is it wrong that a big ass dude took me down last weekend in a bar fight and i jabbed him in the eye with my thumb untill he let go and got off me????
Why would anybody want to learn how to punch like Chucky? His standup is shit and he can only beat wrestlers who have horrible standup.
Tito,Babablu,Couture,Horn,Randleman all of them wrasslers with horrible standup. As soon as ole chucky fought a good striker again (Rampage) then chucky folded like a cheap suit from Walmart and chucky got KO'd
what do you think Chuck Liddell would do if 50 really big guys were trying to rape him like in jail? do you think he could beat them all? also these guys will most likely be black
it didnt really give any techniques but it was still cool 2 watch his kicks n shit. probably 4 the best tho coz if sum1 learns how 2 really fuck sum1 up like chuck then they might find themself in jail lol
Anyone who ever fought will tell you that the best punch is the one that hits the target. It doesn't matter if it's a strong punch or a fast punch, if it misses the target it's a useless punch
it doesn't matter who "punches harder", because truth is, almost all of them punch hard enough to ko someone. its kinda like arguing what bullet is stronger for killing somebody...
GOOD OBSERVATION!!!!!! TOO MANY PEOPLE GET CAUGHT UP INTO NONFIGHTING CONCERNS. 2 train with the mindset that anyone doesnt punch hard is really a mistake. it is not where the focus should be. again, good observation.
true, but pretty much any bullet can kill a person if it hits them hard enough and in the right spot. and i said "almost" every mma fighter, not all. and same rules apply as the bullet.. depends on how square they hit the person- angle, distance, power, whether or not the person saw it coming.. there's plenty of circumstances where "almost" anyone could ko someone else with one punch.
this a video with a fighter who's famous for his knock out power, and im talking about how strength isn't always the key to a ko. so the "randon bullshit" as you said, is pretty relevant to wtf we're all talking about. why do people like YOU always have to argue with people for no reason. like you're insecure and you have to point out other peoples mistakes, even when they didn't do anything wrong, just so you can feel better about yourself before you go to bed at night. wow
@ricksexyy if you put your hips into a punch and do everythin with perfect technique, and you catch sum1 completely square, you can knock a person out. weight & power Does make a difference but like i said, the power can all depend on the angle from where they get hit, the distance they were hit from, and exactly where they Got hit. thats y back in the old ufc you'd see the scrawny ass people koing the heavyweights. machida is known for his technique and not power, and look what he did to rashad
@breakneck14 because a year ago when i commented on this video (lol) everyone was talking about who had a stronger punch between mma fighters vs. boxers and blah blah blah and it was stupid because regardless of who can punch harder, the outcome is the same for the person they're fighting. my bullet analogy was just saying how it doesn't matter cuz a shot to the head from either bullet is pretty likely to kill someone. don't take it too literally, i was just trying to give an example =/
@bigmanoooo1 i'm so tired of talking about this lol i said what i said a year ago. if people are still arguing with me, then they're still missing the point i'm trying to make
@nateisgreat1134 i get the point you were making, all mma fighters can punch hard as hell so its pointless arguing who hits hardest, i wasn't disputing the point you were making i was disputing the gun analogy
I think that's debatable. It's not who throws the punch it's how the punch is thrown. Everyone knows a solid powerful punch starts from the feet goes through the twisting hips up through the twisted core (abs, chest) and through the coiled arm. It's like a chain reaction. Arm punches are the opposite of this. As far as seeing Mike Tyson on this machine back in the day; of course who wouldn't want to see that? He had the mass not the acceleration which made his punch forceful.
Just so you know, there was a t.v. show on Discovery where scientists compared the amount of force with a punch from one of the best boxers, mma fighters, and I think that it was kickboxing(not 100% sure), and Quinton Jackson had the hardest punch out of all of them.... Just so you know.
do you really think that quinton jackson could punch harder than a boxer? tyson for example who isnt even one of the superpunchers punches wayy harder than jackson.
Even if they dont have a harder punch then tyson or marciano, who gives a fuck that wasnt your question. Your question was who has a hard punch worth mentioning. all i know is tysons punch was hard, and never heard shit about marciano.
are you fuckin kidding me sharodm13?? Quinton "Rampage" Jackson just had his punch recorded at 1800lbs. Two sumo wrestles colliding into eachother has 1000lbs of force. You prove that there is no punch worth mentioning now.
