Forensic DSLR Camera Question - Nikon D90 & GPS 090630

[Nutters111]

Keep a log of everything you do, any changes you log it, it shows that you have a paper trail, and nothing was tampered with.

[redesign2003]

My advice.

For court cases use camera with film.

[Wamfox]

it would be a film camera

[jh3835]

hmmm, tough one. in todays digital age i figure thats hard to do.

[joseabc1509]

what is the lens?

[bite0020]

just shoot in JPG? The meta data should hold time/date/geotag etc

[MrGeotagger]

The GPS-Data is written to the EXIF header of the JPG and/or RAW file. Photoshop is a very bad tool to modify EXIF data. But there are hundreds of tools to do so (ExifTool, ...)

In my eyes the Nikon GP-1 is crap. Not only because of the terrible cable for Nikon D90, D3100, D5000 and D7000 which stands straight out of the body (Dawntech and Solmeta Geotagger have L-shaped connectors!)

GP-1 lacks a lot of features like compass or indoor function

[MrGeotagger]

AFAIK Nikon D90 has no "forensic" feature to proof the pic is unchanged. Canon has, but ist is cracked: h-online.com/security/news/ite­m/Russians-on-the-moon-Canon-s­-image-verification-system-cra­cked-1145443.html

[175myles]

My standard windows program tells you if the image has been messed with or not.

[richardperth2002]

use Film camera because there is no way you can cheat with film , film in australia is good as gold in court as proof because the negotive don't tell lies mate

[Freezerburnv2]

It's called "Image Authentication Software" on Nikon's website.

[PoppyRoxxx]

if u want to prove that u did not edit a picture, upload it to flickr and view the exif file of you image

[CaribbeanMX]

Get a JOB but if you have one get a girlfriend and if you have both , Get a life !!!

[cdoamh]

What kind of lens you've used on the nikon d90??

[Zedorwin]

search the youtube for Digital forensics at Binghamton University featured on FOX News

it might help

[zharcos]

Hi, just found this software and remembered someone on yt asked about this. I hope this still helps someone : imaging.nikon.com/products/ima­ging/lineup/software/img_auth/

[Altair8801]

I'm in no doubt about your intentions with this technology, why you so eagerly need it. I am sure you will be using it for a good cause. Forensic photography usually helps solve crimes, it doesn't work the other way. Which leads me to think what it is you have discovered that you want to share with the rest of the world, but for which you need a method for taking an authentic photo. Only time can tell. But wouldn't it be easier to borrow a real forensic camera or call in an forensic expert? CSI?

[Altair8801]

I'm not familiar with forensic photography, or forensic sciences in general. Except for obvious things like it's not a good idea to leave fingerprints and DNS at a crime scene and that sort of thing you would learn today from movies and TV shows like Cold Case, CSI, CSI:NY, CSI:MIAMI, CSI:CA, CSI:FL, and what not... does Boston Legal and Dexter count in here?... man there are so many crime "shows" today, I'm sick and tired of it. When crime becomes a show, that's probably when we go under!

[Altair8801]

I'm also curious why Nikon won't help you answer the question whether or not this is possible to do with the equipment you got or at least suggest another Nikon product or accessory that you can use, like the OSK-E3 offered by Canon.

[Altair8801]

I can't link to the OSK-E3 product page directly in comments but there is a complete presentation on Canon Japan website. Just Google OSK-E3. It's interesting to see how that thing works. So check it out. Again, this probably doesn't help you any way since you are using a Nikon camera. But perhaps Nikon has a similar accessory to offer?

[Altair8801]

This probably doesn't answer your question since you are using Nikon camera but by coincidence I have just discovered a Canon product specifically designed for digital forensic photography. I was visiting the Canon Sweden website when I stumbled upon something called OSK-E3. It stands for Original Data Security Kit and it's a tool or actually a set of tools for authenticating digital photos.

[Altair8801]

I am very interested in hearing your results. Because you have opened up a very interesting question. One that I never actually thought about before. And I am about to buy a new camera, and I have narrowed my selection down to two candidates - the Canon 50D and the Nikon D90. So one of those two will probably be my new camera. I won't base my decision just on this "forensic" feature you talk about, even though it may be a good thing to have some time. It can be a really useful feature, indeed.

[Spencerian]

@Altair8801 The current crop of Canon SLR cameras have this forensic feature. I'm not sure if the D90 has it... I still don't think it does. It does have a GPS feature on it, though. What it does is that it writes the GPS coordinates to the metadata at the time or recording, and that's what I'm using to record an event at a specific place. That's why I need something that has a forensic feature - to prove that the file wasn't photoshopped or manipulated.

[blissologist]

@Spencerian Maybe it's already been said, but If it's just one photo. Hire a notary and or third party to witness or take the photo and give them the file until the court date. If it's multiple photos at multiple sites the metadata should be enough to be acceptable in court unless it's something super serious and the lawyer is trying to pick it apart. If that was the case i would hire a pro third party.

[Altair8801]

What have you come up with? Were you able to find a way to make authentic (forensic) photos on a Nikon D90?

[computerwolfe5]

First: Put the camera in RAW (NEF), And then take the pictures, keep the originals on your CF, card. And it has geotagging but im not sure how to do it on the D90.

[supersamuelyt]

Sandisk just recently came out with a new line of SD cards that are completely tamper-proof. They're write once, un-erasable, and supposedly last for years.

[selca14]

its not called kneecon its called n-eye-con

[mhensley81]

@selca14 being that it's a Japanese name, he pronounced it correctly.

[marshallsan00]

@mhensley81 he still pronounced it wrong though. He elongated the "i" sound too much. its Ni - kon!

