Wait here good sir. Voltaire's works are standards in collegiate courses throughout the world. I'm not attacking the Bible, but when you suggest that Voltaire is a forgotten man lost to history you're either lying or ignorant.
May 21, 2011, Jesus Christ is The SON of GOD, He is not GOD. Only GOD The FATHER is GOD. There is only ONE GOD and that ONE GOD is GOD THE FATHER. Jesus Christ never claimed or said that he is GOD. Jesus Christ always spoke of His Father as being GOD His FATHER. Jesus Christ is the one and only True Divine Perfect SON of GOD.
so because the dead sea scrolls prove that the"old testament" was 'virtually' unchanged, (what does that men anyways?) it proves that jesus was real? what about proving the new testament?
To me it seems that you people are afraid that if the bible is not "real" then christianity isn't worth anything... That's kind of sad. So if all bibles were destroyed tomorrow christianity would seize to exist because nobody would be able to read what to believe?
The Old Testament prophecies can only be considered fulfilled if you believe that the New Testament is accurate. You are using the bible to prove the bible is true. That is called circular reasoning.
A quite interesting theory on prayers. Why do some people receive what they want and others dont? Think of it like this- you cant drink from an empty glass. What one receives after praying is considered to be a "borrowed" energy. One has to continue to do good deeds in order to borrow that energy and receive what he's asking for. It's like a bank account- you simply cant withdraw from an empty account. Same concept when praying...
Why try to "prove" anything? Faith is of the Spirit, not of reason. The Love of God is the fruit of faith. It is also the highest commandment of the Lord.
The NT was written from 49 AD to 90 AD. Thats only 16 years after Jesus death, by eyewitnesses who knew him. We have 24,633 complete manuscripts to date, with the only differences being puncuation.
Compare these historical facts to the writings of Cesar, Plato, & Socrates, whose writings are accepted by almost all liberal scholars as historically factual.
Keep in mind, the accuracy of any ancient text is the number of surviving manuscripts and the time between the author and the manuscript.
This video does not prove at all of the actual truth of the Bible. Stating that the Dead Sea Scrolls proved that parts of the Old Testament were4 written prior to when Jesus is thought to have lived, only proves that point, assuming of course, that the dead Sea Scrolls are legitimate. It does nothing to prove that the prophecies of the Old Testament could not still have been written into the New Testament as being fulfilled. No proof of the New Testament exists.
A very concise and accurate description of the Jesus seminar and their motive. There is truly nothing new under the sun. All of the prophecies in the Old Testament concerning Jesus can be found in the Dead Sea Scrolls thus disproving the idea that those prophecies were put in the Bible after His death. We still see prophecy fulfilled today in the re-establishment of Israel prophesied in Ezekiel 36-38 and other places.
ugh what a dreadful waste of time, who cares, it was rewritten so many times, translated and written after his life. the only people that might benefit from this is people who take it literally and their the people that wont listen to you. i dont even see the problem that he might not have done miracles, doesnt change the message or anything, these people just seem like trouble makers
1. The video claims that it was a "pillar of liberal theology" to claim that the book of Isaiah was a Christian forgery of the 2nd century. Who has ever claimed this? There are scholarly debates about the authorship of Isaiah but all agreed that it was written centures before Jesus.
2, The video is wrong about the Dead Sea Scrolls. Far from proving that the Old Testament comes to us unaltered - these scrolls demonstrate how fluid the text is, how much it changes over time.
@hazydavey Obviously no one says that NOW. But 100 years ago, some liberals (and some Jews) thought the fulfilled messianic prophecies were inserted into the Greek Septuagint by Christians. One example is Psalm 22:16 --
They have very sweet smiles but this sort of conspiracy-mongering makes for bad history but very clever salesmanship ("buy the DVD that the mainstream media and those 'liberal theologians' don't what you to know about!) It reminds me of the folks who sell dietary supplements and herbal remedies as miracle cures on TV infomercials.
Jesus(Yahshua) was Black.....He was from the seed of David ,father of Soloman who we all know was black...Hebrew is an Afrocentric/Asiac name. They are of HAMITES(Black). Isreal was apart of North Africa in those days along with Egypt before the Europeans changed it....LOOK IT UP....IT'S TRUE. Sorry to hurt anyone's feelings but your Jesus was a black man, That's why he fled to Egypt to hide from King Herod..... among other black people...OK.
@yaacobUriyah Oh Please Spare me here for Jesus was a a Jew and the Jewish Race goes back to God made the world. The Jews go back 6,000 yr. just after the great flood to kill all and start over. now for your infomation there was no black or white people,but just people and if you lived in different parts of the country you developed a pigmet of the skin to deal with the sun lite. If you was in the Hot Sun area you had dark skin. If you lived in forest areas. You had a light color skin ! Period !
And Ehud reached with his left hand, took the sword from his right thigh, and thrust it into his belly. And the hilt also went in after the blade, and the fat closed over the blade, for he did not pull the sword out of his belly; and the dung came out.
im roman catholic but im afraid to say that quran is more acurate more HOLY than your book or should i say your bible because they are more writers in your bible and they are not prophets
Yahshua (Jesus) was BLACK....He was of the seed of David....Soloman was the son of David...Soloman was described as being BLACK, The Hebrews came out of Egypt(Black).....Canaan is of Ham(Black)....Hebrew is an Afrocentric/asiac name(look it up) Therefore the Hebrews were of African orgin. In those days Isreal was apart of North Africa , along with Egypt.
i wouldn't offend black people by saying that...Jesus is a lie. No proof when he was "living". This poxy video is so wrong. the dead Sea scrolls could have been put there,could they not? just to go on perpetuating the myth...
@afterdavit actually, most historians agree that jesus of nazereth was indeed a real, living person, even if his life may have been considerably different from the one portrayed in the gospels.
The real Jesus was not black and not white or orange or green /
He was all a mix of everything . With such a hateful post like yours i can say Jesus would not stand for it.
I will say what he would .Your thought of separation and race are earthly matters . Jesus and Gods people are one , We do not see race . or color we love all no matter what .
@v8legend28 The real Jesus was in the line of King David, so how could he have been black? He wasn't white either, he was arabic, but that was just his human body
If you are watching this...You are on the right track...Forget the UFOs Forget the rapture BS...Forget the Crap you hear....6th trump = Bad Guy....7th Trump = Jesus...Belive on Him thats all you need to know....In the meantime TRY not to sin too much ...OK?
just because the theologians on that documentary were liberal theologians doesn't mean what they said wasn't accurate, they still had to study Jesus life, just not from a close minded perspective, and at least it still represented both sides as well, unlike this "documentary"
The Old Testament has 3 authors and many re-writes. The book of Thomas is the most recent scripture written after the events of Jesus. In it Jesus is said to refer to himself as a Jew and a prophet but not the son of God, and there is no mention of the resurrection. The others, Mark, Luke and John were written 40-50 yrs later. That is historians found, but I guess its up to you what you believe.
@siwooot Everyone is entitled to an opinion, and just because you have one it does not necessarily make it correct. It is obvious that the media in general don't want Jesus to have any sort of authority in thier lives so they stack the deck to TRY and prove a long ignored point of view that is both irrational and has no plausability.
Well Done! We have to be wise and on to the media's manipulations... or they will continue to run amuck with lies and propaganda. Basically if the media promotes it, you can with genuine certainty assume it it a load of nonsense. Basically you can just assume that the Devil himself owns the networks. I have lived long enough to see this so clearly.
At 15 I desired to find out who God was and began to read the Koran. Practising the religion for me seemed void of a relationship with God but it had an appearance of godliness which gave me a way of life. I was empty and I struggled to please God.
One day God showed me a vision of hell and I was there suffering because i was lost. Hell is real. In the vision I called out 'God' and a voice told me cry out Jesus Christ. He came and rescued me from the torture. Jesus is the only one who can SAVE
Keep your faith and keep your mouth shut, wheter you are atheist like me, or chritian all the way to Hindu, just live your life in peace and if religion makes you happy then so be it, I don't judge or rip on theists unless they tred in my water. Peace to all!
The things is .Archaeological evidence isn't enough until someone writes a thesis. I am sure alot of people have written thesis papers on the scrolls, or on any archaeological finds that support the bible, but when peer reviewed the lack of other evidence that cannot be found makes all evidence that has been found discredited. It's sad but true, the bible is full of holes and will never be fully confirmed until the so called 'God' of everything comes down and explains it to us.
"the lack of evidence that cannot be found makes all evidence that has been found discredited ..."
I don't follow this twisted logic.
The Bible itself speaks of man being so flawed in his thinking that he cannot understand the Word of God until God comes down and explains it to him. There are four whole chapters in John (14,15,16,17) in which Jesus prays for the Comforter (Paraclete) to come and guide you into all truth.
