Another Problem is the Gas inpingement, spraying dirty gas all over the internals. I dont understand why eugene stoner didnt design that system in a way where the gas tube, at all time, is covered by the carrier key so no gas leaks out. Off course, the bolt would move much more violently, but that can be prevented by making the gas-hole smaller so less pressure is built up.
Well, was thinking about something like this indeed. But would either require a heavily modified much longer carrier key or some sort of valve at the end of the gas tube, which shuts off, when it is coming out of the carrier key.
Would make it more complicated and the dirt would still get into the bolt carrier.
I've owned a Swiss PE90 based civilian semi-auto. Believe it or not it's non-restricted in Canada but was banned for years in the USA as a Sig550 assault rifle. Crazy. It used a piston system that is similar to what some companies have added to the AR platform, HK416 for example. I like the evolution of the AR but with the short stroke piston I'd trust my life to it. Without the piston Swissarms Classic Green.
This guy sounds German and as we all know Germans are poor engineers. No wait that is the British, I do not understand all of what is said/written there are some terminology errors but, Good point. Informative and gives one something to think about, thanks.
@hedonistic1979 the Germans are some of the best engineers throughout history. German firearms are expensive for a reason, they are the best. Models that get assembled outside of Germany are not quite as good IMO. That's why my SIG P226 says "Made in W. Germany" on it and features no useless rail or picatinny mount.
@14goldmedals That was sarcasm, your Sig was engineered by the Swedes or the Swiss I forget witch. At the time they partnered with the Germans to build it because of their export laws. Yea the American built Sigs are not as good that is why mine is also German. The rail is not useless when I was a dog handler it was great when I needed a gun a light and had a dog on leash. Unless you have a dog a shield or are on an entry team rails are just tacti-cool.
@hedonistic1979 given your examples I would agree with "your" need for a rail. For me it's just one less edge to snag coming out of the holster. In my life if I end up in a shoot/no shoot situation it's gonna be up close and no light required. And you do have the tacti-cool sales pitch figured out perfectly. Tactical, Sniper, Entry, 3 words that sell anything to wannabes.
@14goldmedals I am a usetobe I have been out of the military for four years now I have a glock with a rail because without was not an option, I have no plans to hang anything on the rail. Hand held lights are the way to go for those of not on SWAT or in Special Forces.
@hedonistic1979 thank you Sir for your previous service to your country and well earned "usetobe" status. I hope you don't mind me using that moniker, it's catchy! I'm what you would call a usetobe Cst. lol
@14goldmedals CST? I am proud to be a usetobe preferred to has-been and far better than a wannabe. I am a security guard for the Army we have a wannabe has never been trainer. A man who knows it and is not afraid to make it up. That is the type I despise loathe and detest. To give you an idea this arisoft warrior was nearly kicked out of an Army SRT course for not only trying to teach the class but tiring to tell decelerated combat veterans he knows better.
@hedonistic1979 if you read any of my posts on youtube regarding airsoft they're pretty much the same. "Airsoft fags should stop wasting youtube's bandwidth, non-gun owners don't get it and don't care. Gun owners wish you'd fall on your rubber bayonets lol. You give real gun owners a bad name." And kids that post video game dog fights or combat missions need a serious bitch slap too.
AR-15s are too picky of a weapon system, thats why I dont like them. I will always be an AK fan boy. Ive built two of them, and my dream project will be an AK-105. As soon as I draw up the funds and necessary press tool for it. Too bad the Army makes me use their shitty M-4s. :-(
@suckyalaterhead now you know what the serations on the bolt's sides are for. In the field the prepared grunt grates a little fresh parmesan cheese over his spaghetti MRE then cleans the weapon before sitting down to chow. Not really, but really.
You are right my friend it is a minor flaw in the AR15 design and everybody here thats posting stupid comments obviously haven't been to combat so they don't know how it affects the weapon during prolong firing and rugged terrains with alot of debris. The solution is simple buy a POF roller cam pin. It's round and there's no friction what so ever and it will never get stuck !
Thanks! The roller cam pin - I referred to it in the description to this video - came out May 2009 IIRC, about 8 months after this video was published and got some nasty bashing...
@troubleshooterBerlin, I tried to recreate this jam in my Pof415 and Dpms 16" bull barrel Ar15 rifles. Neither one jam this way. Which leads me to believe the phosphate coating ( or the coating that makes them not stick, Teflon is also used) is worn out. You can replace the cam pin on the rifle you show in video for 5 dollars. In other words it is meant to be replaced after so many round like the oil in your car. Ar platform is advanced and with that comes responsibility. Also lube it.
Give me about an hour with an AK or any other firearm and i can make an equally absurd video demonstrating "non issues" like this to convince people the weapon is a useless piece of junk.
In actuality nothing this guys shows in this video is an actual problem.
I don't have this issue with my Rock River Arms 20 inch AR15 (m16) or even my cheap DPMs Panther ap4 (m4 style). What manufacturer is your rifle and what year was it made?
At any rate this is a poorly made and overly opinionated video that shows nothing what so ever.
I wouldn't own an AR15 if you paid me to take it. The one exception I would make would be so I could make a video of me exploiting this pathetic weapon's every weakness for fun and for....well, mainly for fun with an eye to educational.
I love how a guy like you would be so bold and quick to call a design that has been so widely used by some of the best militaries in the world for over 40 years as "pathetic." that in and of itself shows that your knowledge in the firearms world is...well "pathetic"
You might need more gas pressure when using heavier buffer and/or buffer springs. Both would give you more momentum for the bcg on the forward move. But I would simply try. As long as you don't experience short-stroking with your bcg the gas setting is ok.
EVERY ONE! start useing grease instead of liquid lube. That stuff sucks. i use wheel barring grease its cheap and has yet to ever dry up during use or when its stowed away.
I jus tried this same trick on my ar 15 and it didnt work. All though i did feel it starting to rub it did not stop the bolt. i even pushed on both the rear of the bolt assembly and on the bolt face very hard and that did not stop it. Im guessing different manufacturers have different tolerences. What is the brand and year of the ars your using? If its a colt then thats could be it. With all the research i've personally done, COLTS are the most unreliable ars. sorry colt fans just IMHO.
Colt the most unreliable? I'd like to hear more about this "research" that you claim to have done. What's your experience and background? Out of all the AR's I've owned (I run BCM's these days but have a 6920), and ones I've been around at the carbine classes I've attended, your claims are completely off base. I simply find the premise they are worse than Olympic Arms, DPMS, Bushmaster, etc. ludicrous.
@opmike343 well like i said IMHO which mean in my honest opinion because i was looking into buying one for myself and as i did my research through the internet and many many many MANY FORUMS i begin to realize that colts are very picky to different ammo and if you do not run brass through them they will most likely jam. every time i buy my bulk ammo online and read the bad reviews it seems to come mainly from colt users. i love the colt brand i just dont like their ars. look up 21century rifle.
@opmike343 i did not say i did military or scientific research. i did personal research. I am not military or police but i know what i like n dont like. now like i said it was my opinion and from a person like u claiming to have so much experience that shouldnt matter to you. i own a del-ton u can say its the worst gun in the world thats ok thats your opinion but i know its a great rifle. But what you probably dont know is that colts parts are not all made by colt.
@opmike343 del-ton the comp that makes my ar use to make parts for colt(bolt assembilies) if u did ur research u would know that. i dont know if this is still the case becuase i hear del-ton stopped giving colt there parts and began makeing there own rifles every piece. which means a good fit rifle with little play over a rifle put together from other comanies parts. if u do a reliablilty test with different ammos i will be the 1st to say i was wrong. S&Ws do it all the time and lwrc n many more
@opmike343 all the new and very reliable ar manufactures have learned the advantage of makeing all the parts themselves to have a tight fitting rifle. For the price u pay for a colt i would demand alot better. look up ar 15 torture tests there are not many colts that pop up. Remember just becuase the military uses them does not mean there the best. I am a young guy and i have even learned this early on.
@biggboysouth Military Engineering Standards, Procedures, Specifications and Quality Control/Root Cause Analysis are just some of the tools used by teams of Military & civilian Professional Engineers educated and specializing in weapons warfare. These guys make the decisions on what weapons to use in the military & why.
@biggboysouth also keep in mind, manufacturing, as in everything else is not perfect, some flaws are to be expected. Because one unit might be junk, does not mean the design itself is junk. Imperfect...sure, but not junk
@Alexn1067 Oh no i never ment to say the ar15 is junk, i was just trying to law out my personal oppinion of a certain manufacturer's version. i own an ar and there amazing rifles.
