MormonMessages - Grace AFTER ALL You Can Do

[babyface1523]

Wait so you don't know when you're doing your best??? I think it's pretty simple either you feel like you're doing your best or you don't... If you are, that's all God can ask of you correct? What's so hard about knowing if you're trying your hardest?

[babyface1523]

@babyface1523 I'd hate to play sports or anything competitive with the makers of this video... "Bro just give it your all, just do your best..."... "K i'll try, i'm not entirely sure what my best is, i'm just confused now!"...

[joshuaTLM]

haha, i love how all these religons bash on each other... so Christ like, lol. i guess at least those Mormons dont come out and bash other churches, they got that going for them...

[benbmormon]

This is so dumb... What are you guys talking about.. You're right that, no one will ever come even close to doing everything right, so we all need the atonement to save us. But what is the purpose of our time here on earth? To say six little words, "I accept Jesus as my Savior", or to actually show it, by doing our best all our lives?

[majinish]

You read 2 Nephi 25:23. Critics stop at certain verses to attempt to discredit the Book of Mormon. Read verse 24. Nephi was referring to himself and the others of his time in accordance with the Law of Moses since Jesus hadn't come yet. 2 Nephi 25:23 doesn't contradict the teachings from the Bible at all.

[1stcorinthians1vrs18]

@majinish Joseph Smith the author of the Book of Mormon & The Pearl of Great Price, can very easily be discredited as a liar, by comparing Page 41 of the Pearl of Great Price figures 2 & 4, & Josephs false identification of these figures with any encyclopedia, egyptian book, or internet article, on the egyptian godesses Isis & Maat. Figure 2 is not King Pharaoh, SHE is the egyptian godess Isis. Figure 4 is not Prince of Pharaoh, SHE is the egyptian godess Maat. Figure 1 is Osiris, not Abraham.

[majinish]

@1stcorinthians1vrs18 Joseph Smith isn't the author of the Book of Mormon or The Pearl of Great Price. He was the translator but more than that he was a prophet of God. The Pearl of Great Price has been proven to be accurate on the facsimiles, not what you claim. You need to look up the Testament of Abraham & Apocalypse of Abraham verse 11.

[1stcorinthians1vrs18]

@majinish When the Book of Mormon was 1st printed, it declared Joseph Smith as the author. This of course got changed later. Have U ever studied anything about the egyptian godesses Isis & Maat? U do not need any particular source, look them up in an encyclopedia, an egyptian book, do a search on the internet. No egyptian scholar would ever validate any of the fraudulent claims of Joseph conceerning the egyptian writings. Have U even looked at figures 2 & 4? Don't they look a little feminine 2U?

[majinish]

@1stcorinthians1vrs18 He had to because that's how things were back then. Joseph Smith knew he wasn't the author but for the Book of Mormon to be published an author was required so the prophet of God had to go with the rules. Have you ever studied anything about Abraham and the different texts about him? Joseph Smith didn't give any fraudulent claims. I've looked at the images and they're incredible.

[1stcorinthians1vrs18]

@majinish So Joseph Smith lied to please the rules of men? The images are a Joke. Figures 2 and 4 on page 41 of the Pearl of Great Price could not possibly look any more feminine than they do. With all the women Joseph was married to, he should have at least been able to tell the difference between an obvious woman and a man. Joseph even identified and egyptian sex god, as representing "God" figure 7 on page 36. The erect penis has been removed in some of the copies of the Pearl of Great Price.

[majinish]

@1stcorinthians1vrs18 No he didn't lie. The images are wonderful, not a joke. Obviously you don't know anything about Abraham.

[1stcorinthians1vrs18]

Great video. Grace and works are direct opposites Romans 11:6. Salvation is free to all wha accept Christ for Who He Is. Salvation is free to us, but it came at unimaginable cost to Him. John 3:18,36.

[majinish]

@1stcorinthians1vrs18 False. Paul and James didn't teach anything contradictory to each other. It's not faith alone and it's not works alone, it's both. Faith is dead without works.

[1stcorinthians1vrs18]

@majinish Of course they did not contradict each other. Romans 11:6 "And if by grace then is it NO MORE OF WORKS, otherwise grace is no more grace, but if it be of works then is it no more of grace, otherwise work is no more work." caps added. Works earn wages, salvation is a gift Romans 6:23. God saves us unto good works, which are impossible, until we are saved Ephesians 2:8-10. Before salvation "good works" R done 2 try 2 merit salvation. After salvation our good works R only 2 glorify God.