Sorry To Burst bubbles but according to large studies tyson's punch was more than 4times as powerful as average humans.Oh yeah,the average bro boxer punch isnt 600.There are boxers who aren't even known yet who punch over 1000 pounds,such as the boxer on fight science.
That's actually true I watched that fight science. I also watched the one with the female boxer who punched 960 pounds of force with her left hand.. I would love to have had that technology back in the day to measure bruce lee's force through his punches and kicks; totally devastating I'm sure..
Wrong, at Cuck's weightclass, many boxers hit as hard as him, and they do it so much better, he looks like a pathetic amatuer. I think the limitations of his punching "style" have been clearly shown by everyone who he's fought that knows to keep your hands up, and use mediocre boxing against him.
and both of those guys who knocked him out were subsequently champions. he'd still knock your head off. and say he fought a pro boxer, he knows how to kick and take you down. your argument is imbecilic, alluding to the fact that you probably are mentally handicapped and/or huff paint. Begone peasant!
Fail. I'm not saying I would beat him. I'm not saying he couldn't take down a boxer or leg kick him till he couldn't move. I'm saying his hand technique is NOT something to aspire too at all. I'll aspire to have hands like 100's of proffesional boxers who are vastly superior. How about most people who kickbox. Rua and Rampage whipped his ass with superior technique. To say you want to learn to punch like Liddell is like saying I want to learn to do takedowns like Kongo.
u cant compare chucks boxing style to a boxers boxing style because Chucks is meant for mma, there r difference becuase the distants has to be different to stop take downs and check kicks, mma boxing and boxer boxing is very different
Half of those guys are trained in Muay Thai. Most of Chuck's style was looking for a knockout at whatever angle he could find one. That and he was a big counter punch guy. In his prime his reflexes were to the point where if he got hit he was going to make you pay with one of his looping haymakers. Chuck Lidell is one of the few guys in MMA to ever knock someone down with a falling back uppercut. Randy Couture is a decent boxer. Chuck KO'ed him twice.
Couture is not a decent boxer. Even Rampage I'd consider a "mediocre" boxer, and he whipped Chuck's ass TWICE with that mediocre boxing. Tight guard, compact punches. Boxing 101 defeated Chuck's style.
in those fights, but compact punches? He knocked him down with a right hook then mounted him and won by a TKO(in UFC) . Andrei Arlovski trains with FREDDIE ROACH and lost his last fight to a guy throwing haymakers. If Alistar Overeem's style is so superior to Chuck Lidell's why did Lidell KO him in Pride? All that matters is what works in that one split second. St. Pierre got his ass handed to him by Matt Cerra...and that guy isn't known for his striking ability at all
1. Yeah, a right hook more compact than I've EVER seen Liddell throw.
2. Fedor was NOT throwing haymakers. Look up Russian hooks.
3. Overeem was beating Liddell until he gassed and opened up. If you think that makes Overeems striking worse than Liddell's, you're a fool. Liddell would be better if he had Overeem's striiking too.
4. So an instance of St. Pierre not taking his opponent seriously makes St. Pierre's striking less effective? Complete lunacy. Oh, and Pierre went on to beat him..
@chiconspiricy i wasn't talking about Fedor. Brett Rogers layed out Arlovski by throwing haymakers. Yeah that makes Overeems striking worse it wasn't good enough to beat Chuck, and his defense wasn't good enough to defend against that shot and/or counter it. With Pierre obviously his striking wasn't as good as it is NOW because he beat Matt Cerra in the rematch and even then it was mostly with his takedowns and ground and pound.
and for mmatazo your an idiot for he asking chuck to change camps.....thats were it all started for him and is a very very good camp and has alot of wec, bodog,affliction,k1, ufc and many other household named fighters training there......that camp has top ranked fighters there.....get your fact straight before you say some dumb shit like that!!
BOOOOOOO.LETS WACTH HOW TO PUNCH LIKE CHUCK NORRIS
Epicdancer123 6 months ago 2
British won cage fighting against Americans ;P
BigBoy250F 9 months ago
@BigBoy250F I'm British so feel compelled to tell you to stop making stupid comments
TwoSevenElevenEighty 7 months ago
is it wrong that a big ass dude took me down last weekend in a bar fight and i jabbed him in the eye with my thumb untill he let go and got off me????
brucekirk89 10 months ago
@brucekirk89 lmfao
angeriod 9 months ago
@brucekirk89
Depends, where you antagonising him or was he just an asshole?
