@nastylefthook1 Ali outclassed Foreman. Ali wasnt hurt at all in that fight. Many of the punches foreman threw werent even hitting Ali squarely. Everyone had Ali ahead going into the 8th round anyways. & it makes perfect sense that Liston couldnt beat Ali the 1st time because styles make fights! Ali was faster & used that speed to stay out of range. Backing up had a PRIME Ali fought Frazier he would have ran circles around frazier. Frazier landed the heavier blows & thats why he got the decision
@nastylefthook1 I know you did not just bring Ali's parkinson's disease into the conversation. You are terrible we are talking about in the ring not the effects it had afterwards. Are you joking Ali was not in his prime when he fought Frazier he had been away for 3 years he lost his sharpness and reflexes. Norton lost a unanimous decision in the 3rd fight with Ali and the 2nd fight was was close and the judges voted in favor of Ali.
1899sharkey,,,,not particularly long,,,but a dogged fighter who kept after clay,,,much like frazier did in first fight,,,,more of a stand up fighter with a sneaky right,,,after watching clay/jones,,,it doesnt make any sense that liston could not defeat clay in their first fight,,
clay was not the greatest,,,liberal media hype,,,doug jones at 600 ft 188 had clay nearly whipped in 1963,,norton beat him three times,,prime frazier kicked prime clays ass,,,foreman pounded him for 7 rounds,,,trouble was he exhausted himself pounding on idiot clay,,,foreman still has his facalties,,clay is punch drunk,,who won,
@nastylefthook1 Were you born stupid, or have you been hit in the head too many times (given your user name). You are right ALI did run but that was his style hes not going to stand there and slug with Liston. He used his quickness and outboxed Liston all night in Miami. Ali was the greatest fight to ever step into the ring and would have beaten Liston everyday of the week. Ali ran his mouth to get inside opponents heads and it worked everytime except once... When he fought Frazier the 1st time.
sonny liston was approached by young cassius clay in a las vegas casino,,clay ran his big mouth,,,and sonny walked up and slapped him like a bitch,,,,clay didnt do anything but run,,,,liston was a man,,,clay has always been a punk
@Mrkilluminati248 That's B.S. He beat the crap out of Patterson and won the title fair and square. Boxers hold and hit all the time, it's the ref's job to keep them apart. I suppose you're gonna say he cheated in the 2nd fight too? Where Sonny again knocked Floyd out in the 1st round.
I read that Patterson may have thrown this fight. I'm watching it to see for myself and it's odd. Aside from the two quick lefts that Patterson landed at 0:11, I don't think he connected a single blow in this fight.
True story: I was born the night of this fight. My mother said that the doctors were listening to the fight over the radio and just when they announced the knockout, I was born. They didn't have the exact time of my birth until they read when the knockout occurred.
I have never known what to make of Sonny Liston...I have often rated champions by what they did after they lost the title and Liston did nothing. It is true he won the title at an old age, but both Eddie Machen and Muhammad Ali made Liston look very average. One feature I never liked was the fact that he was very robotic in his movements, you can almost predict what he is going to do. He also was bad when he was put on the defensive.
@kinneyshoe He did do a little after losing the title. he beat some decent (though not contending) opponents. And it looked like he might have been nearing a title shot had he not lost to Leotis Martin. Personally, I could easily see Frazier underestimating Liston, because we all know what happened when the former fought George Foreman. Otherwise... I must agree. Liston never did really did good when he was in trouble, although I give him credit for being able to avoid it- usually.
It was said that Sonny was never really deft - like he was saying "Ahem" before each punch. But having been almost shocked here by Patterson's lack of attacking game, he obviously saw he could lam him fast and finish it off. But he was furious when he felt that the reporters dissed Floyd afterwards by asking if Sonny thought Floyd was so scared he had "laid down." He told them "That last punch would have put ANY man down" - along with a meaningful glare at the offending enquirer.
Using a come forward peek-a-boo style against Liston is the worst way to fight him. If Patterson "boxed" instead of coming forward he might have been able to beat Liston...
@theDeckisStacked He Didn't have much trouble in the second one though, he won convincingly. While there were no knockdowns he did out box Frazier all night. But their trilogy was very close all together, both had the styles that their fights were destined to be classics. Even though Frazier won the first fight, Frazier was in the hospital for one month, and even though Ali won the rubber match they both finished each other in Manila in terms of both becoming shot after such a WAR.
Liston wins this fight 10/10 times. He was a heavyweight...Patterson would be a cruiserweight today. He was just too small and did not have enough of a chin to stay in there with a younger Liston. Easy money for Sonny
@cbaldwinjr You've said what I've never had the guts to say online in 3 years of being on YT lol! Yeah, always thought Floyd was too " boyish" in his make up for Ali and Liston. Liston was a bear. Never stood a chance. Too light. You can see the difference in the Patterson - Ali fight ' 72. Still my favorite boxer though.
Patterson began as middleweight: at 17 he won Olympic, Golden Gloves and National Amateur titles. Later upped to light-heavyweight, his natural class.
D'Amato wanted him in the marquee division -but admitted "we put him on a diet we soon have a middleweight on our hands again". But even with bulking, Liston outweighed him 214 to 189. The laws of physics obtained and Floyd got the Mack truck upside the head experience.
BTW Sonny was about 5 years older than his license stated.
Spot on with all of those points. Yeah, he might be more of a light-heavy...around 175 pounds. Does anyone really know how old Charles "Sonny" Liston really was???
@krakenwave I don't think anyone really knows how old Sonny was - there were no birth records anywhere for him - no birth certificate etc, Nobody knows exactly when he died either - they can only estimate that. Sort of adds to the mystery and enigma that was Liston IMO.
Liston was very smart. He adjusted by bringing punches up, and once he did that Patterson had no idea how to avoid the beating he absorbed.
He had quick hands, but his legs were nothing special. I'm surprised he didn't try to stay inside more, and tie up those long arms. But, Liston was a terrible opponent for just about anyone, and probably a fight Patterson would lose 95 out of 100 times no matter what he did.
reason why floyd loose against soony is that he had 0 punches in his face too slow, haha liston is old enough to be patterson father WRONG he is born 1932 floyd 1935 but speed is important in box that day floyd loose speed and he look like 20 years older then soony. but i think that 2 matches 62 and 63 is legendary matches. both boxers would be kill klickov and tyson that s for sure.
Liston was what we might call "a short-runner". He was ok for the first six rounds after which he began to tire visibly. Had Floyd employed a hit and run tactics, he would have found Sonny Boy out. But I guess Liston's reputation somewhat overwhelmed Patterson who I thought adopted a wrong style in fighting Liston. Ali later proved my point correct in bombing out the frustrated Liston to claim the title.
@trailstar1 The cruiserweight division is not necessary. Dempsey, Louis, Satterfield, Quarry, among others, were all under 200lbs for most of their careers. All of them beat much bigger fighters on a regular basis. Any fighter over 185lbs could do well in the heavyweight division. Patterson himself defeated many big men after losing his title. His problems with Liston were that 1)He was somewhat intimidated by Liston. 2)He could not take much punishment.
@bismarck1234561 3) Liston had one of the best jabs in heavyweight history.
BTW you can see Liston using the very same strategy many used to beat another D'Amato protege Mike Tyson. Throw the big left jab. Three punches at a time. When Patterson gets close, tie him up and push him off. Patterson turns into a one punch fighter.
@bismarck1234561 Plus Floyd was very light for a heavyweight. 190 pounds. Liston out weighed him by 25 pounds. Patterson;s style was tailormade for Sonny - he just walked right up to him trying to get underneath. It just a matter of time before Liston's bombs killed him
Liston was one of the toughest fighters who ever fought in the heavyweight division. He had a HUGE reach of 84 inches. His jab was like a cattle prod... and he could hook good with his left also. He was quick for a man his size; not as fast as Ali, but quick nonetheless. If you believed he was unbeatable as many did, then you were disappointed at his loss to Ali; but considering Ali was probably the best. of all...he really wasn't that bad.. Pretty dam good, in fact.