[majinish]

@1stcorinthians1vrs18 Faith is dead without works and since grace is by having faith in Christ then dead faith puts a damper on grace upon a person.

[1stcorinthians1vrs18]

@majinish Grace is not only unearned, it is actually something that is opposite of what we deserve. We all have earned and deserve the wrath of God Romans 3:23. God gives us grace, because He loves us, even when we hate Him and fight against Him Romans 5:8-11. Read John 3 it spells things out very clearly and thoroughly. Faith produces works, it is not created by our works. The work of God is that we love one another, as He has loved us.

[majinish]

@1stcorinthians1vrs18 @"it is actually something that is opposite of what we deserve" God doesn't give anyone something they don't deserve. That would make Him unjust.

[1stcorinthians1vrs18]

@majinish Do you deserve heaven? Is there anything that you do, do or courld do to absolutely merit and deserve heaven? God does not sin. God does not dwell with sinners. Did you read Romans 5:8-11? If God ever allowed someone who had sinned into Heaven, that would make Him unjust, unless that sin had been totally paid for and removed. The wages of sin is death. Without the shedding of blood there is no remission of sins Leviticus 17:11.

[RedSun875]

Reading in verse 19 we see the context is universal world law, not simply ceramonial the law of Moses. "Now we know that whatever the law says, it says to those who are under the law, that EVERY mouth may be stopped and ALL THE WORLD may become quilty before God. Romans 3:19

[LDStothecore]

He asks how do we know if we have done enough? That's easy. Elder McConkie said as long as we are doing what we should be doing when we leave this life, we will continue in that direction.

[RedSun875]

@LDStothecore "But now the righteousness of God apart from the law is revealed, being witnessed by the law and the Prophets, even the righteousness of God, through faith in Jesus Christ, to all and on all who believe. For there is no difference;" Romans 3:21,22

[LDStothecore]

@RedSun875 Man is not justified by the law of Moses—He is justified through righteousness, which comes through faith in Christ, made possible through Christ’s atoning sacrifice.

[JarheadPatriot0311]

This young man has no concept of whatserving G-d in the Temple was all about. For some reason,he's accounting that to salvation. He really doesn't know Judaism. I am a Jew who believes that Yeshua is the Messiah but that in no way nullifys the instruction of Torah which the church loves to destroy. They are very much in error. Yeshua is the saviour and the son of G-d,but that does not cancel out the Torah. Torah was never for salvation but a way to live according to G-d's standard

[archonfury]

sad :( a group of kids that didnt feel loved sad.. well at least they have jesus now.. even if they wanna pick and choose what scripture they believe in. regarding the whole works/faith thing.. go read james O.o but thats ok you can kinda say ohh that doesnt count and go back to and only refer to Acts when talking about the topic.

[Reklaw008]

Salvation is by grace but judgment is according to works; works are the condition of remaining in, but they do not earn salvationThe view that salvation is by grace but judgment is according to works may at first appear paradoxical, although it is not. The point is that God saves by grace, but within the framework established by grace he rewards good deeds and punishes transgression. (E.P. Sanders, Paul and Palestinian Judaism: A Comparison of Patterns of Religion, 1977)

[Reklaw008]

Love was seen as "the bond that holds together those in intimate relationships, the relationships of family and kindred...Behavior required by or appropriate to a kinship relationship becomes "gracious" or "altruistic" behavior." (Frank Moore Cross, From Epic to Canon: History and Literature in Ancient Israel, 2000)

[Reklaw008]

"Grace must be met with grace; favor must always give birth to favor; gift must always be met with gratitude...From [many] ancient witnesses, we learn that there is no such thing as an isolated act of grace. An act of favor and its manifestation (the gift) initiate a circle dance in which the recipients of favor and gifts must return the favor, that is, give again to the giver." (David DeSilva, Honor, Patronage, Kinship & Purity: Unlocking New Testament Culture, 2000)

[Reklaw008]

If he understood the client-patron relationship or the acts of kinship found in West Semitic tribes, perhaps he wouldn't have such a distorted view of 'grace'.

[Ahijah7]

Quit bagging on the Mormons... God isn't going to send them to hell for DOING all the good things they DO even if it doesn't mean anything to you. Of course we are saved by grace but that grace also means we need to extend His loving kindness to ALL of God's children. I grew up around Mormons and they have some of the strongest families and are some of the most Christlike people I know. Word is the Mormons were the first into Haiti last week even before the Red Cross! Less judging more loving!