Yes the bible says one thing, but real natural evidence says otherwise. I am not saying if someone finds within' themselves the holy spirit that the trueth cannot be found. But from my point of view whtich is archaeology artifacts and theories with local stories seem to be more beleivable.
Thanks for clarifying. I agree that physical evidence ought to back up the biblical accounts. In fact, there are hundreds if not thousands of archaeological artifacts that corroborate the New Testament. I don't of a single piece of physical evidence that definitely contradicts.
Of course there are going to be many, many artifacts that can show the new testament was somewhat real, thats what makes the bible so beleiveable. It took real life accounts and twisted them into a religion.
Archeology consitently contradicts the myth of the bible. For example the Flood and the Exodus are two myths for which there is not a scrap of evidence. Abraham coming from "Ur of the Chaldees" and riding camels.
These myths were written down millenia after the tales supposedly happened.
And the only evidence they show here is that the dead sea scrolls, say some of the same things the bible includes. But that shows us the the bible is copied off of something that was written many years before Jesus. So, how does that prove Jesus was real?! it only proves that, if he was real then the bible lied about when he was born. So you wouldnt need to go as far as to write a thesis.. Its critical for people to use their mind and think about things before you start to worship them.
You can actually buy "The Dead Sea Scrolls Bible" (Abegg, Flint, Uhlrich) and read the prophecies of Jesus that from scrolls that existed prior to His birth.
Prior to their discovery some used to claim that some of these were later Christian interpolations.
I'm not sure where the reply message is that I am responding too, but the user said that this video was regarding to the canonical text found within the DSS. He offered the term "son of man" like that found within Daniel, however, "son of man" appears only two times, 7:13 which talks about ancient times and 8:17. Both of which have nothing to do with Jesus of the Gospels, nor does any OT book.
Actually the manuscripts started soon after Christ's death. Historical, archeological, geographical evidence. Even the supreme Court said the evidence is overwhelming. Read "Resurrection" by Hanegraaff and "Case for a Creator, Faith and Christ" by Strobel.
Lee Strobel's "The Case for the Real Jesus" is actually quite good. The book consists of interviews with scholars on many of the topics covered in this DVD.
These aren't fundamentalist hacks, but leading scholars in the field, such as William Lane Craig.
If you were open-minded, you'd actually read the book. I consider some of the conclusions very moderate to liberal against my more conservative views.
But Strobel INVESTIGATES using all his forensic skills.
Lee Strobel only investigated one side. When he was supposedly looking at the other side he never actually interviewed them... he went to their biggest and best opposition. How is that fair and balanced? Tell you what, even if you don't agree with what the opposite side has to say why don't you look at it to see what they're talking about in order to be able to understand where the opposition is coming from. The counter to "The Case for Christ" is called "Challenging the Verdict" by Earl Doherty
Strobel was an atheist an a cynical investigative journalist (quite successful at it).
He took the skeptical position and then tried to prove that the opposite position was tenable.
Strobel deals only briefly with Doherty, but the Jesus myth hypothesis is held by NO credentialed historian. (Richard Carrier is the only exception.) It's not even worth considering because it has been refuted over and over again by the scholarly world.
Doherty ought to be happy that he got a whole chapter.
Yes, yes, I've heard all that many times over. If you're so sure that your side is infallible than why don't you read what the other side has to say about your claims (Challenging the Verdict) so that you can accurately counteract their claims? Or maybe go read some real history on the subject that isn't so far left or right and read "Backgrounds of early Christianity" By Everett Fergeson. He's a real christian, so you shouldn't have to fear his work.
I'd read Doherty if he was a credentialed historian or a credentialed anything. Doherty has made no impact on scholarly debate. His views have received attention only on the internet.
Strobel's book is a series of interviews with credentialed scholars who are involved in scholarly debate.
Doherty has a degree in Ancient History and Classical Languages, Strobel received a journalism degree and a Master of Studies in Law degree from Yale.
Judging from their education who do you think would be more qualified in their interpretation of the texts in question? And who would be more easily mislead by someone more interested in pushing their own agenda rather than trying to get to the truth?
Doherty didn't convince me that Christ never existed... he convinced me not to trust Strobel
I found that on WIKI... but I'm having trouble finding out where. So far it sounds like he has an M.A. so I'm going to ask him and hope he responds. That could take a couple days.
Well he replied back to me pretty quick... maybe he only reponds when he's asked politely.
Anyway, his words were "I have an Honors B.A. in Ancient History and Classical Languages (Greek and Latin) from a Canadian University"
So, I've asked him which school and I'm trying to get a registry link of some sort to link to Wikipedia for him so he doesn't have to keep answering this same question.
Well, we already know that it was in Canada it's on Wikipedia, which is never wrong.
What is he hiding?
Elsewhere he says he studied under GA Wells, who taught at the University of London. Well, BTW, changed his mind and now refutes the hypothesis that Jesus never existed.
My suspicion is that Doherty might have a degree in something. He studied some classical languages and ancient history, but does not have a degree in this. He also read Wells' book and got most of his ideas from there.
BTW: Doherty's book is on-line and I've read parts of it. I am familiar enough to know the fallacies of the Jesus-as-myth hypothesis. If the premises aren't true, then the arguments might be valid and logical, but not true in their conclusions.
It was a direct copy pasta from him. Anyway, now that I think we're on the same page about his education. (He has it, albeit limited).
Now I'm guessing that your purpose on here is to try to convert the atheists back to Christianity. The way to do that is going to have to be to read their claims and then counter them.
When an atheist reads "The Case for Christ", then "Challenging the Verdict" they come out with the impression that Christians aren't doing a whole lot of research for...
ugh what a dreadful waste of time, who cares, it was rewritten so many times, translated and written after his life. the only people that might benefit from this is people who take it literally and their the people that wont listen to you. i dont even see the problem that he might not have done miracles, doesnt change the message or anything, these people just seem like trouble makers
@1toneboy the bible has never been rewritten,,,the ancient scrolls 50,000 in all, are under air tight glass,,,,they have never been in one persons hands at one time,,,not the catholic church not any church,,,these ancient scrolls have been copied and translated,,,if someone creates a bogus translation we know it immediately bc we have the ancient scrolls,,,this idea that the Bible has been changed is wrong,,when we found the dead sea scrolls we were able to see that our Bible is accurate ,,
themselves and suspect that they're being intellectually lazy.
That's why I had also earlier suggested "Backgrounds of Early Christianity" as an excellent source for learning about what was going on at that time in history and it will help to speed up searching for specific area's of interest.
BTW, after finishing reading Strobel and Doherty, I was unchanged from my previous view that the evidence for Christ one way or the other results in an inconclusive verdict...
im a sinner saved by grace so iwont comment.. i kno the word of God is true. in signs n wonders man serious .. if not God then what, us? nooooo way! man destroys n its God who helps us in time of need. "oh my scientists help me"!
Christ is the Truth and the only way to the father! it's not for me to make you beleave...it's up to the holy spirit...men do not seek God for God seeks us...many are called few are chosen. don't be decieved by the reasonungs of men and devils that twist and corrupt all that is sacred...praise Yeshua Christ!
Religion is the greatest FRAUD in all history. No evidence of a Jesus. All so-called "gospels" written btween 2 decades to 300 years after his alleged life. The story (Bible) has been modified dozens of times - more than 50 versions of the bible today. Religion - ALL religions are mythological nonsense - afterlife, virgin birth, resurrection, miracles, angels - come on.
Read Josephus, Livius and Suedonius. To deny the historicity os Jesus is to deny there was a Julius Caesar, a Roman Empire, and a 1st C Israel. All Gospels pre-date the 2nd C. All basic textual criticism and historiography.
What about Isaiah 53? How do you explain the fine tuned universal constants? How do you explain the zero probability for the assimilation of metabolizing and reproducing first cells? How do you explain the fact that you are made of nothing but atoms, yet you are self aware? Men do not have conclusive answers to these questions, so why are you so sure?
Followers of Jesus as read in the Bible should be more concerned with his core messages, namely love your enemy and Activley care for the poor in your communities. As opposed to arguing about creation, supporting war death and destruction, and fighting about perverts.
"Historical Jesus" or not, look for yourself at the life and teachings of Jesus.
the bible was riten by men,and there are about 80 gaspols & leters riten in 1 and 2 century,befor the bible was riten in 4th century by only 4 gaspols,and the rest of gaspols & leters gat bornd.
bisaids the christion god was whorshipt century befor jesus was born,you shuld check al the fackts
The four Gospels have a pedigree. They are quoted extensively by the church fathers beginning around 90 AD. The earliest fragments from the canonical Gospels come from the early 2nd century from the original copies made int he first century.
