No moderate, no realist, McCain the neocon

[allgoo19]

This video was made way before McCain changed his tone during the primary when he saw he was losing the race.

How right what this guy is saying considering what happened after this video. McCain changed from maverick among the republicans to the far right, seeking support from religious right and George W.

[capitalist888]

If you want moderate government, McCain is the smart choice. Not only does he have that record (drawing the ire of his own party on many important votes), but he'll be up against a Democrat controlled congress. A reasonable middle ground will be reached.

Clinton governed as a moderate under similar circumstances, with a Republican congress in the 90's.

Democrats will have huge majorities in the upcoming Congress. Combined with Obama the far left will overwhelm any moderate influence.

[Emceeh123]

I would have agreed with you before McCain's presidential campaign, but in order to run he had to change his position on a lot of policies and became a neo-con

[coffeefish]

"...neoconservatism came from Marxist backgrounds. It continues to be a phenomenon of Jewish intellectualism. In the early 20th century, Marxism attracted a disproportionate pool of Jewish recruits for a number of obvious reasons. There are complex psychological and social reasons for the attraction, all of which stem from the fact that Marxist internationalism is an ideology which finds disciples among a rootless, anti-religious urban intelligentsia".

Original Dissent 5/15/02

[coffeefish]

When there was one, it was made up of former Democrats who embraced the welfare state but supported Ronald Reagan's Cold War policies against the Soviet bloc. Today 'neo-conservatism' identifies those who believe in an aggressive policy against radical Islam and the global terrorists.

Wikipedia

[coffeefish]

A neo-con is a new communist (a liberal.)

I looked it up, why do you insist on misusing the word?

At the worst, you are refering to a centrist republican.

[Amebixfan]

No it's not, it's a Militant right wing ideology.

[coffeefish]

Duuude,, I check it on wikipedia. It is a word from the communist revival in Russia. A Neo-con was a Russian who pretended that all the BS from the previous communist regime, never happened.

[Amebixfan]

Jesus, can you read?

"Neoconservatism is a right-wing political philosophy that emerged in the United States from the rejection of the social liberalism, moral relativism, and New Left counterculture of the 1960s. In United States, they align themselves with most conservative values, such as free market, limited welfare, and traditional cultural values. Their key distinction is on international affairs: they prefer a proactive approach internationally that would protect the national interests."

[coffeefish]

It is funny how you try to make Free Markets, Limited Welfare, and Cultural values, sounf like an evil thing.

[Amebixfan]

I never made them out to be a evil thing, learn to fucking read.

[billville111]

People-

There is no election- just the illusion of a choice.

Both candidates are from the same party, the one that acts for big business, because big business IS the government.

People like you who make less than eight figures are left out of the decision making process, except which employee of the same company you are going to vote for.

[mikebott]

nothing like seeing a libertarian source cut the knees out from under neo-con positions.

[t4705mb6]

The money masters are planning world war 3 with Russia to usher in the NWO.

Both Obama & McCain are "on board" with this.

BOTH.

[mengwise36]

Huh?

[johndownunder]

Like Bush McCain thinks he has all the answers.The truth is he does not ask himself the right questions.Such as should the USA leave Iraq because it has killed 1 Million of their citizens in an illegal war to steal their OIL.McCain only means increased threats of terrorisim against the USA and troops sacrificed in an illegal invasion.

[didyoulisiten]

IDIOT SIGHTING: The stoplight on the corner buzzes when it's safe to cross the street. I was crossing with an intellectually challenged coworker of mine. She asked if I knew what the buzzer was for. I explained that it signals blind people when the light is red. Appalled, she responded: "What on earth are blind people doing driving?"!! "She was a probation officer in Wichita, KS"...STAY ALERT! They walk among us...and they VOTE and they REPRODUCE...They are call Obama Democrats.

[monkeypeopleofearth]

apparently they use the internet and have a youtube account as well...didyoulisiten is a perfect example. IDIOT SIGHTING !