@theman1819 I can believe that. When I was young, I trained in a gym with pro boxers in it, and trainers didn't like to teach people to fight left-handed for several reasons: 1) because they didn't know how to teach people to fight left handed, 2) it made lousy fights, they got tangled up with both fighters leading from the same side. There weren't too many fighters in the US who were lefties until Hagler came around. The only ones I remember were "cuties" like Kenny Lane, who made lousy fights
@TheGatorfan93 I don't believe that would have happened. Liston had pretty good reflexes and was at the top of his career when he fought Ali. It wasn't lack of stamina that defeated him. It was someone who was just a better fighter. Ali dominated him. To assume that there would have been a different outcome if Liston was younger would be unreasonable in my opinion. He didn't even knock Ali down or hurt him when he couldn't even see.
He was at least 36,how can he be at the top of his career?He was at his best in the mid to late 50's!Of course ali was the better fighter...THEN ..in 1964.He was at his physical peak.Liston had a good 2nd and 4th round,and did hurt ali late in the 3rd round with a couple of uppercuts,that forced ali to hold on for dear life.So i don't know how you could think that its unreasonable he'd beat ali,being much younger and with obviously better reflexes.
@TheGatorfan93:I don't think Ali reached that until he was about 30 when he beat Foreman. Maybe you're right about Liston not being at his peak. He was inactive for two years before Ali except for the Patterson fights, which were almost nothing. I have watched Liston's fights with Machen and Whitehurst on ESPN though. They both took him the distance. I thought the Machen fight was very close. Whitehurst actually had Liston hurt a couple times early.
@fistofate It was obvious Machen just wanted to survive,he didn't throw a right hand in the fight...not one...i don't think.And whitehurst caught liston a few times,but i don't think he ever hurt him.And liston won every round i believe.
@fistofate I think the Machen fight was the blueprint for Ali's strategy. Dundee was probably watching and saw how to trouble Liston with his kid in the future
Patterson went into this fight knowing he was going to lose. There was so much more than just boxing involved, he had all the black civil rights leaders hoping he would win, (due to Listons criminal record and ties to the "mob") so he could be a poster child for the black movement, also he met with JFK and he really wanted him to win aswell. Aparentley Patterson said years later "all i could see were the faces of the people who wanted me to win" He took a disgiuse with him to wear home.2niceGuy.
Actually, Floyd Patterson could punch. Ask Ingemar Johannsson, Henry Cooper and Archie Moore. While it's true that he did not have the best chin, he often took good shots and got up after having been knocked down.
A contrast in styles: Patterson was fighting out of couch, bobbing and weaving. It is hard to hit a moving target. Patterson seems to be the aggressor and is lunging into Liston. Patterson is similiar to Frazier; Liston is similiar to Foreman. Both men get caught with one, big, powerful blow from which neither recovers. Ali would have rested against the ropes, until his head cleared, but rope-a-dope would have been an absolute contradiction to these men's styles of boxing.
Obviously Patterson should have stayed away from him. Frazier could punch and take a punch, Patterson could do neither. Liston had a much more compact style than Foreman.
I just finish watching phantom punch movie about sonny liston the movie was entertaining I really dont know how much of the story was true or hollywood fiction but the actor who played sonny (ving rhames) did a hell of a job to bad it went straight to dvd and not marketed to the movies
I think that Floyd forgot his gameplan because he was scared of the giant Liston.Sonny was a scary man,no doubt about that.This was boxing when boxing was boxing,those were the times.
I think that Floyd forgot his gameplan because he was scared of the giant Liston.Sonny was a scary man,no doubt about that.This was boxing when boxing was boxing,those were the times.
That was decent of Liston to go straight over to Patterson after he had just won the world championship. Most guys would be running round the ring going mental.
Get real people. If sonny liston was fighting today he would be undisputed undefeated heavyweight champion of the world. The same can be said for muhammad ali, george foreman, joe louis, rocky marciano, jim jeffries, joe frazier, jack dempsey and so many more, the current heavyweight champions are pathetic.
You get real and stop living in the past. Wladimir Klitschko may not be the greatest heavyweight champion but hes still better then jeffries, who we barely have any footage of..
@TommyGun7111 Better than jeffries, don't make me laugh, anyone who ever saw jeffries fight were amazed by him, the founder of ring magazine who saw all the great champions always maintained jeffries was the best, he could do 6ft high jump, run the 100 yard dash in 10.5 seconds, he is definetly a top 10 heavyweight on a all time list. Jeffries can't help the era in which he fought, there is some good footage of jeffries training on youtube, its worth a watch. Wladimir is not top 20.
uhh yeah Wladimir Klitschko is way better actually..
basically all you're telling me is that he was a great athlete, but theres still not that many fights of him. We have no idea how good he really was. so we can just speculate on the stories that you're telling me.
I actually think Wladimir is already top 20. if he gets a chance to beat Haye, Vitali, Povetkin, Solis, and Adamek, he is going to be even higher.
@TommyGun7111 He has a poor chin, against any man who can punch hard, has great stamina and can take a punch he would get knocked out. Jeffries has all those components to defeat wladimir, jeffries before his return to fight johnson had never been even knocked down, and lets not forget it took an active, sharp, great fighter like johnson till the final round to defeat a rusty coming out of six years in retirement jeffries, that alone is testament to how good jeffries was.
tommy i disagree in this topic, sulivan for example was a fucking animal and any old champ had much more stamina than both klitschko, because they could fight more than 20 rounds and the klitschko never fought more than 12 rounds. jim jefries could take a good blow, he was robust like the hell, he was 6,0 and weighed 240 pounds of muscle when he was 25 years old against Finnegan, wladimir is 6´6 and 240 pounds, jefriess might fight in the round 12 with the same intensity as in the round 5.
@TommyGun7111 - Jeffries would demolish W. Klitchko. We may not of seen a ton of Jeff, but I've seen plenty enough to know he'd k.o. glass chin W. . Top 20? lmao
Nope. Who knows how he really fought besides those 3 fights that he had. who knows how he really preformed in his other bouts.
Yeah top 20. The guy is dominant, has plenty of defenses, and has defeated some good competition.
You're probably one of those nostoligic dudes who thinks Fighters THAT FAR BACK were actually better then these huge modern heavyweights.. These Klitschko guys hit harder, are faster, stronger, bigger, and had more skill then Jeffries for sure...
@TommyGun7111 - " These huge modern heavyweights" Who fall over when tapped on the chin! Pathetic. You're one of these "modern" dudes who actually believe these rank novices are fighters. So,how would W. handle going 15? Or do we have to make it a 12 rounder for these great modern fighters. Jeff would k.o. both robots in the same night easily.
@TommyGun7111 - We sure do have enough footage. Theres all kinds of footage on the K's, thats all I need to see. Hell, Jess Willard would beat W. You are too wrapped in the myth that modern fighters are somehow magically superior to the old timers. Boxing gym's in every n'hood from 1920- 70. Nothing today.
@TommyGun7111 I agree with sharkey, and in case you didn't know jeffries was surprisingly fast, jeffries is a class above sullivan, so don't compare the two, the klitschko's are paper champions, beating no name fighters, in often boring fashion. Hell they won't even fight haye, shows how cowardly they are. They are champions in the very weakest of the heavyweight divisions history. I did value your opinon but if you believe any of the current crop of heavyweights could beat jeffries, DAMN.