The first time we hear of the Gnostic Gospels, they are denounced as heretical texts by Irenaeus and Tertullian.
The earliest Gnostic Gospel fragments come from the 4th century copied from originals made in the 2nd century.
Yes, a silly fisherman like John could hardly be a wiser philosopher than Crossan and Borg.
Let's give it two or three thousand more years (theoretically YouTube's data base will still be around then) and future judges will see whose books are forgotten.
Stupid is as stupid does my Momma always used to say.
That's because evolution on the genus scale is happening.
What many Christians disagree with is total organic evolution -- that all life came out of a single cell that was created out of nothing with no Creator as the first cause.
But evolutionists don't even discuss the matter of the first cause. Evolutionists have set up a consistent explanation of the development of life on Earth based on archeological facts and genetical studies. They explain life, they don't discuss the cause of it.
There are no GENUINE archeological evidences to support evolution.
The piltdown man case survived for 40 years after which it was concluded that the whole case was a FRAUD. It remained a FRAUD for 40yrs and do u know what happens within those yrs? It CONVINCES people of evolution.
Modern science have dug and r still digging into unknown phenomena of EXISTENCE which are disapproving evolution and supporting the idea of a supernatural power or in other words the existence of a God.
If the accounts in Matthew and Luke are both accurate then Quirinius was Governor of Syria before Herod died in 4BCE. This is not the case. From this I conclude that the bible is not inerrant.
You are not inerrant either since neither Tacitus, Josephus nor Luke says that Quirinius was ever a "governor" of Syria -- he was variously a ruler, judge or procurator,
Luke has Quirinius as a ruler of Syria c. 3 BC. Other sources also have Quirinius as a ruler in the region at Jesus' birth -- not specifically "Syria."
No. My argument is that we know (from Josephus) who was Governor of Syria from 6 CE: Quirinius. Luke states that Joseph and Mary went to Bethlehem to be taxed "And this taxing was first made when Cyrenius was governor of Syria" , so this must have been 6 CE at earliest. Matthew states that Jesus was born under the reign of Herod. As angels told Joseph (Matthew 2:19, my mistake) that Herod had died we can only infer that the Herod must have been Herod the Great: died 4BCE.
It's also possible that Quirinius was a ruler of Syria from 4 BC to 1 BC, isn't it? This is what Luke and Justin martyr say.
BTW: HEGEMON in Greek is a generic term for any ruler. Luke says he was governing Syria (the verb form) but doesn't say what his title was. Justin says Quirinius was a procurator. And we know that often there was both a procurator and a governor.
Matthew doesnt mention Quirinius because he is writing to a primarily Jewish audience who would remember the cruelty of Herod and Varus.
Luke is writing to a Gentile audience in Greece, Macedonia and Asia Minor who would remember Quirinius and know little of Varus. The administration of Judea might be lost on a Greek audience many decades later far removed geographically from those events.
Like you knowing who the governor of New York was in 1950 if you are living now in Toronto.
The difficulty is not the date of the worldwide census or the date of the death of Herod. The real question is whether Quirinius was actually a governor of Syria from late 4 BC to February 5th, 2 BC, when census for the oath of allegiance was completed in other provinces throughout the Empire.
My solution is that Quirinius would have been considered a ruler over several provinces in the absence of a provincial governor in Syria, even while ruling in Cilicia, on Syria's border.
Josephus in his Antiquities doesn't mention Quirinius holding any office from the time he was consul until he became governor of Syria in 6 AD.
Now Cyrenius (Qurinius), a Roman senator, and one who had gone through other magistracies, and had passed through them till he had been consul, and one who, on other accounts, was of great dignity, came at this time into Syria, with a few others, being sent by Caesar to he a judge of that nation, and to take an account of their substance.
There is no note by Josephus of where Quirinius was located from the time when he had been consul, neither does Josephus mention who was governing Syria from 4 to 1 BC. This piece of information is supplied by the Roman historian Tacitus in Annals:
Around this time, he [Tiberius Caesar] requested that the Senate pay tribute to the death of Sulpicius Quirinus with a public funeral ... A tireless soldier, who had by his faithful services become consul during the reign of Augustus, and later was honored for his victory concerning his assault on the fortresses of the Homonadenses in Cilicia.
Justin Martyr also corroborates with an important added detail about Quirinius' sphere of authority.
Now there is a village in the land of the Jews, thirty-five stadia from Jerusalem, in which Jesus Christ was born, as you can ascertain also from the registers of the taxing made under Cyrenius [Quirinius], your first procurator in Judea (Justin, Apology, 34).
I've never encountered a so-called "contradiction" that cannot be explained by a difference in perspective or of one Gospel writer including more (or less) information than another writer. There are no differences that cannot be reconciled.
If you think there are, name the best one you can think of.
This delusion is eroding due to the tranfer of knowledge and reduction of Godly ignorance. It is about time we grew out of this ridiculous superstition that has retarded every positive human endeavor since it's inception.
What about the prophesy regarding Jesus' predicted return. Jesus told his desciples that there generation would see him return before they all died. "I tell you the truth, this generation will certainly not pass away until all these things have happened." (Mark 13:30) What generation? If he meant some far off future generation he would have said "that generation". Guess what? No Jesus yet.. So that makes Jesus a false prophet and a liar according to the Bible.
Jesus said that Jerusalem would be surrounded by armies and the Temple would be destroyed in one generation.
"...for all these things must come to pass, but the end is not yet" (Mt. 24:6).
The Temple would be destroyed in "this generation" (Mt. 24:34), but the Second Coming does not occur until we "make disciples of all nations" (Mt 28:19).
"And this gospel of the kingdom will be preached in all the world as a witness to all the nations, and then the end will come" (Mt 24:14).
So you are calling Jesus a liar. He did so say he would come before his generation died out. "I tell you the truth, this generation will certainly not pass away until all these things have happened." One of the things he was talking about was his second coming (Mk 13:26) Do you refuse to take his words literally? The early Christians seemed to take him quite literally. [ I Cr 7:29; Ph 4:5]
No, He was talking about His "coming on the clouds," not coming back to earth. Throughout scripture "coming on the clouds" is a metaphor for God coming in judgment, which Christ did in 70 AD when Jerusalem was destroyed.
Matthew 28:19 does not say that Jesus will return after preaching to the world. It just says make disciples of people from all nations. That was pretty easy to do back then because the world was a lot smaller back then. It was basically limited to the Mediteranian. Besides, they didn't have to travel very far since people from all nations were represented in Palestine.
What Jesus meant was that the generation that sees the things He described in Mt. 24 and Mark 13 would witness His return. "this generation" was the terms He used, not "your generation".
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Congratulations on this Whole Video, Its very Nice!
Irenaeus, Tertullian and Justin Martyr are all Catholic! :) And so was Athanasias, Augustine and Aquinas! And many more Ante-Nicene and early Christian Fathers!
I do believe in Jesus & have a PhD in philosophy, allow me to make a few points: 1) The girl in this video is the sort of intellectual zero who gives christianity a bad name 2) You obviously never read Schleiermacher, who remains one of the greatest theologians ever 3) The Gospels do contradict one another 4) There's a chasm among churches, most christians and the real Jesus 5) Some Gnostic Gospels are as valid as the canonical ones (Thomas', for one) 6) Jesus is Lord, but you better smarten up
How would you know? Judging from your videos you seem to know very litlle. And they are the ones that make people laugh!! Mine was advice; you can't take it... Goodbye!!!
I'm not here to publicize my private life, if I was I wouldn't be using a username; besides I work as a musician, I only lecture on philosophy when invited. For the record: 1) Grammar School Diploma, exams in Literature, Latin, Ancient Greek, Philosophy & History 2) Degree Modern Letters & Philosophy, Sapienza University, Rome, Italy 3) BA in Philosophy & English Literary Studies at Middlesex University, London. 4 & 5) MA & PhD At UCL, London. None of this has anything to do with the comments
Anyway, I don't want to have arguments with you. I appreciate what the videos are trying to do, just thought it could have been done better. My criticism were perhaps too harsh, I apologize. You have no idea of the number of idiotic aetheists who hassle me on YT because of comments I at times make in defence of Christianity & religions (or Metaphysics). If you think my comments were uncalled for, delete them, I don't mind. I apologize again, but I stand by what I wrote. I wish you all the best
Let me give you an example of how you prove the historical existence & divinity of Jesus: the darkness that appeared as He died on the cross. It could not have been an eclipse of the sun, 'cause they last only minutes; also, there was an earthquake. Well, it was all witnessed as far away as Greece. There are authentic records of philosophers wondering what could have caused it. Naturally, they weren't Christians, like Thalus, from Syria. It was dated & coincides with the Jews' passover of AD 33
Is this directed at me? It's not an argument, just a simple example. My PhD thesis was a study of The Scapigliatura, an Italian avant-garde movement (1860-1890). Starting from literary works, it expanded into Metaphysics & Aesthetics, my fields of knowledge of the 5 branches of modern Philsophy (the other 3 are Epistemology, Ethics, Politcs). My BA Philosophy dissertation was on Kant, my English Lit one on Shakespeare. I published 2 poetry collections, 1 of essays, 2 of translations.