If he was, then hell no!
the26thhour 7 months ago
@the26thhour nope he was just an asshole talking shit but i did not back down and he got mad LOL
brucekirk89 7 months ago
@brucekirk89 Then well done 8)
the26thhour 7 months ago
:38 i love that move one time i used it in a street fight and everyon as like"Damn man you really know how to fight"
69LuCkYChArmZ69 10 months ago
its like ryu and akuma
Fightrec 1 year ago
looks like fun!
KrazyKali69 1 year ago
Why would anybody want to learn how to punch like Chucky? His standup is shit and he can only beat wrestlers who have horrible standup.
Tito,Babablu,Couture,Horn,Randleman all of them wrasslers with horrible standup. As soon as ole chucky fought a good striker again (Rampage) then chucky folded like a cheap suit from Walmart and chucky got KO'd
SuperKing1320 1 year ago
@SuperKing1320 If chuck fought rampage while chuck was in his prime, rampage would've had no chance.
MartinLG0 1 year ago
@MartinLG0 Dude chuck sucks rampage alright veat his ass 2 or 3 times
Littletorrico 1 year ago
@Littletorrico They fought twice.
MartinLG0 1 year ago
my sis know john hacklemans son johny
ACEOFSPADES97 1 year ago
gay!
jobowtackmasterx 1 year ago
Chuck is the best lightheavyweight of all time, i sure wish he didnt get old....i love him though
TrubacaCj09 1 year ago
I'd sure like to train with chuck. guy is brutal good.
LordInstigator 1 year ago 2
i do believe chuck dosnt need to fight black guys that are gay in jail cause they know hell kill em :)
westcoaststandup 1 year ago
@westcoaststandup Wow super gay comment and uneducated
RealDeohge 1 year ago
what do you think Chuck Liddell would do if 50 really big guys were trying to rape him like in jail? do you think he could beat them all? also these guys will most likely be black
terrapatra 1 year ago
it didnt really give any techniques but it was still cool 2 watch his kicks n shit. probably 4 the best tho coz if sum1 learns how 2 really fuck sum1 up like chuck then they might find themself in jail lol
boozhownd1 1 year ago
LOVE IT LOVE IT LOVE IT
ibrahim10santos 1 year ago
Chuck is the man!
bluemystic7502 1 year ago
what the hell was that? didnt learn shit
sirJeffCaron 2 years ago
Anyone who ever fought will tell you that the best punch is the one that hits the target. It doesn't matter if it's a strong punch or a fast punch, if it misses the target it's a useless punch
djsonicc 2 years ago 12
so tru i mean i no from experience so.
bbrezzy007 2 years ago
do yourself a favor and dont learnhow to punch like chck liddell
gdsagfus 2 years ago
ha ha lol i was just thinking the same!!!!!!!!
jaikaransingh 2 years ago
If a truck just misses you but a car runs straight into you then the car does the damage so accuracy is the key.
byen8 2 years ago
it doesn't matter who "punches harder", because truth is, almost all of them punch hard enough to ko someone. its kinda like arguing what bullet is stronger for killing somebody...
nateisgreat1134 2 years ago 46
GOOD OBSERVATION!!!!!! TOO MANY PEOPLE GET CAUGHT UP INTO NONFIGHTING CONCERNS. 2 train with the mindset that anyone doesnt punch hard is really a mistake. it is not where the focus should be. again, good observation.
genious4real 2 years ago
hmmm cept that there are bullets that suck at killing people...ask any vietnam vet
& not all fighters in MMA have 1 hit KO power in their punches
Zuranthus 2 years ago
true, but pretty much any bullet can kill a person if it hits them hard enough and in the right spot. and i said "almost" every mma fighter, not all. and same rules apply as the bullet.. depends on how square they hit the person- angle, distance, power, whether or not the person saw it coming.. there's plenty of circumstances where "almost" anyone could ko someone else with one punch.