@opmike343 But like i said b4 this is all just in my personal opinion if u think they are the best then they are the best i disagree but that is why there are so many different manufacturers. Just one guys opinion vs. anothers thats what the world is built on.
for the piece that is creating the problem there is an easy fix you just gotta search websites for it. I dont know the name but their is a piece that fits ars where the top is not squared its actually a wheel that rotates.
Are you talking about the cam pin? POF has a "roller" unit, I believe. In any case, I haven't been able to replicate this "problem" with ANY of my AR's or my friend's rifles. We're all running bolts by LMT, Colt, BCM, or Daniel Defense. Without a larger sample size, it would be difficult to rule out the possibility that there's simply a manufacturing defect, or that his bolt, bolt carrier, cam pin, upper receiver, etc. is out of spec.
I did know M16 has problems but this seems to be really bad...
Ive worked with the AK5 and the main differences seem to be the size of the boltcarrier, that the boltcarrier dont have any parts that can come off due to forces while shooting and that the boltcarrier dont do any movement sideways inside the rifle.
The key of the AK5 is Simple as a brick and works.
I have put more than my fair share of rounds through quite a number of M16s and have never have a failure and I bet all the M16s I fired were older than me at time. Not matter which weapon system, close to 100% of operational failures is due to poor maintenance and cleaning. Also, the forward assist does absolutely nothing until the shooter pushes it to ensure the bolt is full forward and locked, it does nothing by itself.
M16 istn that unreliable. Ive seen an AK and M16 side to side comparison. The both guns where poured over with Sand and Dust, and after the First shot the AK jamed, because the Bolt allows Sand to get into the Trigger, which blocks the Mechanism th AK ajmed every time after 1-3 Shots, the M16 fired with no interruptions 5 Magazines and it was botherted io the sand 5 times
all they did was exploit the AK's one achilles heel. If the ak had the safety off then it would have performed flawlessly as well. I dare anyone to take an AR (or any weapon for that matter) and dump sand into an open receiver and see what happens.
oh oh i forgot to ask, if it was a roller cam, how do you rotate it? can you post vid of installing the pof roller cam? if i remember correctly, cam pins need be rotated.
"the AK design avoids this problem from the begining". i was seriously considering an AR, but now i may go with a mini-14 and invest my money in sighting it nicely....since i allready own an AK.
Thanks for the video and information. I think it depends on the Manufacture as whether their is a problem. Some Manufactures address this and some don't.
My M16A1 jammed several times when I was in the desert. This turned me off the whole platform.
You can ask all the guys killed by the hands of an M16 series of weapons over the years if there is a problem. Woops, they can't answer because they are dead.
@trueamerica75 people don't understand quality. my Bushmaster didn't jam until after 2000 rounds and it was due to improper cleaning (I let my brother borrow it and he sucks at taking care of guns).
Excellent demonstration. I've never actually seen the m16 method of rotating the bolt lugs and can say I'm not very impressed with it after seeing this. Unnecessarily complicated.
Why do you think the bolt should be able to be reversed when it's job is to strip the round and slam home, caming into the barrel extension? Your test has only one force beyond one G, ramp up the bold carrier force and try it again, watch your fingers though! Obviously anyone who has fired a M16/AR-15 knows that the buffer spring has enough energy to strip off a round on a full mag. What more do you want, this is just mental masturbation.
@stiles72: It seems as though you are missing the point.
He is simply proving that the design flaw with the cam pin creates unnecessary torque and friction in the receiver. Will a stronger recoil spring and heavier buffer help, yes, will it eliminate the fact that the cam pin is grinding against the inside of the receiver while stripping a round and causing failures, no.
If you love your AR as much as it seems you do, open your mind and FIX the problem rather than ignoring it.
@shawnmlynch The solution is simple. Buy a new cam pin that still has it's non-stick coating attached. You can buy them anywhere for about 5 dollars. I don't know what all this discussion is about. The solution is ridiculously simple. Also i hope he hasn't ruined his upper receiver. Because if that is work because of using a worn out cam pin you have to get a new one. It is like running your engine without oil. Do you expect to last.
@stiles72: It seems as though you are missing the point.
He is simply proving that the design flaw with the cam pin creates unnecessary torque and friction in the receiver. Will a stronger recoil spring and heavier buffer help, yes, will it eliminate the fact that the cam pin is grinding against the inside of the receiver while stripping a round and causing failures, no.
If you love your AR as much as it seems you do, open your mind and FIX the problem rather than ignoring it.
are you making ar15 pizza lol. Hahaha So what is the point of this video ? Showing people how the ar's jamming ? hmm.. But i still love m4. As long as you clean and take care of it. It won't give you a hard time.
He is using the clamp as a demonstration tool to prove that his assertion is correct / true. He is in no way suggesting or implying that you should use a clamp to fix the problem. I suggest that you do as he said and check out the links below the video in his description.
I didnt ask that questiont o be an asshole and start some controversy or anything... I simply asked a question. And obviously you wouldnt use a clamp, becasue then, it would run into the hammer, and other components of the gun...
@krazzykid96 I've read all your comments. The clamp won't be anywhere near the hammer for a start. You got a bit to learn buddy. Best to not comment until you've learnt a bit more!
Actually, i own an ar 15... and, ok. The clamp wouldn't rub the hammer, but it would touch the disconnector, and other pieces in the lower. And the clamp wouldnt allow the locking luggs to lock into the barrell extention. I dont understand why people keep calling me on this. Is it because they're trying to be a dick? I know the ar 15 platform very well. Best not comment about other people until you actually know who they are!
@krazzykid96 "How does the bolt lock if the clamp is keeping it from moving backwards?" "And obviously you wouldnt use a clamp, becasue then, it would run into the hammer, and other components of the gun"
Maybe you do own an ar15... airsoft perhaps or use a grown ups'. because you sure didn't exhibit knowledge of the platform. But now I see you've received some accurate advice so that's good.
First off, i dont play airsoft. Its a colt 6920. It has a 16" 1X7 twist barrel. The twist helps stabilize heaver grain ammo. It runs off of the DI system (Direct Impingement) that many people tend to criticize, because it is very dirty. This all sounds like pretty accurate information to me. You make me sound like im an idiot. I have a lot of knowledge on the platform, but of corse i cant prove that to you, because this is youtube...
@grannman Maybe back in 1967 it had jamming problems when guys didn't clean them and Army switched powder type but why would they still use it 50 years later? I've tried many other types of rifles and they have serious issues also. I had a $2000 SIG 556 piston rifle and it was a complete pile of junk and based on AK bolt type system. I love that my AR can do anything, I can change the barrel in 10 minutes and they are very easy to add stuff to like night vision. I wish I was only one who had AR
@semiautoriflelover On merits the m16 platform is better (the price demands it) so long as you can maintain it. However that's only a part of the picture. A soldier's quote, "I know it fires very well and accurate clean. But sometimes it needs to fire dirty well too". Other platforms like the Garand, FAL and AK built up solid reputations regardless of ergonomic & modularity shortfalls. The m16 doesn't have that same reputation and it's not an accident. The US Army dust test feeds this view.
@grannman I see a ton of videos on youtube with Fals jamming. As long as a AR15 is lubed it will fire, they work when dirty. Type in dirt sand test for AR15 and AK47 on youtube and see what happened. The AK jammed up and the AR didn't stop firing. I will never have to worry about sand because I don't live anywhere near it. For 99% of combat an M16 or AR15 is perfect since it's light and mostly city fighting without sand. Check out the dirt/sand test video with AR15 you'll be surprised.
Okay so what does this actually prove? I run the shit out of 10.5" suppressed Noveske and KAC SR15E3, no cycling issue. Theres more to the AR gas system than just the unlocking of the bolt. The inertia of the buffer system helps the BCG cycles.
I like how people say their gun doesnt jam. All guns jam let's be honest, and they jam more than what you think. About the video now; so you're showing us a solution for the reliability problem? by the way, i believe all guns should be able to perform just as well dry, as they would lubed up.
The AUG and F2000 e.g. have some sort of blocking device that prevents the bolt from rotation until it entered the barrel extension. There exist several other possibilities.
Just made a chart regarding some mods or improvements (ouch - no one wants to call it that way since actually everything is fine...) possible at the AR15.
@momo671 thats like saying a car engine should run as good with out oil as it does with oil. i have owned both an ak an ar and both run way way better with lub than with out. there is no gun on this planet yet that i know of that runs as good with out lube as it does lubed. Dont want to be mean but i get the impression you have yet to own a firearm.