This all seems more like wishful thinking rather than serious textual criticism. The only academic scholars who are qualified for making accurate assessments in the textual criticism of the Gospels are them who do not have any interest in whether the traditional Christian view is authentic or not.
First, this isn't textual criticism. It is an attempt to refute the fallacies of liberal Higher Criticism.
Textual criticism has to do with looking at available manuscripts and deciding which variants in the text were in the archetype and then using those archetypes to arrive at a majority text that reflects the autograph accurately.
Second, you think Dan Brown, who wrote the foremost textbook on KOINE Greek, is not qualified to work with NT manuscripts because he is a believer?
all this kind of stuff does is justify rather worrying authoritarian and right wing and eventual totalitarian governace! most unwise and uglym (ever seen a pretty totalitarian state, -think russia, urban china, and so on, ugly ugly ugly.
to closly examine christ we see anarchy spiritually so! a glorius seeming contradiction,
besides! you can find truth anywhere! you dont need a book, you dont need a church! being awake! eyes! ears! senes! alertness! truthfulness love! sensitivity, truth is THERE to be had! its a living thing!
only the blind NEED a book to tell them about it!
its not multi faceted! and yet it is too!
revelations tells you about the eye covered spirit! how it is sevenfold/manifold. the twenty two arch names of god are like multi facets of one personality! its NORMAL
Wait here good sir. Voltaire's works are standards in collegiate courses throughout the world. I'm not attacking the Bible, but when you suggest that Voltaire is a forgotten man lost to history you're either lying or ignorant.
Seth23211 1 month ago in playlist jesus
@Seth23211 His prediction that the Bible would fade away was lost to history.
jcr4runner 3 weeks ago
Where's the love button instead of like?
bodom71 3 months ago in playlist The Real Jesus
@bodom71 The love button is the "ORDER THE DVD" button. :-)
jcr4runner 3 months ago
May 21, 2011, Jesus Christ is The SON of GOD, He is not GOD. Only GOD The FATHER is GOD. There is only ONE GOD and that ONE GOD is GOD THE FATHER. Jesus Christ never claimed or said that he is GOD. Jesus Christ always spoke of His Father as being GOD His FATHER. Jesus Christ is the one and only True Divine Perfect SON of GOD.
MASTER105175 8 months ago in playlist The Real Jesus (Video Podcast with Ariel and Joel)
so because the dead sea scrolls prove that the"old testament" was 'virtually' unchanged, (what does that men anyways?) it proves that jesus was real? what about proving the new testament?
aaronmorillon 8 months ago
To me it seems that you people are afraid that if the bible is not "real" then christianity isn't worth anything... That's kind of sad. So if all bibles were destroyed tomorrow christianity would seize to exist because nobody would be able to read what to believe?
Nygaard2 9 months ago
The Old Testament prophecies can only be considered fulfilled if you believe that the New Testament is accurate. You are using the bible to prove the bible is true. That is called circular reasoning.
BiffWhitebread13 1 year ago
A quite interesting theory on prayers. Why do some people receive what they want and others dont? Think of it like this- you cant drink from an empty glass. What one receives after praying is considered to be a "borrowed" energy. One has to continue to do good deeds in order to borrow that energy and receive what he's asking for. It's like a bank account- you simply cant withdraw from an empty account. Same concept when praying...
RUSSKAYAG 1 year ago
Why try to "prove" anything? Faith is of the Spirit, not of reason. The Love of God is the fruit of faith. It is also the highest commandment of the Lord.
I trust God, not men and their words.
bluetortilla 1 year ago
The NT was written from 49 AD to 90 AD. Thats only 16 years after Jesus death, by eyewitnesses who knew him. We have 24,633 complete manuscripts to date, with the only differences being puncuation.
Compare these historical facts to the writings of Cesar, Plato, & Socrates, whose writings are accepted by almost all liberal scholars as historically factual.
Keep in mind, the accuracy of any ancient text is the number of surviving manuscripts and the time between the author and the manuscript.
rubbersole79 1 year ago
what type of material the dead sea scrolls written in is it paper or leather or what
ejasem1 1 year ago
@ejasem1 Both papyrus and leather parchment. The parchment is in better condition.
jcr4runner 1 year ago
This video does not prove at all of the actual truth of the Bible. Stating that the Dead Sea Scrolls proved that parts of the Old Testament were4 written prior to when Jesus is thought to have lived, only proves that point, assuming of course, that the dead Sea Scrolls are legitimate. It does nothing to prove that the prophecies of the Old Testament could not still have been written into the New Testament as being fulfilled. No proof of the New Testament exists.
boootts 1 year ago
This lyric says it all, "Jesus loves me this I know, the Holy Bible tells me so."
AcePilot2009 1 year ago
A very concise and accurate description of the Jesus seminar and their motive. There is truly nothing new under the sun. All of the prophecies in the Old Testament concerning Jesus can be found in the Dead Sea Scrolls thus disproving the idea that those prophecies were put in the Bible after His death. We still see prophecy fulfilled today in the re-establishment of Israel prophesied in Ezekiel 36-38 and other places.
otaycec 1 year ago
ugh what a dreadful waste of time, who cares, it was rewritten so many times, translated and written after his life. the only people that might benefit from this is people who take it literally and their the people that wont listen to you. i dont even see the problem that he might not have done miracles, doesnt change the message or anything, these people just seem like trouble makers
1toneboy 1 year ago
I would love to see a video refuting the claims of Thomas Paine.
ModernDeism 1 year ago
Context - Context - Context - Isaiah in context are not prophecies of Jesus.
Read it.
ModernDeism 1 year ago
2 remarks:
1. The video claims that it was a "pillar of liberal theology" to claim that the book of Isaiah was a Christian forgery of the 2nd century. Who has ever claimed this? There are scholarly debates about the authorship of Isaiah but all agreed that it was written centures before Jesus.
2, The video is wrong about the Dead Sea Scrolls. Far from proving that the Old Testament comes to us unaltered - these scrolls demonstrate how fluid the text is, how much it changes over time.
hazydavey 1 year ago
@hazydavey Obviously no one says that NOW. But 100 years ago, some liberals (and some Jews) thought the fulfilled messianic prophecies were inserted into the Greek Septuagint by Christians. One example is Psalm 22:16 --
jcr4runner 1 year ago
They have very sweet smiles but this sort of conspiracy-mongering makes for bad history but very clever salesmanship ("buy the DVD that the mainstream media and those 'liberal theologians' don't what you to know about!) It reminds me of the folks who sell dietary supplements and herbal remedies as miracle cures on TV infomercials.
hazydavey 1 year ago
This should be called:
The real Jesus: Indoctrination
PantsThatDontFit 1 year ago
Jesus(Yahshua) was Black.....He was from the seed of David ,father of Soloman who we all know was black...Hebrew is an Afrocentric/Asiac name. They are of HAMITES(Black). Isreal was apart of North Africa in those days along with Egypt before the Europeans changed it....LOOK IT UP....IT'S TRUE. Sorry to hurt anyone's feelings but your Jesus was a black man, That's why he fled to Egypt to hide from King Herod..... among other black people...OK.
yaacobUriyah 1 year ago
@yaacobUriyah Oh Please Spare me here for Jesus was a a Jew and the Jewish Race goes back to God made the world. The Jews go back 6,000 yr. just after the great flood to kill all and start over. now for your infomation there was no black or white people,but just people and if you lived in different parts of the country you developed a pigmet of the skin to deal with the sun lite. If you was in the Hot Sun area you had dark skin. If you lived in forest areas. You had a light color skin ! Period !
turtle4aire 1 year ago
as an asian i can make the following statement with confidence:
we are expert in selling vacuum cleaners to the world.
we sold the vacuum cleaner of judaism and chrisianity to the world.
we sold the vacuum cleaner of islam to the world
we sold the vacuum cleaner of hinduism and budhism to the world.
ever wondered why no prophet was ever born in newzealand, aurtralia, brazil, england, holland or iceland.
we specialize in creating and selling the vacuum cleaners in the name of religion.
zulfitareen 1 year ago
Judges 3:21-22
ESV
And Ehud reached with his left hand, took the sword from his right thigh, and thrust it into his belly. And the hilt also went in after the blade, and the fat closed over the blade, for he did not pull the sword out of his belly; and the dung came out.
lizazoon 1 year ago
this is very offense.