@XavierMarciano xavier, i haven´t jefries in my top 10 hw, because his record is
won 19 (KO 16) 1 (KO 1), i think that an all time great should have more fights and more wars in his record, and his few rivals weren´t "ali", "joe louis", "foreman","frazier", "marciano"...
hi deserves credit, of course,but his record is not "GREAT"
@combatesdeboxeo Jeffries was 6'2" and his best weight was 220-225 pounds, I don't think its about the number of fights you have, i believe its what you do in those fights that matters. Jeffries was the heavyweight champion with the least amount of fights in getting there ever, he could have " PADDED " his record with soft wins like almost every fighter does, but he didn't, that is one of the biggest reasons I admire him.
@XavierMarciano - Well said! Jeff fought 14 rounds in his debut , many fighters needed 30 fights to build that kind of endurance. He was also a fighting champ defending his belt 6 or 7 times.
@1899sharkey Thanks 1899sharkey, you clearly know your stuff about the boilermaker jeffries, I think he vastly underated, its a shame of the time he fought in, if there was more footage of him, no doubt tommygun7111 and many others would quickly change their opinon of him, he would be more highly regarded, of course I already have great respect for him.
@XavierMarciano I THINK JEFRIES MIGHT WELL KO WLADIMIR, BUT I THINK VITALI HAS BETTER CHIN THAN HIS BROTHER, HE WOULD BE A HARD MATCH FOR HIS SIZE AND SKILL. BUT JEFRIES WOULD HAVE HIS CHANCE OF COURSE. HE HAD MORE STAMINA, I THINK IF THEY FIGHT MORE THAN 15 ROUNDS, JEFRIES WOULD WIN FOR SURE. ARTICLE CORBETT VS JEFRIES "He was clearly outboxed in 20 rounds and at times was made to look like a novice,but Jeffries showed his ability to take punishment at any distance and hard."
@XavierMarciano YES XAVIER, I AGREE IT IS NOT JUST ON NUMBERS,AND I THINK JEFRIES HAD GREAT STAMINA,HE WAS A STRONG GUY, AND HE COULD TAKE A PUNCH BUT I THINK JEFRIES NEVER WAS TESTED WITH GREAT BOXERS, I THINK HIS BEST VICTORIES WERE AGAINST Bob Fitzsimmons(172 POUNDS) AND CORBETT(183 POUNDS). I THINK MARCIANO NEVER FACED GREAT RIVALS,BUT HE FACED BETTER RIVALS THAN JEFRIES DID IN MY OPINION.
@TommyGun7111 you should give more credit to the old champs, maybe wladimir has more skill than jefries, but jim was a stronger man who lived a harder era , i think wladimir has not a good chin, if they fight to 20 rounds, wladimir would be the jefries´s victim after of the round 15, simply like that.
@1899sharkey i think the biggest advantage of jeffries on the klitschkos is the stamina, i think if they fight 12 rounds jefries would lose against vitali, but if they fight more than 15, jefries would win.
@combatesdeboxeo - I am always talking 15 championship rounds, 3minutes long and a 20ft. ring with 6 ounce gloves. The 13,14 and 15th round were what seperates the men from the boys. Neither K brother belongs in the same breath as Jeffries.
@combatesdeboxeo I think jeffries would score a late knock out for either klitschko, there is such a huge difference between fighting twelve rounds than fiftheen, Those three more rounds are what make legendary champions, when your down in the trenches, taking big blows, tiring and taking deep breaths, and your rival is still coming forward, that is when you discover how good a fighter really is. When the chips are down, and the fight are going against them, ability to overcome is what counts.
@XavierMarciano "there is such a huge difference between fighting twelve rounds than fiftheen, Those three more rounds are what make legendary champions"
@XavierMarciano " There is such a huge difference between fighting twelve rounds than fiftheen, Those three more rounds are what make legendary champions" I AGREE ABSOLUTELY
dude they had to go for a slower workrate to go that many rounds. Today they add on more muscle and weight because they don't have to go as many rounds.
we still dont have enough footage of them... Wlad has shown devestating power and speed of the footage we have of him.
@TommyGun7111 - If ignorance is bliss then you are one very happy man. Jeffries- Sharkey at coney isle was 25 rounds of constant, hard fighting. Nuff said
@TommyGun7111 Its hard to imagine anyone knocking out jeffries, you could probably count the true contenders on one hand, there are many fighters who could decision jeffries possibly, but very few who would be capable of knocking him out, and there is a huge difference in going fiftheen rounds than twelve, the gap is massive. Wlad would be knocked out in round 8, vitali would be knocked out in round 13.
Why do you think that? Jeffries isn't some superhuman incapable of gettign knocked out.
yeah I agree with you. What's the point of comparing Wlad going 15 rounds? they changed the rules so the only fair way to compare the two is by going 12 rounds.
Vitali just flat out WOULDN'T be knocked out. If Lennox lewis cant do it then Jeffires is certainly not doing it
@TommyGun7111 Old lennox lewis couldn't do it, vitali is just a big lump of a man, if he was to face a fighter with real aggression, power, and the stamina to keep on punching he would be knocked out, I would back frazier to knock out vitali, and hell there is a massive size and weight difference between them, it wouldn't make a difference frazier would cut him down with body shots and left hooks. Frazier is 5'11" and half, best weight 209. Jeffries is 6'2" best weight 225. Both would beat him.
@XavierMarciano - Absolutely. Frazier was a real fighter and a great one at that.All the Klitchkos have is size. This isn't wrestling or basketball for gods sake, its fighting and the main ingredient is knowing how to fight. This present crop of h.w.s makes the bums of the 80's look good.
@TommyGun7111 - Damn right I'm nostalgic, These bums today are pathetic. I'm used to debating fights between great fighters but you make it too easy. When you throw out all the paper champions since the 80's and just count the legitimate champs W. k. is one of the worst champs in history. A pure novice with a glass jaw.
@thecaliforniaknight Liston was a very skilled and calculated fighter with one of the greatest jabs in HW history and a rock solid chin. The fantom punch everyone knows was b.s. He has more than a chance with any HW past or present. Check out the Cleveland Williams fight.
That is true but if the kiltchkos and david haye dont fight then I will never watch another heavy bout for long time. Everyone of the top ten fighters refused to fight james lights out toney which pretty much forced him out of boxing. James toney is so defensive and hard hitting they fear him for it
Floyd was just an insecure, neurotic mess for this fight, if not all the time. Floyd gave up like 40 pounds to Liston. And Liston hit like a Mack Truck..
Patterson lost this fight before it even started, you cant see it on this tape but if you ever watched the pre-fight introduction staredowns Floyd kept looking down and sort of refused to lock eyes with Sonny.
He was already intimidated before the opening bell!
@jwh1999 Yea i just came across this movie on netflicks (it's on the instant cue) and man was it good. I was always a fan of Liston even though he was way before my time (i'm only 29) Most definatly a great fighter and if you guys get a chance you should watch this movie it shows a whole new light to Sonny and his turmoil in life.
Liston was cool after the knockout, going over to check on Floyd before celebrating. He did the same thing in the first fight w/Cleveland Williams. That glare of his, the connections with the mob, it all seemed to add up to a really bad dude--and he was inside the ring. But I bet he was cool outside of it.
@1899sharkey: Yeah, I thought so. I knew Floyd Patterson was one of the nicest gentleman to ever step into a ring and figured by his behavior, Liston must have been cool too.
BTW, I saw your comment on another upload in which you remarked that you once met Floyd and he was very nice and signed autographs all day long w/out complaint. He was a real credit to boxing, a great guy.
@Kedbuka - What was impressive was Floyd drove from New York to michigan with a car load of kids for a small town amateur boxing show. I was very happy when the crowd gave him a tremendous ovation. A true gentleman and a great fighter.
Its too bad Floyd is remembered primarily for the Liston fights. A two time undisputed champ who fought all the contenders after his losses to Sonny in the sixtys. He even beat Bonavena in '72, sixteen years after first winning the belt. All in all I'd say a heck of a career.
