My boss has cancer..... Maybe he should work a program.... I have been clean for over 5 years I did it through NA great place to start. 9 months ago I decided to practice the most unpracticed so called "spiritual principal" in NA...... open-mindedness! I have stopped calling myself an addict, and get looked down on. I no longer attend meetings, some say I'm using. Seriously? Firstly I CHOSE TO USE all those years ago. I CHOSE TO STOP! My boss does not have this option! My partner had a lapse wh
If you have been to jail, rehab, overdosed, stole from the ones you love, and been revived from death all multiple times then you can tell me alcoholism isn't a disease. Until then, you don't know shit about alcoholism.
These videos are great for people who are committed to recovery, but have reservations about surrendering to NA. Their literature is a bunch of vague, useless platitudes. I've also always wondered why people don't sit down and honestly figure out their own, personalized steps for recovering from whatever it is that has a hold on them. Doing this improved my life more than any 12 ambiguous steps or cult ideology ever could. Keep up the videos, It takes balls to put yourself out there like this.
I am disgraced as a human being to think that we have no power over any addiction. I believed it for years and thought myself to be doing the right thing, pushing myself to be happy but I actually never was. Being labelled by an institution or traditional step programme mirrors powerlessness. I left my NA recovery center after 13 weeks. The daily reminder that I was doomed and heavily diseased plummeted me into depression. Twas only as I was praying one night I understood it was a choice. FREE!
HI I love what you are saying here. Thank you for posting this. I have a few videos too. I agree. It is not a disease. They are nuts. Keep them coming. In the light telling the truth not hiding. This is great!
AA NA CA and any other A isn't the only way. That's what worked 4 me, but there's a lot of ways for a lot of people. Some people get it in church...some people get it in RR Rational Recovery. Some get it in CS Christian Science. Some people just Quit. Stats for the recovery rate of EVERY method is about 5%. No matter which method you are talking about. I think it's the moms and dads trying to fix their kid that aint ready to be fixed yet. However you do it, do it. Find the way that works 4 you.
If I had believed in "powerlessness" and "one day at a time," I would have died of my crack addiction 15 years ago.
"One day at a time" is a permission statement to relapse tomorrow. What's wrong with making a solemn vow to yourself to stop drugging for the rest of your life?
You know what? Whether you think you're powerless, or you think you have ultimate power over what you put in your body . . . either way, you're correct.
@ckedwards65 I too cant stand these 12 step cult programs and its weak, mindless followers. I stopped drinking on my own years ago and credit MYSELF for everything that happens in my life; good or bad. EVERYTHING IN LIFE IS A CHOICE! Its not that this man had a bad experence with some 12 step cult. Its just that SOMEONE has to denounce this garbage for what it is!
@isegoria1 Look, If you're sober and happy, that's good. And yes, ignorance is bliss when you are able to ignore the haters. I'd much rather be sober, happy, have my successful career, and help others to acheive the same thing, than to live the way I used to.
@naclean91 So now it is a matter of choice? Your cult says it is a disease. You are a walking contradiction and you dont even know it. BTW your extra years clean means nothing to me. It does not give your credence or clout. The AMA has a dirty past that is akin to the mob. Maybe you should read up on them before you use such a poor starting point. BTW AMA has NEVER agreed with AA that it was a disease. No matter how much pushing and shoving AA has done.
@isegoria1 If you look at the medical definition of addiction you would realize it is a disease. I have a doctorate in neuroscience and work at the University of Utah. I have been doing experiments and tests on lab rats and humans for 17 years. At first, I did not believe addiction is a disease but when you get the education and do the work and experiments behind it, addiction is a disease. Your comments are not educated and backed up by any research and are therefore useless.
I am sorry to hear that you are receiving hate-barbed messages from people who are supposedly working a good 12-step program. The program has worked for me, but I will be the first to admit that it is not the ONLY program available to people. Hate is not a characteristic of anyone working a good program--12 step or otherwise.
"A.A. is not allied with any sect, denomination, politics, organization or institution" Flat out lie. Dr. Bob Smith founder of AA was a freemason therefore there is a definite affiliation with another cult.
AA is a cult in the same sense RR is, or the police or the fire dept. or military. Its a group of people with a purpose. Its a fellowship of alcoholics that have recovered from alcoholism and they are there to help others. Theres no leaders in AA. Only God, He is the ultimate authority in AA. The sickies in AA are the non alcoholics. I wish they would leave and come to RR so you guys can put up with their bogus, counterfeit bullshit alternative to recovery like you clowns
@miket1m Yeah that makes sense consider Dr. Bob was a freemason. AA is a full fledged cult and froom what I have seen, ppl get sober but as far as recovery, there is very little to none as the addictions get transfered to other things including the program. Helping others? Pffft. AA alcoholics only ever help themselves. Even any service ultimately comes back to their ego so they can pat themself on the back. There are leaders, narcisists who sponser others it's like the blind leading the blind
@beautifulmind546 There are no leaders in AA. God is the ultimate authority. So what if Dr. Bob was a free mason. Theres nothing wrong with being a mason. People do recover in AA, I am one of them. I have recovered from a "seemly hopeless state of mind and body" otherwise known as alcoholism. I don't know what AA meeting you went to. Don't judge AA as a whole just on your experience, thats ignorance. Humility is helping others. We look down on grand standing in my group. Thats not what its about
@miket1m Dr Bob being a mason is significant because like many masonic touched organizations, the elements of asserting control over others, deceit and manipulation are ever present. This is true for AA as well. I have been a sober person all my life and watched family go from drunk to being sucked in by this cult with addictions being transfered to other things being called 'recovery'. You can only claim recover if your addictive tendencies and narcisism, need to manipulate is gone.
Alcoholics Anonymous is a fellowship of men and women who share their experience, strength and hope with each other that they may solve their common problem and help others to recover from alcoholism. The only requirement for membership is a desire to stop drinking. There are no dues or fees for A.A. membership; we are self supporting through our own contributions. A.A. is not allied with any sect, denomination, politics, organization or institution;
does not wish to engage in any controversy, neither endorses nor opposes any causes. Our primary purpose is to stay sober and help other alcoholics to achieve sobriety.
This is all AA is. There are no leaders in AA. We have over 2 million members. That many drunks and no leaders. Tell me there is no God.
@miket1m So basically you have been taught to revomit the brainwashing teachings from the big book and you can't think for yourself. It is a FACT Dr. Bob WAS a Freemason which means that AA is in fact allied with the sect, politics, organization and institution that is Freemasonry. You are basically repeating a flat out mind controlling lie.
@beautifulmind546 I consider myself to be an AA historian and I don't remember ever seeing that anywhere. I know that Bob was a very spiritual man and him and sister Ignatia took about 5000 people through the program at Akron's City Hospital I don't really give a rats ass what you think AA is. Thats what our preamble says, that what I observe. We do not get involved in anything outside of AA. Its obvious you don't know squat about AA .
@miket1m Have you hear the expression about ASSumptions in AA? Not that it matters but I have always been a sober person. All my experiences with AA have been watching my alcoholic family members and their friends go through this cult. I have seen it further destroy so many lives that I lost count. lives that were on the brink of healing. My own family is destroyed because of this cult just like any other cult tears family members apart.
@beautifulmind546 You're not even an alcoholic so why don't you just shut the hell up. You sound like a friggin nut, do you know that? Comparing AA to the moonies or some other crazy groups. You're an idiot and I'm so tired of talking to your dumbass.
@miket1m NO I will not stfu. I have spent most of my life fighting to survive from the alcoholism of those in my life and for my family. After being abused and neglected by the drunks in my family I still fought for healing only to have AA make it impossible. AA IS a cult and it makes ppl like YOU completely brainwashed selfish, narcissistic and irresponsible. You are the one who escapes into drink and I am the dumbass and idiot? Your comments only prove what I am saying about AA U R a perfectex
@beautifulmind546 I am a recovered alcoholic 25 years. You are a whining cry baby who needs God in their life. You are an idiot who has nothing nice to say about anything that helps people. AA was the greatest spiritual movement of the 20th century. Millions have recovered from alcoholism. We are worldwide and we have an excellent recovery rate. Sorry, but that is a fact! AA works, if you work it. If an alcoholic want sobriety they have to work for it through the 12 steps.
@miket1m WOW 25 years sobriety and look at how much consideration and empathy that you have developed in yourself from this 'spiritual program' PFFFT! Could not fill a thimble! AA does not help ppl. It tells them they are powerless which makes them disempowered. It tells them they have a disease or allergy which makes them irresponsible. It transfers addictions to other addictions and it keeps ppl from using their brains and thinking. 'keep it simple stupid!' AA is mind control and you are MCed!
@beautifulmind546 I have no tolerance for stupidity. If you are a real alcoholic, you are powerless over alcohol. You might excel in all areas, but when it comes to drinking, you don't have a choice. Alcoholics have no choice in the matter, they drink because they have to. Thats why people pursue this into the gates of hell or death. No one can relieve an alcoholic from their alcoholism. Only One can and that One is God. You do the steps to get God and He keeps you sober, whiner
@miket1m That is a completely irresponsible and mind controlled statement. All drinking is a choice but it's easier for you to pretend it's not so that you can play the victim. With your mentality I would not be surprised if you would say that your abusive behavior is not your fault either and it's because you have a disease. Let's discuss how many ppl's lives YOU have fucked up with your choice to be a drunk and an abusive ass. 25 yrs sober and still a jerk. Another AA success story pffft
No its not, its a fact. The alcoholic has lost the choice to drink, he has no will power whatsoever in regards to drinking. He drinks insanely. Most alcoholics lose, jobs, family, homes, cars, freedom, etc... You think it was their choice to do all that. They didn't drink because they wanted to, they drank because they had to. You're a no nothing non alcoholic who thinks he knows what he's talking about. Get a life you whiner.