Who did this video have no idea
CloudsofBliss 1 year ago
im roman catholic but im afraid to say that quran is more acurate more HOLY than your book or should i say your bible because they are more writers in your bible and they are not prophets
wish17max 1 year ago
Just remember the real jesus was black
v8legend28 1 year ago
@v8legend28 No. He was neither black nor European white.
lordofhispania1 1 year ago
Yahshua (Jesus) was BLACK....He was of the seed of David....Soloman was the son of David...Soloman was described as being BLACK, The Hebrews came out of Egypt(Black).....Canaan is of Ham(Black)....Hebrew is an Afrocentric/asiac name(look it up) Therefore the Hebrews were of African orgin. In those days Isreal was apart of North Africa , along with Egypt.
yaacobUriyah 1 year ago
i wouldn't offend black people by saying that...Jesus is a lie. No proof when he was "living". This poxy video is so wrong. the dead Sea scrolls could have been put there,could they not? just to go on perpetuating the myth...
afterdavit 1 year ago
@afterdavit Yes, the DSS could have been put there around 167 BC.
jcr4runner 1 year ago 3
@afterdavit Well there are historians who back up Jesus being alive, The Roman Govenor put him to death.
DavidTheCatholic 1 year ago
@afterdavit actually, most historians agree that jesus of nazereth was indeed a real, living person, even if his life may have been considerably different from the one portrayed in the gospels.
mightyafrowhitey 1 year ago
@v8legend28 .
The real Jesus was not black and not white or orange or green /
He was all a mix of everything . With such a hateful post like yours i can say Jesus would not stand for it.
I will say what he would .Your thought of separation and race are earthly matters . Jesus and Gods people are one , We do not see race . or color we love all no matter what .
xingwei12 1 year ago
@xingwei12 why did christians support slavery for so long?
mik99D 1 year ago
@mik99D Not all christians did and sadly they didnt read the bible cuz James 2:1 speaks out against choosing something over another.
FlyDeathOrangatang 1 year ago
@v8legend28 The real Jesus was in the line of King David, so how could he have been black? He wasn't white either, he was arabic, but that was just his human body
DavidTheCatholic 1 year ago
@v8legend28 yep
jbthegrinder 1 year ago
2 Sam 24 Lord tells David number ppl of Israel
1 Chron 21 Satan tells David number ppl
so who really told David to number ppl
tryingtogotoheaven 2 years ago
If you are watching this...You are on the right track...Forget the UFOs Forget the rapture BS...Forget the Crap you hear....6th trump = Bad Guy....7th Trump = Jesus...Belive on Him thats all you need to know....In the meantime TRY not to sin too much ...OK?
ToutmaskX 2 years ago
WHO CRES???? I STILL LOVE JESUS
karishmen 2 years ago
just because the theologians on that documentary were liberal theologians doesn't mean what they said wasn't accurate, they still had to study Jesus life, just not from a close minded perspective, and at least it still represented both sides as well, unlike this "documentary"
siwooot 2 years ago
@siwooot Being liberal theologians means they are not accurate in what matters most.
jcr4runner 2 years ago
The Old Testament has 3 authors and many re-writes. The book of Thomas is the most recent scripture written after the events of Jesus. In it Jesus is said to refer to himself as a Jew and a prophet but not the son of God, and there is no mention of the resurrection. The others, Mark, Luke and John were written 40-50 yrs later. That is historians found, but I guess its up to you what you believe.
MegaJay79 2 years ago
@siwooot Everyone is entitled to an opinion, and just because you have one it does not necessarily make it correct. It is obvious that the media in general don't want Jesus to have any sort of authority in thier lives so they stack the deck to TRY and prove a long ignored point of view that is both irrational and has no plausability.
abbyguy 2 years ago
Well Done! We have to be wise and on to the media's manipulations... or they will continue to run amuck with lies and propaganda. Basically if the media promotes it, you can with genuine certainty assume it it a load of nonsense. Basically you can just assume that the Devil himself owns the networks. I have lived long enough to see this so clearly.
DanieljDixon 2 years ago
@DanieljDixon i've seen propaganda come from a lot of religious tv programs too
siwooot 2 years ago
when is jesus coming back to save us all ?
charlieiscool1000 2 years ago
soon! very soon.. if you have believed in JESUS. he will come for you befor they get you. no harm will come to you.
imthefrogman 2 years ago
you will not know the moment nor the hour. repent and pray daily.
pablocoon 1 year ago
etymology JESUS the name started being used 1175 ad so how could he be real if his name was used until 1175...
blackprez17 2 years ago
A translation!
Meddre 2 years ago
At 15 I desired to find out who God was and began to read the Koran. Practising the religion for me seemed void of a relationship with God but it had an appearance of godliness which gave me a way of life. I was empty and I struggled to please God.
One day God showed me a vision of hell and I was there suffering because i was lost. Hell is real. In the vision I called out 'God' and a voice told me cry out Jesus Christ. He came and rescued me from the torture. Jesus is the only one who can SAVE
GreaterSolomon 2 years ago
to share gods message dont need to sale DVD lol, unless is useful
chienhaolei 2 years ago
And that is why it is free on YouTube.
jcr4runner 2 years ago
Does bible say anything about december 21,2012 mayan calendar's doomsday?
FilmBorne 2 years ago
Nothing.
jcr4runner 2 years ago
I have three books by Voltaire on my shelf... only one by god. They do indeed still print Voltaire's work.
snowman6427 2 years ago
thanks for all the vids. i love to watch and learn. i could watch for hours.
MrYaesuman 2 years ago
invented by the church
Vykke 2 years ago
Why don't christians believe in Mormonism?
GordieRoss 2 years ago
Why dont they belive in Islam?
kurdatheist 2 years ago
Continue:
Keep your faith and keep your mouth shut, wheter you are atheist like me, or chritian all the way to Hindu, just live your life in peace and if religion makes you happy then so be it, I don't judge or rip on theists unless they tred in my water. Peace to all!
strongfp 2 years ago
The things is .Archaeological evidence isn't enough until someone writes a thesis. I am sure alot of people have written thesis papers on the scrolls, or on any archaeological finds that support the bible, but when peer reviewed the lack of other evidence that cannot be found makes all evidence that has been found discredited. It's sad but true, the bible is full of holes and will never be fully confirmed until the so called 'God' of everything comes down and explains it to us.
strongfp 2 years ago
"the lack of evidence that cannot be found makes all evidence that has been found discredited ..."
I don't follow this twisted logic.
The Bible itself speaks of man being so flawed in his thinking that he cannot understand the Word of God until God comes down and explains it to him. There are four whole chapters in John (14,15,16,17) in which Jesus prays for the Comforter (Paraclete) to come and guide you into all truth.
He is called "the Holy Spirit."
jcr4runner 2 years ago
Yes the bible says one thing, but real natural evidence says otherwise. I am not saying if someone finds within' themselves the holy spirit that the trueth cannot be found. But from my point of view whtich is archaeology artifacts and theories with local stories seem to be more beleivable.
strongfp 2 years ago
Thanks for clarifying. I agree that physical evidence ought to back up the biblical accounts. In fact, there are hundreds if not thousands of archaeological artifacts that corroborate the New Testament. I don't of a single piece of physical evidence that definitely contradicts.
jcr4runner 2 years ago
Of course there are going to be many, many artifacts that can show the new testament was somewhat real, thats what makes the bible so beleiveable. It took real life accounts and twisted them into a religion.
strongfp 2 years ago
Archeology consitently contradicts the myth of the bible. For example the Flood and the Exodus are two myths for which there is not a scrap of evidence. Abraham coming from "Ur of the Chaldees" and riding camels.
These myths were written down millenia after the tales supposedly happened.
bartyfarslar 2 years ago 2
When you say there is not a "scrap of evidence," that is an argument from silence. fallacy.
There isn't any archaeological evidence that CONTRADICTS the Bible, only plenty that supports it.
jcr4runner 2 years ago
And the only evidence they show here is that the dead sea scrolls, say some of the same things the bible includes. But that shows us the the bible is copied off of something that was written many years before Jesus. So, how does that prove Jesus was real?! it only proves that, if he was real then the bible lied about when he was born. So you wouldnt need to go as far as to write a thesis.. Its critical for people to use their mind and think about things before you start to worship them.
KutZ89 2 years ago
You can actually buy "The Dead Sea Scrolls Bible" (Abegg, Flint, Uhlrich) and read the prophecies of Jesus that from scrolls that existed prior to His birth.
Prior to their discovery some used to claim that some of these were later Christian interpolations.
jcr4runner 2 years ago
You make the assumption that those prophecies came from Jesus of Nazareth. Yet, like in OT scripture, Jesus' name is never mentioned.
