LYNDON JOHNSON TAPES: Bobby Kennedy on Civil Rights Act

[sidrahsiddiqui]

Can anyone please provide subtitles to what RFK is saying to LBJ? the sound is not clear at times.

[MetrazolElectricity]

bill moyers?

[Nominay]

@MetrazolElectricity if you know who Bill Moyers is, then yes, THAT Bill Moyers. He was LBJ's assistant starting in the 50's up through his Presidency

[hiphopfan22]

"Mutual Contempt" pretty much sums it up. RFK thought LBJ was a uncooked moron and LBJ though RFK was a snotty-nosed spoiled brat. They worked together on some initiatives (with great success) but they never, ever liked each other.

[pat442389]

@hiphopfan22 lets be honest they hated each other and had it been the 1700s or early 1800s they probably would have had an old fashioned duel. RFK didnt respect johnson but when johnson became president he rubbed his nose in RFKs grief. both treated the other like shit and had they teamed up, b4 or after the assassination could have done great things. but rfk was bread differently then the old boy system johnson had.

[Jellolion1]

@hiphopfan22 what initiatives are you referring to?

[democrat10]

You can just hear the personal chemistry between the two oozing out of the conversation.

[jerzy862]

@democrat10 youre being sarcastic i hope, lol?

[Kenneth2816]

LBJ was the wealthiest man (up to Bush) to ever occupy the WH>

[Jellolion1]

@Kenneth2816 LBJ wasnt more wealthy than the Kennedy family.

[Jellolion1]

Respond to this video... where do you get your facts??? Forbes magazine says George Washington was by far the wealthiest president, in relative terms. In the 20th century, Herbert Hoover was the wealthiest president. FDR was also from a very wealthy family. The Kennedys were one of the richest families in the US, atr one time. LBJ came from a poor family, and started working as a school teacher. He didnt make money until later in life, when his wife started a prosperous radio station.

[Jellolion1]

@Kenneth2816 .it is so easy to get the facts these days. Why do you want to pull things out of your ass and try to pass them off as facts? The truth is, LBJ was FAR from the wealthiest man to occupy the white house.

[at1212b]

@Kenneth2816 Actually, Harry Truman was #1

[sboudreaux27]

We all know LBJ wanted to be President and hated Bobby a lot, (according to the movie, LBJ the Early Years) where the Kennedy brothers treated him like crap.

[daGr8Satan]

Our government couldn't even assassinate Fidel Castro. How the hell could they pull off the Kennedy assassination?

[TheVardiss22]

@daGr8Satan ..Castro had people around him in positions of power that he could trust(with his life)..Kennedy sure as hell did not...if the JFK assassination was indeed a inside job as alot of people believe then you need folks that are very close to the president to facilitate the when and where of such a event (the mob has been doing it forever) the Kennedy's themselves tried to get Castro (Op. Mongoose) through theCIA but couldn't get to anyone close to Castro to make it work( ie draw him out)

[capetown99]

People talk of Pres Kennedys poor legislative record but is that fair considering that the laws passed after his death were originated and implemented by him? Plus is it fair considering he was only Pres from Jan 61-Nov 63-hardly two full terms.

During which time he had to deal with Eisenhower/CIA Bay Of Pigs, Berlin standoff, Missile Crisis, Civil Rights bill etc?

[jayteso]

agree all those laws were originated by kennedy and passed quickly because they were almost in honor of him because everyone knew it was him not LBJ

[capetown99]

Right. I cant believe some of the comments (like proferic below) who say that JFK did nothing except save the world and get himself shot. What amazes me is that their country profile is U.S. How do I, a non US citizen know what his contribution was and they are so ignorant?

[proferic]

@capetown99 Ignorant? I teach this stuff. I know exactly what I am talking about. Don't get so defensive about JFK. He was good. He was no LBJ, but he was good.

[capetown99]

Im not on here to bash LBJ. I know what his contribution was in 64/65. "His entire legislative agenda was stalled in Congress at the time of his death, going nowhere" Was that JFKs fault or a lethargic Congress? He stood up to US Steel to lower their prices in 62. Civil Rights act was his idea. Test Ban Treaty. Save the world and get himself shot-I dont think so.