I read Hunter S. Thompson was somewhere front row with Rocky Marciano during the fight. He didn't bet wrong, and was bummed he didn't even finish his second beer before it was over.
Patterson had the best hand-speed of all heavyweights (except for Ali), he should have boxed more and stayed away from Liston instead of trying to go inside and slug it out with the monstrous Liston
TommyGun, just seen it, yes clear left straight arm, hip movement connected with cheeckbone. still surprised it was enough to KO a guy as hard as Liston but it was a real hit.
@TommyGun7111 Yeh a magic punch that shows Ali after the fight saying "did i hit him?" and enough to knock Liston down until he thinks the fight is over by which time he gets up comfrotably and leaves the ring. Amazing "knock out punch"
ummm please you really don't know how hard it was.. that was actually the same exact punch that knocked down Zora folley the first time, it was originally a Jack Johnson original punch.
Also Liston kind of ran into it, it was certainly by surprise. It's the punches that a fighter doesn't see that will knock him out.
Anyway, you're free to have your own opinion on the punch, seriously it's old history, but anyway Liston was 100% Lethal in his prime.
@nastylefthook1 Ali outclassed Foreman. Ali wasnt hurt at all in that fight. Many of the punches foreman threw werent even hitting Ali squarely. Everyone had Ali ahead going into the 8th round anyways. & it makes perfect sense that Liston couldnt beat Ali the 1st time because styles make fights! Ali was faster & used that speed to stay out of range. Backing up had a PRIME Ali fought Frazier he would have ran circles around frazier. Frazier landed the heavier blows & thats why he got the decision
Dpal93 1 week ago
@nastylefthook1 I know you did not just bring Ali's parkinson's disease into the conversation. You are terrible we are talking about in the ring not the effects it had afterwards. Are you joking Ali was not in his prime when he fought Frazier he had been away for 3 years he lost his sharpness and reflexes. Norton lost a unanimous decision in the 3rd fight with Ali and the 2nd fight was was close and the judges voted in favor of Ali.
Dpal93 1 week ago
1899sharkey,,,,not particularly long,,,but a dogged fighter who kept after clay,,,much like frazier did in first fight,,,,more of a stand up fighter with a sneaky right,,,after watching clay/jones,,,it doesnt make any sense that liston could not defeat clay in their first fight,,
nastylefthook1 1 week ago
clay was not the greatest,,,liberal media hype,,,doug jones at 600 ft 188 had clay nearly whipped in 1963,,norton beat him three times,,prime frazier kicked prime clays ass,,,foreman pounded him for 7 rounds,,,trouble was he exhausted himself pounding on idiot clay,,,foreman still has his facalties,,clay is punch drunk,,who won,
nastylefthook1 2 weeks ago
@nastylefthook1 - 600 ft. tall? He must of had a hell of a reach!
1899sharkey 1 week ago
@nastylefthook1 Were you born stupid, or have you been hit in the head too many times (given your user name). You are right ALI did run but that was his style hes not going to stand there and slug with Liston. He used his quickness and outboxed Liston all night in Miami. Ali was the greatest fight to ever step into the ring and would have beaten Liston everyday of the week. Ali ran his mouth to get inside opponents heads and it worked everytime except once... When he fought Frazier the 1st time.
Dpal93 3 weeks ago 3
@nastylefthook1 WHATS UR PROBLEM FAGGOT, UR NOT MAN ENOUGH TO CALL HIM CLAY U HOUSE NIGGA HE D SLAP U LIKE THE BITCH U ARE
smokinlefthook 1 month ago
sonny liston was approached by young cassius clay in a las vegas casino,,clay ran his big mouth,,,and sonny walked up and slapped him like a bitch,,,,clay didnt do anything but run,,,,liston was a man,,,clay has always been a punk
nastylefthook1 1 month ago
@nastylefthook1 I don't know who you're referring to. This Clay guy....oh that white lightweight guy from New Jersey? Was that him?
Seguris 3 weeks ago
Iced out chain lookin like Sonny Liston
generalwilcox 2 months ago
At 1:47: Liston lands the left hook that sets up the win, after that Patterson is only seeking evasive action.
eckythimble 3 months ago
@theirishbloke Sonny was in his prime here...
ssimon64 4 months ago
@Mrkilluminati248 That's B.S. He beat the crap out of Patterson and won the title fair and square. Boxers hold and hit all the time, it's the ref's job to keep them apart. I suppose you're gonna say he cheated in the 2nd fight too? Where Sonny again knocked Floyd out in the 1st round.
ssimon64 4 months ago
lol liston cheated.he was holding and punching before the knock out.
MrKilluminati248 4 months ago
All Floyd had to do was KEEP AWAY and box. But NOOOO....
conewells 4 months ago 2
49yr's ago today ....just a pity Sonny never got a title shot in his prime ...when he should of ,,
theirishbloke 5 months ago
I read that Patterson may have thrown this fight. I'm watching it to see for myself and it's odd. Aside from the two quick lefts that Patterson landed at 0:11, I don't think he connected a single blow in this fight.
TrueTalkTV 5 months ago
True story: I was born the night of this fight. My mother said that the doctors were listening to the fight over the radio and just when they announced the knockout, I was born. They didn't have the exact time of my birth until they read when the knockout occurred.
trinasp 5 months ago
Was Patterson the first to use the peek-a-boo stance?? Notice how he's bobbing n weaving like tyson.
destroyxeverything 6 months ago
@destroyxeverything
yeah they had the same mentor in Cus Damato and he was the God of the peak a boo style.
Ahmet1445 5 months ago
Comment removed
JeverHuelse 6 months ago
poor floyd liston was too powerful!
rtfuhj 6 months ago
I have never known what to make of Sonny Liston...I have often rated champions by what they did after they lost the title and Liston did nothing. It is true he won the title at an old age, but both Eddie Machen and Muhammad Ali made Liston look very average. One feature I never liked was the fact that he was very robotic in his movements, you can almost predict what he is going to do. He also was bad when he was put on the defensive.
kinneyshoe 6 months ago
@kinneyshoe He did do a little after losing the title. he beat some decent (though not contending) opponents. And it looked like he might have been nearing a title shot had he not lost to Leotis Martin. Personally, I could easily see Frazier underestimating Liston, because we all know what happened when the former fought George Foreman. Otherwise... I must agree. Liston never did really did good when he was in trouble, although I give him credit for being able to avoid it- usually.
93stormer 6 months ago
@kinneyshoe
It was said that Sonny was never really deft - like he was saying "Ahem" before each punch. But having been almost shocked here by Patterson's lack of attacking game, he obviously saw he could lam him fast and finish it off. But he was furious when he felt that the reporters dissed Floyd afterwards by asking if Sonny thought Floyd was so scared he had "laid down." He told them "That last punch would have put ANY man down" - along with a meaningful glare at the offending enquirer.
krakenwave 6 months ago
Using a come forward peek-a-boo style against Liston is the worst way to fight him. If Patterson "boxed" instead of coming forward he might have been able to beat Liston...
vladiator100 7 months ago
@theDeckisStacked He Didn't have much trouble in the second one though, he won convincingly. While there were no knockdowns he did out box Frazier all night. But their trilogy was very close all together, both had the styles that their fights were destined to be classics. Even though Frazier won the first fight, Frazier was in the hospital for one month, and even though Ali won the rubber match they both finished each other in Manila in terms of both becoming shot after such a WAR.
vladiator100 7 months ago
Liston wins this fight 10/10 times. He was a heavyweight...Patterson would be a cruiserweight today. He was just too small and did not have enough of a chin to stay in there with a younger Liston. Easy money for Sonny
cbaldwinjr 7 months ago
@cbaldwinjr You've said what I've never had the guts to say online in 3 years of being on YT lol! Yeah, always thought Floyd was too " boyish" in his make up for Ali and Liston. Liston was a bear. Never stood a chance. Too light. You can see the difference in the Patterson - Ali fight ' 72. Still my favorite boxer though.