The focal point of the DSS is the "teacher of righteousness" that is never explained as being Jesus.
Furthermore, the Teacher of Righteousness was crucified in 88 BCE by Jucundus, not Pontius Pilatus.
QuestioProVerum 2 years ago
I'm not sure where the reply message is that I am responding too, but the user said that this video was regarding to the canonical text found within the DSS. He offered the term "son of man" like that found within Daniel, however, "son of man" appears only two times, 7:13 which talks about ancient times and 8:17. Both of which have nothing to do with Jesus of the Gospels, nor does any OT book.
QuestioProVerum 2 years ago
Actually the manuscripts started soon after Christ's death. Historical, archeological, geographical evidence. Even the supreme Court said the evidence is overwhelming. Read "Resurrection" by Hanegraaff and "Case for a Creator, Faith and Christ" by Strobel.
Brucev7 2 years ago
Haha LEE Stroebel? And WHEN did this amazing Supreme court case come about FAil
bartyfarslar 2 years ago
Lee Strobel's "The Case for the Real Jesus" is actually quite good. The book consists of interviews with scholars on many of the topics covered in this DVD.
These aren't fundamentalist hacks, but leading scholars in the field, such as William Lane Craig.
If you were open-minded, you'd actually read the book. I consider some of the conclusions very moderate to liberal against my more conservative views.
But Strobel INVESTIGATES using all his forensic skills.
Unlike you.
jcr4runner 2 years ago
Lee Strobel only investigated one side. When he was supposedly looking at the other side he never actually interviewed them... he went to their biggest and best opposition. How is that fair and balanced? Tell you what, even if you don't agree with what the opposite side has to say why don't you look at it to see what they're talking about in order to be able to understand where the opposition is coming from. The counter to "The Case for Christ" is called "Challenging the Verdict" by Earl Doherty
Samuria11 2 years ago
Strobel was an atheist an a cynical investigative journalist (quite successful at it).
He took the skeptical position and then tried to prove that the opposite position was tenable.
Strobel deals only briefly with Doherty, but the Jesus myth hypothesis is held by NO credentialed historian. (Richard Carrier is the only exception.) It's not even worth considering because it has been refuted over and over again by the scholarly world.
Doherty ought to be happy that he got a whole chapter.
jcr4runner 2 years ago
Yes, yes, I've heard all that many times over. If you're so sure that your side is infallible than why don't you read what the other side has to say about your claims (Challenging the Verdict) so that you can accurately counteract their claims? Or maybe go read some real history on the subject that isn't so far left or right and read "Backgrounds of early Christianity" By Everett Fergeson. He's a real christian, so you shouldn't have to fear his work.
Samuria11 2 years ago
I'd read Doherty if he was a credentialed historian or a credentialed anything. Doherty has made no impact on scholarly debate. His views have received attention only on the internet.
Strobel's book is a series of interviews with credentialed scholars who are involved in scholarly debate.
I give credence to those who are credentialed.
jcr4runner 2 years ago
Doherty has a degree in Ancient History and Classical Languages, Strobel received a journalism degree and a Master of Studies in Law degree from Yale.
Judging from their education who do you think would be more qualified in their interpretation of the texts in question? And who would be more easily mislead by someone more interested in pushing their own agenda rather than trying to get to the truth?
Doherty didn't convince me that Christ never existed... he convinced me not to trust Strobel
Samuria11 2 years ago
Really??????
From what university?
jcr4runner 2 years ago
I found that on WIKI... but I'm having trouble finding out where. So far it sounds like he has an M.A. so I'm going to ask him and hope he responds. That could take a couple days.
Samuria11 2 years ago
Or forever. People on TheologyWeb have asked him.
He's supposedly from Canada, otherwise someone could easily run a background check on him.
Very convenient!
How odd that his credentials are not listed anywhere?
No one wants to claim him?
You accept Doherty's credentials with no evidence, yet you doubt the existence of Jesus!
Maybe Doherty does not even exist. Certainly, there is a lot more evidence for the Jesus of the Gospels than for Doherty.
jcr4runner 2 years ago
Well he replied back to me pretty quick... maybe he only reponds when he's asked politely.
Anyway, his words were "I have an Honors B.A. in Ancient History and Classical Languages (Greek and Latin) from a Canadian University"
So, I've asked him which school and I'm trying to get a registry link of some sort to link to Wikipedia for him so he doesn't have to keep answering this same question.
Is that enough for you to read his work yet?
Samuria11 2 years ago
Well, we already know that it was in Canada it's on Wikipedia, which is never wrong.
What is he hiding?
Elsewhere he says he studied under GA Wells, who taught at the University of London. Well, BTW, changed his mind and now refutes the hypothesis that Jesus never existed.
My suspicion is that Doherty might have a degree in something. He studied some classical languages and ancient history, but does not have a degree in this. He also read Wells' book and got most of his ideas from there.
jcr4runner 2 years ago
Did he really write "Honors B.A." ?
Or was it "Honours B.A."?
BTW: Doherty's book is on-line and I've read parts of it. I am familiar enough to know the fallacies of the Jesus-as-myth hypothesis. If the premises aren't true, then the arguments might be valid and logical, but not true in their conclusions.
jcr4runner 2 years ago
It was a direct copy pasta from him. Anyway, now that I think we're on the same page about his education. (He has it, albeit limited).
Now I'm guessing that your purpose on here is to try to convert the atheists back to Christianity. The way to do that is going to have to be to read their claims and then counter them.
When an atheist reads "The Case for Christ", then "Challenging the Verdict" they come out with the impression that Christians aren't doing a whole lot of research for...
Samuria11 2 years ago
It's absolutely required to list where you got your credentials if you are to be accepted in any academic setting, forum or publication.
Maybe that is one reason why Doherty has never been peer reviewed whenever he has submitted papers on his Jesus-as-myth thesis?
jcr4runner 2 years ago
ugh what a dreadful waste of time, who cares, it was rewritten so many times, translated and written after his life. the only people that might benefit from this is people who take it literally and their the people that wont listen to you. i dont even see the problem that he might not have done miracles, doesnt change the message or anything, these people just seem like trouble makers
1toneboy 1 year ago
@1toneboy the bible has never been rewritten,,,the ancient scrolls 50,000 in all, are under air tight glass,,,,they have never been in one persons hands at one time,,,not the catholic church not any church,,,these ancient scrolls have been copied and translated,,,if someone creates a bogus translation we know it immediately bc we have the ancient scrolls,,,this idea that the Bible has been changed is wrong,,when we found the dead sea scrolls we were able to see that our Bible is accurate ,,
candiceevans1 8 months ago
themselves and suspect that they're being intellectually lazy.
That's why I had also earlier suggested "Backgrounds of Early Christianity" as an excellent source for learning about what was going on at that time in history and it will help to speed up searching for specific area's of interest.
BTW, after finishing reading Strobel and Doherty, I was unchanged from my previous view that the evidence for Christ one way or the other results in an inconclusive verdict...
Samuria11 2 years ago
im a sinner saved by grace so iwont comment.. i kno the word of God is true. in signs n wonders man serious .. if not God then what, us? nooooo way! man destroys n its God who helps us in time of need. "oh my scientists help me"!
mikeymikes75 2 years ago
Christ is the Truth and the only way to the father! it's not for me to make you beleave...it's up to the holy spirit...men do not seek God for God seeks us...many are called few are chosen. don't be decieved by the reasonungs of men and devils that twist and corrupt all that is sacred...praise Yeshua Christ!
troothseeker57 2 years ago
Nice, impartial, unbiased historic analysis, free from influence of blind faith,lovely...thats what we all want, isnt it? LOL...
neilus 2 years ago 2
Enemies from within the church, too. Not everyone who claims to be a Christian really is one.
The Jesus seminar people need to get right with God.
snnicky 2 years ago
Religion is the greatest FRAUD in all history. No evidence of a Jesus. All so-called "gospels" written btween 2 decades to 300 years after his alleged life. The story (Bible) has been modified dozens of times - more than 50 versions of the bible today. Religion - ALL religions are mythological nonsense - afterlife, virgin birth, resurrection, miracles, angels - come on.
goldstead 2 years ago
Read Josephus, Livius and Suedonius. To deny the historicity os Jesus is to deny there was a Julius Caesar, a Roman Empire, and a 1st C Israel. All Gospels pre-date the 2nd C. All basic textual criticism and historiography.
nunfonseca 2 years ago
What about Isaiah 53? How do you explain the fine tuned universal constants? How do you explain the zero probability for the assimilation of metabolizing and reproducing first cells? How do you explain the fact that you are made of nothing but atoms, yet you are self aware? Men do not have conclusive answers to these questions, so why are you so sure?
bonajab 2 years ago
Jesus spoke out against hypocritical Pharisees of his day. How sad that so many "Christians" still follow the war-loving Pharisees of the present.
morebeauty 2 years ago 16
Followers of Jesus as read in the Bible should be more concerned with his core messages, namely love your enemy and Activley care for the poor in your communities. As opposed to arguing about creation, supporting war death and destruction, and fighting about perverts.