@momo671 Would you run your car without any oil in the engine? Why is it with every other machine, its universal knowledge to keep it oiled, but that mindset somehow goes away with firearms.
@cooroxd123 I have had my AKs jam too. Not often but it happens. My old one jams quite a bit but tobe fairit was military issue and I have put allot through it as well. t is worn WAY past any reasonable expectation of functionality. I still prefer my AR though,It i just as reliable ad It is WAY more accurate.
Alot of, well... basically stupid people here that dont understand simple physics. This IS a problem and it is half the reason for the addition of the forward assist, the other being the charging handle is of the non-recipracating variety. Good vid as usual if you have the brains to understand it. Btw, if you have a clue you can see the BOLT & Bolt Carrier are brand new!
The M-16 is still complete trash. If you tried to pay me to take one, I'd still refuse. I surprised my armorer by telling her I've melted down better rifles than the brand-new (still had the cardboard protector in the barrel) A-4 she handed me.
I believe this issue to only be predominant in AR's that have significant clearancing developed from excessive use of the bolt carrier group without maintenance.
I tried this test on my own AR and the difference was so insignificant it isn't even worth mentioning.
Also, the loading issue is more an excessive tension issue with the magazine. For the record, a lot of soldiers (Myself included) will run 25 rounds in the magazine, as this seems to completely alleviate feeding issues.
Please check the link below in the DESCRIPTION (Update March 2010)
The Big M4 Myth
"...more drag (friction) inside the upper receiver, which slows down the bolt carrier group ... enough to keep it from reliably going into battery ..."
He is counteracting it by heavier buffer and buffer spring. What doesn't solve the problem by itself - just overcome the increased friction by force.
he AR were made with gas piston, but due to the higher cost most use a gas tube that foul the bolt. Never trust a German that drinks becks beer. Every German I talked to when I live there for 2 years said that becks is piss water.
I just tried to simulate the bolt jamming on my AR-15 that you show on your video "M16/M4 reliability problem, increased bolt friction causing jams" but I did not get the same result. The bolt carrier assembly on my rifle moved backwards, freely, as i applied pressure on the bolt face. I think that you may have a faulty or worn bolt carrier, and that is why the jam condition occures in both receivers.
i think that happens on purpose so that the bolt stays locked in when it fires then the extractor spins and then it slides fine. its used to help maintain a good lock with the chamber. It releases after fire.
Nope, the purpose of the cam pin is so that the bolt and bolt carrier remain in the "open" postition (bolt pushed outwards and away from the bolt carrier) when the bolt face strips another round from the magazine. Otherwise, the bolt would rotate upon resistance from the round, causing the locking lugs to hit the lugs of the barrel extension (star chamber), making it impossible for the weapon to go into battery.
I will admit in the m4 system there is a slight amount of drag caused by the cam pin, but it is not nearly as significant as this video makes it seem. I have several M4's and I tried this on all of them. Not ONE of them stopped like the ones in this video. I would imagine this was caused by inferior lubricants, no gas rings, or completely worn out gas rings. I use tw25b and mcfarland one piece gas rings. I had to put a great deal of pressure on the bolt face to make it actually stop.
That's a great question. The pin definitely helps this issue, but I'm not sure whether it completely solves the issue. There would still be some very, very minor resistance from the cam having to turn, but I would say it's a great improvement over the current cam pin design.
Wow. Excellent video. Never really considered how the cam pin impacts the wall of the upper receiver when facing resistance. Another reason why bolt carriers riding on rails are more reliable than the tubular AR system. Very interesting indeed.
This guy doesn't understand the M16 system. When you hold up on the bolt with only the bolt carrier group trying to force it down, it won't work. That is why the designers placed a 1 inch by 18 inch spring in the stock. It forces the bolt forward to strip off the round and push it into the chamber. I will admit (and it is something I've bitched about for years) the gas system is very dirty and requires more maintenance than it should. I would like to see the piston system the AK47 uses.
@dalepittman1 your right, i'm not sure when he made the video he knows that. well the piston sytem of the ak does work expetion but I do like the 5.556mm round of m16 series luckly there the AK-74 but I would like the internals of it to be in a M4 body, that would be my gun if that was on the market (well atleast from what I know)
Yes but consider the added friction of dirt, built up carbon, and a lack of lube. In the worst conditions, the bolt carrier will encounter friction during the rearward motion, and again in the forward motion of the bolt. This may be enough to degrade the force of the buffer spring. We've all seen a failure to feed scenario, and the bolt carrier is stuck in a similar position to where he placed his finger. Guns like the AK, with a massive BCG and rails, encounter very little friction cycling.
Why the AK cycles and the M16 doesn't is due to sloppier manufacturing tolerances. The spring return of the M16 has more force pushing the BCG forward than the AK. The AK is built on a different principal, and uses an operating rod like the M1/M14. The M16 uses a dirtier system, the gas assist. Most of the jams I've seen is due to extended firing without cleaning, partly due to the gas assist system it uses. Between the two, I'd rather carry the AK into battle.
Actually, the AK cycles more reliably because the loose clearances (not tolerances) between moving parts was part of the design (inspired by Sudaev's AS-44). It also has a large, heavy bolt that moves with more momentum, plowing through dirt and grime. The M16 uses a direct gas impingement system, not gas assist, and the very tight clearances and longer buffer spring make for a bolt that moves very smoothly and not nearly as rough as the AK, but can be slowed easily with fouling.
You dumb ass. There is nothing wrong with the design, the problem is that your bolt ring is worn out. The cam pin should not move when you simply apply light finger pressure to the front of the bolt. That is a sign of a bad ring. You also have to take into consideration the amount of pressure the spring would be applying to the bolt, which would continue to move the bolt through the receiver.
Correction, I shouldnt say dumbass, because it does seem like you know a bit about firearms, but you should be aware that this is a common ring problem and the ring simply needs to be replaced. If you do not replace the ring, you will continue to have this problem... The rings are really cheap, just replace and go have some fun! :)
cool vid. I never really saw a problem with cam pin wear... i have 2k rounds down mine and it just took the finish off... i wouldnt call it "excessive force" as it doesnt cause a problem unless the gun is not maintained.
I'm not going to question your talent or qualifications as a machinist or gunsmith.
This really isn't a problem...
I've built, rebuilt, owned and fired over a dozen M-16, Car-15 and match AR-15 and my AR-10.
All of which share the same architecture concerning the bolt/carrier feeding. I've never run into a feeding problem caused by the drag of the receiver/bolt carrier or bolt cam pin.
I don't wanna fire up this debate again but I came across this while checking several decommissioned M16 uppers which all showed that same groove. And I wanted to know where it comes from - I didn't invent it.
First almost everyone was bashing me but half a year later that thing got a name: "cam pin wear" and an experienced AR manufacturer like LWRC claimed this to be a long known thing:
"It is a result of the cam pin acting on that surface during the feeding operation."
If your working with decommissioned upper receivers it is entirerly possible that those rifles (particularily if they have no forward assist) were vietnam era with round counts above 100,000 both single and full auto.
Modern receivers are thicker (and heavier) overall which you can see with the A3 flattop in your video.
Like I said, use mil-spec parts and this isn't a problem.
I replaced half a rifle because the parts were junk, I used mil-spec parts and it worked fine after that...
The best replacement would likely be the Magpul Masada (Bushmaster ACR). It has the fastest barrel change out of all rifles being considered, it is also the only all-American one. The 416 is expensive, and the XM8 doesn't take STANAG mags, not to mention the fact that it doesn't have anywhere near the same controls.
How about the Bushmaster ACR which is what I believe to cheaper and better shooting regular 5.56x45 NATO as regular m4/m16 but have optional 7.62x39 non NATO which fits standard AK-47. Has 30 round clip and much more reliable without much jamming problems with lighter weight than AK-47.
Don't wanna kill all joy but at the Remington ACR fact sheet the 7.62x39 isn't listed. The MASADA introduced an AK lower but wasn't exactly AK-like. But MUST have the same or less receiver contour like the AK. Otherwise the "bad" guys can easily modify their mags to not fit into the new rifle but still in an AK. No use of battlefield pick-up mags anymore.
Not much jamming problems? There isnt a substantial number of them out there to justify such a statement.
Here is a good one for you. What about the Sig 556 rifle? Here we have crappy AKs because of supplement american parts mixed with the AK manufactuer parts to make well not a bad AK, but AK that doesn't hold up to the reputation as well has it should. M4s are ok but Sig 556 seems its modular, accuarcy, and reliable. Other guns are way expensive or hard to find parts for. Sig are also new here in the U.S.