Noodles37UK 6 months ago
@cbaldwinjr
Patterson began as middleweight: at 17 he won Olympic, Golden Gloves and National Amateur titles. Later upped to light-heavyweight, his natural class.
D'Amato wanted him in the marquee division -but admitted "we put him on a diet we soon have a middleweight on our hands again". But even with bulking, Liston outweighed him 214 to 189. The laws of physics obtained and Floyd got the Mack truck upside the head experience.
BTW Sonny was about 5 years older than his license stated.
krakenwave 6 months ago
@krakenwave
Spot on with all of those points. Yeah, he might be more of a light-heavy...around 175 pounds. Does anyone really know how old Charles "Sonny" Liston really was???
cbaldwinjr 6 months ago
@krakenwave I don't think anyone really knows how old Sonny was - there were no birth records anywhere for him - no birth certificate etc, Nobody knows exactly when he died either - they can only estimate that. Sort of adds to the mystery and enigma that was Liston IMO.
theskeptic2010 6 months ago
he held him behind the head when he was knocked down.
trpldc99 7 months ago
@theDeckisStacked
what?
403766 7 months ago
@theDeckisStacked
and frazier, and patterson.. goat
403766 7 months ago
Liston was very smart. He adjusted by bringing punches up, and once he did that Patterson had no idea how to avoid the beating he absorbed.
He had quick hands, but his legs were nothing special. I'm surprised he didn't try to stay inside more, and tie up those long arms. But, Liston was a terrible opponent for just about anyone, and probably a fight Patterson would lose 95 out of 100 times no matter what he did.
TA152H01 8 months ago
Too bad Teddy Atlas doesn't post here and analyze these guys. He knows boxing better than anyone I've ever heard.
fistofate 8 months ago
Liston right shook him up with a right at 1.43 and a left at 1.46 before the ko blows on the ropes
genericgeorge 8 months ago
He was holding behind the neck, dirty but the ref didn't call it. Wouldn't have mattered though.
IChIDH 8 months ago
i think part of the decline of boxing is due to lack of annoucers like this
gino800 8 months ago
Floyd was great, Liston was just a terrible match up for him
agip07 9 months ago
reason why floyd loose against soony is that he had 0 punches in his face too slow, haha liston is old enough to be patterson father WRONG he is born 1932 floyd 1935 but speed is important in box that day floyd loose speed and he look like 20 years older then soony. but i think that 2 matches 62 and 63 is legendary matches. both boxers would be kill klickov and tyson that s for sure.
master82565 9 months ago
DAMN LISTON WAS A MONSTER!! LISTEN TO HIS PUNCHES!!
ONLY 1 LISTON, SHAME HE'S LIVING IN ALI'S SHADOW.
TakedownArmbar 9 months ago
Liston was what we might call "a short-runner". He was ok for the first six rounds after which he began to tire visibly. Had Floyd employed a hit and run tactics, he would have found Sonny Boy out. But I guess Liston's reputation somewhat overwhelmed Patterson who I thought adopted a wrong style in fighting Liston. Ali later proved my point correct in bombing out the frustrated Liston to claim the title.
macvatu 9 months ago
And this is why they made the Cruiserweight division
trailstar1 10 months ago
@trailstar1 The cruiserweight division is not necessary. Dempsey, Louis, Satterfield, Quarry, among others, were all under 200lbs for most of their careers. All of them beat much bigger fighters on a regular basis. Any fighter over 185lbs could do well in the heavyweight division. Patterson himself defeated many big men after losing his title. His problems with Liston were that 1)He was somewhat intimidated by Liston. 2)He could not take much punishment.
bismarck1234561 10 months ago
@bismarck1234561 3) Liston had one of the best jabs in heavyweight history.
BTW you can see Liston using the very same strategy many used to beat another D'Amato protege Mike Tyson. Throw the big left jab. Three punches at a time. When Patterson gets close, tie him up and push him off. Patterson turns into a one punch fighter.
mongoose704 9 months ago
@mongoose704 agreed.
bismarck1234561 9 months ago
@mongoose704 i agree listton ko's tyson in 3-4
messier991102 9 months ago
@bismarck1234561 Plus Floyd was very light for a heavyweight. 190 pounds. Liston out weighed him by 25 pounds. Patterson;s style was tailormade for Sonny - he just walked right up to him trying to get underneath. It just a matter of time before Liston's bombs killed him
genericgeorge 8 months ago
you hear those punches landing? they all sound very heavy coming from liston
Nemesis2151 11 months ago
@Nemesis2151 Well, its no wonder why they say Liston hit harder than guys like Foreman and Tyson...
NyyGyro 10 months ago
man liston had a sick jab
theman1819 11 months ago
this is box this is knockout . both boxers are best, floyd in this match is slow but sonny is beast. this match is better then 63 .
master82565 11 months ago
Liston was one of the toughest fighters who ever fought in the heavyweight division. He had a HUGE reach of 84 inches. His jab was like a cattle prod... and he could hook good with his left also. He was quick for a man his size; not as fast as Ali, but quick nonetheless. If you believed he was unbeatable as many did, then you were disappointed at his loss to Ali; but considering Ali was probably the best. of all...he really wasn't that bad.. Pretty dam good, in fact.
fistofate 1 year ago
@fistofate i heard a story that he was left handed and boxed orthadox
theman1819 11 months ago
@theman1819 this could be very true as im right handed and box southpaw, i'll look into it.
forbesfoofighters 11 months ago
@theman1819 I can believe that. When I was young, I trained in a gym with pro boxers in it, and trainers didn't like to teach people to fight left-handed for several reasons: 1) because they didn't know how to teach people to fight left handed, 2) it made lousy fights, they got tangled up with both fighters leading from the same side. There weren't too many fighters in the US who were lefties until Hagler came around. The only ones I remember were "cuties" like Kenny Lane, who made lousy fights
fistofate 11 months ago
@fistofate Liston was at least 35 when he fought ali,ali had just turned 22!Younger, with his reflexes,he knocks ali out!
TheGatorfan93 11 months ago
@TheGatorfan93 I don't believe that would have happened. Liston had pretty good reflexes and was at the top of his career when he fought Ali. It wasn't lack of stamina that defeated him. It was someone who was just a better fighter. Ali dominated him. To assume that there would have been a different outcome if Liston was younger would be unreasonable in my opinion. He didn't even knock Ali down or hurt him when he couldn't even see.
fistofate 10 months ago
@fistofate ''Top of his career''
He was at least 36,how can he be at the top of his career?He was at his best in the mid to late 50's!Of course ali was the better fighter...THEN ..in 1964.He was at his physical peak.Liston had a good 2nd and 4th round,and did hurt ali late in the 3rd round with a couple of uppercuts,that forced ali to hold on for dear life.So i don't know how you could think that its unreasonable he'd beat ali,being much younger and with obviously better reflexes.
TheGatorfan93 10 months ago
@TheGatorfan93:I don't think Ali reached that until he was about 30 when he beat Foreman. Maybe you're right about Liston not being at his peak. He was inactive for two years before Ali except for the Patterson fights, which were almost nothing. I have watched Liston's fights with Machen and Whitehurst on ESPN though. They both took him the distance. I thought the Machen fight was very close. Whitehurst actually had Liston hurt a couple times early.
fistofate 10 months ago
@fistofate It was obvious Machen just wanted to survive,he didn't throw a right hand in the fight...not one...i don't think.And whitehurst caught liston a few times,but i don't think he ever hurt him.And liston won every round i believe.