@miket1m Cop out and total neglect of responsibility. But you need to believe it so you can be the victim instead of owning your choices. Yes choice, the choice to escape into a bottle at every opportunity instead of muster up a little courage and face life. No one has to drink to escape. Even children who are severly abused find other coping mechanisms - I know that first hand as I was abused by drunks like you. Funny, you are the one who is a drunk, and now mind controlled U get a life whino
@miket1m Right, we can see how 'recovered' and 'spiritual" you are by the way you call ppl harmed by this program 'idiot' 'dumbass' assclown' etc. You are nothing but an irresponsible dry drunk brainwashed lemming. We can see how the cutl of AA has made you such a peaceful, responsible loving person of GOD PFFFFFT!
@beautifulmind546 I don't pull any punches for one, and two, I'm not going to sit here all nice and let your ass abuse me. You're an idiot and you don't know AA, the disease or anything about recovery. Oh, and you whine a lot.
@miket1m Thanks for proving my points with your own hateful comments. AA is such a spiritual program and you who having found god, have become such a peaceful, loving and responsible person after 25 yrs sobriety (heavy sarcasm).
@beautifulmind546 lol, You're a moron. You don't even have a drinking problem, why are you commenting on the page? AA isn't a CHURCH DIPSHIT! God has taken away the obsession to drink. Its like the problem never existed. I was the kind of drunk who blacked out and ended up living in an abandoned house. Unless you have walked in my shoes, you have no right to judge me
@miket1m Funny you mention 'blacking out'. See because I was being abused by drunks like you as a child I spent a good part of my life dissociative. But I never became a drunk like you. Instead I fought to heal and have a life. I comment on this page because I am sick and tired of drunks like you in AA spewing your so called spiritual vile never owning any responsibility for your crimes and just continuing to be a frickin victim. How many ppl did you harm in those blackouts? I'm sure plenty
@beautifulmind546 After being beat by a drunk as a child I would think you would be for anything that helps alcoholics. I'm sorry that happened to you. I owned everything that I did. The jobs I lost, the family I lost, etc. All a result of my selfish, self centered behavior. You see, drinking is just a symptom of what wrong with us. Dishonesty, no faith in anything, full of fear, jealousy, envy, laziness, etc... I hurt people that I loved as a result of my alcoholic behavior and drinking.
@beautifulmind546 The adult child of an alcoholic can become just as sick as the alcoholic himself. they can become selfish, self centered, dishonest (lying to yourself in the form of excuses, rationalizations), You have no faith in God, AA, not even in yourself. As a result of lack of faith, you have fear and out of fear comes intolerance, anger, depression, etc. Because of all this negativity you are not grateful for anything. And you don't do anything for anyone unless you can get something
@beautifulmind546 Does this sound a lot like you? Do you know only two emotions, anger and depression? Get on Welbutrin, it will help you out. Also you should get some counseling if you're not already. The resentment you have for that drunk who beat you, is hurting you, not that drunk. You have only two alternatives. Keep going the painful way your going or except spiritual help. Go to ACOA and take the 12 steps. This is just a suggestion.
@miket1m Nope it doesn't sound like me at all. This particular topic runs hot for me but unlike you I can have an emotion and go on with the rest of my life. I don't have to join a cult to handle myself nor get drunk. Don't need meds like I don't need booze. Please keep your two bit revomitted AA advice to yourself because YOU are the one who needs it, not me. You are the drunk and the cult member. Another AA success story 25 yrs sober and still an narcisistic egomaniac.
First of all, you are not "in the program". The program is the 12 steps. You are in the AA fellowship and you are suppose to take the steps, as in "here are the steps we took"
How much money are you making off the poor unfortunate alcoholics? Do you keep recovery or success records? How do you know what you are doing is working? All the successors prior to AA, the temperance movement, the Washingtonians, etc. all failed. What make this RR different from them. It sounds like the ODAAT bull in AA
@arrdvarks1 Life with special modifiers? You guys remind me of the get rich quick schemers who say that it did not work for you because you did not do it their way to the letter. You remind me also of the people who excuse child rape cases for pastors and priests. You make me sick. I am not defensive or attacking. How is a person rejecting crap attacking? I am to the point. I have no time in my life for senseless bullshit babble which is why I don't bother with your cult anymore.
@arrdvarks1 No it did not take "root" in me. In fact I did it all by myself like millions of people do everyday. What was planted was bullshit that took countless hours of therapy to undo the damage created by your cult. I wonder why it pisses you people off so bad when people disagree with your group cult think?
@arrdvarks1 Speak out? You mean like the daily death threats I get? You people are too funny. I have covered this shit with you before. It is simply not my fault you are too slow to follow it.
you're right my man, and keep it up. i havent been happier in a long time, and it's because i left that ridiculous cult of NA. it all comes down to buckling down, and taking some personal responsibility. powerless my ass. im a human being and i have the power to make choices. thats a fact. we all have the POWER to make a CHOICE. fuck 12 step programs. do you really want what the "winners" have? what do they have? tell me please. they're just as egotistical as they always were.
I hasn't had a drink or drug in 3 and a half years truth is I'm not in love with meetings but I don't go looking for the drug dealer if I go there what ever works right.
nothing in the big book of aa says disease, the people in the rooms are sick and use that at first till they learn to deal with underlying issues through the steps.
@savanah626 I have covered your lame argument and will not do it again. Please do attend some meeting so you can hear all about the disease in which teh ends are always the same - jails institutions and death. BTW I have not been through any of those since leaving your self deprecating cult. I feel no more need to abuse myself. I pity you.
@savanah626 But the 'disease' of alcoholism is continuously discussed and used throughout the program as a crutch. And the steps don't serve dealing with the underlying issues at all. All they do is create a framework for an appearance of healing when the real healing never gets done. My family members supposedly 'worked the steps' but no amends were made, no internal changes. But hey, fake it until you make it right?
Hi. I just want to say that I was a heroin user for 8 years...I ended up in jail, psychiatric institutions, left for dead after overdosing and numerous AA/NA meetings! Guess which 1 of these things helped me to be the 8 years sober I am today? Thats right..NONE!! I did it because I wanted to...and guess what? I can still have a tequila and oj or glass of wine and not end up with a needle in my arm! So I totally back you isegoria But as it goes "2 each his own" but there IS another way! DECIDE!
@11jmarie Thank you for talking good solid sense. And thanks for taking the time to chime in. Here's to your continued -um eh clean time. I think that is how I would put it. :)
One question....who is the "hater" here ? Look in the mirror dude. I'm in AA and I've been sober 3 years. I live a pretty good life today thanks to AA.
@goindownthe1road I get plenty of death threats almost daily for questioning your sacrosanct cult. Now run along and blame it all on your made up disease.
@goindownthe1road No, not thanks to AA. Seriously? You made the CHOICE to drink and you made the CHOICE in the last three years to be responsible and you are going to give that credit to AA instead of empowering yourself and owning that YOU MADE THAT CHOICE? You were Never powerless. That is a lie. You always had the choice. Why do you need to believe you are a victim of a false disease in order to make yourself feel ok about making a responsible healthy choice? Be honest with yourself.
@beautifulmind546 Yes, thanks to AA. Seriously. And, no, I did not always have the choice. I would wake up in the a.m. hung over and say "I'm never drinking again" and by 2:30-3:00 in the afternoon when I got feeling better, the obsession would kick in and I would have to drink again. It was a nightmare. I would rather go to AA the rest of my life than risk experiencing that again. I know what I'm talking about, I've lived it.
@goindownthe1road You have always had the choice. You are sober now because you made a choice to be. AA had nothing to do with it other than it allowed you to trick your own mind into believing you have a disease (which you don't) and that it was a HP who saved you. It's a whole lot easier that way than to own up that you chose to escape and drink. You get to be a victim and you like that. Ask yourself why it is so hard for you to claim your own power and responsibility to yourself.
Anger is a normal emotion when used appropriately. AA indirectly causes people to die via suicide and relapse. Research it. Any normal rational, non pro- AA brainwashed person would be very angry. I have not heard 1 12 step arguement to date proving me wrong on this.
It also explains te we have a mental obsesion over alcohol, the mind is sick!!!! if you be any type of addict then you will think of the substance a whole lot. the book talks about changing our mind. how can you change your mind- ,your thinking? what you think is what you are, AA is not manopoly, the book explains that they are many different ways to achieve sobriety, this is only one of them
@paredea81 "The ends are ALWAYS the same, jails institutions and death" I am nowhere near any of these. You can excuse AA's monopoly anyway you like. Just don't expect other people to buy into the bullshit storm.
An allergy is a rection fron the body, A part of the Big Book in the doctors opinion expressed by Dr. Silksworth: Men and women drink essentially for the effect produce by alcohol. Do you like the effect? THen it Goes and explains that after a conciderable period their state of mind become so illusive and that the person drinking alcohol they can't distinguish the true from the false. In my experience once I get buzz then I for watever reason I continue to grab & grab anotherone.