nateisgreat1134 2 years ago 2
why do people like you always talk about randon bullshit
itsallgood239 1 year ago
this a video with a fighter who's famous for his knock out power, and im talking about how strength isn't always the key to a ko. so the "randon bullshit" as you said, is pretty relevant to wtf we're all talking about. why do people like YOU always have to argue with people for no reason. like you're insecure and you have to point out other peoples mistakes, even when they didn't do anything wrong, just so you can feel better about yourself before you go to bed at night. wow
nateisgreat1134 1 year ago
I like your little theory
itsallgood239 1 year ago
bullets that suck at killing? what the fuck are you babbling about?
tremold2043 2 years ago
@nateisgreat1134 so not true. There's knock down and being knocked out....cold
that takes weight and power, the former is all technique.
ricksexyy 1 year ago
@ricksexyy if you put your hips into a punch and do everythin with perfect technique, and you catch sum1 completely square, you can knock a person out. weight & power Does make a difference but like i said, the power can all depend on the angle from where they get hit, the distance they were hit from, and exactly where they Got hit. thats y back in the old ufc you'd see the scrawny ass people koing the heavyweights. machida is known for his technique and not power, and look what he did to rashad
nateisgreat1134 1 year ago
@nateisgreat1134 Aye. It's not strength, it's speed and accuracy.
Westley0907 1 year ago
@nateisgreat1134 How is it like arguing what bullet is stronger for killing somebody?
breakneck14 1 year ago
@breakneck14 because a year ago when i commented on this video (lol) everyone was talking about who had a stronger punch between mma fighters vs. boxers and blah blah blah and it was stupid because regardless of who can punch harder, the outcome is the same for the person they're fighting. my bullet analogy was just saying how it doesn't matter cuz a shot to the head from either bullet is pretty likely to kill someone. don't take it too literally, i was just trying to give an example =/
nateisgreat1134 1 year ago
@nateisgreat1134 its still nice to know if one of them could KILL you with one punch though CAN I GET AN AMEN !
Synthasism 8 months ago
@nateisgreat1134 not really because 22 caliber bullets have been known to bounce off false teeth
bigmanoooo1 8 months ago
@bigmanoooo1 i'm so tired of talking about this lol i said what i said a year ago. if people are still arguing with me, then they're still missing the point i'm trying to make
nateisgreat1134 8 months ago
@nateisgreat1134 i get the point you were making, all mma fighters can punch hard as hell so its pointless arguing who hits hardest, i wasn't disputing the point you were making i was disputing the gun analogy
bigmanoooo1 8 months ago
@nateisgreat1134 Agreed except if you punch hard enough it can go trought someones guard.
w1iper 6 months ago
@w1iper Trought? I went trought fishing, once.
jonesy97 3 months ago
@jonesy97 LOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOL
956crazyman19 2 months ago
i think every fighter is great no matter what there record is there all great
SmurFCuTiTuP1 2 years ago
then i'm a great fighter myself
lehapankov 1 year ago
By the way,Mma Fighters won't graph higher than boxers.Just to let everyone know.Who in Mma Has a Hard Punch that's worth mentioning?
sharodm13 2 years ago
I think that's debatable. It's not who throws the punch it's how the punch is thrown. Everyone knows a solid powerful punch starts from the feet goes through the twisting hips up through the twisted core (abs, chest) and through the coiled arm. It's like a chain reaction. Arm punches are the opposite of this. As far as seeing Mike Tyson on this machine back in the day; of course who wouldn't want to see that? He had the mass not the acceleration which made his punch forceful.
Paronomastic 2 years ago
kimbo slice. anderson silva. rampage jackson. should i go on
arcadi656 2 years ago
Ew no.
Foreman and Frazier punch harder then them all.
sharodm13 2 years ago
Just so you know, there was a t.v. show on Discovery where scientists compared the amount of force with a punch from one of the best boxers, mma fighters, and I think that it was kickboxing(not 100% sure), and Quinton Jackson had the hardest punch out of all of them.... Just so you know.
kthrift2991 2 years ago
do you really think that quinton jackson could punch harder than a boxer? tyson for example who isnt even one of the superpunchers punches wayy harder than jackson.
thecrazyoftheinsane 2 years ago
That was the point i was making.
sharodm13 2 years ago
Kimbo? LMAO....
dawgyv72 2 years ago
Lol, Chuck Liddel, Forest Griffen, Quinton Jackson, Houston Alexander... There are alot of people that have a hard punch and are worth mentioning.