[Jellolion1]

@capetown99 civil rights act was JFK's idea? Now there's a laugh!!

[norr4636]

@Jellolion1 JFK proposed the sent the Civil Rights Act to congress...and in fact...it was in committe the day he was KILLED.

[Jellolion1]

@norr4636 I am not quibbling with the facts. The real meat of the civil rights act was put in when the bill was in committee, and it was pushed through by LBJ. JFK was resistant to civil rights legislation. Civil rights was a passion, on of the top priorities, along with ending poverty, for LBJ.

[ironicxox]

@proferic hahahahaha, good one. :)

[keikoreo]

@capetown99 In America, there seems to be cyclical backlashes against the Kennedys every couple of years. Part of it is due to the number of 'expose-style' books that are churned out like clockwork. I think that there are also a lot of people who would rather dismiss his presidency rather than give him credit for anything substantial. It is easier to just call him a drug-using playboy who got shot than recognize his achievements. He was a great President during a crucial time in America.

[capetown99]

I think so too. There were other great Presidents before him and he was'nt perfect but who is in public life? His duration in office was very short so thats important in my book. I guess in the same way that people admire someone others have to try and destroy their character and thats freedom of speech which John Kennedy himself would have upheld anyway even though the attacks were against him.

[Jellolion1]

@jayteso the guts of the civil rights act were created in committee, after JFK was already dead. The biggest influence on the bill and the person chaperoning the bill through congress-LBJ!!

[ironicxox]

@Jellolion1 That's not actually true. There are many, many sources which say that what passed was already written by JFK and his administration and LBJ passed virtually the same thing. Republican congressman Charles Halleck said, "The assassination made no difference. The program was already made." And Dem congressman Carl Albert said, "The pressure behind the program had become so great that it would have been adopted in essentially the same form whether Kennedy lived or died."

[Jellolion1]

@ironicxox the meat of the civil rights act was written in committee in 1964. It would have been in the same form whether JFK lived or died, because JFK had little to do with the specifics of the bill. JFK was a freshman senator with little experience when his daddy made him president.

[Jellolion1]

@ironicxox you obviously have no idea about the process of how bills are written,and modified as they move through congress. JFK was not alive. How could he have "written the bill"? He may have written a few paragraphs, but the bulk was written in committee, under close watch by LBJ, a person who knew very well how to get what he wanted written into law, unlike the fresshman JFK.

[Jellolion1]

@jayteso what a crock of shit.

[Jellolion1]

Respond to this video...yeah right. The entire great society program was in honor of JFK? Bullshit! LBJ had a good 30 years experience in congress before becoming vice president. LBJ knew how to get bills through congress. He knew all the players, and he knew how to play them. What was JFK's experience? He was a party boy. He had no experience, just a very rich daddy.

[Jellolion1]

@capetown99 how could laws be "implemented" by JFK after he was already dead? Did he implement them from the grave? The meat of the 1964 civil rights act was written in committee, during 1964. LBJ was passionate about the Great Society, helping poor people, and civil rights. JFK was passionate about having naked parties in the white house, running around with animal masks on, swimming pool orgies. If JFK wasnt asassinated, he wouldnt have had a second term anyways.

[dannyd1572]

One thing about JFK's death that still amazes me; its been nearly 50 years and no one has talked. If it was a mob hit, by now someone would have turned. Someone would have talked. There is no doubt that when you involve a massive amount of people in a plot, one will talk sooner or later. The more time goes on, the more it makes us wonder.

[proferic]

@dannyd1572 Not the mob. It was one guy, one gun, three bullets. End of story.

[dannyd1572]

Ok...

[norr4636]

@dannyd1572 Please google the book Someone would've Talked, I forgot the author's name but it will show how LBJ manipulated the cover-up with J. Edgar Hoover and how Warran Commissioners(two) didn't agree with the final report. Boggs(Plane went missing in '72) Plane and Boggs never found.

