First Aid & CPR Basics : Hand Position for CPR Chest Compressions

[wcresponder]

it is not manditory to bare the patients chest.

[Seaflowerr]

We are not physicians, we donnot know what is the problem with the patient! How can we act on our own and doing these!?!?!??

[salaeh100]

watch the frenchmaidtv version

[dimseeeen]

what if the victim is an old woman with large floppy breasts?

[solomonpk]

@dimseeeen : hw s dat gona bother??? saving her life s wat u must think of.....

[megdabest]

Oh so if someone DOES need to perform CPR on me.. they will first have to take my top off.. and second, have the nervs to actually break some of my ribs doing so.. lovely

[TRIXSTER03]

@megdabest----Yes, they may have to take your bra off. Not always though. If the attendant does have to, they should protect patient dignity and cover you up. Also, your ribs may not always break, however it is possible on some patients.

[polivo0111]

@megdabest they could just leave you there, unconciuos and dieing. but atleast youll die dressed, ribs in tact.

[megdabest]

@polivo0111 I was infact being sarcastic, friend.

[Enigma5hrs]

where do you position your hand if the victim has breasts ?

[TRIXSTER03]

@Enigma5hrs - same position, just off center of chest. You can place your hands above the breasts.

[smartndumb101]

Yeah about that - what about the bra? The sternum is extremely painful to push into and that would make it hurt :( Take it off, I suppose. That would be VERY uncomfortable.

[TRIXSTER03]

@smartndumb----you may have to take it off in some cases. But usually you don't do not have too. If your using an A.E.D. then it could be a wise idea as you don't want the electrode pads to accidentally catch the bra on fire. Also, the metal wire in some bra's may also react with the electrical output of the A.E.D.

[smartndumb101]

k, thanks :)

[TRIXSTER03]

no problem

[pullumpurna]

she loox like she's do'N da compressions too fast. Da chest fully needs to recoil

[TRIXSTER03]

@pullumpurna- no the compression rate is fine.

[TRIXSTER03]

Technically none of the CPR videos or other first aid videos she be posted on youtube or any other online media source. Remeber, just because you are being shown how to do CPR in this video, doesn't mean just anyone can go ahead and do it. You should have a valid first aid ticket. I recommend NOT to perform CPR unless you are properly trained by a certified instructor. You need to know exactly how to deal with the nature of the emergency.

[majorvoltage]

Great advice TRIXSTER03. If I ever discover you not breathing, I'll be sure to honour your wishes and not revive you.

[TRIXSTER03]

umm... okay, I much rather have someone who has been fully qualified to perform CPR on myself, rather then someone who has watched a 2:22 video. And honour my wish of not being revived? What do I have a DNR?

[statcodemaster]

Lay-rescuers are usually unaware of State-approved DNR identification forms, bracelets, wallet inserts, and necklaces that are usually with the victim/patient. Even if they find one, they may not recognize the logo or the letters DNR (do not resuscitate). If CPR was initiated by lay-rescuers, DNR will be terminated by medical staff (EMS, MDs, RNs). Lay-rescuers are covered by the Good Samaritan Law. I hope you know what that means Trixster03.

[TRIXSTER03]

Obviously I know what that means. However since I am Canadian and you are an American, our GSL's (Good Samaritan Laws,) are different in some instances. And also, you don't need to do this--- DNR (Do Not Resuscitate.) I obviously know what that abreviation means as I used it.

[TRIXSTER03]

And I KNOW lay-rescuers are covered by the GSL, however the GSL's can be different in certain countries. In Canada, the GSL will protect a person as long as they act in good faith, offer to help, Do not leave or abandon the patient, only use the training your ticket allows you to use (If you have a ticket.)

[Medic3715]

This is right!!! This is Canadian Good Samaritan law.

[TRIXSTER03]

p.s I suggest reading the whole comment as I said it's IMPORTANT FOR A PERSON TO KNOW EXACTLY HOW TO DEAL WITH THE NATURE OF THE EMERGENCY. you can learn more about CPR and other live saving knowledge from taking an actual first aid course rather then watching a 2:22 video.

[statcodemaster]

Would you rather die?

[statcodemaster]

Actually you're wrong! Compressions must be started with pulseless arrest. As recommended by American Heart Association on March 31, 2008 regarding "Hands Only" CPR(Circulation Magazine), while waiting for the Emergency Medical Services, compressions must be started to provide circulation even without respirations. That's right, I said without breaths for by-stander CPR (that if you don't want to give mouth-to-mouth 30 compressions to 2 ventilations for 2 min. cycles). You're advice is wrong.

[TRIXSTER03]

Actually, your wrong. In order to do CPR, the patient must have no pulse and no breathing. If they are not breathing and have a pulse, start Artificial Respiration---Some standards no longer have AR, however, certain tickets still use AR protocols. (Usually moe adavanced protocols.) Change was made because lay-rescuers were having trouble.

