you blv in something that is impossible to prove or exists, now that is weird!!! even if the proof was there for you, you still would not be convinced because have been deluded by that virus FAITH!!!!
but to try and explain something with the unexplained is highly flawed thinking.
@yob771 I can assure you the organ really does exist. OK, so I've only seen it on TV, but there are other people on this thread who've seen it for real and I have no reason to doubt them.
Also, I can say fairly that, despite the original objectives, the organ is useless at choral accompaniment. It's a pretty unpleasant instrument, overall, a total committee-designed camel - seven humps, five legs and three tails.
@EccentricRichard That's all so interesting. I thought watching the documentary at the time that a) the organ didn't sound good and b) the choirmaster's obvious disappointment came across. I'm not an expert, but I think they fell for the fad of going for "neo classical" organs... German sounding ones, ideal for playing Bach. They sound gruff, shrill, strident. They are not suited to English parish churches and the English choral tradition at all, but became very in-vogue in the 90s.
Carrying on... the bass on these organs is gruff, not warm like on English organs; the top notes are unpleasantly shrill. I heard there was a row at Kings College chapel around that time, because Stephen Cleobury wanted one and lots of lovers of English church music were horrified. Not sure if he got his way. Our own local parish church (in west London) obviously fell for it too because the organ had a rebuild in the 90s and has sounded horrible ever since. A case of emperors' new clothes!
@notyobs - what's your local parish church? Anyway, I can vouch for Frobenius' work - my mother was organist at St Mary's, Stoke d'Abernon (very near to the new Chelsea F. C. training ground, if you follow 22 illiterate, ill-educated, uncultured and obscenely overpaid yobs running round a field kicking a leather bladder...) for quite a few years and said it was the best of Frobenius' work - 1975, their 2nd organ in the country (after Queen's College, Oxford) and her opinion of the Stoke organ...
@notyobs - ... was that the one manual reed (an 8ft Regal on the Brustwerk) was pretty nasty, and certainly impossible to keep in tune, but that the rest of the organ was beautifully voiced, that it worked well as a choral accompaniment instrument in a small, intimate building (not a big-ish town parish church like Kingston), and certainly I've never heard a bad word said about it. I have, though, heard that the Regal has been replaced with a rather nice and indeed civilised small-scale Trumpet!
LOL. "Why compromise?". Well, they ended up with a hopelessly compromised organ... they'd have been far better off rebuilding its predecessor, which was a much better organ, albeit in a very poor state of repair - not poor enough to stop their local organbuilder, a personal friend of mine, from re-using most of it in rebuilding projects of his own.
It's such a pity that, after all their hard work, they ended up with such a dreadful organ. I've spent many, many hours by it, acting as an assistant to several organists, and it's really horrid - badly sited, designed in a totally inappropriate visual style, voiced inappropriately, etc.
Isn't it magnificent. I wonder if the choir is still going strong. Anyone know? It's interesting, because they're not far from St Philip's, home of the famous Libera. Must be a great part of London.
I for one am glad to hear it! Even Cathedral choirs are having trouble recruiting these days, so it's nice to know a few parish choirs are hanging in there. Represent!
you blv in something that is impossible to prove or exists, now that is weird!!! even if the proof was there for you, you still would not be convinced because have been deluded by that virus FAITH!!!!
but to try and explain something with the unexplained is highly flawed thinking.
yob771 1 year ago
@yob771 I can assure you the organ really does exist. OK, so I've only seen it on TV, but there are other people on this thread who've seen it for real and I have no reason to doubt them.
notyobs 1 year ago
@notyobs i was talking about god dummy
yob771 1 year ago
Also, I can say fairly that, despite the original objectives, the organ is useless at choral accompaniment. It's a pretty unpleasant instrument, overall, a total committee-designed camel - seven humps, five legs and three tails.