I had a sig 556 and it had to be sent back to sig 3 times. Mine shot like dog crap. 9" groups at 100 yard with $25 match ammo. I sent it back they changed out the barrel and gas system and still only 4-5" groups. Other parts broke also. I sold it at a $500 loss.
I completely get what your saying it all makes sense, but I have tried to this to my M4 carbine and not cause the same effect in my upper reciever. Then again my carbine only has 200 rounds through it. I would figure maybe a loose gas key and something wrong with the bolt head maybe the gas rings. Either way I do believe this is possible, but my cousin and a manager I work with are in the army and fired thousands of rounds from their M4s and never had this problem. How would you modify the bolt?
@jayrod68 if you try to do it as he does, remember he has only a receiver, which is very light. you will not be able to pick up the upper with all gizmos, barrels, attached (the weight will overcome the friction). if you move the bolt back and forth without the fwd resistance then applie pressure to the bolt face, asif to simulate stripping rounds you will notice additional friction (amount varies)
TBS-what is your take on the FAL? i notice a similar effect, tough in adifferent manner.
But the SKS bolt tilts down in a similar manner. For about half of the bolt travel the hammer pushes from below against the bolt counteracting a possible move downwards. But so you get a tendency to cant between the bolt carrier and the receiver (guide rails in the receiver are too short).
Pics of the FAL bcg show wear marks from the hammer at the lower rear edge of the bolt carrier but not on the the bolt itself. So it doesn't seem to act SKS-like.
you must prevent the bolt from starting (trying) to rotate until it enters the barrel extension. There are several ways. Steyr AUG and FN F2000 e.g. are doing so.
Unfortunately no simple fix that could be done by the user.
troubleshooter this video like your other videos are well done and informative. those of you who dont understand watch again and study it. if you have a AR do as he does and you will notice the additional friction the design imposes on the bolt as it goes to battery. this friction may/ may not be alot but IT IS THERE-it depends on condition/lube/cleanliness, etc. basically some of the energy of the ret spring is wasted overcoming bolt friction instead of stripping rounds affecting reliability
" ...instead of stripping rounds affecting reliability" plus overcoming the stiff extractor and ejector springs at the last few millimeters of the bolt travel what may require to use the forward assist
Another Problem is the Gas inpingement, spraying dirty gas all over the internals. I dont understand why eugene stoner didnt design that system in a way where the gas tube, at all time, is covered by the carrier key so no gas leaks out. Off course, the bolt would move much more violently, but that can be prevented by making the gas-hole smaller so less pressure is built up.
andromedarr 1 week ago
@andromedarr
Well, was thinking about something like this indeed. But would either require a heavily modified much longer carrier key or some sort of valve at the end of the gas tube, which shuts off, when it is coming out of the carrier key.
Would make it more complicated and the dirt would still get into the bolt carrier.
troubleshooterBerlin 1 week ago
Time to get a new rifle....
PeytonManningguy 1 month ago
I've owned a Swiss PE90 based civilian semi-auto. Believe it or not it's non-restricted in Canada but was banned for years in the USA as a Sig550 assault rifle. Crazy. It used a piston system that is similar to what some companies have added to the AR platform, HK416 for example. I like the evolution of the AR but with the short stroke piston I'd trust my life to it. Without the piston Swissarms Classic Green.
14goldmedals 1 month ago
This guy sounds German and as we all know Germans are poor engineers. No wait that is the British, I do not understand all of what is said/written there are some terminology errors but, Good point. Informative and gives one something to think about, thanks.
hedonistic1979 3 months ago
@hedonistic1979 the Germans are some of the best engineers throughout history. German firearms are expensive for a reason, they are the best. Models that get assembled outside of Germany are not quite as good IMO. That's why my SIG P226 says "Made in W. Germany" on it and features no useless rail or picatinny mount.
14goldmedals 1 month ago in playlist More videos from troubleshooterBerlin
@14goldmedals That was sarcasm, your Sig was engineered by the Swedes or the Swiss I forget witch. At the time they partnered with the Germans to build it because of their export laws. Yea the American built Sigs are not as good that is why mine is also German. The rail is not useless when I was a dog handler it was great when I needed a gun a light and had a dog on leash. Unless you have a dog a shield or are on an entry team rails are just tacti-cool.
hedonistic1979 1 month ago
@hedonistic1979 given your examples I would agree with "your" need for a rail. For me it's just one less edge to snag coming out of the holster. In my life if I end up in a shoot/no shoot situation it's gonna be up close and no light required. And you do have the tacti-cool sales pitch figured out perfectly. Tactical, Sniper, Entry, 3 words that sell anything to wannabes.
14goldmedals 1 month ago
@14goldmedals I am a usetobe I have been out of the military for four years now I have a glock with a rail because without was not an option, I have no plans to hang anything on the rail. Hand held lights are the way to go for those of not on SWAT or in Special Forces.
hedonistic1979 1 month ago
@hedonistic1979 thank you Sir for your previous service to your country and well earned "usetobe" status. I hope you don't mind me using that moniker, it's catchy! I'm what you would call a usetobe Cst. lol
14goldmedals 1 month ago
@14goldmedals CST? I am proud to be a usetobe preferred to has-been and far better than a wannabe. I am a security guard for the Army we have a wannabe has never been trainer. A man who knows it and is not afraid to make it up. That is the type I despise loathe and detest. To give you an idea this arisoft warrior was nearly kicked out of an Army SRT course for not only trying to teach the class but tiring to tell decelerated combat veterans he knows better.
hedonistic1979 1 month ago
@hedonistic1979 if you read any of my posts on youtube regarding airsoft they're pretty much the same. "Airsoft fags should stop wasting youtube's bandwidth, non-gun owners don't get it and don't care. Gun owners wish you'd fall on your rubber bayonets lol. You give real gun owners a bad name." And kids that post video game dog fights or combat missions need a serious bitch slap too.
14goldmedals 1 month ago
AR-15s are too picky of a weapon system, thats why I dont like them. I will always be an AK fan boy. Ive built two of them, and my dream project will be an AK-105. As soon as I draw up the funds and necessary press tool for it. Too bad the Army makes me use their shitty M-4s. :-(
TheMedievalMan 4 months ago
whats for dinner? ar 15 with grated cheese thats what!
suckyalaterhead 6 months ago 2
@suckyalaterhead now you know what the serations on the bolt's sides are for. In the field the prepared grunt grates a little fresh parmesan cheese over his spaghetti MRE then cleans the weapon before sitting down to chow. Not really, but really.
14goldmedals 1 month ago
You are right my friend it is a minor flaw in the AR15 design and everybody here thats posting stupid comments obviously haven't been to combat so they don't know how it affects the weapon during prolong firing and rugged terrains with alot of debris. The solution is simple buy a POF roller cam pin. It's round and there's no friction what so ever and it will never get stuck !
agsd619 6 months ago
@agsd619
Thanks! The roller cam pin - I referred to it in the description to this video - came out May 2009 IIRC, about 8 months after this video was published and got some nasty bashing...
troubleshooterBerlin 6 months ago
@troubleshooterBerlin, I tried to recreate this jam in my Pof415 and Dpms 16" bull barrel Ar15 rifles. Neither one jam this way. Which leads me to believe the phosphate coating ( or the coating that makes them not stick, Teflon is also used) is worn out. You can replace the cam pin on the rifle you show in video for 5 dollars. In other words it is meant to be replaced after so many round like the oil in your car. Ar platform is advanced and with that comes responsibility. Also lube it.
Homehous 8 months ago
What a silly video. Dude has no experience with the AR platform.
Harbisondude 8 months ago
Give me about an hour with an AK or any other firearm and i can make an equally absurd video demonstrating "non issues" like this to convince people the weapon is a useless piece of junk.
In actuality nothing this guys shows in this video is an actual problem.
KurNorock 8 months ago
@KurNorock Lets see it happen, make a video like this for an AK. This is a real problem with the AR design.
FireControlGroup 2 months ago
I don't have this issue with my Rock River Arms 20 inch AR15 (m16) or even my cheap DPMs Panther ap4 (m4 style). What manufacturer is your rifle and what year was it made?