[dannyd1572]

Ok..I'll check that out. LBJ wanted him dead..that's no doubt and all signs point to him being a major part of it...all the way down to choosing the Warren Commission. He chose this one guy he thought would fit because he said he was dumb and couldn't chew gum and walk at the same time...it Gerald Ford. It will be interesting to see how much more comes out in the near future from the assasination archives.

[daGr8Satan]

@dannyd1572 Explain to me why LBJ would go through all the trouble to be a part of an assassination plot to seize power from Kennedy only to later on NOT seek reelection.

[dannyd1572]

You bet. Lyndon always wanted to be President. He was getting old and his chance of being Pres. was slipping away as a VP. It was also well known that during the election in 1964 Kennedy was going to drop him from the ticket. LBJ did not run anymore because he knew Bobby Kennedy would trounce on him in the polls. LBJ still believed in winning Nam, where Kennedy wanted out, which is what the people wanted. His health was also terrible. He had angina problems.

[Jellolion1]

@dannyd1572 Kennedy wanted out f Vietnam? Now thats a crock. He spent most of 1963 planning the assasination of Diem so the US could take over running the war. He said in his last interview with Cronkite that leaving Vietnam would be a mistake. Kennedy's health was terrible. He wouldnt have survived a second term anyways.

[dannyd1572]

@Jellolion1 -He wouldn't have survived another term. Correct. However, Kennedy had planned to overthrow Diem and his brother to install another US Friendly puppet government. Diem could no longer be trusted. He said at that time of the Cronkite interview it would be a mistake..true. He had planned to withdraw by the end of his first term.

[Jellolion1]

@dannyd1572 JFK planned to withdraw? Yeah right. Nobody WANTED a protracted expensive war of attrition in asia that would destroy vietnam, Laos, cambodia, and almost the US.  JFK never saw the shitstorm that ensued after his assasination of Diem, one of the worst screwups in the history of this country, leading to 10 years of war and millions dead. Of course JFK wanted to withdraw. LBJ never wanted war either. Nixon wanted to withdraw. Its the details that get in the way. JFK wanted to withdraw

[Jellolion1]

@dannyd1572 Kennedy assasinated Diem so the US could take over and expand the war. He though that once the US applied their military might, the war would be over in a few months, AND...the US would withraw, VICTORIOUSLY. Oh how naive he was. LBJ was totally opposed to the assasination, and as recordings have shown, he knew well what would happen after the US went into Vietnam. And he knew that if he didnt go, the right wing republicans would skewer him in the next election for "losing" Vietnam

[Jellolion1]

@dannyd1572 you should write a book- "dannyd's redneck version of american history." Diem couldnt be trusted? Trusted to do what? Betray his country and do what was thought to be best for the US? By bringing his country into a massive ground war with the North, and killing millions of his people and wrecking the country? Yeah, Diem couldnt be trusted. Anybody that could be "trusted" was a scoundrel.

[Jellolion1]

@dannyd1572 LBJ had health problems almost his entire adult life.

[dannyd1572]

@Jellolion1 and your point is?

[Jellolion1]

@daGr8Satan oh, that little detail. How could you bring up that little detail?

[Jellolion1]

@dannyd1572 you are a real bastard, arent you? One things for sure, Gerald Ford certainly had a lot more on the ball than YOU!!!

[dannyd1572]

@Jellolion1 Now your comparing me to Gerald Ford? LOL

[dannyd1572]

@Jellolion1 You need to go read Path To Power and come back to this posting with a different education on matters you are unfamiliar with.

[Jellolion1]

@dannyd1572 read it. LBJ had ambition. There isnt anybody in politics that doesnt have ambition, but that doesnt take away from the fact that he accomplished more than any other president in modern times, on the front of civil rights, raising the lot of the poor, opening educational opportunities to the poor, in in general raising the standard of living of the US.

[dannyd1572]

@Jellolion1 Yeah...I know. Thats why he's my favorite President along with Clinton. LBJ's Great Society was shaped after Roosevelts New Deal and it had good intentions. Don't let REpublicans tell you different. LBJ was the Master Of The Senate (another good book). People should go back and rediscover LBJ and how he helped this nation. LBJ got things done. LBJ got Kennedy done too.