[maximusjay]

"Quit bagging"

Pull that sheep skin off your back and follow the teachings of Christ. We are to expose the works of darkness and Mark those that do these works as a warning to others. You sound like a Mormon that is pretending to be a Christian. You say that they have strong families which they do but they put them ahead in importance than Christ. You say they are the most Christlike people you know. You need to read the Bible because there is nothing Christ-like about them. They are wolves.

[Sigmanuwife]

This video and this channel are unfortunate. I love how people are so quick tobash our faith as LDS. We know that the Gospel of Jesus Christ is perfect. Our Chruch is set up EXACTLY how the Savior himself set it up. ..If people put aside their prejudice and actually studied for themselves, they would be shocked to knwo that they would have more comfortt and more peace in their lives.

[maximusjay]

"This video and channel"

You speak in absolute ignorance. There is nothing perfect about the Mormon doctrines or the Mormon gospel. It is not the Gospel of Christ. Your Church is unique in how it is established. It is not a Christian organization or even a Jewish one. It is built on a foundation of lies. Show me in the BIBLE where your church is EXACTLY how the "Savior" set it up".

[Sigmanuwife]

@maximusjay I would like 2 speak 2 your ignorace How grateful we should be for the Holy Bible In it we learn nt only of the life & teachings & doctrines of Christ we learn of His Church & of His priesthood & of the organization which He established & named the Church of Jesus Christ in those former days. We believe in that Church & we believe that The Church of Jesus Christ of Latterday Saints is that same Church restored to earth complete with the same organization & the same priesthood.

[Sigmanuwife]

@maximusjay Without the Bible, we would not know of His Church then, nor would we have the fulness of His gospel now.When Jesus established his Church, he personally instructed and directed its leaders. He, in turn, received his instructions from his Father in Heaven. Thus the Church of Jesus Christ was directed by God and not by men (see Hebrews 1:12). Jesus taught his followers that revelation was the rock upon which he would build his Church (see Matthew 16:1618).

[Sigmanuwife]

@maximusjay Before Jesus ascended into heaven after his resurrection, he told his Apostles, I am with you alway, even unto the end of the world (Matthew 28:20). True to his word, he continued to guide them from heaven. He sent the Holy Ghost to be a comforter and a revelator to them (see Luke 12:12; John 14:26). He spoke to Saul in a vision (see Acts 9:36). He revealed to Peter that the gospel should be taught not only to the Jews but to the whole world (see Acts 10). .

[Sigmanuwife]

@maximusjay He revealed to Peter that the gospel should be taught not only to the Jews but to the whole world (see Acts 10). He revealed many glorious truths to John, which are written in the Book of Revelation. The New Testament records many other ways in which Jesus revealed his will to guide his Church and enlighten his disciples. There needed to be Authority from God The ordinances and principles of the gospel cannot be administered and taught without the priesthood.

[Sigmanuwife]

@maximusjay The Father gave this authority to Jesus Christ (see Hebrews 5:46), who in turn ordained his Apostles and gave them the power and authority of the priesthood (see Luke 9:12; Mark 3:14). He reminded them, Ye have not chosen me, but I have chosen you, and ordained you (John 15:16). That there might be order in his Church, Jesus gave the greatest responsibility and authority to the Twelve Apostles. He appointed Peter chief Apostle and gave him the keys to seal blessings cont...

[Sigmanuwife]

@maximusjay both on earth and in heaven (see Matthew 16:19). Jesus also ordained other officers with specific duties to perform. After he ascended into heaven, the pattern of appointment and ordination was continued. Others were ordained to the priesthood by those who had already received that authority. Jesus made it known through the Holy Ghost that he approved of those ordinations (see Acts 1:24).

[Sigmanuwife]

@maximusjay The Church of Jesus Christ was a carefully organized unit. It was compared to a perfectly formed building that was built upon the foundation of the apostles and prophets, Jesus Christ himself being the chief corner stone (Ephesians 2:20). Jesus appointed other priesthood leaders to assist the Apostles in the work of the ministry. He sent officers called seventies in pairs to preach the gospel (see Luke 10:1). Other officers in the Church were...cont....

[Sigmanuwife]

@maximusjay evangelists (patriarchs), pastors (presiding leaders), high priests, elders, bishops, priests, teachers, and deacons (see chapter 14, Priesthood Organization). These officers were all necessary to do missionary work, perform ordinances, and instruct and inspire Church members. These officers helped the members come to a unity of the faith, and of the knowledge of the Son of God (Ephesians 4:13).

