee rules; so the epeeist would be aiming for the Sabre(-ist?)'s whole body, while the Sabre wielder has the advantage of more brute strength and a heavier sword.
thefearlessT 2 months ago
@thefearlessT There's no real good way to do it. If I did as you asked, the saber fencer would be forced to defend against an attack to his legs which there's no parry for in sport-saber.
Egladhon 2 months ago
@Egladhon true, I apologize for my mistake.
thefearlessT 2 months ago
@thefearlessT Was that a classful and legitimate apology on the internet? I applaud you, sir. That sort of thing is rare. Completely made my day.
KingMakerRook 2 months ago
@KingMakerRook I do believe that it was xD glad I made your day.
thefearlessT 1 month ago
1 guy got the arm, 1 guy got the head. the guy that got the arm wont be getting out of bed.
MedievalNerd411 6 months ago
0:24. 1 guy got arm, 1 guy got neck. the round gos to the 1 that cut the others head off
MedievalNerd411 6 months ago
"You ready?" "Fence"
REALLY GUYS?! Facepalm.jpg
sjking92 7 months ago
@sjking92 I've actually fenced in the North American Cup where they will say "on guard…ready…fence." But yes, often times it is done in French, which we can say, but oh well. We're not French.
Egladhon 2 months ago
i wanna swordfight with u guys, lemme whip out my... oh, wrong website.
secutorclaudius 7 months ago
What I want to see most is a fencer facing a viking sword and shield. The shielder would win most every time, for obvious reasons. Still, I'd like to see how the fight plays out. A light stabbing sword vs a shield and heavy hacking blade (there is a difference between hacking and cutting swords, cutting swords are usually curved while hacking are straight, cutting is better against flesh while hacking is better against armor) would be an interesting bout.
demomanchaos 7 months ago
@demomanchaos There is no such thing as a "hacking" blade. The power of a cutting weapon is usually dependent on the balance point. Curved weapons worked against different types of armour. As for whether a light stabbing sword (like a rapier) would win against a sword and shield combo, it depends largely on what armour both are wearing but most of all the swordsman. It is the swordsman, not the sword that most likely determines the bout.
Egladhon 7 months ago 5
@Egladhon Sabers are for cutting flesh, longswords are for hacking into armor and delivering blunt force through it to cause their damage. There is a difference between hacking and cutting. Axes hack, razors cut. You want cutting against softer targets like flesh and light armor, but tougher targets like heavy armor you want to hack. The motions during the swing are far different. You draw the blade across you target when you cut, you hit straight on when you hack.
demomanchaos 7 months ago
@demomanchaos Sabers were military weapons that came along after the bastard sword (or longsword). Longswords were not designed to "hack" into armour. I can tell you that as plate armour became more popular, the weapons changed to become more cut-and-thrust. Thus, swords that were most effective against full-body plate mail armour were more conducive to stabbing as well.
Egladhon 7 months ago
@demomanchaos Also, I can tell you as a fencer and swordsman who has used saber, smallsword, dueling swords, two-handers, rapiers and longswords, that you always move straight towards your target. A good saber fencer will tell you that your fist mimics a punching motion as you move straight toward your target for the cut. As for how far through your target you aim, that depends on other factors like armour.
Egladhon 7 months ago
If they had to apply their respective right of ways, epee would have an advantage. could easily fleche for the win.
DarkSunGod 8 months ago
lol I love it. I want to fence with you guys :). It would be interesting to see who wins if only one lights are counted.
lnoagkois 9 months ago
Is this test even necessary? Isn't it obvious that the saber would rape? lol. still a good vid.
btw- somebody needs to tell the guy fencing saber to reduce his arm movements by about 1000%. look at 0:50. even if he's going for a beat, it doesn't need to be *that* strong.
kevinthemathgeek 9 months ago
@kevinthemathgeek This test was done years ago. As we've done multiple tests as our skill levels have improved, I can honestly say that the one who usually wins is the one who's the overall better fencer. Sabre can beat epee and vice versa, any day. But this was still fun to do.
Egladhon 9 months ago
@kevinthemathgeek with no right of way, parry and riposte, who knows?
chwuwd 9 months ago
Why is the saber fencer wearing shorts? =(
kyoko277 11 months ago
at 0:24 was that a really stretched out flash attack?