[ironicxox]

@dannyd1572 Someone who worked for Nixon, one of his "plumbers" and a main watergate player, admitted right before his death in 2007 that he was involved in a conspiracy to assassinate JFK. E. Howard Hunt. I'm honestly not sure why this hasn't received more attention, and because of this I don't think anyone has significantly looked into whether it's true or not, but it's still very interesting.

[dannyd1572]

@ironicxox There are so many things out there that point to conspracy. The only thing about finding out the truth is that its like beating a dead horse. No one wants to listen or bring it up again. Its old news. No politican is going to talk about bringing it back up for investigation. It won't get any ground in the media because people have been so inundated with conspiracy theories over the years, they don't care...which is what the gov. wanted. Confuse the public so they won't care.

[dannyd1572]

Absolutely hated him. Didn't want him on the ticket. Neither did JFK but they needed Texas to win the election. They were going to drop LBJ in the next election. He knew that and as a result...things didn't go to well for JFK.

[lilkumarjones]

@lostkid19

You're a lost kid.

nuff said.

[dannyd1572]

Bobby doesn't sound to enthused to talk to his Brother's murderer does he?

[proferic]

@dannyd1572 that's bullshit!!

[norr4636]

@proferic I have to disagree with one aspect of the Killing of the President(JFK), I'm really concern about all the killings of people who were involved someway with Dallas 11/22/63 including mob figures, CIA operatives (Morales,Johnny Rosseli, who were called before the HSCA. Please don't tell me it was just fate....They were kill for a reason.

[dannyd1572]

I think LBJ was one of the greatest presidents of our time and as time passes his importance will be more known. However, if you've read anything about the assisnation you would see how many signs point to Johnson, big oil, and hoover.

[Jellolion1]

@dannyd1572 Johnson and Hoover assainated JFK??? You dont have a shred of evidence. Thats a laugh, Hoover assasinating JFK. Hoover took care of people in other ways, with information. He was not a person to assasinate people. You are so FAR off the mark.

[dannyd1572]

@Jellolion1 everyone is ok?

[Jellolion1]

@dannyd1572 you are a simpleton loser.

[Jellolion1]

@dannyd1572 thats how RFK always talked. This was in the during the 1964 election season, and LBJ was going all out to help RFK get elected.

[dannyd1572]

@Jellolion1 WOW! Anyone who knows about Johnson, the 60's or even this era, knows Johnson was not supportive of Kennedy. I've been a Johnson fan for years and I would love to be able to say that he supported RFK. He did not. THus, his withdraw. He knew that Bobby would beat him for the ticket. He didn't want to ousted by 1) a Kennedy and 2) a member of his own party running against him. Thats unheard of.

[Jellolion1]

@dannyd1572 read a book , dude. LBJ made great efforts to help RFK get elected to the Senate.

[dannyd1572]

@Jellolion1 Name the book. I'd like to see it.

[Jellolion1]

@dannyd1572 Reaching for Glory: LBJ's Secret Whitehouse Tapes. Thats where this was plagiarized from. But in that document, they give an accurate description of the nature of the phone call, and it is as I have already described. Now go "check it out", dimwit.

[Jellolion1]

@dannyd1572 your ignorance is showing. Go back and read the history of LBJ in 1964. This phone conversation took place in New York, right after LBJ made a pitch for RFK. Hence the reason for the phone call. LBJis telling RFK about how many people were present, and their enthusuasm for his speech, his speech supporting RFK. Unheard of my ass.

[steveforsane]

Tricky Dick that crook, sabotaged the Vietnam peace talks...you could say he betrayed his country..Johnson was about to sign an agreement until good Dick intervered with Thieu! Johnson did much more for our country than the the asshole eleits and Tricky Dick Nixon Reps ever did!!!

[dannyd1572]

Amen!

[Jellolion1]

stupid shit. thats how he talked. He always sounded like that.

[MsSunlover]

yes i love these tapes as well. johnson and j edgar hated bobby k

[Jellolion1]

@MsSunlover Ummm , well actually, lbj and hoover were not in the minority in hating RFK. If you actually look at RFK's record prior to becoming a peacenik in order to win the 1968 pres election, he really was a little bastard. He was so fixated on weird covert action plots to kill castro. He had a hot temper. He even went after Gore Vidal because he thought Gore was too close to Jackie, Gore's lifelong friend, and distant relative. Not to mention the fact that Gore is gay.