[didyoulisiten]

monkeypeopleofearth,Just proves the IDIOT SAYING. Here is living proof. Confirm this some more why don't you monkeypeopleofearth. I'll start using YOU as an example..mister....Age: 107

City: TRUTHOPOLIS

Country: United States

[monkeypeopleofearth]

your childish remarks makes you look stupid...you should go watch "SMOSH" and let the "smart people" talk on the internet...mmmkay?

[didyoulisiten]

monkeypeopleofearth,You sound like a 14,15 maybe 18yr.old at the best,right? That is the only reason you are so Pissed Off. Huh! Don't have any knowledge, so you, "smart people" talk on the internet...mmmkay, thing. Bright Come-back there Kid.

[monkeypeopleofearth]

I'm 45....people read your comments and it's very clear what you are. nuff said

[didyoulisiten]

monkeypeopleofearth,The only thing that means is, you should be old enough to NOT BELIEVE IN FAIRY TALES. You reasoning on Socialism is just as wrong as Karl Mark was. You are a FU--ING Communist. The only damn thing that shit brings is EVERYONE SUFFERS THE SAME, except of course those who are the "PARTY LEADERS" As YOU said "COMMIE", "people read your comments and it's very clear what you are. nuff said"

[monkeypeopleofearth]

LOL, what the fuck are you talking about

[cvpringle]

let us not worry too much about these criticisms of our next President- we should huddle together and pray we can continue and enhance our war on terror and freedom. Maybe if we are lucky we will be even half as successful as the war on drugs. Iran is simply a red herring and even if bombed will not be a big deal.

Osama would give up the world to his Muslim masters!!!

[geo1671]

United Tits for Israel

 Pulin is a temp girl.once the shit hits the fan, Sarah will jump ship after election and McCain will appoint Liebermann as VP. That's if the Repigs win the election :^)

[2a7e2l91x]

Let us check if John Mc Cain and his VP Sarah Palin are really electable:

John Mc Cain: He is going to stay one hunderert years further in Iraq and Afganistan (v=VFknKVjuyNk). He wants to stay in an illegal war costing weekly 2Billion$.

Sarah Palin: She called those wars a god's plan (v=9H-btXPfhGs). So actually she is just a fundamentalist relgious-right. Comperable to Islamists.

Do I say more about both of them, I do not think so...

OBAMA/BIDEN08

[quixoto]

Don't forget about invading Iran and getting into a ground war with Russia.

Not to mention the social conservative agenda that that psycho Jesus freak Palin would want to implement.

[DillonX]

I'm not believing my ears!

GOP announced Palin will give her 1st so-called "interview" since the convention.

But no real interview.

Palin wants an "interview" w/only pre-approved softball questions. And CHARLIE GIBSON has agreed to do it. Any real journalist would say, "NO WAY!"

SHE MIGHT AS WELL GIVE A SPEECH!

#1 Question should be:"Rumors are out you did not give birth to Trig. Can you positively say that you are the birth-mother?"

(Question not allowed!)

[kurydebarcelona]

grate job RealNews!

[MasterMark123]

My biggest fear is that so many states are still using Di-Bolt voting machines and NO paper ballots or trails. The same company that makes most of the ATM machines in the US and are very accurate, cant make a ballot machine with the same safe guards. Apparently they are quite easy to tamper with and change results. The same machines that were used in FL and OH

[scumbauggio]

My bank's Diebold Machine is constantly being repaired. They must have a really crappy team of software designers. It's amazing that their political connections have given them so many juicy contracts and help them avoid accountability. Such is the American way.

[MooseOfReason]

Good interview.

[MessaicComic]

damn neocons

[aametrogate]

I would like to say something about the surge

McCain is lecturing us on every day. I think Mr. Obama should say that Bush's surge didn't defeat terrorism. It was PM Maliki surge (by increasing the number of Iraqi troops fighting terrorists)and the Sunni surge that defeated terrorists and brought victory to the US and Iraq.

[wcarlpdrysdale]

it was 25 miles of blast wall,,, and killing any brown person you want

[scumbauggio]

There is no "victory" in Iraq - the "surge" is nothing more than a version of the Israeli occupation of the west bank and Gaza - turning an entire country into a prison camp is not a "victory", especially considering that the political situation remains exactly as it has been since our illegal invasion, completely fucked.