Your absolutely right those people are not working the "AA program" at all, in fact whether you're a 12 stepper or not anger is never productive. More power to you people AA and NA does not work for anyone. It is obvious that you are passionate about saving peoples lives, do whatever works.
I did smart recovery because AA/NA and the group norms and the "God" talk and the meetings in my area being soap operas, with the same group of ppl who are old timers and nobody dares to say anything because they will boast their longer sobriety and the ones who take other people's inventory a lot. If you come back from a slip there are always those who look down on you but there are many kickass AA's and some of the teachings from AA help and could be a tool still both could helps some people.
Hey man. Love your uploads. Thankfully i was aware enough to recognise AA and its numerous 12 step incarnations for the snake oil peddlars they really are. Sadly, many do not. Its great to see i am not alone in my suspicion of their spurious claims and was forthright enough to challenge them whenever they transpired. As you can well imagine, i too encountered the same rancorous hostility you describe..
I had never heard of the term "Rational Recovery" until today, but I have been practicing it for years. I used to be a hardcore drunk and I quit on my own and have been sober for years now. I didn't realize there was a term for that LOL
I get it, What part of buying snake oil and hokus-pokus don't people understand? Come in, sit down, be quiet, drink the coffee drink the coffee drink the coffee drink the coffee drink the coffee drink the coffee drink the coffee drink the coffee drink the coffee drink the coffee drink the coffee...
to the person in the video, you poor angry person you lol..lighten up, get clean stay clean worry about yourself..any recovery is good recovery...hope you find your own way and continue on the path ..
I get it, What part of buying snake oil and hokus-pokus don't people understand? Come in, sit down, be quiet, drink the coffee drink the coffee drink the coffee drink the coffee drink the coffee drink the coffee drink the coffee drink the coffee drink the coffee drink the coffee drink the coffee...
I get it, What part of buying snake oil and hokus-pokus don't people understand? Come in, sit down, be quiet, drink the coffee drink the coffee drink the coffee drink the coffee drink the coffee drink the coffee drink the coffee drink the coffee drink the coffee drink the coffee drink the coffee...
@rickg1724 Your program 12 steps causes people to indirectly die via suicide and relapse. The best you can do is say lighten up. If you study RR that sounds like the beast mind speaking.
your chasing a lie so dont preach to me about how good AA is because i know that AA is a lie , snake oil and cult like meetings dont save me or anyone , "There is a principle which is a bar against all information, which is proof against all arguments and which cannot fail to keep a man in everlasting ignorance that principle is contempt prior to investigation."
AA is not for everyone...is not perfect...he missed the whole point of this program... its spiritual....its about God in your life....thats what it points to and that is where the recovery comes from...I do know one thing...I would not want to be like this dude or follow anything he says...what a resentful person......you say you need some positive,,,it helps...yet all you say is negative...who pissed on your cereal... then the final clue at the end...Rational Recovery...lol ... no wonder...
@briand61 So you tie something so important to something you can not prove? It is amazing that you can stay sober. Prove your god or go play appolgetics somewhere else. Millions of people are waiting. "AA is not for everyone" Matter of fact AA works for no one. 5% with AA and 5% without = 0%
AA is not perfect...not for everyone....but I do know one thing for sure... I would not want to be like this dude.... no wonder...he gave the clue...a rational recovery dude...LOL
@briand61 I like your adhom commentary and leaving all points made stand, now run along and spread your bullshit somewhere else - your spiritual venom makes me happy.
Rarely have we seen a person fail who has thoroughly followed our path. Those who do not recover are people who cannot or will not completely give themselves to this simple program, usually men and women who are constitutionally incapable of being honest with themselves. There are such unfortunates. They are not at fault; they seem to have been born that way. They are naturally incapable of grasping and developing a manner of living which demands rigorous honesty.
@murphj4 More mindless blather? DO you people even bother to think for yourselves or is it just easier to have the group think for you? "Constitutionally Incapable" You mean like blaming shit on a made up disease model concocted by a LSD taking mental patient? You can call that honest if you like I have no time for such jibberish. Tell yourself what ever bullshit you need to so you can sleep at night. I will stick with the facts.
@murphj4 It is I who is laughing at you with you boat load of excuses to cover a behavior you intentionally did. Instead of owning up you people rely on a made up disease from a LSD taking failure. Speaking of failure you group has a 0% success ratio. In fact it has been proven many times over that you 12 step cult does more damage than good.
Enjoy your excuses I am done reading your excuse ridden trite.
@murphj4 Lol. I find it amusing that 12 step mullahs are so readily reduced to espousing their sacred scripture( ver batim) in lieu of any meaningful or cogent debate. I believe many of the 12 steppers who have felt obliged to posit their pious tripe secretly harbour fears that we( 12 step critics) may be right, thus compelling them to recite BB incantations in a superstitious attempt to ward off the undesired effects of reasoned rationale. O
Their chances are less than average. There are those, too, who suffer from grave emotional and mental disorders, but many of them do recover if they have the capacity to be honest."
thanks for this video . im clean just over a year now and i feel NA has done more harm than good for me. they make me feel bad about everything i do or did. i hate the fact that if you dont beleive everything they tell you they dont want anything to do with you. thanks for your video im not going to miss NA thanks.
Fair play to you Isegoria! I think if I were a Yank rather than a Brit I'd be every bit as angry as you sometimes get. The stepper nonsense gets infuriating enough even in a country where it hasn't completely infiltrated the judicial and medical establishment. I had to walk away from the rooms for my sanity (and before I chinned someone).
and the allergy thing is referring to how a substance effects people different if they are allergic and alcohol effects alcoholics differently due to many different factors one being enzymes in your liver the alcoholic enzyme brakes down alcohol differently becoming dependent on it ,abnormal irrational behavior
just like pollen to an allergic person causes them to sneeze
and you insult aa for insulting your program when you do the same thing that is very hypocritical shedding the big book that have helped people return to sanity and were not supposed to be offended have you know love for the suffering alcoholic and your statistics are very wrong btw
im glad you have a program to keep you sober but you seem to lack a little in peace and serenity
why do you care so much? what works for some people doesnt work for others. you need to worry about yourself and let the others do what you want. where is all the anger coming from? something must be wrong in your life if you truly feel the need to tell others what is "right" and what isn't.
people who need a hospital and nurses and all this care and support just to stop drinking or taking drugs are WIMPS ! wimps who cry every time life gets hard,
do me a favor and kill your self's . wimps are not wanted
you won't get any hate from me... AA is working for me.. because i am working my recovery program... just like my mom with diabetes... she still had to take personal responsibility for her recovery.. and her choices... peace is a choice we can all make every day... best wishes for your continued growth
I'm a drunk and I relapse. I'm in AA, I love the people there, but it doesn't stop me.I have God in me and love my religion. But again, it doesn't stop me. I admit I'm powerless over alcohol because I am...
@StanBennet Powerless over what you intentionally put in your body? Tell your self what ever bullshit your need to so you can sleep at night. Maybe one day you will get real.
@isegoria1 Religous types don't think rationally because "religion takes the cake on bullshit". Religious and hypocritical are a really bad combo. I would avoid them like the plague. AA ers are scared to death of you.
I think its BS that people in AA NA and others have given you hell you speaking your mind. I agree totally that people do exist in AA and other fellowships that are just plain angry as angry people can get. Personaly i work a 12 step program and i find that it works for me and has been as i celebrate two years this week. I am not a angry or critical, i just felt the need to speak my mind just as you have and i thank you for doing so. "To each his own", and im happy program works for you, :)
@edtheretardg10 Thanks for weighing in and good luck with your continued success. 2 years is an outstanding achievement. I remember that day well for myself. For what ever reason I did take a 1 year coin even though I had not been in a meeting for 6 months. The second year was different. No coin, no birthday cake, just a silent celebration and a sense of clarity and well being that I had not had before.
I quit drinking 30 years ago. I looked at the 12 steps and ecided they are not helpful but in fact make it more difficult. I wrote down what i thought would be the way to go. i didnt end up with 12 steps. i did it with three.
@sandraplumberd Many find that forging their own path is the best way. I have also done mine with great success. Good to hear that there is more than just a few ways to get this done.
On a serious note would you like to contribute to a book on non 12 step recovery? I have an acquaintance that is writing a book about the positive aspects of non 12 step recovery. Contact me and I will provide his email addy for you.
I really think that it would be good if you do videos that demonstrate the positive aspects of your program and leave these negative diplays for others. AA lives and breaths pessimism and negativity. You would be better served just ignoring it.
I think that alcoholism, as it applies to people in AA, could correctly be called a syndrome rather then a disease. I believe that the organization encourages and demands self denial prevail. This insulates the people from their only avenue to recovery. They are forced to deny the power within that can gather control.
Admit that we can not control our drinking. If we have any alcohol at all, we can not control our behaviour and it has a negative affect on our life. We must not have another drink.
Look at our strengths, joys and pleasures in life. Look at the good things we have done in life and be proud of our strengths. Focus on these things and make an effort to step forward positively to a better life for our self and those dear to us.
Step 3
Seek help to understand your anger, your moods and psychological health. If a positive approach to life, appreciation of love and feelings of joy are too hard to find, seek professional help to understand why this is so.