[statcodemaster]

Did you even read my second sentence? Pulesless arrest! That means no pulses and breathing! And by the way, it's rescue breathing or supportive breaths whenever insufficient/absence of breathing is assessed. Changes were NOT made because lay-rescuers were having trouble with CPR, AHA recommended it because it has higher survival rate when bystanders perform CPR while waiting for EMS. Get it? Don't you read articles? I really hope you don't work in the US.

[TRIXSTER03]

Good, you are actually reading my senteces. Glad you know that a pulseless arrest in no pulse and no breathing. I am starting to beleive that you are a doctor (ER-MD.) By the way rescue breathing is also known as AR. Changes WERE made because lay-rescuers were having trouble with AR. I did NOT SAY, changes were made because people were having trouble with CPR, I stated that they were infact having trouble with AR.

[TRIXSTER03]

Since lay-recusers were getting confused with protocol they also removed the Jaw Thrust. Again becuase lay-rescuers were not doing it correctly and effectively. And again are you that dense. I said I am Canadian, why would I want to work in the U.S.? What a joke. You don't even have a decent political system. Or a decent healthcare system for that matter.

[statcodemaster]

And Canada is perfect? Now that's a big joke! Does Canada give 793 billion yearly just for the healthcare of other Countries? I don't think so. I don't even think Canada has a budget for it's Citizens that big. At least American' healthcare system is not as greedy as Canadas'. I guess you got that from the French.

[TRIXSTER03]

Did I say Canada was perfect? No. OMG, Not all Canadians are French. And we pay for healthcare in our taxes. We have care cards which allow us to go to hospitals and clinics and get help that way. We don't pay anything up front like people do in the U.S.

[TRIXSTER03]

And say our healthcare system is greedy? Our system of healthcare is great. Yes we have our flaws, and problems like any other healthcare system in the world, however we have one of the top HC systems in the world.

[TRIXSTER03]

793 billion yearly to other countries, not that I know of. However, we do give 43 billion dollars to 3rd world countries like Afghanistan and Iraq, We donate food, clothing and funds to other countries like Indonesia when a major disaster hits. We also continue to give these countries money, to help their economy become stable. And like I mentioned earlier, our healthcare system is, if you will "free." We can go and get help with no up-front costs. Our citizens healthcare is covered

[TRIXSTER03]

by BlueCross Blue Shield healthcare. We of course pay for this yearly in our taxes.

[Medic3715]

Yes, many changes in numerous protocols were changed. Lay rescuers being confused was one of the main reasons. There are other reasons to, new protocols were introduced as they increase the well being of the patient. Just a few basics.

[TRIXSTER03]

My advice is not wrong. I follow the Canadian Heart and Stroke Foundation's changes. Furthermoe you said, "CPR without breaths for by-stander CPR," I am not a by-stander I am a first aid attendant. In order to do CPR a patient must have no pulse and no breathing. If you start CPR with the patient breathing and/ or with any form of a pulse, you can kill them. So don't tell me my advice is wrong.

[statcodemaster]

You follow the Canadian Heart and Stroke Foundation's changes. Wow! That's amazing because they actually adopt and use AHA's guidelines from AHA 45,000+ researchers! Tell me one thing that Canadian researchers came out with for these new guidelines. Obviously you don't do critical care. Doing CPR on a live person can kill them? YOU ARE WRONG! Your heart is one of the most resilient organs. The only bad thing is broken ribs, but you CANNOT kill a person doing CPR.

[TRIXSTER03]

Yes I do follow the Canadian Heart and Stroke Foundations changes. Yes, the CHSF, does "adopt," some of the AHA's guidelines, however we have different guidlines as well. If we adopt eachother's guidlines exactly then we might as well join forces and become a joint foundation. See this is why some people hate Americans, (NOT THAT I DO.) you always take credit for everything.

[statcodemaster]

AHA has been a started ILCOR and has been a member since 1992. They produced the first International CPR Guidelines in 2000 and an International Consensus on CPR and ECC Science with Treatment Recommendations in 2005. Most CPR recommendations came from Europeans. Does this mean you can't give me one thing CHSF contributed to ILCOR? Now, that's sad. And by the way, Europeans has the credits, not the Americans. Go back to school!

[TRIXSTER03]

Go back to school? I am in school, I am actually turning 18 in4 months. In public school we don't learn about CHSF. Maybe in medical school and clinical studies in University. And you want to know what CHSF does? Well here is some things they do. Similar to that of AHA, but research studies may be conducted differently and produce a variety of different results. Here are some facts for you. From the Ontario HSF:

[TRIXSTER03]

CHSF investS in world-class research to further medical advances, effect social change and educate Canadians, consumer and health professional alike, on how to prevent and manage heart disease and stroke.

They are playing a leading role in improving prevention and treatment of stroke in Canada through our partnership with the Canadian Stroke Network.