[Jellolion1]

@Jellolion1 who was RFK's children's godfather? Joe McCarthy. Look at the old clips of McCarthy's congressional attacks. Who is sitting behind him, smiling? His legal advisor, RFK. The height of nepotism, JFK making RFK attorney general. RFK was generally a prick, by all definitions of the word.

[150133]

murderer....

[themeaningoflife38]

There is an interview with RFK where he talks about J Edgar Hoover telling him that his brother was just murdered.RFK said "I think he enjoyed telling me".

[pat442389]

yeah i thought that was stunning, i love these old tapes esp the ones with bobby because hes very candid with what he says and thinks. theres no doubt in my mind he thought the whole group of hoover LBJ nixon bush sr allen dullas and all those assholes had something to do with his brothers death and most likely his 2

[themeaningoflife38]

there is video of 3 CIA agents leaving the scene of RFK's murder.One of them was David Morales who hated both Kennedys and later bragged that he was in Dallas when JFK was killed and that "we took care of the other one in 68".Morales was set to testify at the HSCA when he suddenly died after visiting Washington.

[Jellolion1]

Yes! Hoover, Nixon, LBJ Dulles, , Democrats, Republicans, they all got together and planned a fullproof plot, and a flawless execution of the plan. Replicans and Democrats working together, pull off the crime of the century, and plan and work things out so perfectly, that the details never ever come to the surface for the rest of eternity. If only democrats and republicans really could work so well together.

[clayp72]

You know it just chapped Bobby's a** to have to call Johnson at all, much less call him "Mr. President".

[themeaningoflife38]

yeah he knew LBJ had his brother killed and in the final months of his presidency he had RFK killed as well.

[clayp72]

You know it was all Bobby could do not to stab Johnson to death every time they met. There are several photos where you can see Bobby's eyes just cut Johnson in half.

[Jellolion1]

what about all the recorded phone conversations? just because you see a phote with a strange expression on rfk, you have to imagine all these plots? RFK was a political opportunist, just as LBJ was. Thats what was between them. Other than that, they were quite civil to each other.

[clayp72]

Those that knew both Johnson and the Kennedys have said they despised eachother.

[Jellolion1]

complete bullshit. LBJ had already pulled himself out of the election. what was the motivation? LBJ was no murderer.

[themeaningoflife38]

to prevent RFK from becoming President and doing a real investigation of his brother's death. LBJ was a piece of shit and 3 CIA agents are caught on film at the scene of RFK's murder

[Jellolion1]

rfk knew how his bother died. Operation Mongoose. RFK hired the thugs himself.

LBJ had already resigned. Why would he care about RFK becoming president? LBJ campaigned for RFK's senate race too. Why would he do that?

[Jellolion1]

you dont know what you are talking about. They werent CIA. They were military intelligence. You are just a parrot. A sheep.

[themeaningoflife38]

David Morales was CIA he was there with two other agents.

Anyone can search it on youtube and see the film. 3 CIA AGENTS

Sorry fox news you lose

[Jellolion1]

watch?v=2W6Iue310hs

Morales?? "Noooo, thats not him at all. That is a security guard for Kennedy. And thats just another shot of the same person. No that doesnt look like him at all". You lose, mr overactive imagination.

[lumpagogo]

JFK

MLK

RFK

Johnson was either VP or Pres--it's just too much of a coincidence. RFK either had a death wish or was the most obtuse individ on the planet. He had two clear examples yet sallied forth anyway. Did he not comprehend the simple fact that his enemies meant business?

[Jellolion1]

coincidence? What are you talking about?? LBJ became president in 1963 because he was the vice president. In 1964 he won by the largest landslide election in history. He was planning to resign in 1964. He had his resignation letter written. LBJ had the personality of an old lady. It is very difficult to imagine him as a killer. But then you guys dont know shit about LBJ. You just pull this stuff out of your ass.