"Historical Jesus" or not, look for yourself at the life and teachings of Jesus.
morebeauty 2 years ago
the bible was riten by men,and there are about 80 gaspols & leters riten in 1 and 2 century,befor the bible was riten in 4th century by only 4 gaspols,and the rest of gaspols & leters gat bornd.
bisaids the christion god was whorshipt century befor jesus was born,you shuld check al the fackts
Chatch2010 2 years ago 2
The four Gospels have a pedigree. They are quoted extensively by the church fathers beginning around 90 AD. The earliest fragments from the canonical Gospels come from the early 2nd century from the original copies made int he first century.
The first time we hear of the Gnostic Gospels, they are denounced as heretical texts by Irenaeus and Tertullian.
The earliest Gnostic Gospel fragments come from the 4th century copied from originals made in the 2nd century.
jcr4runner 2 years ago
Seriously give up. The bible is full of fear and hate.
Mcgregor813 2 years ago
The Gospel is the aroma of death to those who are perishing.
jcr4runner 2 years ago
Yes, a silly fisherman like John could hardly be a wiser philosopher than Crossan and Borg.
Let's give it two or three thousand more years (theoretically YouTube's data base will still be around then) and future judges will see whose books are forgotten.
Stupid is as stupid does my Momma always used to say.
jcr4runner 2 years ago
I'm always amazed on how people can totally ignore and reject all the archeological evidence that support evolution.
Virgeo1228 2 years ago
That's because evolution on the genus scale is happening.
What many Christians disagree with is total organic evolution -- that all life came out of a single cell that was created out of nothing with no Creator as the first cause.
jcr4runner 2 years ago
But evolutionists don't even discuss the matter of the first cause. Evolutionists have set up a consistent explanation of the development of life on Earth based on archeological facts and genetical studies. They explain life, they don't discuss the cause of it.
Karakta 2 years ago
Sorry for this question, that might sound a bit stupid.. But what are we gonna evolve to? Elves?
jordanianandproud 2 years ago
There are no GENUINE archeological evidences to support evolution.
The piltdown man case survived for 40 years after which it was concluded that the whole case was a FRAUD. It remained a FRAUD for 40yrs and do u know what happens within those yrs? It CONVINCES people of evolution.
Modern science have dug and r still digging into unknown phenomena of EXISTENCE which are disapproving evolution and supporting the idea of a supernatural power or in other words the existence of a God.
smhuq4et 2 years ago
Thomas Jefferson also wrote a bible that had none of the supernatural elements in it.
krazykeriful 2 years ago
Jefferson actually just cut out what he didn't like. It's interesting - and well worth reading - but not the final word.
UptonGirl4 2 years ago
Why do you delete comments when you respond to them? we would like to read what you are responding.
krazykeriful 2 years ago
It just appears that way. The comments don't always appear in order. YouTube isn't set up to be a discussion thread.
jcr4runner 2 years ago
27871 views 131 ratings 1 comment
eyecanbee 2 years ago
If the accounts in Matthew and Luke are both accurate then Quirinius was Governor of Syria before Herod died in 4BCE. This is not the case. From this I conclude that the bible is not inerrant.
Gorteenminogue 2 years ago
Governor, procurator and ruler are not the same thing. The phrase Luke uses is "was governing." HEGEMON can be used for all three.
jcr4runner 2 years ago
You are not inerrant either since neither Tacitus, Josephus nor Luke says that Quirinius was ever a "governor" of Syria -- he was variously a ruler, judge or procurator,
jcr4runner 2 years ago
Matthew 2:1 Herod the king alive. (Herod died 4 BCE)
Matthew 3:19 Angels announce Herod's death.
Luke 2:2 Cyrenius (aka Quirinius) governor of Syria. (Appointed 6 CE) starts taxing Jews.
So Jesus was apparently born twice, up to 10 years apart.
The only way to 'reconcile' this (and other) contradictions is to conclude that one account, at least, is wrong.
Gorteenminogue 2 years ago
Luke has Herod as ruler of Judea at Jesus' birth.
He also has Jesus being "about 30" at the time of Tiberias "14th year."
A birth date of 6 AD is impossible.
jcr4runner 2 years ago
Luke has Quirinius as a ruler of Syria c. 3 BC. Other sources also have Quirinius as a ruler in the region at Jesus' birth -- not specifically "Syria."
Here's your argument.
1. Quirinius was ruler of Syria in 6 AD.
2. We don't know who was ruler of Syria c. 3 BC.
3. Therefore it was not Quirinius.
Argument from silence!
jcr4runner 2 years ago
No. My argument is that we know (from Josephus) who was Governor of Syria from 6 CE: Quirinius. Luke states that Joseph and Mary went to Bethlehem to be taxed "And this taxing was first made when Cyrenius was governor of Syria" , so this must have been 6 CE at earliest. Matthew states that Jesus was born under the reign of Herod. As angels told Joseph (Matthew 2:19, my mistake) that Herod had died we can only infer that the Herod must have been Herod the Great: died 4BCE.
Gorteenminogue 2 years ago
It's also possible that Quirinius was a ruler of Syria from 4 BC to 1 BC, isn't it? This is what Luke and Justin martyr say.
BTW: HEGEMON in Greek is a generic term for any ruler. Luke says he was governing Syria (the verb form) but doesn't say what his title was. Justin says Quirinius was a procurator. And we know that often there was both a procurator and a governor.
jcr4runner 2 years ago
Matthew doesnt mention Quirinius because he is writing to a primarily Jewish audience who would remember the cruelty of Herod and Varus.
Luke is writing to a Gentile audience in Greece, Macedonia and Asia Minor who would remember Quirinius and know little of Varus. The administration of Judea might be lost on a Greek audience many decades later far removed geographically from those events.
Like you knowing who the governor of New York was in 1950 if you are living now in Toronto.
jcr4runner 2 years ago
so their changing the word of god just 2 appeal 2 different ethnic groups of people is okay
mobfiggak1 2 years ago
The difficulty is not the date of the worldwide census or the date of the death of Herod. The real question is whether Quirinius was actually a governor of Syria from late 4 BC to February 5th, 2 BC, when census for the oath of allegiance was completed in other provinces throughout the Empire.
My solution is that Quirinius would have been considered a ruler over several provinces in the absence of a provincial governor in Syria, even while ruling in Cilicia, on Syria's border.
jcr4runner 2 years ago
First, here are the governors of Syria according to the traditional timeline:
c. 9-6 BC Gaius Sentius Saturnius the Elder
c. 6-4 BC Publius Quintilius Varus
4-1 BC Unknown
1 BC-4 AD Gaius Julius Caesar Vipsanianus
4-5 AD Lucius Volusius Saturnius
6-12 AD Publius Sulpius Quirinus
jcr4runner 2 years ago
Josephus in his Antiquities doesn't mention Quirinius holding any office from the time he was consul until he became governor of Syria in 6 AD.
Now Cyrenius (Qurinius), a Roman senator, and one who had gone through other magistracies, and had passed through them till he had been consul, and one who, on other accounts, was of great dignity, came at this time into Syria, with a few others, being sent by Caesar to he a judge of that nation, and to take an account of their substance.
jcr4runner 2 years ago
There is no note by Josephus of where Quirinius was located from the time when he had been consul, neither does Josephus mention who was governing Syria from 4 to 1 BC. This piece of information is supplied by the Roman historian Tacitus in Annals:
jcr4runner 2 years ago
Around this time, he [Tiberius Caesar] requested that the Senate pay tribute to the death of Sulpicius Quirinus with a public funeral ... A tireless soldier, who had by his faithful services become consul during the reign of Augustus, and later was honored for his victory concerning his assault on the fortresses of the Homonadenses in Cilicia.
jcr4runner 2 years ago
Justin Martyr also corroborates with an important added detail about Quirinius' sphere of authority.
Now there is a village in the land of the Jews, thirty-five stadia from Jerusalem, in which Jesus Christ was born, as you can ascertain also from the registers of the taxing made under Cyrenius [Quirinius], your first procurator in Judea (Justin, Apology, 34).
jcr4runner 2 years ago
The Gospels are full of contradictions, which probably explains why the view that they are is popular today.
Gorteenminogue 2 years ago
I've never encountered a so-called "contradiction" that cannot be explained by a difference in perspective or of one Gospel writer including more (or less) information than another writer. There are no differences that cannot be reconciled.