Manaphyfreak123 1 year ago
3 kids thinks that a sword fight would be a medieval battle
alextheanonymous 1 year ago
can someone please explain to me, which sword was used for what ? i 'm new to this. i can't tell the difference ? which is heavier , what moments are used ? in history who used them ?
pdannysan13 1 year ago
@pdannysan13 Both are sport weapons. The epee, however, is balanced to most resemble a dueling sword (for civilians), and the rules of the game (no right of way) reflect that.The weapons can be found in the 17th century up through the 19th depending on region. I should also note that "epee" just means "sword". The cup guard that you see was especially popular with Spanish weapons.
Sabre is military. The ones you see here are lighter than most cavalry sabres. Legs are off-target in that.
Egladhon 1 year ago 6
i used to go there
theswordsman09 1 year ago
well, if the Sabre fencer would use their weapon like an epee, then Sabre would win because of the ability to cut (whip).
he110me 1 year ago
I've done a 15 person sabre vs. Epee vs. Foil match, we had everyone spread out across the room. It was insane.
Electricninjafish 2 years ago
don't understand a point of this bout. are they fencing using epee rules or saber rules?
Stan4ik75 2 years ago
We compromised. No right of way, so epee rules there, but target is waist and higher, following sabre rules.
Egladhon 2 years ago
Well, in this case, you could have had both fencers with epee and simply limit the target to waist up. I don't believe that there is an advantage of having one of the fencers fencing with saber. Bottom line: the title of this video is misleading.
Stan4ik75 2 years ago
still rather have a gun
thorsmitersaw 2 years ago
dude now that was funny you get 21 swag points for that.
GatameOne 2 years ago
Pft, guns are for pussies :P
TheMindIsPoison 2 years ago 23
no. they are for those of us in the 21st century. but have fun swinging your pointy clubs
thorsmitersaw 2 years ago
@TheMindIsPoison
I agree, I find sword fighting more fun than using guns.
Dimitri0809 11 months ago
...Theatrical staged "Rapier"-dueling (i.e. Romeo & Juliet) are Epee/smallswords with Rapier-like Cup and Gavigliano-fake ricasso inside (epee-bladed, triangular). If detailed is requested, they simply add a terminal part/edge as if it were a rapier-like blade (with edges). For example, Zorro fencing is basically Epee fencing with a fashionable Rapier-styled Cup. But the quickness is due to the smallsword construction of the actual steel "blade".
antonioeduardo617 2 years ago
Actually, the small sword is named so because of the size of guard, not blade.
Egladhon 2 years ago
I think much of confusion is emerging just because of definition of term "Rapier". Early rapier were heavy, deriving in blacksmiths art from broadswords. But re-introduced after long-dagger/Roman gladius era the basic idea of Thrusting. Later "Rapiers", lighter and quick, were of course evolution to the smallsword, light and quick. Modern Epee is as long as Old Rapier, as light as Neo-Classic Smallsword.
antonioeduardo617 2 years ago
Are you saying that an epee is slower than an actual duelling weapon, or slower than a foil?
I trained in foil before switching to epee because my coach insisted. That broke my habit of always trying to stop hit. Later, I did epee in tournaments but sometimes trained with foil. I noticed how foilists leave their heads and legs open when they lunge.
66Scorpio 3 years ago
IMO foil trains bad fencing. This is due to both the target areas and the rules of right-of-way. I've found that my foil training has done damage to my rapier fencing. That's why I've switched primarily to epee. Still, I think simultaneous hits should not count in epee (as in kendo). In real fighting simultaneous hits can mean two dead idiots.
PissedFechtmeister 2 years ago
Foil fencing with post-2005 time settings became neat and truly swordplay-ish. You underestimate what modern sport fencing is - it's the essentials of fencing with sharp blades turned into sport. Epee is the essence of duelling - drawing the first blood. Foil, on the contrary is about the delivery of a safe, lethal thrust. That's not bad at all. Ignoring double hits leads nowhere, there are many ways to use it to ones advantage.
jbujko 2 years ago
Foil trains you to parry-riposte. It is good training as long as you don't give in to the "game" of right of way and such.
66Scorpio 2 years ago
The sport sabre is a toy that could not inflict meaningful damage on an opponent with the blade.