TheGatorfan93 10 months ago
@fistofate I think the Machen fight was the blueprint for Ali's strategy. Dundee was probably watching and saw how to trouble Liston with his kid in the future
genericgeorge 8 months ago
Floyd was k.o.d by two big hitters, Liston and Johannson, he more than held his own with everyone else.
1899sharkey 1 year ago
idc what anyone says, Floyd Patterson held his own in his loses, still one of the greatest heavyweights of all time
CLS718 1 year ago
Patterson went into this fight knowing he was going to lose. There was so much more than just boxing involved, he had all the black civil rights leaders hoping he would win, (due to Listons criminal record and ties to the "mob") so he could be a poster child for the black movement, also he met with JFK and he really wanted him to win aswell. Aparentley Patterson said years later "all i could see were the faces of the people who wanted me to win" He took a disgiuse with him to wear home.2niceGuy.
WALLY1234556 1 year ago
Floyd Patterson really got beat down in this fight. I think anyone would be knocked down if someone was in the position Floyd was in.
lilgrijalva 1 year ago
Actually, Floyd Patterson could punch. Ask Ingemar Johannsson, Henry Cooper and Archie Moore. While it's true that he did not have the best chin, he often took good shots and got up after having been knocked down.
jamaal7 1 year ago
Just like the first Frazier-Foreman fight.
imavaughanstar 1 year ago
A contrast in styles: Patterson was fighting out of couch, bobbing and weaving. It is hard to hit a moving target. Patterson seems to be the aggressor and is lunging into Liston. Patterson is similiar to Frazier; Liston is similiar to Foreman. Both men get caught with one, big, powerful blow from which neither recovers. Ali would have rested against the ropes, until his head cleared, but rope-a-dope would have been an absolute contradiction to these men's styles of boxing.
stephenwinkler 1 year ago
Obviously Patterson should have stayed away from him. Frazier could punch and take a punch, Patterson could do neither. Liston had a much more compact style than Foreman.
deepcosmiclove 1 year ago
are those sfx added in?
JessikahAznBabyy 1 year ago
I just finish watching phantom punch movie about sonny liston the movie was entertaining I really dont know how much of the story was true or hollywood fiction but the actor who played sonny (ving rhames) did a hell of a job to bad it went straight to dvd and not marketed to the movies
usabkny 1 year ago
"Everybody that hit Patterson knocked him down and if Liston hits him he's not gonna get back up."
Cassius Clay
jeffmagic32 1 year ago
floyd paterson doestn move like tyson
thodone 1 year ago
Sonny Liston was a gentlemen despite his intimidating presence... A ladies man, despite his fearful glares!
expressivechild 1 year ago
liston reminds me of a trained version of kimbo
Sunny4434 1 year ago
I think that Floyd forgot his gameplan because he was scared of the giant Liston.Sonny was a scary man,no doubt about that.This was boxing when boxing was boxing,those were the times.
Anders2989 1 year ago
@Anders2989 No doubt Sonny was scary. But, it's hard for me to think of a 6-0, 215 man as a giant.
Those were good times.
bptaylor11 1 year ago
@bptaylor11
compared to Patterson he was a giant.
tdk813 1 year ago
I think that Floyd forgot his gameplan because he was scared of the giant Liston.Sonny was a scary man,no doubt about that.This was boxing when boxing was boxing,those were the times.
Anders2989 1 year ago
What was Floyd thinking? He gave up his speed advantage to slug with Sonny Liston?! Pride can get your ass whipped!
zulubro 1 year ago
floyd has an enormous body
BadBlueBoy213 1 year ago
That was decent of Liston to go straight over to Patterson after he had just won the world championship. Most guys would be running round the ring going mental.
Maxshard 1 year ago
Get real people. If sonny liston was fighting today he would be undisputed undefeated heavyweight champion of the world. The same can be said for muhammad ali, george foreman, joe louis, rocky marciano, jim jeffries, joe frazier, jack dempsey and so many more, the current heavyweight champions are pathetic.
XavierMarciano 1 year ago
@XavierMarciano
You get real and stop living in the past. Wladimir Klitschko may not be the greatest heavyweight champion but hes still better then jeffries, who we barely have any footage of..
TommyGun7111 1 year ago
@TommyGun7111 Better than jeffries, don't make me laugh, anyone who ever saw jeffries fight were amazed by him, the founder of ring magazine who saw all the great champions always maintained jeffries was the best, he could do 6ft high jump, run the 100 yard dash in 10.5 seconds, he is definetly a top 10 heavyweight on a all time list. Jeffries can't help the era in which he fought, there is some good footage of jeffries training on youtube, its worth a watch. Wladimir is not top 20.
XavierMarciano 1 year ago
@XavierMarciano
uhh yeah Wladimir Klitschko is way better actually..
basically all you're telling me is that he was a great athlete, but theres still not that many fights of him. We have no idea how good he really was. so we can just speculate on the stories that you're telling me.
I actually think Wladimir is already top 20. if he gets a chance to beat Haye, Vitali, Povetkin, Solis, and Adamek, he is going to be even higher.
TommyGun7111 1 year ago
@TommyGun7111 He has a poor chin, against any man who can punch hard, has great stamina and can take a punch he would get knocked out. Jeffries has all those components to defeat wladimir, jeffries before his return to fight johnson had never been even knocked down, and lets not forget it took an active, sharp, great fighter like johnson till the final round to defeat a rusty coming out of six years in retirement jeffries, that alone is testament to how good jeffries was.
XavierMarciano 1 year ago
@XavierMarciano
Dude, Wlad may have a bad chin but he has heart. he will come back.
We don't have enough footage. i suppose you think wlad would get KO'd by John L Sullivan too?
I call bullshit.
TommyGun7111 1 year ago
tommy i disagree in this topic, sulivan for example was a fucking animal and any old champ had much more stamina than both klitschko, because they could fight more than 20 rounds and the klitschko never fought more than 12 rounds. jim jefries could take a good blow, he was robust like the hell, he was 6,0 and weighed 240 pounds of muscle when he was 25 years old against Finnegan, wladimir is 6´6 and 240 pounds, jefriess might fight in the round 12 with the same intensity as in the round 5.
combatesdeboxeo 1 year ago
@TommyGun7111 - Jeffries would demolish W. Klitchko. We may not of seen a ton of Jeff, but I've seen plenty enough to know he'd k.o. glass chin W. . Top 20? lmao
1899sharkey 1 year ago
@1899sharkey
Nope. Who knows how he really fought besides those 3 fights that he had. who knows how he really preformed in his other bouts.
Yeah top 20. The guy is dominant, has plenty of defenses, and has defeated some good competition.
You're probably one of those nostoligic dudes who thinks Fighters THAT FAR BACK were actually better then these huge modern heavyweights.. These Klitschko guys hit harder, are faster, stronger, bigger, and had more skill then Jeffries for sure...
TommyGun7111 1 year ago
@TommyGun7111 - " These huge modern heavyweights" Who fall over when tapped on the chin! Pathetic. You're one of these "modern" dudes who actually believe these rank novices are fighters. So,how would W. handle going 15? Or do we have to make it a 12 rounder for these great modern fighters. Jeff would k.o. both robots in the same night easily.
1899sharkey 1 year ago
@1899sharkey
Dude they don't need to go 15.
I seriously doubt jeff would KO either klitschko. we just dont have enough footage to determine that.
TommyGun7111 1 year ago
@TommyGun7111 - We sure do have enough footage. Theres all kinds of footage on the K's, thats all I need to see. Hell, Jess Willard would beat W. You are too wrapped in the myth that modern fighters are somehow magically superior to the old timers. Boxing gym's in every n'hood from 1920- 70. Nothing today.