[pongman]

Interesting that we still feel that we should govern Iran as to what they can and can't have when the United States dictates to the rest of the world where we can stockpile our nuclear defense shield. If the situation in Iran were to come to a dire offensive situation I would think Russia could easily curtail this by placing a defense shield around Iran to protect it. After all the Russian nuclear weapons capabilities can easily attack anyone within 10,500 km.

[pongman]

With the recent Bush administration attempt to put a defense shield in Poland I would think Russia could easily place one in Iran. If that situation were to become un-agreeable then perhaps the US and Russia can come to terms at the table, make a compromise and defuse the situation.

[GrownupPhan]

Russia doesn't have a defense shield program anything like ours. Even ours doesn't work either despite the WH spin, but Russia never even made the atempt to go in that direction with its military.

[scumbauggio]

The Chinese are heavily invested in Iranian oil. If we fuck with Iran all they would need to do is to call in the debt we owe. McCain will finish the job that Bush started, we ( the regular folk ) will be screwed.

[koolboyskee]

Mccain has to have SARAH there or no one won't listen and the crowd would be little. She's a wrotten liar. Mccain is an insult to America. Have you noticed that Barrack and Biden are doing their speeches in differnt places in around the country and Mccain needs Sarah there to bring the crowd and she needs him because she doesn't know shit.

[washmytoes]

i'm not a big obama supporter, but mccain lost me with this vp pick. no disrespect to women, but if mccain's so tough, why does he need to a woman to fight his battles for him? the fact that people accept her at face value makes me worry deeply for the future of this country.

[natem20]

McCain is out of touch...

[GamlGandalf]

The government should restart their anthrax program and poison themselves instead their pawns. They should take the almost secret rulers with themselves. Bilderberg, CFR, Skull and Bones, Bohemian Grove. YOU ARE DONE! The times of kings beside the Queens had ended as you're time will end now, too.

[Bocbo]

The drums of war will beat for Russia, the only way for the republicans to win is to up the security stakes, mccain wins, cancer returns and the neocons get a woman to start ww3, if "she" gets attacked ,she bieng a metaphor for both country and the then president palin, then it will be easy to let her go all the way to war, after all "they" hit a girl.

[idicula1979]

John McCain picked Sarah Palin to cozy up to the right wing religious nut,Rush Limbaugh type fanatics in his party,(who he alienated when he told Bill Cunnigham, and Ted Haggard to shove of)that and that alone is why Sarah Palin is the VP for the republicans. How else would you explain Why they picked Sarah Palin a woman who admitted she didn't know that much about Iraq...short of we are there to fulfill "god's plan".

[monkeypeopleofearth]

The decision takes the spotlight off McCain and his campaign(which is doing very poorly) and puts the attention directly on the choice of VP. The republicans effectively are playing "smoke and mirrors" with the voting public. Look at the week following the announcement of Palin for VP... All the news outlets concentrated on that, instead of any "real" issues concerning McCain. Palin is inexperienced, does not understand the "national" issues, and is a right-wing religious nut-job... EPIC FAIL

[photofu]

mccain is so crazy, and surrounded by even crazier people, bad options.

[abilityoflove]

McCain is an American nationalist. He believes that Americans are the most special nation in the world and whatever they do to non-Americans is always right, including torture and bombing. Anybody who questions this is un-American and an 'enemy'.

His perception of economy and society is Darwinian - survival of the fittest; winners and losers.

[monkeypeopleofearth]

When an American says that he loves his country, he means not only that he loves the New England hills, the prairies glistening in the sun, the wide and rising plains, the great mountains, and the sea. He means that he loves an inner air, an inner light in which freedom lives and in which a man can draw the breath of self-respect. ~Adlai Stevenson

[abilityoflove]

To be a true human being, outweigh being an American.

[blackiron60]

Amen to that.

[mengwise36]

Unfortunately, he is not alone.

[wiskawind]

How about McSame's VP pick?

"The National Enquirer is reporting that Sarah Palin had an affair with her husband's business partner, who reportedly just tried to have his divorce records sealed."