[Starvalleybotany]

I wonder what these people on this site think about gay people. I wonder how they treat gay people. I also wonder whether they have also been involved in trying to to thwart LGBT civil and marriage equality away.

[JediMormon]

"Saved by grace after all we can do" is probably one of the most misunderstood verses in LDS scripture. Sever points: 1)Grace is always there. 2)No matter how much we do, our good works alone will not be enough to save us. 3)Thus, when we fall short--and we WILL fall short, grace will be there to make up for what we lack. James in the Bible says that good works are proof of our true faith, and that if we DON'T have works, then our faith is DEAD, being alone.

[maximusjay]

Jedi you have the cart before the horse. James is one of the most misunderstood scriptures for Mormons. James reconciled to Paul teaches us that Grace is a free gift from God and cannot be earned. The Fruit of True Faith is Good Works, however no amount of works will save you. However as James points out, if you say you have Faith yet produce no Good works, then do you truly have the Faith that can Save you. There is no misunderstanding of Mormonism. You just are not the usual drone.

[JediMormon]

"Grace is a free gift from God" The Book of Mormon says the same thing. And, I never said that grace could be earned, because it CAN'T. However, God expects us to do good works. Recall the parable of the Good Samaritan? Nowhere was religious preference mentioned, except when the Priest crossed to the other side of the road. LDS do good works, not in an effort to "earn" salvation, but because that is what God wants us to do.

[awolLDSasap]

lds salvation is not free. You must labor at duties in the church, then repeat names and secrets to live with God.

This is not the grace of God.

It is bondage to a religion.

[exmo81]

The truth is we are saved by grace despite of what we've done!! That is how powerful Jesus is! In Moroni you have to deny ALL ungodliness before grace is sufficient for you. Is it sufficient for you already? So when you are saved partial glory is yours? the author and finisher of your salvation is Jesus and partial you? Wake up!! I pray that God will help you open your eyes! As he did a few months ago to me! God Bless

[awolLDSasap]

And you believe Mormon works are acceptable to God?

Most Mormon works, laws and ordinances aren't even Biblical.

You fail to understand what grace is. You fail to understand what freedom and liberty in Christ means.

[JediMormon]

I believe that ANY religions works that involve helping the needy, taking care of the widow, etc, are acceptable to God, provided that the works were done for the glory of God. As Jesus told his disciples: "Let your light so shine before men, that they may see your good works, and glorify your Father which is in heaven." (Matthew 5:16)" Another: "Inasmuch as ye have done it unto one of the least of these my brethren, ye have done it unto me."Matthew 25:40)"

[awolLDSasap]

And Mormons boast about their works, to outsiders and amongst themselves.

Why do you think that all works will be set to fire?

The works of a religious movement will burn.

[jpgr1958]

again aTrueHybrid when you state "we just happen to understand him differently," with all respect, that is political correctness. As I stated, as painful as it is, one of us has a misunderstanding of Jesus. If one of us has the wrong Jesus, one cannot be saved no matter how much we want it to be so.

Again, we can be friends, but this issue is so very important. Please watch the video I mentioned in your personnel box. I think you will be surprised by it. Take care.

[jpgr1958]

aTrueHybrid, thanks for your comment, however in the debate I mentioned to you in your comment box, it was stated by Oneness representatives, that those who believe in the Trinity, are not baptized in Jesus name only, and who are not a member of the UPC church are lost. It appears the leaders of your church believe differently than you do.

Also, as I stated in my comment to you, as politically incorrect as it sounds, we have different Jesus'. One of us is wrong. Sorry, but it's true.

[jpgr1958]

The problem with this is that it threatens the incarnation of the Word made flesh as a complete and single person. Jesus was both God and man in one person. He had a will, He ate, He slept, etc. He was a man. He needed to be a human in order to bear the sins of people. No mere man could do this. But the fact is, Jesus was one person--and still is. Jesus was both God and man at the same time in the form of a single person.

The Oneness explanation you gave risks the error of Nestorianism....

[jpgr1958]

aTrueHybrid, thanks again for your response. After reading your comments, I do agree with you in some areas. I do agree that there is only one God, and all the Scriptures you gave, I fully agree with. I also agree with you that Jesus had two natures. He was both God and man while He walked this earth. But what oneness does is divide Jesus into two parts and have the human nature address the divine nature--which was somehow in heaven while Jesus, who has two natures, was on earth.