At any rate this is a poorly made and overly opinionated video that shows nothing what so ever.
adobo777 9 months ago
Styre or how ever it is spelt the Aussies use them
you can out it in sand under water and then out in action still works
takes a pounding in all conditions but still lets a round out when u need it
then you clean it at night or as safe to do so and all is ready to go again!! have used it after it is pulled from the water all good reilable as ever
as with all things aussie army we have to use what is good because we don't have many men!!!!!!!
chopperwheels 9 months ago
@chopperwheels
We spell Steyr like “fire” and the S like in “shrapnel” so like: shtire
BTW – just working on an upgrade stock for the AUG making it really ambidextrous and better ergonomics.
troubleshooterBerlin 9 months ago
I wouldn't own an AR15 if you paid me to take it. The one exception I would make would be so I could make a video of me exploiting this pathetic weapon's every weakness for fun and for....well, mainly for fun with an eye to educational.
nov284 10 months ago
@nov284 then I would say you are ignorant.
I love how a guy like you would be so bold and quick to call a design that has been so widely used by some of the best militaries in the world for over 40 years as "pathetic." that in and of itself shows that your knowledge in the firearms world is...well "pathetic"
good day sir
Alexn1067 9 months ago
@nov284 - your loss
KurNorock 8 months ago
u should try hi-temp wheel bearing grease.It's like the marine corp DI'S used to say.............."works good,lasts a long time."
rw5791 11 months ago
If you increase the gas flow, for more power??? would that not take care of the weak spring issue???
TheThedot 1 year ago
@TheThedot
You might need more gas pressure when using heavier buffer and/or buffer springs. Both would give you more momentum for the bcg on the forward move. But I would simply try. As long as you don't experience short-stroking with your bcg the gas setting is ok.
troubleshooterBerlin 1 year ago
Great info, now I am looking for stronger springs. do you have a good source of springs i can contact in the states???
TheThedot 1 year ago
@TheThedot
Try the AR15 section ar ARFCOM - they will know. Here in Germany it would be Midway e.g.
troubleshooterBerlin 1 year ago
EVERY ONE! start useing grease instead of liquid lube. That stuff sucks. i use wheel barring grease its cheap and has yet to ever dry up during use or when its stowed away.
biggboysouth 1 year ago
I jus tried this same trick on my ar 15 and it didnt work. All though i did feel it starting to rub it did not stop the bolt. i even pushed on both the rear of the bolt assembly and on the bolt face very hard and that did not stop it. Im guessing different manufacturers have different tolerences. What is the brand and year of the ars your using? If its a colt then thats could be it. With all the research i've personally done, COLTS are the most unreliable ars. sorry colt fans just IMHO.
biggboysouth 1 year ago
@biggboysouth
Colt the most unreliable? I'd like to hear more about this "research" that you claim to have done. What's your experience and background? Out of all the AR's I've owned (I run BCM's these days but have a 6920), and ones I've been around at the carbine classes I've attended, your claims are completely off base. I simply find the premise they are worse than Olympic Arms, DPMS, Bushmaster, etc. ludicrous.
opmike343 1 year ago
@opmike343 well like i said IMHO which mean in my honest opinion because i was looking into buying one for myself and as i did my research through the internet and many many many MANY FORUMS i begin to realize that colts are very picky to different ammo and if you do not run brass through them they will most likely jam. every time i buy my bulk ammo online and read the bad reviews it seems to come mainly from colt users. i love the colt brand i just dont like their ars. look up 21century rifle.
biggboysouth 1 year ago
@opmike343 i did not say i did military or scientific research. i did personal research. I am not military or police but i know what i like n dont like. now like i said it was my opinion and from a person like u claiming to have so much experience that shouldnt matter to you. i own a del-ton u can say its the worst gun in the world thats ok thats your opinion but i know its a great rifle. But what you probably dont know is that colts parts are not all made by colt.
biggboysouth 1 year ago
@opmike343 del-ton the comp that makes my ar use to make parts for colt(bolt assembilies) if u did ur research u would know that. i dont know if this is still the case becuase i hear del-ton stopped giving colt there parts and began makeing there own rifles every piece. which means a good fit rifle with little play over a rifle put together from other comanies parts. if u do a reliablilty test with different ammos i will be the 1st to say i was wrong. S&Ws do it all the time and lwrc n many more
biggboysouth 1 year ago
@opmike343 all the new and very reliable ar manufactures have learned the advantage of makeing all the parts themselves to have a tight fitting rifle. For the price u pay for a colt i would demand alot better. look up ar 15 torture tests there are not many colts that pop up. Remember just becuase the military uses them does not mean there the best. I am a young guy and i have even learned this early on.
biggboysouth 1 year ago
@biggboysouth Military Engineering Standards, Procedures, Specifications and Quality Control/Root Cause Analysis are just some of the tools used by teams of Military & civilian Professional Engineers educated and specializing in weapons warfare. These guys make the decisions on what weapons to use in the military & why.
mayito714 1 year ago
@biggboysouth also keep in mind, manufacturing, as in everything else is not perfect, some flaws are to be expected. Because one unit might be junk, does not mean the design itself is junk. Imperfect...sure, but not junk
Alexn1067 9 months ago
@Alexn1067 Oh no i never ment to say the ar15 is junk, i was just trying to law out my personal oppinion of a certain manufacturer's version. i own an ar and there amazing rifles.
biggboysouth 9 months ago
@opmike343 But like i said b4 this is all just in my personal opinion if u think they are the best then they are the best i disagree but that is why there are so many different manufacturers. Just one guys opinion vs. anothers thats what the world is built on.
biggboysouth 1 year ago
for the piece that is creating the problem there is an easy fix you just gotta search websites for it. I dont know the name but their is a piece that fits ars where the top is not squared its actually a wheel that rotates.
biggboysouth 1 year ago
@biggboysouth
Are you talking about the cam pin? POF has a "roller" unit, I believe. In any case, I haven't been able to replicate this "problem" with ANY of my AR's or my friend's rifles. We're all running bolts by LMT, Colt, BCM, or Daniel Defense. Without a larger sample size, it would be difficult to rule out the possibility that there's simply a manufacturing defect, or that his bolt, bolt carrier, cam pin, upper receiver, etc. is out of spec.
opmike343 1 year ago
Wow cool to see how the gun works and everything.
I did know M16 has problems but this seems to be really bad...
Ive worked with the AK5 and the main differences seem to be the size of the boltcarrier, that the boltcarrier dont have any parts that can come off due to forces while shooting and that the boltcarrier dont do any movement sideways inside the rifle.
The key of the AK5 is Simple as a brick and works.
tenkikun 1 year ago
I have put more than my fair share of rounds through quite a number of M16s and have never have a failure and I bet all the M16s I fired were older than me at time. Not matter which weapon system, close to 100% of operational failures is due to poor maintenance and cleaning. Also, the forward assist does absolutely nothing until the shooter pushes it to ensure the bolt is full forward and locked, it does nothing by itself.
Robbob9933 1 year ago
M16 istn that unreliable. Ive seen an AK and M16 side to side comparison. The both guns where poured over with Sand and Dust, and after the First shot the AK jamed, because the Bolt allows Sand to get into the Trigger, which blocks the Mechanism th AK ajmed every time after 1-3 Shots, the M16 fired with no interruptions 5 Magazines and it was botherted io the sand 5 times
andromedarr 1 year ago
@andromedarr
all they did was exploit the AK's one achilles heel. If the ak had the safety off then it would have performed flawlessly as well. I dare anyone to take an AR (or any weapon for that matter) and dump sand into an open receiver and see what happens.
D0ublezer0x 1 year ago
@andromedarr
all they did was exploit the AK's safety design. If the safety was on then it would have performed flawlessly as well.
D0ublezer0x 1 year ago
oh oh i forgot to ask, if it was a roller cam, how do you rotate it? can you post vid of installing the pof roller cam? if i remember correctly, cam pins need be rotated.
nakazatoGTR 1 year ago
"the AK design avoids this problem from the begining". i was seriously considering an AR, but now i may go with a mini-14 and invest my money in sighting it nicely....since i allready own an AK.
jheetman 1 year ago
Thanks for the video and information. I think it depends on the Manufacture as whether their is a problem. Some Manufactures address this and some don't.