"Motion to Make Case File Confidential Attorney: Pro per (0100001) Scott Alan Richter (Petitioner); Case Motion

#3"

Palin= a female Pit Bull in heat!

[monkeypeopleofearth]

The sad truth is that Americans will vote for their party. Individual voters cast ballots based on their personal interests. If you're a pro-lifer, you'll vote republican. Americans need to break the cycle of the two party system. McCain is TOO OLD, doesn't speak well, doesn't represent American ideals, is not a very intelligent man, has a inconsistent voting record in Congress, and is out of touch with middle class Americans, YET, Americans will vote for him because he's a republican

[GaddingImp]

I agree. Political parties have become like fraternities in which people swear their loyalty. In regards to a presidential election, I would encourage people to make their choice wisely considering the visible evidence of the individual candidate. Rather than adhering to any prior allegiance.

[monkeypeopleofearth]

I'm not saying that a Republican couldn't do a acceptable job as President. But if the delegates of the Republican party think that John McCain is the best choice of every single Republican to represent their party, it makes me wonder if the Republicans really have the best interests of the United States at heart. The struggle for power, between the two parties, is destroying this country. A vote for Ron Paul, Bob Barr, or Ralph Nader, is a vote that an American patriot would cast.

[SuPeRfIcIaLfOoL]

well said.

[mengwise36]

What is the best interests of the United States? Your take on it is probably vastly different from mine or someone in the GOP.

My problem with the 3rd party is none of them develop at grass root. We don't hear about Nader unless it's an election year. And this election is the first time I heard of Ron Paul.

If any third party wants to break the two party system, they need to have a 100 year plan. Start local, start small. Going for the presidency every 4 years is not going to work.

[washmytoes]

very good points. the ron paul campaign, though began as a grass roots internet campaign, and now has a pretty impressive following that will extend the life of this election year. the difficulty for third party candidates, as jesse ventura mentioned, is getting on the ballot as each state has their own requirements. until this is changed, third party candidates are discouraged in our two party system not just in projecting their message, but by getting their name on the ballot.

[mengwise36]

Of course it is hard. The GOP was founded in 1854 and the Democratic Party can be traced back to 1792 or 1830's depending who you ask. The Constitution Party was founded in 1992. The Green Party started acting as third party in 2001. The Libertarian Party was founded in 1971. Why should the old parties give the new ones a free ride?

My advice to all these parties is to develop grass root organization and compete with the two main parties. Win locally and then think nationally.

[quixoto]

Usually the biggest failure of the third parties can be chalked up to a similar reason why Hillary Clinton was defeated by Barack Obama: constant infighting, power plays, and a lack of the "organizational mentality." There are a lot of great community organizers out there, and many are very sympathetic with the Greens, but due to the hierarchy these people never get anywhere into any position of power in the party.

Also, don't forget Ralph Nader, whose run in 2000 sent the Greens back awhile.

[mengwise36]

You mean 90% of black voters voting for a black man were NOT the reason Hillary was "defeated" by Obama?

I am no in any party so I would not know anything about infighting or power play. I am talking theory here. You can't expect the power that be to let you have the power. You have to take it, gradually if you want to avoid out right civil war. Maybe it will never work but one thing is for sure: running for President every 4 years and bitching about lat of respect is not going to cut it.

[quixoto]

Well, if you consider the fact that black people only make up 15-20% of the most highly concentrated states in America, 2-3% in others, then you might think that the black vote alone isn't what put Obama over the top.

My point is that in order to succeed in politics you need to do a lot of things that Obama did, such as grassroots organizing, to go from a complete unknown to a superstar in a relatively short amount of time.

[mengwise36]

1. We are talking primaries here. In most of the southern states, the Black votes where 30 - 40 even more of the democratic primary votes. Obama won all of them by significant margin. If you split the black vote 50/50 like the white vote, Clinton won.

2. Obama became a superstar because he is the most liberal and he is the party favor. The kind of grass root organizations he had was not put in 2 months. They were the Democratic grass root.