[jpgr1958]

aTrueHybrid, thanks for your response. Before we move on to your question, I just want to make sure I understand your position. When you state: "we do believe in a distinction between Father and Son," can you elaborate a bit more on that? Are they or are they not distinct persons? If not, just exactly what are they? Again, I'm trying to understand your position. Thanks again.

[jpgr1958]

atrueHybrid, thanks for your response. Since you are oneness, and stated that I have made false assumptions about the UPC church and their believes, would you mind if I ask a question? With whom or who was Jesus speaking to in John 17 when He said: "Father, the time has come. Glorify Me with the glory I had with you before the foundation of the world?" Even though you stated you "stay away from doctrines," I believe this is an important one. Thanks for your time.

[allzago]

I am posting this without reading all previous comments, so sorry if it is repetitive...it's a pity this young man misinterpreted the Book of Mormon and tried to work his way into heaven...what is "after all we can do"? All we can do is repent and sincerely strive to follow Jesus. Sorry you somehow missed that detail, young man. It is you who robbed yourself. I have been a Mormon for quite some time and this overlooked detail is the centre-point of my faith.

[geobona]

In saying that..We still believe in the Bible, and the Book of Mormon we use together with the Bible to make clear the teachings of the Gospel...

Can anyone explain to me why there are so many different Christian denominations even though they all believe in the one Bible? Has it ever occured to people some of the original teachings of the Bible have been lost due to mankind rewriting their own versions????

[SisterSkeeba]

'Can anyone explain to me why there are so many different Christian denominations even though they all believe in the one Bible?'

Its like the many different Mormon sects who believe in the book of mormon. There are over 200 Mormon sects and the LDS version is just one of them.

The FLDS follow Joseph Smith and his teachings alot more closer than the LDS church which backtracks on key issues and his revelations when the going gets tough for them.

[geobona]

From the Articles of Faith...(core beliefs of LDS church)

"We believe the Bible to the word of God as far as it is translated correctly..we also believe the Book of Mormon to be the word of God".

The reason why we have the Book of Mormon is because many of the plain and precious truths of the Bible have been removed. The reason why we have the King James version of the bible is because it is the most correct version of the Bible...

[SisterSkeeba]

The Book of Mormon does not contain Eternal Marriage, baptism for the dead, multiple Gods, man can become God etc

Thats because Smith had not made them up or plageurised these ideas yet as his original fiction was to address the origin of the Indians in which he was wrong anyway. They are not decended from any Lamanites or from any Hebrew character called Lehi. They came from Siberia and are Asian Mongolion in origin.

The book of mormon is a fraud.

[Blogrich55]

Sadly it is not the LDS, Jehovah's Witnesses or the other vults only who are teaching works mixed with grace and faith but many misled Christians as well. Christ came to save us and set us free. Good works will follow BUT follow and NOT proceed grace. God bless.

[JediMormon]

Even atheists are capable of good works, folks. True, good works will follow, but they can also go before. Need knows no religion, as proven by the Savior's parable of the Good Samaritan.

[Blogrich55]

@JediMormon So you reject the scripture that bluntly says:

1. "The plowing of the wicked is sin." Proverbs 21:4

2. "Without faith it is impossible to please Him." Hebrews 11:6

The Bible says our righteousness is as filthy rags. It is the righteousness of Christ, granted by God through faith, that covers us and our sins in His holy eyes. We can approach Him not by OUR works but by the works of Jesus. This is the doctrine of justification by faith alone the BOM calls pernicious.

[awolLDSasap]

This is where I become worried about my family who are still members. They believe God is a kindly father who rewards every good work. Not true. They fail to understand.....

Philippians 2:5-8 "the word was God"

1 Timothy 3:16 GOD was manifest in the FLESH.

MATTHEW 1:23

"...if ye believe not that "I am he", ye shall die in your sins."

There will be false prophets and false Christs that will lead people to destruction.

[awolLDSasap]

Jesus has a different identity and is not sufficient in mormonism.

[LDSMASON1]

The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints

13,508,509 members

265,593 converts baptized in 2008

123,502 new children of record for 2008

2,818 stakes

348 missions

622 districts

28,109 wards and branches

52,494 missionaries serving

Nuff said.

[tezkingkong]

Active?....Temple "worthy"??....

[truth96130]

Hear is my parable-A man lived on earth and had a son. His son loved his father with all his heart and soul and honored him every day. His son did all his fathers will. One day his father explained to him that he is actually 3 different people yet one. His son did not believe that he was 3 yet one. Still his son did all his will and loved his father.