1899sharkey 1 year ago
@TommyGun7111 I agree with sharkey, and in case you didn't know jeffries was surprisingly fast, jeffries is a class above sullivan, so don't compare the two, the klitschko's are paper champions, beating no name fighters, in often boring fashion. Hell they won't even fight haye, shows how cowardly they are. They are champions in the very weakest of the heavyweight divisions history. I did value your opinon but if you believe any of the current crop of heavyweights could beat jeffries, DAMN.
XavierMarciano 1 year ago
@XavierMarciano xavier, i haven´t jefries in my top 10 hw, because his record is
won 19 (KO 16) 1 (KO 1), i think that an all time great should have more fights and more wars in his record, and his few rivals weren´t "ali", "joe louis", "foreman","frazier", "marciano"...
hi deserves credit, of course,but his record is not "GREAT"
combatesdeboxeo 1 year ago
@combatesdeboxeo Jeffries was 6'2" and his best weight was 220-225 pounds, I don't think its about the number of fights you have, i believe its what you do in those fights that matters. Jeffries was the heavyweight champion with the least amount of fights in getting there ever, he could have " PADDED " his record with soft wins like almost every fighter does, but he didn't, that is one of the biggest reasons I admire him.
XavierMarciano 1 year ago
@XavierMarciano - Well said! Jeff fought 14 rounds in his debut , many fighters needed 30 fights to build that kind of endurance. He was also a fighting champ defending his belt 6 or 7 times.
1899sharkey 1 year ago
@1899sharkey Thanks 1899sharkey, you clearly know your stuff about the boilermaker jeffries, I think he vastly underated, its a shame of the time he fought in, if there was more footage of him, no doubt tommygun7111 and many others would quickly change their opinon of him, he would be more highly regarded, of course I already have great respect for him.
XavierMarciano 1 year ago
@XavierMarciano I THINK JEFRIES MIGHT WELL KO WLADIMIR, BUT I THINK VITALI HAS BETTER CHIN THAN HIS BROTHER, HE WOULD BE A HARD MATCH FOR HIS SIZE AND SKILL. BUT JEFRIES WOULD HAVE HIS CHANCE OF COURSE. HE HAD MORE STAMINA, I THINK IF THEY FIGHT MORE THAN 15 ROUNDS, JEFRIES WOULD WIN FOR SURE. ARTICLE CORBETT VS JEFRIES "He was clearly outboxed in 20 rounds and at times was made to look like a novice,but Jeffries showed his ability to take punishment at any distance and hard."
combatesdeboxeo 1 year ago
@XavierMarciano YES XAVIER, I AGREE IT IS NOT JUST ON NUMBERS,AND I THINK JEFRIES HAD GREAT STAMINA,HE WAS A STRONG GUY, AND HE COULD TAKE A PUNCH BUT I THINK JEFRIES NEVER WAS TESTED WITH GREAT BOXERS, I THINK HIS BEST VICTORIES WERE AGAINST Bob Fitzsimmons(172 POUNDS) AND CORBETT(183 POUNDS). I THINK MARCIANO NEVER FACED GREAT RIVALS,BUT HE FACED BETTER RIVALS THAN JEFRIES DID IN MY OPINION.
combatesdeboxeo 1 year ago
@XavierMarciano
wow... you honestly think that the klitschkos are scared of haye?
WOW.
the klitschkos called them out.. they have been calling him out for a long while..its haye who won't fight him.
TommyGun7111 1 year ago
@TommyGun7111 you should give more credit to the old champs, maybe wladimir has more skill than jefries, but jim was a stronger man who lived a harder era , i think wladimir has not a good chin, if they fight to 20 rounds, wladimir would be the jefries´s victim after of the round 15, simply like that.
combatesdeboxeo 1 year ago
@combatesdeboxeo
Do you honestly think that Jeffires would beat the klitschkos??
I dont think Jeffries is stronger. Wladimir is 245 LB in his peak. and he's always ripped to shreads.
Wladimir has never gone 20 rounds in his life so why are you making that comparison? How about they go 12 rounds and see what happens?
Wladimir AND Vitali would beat Jeffries. Guarantee.
TommyGun7111 1 year ago
@TommyGun7111 - " How about they go 12 rounds and see what happens?" lmao Now we have to go 12 rounds so the great modern fighter can compete.
1899sharkey 1 year ago
@1899sharkey i think the biggest advantage of jeffries on the klitschkos is the stamina, i think if they fight 12 rounds jefries would lose against vitali, but if they fight more than 15, jefries would win.
combatesdeboxeo 1 year ago
@combatesdeboxeo - I am always talking 15 championship rounds, 3minutes long and a 20ft. ring with 6 ounce gloves. The 13,14 and 15th round were what seperates the men from the boys. Neither K brother belongs in the same breath as Jeffries.
1899sharkey 1 year ago
@1899sharkey YES I AGREE , BUT ALWAYS MORE THAN 12 ROUNDS
combatesdeboxeo 1 year ago
@combatesdeboxeo I think jeffries would score a late knock out for either klitschko, there is such a huge difference between fighting twelve rounds than fiftheen, Those three more rounds are what make legendary champions, when your down in the trenches, taking big blows, tiring and taking deep breaths, and your rival is still coming forward, that is when you discover how good a fighter really is. When the chips are down, and the fight are going against them, ability to overcome is what counts.
XavierMarciano 1 year ago
This has been flagged as spam show
@XavierMarciano "there is such a huge difference between fighting twelve rounds than fiftheen, Those three more rounds are what make legendary champions"
i agree absolutely
combatesdeboxeo 1 year ago
This has been flagged as spam show
@XavierMarciano " There is such a huge difference between fighting twelve rounds than fiftheen, Those three more rounds are what make legendary champions" I AGREE ABSOLUTELY
combatesdeboxeo 1 year ago
@XavierMarciano I AGREE
combatesdeboxeo 1 year ago
@1899sharkey
dude they had to go for a slower workrate to go that many rounds. Today they add on more muscle and weight because they don't have to go as many rounds.
we still dont have enough footage of them... Wlad has shown devestating power and speed of the footage we have of him.
TommyGun7111 1 year ago
@TommyGun7111 - If ignorance is bliss then you are one very happy man. Jeffries- Sharkey at coney isle was 25 rounds of constant, hard fighting. Nuff said
1899sharkey 1 year ago
@1899sharkey
and a lot of holding.
Wlad would ko jeffries and sharkey.
and sullivan.
but i do think he would lose to jack johnson just based on johnsons speed and defensive technique if that makes your nostalgic ass happy
TommyGun7111 1 year ago
@TommyGun7111 Its hard to imagine anyone knocking out jeffries, you could probably count the true contenders on one hand, there are many fighters who could decision jeffries possibly, but very few who would be capable of knocking him out, and there is a huge difference in going fiftheen rounds than twelve, the gap is massive. Wlad would be knocked out in round 8, vitali would be knocked out in round 13.
XavierMarciano 1 year ago
@XavierMarciano
Why do you think that? Jeffries isn't some superhuman incapable of gettign knocked out.
yeah I agree with you. What's the point of comparing Wlad going 15 rounds? they changed the rules so the only fair way to compare the two is by going 12 rounds.
Vitali just flat out WOULDN'T be knocked out. If Lennox lewis cant do it then Jeffires is certainly not doing it
TommyGun7111 1 year ago
@TommyGun7111 Old lennox lewis couldn't do it, vitali is just a big lump of a man, if he was to face a fighter with real aggression, power, and the stamina to keep on punching he would be knocked out, I would back frazier to knock out vitali, and hell there is a massive size and weight difference between them, it wouldn't make a difference frazier would cut him down with body shots and left hooks. Frazier is 5'11" and half, best weight 209. Jeffries is 6'2" best weight 225. Both would beat him.