[quixoto]

They were Democratic grass roots HE organized.

And he's not the most liberal Senator (ranked 46th i '07), or even the most liberal Democrat running that year. Did you listen to anything Dennis Kucinich was saying? Hell, I think I remember a lot more so called "liberal" quotes coming from Bill Richardson or John Edwards. The Daily Kos didn't even endorse him until he'd practically wrapped up the nomination because they thought he was too moderate.

[mengwise36]

1. He was elected to the Senate in 06 and started running in 07. And the primaries were 3 months later. Are you telling me that HE built the grass root in 1 year and 3 months? My grass does not even grow that fast. He applealed the Democratic establishment and they were his grass root.

2. I don't know where you got your data but according to the National Journal, he was the most liberal in 07. We are talking about senators. DK is not a senator.

[quixoto]

Lotsa inaccuracies right there:

The National Journal is a conservative organization and puts out that biased set of rankings every time there's an election. The same thing happened with Kerry in '04. Find a variety of sources for an accurate portrayal of that kind of idea, not just one. Also, define what "most liberal" means. Plus, Obama was elected in 04, took office in January, '05. But that doesn't matter. I'm talking about the campaign itself and what he's organized since January, '07.

[mengwise36]

You mean they missed 05, 06 and jumped to 07?

The DW-NOMINATE score still puts Obama to the left of Hillary, slightly. And the most liberals according to the DW-NOMINATE score are not in the race, at least not in the running.

[quixoto]

Also, I don't plan on arguing with you anymore since it doesn't seem clear to me that you really have a point still to make. If all you're trying to say is that his organizational skills are not what got him this far, then I'll concede the point.  If you're just trying to find any sort of way to disparage Barack Obama that you can, then I'll bid you good day.

[mengwise36]

Here are my points:

1. Obama won because he positioned himself to the left of Hillary and thus won the hard core liberal vote. You can quote one score and I can quote another but the perception was Obama was much more liberal than Hillary.

2. Obama won because the black voters voted for him because he is black.

3. Obama won because he swept the caucus states which do not represent popular vote.

4. Obama won because DNC penalized Hillary in MI and FL.

5. Obama won only in delegate.

[quixoto]

Nevertheless, however he did it, however close it was (he won more delegates, she won more votes... even though that 18 million count doesn't actually include caucuses which aren't based on an exact head count), and whatever ranking you want to give him determined by some arbitrary liberal/conservative score that any number of biased sources... what's your point? The Primary's over.  Why are we still talking about it? Obama v McCain is the real battle, and it's only like 8 weeks away.

[mengwise36]

If you go back to the begin of this thread, you will see I said "You mean 90% of black voters voting for a black man were NOT the reason Hillary was "defeated" by Obama? ". That is all.

[quixoto]

Right, and I still say that they were not the ONLY reason. I'm now saying that how the primary is immaterial in fighting the general election. Unless, that is, you want to take into account the strengths Obama exhibited throughout the primary and how they may be used to beat McCain.

[mengwise36]

Of course it is not the ONLY reason. I listed 4. The primary, especially the Democratic primary with their proportional delegation, is counter productive. Here is what I think they should have done: All the states that was decided by over 5% in the previous election should vote after several national debates. The 2 winner of this election will get another 2-3 months to work on the swing states. Then all the swing states vote between the 2 and the winner is the nominee. No super delegate.

[quixoto]

Well, I don't think that would work even if it might be more accurate, just like how run-off elections are a much better reflection of the people's vote but will never allow it. This is an instant gratification culture, and can you really assume for a minute that people will accept the idea of having to vote twice and wait days, possibly longer, for results.

I do agree with you about getting rid of the superdelegates, but anything that overcomplicates the process is not gonna work.

[mengwise36]

You mis understood. Everyone still vote once. People of those states that were decided by a large margin vote first to decide popularity. Then people of swing states get to choose between the top two instead of the super delegates.

I don't think that is overcomplicated for average voters. They still vote once, whenever their state's primary is. The complication is for the NDC and state party leaders.

I just don't like the idea that Iowa HAS to be first. I also hate caucuses.