[lumpagogo]

Hi Jelly:

You might want to get a copy of "The Texas Connection" by Craig Zirbel. You'll find that "Lying Lyndon" was anything but a harmless "old lady." Your shilling for this man with no conscience is most disconcerting.

[Jellolion1]

shilling with no conscience. what bullshit! I know this is a man who had a vision for a better america, and he carried it out. He made more lasting improvements in this country than any other president in history. More than FDR. LBJ saved this country. Without LBJ, we probably would have tore ourselves apart with race riots. Tell me I dont have a conscience?? Ha. You are accusing somebody of murdr without a shred of evidence. I am still waiting for somebody to give me a shred of evidence.

[Jellolion1]

I have listened to every single one of these recordings. There is nothing here that makes him look anything like a murderer. If anything, it makes him look overly sentimental, too emotional and soft. Nobody has shown me a shred of evidence yet. Just one little piece of solid evidence??? Where is it?? I dont want to hear what somebody thinks, sombodies conspiracy theories. This is a man who recorded every single phone conversation, then had them transcribed.

[lumpagogo]

Oh, Jelli:

When you accused RFK of planning the murder of JFK, it uh, didn't augment your credibility. No, it dih-hintt...... As to why you

remain an LBJ-a-holic, who know?

LBJ will always rank as our premier war criminal but you already knew that, Jelloi.

[Jellolion1]

you never heard of operation mongoose? RFK was running it. It employed all of the right wing cubans whose names all came up in the JFK assasination investigation. You dont know this?? Geez. This is very basic stuff about the assasination, and I am not even a conspiracy buff. It says a lot for your credibility that you are unaware of the most basic details of the JFK assasination.

[Jellolion1]

oh, lumpy, I know that every other person on here that knows anything about the JFK assasination knows very well the details of operation mongoose, the fact that it was set up and run by RFK, and employed all the right wing cubans who came up in the JFK assasination investigation. The fact you are cluless about this information shows you know nothing about what you are trying to talk about. You are a joke. You are clueless with a big mouth.

[lumpagogo]

Jelli, you've already changed your wording about RFK and Op/Mongoose---did you think no one would notice? Yes, JFK was no saint but he never promised not to send 500,000 American troops "to fight in an Asian War." You're happiest when you adopt the ad hominem form of argumentation so this discussion is now concluded. "Time's yours" for a final tirade.

[Jellolion1]

I changed my wording about operation mongoose? Lets see, I mentioned it once, so how is it possible to change the wording??? You must be the smartest boy in your class. JFK said we were winning the war, and the troops could come home before 1965. Hows that for honesty?

[Jellolion1]

and if LBJ is a war criminal, so is JFK, Eisenhower and Truman, as well as Nixon. Ever read the pentagon papers? I didnt think so. There was no deviation from the vietnam policy since the 50's. As soon as JFK got into office, he broke the 1954 UN mandate calling for no more than 300 US advisors. By 1963, he had 18000, and he planned and carried out the coup against the president of vietnam that resulted in their death. He broke a lot of laws doing that, thas for sure.

[lilkumarjones]

You are wasting your time arguing with this Jello boy over there. Don't try. He's an idiot. He has gone to EVERY Kennedy video and just blasted the Kennedys. The fact that he thinks LBJ did more for America than any other President is where the conversation ends. Just don't bother.

[lumpagogo]

jones is true on this. LBJ has a few apologists such as that oddball female who writes lots of books about former POTUS but she and these other pro-LBJ space cadets such as "Jelly Boy" have zero believability. LBJ was even more intrinsically malicious than Ronald Reagan, which is saying a lot.

[steveforsane]

Explain exasctly where is your evidence???????? Listen in all of the time Kennedys were in the WH..name 3 legislative accomplishment???? John Kennedy was concerned about two things...his reelection and womanizing! You have been schooled! Johnson in one year, passed Civil rights legislation, Madeical, educational reform, conservation laws...the lsi tgoes..we need more presidents like Lyndon Johnson, for the people...Kennedy layed the groundwork which entraped Johnson in Vietnam.