[truth96130]

His Father loved him back even though he did not believe he was actually 3 yet one person. His father continued loving him and said to his son I love you son and one day when you die you will understand what I meant when I say I am

(3 yet 1).

[truth96130]

Question-Just because the son did not believe his father was (3 yet 1) did this mean that the son was (magically) serving a different Father all those years? Of corse not. Yes the son was serving his real father even if he did not think he was 3 yet one person. Would you disown your son because he thought you were form Mars? I think not.

[truth96130]

Nor do I think God would disown someone that has a different understanding of the trinity then what you have. What matters most is that you believe there all God. Exactly the same being or (separate yet the same in nature) is an issue that we may never truly understand until we die and see Jesus ourselves. God bless.

[jpgr1958]

truth96130, you stated: "Nor do I think God would disown someone that has a different understanding of the trinity than what you have." Now I can understand, for example, the thief on the cross who cried out to the Lord, not having a full knowledge of the Trinity. I believe that God will take everything into account, and that His judgement will be fair and just. But I'm talking about those who have had the Trinity explained to them from a Biblical standpoint, and still refuse to believe in it.

[jpgr1958]

An example would the the United Pentecostal Church who have stated that the Trinity comes from pagan sources, and is demonic in it's teaching. They believe in what is called modalism. Their Jesus did not come into being until He was born in Bethlehem. They also teach that Jesus was once the Father, then became the son, them became the Holy Spirit, much like an actor putting different masks. So when you ask them who Jesus was speaking to in John 17, when He said...

[jpgr1958]

"Father, the hour has come. Glorify Your Son, that Your Son also may glorify You," they will say that Jesus was talking, not to another person, but to His divine side. This is what we would call today as schizophrenia, for Jesus would be talking to Himself. That is NOT the Jesus of the Bible.

So again, it's so important to know the REAL Jesus. The biblical Jesus always existed with The Father, was not created, and that this Jesus became man with two natures, 100% human and 100% divine.

[jpgr1958]

One more point. It doesn't matter if we as finite humans can understand the Trinity or not, for if we could fully understand it, we would BE GOD!!! Again, I do believe that God will take into account everything when He passes judgement, but if one turns a blind eye from the clear teaching of scripture concerning this, then you fall into what Paul stated in Galatians, you have another Jesus, another Gospel, and another Spirit. I say all of this knowing it's politically incorrect to do so.

[truth96130]

I believe in the trinity however I do not believe that it is necessary for salivation because the thief on the cross (as far as we know) had no understanding of the trinity yet he was saved. The Lord could of explained it to him in paradise yet the man was still saved.

[filoIII]

you dont think the thief knew Jesus was God? the perfect, sinless one? just asking

[truth96130]

1 John 2/23 No one who denies the Son has the Father; whoever acknowledges the Son has the Father also.

1 John 4/2 By this you know the Spirit of God: Every spirit that confesses that Jesus Christ has come in the flesh is of God, and every spirit that does not confess that Jesus Christ has come in the flesh is not of God.

[truth96130]

When someone is on there death bed and they are tolled about Jesus and accept him into there heart yet do not learn about the trinity, dos that mean he is not saved? Of corse not. It is faith in Jesus that saves not your understanding of the trinity.

[jpgr1958]

truth96131, if I may give some examples of what Paul meant about if any one preaches another Jesus...

Let's take the Jehovah Witness. They believe that Jesus is Michael the Archangel, and was created as a junior partner along with The Father. The New Age believer states that Jesus was a great avatar. And the Mormon states that Jesus is one god amongst many gods. What Paul is talking about the nature of Christ, that Jesus was God in the flesh, 2nd person of the Trinity. Jesus was the one who...

[jpgr1958]

spoke and the universe leapt into existence. This is a far cry from saying that if your son thought you came from the moon, would he still be your son? Your son believes that you are human, whereas the Jesus of the Bible was 100% man and 100% God, the God-man. He was not 50-50. He had two natures, divine and human whereas we have only one nature. This is the core teaching of the historic Christian church. So if a person or group teaches that Jesus is not the God-man, their Jesus cannot save.

[jpgr1958]

Again, it's not the term Jesus Christ that is the issue, but the meaning one pours into that term that is the difference. And there's a huge difference between the Jesus of the groups I mentioned before, JWS, New Age, Mormons, Moonies, Christian Science, etc., and the Jesus of the Bible. Remember, the most important question Jesus asked was "who do people say that I am? That's why we must have the real and true Jesus, not a figment of our imagination, or what we THINK Jesus is.