With you all the way. I sober up as a Buddhist - 8 fold path. 16 yrs. Dry Drunk = Heretic and too cool etc. is Christian algebra for do what we do or we will kill you cause we are spiritual today. I live in town of night of the living 12 steppers and its constantly having to listen to AA guru shitheads smash on people who quit sans AA. Talk about Earths oldest insanity being called solution again - me and my holy book or else. Keep up the good work. Abrahamic faith filth doesn't work
I am an AA'er and I respect all avenues of recovery, not just mine. And even though I have no power over alcohol, I still must take responsibility for my actions, even when I drank, no exceptions. I am addicted to alcohol and all I can do is abstain from it for life.
I want to live and grow spiritually for my own benefit. May your program bring you the peace and joy that mine has.
@1981Winddancer between you and mraindog81 who commented before you; I am starting to think there are some sane people that follow 12 step recovery. Look at the contrast between the comments you both left and the trolls before you. Good luck with your continued sobriety.
@isegoria1 I am sorry for their insane comments my friend. Steps 6 and 7 are often missed by many of us in AA. Here we learn to drop the character defects like backbiting that hurt not only others but our own sobriety as well. If you are sober, happy, joyful and free, then your sobriety is truly awesome and you do not need to apologize for how you got there.
I am a friend of Bill, and I am just happy to see anybody recover by any means that works for them. I don't know anyone from the program who doesn't feel that way. I was a mess for eight years, and since I came to terms with my problem and started attending meetings a year ago, I have been free of my obsession. Sneer all you want to: I am sticking with what has brought me immeasurable relief.
@mraindog81 No sneering here. Good luck with your sobriety may it be a lasting thing for you. BTW yours is about the most sane comment I have seen from a 12 stepper in a long time.
I guess your just SMARTER and WISER than the Americam Medical Association As they have classed it as a DISEASE, And once again having a disease does not negate any personal responsibilty whatsoever. Who is the hater in all realityHMMM GET HONEST MY FRIEND
@thewiledchild AMA is one of many organizations used as AA front groups. AMA has never once listed alcoholism as a disease. It appears that it is you who must get real. Besides for me to know everything as you do I would need to either belong to religion or your ineffective cult. Anything but take personal responsibility for your past huh? FAIL
@thewiledchild The AMA is a Christian backed shit talking circle jerk. AA is Abrahamic faith filth passed off as solution again. If you dont think the best moments of the middle east are perpetuated for the same reason you AAers call the SOBER person sans AA filth a Dry Drunk guess again you antidiluvian born again idiot with a Big Book. Your just another filthy AA Guru screaming do it our way or we will kill you cause - well - uh - yer spiritual today. FILTHY GURU!!!
Nice anger you call that recovery who would want that? Read the literature in full Then you might know what you are talking about. There is an old saying "keep your mouth shut and have them all think your stupid or speak up and remove all doubt. The whole program is ABOUT taking RESPONIBILTY however you'd know that if you had actually researched your preaching. As for "the diease model" Well
@thewiledchild Angry? pfft. You people really need a new play book. I am not angry. I find it interesting that you claim that I am angry because I ask that AA prove their claims. Thanks for proving yours is a sacrosanct cult religion. The anti thought in your empty platitude is astounding. Your whole "program" is the opposite of taking responsibility. I like how you culties blame it all on a made up disease.
What an angry lil bunny! lol All i know is my life is great thanks to NA. I hope you find a little respite from your rage, I used to go there a lot but im happier now i can let most of it just slide away. Im sorry the room guys are knocking your way -thoses guys just aint got it yet, but hey whatever works for ya! hope ya find peace from your anger and find happiness. Best wishes. Mark Jordan
@mjbelfast Thanks for the predictable adhom commentary. You really are full of stupid assumptions aren't you. Anything but deal with the points made in the video huh? Thanks for making my point with your bullshit commentary. Then you give me empty well wishing which translates to "go to hell". You people are so funny and predictable. What is sad is that you thought you were being witty. Nice excuses but still lame.
You dont look a very happy person, so much anger there and hostility for AA! I went to AA to stop drinking because nothing else was working for me and its kept me sober for 7yrs and thats cant be a bad thing surely!!! Sounds like you dont have a clue about AA and just get off on anger to get a response!!!
@askinfull Much happier than you who has taken the time to share your delusion with us. Anything but just knock it off huh? Nothing but lames excuses as always, your cult never changes. I suppose by your stupid assumption my 10 years in your cult makes it where I know nothing about your cult. Tell yourself what ever lies you need to sleep at night. Yours is a comment I have seen many times over, always from your cult. Do you people think for yourselves ever?
I am one of the 5%. Faith in a power greater than myself keeps me sober. AIDS is a disease. The letter A stands for acquired. I acquired the phenomenon of craving due to drinking too much, too often, for far too long. I work the 12 Steps to the best of my ability. When I don't work at it, my life is uncomfortable. This is called untreated alcoholism.
Hay, thanks for putting your self out there. I like a lot of what you say. Some is a bit much but for the most part I believe what you say. There is a lot of finger pointing and judgmental attitudes. What you say about powerless is right on. Most people in AA hid behind the "powerless" concept. There is a wide misunderstanding of powerlessness. And there is a lot of real ridiculous belief that AA have "stinking thinking" even after years of sobriety they believe there thinking still "stinks"
My boss has cancer..... Maybe he should work a program.... I have been clean for over 5 years I did it through NA great place to start. 9 months ago I decided to practice the most unpracticed so called "spiritual principal" in NA...... open-mindedness! I have stopped calling myself an addict, and get looked down on. I no longer attend meetings, some say I'm using. Seriously? Firstly I CHOSE TO USE all those years ago. I CHOSE TO STOP! My boss does not have this option! My partner had a lapse wh
andrumay 3 days ago
If you have been to jail, rehab, overdosed, stole from the ones you love, and been revived from death all multiple times then you can tell me alcoholism isn't a disease. Until then, you don't know shit about alcoholism.
MrDCSLC 1 week ago
A DISEASE, MY ASS !
IGOROZKARSKY 1 week ago
The voice of reason.
lancerandy 1 week ago
Let's just say this guy has a good point......however he doesn't look happy AT ALL
toesRme123 2 weeks ago
These videos are great for people who are committed to recovery, but have reservations about surrendering to NA. Their literature is a bunch of vague, useless platitudes. I've also always wondered why people don't sit down and honestly figure out their own, personalized steps for recovering from whatever it is that has a hold on them. Doing this improved my life more than any 12 ambiguous steps or cult ideology ever could. Keep up the videos, It takes balls to put yourself out there like this.
matthew1722 3 weeks ago 3
I am disgraced as a human being to think that we have no power over any addiction. I believed it for years and thought myself to be doing the right thing, pushing myself to be happy but I actually never was. Being labelled by an institution or traditional step programme mirrors powerlessness. I left my NA recovery center after 13 weeks. The daily reminder that I was doomed and heavily diseased plummeted me into depression. Twas only as I was praying one night I understood it was a choice. FREE!
liveguy7 1 month ago
great video keep posting
Openmindness 1 month ago
I DO BELEAVCE
MrSparky1414 1 month ago
YOU are right. Thank you for doing what you do.
bluebirdofrock 1 month ago
I am an addict in recovery, and you hit it right on the money! You are right. Thanks for speaking up!
erklesko 1 month ago
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wilcoboi19 2 months ago
@wilcoboi19 Yea - That AA spiritual hate is so much better
isegoria1 2 months ago
HI I love what you are saying here. Thank you for posting this. I have a few videos too. I agree. It is not a disease. They are nuts. Keep them coming. In the light telling the truth not hiding. This is great!
inwood75 2 months ago
AA NA CA and any other A isn't the only way. That's what worked 4 me, but there's a lot of ways for a lot of people. Some people get it in church...some people get it in RR Rational Recovery. Some get it in CS Christian Science. Some people just Quit. Stats for the recovery rate of EVERY method is about 5%. No matter which method you are talking about. I think it's the moms and dads trying to fix their kid that aint ready to be fixed yet. However you do it, do it. Find the way that works 4 you.
diabloentertain 3 months ago
If I had believed in "powerlessness" and "one day at a time," I would have died of my crack addiction 15 years ago.
"One day at a time" is a permission statement to relapse tomorrow. What's wrong with making a solemn vow to yourself to stop drugging for the rest of your life?
You know what? Whether you think you're powerless, or you think you have ultimate power over what you put in your body . . . either way, you're correct.
BlatzBeer 3 months ago
Gotta wonder why this man is so against 12 step programs. Something has obviously happened to him.
I just have to say I am glad I am part of that 5% that this program helped to get clean and learn how to live life sober.
ckedwards65 5 months ago
@ckedwards65 I too cant stand these 12 step cult programs and its weak, mindless followers. I stopped drinking on my own years ago and credit MYSELF for everything that happens in my life; good or bad. EVERYTHING IN LIFE IS A CHOICE! Its not that this man had a bad experence with some 12 step cult. Its just that SOMEONE has to denounce this garbage for what it is!
mrfilmnoir68 2 months ago
All I know is I was drunk & miserable & now I'm sober and happy. AA works for me. Long term. It ain't the only way, but it is a good way.
tommym202 5 months ago
@tommym202 Ignorance is bliss
isegoria1 5 months ago 4
@isegoria1 Look, If you're sober and happy, that's good. And yes, ignorance is bliss when you are able to ignore the haters. I'd much rather be sober, happy, have my successful career, and help others to acheive the same thing, than to live the way I used to.
tommym202 5 months ago
@isegoria1
no its not. that is a stupid AA saying cult programming.
inwood75 2 months ago
@isegoria1 Yes, and unfortunately you are ignorant and have no education on how the brain works. Come talk to me when you have a PhD in neuroscience.