My understanding is that the epee developed as a duelling weapon where the object was to draw first blood. A well-placed thrust could kill a man, but the sport developed out of this less-lethal duelling convention.
As a matter of geometry, the point has a better reach than the blade. Additionally, a man pointing a sabre will present a target along the radius because there is a smaller guard.
66Scorpio 3 years ago
If the distance is closed, a slashing weapon becomes more useful and a dagger of some sort is particularly useful. With an epee, you would either beat a hasty retreat in defence, or attack by moving corps-a-corps and then dropping low to the ground thrusting upwards or reaching as high as possible and thrusting downwards.
Chopping weapons need weight to do damage, but heavy weapons are slow. In a one-on-one confrontation without armour, a light thrusting weapon is superior.
66Scorpio 3 years ago
i think you're just saying that because you watched die another day
Supertomiman 2 years ago
Epee always beats sabre because while the sabre fencer is going for targets waist up the epeeist can hit his leg or thigh.
TheFencer8089 3 years ago
FOIL FTW!!!!!
TheFencer8089 3 years ago
With olympic fencing weapons? Sabre wins all the time, it's the lightest and the fastest weapon of all three. With historical weapons - rapier owns all ;)
jbujko 3 years ago
Well, as you can see, sabre didn't win this round.
Egladhon 3 years ago
perhaps because this sabreur fences like it was his first time with a sabre in his hand? Oh c'mon, his footwork sucks donkey balls and he moves his sword wielding arm just as if he had tetanus or something.. I know that they were just having fun but this bout is hardly reliable as a source of oppinion about the sabre so... SABRE!
jbujko 3 years ago
Well jbujko, I fence both weapons, and we've had bouts in our club with coaches fencing sabre vs. epee. The one who wins tends to be the one who understands both weapons best.
Oh, and as for rapier, I fence rapier, but if you give me a dagger and buckler, beating a rapier fencer isn't too difficult.
Egladhon 3 years ago
As always - the fastest one wins. However the olympic sabre gives the advantage of speed because its almost half the weight of an olympic epee. With the possibility to perform quick slashes that count as a point and without the accuracy that an epee demands, the sabre allows even a mediocre fencer with a sabre to beat a skilled fencer wit an epee. And about what you've written about rapiers - I see that you've had contact only with, I don't know, legless rapier fencers?
jbujko 3 years ago
Legless rapier fencers. No. I'm just speaking from experience in our club. Both my coach and I do well if we have daggers and if our opponents have rapiers. It's not that difficult as long as the quillons allow a good bind.
Egladhon 3 years ago
When it comes to olympic sabre versus olympic epee, if the epeeist is using a french grip and has good reaction (which epee does tend to instill in its practitioners) the sabreur is at a disadvantage due to the epeeist's longer reach, plus the epeeist can also attack the leg and hand. or fleche. but i don't think any epeeist really wants to fleche against a sabreur...
yuso619 3 years ago
First of all - the sabre has the same reach as the epee, the blades are of the same lenght. Secondly - If You're mixing weapons then the valid target area should be the same and so should be the rules of the bout (permission to perform a fleche for a sabreur). Besides - sabre is lighter and faster than the epee
jbujko 3 years ago
The big difference is not just in the target areas but also in the right-of-way rules. That totally changes the flavour of the contest. Sabre and foil have essentially the same rules in that respect. A foilist can pick up a sabre and give a good showing using only the point.
I'm just speculating but, it seems to me that the right-of-way rules were developed for two reasons: 1) to instill a parry-riposte mentality and 2) as a method to judge the hits because the weapons are so damn fast.
66Scorpio 3 years ago
But you are aware that with a french grip on epee you can hold it at the pommel end, giving you an inch or two extra length compared to pistol grip wich gives you the same reach as a sabre?
And the sabre is 105cm, the epee 110.
itzavision 2 years ago
the lengths of the blades depend on what size blade your using and the pommel grip can have advantages except its its very easy to beat attack or parry the blade
angrywhiteflag 1 year ago
To try to reduce the art of fencing to "the fastest one wins" is simply absurd.