My M16A1 jammed several times when I was in the desert. This turned me off the whole platform.
frankgon4 1 year ago
beck's beer RULES
Zaidmolina 1 year ago
You can ask all the guys killed by the hands of an M16 series of weapons over the years if there is a problem. Woops, they can't answer because they are dead.
semiautoriflelover 1 year ago
POF roller cam is well worth the money especially with the chromed gas key, F. pin, and bolt. 3k rds, no jams.
axishans 1 year ago
my possible solution is placing a roller/bearing on the cam pin's side which contacts the rail inside the receiver..
nakazatoGTR 1 year ago
@nakazatoGTR
POF roller cam, as linked below in the DESCRIPTION
troubleshooterBerlin 1 year ago
@troubleshooterBerlin like what i thought other geniuses were there first!!
nakazatoGTR 1 year ago
yeah how often does this happen..come on. i have a mp 15t never jamed once 1000 rnds through it.
trueamerica75 1 year ago
@trueamerica75 people don't understand quality. my Bushmaster didn't jam until after 2000 rounds and it was due to improper cleaning (I let my brother borrow it and he sucks at taking care of guns).
Tuck1911 1 year ago
Excellent demonstration. I've never actually seen the m16 method of rotating the bolt lugs and can say I'm not very impressed with it after seeing this. Unnecessarily complicated.
grannman 1 year ago
This is a non issue. Staking your gas key will solve more problems than fixing the 'problem' you have shown.
jebustheone 1 year ago
Why do you think the bolt should be able to be reversed when it's job is to strip the round and slam home, caming into the barrel extension? Your test has only one force beyond one G, ramp up the bold carrier force and try it again, watch your fingers though! Obviously anyone who has fired a M16/AR-15 knows that the buffer spring has enough energy to strip off a round on a full mag. What more do you want, this is just mental masturbation.
stiles72 1 year ago
@stiles72: It seems as though you are missing the point.
He is simply proving that the design flaw with the cam pin creates unnecessary torque and friction in the receiver. Will a stronger recoil spring and heavier buffer help, yes, will it eliminate the fact that the cam pin is grinding against the inside of the receiver while stripping a round and causing failures, no.
If you love your AR as much as it seems you do, open your mind and FIX the problem rather than ignoring it.
Take care..!
shawnmlynch 1 year ago
@shawnmlynch The solution is simple. Buy a new cam pin that still has it's non-stick coating attached. You can buy them anywhere for about 5 dollars. I don't know what all this discussion is about. The solution is ridiculously simple. Also i hope he hasn't ruined his upper receiver. Because if that is work because of using a worn out cam pin you have to get a new one. It is like running your engine without oil. Do you expect to last.
Homehous 7 months ago
This has been flagged as spam show
@stiles72: It seems as though you are missing the point.
He is simply proving that the design flaw with the cam pin creates unnecessary torque and friction in the receiver. Will a stronger recoil spring and heavier buffer help, yes, will it eliminate the fact that the cam pin is grinding against the inside of the receiver while stripping a round and causing failures, no.
If you love your AR as much as it seems you do, open your mind and FIX the problem rather than ignoring it.
Take care..!
shawnmlynch 1 year ago
are you making ar15 pizza lol. Hahaha So what is the point of this video ? Showing people how the ar's jamming ? hmm.. But i still love m4. As long as you clean and take care of it. It won't give you a hard time.
Vietboy1st 1 year ago
I'd be glad to see your soultion.
Have a great day , from your italian friend!
TheBelva85 1 year ago
troubleshooterBerlin
You never posted a film addressing how you would modify your bolt to fix this problem.
OakIslandBandit 1 year ago
@OakIslandBandit
There is no simple fix the owner could perform on it's own - otherwise I would have shown there.
It's something the manufacturers would need to change.
troubleshooterBerlin 1 year ago
@troubleshooterBerlin
How does the bolt lock if the clamp is keeping it from moving backwards?
krazzykid96 1 year ago
@krazzykid96: Wow really..?
He is using the clamp as a demonstration tool to prove that his assertion is correct / true. He is in no way suggesting or implying that you should use a clamp to fix the problem. I suggest that you do as he said and check out the links below the video in his description.
shawnmlynch 1 year ago
@shawnmlynch
I didnt ask that questiont o be an asshole and start some controversy or anything... I simply asked a question. And obviously you wouldnt use a clamp, becasue then, it would run into the hammer, and other components of the gun...
krazzykid96 1 year ago
@krazzykid96 oh my gosh you thought he was using the clamp as a fix? Good grief.
grannman 1 year ago
@grannman
Read my later comments on the other person who said almost the exact same thing...
krazzykid96 1 year ago
@krazzykid96 I've read all your comments. The clamp won't be anywhere near the hammer for a start. You got a bit to learn buddy. Best to not comment until you've learnt a bit more!
grannman 1 year ago
@grannman
Actually, i own an ar 15... and, ok. The clamp wouldn't rub the hammer, but it would touch the disconnector, and other pieces in the lower. And the clamp wouldnt allow the locking luggs to lock into the barrell extention. I dont understand why people keep calling me on this. Is it because they're trying to be a dick? I know the ar 15 platform very well. Best not comment about other people until you actually know who they are!
krazzykid96 1 year ago
@krazzykid96 "How does the bolt lock if the clamp is keeping it from moving backwards?" "And obviously you wouldnt use a clamp, becasue then, it would run into the hammer, and other components of the gun"
Maybe you do own an ar15... airsoft perhaps or use a grown ups'. because you sure didn't exhibit knowledge of the platform. But now I see you've received some accurate advice so that's good.
grannman 1 year ago
@grannman
First off, i dont play airsoft. Its a colt 6920. It has a 16" 1X7 twist barrel. The twist helps stabilize heaver grain ammo. It runs off of the DI system (Direct Impingement) that many people tend to criticize, because it is very dirty. This all sounds like pretty accurate information to me. You make me sound like im an idiot. I have a lot of knowledge on the platform, but of corse i cant prove that to you, because this is youtube...
krazzykid96 1 year ago
@krazzykid96 all standard info. You sure can't be indignant with anyone considering what you said initially.
grannman 1 year ago
@grannman
Ok, then. What isnt standard info?
krazzykid96 1 year ago
@krazzykid96 non bog-standard wikipedia stuff like this video for example.
Or write-ups like vietnam vet - Mad Ogre "Why I hate the M-16/AR-15 Rifle and variants"
army times, "Newer carbines outperform M4 in dust test"
& "Better than M4, but you can’t have one"
& "Heavy lubrication shown to improve M16, M4 effectiveness"
grannman 1 year ago
@grannman
I see...
krazzykid96 1 year ago
@grannman How about these articles:
why the sights on AK47s suck
Why did russians move away from ineffective 7.62X39?
Why 5 MOA is amazing for an AK?
AK47 perfect for middle eastern morons and 3rd world retards who can't shoot straight.
semiautoriflelover 1 year ago
@semiautoriflelover I never said anything about the AK? The m16 platform is usable but controvesial. A reality it built up for itself.
grannman 1 year ago
@grannman Maybe back in 1967 it had jamming problems when guys didn't clean them and Army switched powder type but why would they still use it 50 years later? I've tried many other types of rifles and they have serious issues also. I had a $2000 SIG 556 piston rifle and it was a complete pile of junk and based on AK bolt type system. I love that my AR can do anything, I can change the barrel in 10 minutes and they are very easy to add stuff to like night vision. I wish I was only one who had AR
semiautoriflelover 1 year ago
@semiautoriflelover On merits the m16 platform is better (the price demands it) so long as you can maintain it. However that's only a part of the picture. A soldier's quote, "I know it fires very well and accurate clean. But sometimes it needs to fire dirty well too". Other platforms like the Garand, FAL and AK built up solid reputations regardless of ergonomic & modularity shortfalls. The m16 doesn't have that same reputation and it's not an accident. The US Army dust test feeds this view.
grannman 1 year ago
@grannman I see a ton of videos on youtube with Fals jamming. As long as a AR15 is lubed it will fire, they work when dirty. Type in dirt sand test for AR15 and AK47 on youtube and see what happened. The AK jammed up and the AR didn't stop firing. I will never have to worry about sand because I don't live anywhere near it. For 99% of combat an M16 or AR15 is perfect since it's light and mostly city fighting without sand. Check out the dirt/sand test video with AR15 you'll be surprised.
semiautoriflelover 1 year ago
@troubleshooterBerlin So it's a receiver thing too?
TheBelva85 1 year ago
@troubleshooterBerlin Can youj maek a vid on how the soviets solved this on the ak?