XavierMarciano 1 year ago
@XavierMarciano - Absolutely. Frazier was a real fighter and a great one at that.All the Klitchkos have is size. This isn't wrestling or basketball for gods sake, its fighting and the main ingredient is knowing how to fight. This present crop of h.w.s makes the bums of the 80's look good.
1899sharkey 1 year ago
@TommyGun7111 - Damn right I'm nostalgic, These bums today are pathetic. I'm used to debating fights between great fighters but you make it too easy. When you throw out all the paper champions since the 80's and just count the legitimate champs W. k. is one of the worst champs in history. A pure novice with a glass jaw.
1899sharkey 1 year ago
@1899sharkey
Yeah right Wladimir Klitschko is the worst champ in history. That's just bs.
A novice? right. A novice with almost 60 fights? come on.
Yeah I know he has a glass jaw, does that automaticly mean everyone with a punch back then would KO Wlad? Nope.
TommyGun7111 1 year ago
that was then.
the White Man Rules now...
NIGGAKILLAMF 1 year ago
i don't know if sonny would dominate in 2010 but i think he could kick some russian ass.
mow1717 1 year ago
The background crowd sounds exactly like the one from Mike Tysons Punch out
KillingJoke696 1 year ago
This fight looks like a father giving his upstart son a spanking.
madmax8903 1 year ago 6
If the rumours are true, Liston could have been old enough to be Patterson's father.
TheGreatA 1 year ago 12
@TheGreatA although the stories abound that he was very old in truth he was possibly only a year or two older than his official age.
tlig 1 year ago
@TheGreatA WHOSE YOUR DADDY?!?! LMAO
Ricky42791 1 year ago
@TheGreatA
Holy crap. That would make him at least 41 lol
womblewandering 1 year ago
@TheGreatA liston was only 38 wen he died so i find that hard to believe
Kane16802 10 months ago
@TheGreatA To be honest that could just mean 12 years difference
KiidDynamiteReturns 8 months ago
Sonny liston would not be able to hang in the heavyweight divison and dominate as he did. Several people would beat him.
thecaliforniaknight 1 year ago
@thecaliforniaknight Liston was a very skilled and calculated fighter with one of the greatest jabs in HW history and a rock solid chin. The fantom punch everyone knows was b.s. He has more than a chance with any HW past or present. Check out the Cleveland Williams fight.
murk2020 1 year ago
@thecaliforniaknight Heavyweights of today suck ass.
PierceMyPenis 1 year ago
@PierceMyPenis
That is true but if the kiltchkos and david haye dont fight then I will never watch another heavy bout for long time. Everyone of the top ten fighters refused to fight james lights out toney which pretty much forced him out of boxing. James toney is so defensive and hard hitting they fear him for it
thecaliforniaknight 1 year ago
Floyd was just an insecure, neurotic mess for this fight, if not all the time. Floyd gave up like 40 pounds to Liston. And Liston hit like a Mack Truck..
bwconklin 1 year ago
Patterson lost this fight before it even started, you cant see it on this tape but if you ever watched the pre-fight introduction staredowns Floyd kept looking down and sort of refused to lock eyes with Sonny.
He was already intimidated before the opening bell!
thorn35 1 year ago
the two gentlemens of the sport, p.s. sonny liston hits like a TRUCK!
Dakashizzlenizzle 1 year ago
I just watched the movie called Phantom Punch about Liston's life, it was great!
jwh1999 1 year ago
@jwh1999 Yea i just came across this movie on netflicks (it's on the instant cue) and man was it good. I was always a fan of Liston even though he was way before my time (i'm only 29) Most definatly a great fighter and if you guys get a chance you should watch this movie it shows a whole new light to Sonny and his turmoil in life.
RayLopez 1 year ago
nice clip, but that phony sound of the punches is SILLY
billthestinker 1 year ago
Cus D'Amato warned Patterson to never fight Sonny Liston, but obviously he didn't listen.
Liston is ridiculous, listen to the "thuds" of his punches. His jab could knock any man down.
If anything, Floyd has heart, because these days he'd be a lightweight or cruiserweight, he was only around 180 pounds...
bastardoi 1 year ago
liston was great so was patterson but liston was better
AliRidah619 1 year ago
Liston was cool after the knockout, going over to check on Floyd before celebrating. He did the same thing in the first fight w/Cleveland Williams. That glare of his, the connections with the mob, it all seemed to add up to a really bad dude--and he was inside the ring. But I bet he was cool outside of it.
Kedbuka 1 year ago
@Kedbuka - You are right. Sonny always showed class even when Ali was hounding him. His wife said Sonny was a kind and gentleman in private.
1899sharkey 1 year ago
@1899sharkey: Yeah, I thought so. I knew Floyd Patterson was one of the nicest gentleman to ever step into a ring and figured by his behavior, Liston must have been cool too.
BTW, I saw your comment on another upload in which you remarked that you once met Floyd and he was very nice and signed autographs all day long w/out complaint. He was a real credit to boxing, a great guy.
Kedbuka 1 year ago
@Kedbuka - What was impressive was Floyd drove from New York to michigan with a car load of kids for a small town amateur boxing show. I was very happy when the crowd gave him a tremendous ovation. A true gentleman and a great fighter.
1899sharkey 1 year ago
Its too bad Floyd is remembered primarily for the Liston fights. A two time undisputed champ who fought all the contenders after his losses to Sonny in the sixtys. He even beat Bonavena in '72, sixteen years after first winning the belt. All in all I'd say a heck of a career.
1899sharkey 1 year ago 2
I read Hunter S. Thompson was somewhere front row with Rocky Marciano during the fight. He didn't bet wrong, and was bummed he didn't even finish his second beer before it was over.
MrMikesk8r 1 year ago
Henry cooper would have beat sonny liston
nickic272 1 year ago
@nickic272 Liston would have killed cooper.
MultiGreat1 1 year ago
anyone reminded of fraizer foreman?
trailstar1 1 year ago
Love those fake sound effects. Haahahaha. Surprised they don't have the "Pow" and "Blammo" graphics like in the old batman series.
bburl 1 year ago
ROUND 1.....fucked up ,...daamnnn!
TRANZA23 1 year ago
Patterson had the best hand-speed of all heavyweights (except for Ali), he should have boxed more and stayed away from Liston instead of trying to go inside and slug it out with the monstrous Liston
goldenbrick2 1 year ago
@goldenbrick2 His trainer actually wanted him to do that. He wanted him to use his good foot work, and speed to his advantage.
lwj24 1 year ago
I think the punch that did the damage was the left when Liston was holding Patterson's head.
capablemachine 1 year ago
Doesn't really look enough to knock someone out but there you go...
dcasey77 1 year ago
TommyGun, just seen it, yes clear left straight arm, hip movement connected with cheeckbone. still surprised it was enough to KO a guy as hard as Liston but it was a real hit.
hullcityafc72 1 year ago
so who's going to explain why Liston was KO'd by a 'ghost' punch in the Ali fight?
hullcityafc72 1 year ago
@hullcityafc72 did you watch the slow motion
the "PHANTOM" punch clearly connected as you can see the head pop back.
TommyGun7111 1 year ago
@TommyGun7111 yes it did! straight left with hip movement, very quick action.
hullcityafc72 1 year ago
@TommyGun7111 Yeh a magic punch that shows Ali after the fight saying "did i hit him?" and enough to knock Liston down until he thinks the fight is over by which time he gets up comfrotably and leaves the ring. Amazing "knock out punch"
capablemachine 1 year ago
@capablemachine
ummm please you really don't know how hard it was.. that was actually the same exact punch that knocked down Zora folley the first time, it was originally a Jack Johnson original punch.
Also Liston kind of ran into it, it was certainly by surprise. It's the punches that a fighter doesn't see that will knock him out.
Anyway, you're free to have your own opinion on the punch, seriously it's old history, but anyway Liston was 100% Lethal in his prime.
TommyGun7111 1 year ago