PissedFechtmeister 2 years ago
And why is that? Fencing with sharp blades relies on "the fastest one wins"..
jbujko 2 years ago
What good is speed if you have bad timing or sense of distance, sloppy footwork, and ignorance of strategy and tactics? Don't get me wrong, speed is not unimportant. There are a large number of factors involved and emphasizing just one is folly.
PissedFechtmeister 2 years ago
that's why I love my fencing class, because my instructors emphasize things like footwork, accuracy, and basically everything else that people seem to ignore during bouts. I fence saber BTW
lovefordante 1 year ago
No, the rapier is to long and heavy.
It's a myth that the rapier it's superior.
The epee is perhaps the most agile weapon, but has some weekneses at very close range, and that it can get stuck in the target.
ugle99 3 years ago
Dude, have You ever had a rapier in Your hand before? The rapier, employed with a main gauche, has both the superior distance advantage and the close range advantage. There is no hand held blade that is more devastating in a duel without any armour. Only pole-arms are superior to rapier but they're not side-arms
jbujko 3 years ago
Yes i have two, one Hanwei and an old spanish 17'th century rapier. I also have several small swords (the swords closest to Epee fencing swords) one new from cold steel two old Englis swords. I also have done Epee fencing for more than 20 years. I used to believe that the longer the rapier/pointed sword is, the better it is. But as your fencing skills improve having a lightweight balanced high quality epee with awerage length, is to preffer. However it needs more skills.
ugle99 3 years ago
There is no close range advantage with a rapier and a gauche. If an epee (Small sword) or saber fencer gets behind the rapier, youre finished.
The rapier can have advantages agianst swords of it time. However as smithing skilles improved, the rapiers wanished and got replaced by small swords, and one hand sabers.
ugle99 3 years ago
Sorry mate but what You've written here showed me that Your knowledge abut fencing is almost non-existent. Post some vids, prove Your skill and then we'll talk. Geez.. To get behind a fencer with a rapier and a main gauche.. It's a hoot
jbujko 3 years ago
The final period of the rapier is called the 'transitional' period, which lasted from about 1650 to 1680. This marked the shift into fighting in double time. Rapiers became shorter and lighter; the off hand weapon was abandoned in favor of the parry-riposte; and the cup-hilt became common.
The rapier was replaced by the smallsword, a very light weapon designed for fast double time fighting. Double time = parry-riposte,
as two distinct movements.
the rapier is to heavey to do this.
ugle99 3 years ago
I am not saying that the small sword is superior in anyway. Just that longer is better and that a dagger/gauche is a superior defence, is a myth. Many of the old masters points this out. "New Method of Fencing", c.1708, by Sir William Hope and
"Comprehnsion of destreza", by De la Vega.
Remember the rapier fencer might have is blade grabbed or pushed aside by the epee/small sword/saber fencer (with he's free hand or blade). The gauche/dagger is a bad deffence against a small sword.
ugle99 3 years ago
I am not saying that the small sword is superior in anyway. Just that longer is better and that a dagger / gauche is a superior deffence, is a myth. Many of the old masters points this out. "New method of fencing" 1708 by Sir William Hope and "Comprehnsion of destreza" by De la Vega. Remember the rapier fencer might have he's blade grabbed or pushed aside by the small sword/ court sword or saber fencer (With he's free hand or a parry). The gauche dagger is a bad deffence against a small sword.
ugle99 3 years ago
SABRE
BuffaloSabres304 3 years ago
Épée!
jlorenow 3 years ago
Epee!!!!!
jeyerd 3 years ago
I have a significant amount of respect for epeeists. I see the bruises and the mind games that take place on the strip (that has a timer), so don't think I hate on it when I say that sabretakes an amazing amount of skill, as well. Any epeeist could get on the strip and "flail," but making split-second decisions while keeping the offensive with a crapload of right of way rules takes talent. People who say "EPEE!" should make it a point to have a few bouts with an experienced sabreist first.
ok2bPsycho 3 years ago
i have been cut and got a scab in sabre
bioniclekiller999 3 years ago
epee, nuff said
waelthassan 3 years ago
Epee
s4berfencer 3 years ago
Epee
s4berfencer 3 years ago
épée is so much better... search your feelings. You know it to be true
frenchie16000 4 years ago
Epee!
GuranAnka 4 years ago
saber ftw!!!2
unicornlad 4 years ago