Exposing GOP Lies About Reconciliation and the 'Nuclear Option'

[rs09985]

Judd Gregg needs to go back to the hole he crawled out of in New Hampshire

[darkhorse911]

What you are failing to realize is that all of your examples are for budget purposes. Healthcare mandate and reform is not a budget issue. The POTUS Mr. Obama said himself in 2005, 2006, and promised repeatedly during his campaign that it would not be used, and should not be used for healthcare.

[goodganews]

Cobra? Health Care.

Medicare reform? Health Care.

Medicaid reform? Health Care.

Two Bush tax cuts? Handouts to the wealthy driving up the deficit. I don't see how that's a "budget item."

What you think is true - isn't. You need to look past the GOP talking points and get to the nut of the issue.

[darkhorse911]

Let me be more clear. No where in History has the US government attempted a take over of an industry as large as this. Let us also not forget there hasn't been an honest politician on either side in quite some time. I live with and under Government run health care at times as a member of the Military and have sad news for you if you think the Government will do it better. It CAN'T!

Finally if you are too stupid to realize that tax cuts are a budget issue. I don't know what to say.

[dfrutled]

@darkhorse911 Goodganews already owned you so there is no need for me to rewrite exactly what he wrote.

The truth is that the Republicans are for the rich and the corporations and EVERYTHING they have ever done supports those facts. If they cared about avg man affording healthcare for his family why didn't they bring up a bill during 8 years of their rule? How many bills on HCR did they push? ZERO. So either they are inept or just don't care. I say both.

[darkhorse911]

On trying to take over the healthcare industry? On trying to mandate coverage for everyone whether they want it or not with jail as a possible out come? On increasing the tax rate on the most productive to hand it over in social program to the less productive?

Your right none.

On the single largest expansion of Medicaid and Medicare since its inception?

Oh, they passed that.

One final question if I may. Where in the US Constitution is supposed right to healthcare that all you espouse?

[dfrutled]

@darkhorse911 Sorry to inform you of this fact but the largest expansion of Medicaid was done by who? That's right, GW Bush. I didn't hear any tea baggers yelling for Bush's head to roll when he ballooned that SOCIALIST program. Are you in the top 5% tax bracket or like most tea baggers who actually benefited from Obama's policies such as his tax cuts to 95% of all working Americans? But if you want to talk about the const. see next comment.

[darkhorse911]

Reread my previous post as I was blaming the R's and Bush for that. As to Spend happy Bush, I was opposed to his overspending. 08 deficit 455B under Bush and DEM Congress, 09 deficit 1.4T under Obama and Dem Congress. The NY Times is projecting a 1.75T deficit this year. We cant afford to keep spending. No matter if it is a D or an R in the White House. This country can and will go bankrupt if we keep spending like we have for the last 10 years.

[dfrutled]

@darkhorse911 continuing on..

Section 8. "The Congress shall have power to lay and collect Taxes..., to pay the Debts and provide for the common defence and "GENERAL WELFARE" of the United States." U can interrupt that clause how you like. Now, try this clause from the Const.

Section 8: "To REGULATE COMMERCE...among the several States." Now, HC is commerce correct? Simple 1st year Con Law class in law School tells us that fact. So yes they can regulate it.

[darkhorse911]

General welfare. As to Regulate commerce among, meaning between the states not Individuals.

See the 5th Amendment. "nor be deprived of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law; " Strikes against mandating health coverage. Never mind the 10th Amendment that states "The powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution, nor prohibited by it to the States, are reserved to the States respectively, or to the people." It is my right to chose if I carry insurance or not.

[goodganews]

But do you have a right not pay federal income taxes?

Do you have a right to not register with selective service when you turn 18?

There are things that the federal gov't does do. But you are correct in asserting that this is certainly a debatable issue and not one cleanly defined. I agree that there are constitutional issues with mandating health care at the federal level.

But that's also true about Social Security. Most pple have to pay into it. Although I don't - self-employed.

[dfrutled]

@darkhorse911 I see you aren't a Lawyer or have been to law school based on your response so I will forgive you. However, based on almost 50 years of case law, the SCOTUS has construed the commerce clause broadly and it has been stated that the CC means govt can regulate just about anything that affects interstate and intrastate commerce. Even the farmer who doesnt plan on selling his crops can be regulated. Almost every case, like the one u stated, has been shot down by SCOTUS. So yes they can

[darkhorse911]

Your are correct that I have never even darkened the door of a law school. All I know is that handing over one more of my liberties make me wanna puke! I care not if it is the D with healthcare or the R with the Patriot Act. I say it is time for Americans to stop begging for Big Brother Government to take from someone else and give to them. It is time we hold ourselves accountable for our actions and outcomes. I am not a victim & hate the victim mentality that Americans now seem to love so much

[TheMaskhadov]

Also I'm sure the republicans will be in outrage if this is used to pass the health bill. But thats politics for you and I'm almost doubly sure that Fox news will say its an attack on freedoms and the founding fathers of America will be turning in their grave at this very moment. At the end of the day majority should rule and you shouldn'tr attack someone for using the same tactics that you yourself use.

[TheMaskhadov]

I don't understand why majority isn't always used in votes in the senate. In the British parliament as long as you've got a majority you've passed the bill.

[goodganews]

I think if you polled the American people and asked them if they think a majority should be able to pass bills in Congress, they'd say "yes."

The GOP doesn't have to filibuster the health care bill, they could just allow a simple up-or-down vote on it. They aren't required to filibuster, they choose to.

It's ridiculous. Frankly the founders screwed up by not choosing a parliament, or Congress is a joke.

And the filibuster is not in the constitution, it's a senate rule.