[lumpagogo]

The record shows that:

1. LBJ was worth a net $14,000,000 upon leaving office of POTUS, having started at less than a $500,000 pocketbook in 1963.

2. LBJ , Teddy Kennedy, others engineered the 1965 Immigration Reform Act which ushered in a new, masochistic influx from which we will never recover, + which only gets worse every day 46 years later.

3. LBJ's personal life as a shrewd criminal + murderer has been documented by Craig Zirbel + many other credible sources.

[proferic]

@lilkumarjones I love the Kennedys, but I would agree that LBJ was a much better president than JFK. No offense or trying to start an argument.

[keikoreo]

I have to disagree with you. I don't think LBJ was a bad President, but I'm assuming your reasons for favoring him have more to do with the Great Society programs and less to do with Vietnam. He was a great Senate Majority Leader who knew how to get legislation through Congress (Someone we could really use today, actually). But he was not a good foreign policy president. He did not understand the war in Vietnam and he left the country in considerable chaos in '69.

[proferic]

@keikoreo Johnson didn't have JFK's vision, but he knew how to get things done. He got JFK's stalled legislative program through Congress. True, he screwed up with Vietnam. But, I don't think Kennedy would have pulled out either. He did not want the blame for being the first president to "lose" a war. From a historical perspective, fate blessed JFK by making him a mayrter (sp).

[keikoreo]

The reason WHY LBJ was able to pass his Great Society programs was in 1964 the Democrats won an additional 36 seats in the House, giving LBJ a 2/3's majority. This allowed LBJ to bypass the Southern Democrats who stalled JFK's New Frontier and Civil Rights legislation. When LBJ lost 48 House seats in 1966, that was the end of any additional Great Society legislation getting passed. If JFK had had a 2/3's majority in 1963, he would have passed just as much legislation as Johnson.

[proferic]

@keikoreo I agree with you as far as JFK being a great guy, but he was no LBJ as far as legislative skill. JFK didn't know how to give the "Johnson treatment". In fact, LBJ never met once with JFK privately when he was majority leader because he thought Kennedy was such a lightweight.

[jayteso]

again LBJ didn't create those civil right laws JFK did they only passed so quickly because they were in honor of JFK everyone knew it was him not LBJ you fucking moron

[proferic]

@jayteso When people start using personal attacks, that usually means they are losing on the issues.

[norr4636]

@proferic LBJ didn't think Jack Kennedy was going to win the '60 nomination....BOY was he surprise. But you are correct

[proferic]

@keikoreo I think that perhaps your'e a little blinded by rhe Kennedy charisma and glamour. Really, the only think Kennedy did (aside from saving the world during the Cuan Missle Crisis) was get himself shot.

[keikoreo]

You response sadly lacks in maturity yet exceeds in erroneous information. LBJ did meet with JFK privately when he was majority leader. He met with every new senator in the Democratic party as majority leader; part of the 'Johnson treatment' was to meet people to figure out how to play them. LBJ did think JFK was a lightweight, which is why he lost at the 1960 DNC. And maybe you've heard of the Peace Corps, Civil Rights Bill, Nuclear Test Ban Treaty & the Apollo Program--all were started by JFK.

[jayteso]

all those civil rights laws were originated by kennedy you fucking moron

[proferic]

@jayteso They were originate by Kennedy, but he couldn't get them passed. His entire legislative agenda was stalled in Congress at the time of his death, going nowhere. Look it up if you don't believe me.

[jayteso]

thats not true at all you moron kennedy had the same support he wasn't even in there a full term he didn't have time to get it passes plus they passes quickly with LBJ because people knew it was in honor of kennedy and they knew it would've looked bad politically if they were anti kennedy in voting against his legislation you don't know politics trust me you don't i know you think you do and still will but you simply don't so just end it at that i let you off easy consider yourself lucky

[proferic]

@jayteso I know more about politics when I'm sleeping than you ever will. I teach the stuf as well as run campaigns. I don't need some little Youtube whackjob telling like you telling me what they obviously know nothing about. *lol*

[jayteso]

yea im sure you do you pathetic fucking liar

[proferic]

@jayteso *this is like arguing with a fencepost* OK, we're done!