[TRIXSTER03]

CHSF funds and studies independend research behind the development and use of the implantable pacemaker

pioneering the artificial heart for transplant patients

creating a scale that measures the severity of strokes

the use of acetylsalicylic acid (ASA) in preventing heart attack and stroke

clot-busting drugs that reduce mental and physical damage caused by 80% of strokes

[statcodemaster]

The more you blog, the more you embarrass yourself. It shows how you don't know anything about healthcare. Stick to your First Aid. ASA on stroke? That's really old news. Give me something new. By the way, nice "cut-and-paste" job from CHSF's site. CHSF behind pacemakers? It shows how ignorant you are! For your information Medtronic was the first company who MADE pacemakers for crying out loud. They're located here in Minneapolis, Minnesota. Please, for our sake, stop blogging false infomation.

[TRIXSTER03]

Ya, So you said you wanted some facts you got them. So stop acting like a little bitch and quit being so argumentative. Shows how ignorant I am? How does that show I am ignorant? Anyways, I am not going to argue with you because it's pointless. Just because your a doctor doesn't mean your always right. Grow up.

[TRIXSTER03]

Nice. CPR cannot kill a person because a person is already considered "clinically dead." CPR will only help. Even if CPR is done incorrectly. Aside from broken ribs being a bad factor, the success rate for CPR is quite low roughly 15-30% if even that.

P.S. What university did you graduate from? And how long have you been an M.D. for?

[UnNethertrash]

Just about everything expert village has is total crap. In this case she is not only going to break the ribs, but break off the xyphoid process and lacerate the liver.

[AdHocGroup]

@UnNethertrash In 40 years of doing CPR in hospitals, my technique as demonstrated has never broken a rib, a xiphoid process, punctured a liver or any organ, or caused any complication beyond a bruised sternum. I have, however, saved countless lives. Patients who complained about the soreness did so in good humor while thanking the staff for saving their lives. The point is to assure anyone who attempts CPR that they are better off doing something than letting such concerns delay action.

[Mindfreak410]

u stupid fat bitch dont show people this shit if your not doing it right.. your arms are bending you dumb bitch and your fuckin hands go between the nipple line...

[rrgison]

She's teaching viewers to save lives by CPR and you're calling her a fat B__?

[osdtraining]

I think you may have made people more confused with that video. Keep things simple, you probably threw more confusing words and unneeded medical terminology than necessary.

[bungacinta83]

she gonna break his ribs!!

[rrgison]

Ribs will heal; the important part needs to be done to pump blood into the heart

[TRIXSTER03]

She may infact break the patients ribs. However the patient will probably be more happy that a few of their ribs are broken, rather than losing their life.

[Medic3715]

Ribs on some patients may break. Elderly patietns and children are the people who are most prone for having the possibility of their ribs break. But generally, anyone's ribs can break due to the force caused by the compressions.

[TRIXSTER03]

Remember the main objective of CPR is to keep the vital organs alive for transplant.

The patient only has roughly about a 10%-20% chance of being revived. The odds of being revived are not that great.

[Medic3715]

Right. Most attempts of C.P.R. are unsuccessful. The goal of the initial rescuers on scene (lay rescuers) is to attempt to keep vital organs alive. This is what they teach you in Standard Courses, OFA courses and other courses whether they be a basic life support course of an avanced course. Paramedics and firefighters have different protocols to follow.

[TRIXSTER03]

While doing CPR on a patient, the Pt. ribs will probably break. Is this the case for every Pt., No. However when performing CPR on a patient, the ribs may infact fracture.

[TRIXSTER03]

Compressions keep the blood flowing so it continues to becomes oxygenated and travels to the heart and throughtout the circulatory system.

[sexybabe1288]

iam taking a test on that tommrow for medical class

[cutiegirl1412]

we learn that in health.

[alkhains992]

ma'am.. what if we got a victim whose ribs is fractured.. what is the proper assessment to be done..

[ChristianConservativ]

The same applies whether fractured or not. In fact in most cases of cpr you will most likely fracture the pt's ribs.

[devonswebster]

you gotta take the B.S.H british standard hand full!!!!!!!!

[nexypointy]

isn't it gonna hurt the person you're doing it to?

[TRIXSTER03]

It may caus ethe Patient some pain, but the patient will probably be more thankful that a few of their ribs are broken rather the losing their life.

[goaheadandshoot]

this video doesn't explain why you'd do hand compressions....people are going to get the wrong idea on this.

[calrageous]

True, there is no comment in the video regarding assessment of victim.

Please view the AHA video on hands-only cpr:

It's not Rocket Science, it's Hand-Only CPR!

For those lay rescuers trained in cpr, proper assessment includes: checking for response; calling 911; check for breathing (head-tilt-chin lift); two rescue breathes (if not breathing); & then compressions with breathes at 30:2 ratio.

[asv786]

thank you may allah bless you

[warheadz]

Very helpful, thanx!