MrDCSLC 1 week ago
AA is an example of the old saying "if you repeat a lie often enough people will believe it".
Ironhand09 5 months ago
I do not hate you I FULLY AGREE WITH YOU! NEEDED TO BE SAID! THE TRUTH!
AngeliaClaire 5 months ago
any cult groups will hate those that hold a mirror to their lies and misperceptions.
ShaaaBang73 6 months ago
I've been clean in NA for almost 20 years. I do it by personal choice as treatment for an addiction disorder that is recognized by the AMA.
naclean91 6 months ago 2
@naclean91 So now it is a matter of choice? Your cult says it is a disease. You are a walking contradiction and you dont even know it. BTW your extra years clean means nothing to me. It does not give your credence or clout. The AMA has a dirty past that is akin to the mob. Maybe you should read up on them before you use such a poor starting point. BTW AMA has NEVER agreed with AA that it was a disease. No matter how much pushing and shoving AA has done.
isegoria1 6 months ago
@isegoria1 If you look at the medical definition of addiction you would realize it is a disease. I have a doctorate in neuroscience and work at the University of Utah. I have been doing experiments and tests on lab rats and humans for 17 years. At first, I did not believe addiction is a disease but when you get the education and do the work and experiments behind it, addiction is a disease. Your comments are not educated and backed up by any research and are therefore useless.
MrDCSLC 1 week ago
Amen. I had to walk away from AA to stay sober. It is full of narcissism and predators alike. Rational recovery makes sense.
"Does a person who jumps off a building have an allergy to heights?"
Classic.
GeorgeWCIII 7 months ago
I am sorry to hear that you are receiving hate-barbed messages from people who are supposedly working a good 12-step program. The program has worked for me, but I will be the first to admit that it is not the ONLY program available to people. Hate is not a characteristic of anyone working a good program--12 step or otherwise.
jwalsh671 7 months ago
@jwalsh671 Good call, man.
tommym202 5 months ago
Thanks for the videos. Yours and the ones by blamethenile and others helped me to escape the damn cult. And I'm doing OK without them.
The "allergy" part was a really good analogy.
dimefeet 7 months ago
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zrhorner723 7 months ago
You sound perfectly at peace and ease....not.
Take up your disease issue with the AMA.
ONLY 5% will do the work.
medic357 9 months ago
@medic357 Only 5% keep going. Far more leave and succeed, without the replacement addiction to the meetings and the dogma.
dimefeet 7 months ago
This has been flagged as spam show
"A.A. is not allied with any sect, denomination, politics, organization or institution" Flat out lie. Dr. Bob Smith founder of AA was a freemason therefore there is a definite affiliation with another cult.
beautifulmind546 9 months ago
AA is a cult in the same sense RR is, or the police or the fire dept. or military. Its a group of people with a purpose. Its a fellowship of alcoholics that have recovered from alcoholism and they are there to help others. Theres no leaders in AA. Only God, He is the ultimate authority in AA. The sickies in AA are the non alcoholics. I wish they would leave and come to RR so you guys can put up with their bogus, counterfeit bullshit alternative to recovery like you clowns
miket1m 10 months ago
@miket1m Yeah that makes sense consider Dr. Bob was a freemason. AA is a full fledged cult and froom what I have seen, ppl get sober but as far as recovery, there is very little to none as the addictions get transfered to other things including the program. Helping others? Pffft. AA alcoholics only ever help themselves. Even any service ultimately comes back to their ego so they can pat themself on the back. There are leaders, narcisists who sponser others it's like the blind leading the blind
beautifulmind546 9 months ago
@beautifulmind546 There are no leaders in AA. God is the ultimate authority. So what if Dr. Bob was a free mason. Theres nothing wrong with being a mason. People do recover in AA, I am one of them. I have recovered from a "seemly hopeless state of mind and body" otherwise known as alcoholism. I don't know what AA meeting you went to. Don't judge AA as a whole just on your experience, thats ignorance. Humility is helping others. We look down on grand standing in my group. Thats not what its about
miket1m 9 months ago
@miket1m Dr Bob being a mason is significant because like many masonic touched organizations, the elements of asserting control over others, deceit and manipulation are ever present. This is true for AA as well. I have been a sober person all my life and watched family go from drunk to being sucked in by this cult with addictions being transfered to other things being called 'recovery'. You can only claim recover if your addictive tendencies and narcisism, need to manipulate is gone.
beautifulmind546 9 months ago
1.
@beautifulmind546
Alcoholics Anonymous is a fellowship of men and women who share their experience, strength and hope with each other that they may solve their common problem and help others to recover from alcoholism. The only requirement for membership is a desire to stop drinking. There are no dues or fees for A.A. membership; we are self supporting through our own contributions. A.A. is not allied with any sect, denomination, politics, organization or institution;
miket1m 9 months ago
2.
@beautifulmind546
does not wish to engage in any controversy, neither endorses nor opposes any causes. Our primary purpose is to stay sober and help other alcoholics to achieve sobriety.
This is all AA is. There are no leaders in AA. We have over 2 million members. That many drunks and no leaders. Tell me there is no God.
miket1m 9 months ago
@miket1m So basically you have been taught to revomit the brainwashing teachings from the big book and you can't think for yourself. It is a FACT Dr. Bob WAS a Freemason which means that AA is in fact allied with the sect, politics, organization and institution that is Freemasonry. You are basically repeating a flat out mind controlling lie.
beautifulmind546 9 months ago
@beautifulmind546 I consider myself to be an AA historian and I don't remember ever seeing that anywhere. I know that Bob was a very spiritual man and him and sister Ignatia took about 5000 people through the program at Akron's City Hospital I don't really give a rats ass what you think AA is. Thats what our preamble says, that what I observe. We do not get involved in anything outside of AA. Its obvious you don't know squat about AA .
miket1m 9 months ago
@miket1m Historian really? Ever hear of the internet? mywordlikefire.wordpress(dot)com/2008/11/26/942/
beautifulmind546 9 months ago
@beautifulmind546 At least I don't have an alcoholic mind controlling me like it is you. You'r5e a sick person
miket1m 9 months ago
@miket1m Have you hear the expression about ASSumptions in AA? Not that it matters but I have always been a sober person. All my experiences with AA have been watching my alcoholic family members and their friends go through this cult. I have seen it further destroy so many lives that I lost count. lives that were on the brink of healing. My own family is destroyed because of this cult just like any other cult tears family members apart.
beautifulmind546 9 months ago
@beautifulmind546 You're not even an alcoholic so why don't you just shut the hell up. You sound like a friggin nut, do you know that? Comparing AA to the moonies or some other crazy groups. You're an idiot and I'm so tired of talking to your dumbass.
miket1m 9 months ago
@miket1m NO I will not stfu. I have spent most of my life fighting to survive from the alcoholism of those in my life and for my family. After being abused and neglected by the drunks in my family I still fought for healing only to have AA make it impossible. AA IS a cult and it makes ppl like YOU completely brainwashed selfish, narcissistic and irresponsible. You are the one who escapes into drink and I am the dumbass and idiot? Your comments only prove what I am saying about AA U R a perfectex
beautifulmind546 9 months ago
@beautifulmind546 I am a recovered alcoholic 25 years. You are a whining cry baby who needs God in their life. You are an idiot who has nothing nice to say about anything that helps people. AA was the greatest spiritual movement of the 20th century. Millions have recovered from alcoholism. We are worldwide and we have an excellent recovery rate. Sorry, but that is a fact! AA works, if you work it. If an alcoholic want sobriety they have to work for it through the 12 steps.
miket1m 9 months ago
@miket1m WOW 25 years sobriety and look at how much consideration and empathy that you have developed in yourself from this 'spiritual program' PFFFT! Could not fill a thimble! AA does not help ppl. It tells them they are powerless which makes them disempowered. It tells them they have a disease or allergy which makes them irresponsible. It transfers addictions to other addictions and it keeps ppl from using their brains and thinking. 'keep it simple stupid!' AA is mind control and you are MCed!
beautifulmind546 9 months ago
@beautifulmind546 I have no tolerance for stupidity. If you are a real alcoholic, you are powerless over alcohol. You might excel in all areas, but when it comes to drinking, you don't have a choice. Alcoholics have no choice in the matter, they drink because they have to. Thats why people pursue this into the gates of hell or death. No one can relieve an alcoholic from their alcoholism. Only One can and that One is God. You do the steps to get God and He keeps you sober, whiner
miket1m 9 months ago
@miket1m That is a completely irresponsible and mind controlled statement. All drinking is a choice but it's easier for you to pretend it's not so that you can play the victim. With your mentality I would not be surprised if you would say that your abusive behavior is not your fault either and it's because you have a disease. Let's discuss how many ppl's lives YOU have fucked up with your choice to be a drunk and an abusive ass. 25 yrs sober and still a jerk. Another AA success story pffft
beautifulmind546 9 months ago
@beautifulmind546
No its not, its a fact. The alcoholic has lost the choice to drink, he has no will power whatsoever in regards to drinking. He drinks insanely. Most alcoholics lose, jobs, family, homes, cars, freedom, etc... You think it was their choice to do all that. They didn't drink because they wanted to, they drank because they had to. You're a no nothing non alcoholic who thinks he knows what he's talking about. Get a life you whiner.