TheBelva85 1 year ago
Ok one question guys,me and my father are having a bet.Will a gun jam or even possibly explode if you put it in sand or water?
markjin08 1 year ago
Okay so what does this actually prove? I run the shit out of 10.5" suppressed Noveske and KAC SR15E3, no cycling issue. Theres more to the AR gas system than just the unlocking of the bolt. The inertia of the buffer system helps the BCG cycles.
pittwm 1 year ago
I like how people say their gun doesnt jam. All guns jam let's be honest, and they jam more than what you think. About the video now; so you're showing us a solution for the reliability problem? by the way, i believe all guns should be able to perform just as well dry, as they would lubed up.
momo671 1 year ago
@momo671
The AUG and F2000 e.g. have some sort of blocking device that prevents the bolt from rotation until it entered the barrel extension. There exist several other possibilities.
Just made a chart regarding some mods or improvements (ouch - no one wants to call it that way since actually everything is fine...) possible at the AR15.
Click the link right on top of the DESCRIPTION.
troubleshooterBerlin 1 year ago
@momo671
the g-36 doesn't jam... neither do the ak's, of course, the ak's can't aim for shit.
chica476 1 year ago
@chica476 I've had AK's jam. All guns jam you fool. If you can't hit anything with an AK, then it's the indian not the arrow.
esh325 1 year ago
@esh325
Can you hit yourself? :)
chica476 1 year ago
@momo671 thats like saying a car engine should run as good with out oil as it does with oil. i have owned both an ak an ar and both run way way better with lub than with out. there is no gun on this planet yet that i know of that runs as good with out lube as it does lubed. Dont want to be mean but i get the impression you have yet to own a firearm.
biggboysouth 1 year ago
@momo671 Would you run your car without any oil in the engine? Why is it with every other machine, its universal knowledge to keep it oiled, but that mindset somehow goes away with firearms.
It's ridiculous
TheDoxy 1 year ago
is there an auto carrier? designed to take care of that problem?
momo671 1 year ago
auto carrier is what it needs.
momo671 1 year ago
this is why the ak 47 rulez.
cooroxd123 1 year ago
@cooroxd123 I have had my AKs jam too. Not often but it happens. My old one jams quite a bit but tobe fairit was military issue and I have put allot through it as well. t is worn WAY past any reasonable expectation of functionality. I still prefer my AR though,It i just as reliable ad It is WAY more accurate.
TGLymantaiste 1 year ago
Alot of, well... basically stupid people here that dont understand simple physics. This IS a problem and it is half the reason for the addition of the forward assist, the other being the charging handle is of the non-recipracating variety. Good vid as usual if you have the brains to understand it. Btw, if you have a clue you can see the BOLT & Bolt Carrier are brand new!
mrtruthify 1 year ago
The M-16 is still complete trash. If you tried to pay me to take one, I'd still refuse. I surprised my armorer by telling her I've melted down better rifles than the brand-new (still had the cardboard protector in the barrel) A-4 she handed me.
nov284 1 year ago
I call BS on this video.
NIKON777 1 year ago
@tru7hmnb EXACTLY
NIKON777 1 year ago
I believe this issue to only be predominant in AR's that have significant clearancing developed from excessive use of the bolt carrier group without maintenance.
I tried this test on my own AR and the difference was so insignificant it isn't even worth mentioning.
Also, the loading issue is more an excessive tension issue with the magazine. For the record, a lot of soldiers (Myself included) will run 25 rounds in the magazine, as this seems to completely alleviate feeding issues.
Good vid tho
GR40GT 1 year ago
Comment removed
traiter82 1 year ago 3
Please check the link below in the DESCRIPTION (Update March 2010)
The Big M4 Myth
"...more drag (friction) inside the upper receiver, which slows down the bolt carrier group ... enough to keep it from reliably going into battery ..."
He is counteracting it by heavier buffer and buffer spring. What doesn't solve the problem by itself - just overcome the increased friction by force.
troubleshooterBerlin 1 year ago
he AR were made with gas piston, but due to the higher cost most use a gas tube that foul the bolt. Never trust a German that drinks becks beer. Every German I talked to when I live there for 2 years said that becks is piss water.
Stain5150v 1 year ago
This comment has received too many negative votes show
Hummm. these are hand simulated jams. show a video of this happening under the stress of fire. Until i see that, your video is worthless.
datzitteezy 2 years ago
How often is the rifle being fired straight down? Try it sideways.
seadevil38 2 years ago
This comment has received too many negative votes show
He is using old wornout parts. Nice try but you fail.
mmalle2 2 years ago
I just tried to simulate the bolt jamming on my AR-15 that you show on your video "M16/M4 reliability problem, increased bolt friction causing jams" but I did not get the same result. The bolt carrier assembly on my rifle moved backwards, freely, as i applied pressure on the bolt face. I think that you may have a faulty or worn bolt carrier, and that is why the jam condition occures in both receivers.
rllang01 2 years ago
i think that happens on purpose so that the bolt stays locked in when it fires then the extractor spins and then it slides fine. its used to help maintain a good lock with the chamber. It releases after fire.
marktse 2 years ago
Nope, the purpose of the cam pin is so that the bolt and bolt carrier remain in the "open" postition (bolt pushed outwards and away from the bolt carrier) when the bolt face strips another round from the magazine. Otherwise, the bolt would rotate upon resistance from the round, causing the locking lugs to hit the lugs of the barrel extension (star chamber), making it impossible for the weapon to go into battery.
megatron515 2 years ago
I will admit in the m4 system there is a slight amount of drag caused by the cam pin, but it is not nearly as significant as this video makes it seem. I have several M4's and I tried this on all of them. Not ONE of them stopped like the ones in this video. I would imagine this was caused by inferior lubricants, no gas rings, or completely worn out gas rings. I use tw25b and mcfarland one piece gas rings. I had to put a great deal of pressure on the bolt face to make it actually stop.
xounlistedxox 2 years ago
I have 2500 rounds in my new colt 6920 and it never jammed yet.
seadevil38 2 years ago
Can you make a video showing everyone why the AK47 is such a poor shooter? Teach everyone why it shoots 5" groups at 100 yards.
ferret6677 2 years ago
I just tested my Bushmaster A2 - there was only very slight resistance, I can't see it as a big problem.
thestrugglevideo 2 years ago
if it was a big problem in my 16 AR15s I would have had more then 4 jams ever in 17 years of shooting.
ferret6677 2 years ago
I dont think I can yell BULL SHIT loud enough
sn1per194 2 years ago
does the POF cam roller cam pin solver this issue, or mitigate it?
krossF 2 years ago
That's a great question. The pin definitely helps this issue, but I'm not sure whether it completely solves the issue. There would still be some very, very minor resistance from the cam having to turn, but I would say it's a great improvement over the current cam pin design.
megatron515 2 years ago 2
Wow. Excellent video. Never really considered how the cam pin impacts the wall of the upper receiver when facing resistance. Another reason why bolt carriers riding on rails are more reliable than the tubular AR system. Very interesting indeed.
megatron515 2 years ago
For some reason, whenever someone lectures or talks about the M16's internals, I get somewhat drowsy or sleepy..
Crim15 2 years ago
This guy doesn't understand the M16 system. When you hold up on the bolt with only the bolt carrier group trying to force it down, it won't work. That is why the designers placed a 1 inch by 18 inch spring in the stock. It forces the bolt forward to strip off the round and push it into the chamber. I will admit (and it is something I've bitched about for years) the gas system is very dirty and requires more maintenance than it should. I would like to see the piston system the AK47 uses.
dalepittman1 2 years ago
@dalepittman1 your right, i'm not sure when he made the video he knows that. well the piston sytem of the ak does work expetion but I do like the 5.556mm round of m16 series luckly there the AK-74 but I would like the internals of it to be in a M4 body, that would be my gun if that was on the market (well atleast from what I know)
Roan1414 2 years ago
Yes but consider the added friction of dirt, built up carbon, and a lack of lube. In the worst conditions, the bolt carrier will encounter friction during the rearward motion, and again in the forward motion of the bolt. This may be enough to degrade the force of the buffer spring. We've all seen a failure to feed scenario, and the bolt carrier is stuck in a similar position to where he placed his finger. Guns like the AK, with a massive BCG and rails, encounter very little friction cycling.
megatron515 2 years ago
Why the AK cycles and the M16 doesn't is due to sloppier manufacturing tolerances. The spring return of the M16 has more force pushing the BCG forward than the AK. The AK is built on a different principal, and uses an operating rod like the M1/M14. The M16 uses a dirtier system, the gas assist. Most of the jams I've seen is due to extended firing without cleaning, partly due to the gas assist system it uses. Between the two, I'd rather carry the AK into battle.