EccentricRichard 1 year ago
@EccentricRichard That's all so interesting. I thought watching the documentary at the time that a) the organ didn't sound good and b) the choirmaster's obvious disappointment came across. I'm not an expert, but I think they fell for the fad of going for "neo classical" organs... German sounding ones, ideal for playing Bach. They sound gruff, shrill, strident. They are not suited to English parish churches and the English choral tradition at all, but became very in-vogue in the 90s.
notyobs 1 year ago
Carrying on... the bass on these organs is gruff, not warm like on English organs; the top notes are unpleasantly shrill. I heard there was a row at Kings College chapel around that time, because Stephen Cleobury wanted one and lots of lovers of English church music were horrified. Not sure if he got his way. Our own local parish church (in west London) obviously fell for it too because the organ had a rebuild in the 90s and has sounded horrible ever since. A case of emperors' new clothes!
notyobs 1 year ago
@notyobs - what's your local parish church? Anyway, I can vouch for Frobenius' work - my mother was organist at St Mary's, Stoke d'Abernon (very near to the new Chelsea F. C. training ground, if you follow 22 illiterate, ill-educated, uncultured and obscenely overpaid yobs running round a field kicking a leather bladder...) for quite a few years and said it was the best of Frobenius' work - 1975, their 2nd organ in the country (after Queen's College, Oxford) and her opinion of the Stoke organ...
EccentricRichard 1 year ago
@notyobs - ... was that the one manual reed (an 8ft Regal on the Brustwerk) was pretty nasty, and certainly impossible to keep in tune, but that the rest of the organ was beautifully voiced, that it worked well as a choral accompaniment instrument in a small, intimate building (not a big-ish town parish church like Kingston), and certainly I've never heard a bad word said about it. I have, though, heard that the Regal has been replaced with a rather nice and indeed civilised small-scale Trumpet!
EccentricRichard 1 year ago
LOL. "Why compromise?". Well, they ended up with a hopelessly compromised organ... they'd have been far better off rebuilding its predecessor, which was a much better organ, albeit in a very poor state of repair - not poor enough to stop their local organbuilder, a personal friend of mine, from re-using most of it in rebuilding projects of his own.
EccentricRichard 1 year ago
It's such a pity that, after all their hard work, they ended up with such a dreadful organ. I've spent many, many hours by it, acting as an assistant to several organists, and it's really horrid - badly sited, designed in a totally inappropriate visual style, voiced inappropriately, etc.
EccentricRichard 1 year ago
Is that Roy Massey skulking around at the back of the church during the Bainton?!
allwasforanapple 2 years ago
@allwasforanapple
No. It's Erik Frobenius.
caj58uk 1 year ago
Yep it is still there.
My freind sings for it. I am going to watch them.Should be good.
aliciap891 3 years ago
what is the piece the choir is singing at about 1:40? it is stunning!
janeym 4 years ago
'And I saw a new heaven' by Bainton
pheradin 4 years ago
Isn't it magnificent. I wonder if the choir is still going strong. Anyone know? It's interesting, because they're not far from St Philip's, home of the famous Libera. Must be a great part of London.
notyobs 4 years ago
I'm a member of the choir and yes we are still going strong, Simon Toyne now runs it.
pheradin 4 years ago
EXCELLENT!!
happydayschannel 4 years ago
I for one am glad to hear it! Even Cathedral choirs are having trouble recruiting these days, so it's nice to know a few parish choirs are hanging in there. Represent!
paracletelux 2 years ago
yes actually, it is. i am in it and it is very strong. we reahearse a lot but its really worth it!
lloydino 3 years ago
Great news! Any clips of the current choir on Youtube for us to see?
notyobs 3 years ago
um...no... i dont think so
lloydino 3 years ago
Gold!
taflukta 4 years ago
aah Bainton and I saw a new heaven!! What a good piece!
edders05 4 years ago
I agree!
Nathan1097 4 years ago
I've got the whole documentary bar just a few frames where I nearly recorded over it! I've posted four extracts, including the very end.
notyobs 4 years ago
Do you have the end of the documentary?
RyanControl 4 years ago