miket1m 9 months ago
@miket1m Cop out and total neglect of responsibility. But you need to believe it so you can be the victim instead of owning your choices. Yes choice, the choice to escape into a bottle at every opportunity instead of muster up a little courage and face life. No one has to drink to escape. Even children who are severly abused find other coping mechanisms - I know that first hand as I was abused by drunks like you. Funny, you are the one who is a drunk, and now mind controlled U get a life whino
beautifulmind546 9 months ago
@miket1m "Recovered" MY ASS
beautifulmind546 9 months ago
@beautifulmind546 Yes recovered, Ass Clown.
miket1m 9 months ago
@miket1m Right, we can see how 'recovered' and 'spiritual" you are by the way you call ppl harmed by this program 'idiot' 'dumbass' assclown' etc. You are nothing but an irresponsible dry drunk brainwashed lemming. We can see how the cutl of AA has made you such a peaceful, responsible loving person of GOD PFFFFFT!
beautifulmind546 9 months ago
@beautifulmind546 I don't pull any punches for one, and two, I'm not going to sit here all nice and let your ass abuse me. You're an idiot and you don't know AA, the disease or anything about recovery. Oh, and you whine a lot.
miket1m 9 months ago
@miket1m Thanks for proving my points with your own hateful comments. AA is such a spiritual program and you who having found god, have become such a peaceful, loving and responsible person after 25 yrs sobriety (heavy sarcasm).
beautifulmind546 9 months ago
@beautifulmind546 lol, You're a moron. You don't even have a drinking problem, why are you commenting on the page? AA isn't a CHURCH DIPSHIT! God has taken away the obsession to drink. Its like the problem never existed. I was the kind of drunk who blacked out and ended up living in an abandoned house. Unless you have walked in my shoes, you have no right to judge me
miket1m 9 months ago
@miket1m Funny you mention 'blacking out'. See because I was being abused by drunks like you as a child I spent a good part of my life dissociative. But I never became a drunk like you. Instead I fought to heal and have a life. I comment on this page because I am sick and tired of drunks like you in AA spewing your so called spiritual vile never owning any responsibility for your crimes and just continuing to be a frickin victim. How many ppl did you harm in those blackouts? I'm sure plenty
beautifulmind546 9 months ago
@beautifulmind546 After being beat by a drunk as a child I would think you would be for anything that helps alcoholics. I'm sorry that happened to you. I owned everything that I did. The jobs I lost, the family I lost, etc. All a result of my selfish, self centered behavior. You see, drinking is just a symptom of what wrong with us. Dishonesty, no faith in anything, full of fear, jealousy, envy, laziness, etc... I hurt people that I loved as a result of my alcoholic behavior and drinking.
miket1m 9 months ago
@beautifulmind546 The adult child of an alcoholic can become just as sick as the alcoholic himself. they can become selfish, self centered, dishonest (lying to yourself in the form of excuses, rationalizations), You have no faith in God, AA, not even in yourself. As a result of lack of faith, you have fear and out of fear comes intolerance, anger, depression, etc. Because of all this negativity you are not grateful for anything. And you don't do anything for anyone unless you can get something
miket1m 9 months ago
@beautifulmind546 Does this sound a lot like you? Do you know only two emotions, anger and depression? Get on Welbutrin, it will help you out. Also you should get some counseling if you're not already. The resentment you have for that drunk who beat you, is hurting you, not that drunk. You have only two alternatives. Keep going the painful way your going or except spiritual help. Go to ACOA and take the 12 steps. This is just a suggestion.
miket1m 9 months ago
@miket1m Nope it doesn't sound like me at all. This particular topic runs hot for me but unlike you I can have an emotion and go on with the rest of my life. I don't have to join a cult to handle myself nor get drunk. Don't need meds like I don't need booze. Please keep your two bit revomitted AA advice to yourself because YOU are the one who needs it, not me. You are the drunk and the cult member. Another AA success story 25 yrs sober and still an narcisistic egomaniac.
beautifulmind546 9 months ago 2
First of all, you are not "in the program". The program is the 12 steps. You are in the AA fellowship and you are suppose to take the steps, as in "here are the steps we took"
How much money are you making off the poor unfortunate alcoholics? Do you keep recovery or success records? How do you know what you are doing is working? All the successors prior to AA, the temperance movement, the Washingtonians, etc. all failed. What make this RR different from them. It sounds like the ODAAT bull in AA
miket1m 10 months ago
@arrdvarks1 Life with special modifiers? You guys remind me of the get rich quick schemers who say that it did not work for you because you did not do it their way to the letter. You remind me also of the people who excuse child rape cases for pastors and priests. You make me sick. I am not defensive or attacking. How is a person rejecting crap attacking? I am to the point. I have no time in my life for senseless bullshit babble which is why I don't bother with your cult anymore.
isegoria1 10 months ago
@arrdvarks1 No it did not take "root" in me. In fact I did it all by myself like millions of people do everyday. What was planted was bullshit that took countless hours of therapy to undo the damage created by your cult. I wonder why it pisses you people off so bad when people disagree with your group cult think?
isegoria1 10 months ago
@arrdvarks1 Speak out? You mean like the daily death threats I get? You people are too funny. I have covered this shit with you before. It is simply not my fault you are too slow to follow it.
isegoria1 10 months ago 2
you're right my man, and keep it up. i havent been happier in a long time, and it's because i left that ridiculous cult of NA. it all comes down to buckling down, and taking some personal responsibility. powerless my ass. im a human being and i have the power to make choices. thats a fact. we all have the POWER to make a CHOICE. fuck 12 step programs. do you really want what the "winners" have? what do they have? tell me please. they're just as egotistical as they always were.
ststephenwitharose 11 months ago 5
no (real) alcoholic can regain control for long according to the big book and my experience.
savanah626 1 year ago
if what that 12j marie says is true she was never an a
savanah626 1 year ago
I hasn't had a drink or drug in 3 and a half years truth is I'm not in love with meetings but I don't go looking for the drug dealer if I go there what ever works right.
savanah626 1 year ago
nothing in the big book of aa says disease, the people in the rooms are sick and use that at first till they learn to deal with underlying issues through the steps.
savanah626 1 year ago
@savanah626 I have covered your lame argument and will not do it again. Please do attend some meeting so you can hear all about the disease in which teh ends are always the same - jails institutions and death. BTW I have not been through any of those since leaving your self deprecating cult. I feel no more need to abuse myself. I pity you.
isegoria1 1 year ago
@savanah626 But the 'disease' of alcoholism is continuously discussed and used throughout the program as a crutch. And the steps don't serve dealing with the underlying issues at all. All they do is create a framework for an appearance of healing when the real healing never gets done. My family members supposedly 'worked the steps' but no amends were made, no internal changes. But hey, fake it until you make it right?
beautifulmind546 11 months ago
Good on yer, man! More power to your elbow!
MrTobytwirl 1 year ago
Hi. I just want to say that I was a heroin user for 8 years...I ended up in jail, psychiatric institutions, left for dead after overdosing and numerous AA/NA meetings! Guess which 1 of these things helped me to be the 8 years sober I am today? Thats right..NONE!! I did it because I wanted to...and guess what? I can still have a tequila and oj or glass of wine and not end up with a needle in my arm! So I totally back you isegoria But as it goes "2 each his own" but there IS another way! DECIDE!
11jmarie 1 year ago 8
@11jmarie Thank you for talking good solid sense. And thanks for taking the time to chime in. Here's to your continued -um eh clean time. I think that is how I would put it. :)
isegoria1 1 year ago
One question....who is the "hater" here ? Look in the mirror dude. I'm in AA and I've been sober 3 years. I live a pretty good life today thanks to AA.
goindownthe1road 1 year ago
@goindownthe1road I get plenty of death threats almost daily for questioning your sacrosanct cult. Now run along and blame it all on your made up disease.
isegoria1 1 year ago
@goindownthe1road No, not thanks to AA. Seriously? You made the CHOICE to drink and you made the CHOICE in the last three years to be responsible and you are going to give that credit to AA instead of empowering yourself and owning that YOU MADE THAT CHOICE? You were Never powerless. That is a lie. You always had the choice. Why do you need to believe you are a victim of a false disease in order to make yourself feel ok about making a responsible healthy choice? Be honest with yourself.
beautifulmind546 11 months ago
@beautifulmind546 Yes, thanks to AA. Seriously. And, no, I did not always have the choice. I would wake up in the a.m. hung over and say "I'm never drinking again" and by 2:30-3:00 in the afternoon when I got feeling better, the obsession would kick in and I would have to drink again. It was a nightmare. I would rather go to AA the rest of my life than risk experiencing that again. I know what I'm talking about, I've lived it.
goindownthe1road 11 months ago
@goindownthe1road You have always had the choice. You are sober now because you made a choice to be. AA had nothing to do with it other than it allowed you to trick your own mind into believing you have a disease (which you don't) and that it was a HP who saved you. It's a whole lot easier that way than to own up that you chose to escape and drink. You get to be a victim and you like that. Ask yourself why it is so hard for you to claim your own power and responsibility to yourself.