[OneMormonThinker]

Then I take it you believe in the bearded Jesus? Did he also have long hair? or was he bald? Which Jesus do you really believe in?

[OneMormonThinker]

I don't understand the issue?

We are all saved by the grace of God.

Suddenly all of "Christianity" conveniently forgets the LDS concept of salvation vs exaltation? Please folks, keep your facts straight, this Mormonology 101.

[bsl103158]

jone other comment- I do not live where it is heavily lds- and I can certainly assure anyone reading this that it does not take lds membership to inspire godly living in a person- what it takes is a humble and complete surrender of one's heart and mind to the blood redemption by Christ upon Calvary's cross to transform us. In our own efforts, we may seem better and better to some, but again, if we are looking to our own "acts of righteousness" to earn points, our pride is showing.

[bsl103158]

I for one am grateful daily that the salvation Christ provided to me,unearned, IS NOT contingent upon my personal ability or disability to add to what the Cross did for me. I would go insane with fear and frustration if I had to constantly worry like that. I do not know how lds members bear that kind of worry and burden.They ALL need to be set free from such torment and slavery. AND PRIDE-of thinking their "righteousness" is earning them brownie points with the Lord more than the next person.

[bsl103158]

why would Almighty God send His only begotten Son to experience the pains of death for us if we could earn heaven and peace with God without Christ's suffering all of that? Christ endured 30 plus years living in a world crammed with all kinds of sinners, yet without any sin of His own- He was/always will be the ONLY WORTHY ONE- His title "THE LAMB OF GOD", (WHO TAKES AWAY THE SIN OF THE WORLD)"as John the Baptist put it- His blood made it possible for ALL sin to be cast away from us forever.

[Ahijah7]

Yes... we both agree on this and the more we grow in our relationship to Jesus the more we become like him and naturally our works demonstrate that love. As Mormons do the works of Christ which we call Charity perhaps their very natures will change and they in turn will become like him. Then as John says... "when he shall appear, we shall be like him." Once again at that point Christ will be the judge not you or me.

[Ahijah7]

Let Jesus decide who he will save and who he won't. God looketh upon the heart and knows the intent of those who do righteous acts of service. Read Matthew 25 the parable of the Sheep and Goats... note that the sheep are saved because they were doing Chirstlike works... these were not done to EARN their way into heaven but showed their true natures... I believe the Lord will know which Mormons have pure hearts the same as he will know which Christians do. He is the only perfect Judge.

[beshxo]

Exactly.

[Ahijah7]

Quit bagging on the Mormons... God isn't going to send them to hell for DOING all the good things they DO even if it doesn't mean anything to you. Of course we are saved by grace but that grace also means we need to extend His loving kindness to ALL of God's children. I grew up around Mormons and they have some of the strongest families and are some of the most Christlike people I know. They help the poor, serve in communities and stand for morality across the world. Pick on someone else!

[jpgr1958]

Ahijah7, you must remember that the bible speaks of another Jesus, another spirit, and another gospel. This means that there are false Christ's, spirits, and Gospels flying around the landscape. Please read Galatians 1: 6-10. Jesus also told his disciples to be aware of false Christ's. So we have to discern which is the real Jesus and which is the counterfiet. The Mormons, Jehovah Witness, Islam, Moonies, etc., do not have the Jesus of the bible, therefore their Jesus can not save.

[Ahijah7]

The REAL Jesus will look upon the hearts of all of God's children and in his all knowing understanding will judge who is worthy of the Kingdom. You or any other earthly being cannot and should not be exalting yourselves above others. His grace is sufficient to cover ALL sin. He He is the Savior yet you seek to focus on damning everyone who doesn't prescribe to your limited view. You use the same arguments against Mormons as the those who charged Jesus with blaspheme and sent him to the cross.

[jpgr1958]

Ahijah7, you throw out a lot of accusations without any proof. I suppose Galations 1:6-10 really does not mean much to you. But your kind of argumentation is in the line of political correctness, which is a cancer that has infiltrated our culture.

Oh yes, all those rhetorical questions you asked in your last post: Mormons having strong families, drug free kids, etc., the same can be said of other groups like Jehovah Witness, Moonies, Christian Scientists, and the list is endless.

[Ahijah7]

Don't take the Word of God out of context... The Galatians were a small minority surrounded mostly by heathens and a few Jewish Christians who were called Judaizers because, although they professed to belief in Christ, they still insisted that the Judean law be observed. The pressures of these pseudo-Christians had induced the Galatians to conform to the requirements of the law of Moses notwithstanding the fact Paul had taught them that Christ had fulfilled the law. Mormons don't do that!