[quixoto]

Well, I still don't really understand what you're saying on how to change the primary process, but I don't think that should matter. If you want to see change try writing a sternly worded letter to Howard Dean and the DNC about how they can do a better job in 2012. That's my suggestion. I know it certainly wasn't a perfect process this year, but I can't really complain because if any one or two rules changed Hillary Clinton would've been the nominee.

[mengwise36]

And that is exactly my complain. The candidate better prepared for McCain is not the nominee. The Democrats have yet found another way to loose when it seems almost impossible to do so.

[quixoto]

Ugh, see that's what I thought your point was eventually going to become. I don't agree with you about whether Hillary Clinton would have an easier or harder time against McCain, especially when you consider that if she was the nominee the strategy against her would be completely different. Also, by assuming that sort of thing at this stage in the game merely sounds like someone preparing to say "I told you so" if Obama does lose. And that's just deplorable.

[mengwise36]

I am not preparing to say "I told you so". I am predicting a Obama loss, just like I predicted a messy Iraq BEFORE the invasion, and I am telling you "I told you so" NOW.

What is deplorable is someone taking advantage the timing, step over the better candidate, and use the black people as tools which will set back the civil rights movement for decades.

What is even more deplorable is someone who call me deplorable for speaking my mind and call themselves democrats at the same time.

[quixoto]

Hopefully this is the only time I ever going to quote Donald Rumsfeld, but it something he says applies here: "You go to war with the army you have, not the army you wish you had."

In this way you could compare the general election to the Iraq War. Forget how we got there. We're there right now. Deal with the issue at hand. Obama can beat McCain. He must beat McCain. We need to see to it that that happens.

[mengwise36]

You are doing far worse than quoting Rumsfeld and I hope you see that.

You are basically telling me to stay the course. You people got us into this mess but now I have to support you because losing is not acceptable. And if I question you in any way, I am not a true democrat. Have I missed any other metaphor here?

[quixoto]

You seem to be getting pretty offended here. I think you should settle down a bit. Nothing's over yet. Polls are not entirely accurate, especially if they're based on "likely voters," those who have already voted in the past. You don't know who's going to win. Stop pretending you do. If you want Obama to win, help him win. If you don't, even if you hate all of McCain's policies, then I have nothing more to say to you.

[mengwise36]

I predicted the outcome of the Iraqi invasion BEFORE the invasion. I predicted the outcome of the Democratic Primary BEFORE Super Tuesday. So now I predict a McCain/Palin victory in November.

[quixoto]

My quip about Ralph Nader, mind you, was just to say that in 2000 the Greens achieved the best success they ever could by getting almost 2% of the vote. That might be more than what any third party candidate could get for the next decade or so UNLESS one of those parties can latch on to a specific zeitgeist in America and run a candidate who not only best reflects it but is also charismatic, brilliant and politically savvy.

[monkeypeopleofearth]

A large number people heard about Ron Paul only in the last year. I think most of the hype around Ron Paul came from internet forums. Alot of different types of people, with alot of different type of interests, heard the message of freedom. But don't underestimate the power of the internet. Much can happen in a short time. I am so disgusted with the Dem and Rep, that I would have voted for Jesse Ventura if he ran this cycle

[monkeypeopleofearth]

My point is that people will vote for their esoteric interest. We need to educate people to be able to think beyond their personal interests and vote for whats best for America. That's what Ron Paul does. That's the crux of the problem of the two party system. The LIBERTARIAN party is quickly growing due to the young demographic spending hours a day on the internet. Like Ron Paul, they quickly adapted to a new media. McCain has no idea what myspace really is or it's potential advantages.

[monkeypeopleofearth]

Many young people under 25 were quickly converted to Ron Paul's message of freedom. More people hear the call of liberty everyday. Those people who "got on the bandwagon", will probably be changed in their thinking for a long time. From my personal experience as a Ron Paul volunteer, I know that people fall into two categories. 1. Personal liberties expansion 2. Repeal of marijuana laws. The two reason were most often quoted when I asked people why they wanted Ron Paul to lead the nation.