kthrift2991 2 years ago
Yeah worth mentioning.None of them top tyson nor marciano.
sharodm13 2 years ago
Even if they dont have a harder punch then tyson or marciano, who gives a fuck that wasnt your question. Your question was who has a hard punch worth mentioning. all i know is tysons punch was hard, and never heard shit about marciano.
alzrius 2 years ago
Comment removed
Rtroute 2 years ago
are you fuckin kidding me sharodm13?? Quinton "Rampage" Jackson just had his punch recorded at 1800lbs. Two sumo wrestles colliding into eachother has 1000lbs of force. You prove that there is no punch worth mentioning now.
alzrius 2 years ago
Oh omg!!!!mMA FANS BOYS ARE GONNA JUMP ON ME AND RATE MY COMMENTS LOW
sharodm13 2 years ago
Dam straight faggot.
alzrius 2 years ago
Omg don't take me down and get my from a anal leglock omg
sharodm13 2 years ago
Sorry To Burst bubbles but according to large studies tyson's punch was more than 4times as powerful as average humans.Oh yeah,the average bro boxer punch isnt 600.There are boxers who aren't even known yet who punch over 1000 pounds,such as the boxer on fight science.
sharodm13 2 years ago
That's actually true I watched that fight science. I also watched the one with the female boxer who punched 960 pounds of force with her left hand.. I would love to have had that technology back in the day to measure bruce lee's force through his punches and kicks; totally devastating I'm sure..
Paronomastic 2 years ago
Yeah bro,i would love to measure the force of thomas hearn's right hand.
sharodm13 2 years ago
Another fast fighter. Just knowing that force equals mass multiplied by acceleration, I would also like to see Mayweather go on fight science.
Paronomastic 2 years ago
Me too.You ever thought of Mike Tyson going on there and Rocky marciano?I also wanted to see Muhammed Ali and Joe Frazier.
sharodm13 2 years ago
dude me and chuck are like twin brothers we both can punch around 1100pounds of force with out even breaking a sweat
larryking85 2 years ago
mmhmm im sure chuck doesnt punch 1100 at his max
tatornoob 2 years ago
in real life fight, you gotta hope for the best and train for the worst !
hatealldayhabit 2 years ago
Their is nothing average about being the best
271975hctruth 2 years ago
This comment has received too many negative votes show
chuck needs more practice
dionriccardo 2 years ago
chuck needs more practice? dionriccardo are u a dumb fuck?
colinm27 2 years ago 4
This comment has received too many negative votes show
Chucky Chuck, another average joe fighting in a cage.
canibusko 2 years ago
an average joe that was the best in the cage lololol
no doubt hes much better then many fighters.. well he was not anymore
chainfence63 2 years ago
you wanna take a round with him??? see who ends up the winner??
75ehwtcv 2 years ago 3
average? what kind of average fighter hits with 1100punds of force without haveing a adrenalin pumping?
But ofc, just watching you type in that Chuck is average just shows how much you know about mma.
Plankeeee 2 years ago 2
Actually, every pro boxer at heavy pretty much hits around there...and that's with a fast and crisp cross, not that winging overhand shit.
chiconspiricy 2 years ago
no, average power for a pro boxer is from 600 - 900 pounds.
Plankeeee 2 years ago
Wrong, at Cuck's weightclass, many boxers hit as hard as him, and they do it so much better, he looks like a pathetic amatuer. I think the limitations of his punching "style" have been clearly shown by everyone who he's fought that knows to keep your hands up, and use mediocre boxing against him.
chiconspiricy 2 years ago
and both of those guys who knocked him out were subsequently champions. he'd still knock your head off. and say he fought a pro boxer, he knows how to kick and take you down. your argument is imbecilic, alluding to the fact that you probably are mentally handicapped and/or huff paint. Begone peasant!
themeatloaf360 2 years ago
Fail. I'm not saying I would beat him. I'm not saying he couldn't take down a boxer or leg kick him till he couldn't move. I'm saying his hand technique is NOT something to aspire too at all. I'll aspire to have hands like 100's of proffesional boxers who are vastly superior. How about most people who kickbox. Rua and Rampage whipped his ass with superior technique. To say you want to learn to punch like Liddell is like saying I want to learn to do takedowns like Kongo.