beautifulmind546 11 months ago
Anger is a normal emotion when used appropriately. AA indirectly causes people to die via suicide and relapse. Research it. Any normal rational, non pro- AA brainwashed person would be very angry. I have not heard 1 12 step arguement to date proving me wrong on this.
mattamal1 1 year ago
It also explains te we have a mental obsesion over alcohol, the mind is sick!!!! if you be any type of addict then you will think of the substance a whole lot. the book talks about changing our mind. how can you change your mind- ,your thinking? what you think is what you are, AA is not manopoly, the book explains that they are many different ways to achieve sobriety, this is only one of them
paredea81 1 year ago
@paredea81 "The ends are ALWAYS the same, jails institutions and death" I am nowhere near any of these. You can excuse AA's monopoly anyway you like. Just don't expect other people to buy into the bullshit storm.
isegoria1 1 year ago
An allergy is a rection fron the body, A part of the Big Book in the doctors opinion expressed by Dr. Silksworth: Men and women drink essentially for the effect produce by alcohol. Do you like the effect? THen it Goes and explains that after a conciderable period their state of mind become so illusive and that the person drinking alcohol they can't distinguish the true from the false. In my experience once I get buzz then I for watever reason I continue to grab & grab anotherone.
paredea81 1 year ago
@paredea81 Nice attempt to excuse your DELIBERATE behavior. Anything but own up huh?
isegoria1 1 year ago
Your absolutely right those people are not working the "AA program" at all, in fact whether you're a 12 stepper or not anger is never productive. More power to you people AA and NA does not work for anyone. It is obvious that you are passionate about saving peoples lives, do whatever works.
RealLifeDocumentary 1 year ago
I did smart recovery because AA/NA and the group norms and the "God" talk and the meetings in my area being soap operas, with the same group of ppl who are old timers and nobody dares to say anything because they will boast their longer sobriety and the ones who take other people's inventory a lot. If you come back from a slip there are always those who look down on you but there are many kickass AA's and some of the teachings from AA help and could be a tool still both could helps some people.
9436oelable 1 year ago
Hey man. Love your uploads. Thankfully i was aware enough to recognise AA and its numerous 12 step incarnations for the snake oil peddlars they really are. Sadly, many do not. Its great to see i am not alone in my suspicion of their spurious claims and was forthright enough to challenge them whenever they transpired. As you can well imagine, i too encountered the same rancorous hostility you describe..
All the best. Kind Regards Jeremy
opiatedmonkey 1 year ago
I had never heard of the term "Rational Recovery" until today, but I have been practicing it for years. I used to be a hardcore drunk and I quit on my own and have been sober for years now. I didn't realize there was a term for that LOL
Turdbuckethat 1 year ago
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BILL W. IS A LIAR & THE FATHER OF LIES !
IGOROZKARSKY 1 year ago
driheaves 1 year ago
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driheaves 1 year ago
to the person in the video, you poor angry person you lol..lighten up, get clean stay clean worry about yourself..any recovery is good recovery...hope you find your own way and continue on the path ..
rickg1724 1 year ago
@rickg1724 Thanks for the belly laugh. I like how you people assume I am angry because I disagree with your made up disease and the precious cult.
isegoria1 1 year ago
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driheaves 1 year ago
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driheaves 1 year ago
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driheaves 1 year ago
@rickg1724 Your program 12 steps causes people to indirectly die via suicide and relapse. The best you can do is say lighten up. If you study RR that sounds like the beast mind speaking.
mattamal1 1 year ago
your chasing a lie so dont preach to me about how good AA is because i know that AA is a lie , snake oil and cult like meetings dont save me or anyone , "There is a principle which is a bar against all information, which is proof against all arguments and which cannot fail to keep a man in everlasting ignorance that principle is contempt prior to investigation."
rexxed33 1 year ago
AA is not for everyone...is not perfect...he missed the whole point of this program... its spiritual....its about God in your life....thats what it points to and that is where the recovery comes from...I do know one thing...I would not want to be like this dude or follow anything he says...what a resentful person......you say you need some positive,,,it helps...yet all you say is negative...who pissed on your cereal... then the final clue at the end...Rational Recovery...lol ... no wonder...
briand61 1 year ago
@briand61 So you tie something so important to something you can not prove? It is amazing that you can stay sober. Prove your god or go play appolgetics somewhere else. Millions of people are waiting. "AA is not for everyone" Matter of fact AA works for no one. 5% with AA and 5% without = 0%
isegoria1 1 year ago
@briand61 get real man people fail to get help in AA and die
God isn't real anyway. It's an idea.
mattamal1 1 year ago
AA is not perfect...not for everyone....but I do know one thing for sure... I would not want to be like this dude.... no wonder...he gave the clue...a rational recovery dude...LOL
briand61 1 year ago
@briand61 I like your adhom commentary and leaving all points made stand, now run along and spread your bullshit somewhere else - your spiritual venom makes me happy.
isegoria1 1 year ago
Rarely have we seen a person fail who has thoroughly followed our path. Those who do not recover are people who cannot or will not completely give themselves to this simple program, usually men and women who are constitutionally incapable of being honest with themselves. There are such unfortunates. They are not at fault; they seem to have been born that way. They are naturally incapable of grasping and developing a manner of living which demands rigorous honesty.
murphj4 1 year ago
@murphj4 More mindless blather? DO you people even bother to think for yourselves or is it just easier to have the group think for you? "Constitutionally Incapable" You mean like blaming shit on a made up disease model concocted by a LSD taking mental patient? You can call that honest if you like I have no time for such jibberish. Tell yourself what ever bullshit you need to so you can sleep at night. I will stick with the facts.
isegoria1 1 year ago
@isegoria1 Enjoy your "irrational recovery" LOL.
I can see that it works well for you. LOL
murphj4 1 year ago
@murphj4 It is I who is laughing at you with you boat load of excuses to cover a behavior you intentionally did. Instead of owning up you people rely on a made up disease from a LSD taking failure. Speaking of failure you group has a 0% success ratio. In fact it has been proven many times over that you 12 step cult does more damage than good.
Enjoy your excuses I am done reading your excuse ridden trite.
isegoria1 1 year ago
@murphj4 Lol. I find it amusing that 12 step mullahs are so readily reduced to espousing their sacred scripture( ver batim) in lieu of any meaningful or cogent debate. I believe many of the 12 steppers who have felt obliged to posit their pious tripe secretly harbour fears that we( 12 step critics) may be right, thus compelling them to recite BB incantations in a superstitious attempt to ward off the undesired effects of reasoned rationale. O
opiatedmonkey 1 year ago
Their chances are less than average. There are those, too, who suffer from grave emotional and mental disorders, but many of them do recover if they have the capacity to be honest."
murphj4 1 year ago
thanks for this video . im clean just over a year now and i feel NA has done more harm than good for me. they make me feel bad about everything i do or did. i hate the fact that if you dont beleive everything they tell you they dont want anything to do with you. thanks for your video im not going to miss NA thanks.
nerrad8383 1 year ago
Fair play to you Isegoria! I think if I were a Yank rather than a Brit I'd be every bit as angry as you sometimes get. The stepper nonsense gets infuriating enough even in a country where it hasn't completely infiltrated the judicial and medical establishment. I had to walk away from the rooms for my sanity (and before I chinned someone).
MrTobytwirl 1 year ago
look up Alcoholics Anonymous - the 95% lie on youtube
peveyt60 1 year ago
that 95 percent thing is bullshit
and the allergy thing is referring to how a substance effects people different if they are allergic and alcohol effects alcoholics differently due to many different factors one being enzymes in your liver the alcoholic enzyme brakes down alcohol differently becoming dependent on it ,abnormal irrational behavior
just like pollen to an allergic person causes them to sneeze
peveyt60 1 year ago
and you insult aa for insulting your program when you do the same thing that is very hypocritical shedding the big book that have helped people return to sanity and were not supposed to be offended have you know love for the suffering alcoholic and your statistics are very wrong btw
im glad you have a program to keep you sober but you seem to lack a little in peace and serenity
peveyt60 1 year ago
why do you care so much? what works for some people doesnt work for others. you need to worry about yourself and let the others do what you want. where is all the anger coming from? something must be wrong in your life if you truly feel the need to tell others what is "right" and what isn't.
androoeff 1 year ago
people who need a hospital and nurses and all this care and support just to stop drinking or taking drugs are WIMPS ! wimps who cry every time life gets hard,
do me a favor and kill your self's . wimps are not wanted
gullitulli 1 year ago
nice dude!!!!
dc72368 1 year ago
you won't get any hate from me... AA is working for me.. because i am working my recovery program... just like my mom with diabetes... she still had to take personal responsibility for her recovery.. and her choices... peace is a choice we can all make every day... best wishes for your continued growth
jimmietfreeway 1 year ago
I'm a drunk and I relapse. I'm in AA, I love the people there, but it doesn't stop me.I have God in me and love my religion. But again, it doesn't stop me. I admit I'm powerless over alcohol because I am...