[okiedragonlady2]

So does that mean ron paul is for pot smoking or just deregulation of the product? I don't smoke the crap, but it does seem stupid to keep throwing people in jail - that's expensive - when other people drink.

[monkeypeopleofearth]

It means Ron Paul looks at the Constitution and find's no reference where the Government should interfere with how American adults live their lives...The USA made alcohol illegal in the 1930's via a constitutional amendment, just like Saudi Arabia. The government has no business legislating what happens in the privacy of our homes, or btwn an adult & his/her doctors....The USA incarcerates 2.4 million Americans, and quite frankly, many of those people should be separated from society. But pot?

[okiedragonlady2]

But isn't he on the side of no abortions? That's a big deal to me when it comes to women's rights.

[mengwise36]

Do you know what killed Universal Health Care in the 40's and 50's? Southern whites defecting from the Democrats because they did not want blacks to share their hospitals EVEN though the program would benefit them the most. Which one is the "esoteric interest" in this case?

I agree with Ron Paul's idea that we should not get empire building. However, I also know that the greatest of this nation was built on socialist ideals which he opposes. Where does the interest lie?

[monkeypeopleofearth]

The founding documents of the United States makes no mention of socialism nor any mention of socialist ideas....Here's the definition of socialism..."Socialism refers to a broad set of economic theories of social organization advocating state or collective ownership and administration of the means of production and distribution of goods"...

The United States was founded on personal freedom and liberty, not socialism

[monkeypeopleofearth]

Yesterday when the United States took control of Freddie May and Fanny Mack, that was a socialist move.

[mengwise36]

I don't know what that was but it was definitely proof that capitalism did not work.

[monkeypeopleofearth]

It was proof that GREED in the banking, loan/credit, and mortgage industry is rampant...That people will do anything to transfer the wealth of the common people. into the pockets of the rich people, with little regard to "the average American" living in a car, bankrupt and destitute. Some people in our government have profited from the mortgage meltdown.

[mengwise36]

Isn't that in itself proof that capitalism would not work?

[mengwise36]

With capitalism, the rich will be richer and the poor poorer. Eventually, the poor would loose all their personal freedom and liberty because they can't afford it. Socialism allows the poor to get richer and the richer get richer much slower. So if you are for personal freedom and liberty for ALL people, not just yours, then you are for Socialism.

[monkeypeopleofearth]

you have your terms mixed up...that's not Socialism

[mengwise36]

How so?

[monkeypeopleofearth]

I've previously provided the definition of socialism..."Socialism refers to a broad set of economic theories of social organization advocating state or collective ownership and administration of the means of production and distribution of goods"....Socialism is an ECONOMIC function. Like when the Government owned the Railroads, Phone Companies or Lending Institutions, sometimes that's important when an infrastructure is being created. It has nothing to do with personal freedom or liberities

[mengwise36]

I never said it did. However, Socialism comfort the afflicted and afflict the comfort so the poor has a chance to improve their lives and the rich will not be able to run away from everyone else. It is an equalizer. And isn't personal freedom or liberties all based on "all men are created equal"?

[mengwise36]

Ron Paul ran for president 20 years ago. If he and his party have tried to build any grass root organization, he would not have been such "outsider" this time around. I have been this country 18 years and this is the first time I heard of him. That in itself is a problem.

[monkeypeopleofearth]

I think it's partially Ron Paul's speaking skills. He is not a very good orator. The internet has changed the way people interact. 5 years ago, you and I would never have had this discussion. I write a political blog, have a myspace page, and understand the connectivity that the internet allows.  It provides "the individual" a platform to be heard.

[mengwise36]

He is not a very good orator and he is not much a debater. However, that is no reason to NOT built grass root.

The Internet does provide a platform. However, it does not come close to grass root effort. Even 5 million on line supporters can not guarantee 1 single house or senate seat or 1 primary victor. That is the problem with 3rd party. They all want the presidency but no one is willing to spend the next 10, 20, 50, 100 years building the grass root organizations.

[monkeypeopleofearth]

your point is vaild

[mengwise36]

Thank you.

[SaveOurSovereignty2]

thanks R.N