chiconspiricy 2 years ago
u cant compare chucks boxing style to a boxers boxing style because Chucks is meant for mma, there r difference becuase the distants has to be different to stop take downs and check kicks, mma boxing and boxer boxing is very different
JiggleGiggles17 2 years ago
Ok then, I'll compare it to other MMA striking styles that are superior to Chuck "Hands Down Windmilling" Liddell
A short list: St. Pierre, Anderson Silva, Shogun, Rampage, Machida, Evans, Alves, Rutten, Overeem
chiconspiricy 2 years ago
Half of those guys are trained in Muay Thai. Most of Chuck's style was looking for a knockout at whatever angle he could find one. That and he was a big counter punch guy. In his prime his reflexes were to the point where if he got hit he was going to make you pay with one of his looping haymakers. Chuck Lidell is one of the few guys in MMA to ever knock someone down with a falling back uppercut. Randy Couture is a decent boxer. Chuck KO'ed him twice.
norcalmike707 2 years ago
Couture is not a decent boxer. Even Rampage I'd consider a "mediocre" boxer, and he whipped Chuck's ass TWICE with that mediocre boxing. Tight guard, compact punches. Boxing 101 defeated Chuck's style.
chiconspiricy 2 years ago
in those fights, but compact punches? He knocked him down with a right hook then mounted him and won by a TKO(in UFC) . Andrei Arlovski trains with FREDDIE ROACH and lost his last fight to a guy throwing haymakers. If Alistar Overeem's style is so superior to Chuck Lidell's why did Lidell KO him in Pride? All that matters is what works in that one split second. St. Pierre got his ass handed to him by Matt Cerra...and that guy isn't known for his striking ability at all
norcalmike707 2 years ago
1. Yeah, a right hook more compact than I've EVER seen Liddell throw.
2. Fedor was NOT throwing haymakers. Look up Russian hooks.
3. Overeem was beating Liddell until he gassed and opened up. If you think that makes Overeems striking worse than Liddell's, you're a fool. Liddell would be better if he had Overeem's striiking too.
4. So an instance of St. Pierre not taking his opponent seriously makes St. Pierre's striking less effective? Complete lunacy. Oh, and Pierre went on to beat him..
chiconspiricy 2 years ago 2
@chiconspiricy i wasn't talking about Fedor. Brett Rogers layed out Arlovski by throwing haymakers. Yeah that makes Overeems striking worse it wasn't good enough to beat Chuck, and his defense wasn't good enough to defend against that shot and/or counter it. With Pierre obviously his striking wasn't as good as it is NOW because he beat Matt Cerra in the rematch and even then it was mostly with his takedowns and ground and pound.
norcalmike707 1 year ago
fuck you....... all the chuck liddell haters can suck my balls
TattooGames 2 years ago 25
This comment has received too many negative votes show
Chuck liddel sucks lmao
LuzerSC 2 years ago
Your mom does too! But I usually only laugh when a glob of my jizz lands in her eye!
jacksonswastedlife 2 years ago
1:04 holy shit.
ceejayb 2 years ago
fuck you irOnMiKe151 you can only say that if you can take at least 1 of lidell's punches in the face
nightblend 2 years ago
hey fuck you irOnMiKe 151
scooter199324 2 years ago
chuck should change camps
MaxMortis 2 years ago
This comment has received too many negative votes show
No1 cares about Chuck Liddel
IrOnMiKe151 2 years ago
and for mmatazo your an idiot for he asking chuck to change camps.....thats were it all started for him and is a very very good camp and has alot of wec, bodog,affliction,k1, ufc and many other household named fighters training there......that camp has top ranked fighters there.....get your fact straight before you say some dumb shit like that!!
nativepride888 2 years ago 3
460254 plz dont tell chuck how to fight he does what he does for a reason and he's a very good fighter....he was the champ ya know!!!!
nativepride888 2 years ago 4
good video
kingdonsteele 3 years ago
chuck plz keep tha left hand up.
460254 3 years ago
chuck plz change a camp
mmatazo 3 years ago
That John dude looks like an older version of Chuck! Good tips also.
-Paul
thatguythatrolls 3 years ago 28
go! go! chuck!!! The Champ!!!
karambit35 3 years ago 4
This comment has received too many negative votes show
lol hes not the champ
Smash0Town 3 years ago