[mhensley81]

@marshallsan00 I heard にかん instead of にこん. I can live with that considering he's from Hawaii. Dude before suggested he should say ないこん or んえこん which is just silly. So take your "!" back, I don't need your lesson.

[marshallsan00]

@mhensley81 You obviously do if you bothered to leave a comment. I was just informing him of the situation.

[supersamuelyt]

@selca14 That's if you're white. Everywhere else in the world: nih-con.

[timmis1971]

Nikon has Image Authentication Software, but I'm not sure if it is compatible with the D90, you would would have to check!

[Altair8801]

@timmis1971

What's it called?

[FOVCanada]

There are forensic tags in the meta tags that are altered when a photo is saved post editing. This can no be altered. Shoot the photo in original NEF format and DO NOT edit the photo. I can scientifically prove authentic and unaltered. Law enforcement uses pixel algorithms to detect pixel manipulation. Photoshop extreme zoom to see the pixel inconsistency. Adobe CS5 delayed release because it may interest CIA -prevent Pixel Perfect Manipulation. PPM photos. there you go. Shoot NEF

[xBillLeex]

just leave the photo in the camera...you cant edit pics in the camera

[jimkiss]

What you need to do is "Hash" the image. A hash is a unique numerical value assigned to the image that is read the same using any computer.

You need to hash the raw file on the camera card and save that hash number then put the raw file onto your computer and hash it again and the 2 hash numbers should be the same.

There are free hashing programs such as MD5 or Checksum. (Google those)

As for the GPS coordinates that info should all be contained within the meta data of the image. Good Luck

[jimkiss]

BTW...I do forensic image work for a living.

[Tiddojr]

So, what was it you'll like to take a photo of?

after 7 months its time to reveal, i thought so.!

[Spencerian]

Tiddojr - I can't reveal it just yet until I make sure it's fool proof. Trust me, it's worth it.

[martinaee]

My answer for any digital SLR would be send the raw files and .jpgs (.nef files for the D90)

That's still not 100 percent though.

I'd say the most "authentic" image would be a 35mm color negative.

What you understand though when you are in photography is that even an "unaltered" image is not "true" in the sense that you made choices how to compose the image and process the image (digital or film) even before any post-processing.

[TroutButter]

Sounds like Specerian here is opening a new X-File. ;)

[starzship]

Did you see a UFO?  An ALien??? hahaha

[Spencerian]

Starzship - I saw something really rare, and I need to photograph it to prove it! When I shoot it, you'll see it for sure.

[starzship]

AWESOME !!! CAN't wait!!

[Spencerian]

There is a forensic feature in all the current Canon EOS SLR cameras. As for the Nikon Cameras, only the high end ones have the forensic feature that is defensible in court. I'm uncertain if the Nikon D90 has the feature, and that's what I'm trying to find out.

[Altair8801]

@Spencerian

Is this forensic feature you talk about available in Canon 50D?

[NotnaRed]

Just make a video of the thing.

[robm425]

use a standard film camera

[78UNKNOWN]

try rub two stick togather.

how about a witness included in the photo!

[KTMsmurf]

If it is for to an insurance company.

Set to FINE jpg n RAW. Send both files to them.

Also if you want to be sure.. buy a cheap *ss onetime analog kodak camera.. take picture of you taking picture with digital camera and also of what you plan to take with the digital cam.

Use a D200 myself n never had any insurance agency question my pics.. :)

Hope it works out.

[sketchrider83]

why not use your standard polaroid camera, the photo comes out the second you take the shot. no way that could be tampered with unless scanned in.

[LEXPIX]

As mentioned EXIF data can be forged.

Yeah, take a video of yourself taking the photo to supplement the image and shoot in RAW.

Also you can store in on a memory card and send them the actual card? Or also take the image with two different types of camera to further authenticate your image?

[an80sGuy]

Well I know one thing for sure. ALL photos can be Photoshoped. You might want to Google: The Admissibility of Digital Photographs in Court. Look at the first result.

[8cuttlefish8]

Wow, im not sure. What do u want to take a photo of? Sounds serious lol.

[DashTube1]

take a video of the thing you want a pic of

[spoonmonkey3]

couldn't you just take a video of the thing you want a pic of? thats much more authentic, with the days paper or something...

[Nabster5]

what are you up to man?

all i can think of is paying one of those guys that watches you sigh the dead to your house, and then signs it himself saying that you signed it.... i for get what they are called. good luck in court ;)

[EAGCAD]

yes, what the others are saying is correct, Look at the EXIF data, it will say if it has been altered in photoshop or not. I believe this is also where you will find the GPS coordinates from the GPS.

[Guybrush1816351]

Well theres a simple solution, no digital photography or video counts as evedence in holland. (unless its shot by police with calibrated devices). Tobad stocks of polaroid are gone because that is truly the only non photoshopable film.

as for getting gps, just hold a gps device in frame.

[kaje01]

Yep infinitethrill is right. The most common way of knowing if an image was doctored is by looking at the exif data. It will say "Edited by photoshop" or something like that. Of course this doesn't mean it's impossible to edit a photo and take that out.

Just take your picture from different angles, record video of the object, etc. The more high quality media you get, the more difficult it will be for someone to say it was faked.

[DoomXexec311]

takes several photos and video record yourself taking the picture lol I dunno

[infinitethrill]

As long as the EXIF data is raw from the camera and doesn't show photoshop in its history you should be fine... The EXIF is how it is done so try looking into that...

[Goods81]

the EXIF data can be edited/changed with a hex editor or likely any number of tools now.. To answer spencerian's question, I don't think it's possible to prove without a doubt either of the things he's asking.  Maybe an expert would be willing to testify that the digital photo hasn't been altered. Probably easier to prove a film picture is authentic than digital.

[moToPow3r]

What are you doing this all for man?