[Ahijah7]

Also...Remember Paul's words to Timothy when he foresaw our day where men would "be lovers of their own selves,... false accusers, ... despisers of those that are good," When I read your words I wonder if Jesus would agree with how you judge those He suffered and died for...after all He did die for EVERYONE. Why not be a peacemaker? Isn't that what Jesus admonished? Use your energy to fight the REAL cancers of society... porn, addiction, abuse, war, and even religious bigotry.

[jpgr1958]

Ahijah, let me illustrate what Paul means when talks about "another Jesus", in the book of Galatians.

When a Jehovah Witness talks about Jesus, they believe that Jesus was Michael the Archangel. When a New Ager speaks of Jesus, they define him as a great avatar. When a Muslim speaks about Jesus, they believe that God cannot have a son, as well as believing that Jesus didn't really die on the cross.

Now all of these groups cannot all be correct. That is just plain common sense. Either one is...

[jpgr1958]

correct and the others are wrong, but they all cannot be right. Jesus asked THE most important question which was "who do people say that I am?" That Is the question we must answer correctly, for if we have the wrong Jesus, that Jesus cannot save.

[OneMormonThinker]

Now all of these groups cannot all be correct. That is just plain common sense. Either one is... Amen..

[OneMormonThinker]

you must remember that the bible speaks of another Jesus,

And of course you have the right Jesus?

[theTruthNotLies]

Did you know the Mormons pray to a differente Jesus ,not the biblical one, a different God, a false prophet. These are few of the reasons why Shawn goes on TV and internet to tell the truth about all the lies you'll find on mormonism.

[Ahijah7]

I grew up around Mormons. Ive been in their homes when they had family prayer and visited their church services. They pray in the name of Jesus Christ. They read the Bible and teach that Jesus is the Christ and Savior of the world. You act like Mormons are communists or something. If they are so evil why do they have such strong families? Why do they live longer? Why are their kids drug free? Why do their marriages last? That is evidence of Christ and HIS gospel working in their lives! Wake up!

[truth96130]

That is quite an assumption there. Mormons pray to a different Jesus. Do you know the hearts of all Mormons? Do you know what every Mormon believes? The obvious answer is no. There for you dont know that they pray to a different Jesus. What you know is, what some of there leaders have taught about Jesus. That dos not poove all Mormons believe that way. Some leaders in the Catholic church taught (you get to become God) that dos not mean every catholic believes that way.

[Ahijah7]

truth96130... I think you meant to reply to one of the other comments... you are making the same point I have been trying to make... No one but God knows the hearts of those of other faiths... Nobody but the Lord knows what is said in prayers ... No one should judge that is reserved for God... we are to love all mankind and be peacemakers.... the YouTube video above is obviously meant to tear down Mormons... Where is the pure love of Chirst in that?

[filoIII]

surely you're not saying allah and Jehovah are the same, are you? you have problems if you think that is so.

[Ahijah7]

No of course not... Salvation comes only through our Savior Jesus Christ no one else... The real question is how will Jesus through His infinite mercy and atonement save those who do not yet understand who he is? In fact, the majority of all those ever born have died never even hearing His name. I do not know but I do have faith that a perfectly just God will not condemn those who have never known Him without allowing them a chance to accept the truth. There is only one God

[filoIII]

can you back that up w/ the Bible?

[Ahijah7]

Yes, read Psalms 147:5 "Great is our Lord, and of great power: his understanding is infinite." Infinite sounds like a lot of power and understanding to me. How about Acts 10:34-35 "Then Peter opened his mouth, and said, Of a truth I perceive that God is no respecter of persons: But in every nation he that feareth him, and worketh righteousness, is accepted with him." All men and women are children of God. It is morally wrong for any person or group to judge His children ONLY God may do so!

[OneMormonThinker]

Mormons pray to a differente Jesus

I thank God that I pray to a different Jesus, then the Trinitarians.

Did you know Trinitarians pray to a different Jesus then the bible preaches?

[Exodus314IAM]

Inlighten me, what is different than the Bible teaches? That Jesus is God? (John 8:57-59; John 10:30-33; John 12:44-46)

Maybe because Jesus is not created? (Isaiah 9:6; John 1:12; Hebrews 13:8)

So lets see your Created Jesus who is a god not the God.

God Bless!