StanBennet 1 year ago
@StanBennet Powerless over what you intentionally put in your body? Tell your self what ever bullshit your need to so you can sleep at night. Maybe one day you will get real.
isegoria1 1 year ago
@isegoria1 Religous types don't think rationally because "religion takes the cake on bullshit". Religious and hypocritical are a really bad combo. I would avoid them like the plague. AA ers are scared to death of you.
mattamal1 1 year ago
theres other ways of speaking your mind without breaking your anonymity my friend.
danjov45 1 year ago
I think its BS that people in AA NA and others have given you hell you speaking your mind. I agree totally that people do exist in AA and other fellowships that are just plain angry as angry people can get. Personaly i work a 12 step program and i find that it works for me and has been as i celebrate two years this week. I am not a angry or critical, i just felt the need to speak my mind just as you have and i thank you for doing so. "To each his own", and im happy program works for you, :)
edtheretardg10 1 year ago
@edtheretardg10 Thanks for weighing in and good luck with your continued success. 2 years is an outstanding achievement. I remember that day well for myself. For what ever reason I did take a 1 year coin even though I had not been in a meeting for 6 months. The second year was different. No coin, no birthday cake, just a silent celebration and a sense of clarity and well being that I had not had before.
isegoria1 1 year ago
Sorry that these people in programs and such have caused you so many problems... Thats not cool.
nwmicwrecka 1 year ago
@nwmicwrecka Thanks for taking the time to watch the video. Good luck (skills) on your continued sobriety
isegoria1 1 year ago
I quit drinking 30 years ago. I looked at the 12 steps and ecided they are not helpful but in fact make it more difficult. I wrote down what i thought would be the way to go. i didnt end up with 12 steps. i did it with three.
sandraplumberd 1 year ago
@sandraplumberd Many find that forging their own path is the best way. I have also done mine with great success. Good to hear that there is more than just a few ways to get this done.
On a serious note would you like to contribute to a book on non 12 step recovery? I have an acquaintance that is writing a book about the positive aspects of non 12 step recovery. Contact me and I will provide his email addy for you.
isegoria1 1 year ago
I really think that it would be good if you do videos that demonstrate the positive aspects of your program and leave these negative diplays for others. AA lives and breaths pessimism and negativity. You would be better served just ignoring it.
sandraplumberd 1 year ago
@sandraplumberd Hard to ignore death threats
isegoria1 1 year ago
I think that alcoholism, as it applies to people in AA, could correctly be called a syndrome rather then a disease. I believe that the organization encourages and demands self denial prevail. This insulates the people from their only avenue to recovery. They are forced to deny the power within that can gather control.
sandraplumberd 1 year ago
Step 1
Admit that we can not control our drinking. If we have any alcohol at all, we can not control our behaviour and it has a negative affect on our life. We must not have another drink.
sandraplumberd 1 year ago
@sandraplumberd are these your own made up steps?
isegoria1 1 year ago
@isegoria1
Read the three steps.
This is how people do quit. They tell themselves they need to, they can and they are woth it. Then it happens.
sandraplumberd 1 year ago
@isegoria1
I get a feeling you know i am right
sandraplumberd 1 year ago
Step 2
Look at our strengths, joys and pleasures in life. Look at the good things we have done in life and be proud of our strengths. Focus on these things and make an effort to step forward positively to a better life for our self and those dear to us.
Step 3
Seek help to understand your anger, your moods and psychological health. If a positive approach to life, appreciation of love and feelings of joy are too hard to find, seek professional help to understand why this is so.
sandraplumberd 1 year ago
@sandraplumberd Why is it that people are always claimed to be angry when the question a sacrosanct ideal?
isegoria1 1 year ago
With you all the way. I sober up as a Buddhist - 8 fold path. 16 yrs. Dry Drunk = Heretic and too cool etc. is Christian algebra for do what we do or we will kill you cause we are spiritual today. I live in town of night of the living 12 steppers and its constantly having to listen to AA guru shitheads smash on people who quit sans AA. Talk about Earths oldest insanity being called solution again - me and my holy book or else. Keep up the good work. Abrahamic faith filth doesn't work
zorel7100 1 year ago
I am an AA'er and I respect all avenues of recovery, not just mine. And even though I have no power over alcohol, I still must take responsibility for my actions, even when I drank, no exceptions. I am addicted to alcohol and all I can do is abstain from it for life.
I want to live and grow spiritually for my own benefit. May your program bring you the peace and joy that mine has.
1981Winddancer 1 year ago
@1981Winddancer between you and mraindog81 who commented before you; I am starting to think there are some sane people that follow 12 step recovery. Look at the contrast between the comments you both left and the trolls before you. Good luck with your continued sobriety.
isegoria1 1 year ago
@isegoria1 I am sorry for their insane comments my friend. Steps 6 and 7 are often missed by many of us in AA. Here we learn to drop the character defects like backbiting that hurt not only others but our own sobriety as well. If you are sober, happy, joyful and free, then your sobriety is truly awesome and you do not need to apologize for how you got there.
1981Winddancer 1 year ago
@1981Winddancer Thanks
isegoria1 1 year ago
I am a friend of Bill, and I am just happy to see anybody recover by any means that works for them. I don't know anyone from the program who doesn't feel that way. I was a mess for eight years, and since I came to terms with my problem and started attending meetings a year ago, I have been free of my obsession. Sneer all you want to: I am sticking with what has brought me immeasurable relief.
mraindog81 1 year ago
@mraindog81 No sneering here. Good luck with your sobriety may it be a lasting thing for you. BTW yours is about the most sane comment I have seen from a 12 stepper in a long time.
isegoria1 1 year ago
I guess your just SMARTER and WISER than the Americam Medical Association As they have classed it as a DISEASE, And once again having a disease does not negate any personal responsibilty whatsoever. Who is the hater in all realityHMMM GET HONEST MY FRIEND
thewiledchild 1 year ago
@thewiledchild AMA is one of many organizations used as AA front groups. AMA has never once listed alcoholism as a disease. It appears that it is you who must get real. Besides for me to know everything as you do I would need to either belong to religion or your ineffective cult. Anything but take personal responsibility for your past huh? FAIL
isegoria1 1 year ago
@thewiledchild The AMA is a Christian backed shit talking circle jerk. AA is Abrahamic faith filth passed off as solution again. If you dont think the best moments of the middle east are perpetuated for the same reason you AAers call the SOBER person sans AA filth a Dry Drunk guess again you antidiluvian born again idiot with a Big Book. Your just another filthy AA Guru screaming do it our way or we will kill you cause - well - uh - yer spiritual today. FILTHY GURU!!!
zorel7100 1 year ago
Nice anger you call that recovery who would want that? Read the literature in full Then you might know what you are talking about. There is an old saying "keep your mouth shut and have them all think your stupid or speak up and remove all doubt. The whole program is ABOUT taking RESPONIBILTY however you'd know that if you had actually researched your preaching. As for "the diease model" Well
thewiledchild 1 year ago
@thewiledchild Angry? pfft. You people really need a new play book. I am not angry. I find it interesting that you claim that I am angry because I ask that AA prove their claims. Thanks for proving yours is a sacrosanct cult religion. The anti thought in your empty platitude is astounding. Your whole "program" is the opposite of taking responsibility. I like how you culties blame it all on a made up disease.
isegoria1 1 year ago
What an angry lil bunny! lol All i know is my life is great thanks to NA. I hope you find a little respite from your rage, I used to go there a lot but im happier now i can let most of it just slide away. Im sorry the room guys are knocking your way -thoses guys just aint got it yet, but hey whatever works for ya! hope ya find peace from your anger and find happiness. Best wishes. Mark Jordan
mjbelfast 1 year ago
@mjbelfast Thanks for the predictable adhom commentary. You really are full of stupid assumptions aren't you. Anything but deal with the points made in the video huh? Thanks for making my point with your bullshit commentary. Then you give me empty well wishing which translates to "go to hell". You people are so funny and predictable. What is sad is that you thought you were being witty. Nice excuses but still lame.
isegoria1 1 year ago
You dont look a very happy person, so much anger there and hostility for AA! I went to AA to stop drinking because nothing else was working for me and its kept me sober for 7yrs and thats cant be a bad thing surely!!! Sounds like you dont have a clue about AA and just get off on anger to get a response!!!
askinfull 1 year ago
@askinfull Much happier than you who has taken the time to share your delusion with us. Anything but just knock it off huh? Nothing but lames excuses as always, your cult never changes. I suppose by your stupid assumption my 10 years in your cult makes it where I know nothing about your cult. Tell yourself what ever lies you need to sleep at night. Yours is a comment I have seen many times over, always from your cult. Do you people think for yourselves ever?
isegoria1 1 year ago
I am one of the 5%. Faith in a power greater than myself keeps me sober. AIDS is a disease. The letter A stands for acquired. I acquired the phenomenon of craving due to drinking too much, too often, for far too long. I work the 12 Steps to the best of my ability. When I don't work at it, my life is uncomfortable. This is called untreated alcoholism.
What is the success rate of your method?
az2ak89 1 year ago
@az2ak89 Ummm that is is 5% with and 5% without. Are you not good at math? That is 0%. Try it, 5+ -5 = 0
isegoria1 1 year ago
Hay, thanks for putting your self out there. I like a lot of what you say. Some is a bit much but for the most part I believe what you say. There is a lot of finger pointing and judgmental attitudes. What you say about powerless is right on. Most people in AA hid behind the "powerless" concept. There is a wide misunderstanding of powerlessness. And there is a lot of real ridiculous belief that AA have "stinking thinking" even after years of sobriety they believe there thinking still "stinks"
SuperWeather123 1 year ago