If you think there are, name the best one you can think of.
jcr4runner 2 years ago
Christianity is nearing an end.
This delusion is eroding due to the tranfer of knowledge and reduction of Godly ignorance. It is about time we grew out of this ridiculous superstition that has retarded every positive human endeavor since it's inception.
I for one say GOOD RIDDANCE!
judoyodan 2 years ago
Do you realize that there are now more Christians converted in one day than there were during the whole history of New Testament?
jcr4runner 2 years ago
Do you realize that more Christians die every day than there were during the whole history of the new testament?
judoyodan 2 years ago
The point is that Christianity is growing. How can you say it will soon be gone?
jcr4runner 2 years ago
What about the prophesy regarding Jesus' predicted return. Jesus told his desciples that there generation would see him return before they all died. "I tell you the truth, this generation will certainly not pass away until all these things have happened." (Mark 13:30) What generation? If he meant some far off future generation he would have said "that generation". Guess what? No Jesus yet.. So that makes Jesus a false prophet and a liar according to the Bible.
HomoDefiantz 2 years ago
Actually, no.
Jesus said that Jerusalem would be surrounded by armies and the Temple would be destroyed in one generation.
"...for all these things must come to pass, but the end is not yet" (Mt. 24:6).
The Temple would be destroyed in "this generation" (Mt. 24:34), but the Second Coming does not occur until we "make disciples of all nations" (Mt 28:19).
"And this gospel of the kingdom will be preached in all the world as a witness to all the nations, and then the end will come" (Mt 24:14).
jcr4runner 2 years ago
So you are calling Jesus a liar. He did so say he would come before his generation died out. "I tell you the truth, this generation will certainly not pass away until all these things have happened." One of the things he was talking about was his second coming (Mk 13:26) Do you refuse to take his words literally? The early Christians seemed to take him quite literally. [ I Cr 7:29; Ph 4:5]
HomoDefiantz 2 years ago
No, He was talking about His "coming on the clouds," not coming back to earth. Throughout scripture "coming on the clouds" is a metaphor for God coming in judgment, which Christ did in 70 AD when Jerusalem was destroyed.
jcr4runner 2 years ago
The bible does not teach a third coming of Jesus Christ.
HomoDefiantz 2 years ago
You are attacking a view I don't hold.
I said that "coming on the clouds" is God spiritually coming in judgment. It is not a physical coming to earth.
We have to understand Hebrew idioms here.
Compare this passage with Isaiah 19:1 or 34:4.
These speak of temporal judgments in similar language, not the end of the world.
I believe in the Second Coming of Jesus, but the theology of the end-times is one of the most misinterpreted doctrines of scripture.
jcr4runner 2 years ago
Matthew 28:19 does not say that Jesus will return after preaching to the world. It just says make disciples of people from all nations. That was pretty easy to do back then because the world was a lot smaller back then. It was basically limited to the Mediteranian. Besides, they didn't have to travel very far since people from all nations were represented in Palestine.
HomoDefiantz 2 years ago
In this sense the Gospel was preached to the whole world, if we think of just the Roman Empire at the time.
But there is a larger sense in which this is yet to happen -- we have not yet taught "them to obey all that I have commanded you."
jcr4runner 2 years ago
And what exactly do you think Jesus meant by: "all that I have commanded you"?
HomoDefiantz 2 years ago
All of God's commandments in the whole Bible.
jcr4runner 2 years ago
What Jesus meant was that the generation that sees the things He described in Mt. 24 and Mark 13 would witness His return. "this generation" was the terms He used, not "your generation".
familybc146 2 years ago
God does have a sense of humor...look at voltaire
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MarieHardyer 2 years ago
Think this woman could show a little more leg to entice us a bit more? She's a Christian tease!
BODYSHEENdottcom 2 years ago
Irenaeus, Tertullian and Justin Martyr are all Catholic! :) And so was Athanasias, Augustine and Aquinas! And many more Ante-Nicene and early Christian Fathers!
1Hope4All 2 years ago
An ironic logic is that one can show orthodox Christianity on the Unitarian grounds in so many ways and on so many levels.
If Jesus was a perfect moral teacher and a prophet, he had to be God because he said he was.
numberonesurvivor75 2 years ago
I do believe in Jesus & have a PhD in philosophy, allow me to make a few points: 1) The girl in this video is the sort of intellectual zero who gives christianity a bad name 2) You obviously never read Schleiermacher, who remains one of the greatest theologians ever 3) The Gospels do contradict one another 4) There's a chasm among churches, most christians and the real Jesus 5) Some Gnostic Gospels are as valid as the canonical ones (Thomas', for one) 6) Jesus is Lord, but you better smarten up
kidcalabria 2 years ago
You don't have a Ph.D. in philosophy (don't make me laugh!) and you don't believe in Jesus Christ as the Son of God.
jcr4runner 2 years ago
How would you know? Judging from your videos you seem to know very litlle. And they are the ones that make people laugh!! Mine was advice; you can't take it... Goodbye!!!
kidcalabria 2 years ago
So you are a doctor of philosophy?
Where did you get your degree?
What was your master's thesis on?
Doctoral dissertation? (As you MUST know these are open to the public.)
Where are your writings published so I can read them?
jcr4runner 2 years ago
I'm not here to publicize my private life, if I was I wouldn't be using a username; besides I work as a musician, I only lecture on philosophy when invited. For the record: 1) Grammar School Diploma, exams in Literature, Latin, Ancient Greek, Philosophy & History 2) Degree Modern Letters & Philosophy, Sapienza University, Rome, Italy 3) BA in Philosophy & English Literary Studies at Middlesex University, London. 4 & 5) MA & PhD At UCL, London. None of this has anything to do with the comments
kidcalabria 2 years ago
Anyway, I don't want to have arguments with you. I appreciate what the videos are trying to do, just thought it could have been done better. My criticism were perhaps too harsh, I apologize. You have no idea of the number of idiotic aetheists who hassle me on YT because of comments I at times make in defence of Christianity & religions (or Metaphysics). If you think my comments were uncalled for, delete them, I don't mind. I apologize again, but I stand by what I wrote. I wish you all the best
kidcalabria 2 years ago
Let me give you an example of how you prove the historical existence & divinity of Jesus: the darkness that appeared as He died on the cross. It could not have been an eclipse of the sun, 'cause they last only minutes; also, there was an earthquake. Well, it was all witnessed as far away as Greece. There are authentic records of philosophers wondering what could have caused it. Naturally, they weren't Christians, like Thalus, from Syria. It was dated & coincides with the Jews' passover of AD 33
kidcalabria 2 years ago
There are only about 5 Ph.D.s in the whole world who would make an argument like this. Are you one of them?
jcr4runner 2 years ago
Is this directed at me? It's not an argument, just a simple example. My PhD thesis was a study of The Scapigliatura, an Italian avant-garde movement (1860-1890). Starting from literary works, it expanded into Metaphysics & Aesthetics, my fields of knowledge of the 5 branches of modern Philsophy (the other 3 are Epistemology, Ethics, Politcs). My BA Philosophy dissertation was on Kant, my English Lit one on Shakespeare. I published 2 poetry collections, 1 of essays, 2 of translations.
kidcalabria 2 years ago
This all seems more like wishful thinking rather than serious textual criticism. The only academic scholars who are qualified for making accurate assessments in the textual criticism of the Gospels are them who do not have any interest in whether the traditional Christian view is authentic or not.
jamilihaya 2 years ago
First, this isn't textual criticism. It is an attempt to refute the fallacies of liberal Higher Criticism.
Textual criticism has to do with looking at available manuscripts and deciding which variants in the text were in the archetype and then using those archetypes to arrive at a majority text that reflects the autograph accurately.
Second, you think Dan Brown, who wrote the foremost textbook on KOINE Greek, is not qualified to work with NT manuscripts because he is a believer?
Ridiculous!
jcr4runner 2 years ago
all this kind of stuff does is justify rather worrying authoritarian and right wing and eventual totalitarian governace! most unwise and uglym (ever seen a pretty totalitarian state, -think russia, urban china, and so on, ugly ugly ugly.
to closly examine christ we see anarchy spiritually so! a glorius seeming contradiction,
yet, hmmmm,,
gnowave 3 years ago
urban china and russia were extreme left wing societies.
braino2000 2 years ago
besides! you can find truth anywhere! you dont need a book, you dont need a church! being awake! eyes! ears! senes! alertness! truthfulness love! sensitivity, truth is THERE to be had! its a living thing!
only the blind NEED a book to tell them about it!
its not multi faceted! and yet it is too!
revelations tells you about the eye covered spirit! how it is sevenfold/manifold. the twenty two arch names of god are like multi facets of one personality! its NORMAL
gnowave 3 years ago