dalepittman1 2 years ago
Comment removed
megatron515 2 years ago
Actually, the AK cycles more reliably because the loose clearances (not tolerances) between moving parts was part of the design (inspired by Sudaev's AS-44). It also has a large, heavy bolt that moves with more momentum, plowing through dirt and grime. The M16 uses a direct gas impingement system, not gas assist, and the very tight clearances and longer buffer spring make for a bolt that moves very smoothly and not nearly as rough as the AK, but can be slowed easily with fouling.
megatron515 2 years ago
but only to a certain range...the 5.56 assumes superiority probably at about 400 yards
joehoffy 2 years ago
5.45 is superior to both lol.
yourredcomrade717 2 years ago
You dumb ass. There is nothing wrong with the design, the problem is that your bolt ring is worn out. The cam pin should not move when you simply apply light finger pressure to the front of the bolt. That is a sign of a bad ring. You also have to take into consideration the amount of pressure the spring would be applying to the bolt, which would continue to move the bolt through the receiver.
quaked4 2 years ago
Correction, I shouldnt say dumbass, because it does seem like you know a bit about firearms, but you should be aware that this is a common ring problem and the ring simply needs to be replaced. If you do not replace the ring, you will continue to have this problem... The rings are really cheap, just replace and go have some fun! :)
quaked4 2 years ago
It's 3 gas rings and they were brand-new.
troubleshooterBerlin 2 years ago
If this problem is a concern, change the cam pin to a roller cam pin. POF has them.
BDKEngraving 2 years ago
I know - they brought this out about 8 months after this video appeared (May 2009 update in the DESCRIPTION)
troubleshooterBerlin 2 years ago
cool vid. I never really saw a problem with cam pin wear... i have 2k rounds down mine and it just took the finish off... i wouldnt call it "excessive force" as it doesnt cause a problem unless the gun is not maintained.
vinnyraf 2 years ago
I'm not going to question your talent or qualifications as a machinist or gunsmith.
This really isn't a problem...
I've built, rebuilt, owned and fired over a dozen M-16, Car-15 and match AR-15 and my AR-10.
All of which share the same architecture concerning the bolt/carrier feeding. I've never run into a feeding problem caused by the drag of the receiver/bolt carrier or bolt cam pin.
Whitehorze 2 years ago
Thanks :-)
I don't wanna fire up this debate again but I came across this while checking several decommissioned M16 uppers which all showed that same groove. And I wanted to know where it comes from - I didn't invent it.
First almost everyone was bashing me but half a year later that thing got a name: "cam pin wear" and an experienced AR manufacturer like LWRC claimed this to be a long known thing:
"It is a result of the cam pin acting on that surface during the feeding operation."
relevant?
troubleshooterBerlin 2 years ago
If your working with decommissioned upper receivers it is entirerly possible that those rifles (particularily if they have no forward assist) were vietnam era with round counts above 100,000 both single and full auto.
Modern receivers are thicker (and heavier) overall which you can see with the A3 flattop in your video.
Like I said, use mil-spec parts and this isn't a problem.
I replaced half a rifle because the parts were junk, I used mil-spec parts and it worked fine after that...
Whitehorze 2 years ago
Ah, I remember cleaning the shit out of those back in Basic. I wish the US would decide on a new rifle. I got bored with the M16s and M4s quick
ChiefsFan58 2 years ago
They were trying out the M8, but apparently that melted in the intense heat of...well, the sun :S
nicck 2 years ago
The best replacement would likely be the Magpul Masada (Bushmaster ACR). It has the fastest barrel change out of all rifles being considered, it is also the only all-American one. The 416 is expensive, and the XM8 doesn't take STANAG mags, not to mention the fact that it doesn't have anywhere near the same controls.
patsfanczar 2 years ago
what a piece
verdemanthe1 2 years ago
Comment removed
meatabuse 2 years ago
Disregard, I hadn't watched far enough.
meatabuse 2 years ago
troubleshooter what do you prefer ak47 7.62x39 or ak74 5.45x39? And what would be the grouping MOA at 100 meters with both rifles
jayrod68 2 years ago
hi jayrod
strongly prefer the 7.62x39
never seen the need for the 5.45mm
group will depend on the particular rifle, ammo, barrel length...
with selected ammo and in good shape a standard AK should be able to stay in a circle of 100mm/4in at 100 meters
The SIG550 series is nicely made but expensive and IMO a complicated AK design.
troubleshooterBerlin 2 years ago
How about the Bushmaster ACR which is what I believe to cheaper and better shooting regular 5.56x45 NATO as regular m4/m16 but have optional 7.62x39 non NATO which fits standard AK-47. Has 30 round clip and much more reliable without much jamming problems with lighter weight than AK-47.
TheLOLBUNNIES 2 years ago
Don't wanna kill all joy but at the Remington ACR fact sheet the 7.62x39 isn't listed. The MASADA introduced an AK lower but wasn't exactly AK-like. But MUST have the same or less receiver contour like the AK. Otherwise the "bad" guys can easily modify their mags to not fit into the new rifle but still in an AK. No use of battlefield pick-up mags anymore.
Not much jamming problems? There isnt a substantial number of them out there to justify such a statement.
ACR and AKM weigh about the same.
troubleshooterBerlin 2 years ago
Check wikipedia or go type bushmaster acr future weapons on utube and he will tell you at the end it a optional clip of
7.62x39 clip. Just because he I quoted doesn't mean it can fit ak47 clip, they have to remodify the clip and parts of the gun customization.
TheLOLBUNNIES 2 years ago
ACR shoots 6.8 x43. A ammunition ballistically superior to 5.56 NATO and 7.62 x39.
irbananasalad 2 years ago
I have zero problems with my AR15s. Never jam and I've owned 14 of them over the last 20 years.
tripmatt1 2 years ago
Here is a good one for you. What about the Sig 556 rifle? Here we have crappy AKs because of supplement american parts mixed with the AK manufactuer parts to make well not a bad AK, but AK that doesn't hold up to the reputation as well has it should. M4s are ok but Sig 556 seems its modular, accuarcy, and reliable. Other guns are way expensive or hard to find parts for. Sig are also new here in the U.S.
jayrod68 2 years ago
I had a sig 556 and it had to be sent back to sig 3 times. Mine shot like dog crap. 9" groups at 100 yard with $25 match ammo. I sent it back they changed out the barrel and gas system and still only 4-5" groups. Other parts broke also. I sold it at a $500 loss.
tripmatt1 2 years ago
I completely get what your saying it all makes sense, but I have tried to this to my M4 carbine and not cause the same effect in my upper reciever. Then again my carbine only has 200 rounds through it. I would figure maybe a loose gas key and something wrong with the bolt head maybe the gas rings. Either way I do believe this is possible, but my cousin and a manager I work with are in the army and fired thousands of rounds from their M4s and never had this problem. How would you modify the bolt?
jayrod68 2 years ago
@jayrod68 if you try to do it as he does, remember he has only a receiver, which is very light. you will not be able to pick up the upper with all gizmos, barrels, attached (the weight will overcome the friction). if you move the bolt back and forth without the fwd resistance then applie pressure to the bolt face, asif to simulate stripping rounds you will notice additional friction (amount varies)
TBS-what is your take on the FAL? i notice a similar effect, tough in adifferent manner.
bennie2030 2 years ago
I have no personal experience with the FAL.
But the SKS bolt tilts down in a similar manner. For about half of the bolt travel the hammer pushes from below against the bolt counteracting a possible move downwards. But so you get a tendency to cant between the bolt carrier and the receiver (guide rails in the receiver are too short).
Pics of the FAL bcg show wear marks from the hammer at the lower rear edge of the bolt carrier but not on the the bolt itself. So it doesn't seem to act SKS-like.
troubleshooterBerlin 2 years ago
hi jayrod
you must prevent the bolt from starting (trying) to rotate until it enters the barrel extension. There are several ways. Steyr AUG and FN F2000 e.g. are doing so.
Unfortunately no simple fix that could be done by the user.
troubleshooterBerlin 2 years ago
troubleshooter this video like your other videos are well done and informative. those of you who dont understand watch again and study it. if you have a AR do as he does and you will notice the additional friction the design imposes on the bolt as it goes to battery. this friction may/ may not be alot but IT IS THERE-it depends on condition/lube/cleanliness, etc. basically some of the energy of the ret spring is wasted overcoming bolt friction instead of stripping rounds affecting reliability
bennie2030 2 years ago
" ...instead of stripping rounds affecting reliability" plus overcoming the stiff extractor and ejector springs at the last few millimeters of the bolt travel what may require to use the forward assist
Thank you! - that's exactly what this is about