LIke the pre-supposition of a god and that Jesus was its son? I just want a little bit of that "avalanche of evidence" and I need a bit more than an empty tomb found by women which if accepted would prove that there was an empty tomb and nothing more.
I find it really hard to believe Strobel is a "former atheist" and journalist. He relies on some of the most flimsy and tainted evidence. For example, he never addresses the question of why there is not a single Greek or Roman mention of Jesus of any kind in the 1st century. Zip. Only bible sources, which is circular attestation (except for Jewish Josephus, who is considered a possible forgery).
@paulinator61 Actually ther are non-Christian historians like Josephus, Tacitus, Pliny the Younger &other who do mention Jesus in their writing. Not only that, their writing are as early as the early 2nd century, & they mention things about Jesus that's consistent with the gospel concerning that they were hostile towards Christians.
@bigmike5989 you are correct. I would like to point out further that although Josephus mentioned Jesus, later christian scribes altered his work and had him say that Jesus was the messiah, and performed miracles. If he believed these, he would've been Christian.
Can you do another one on how all sickness and disease is caused by demons and evil spirits? The stupid ignorant scientists and atheists actually think it's caused by genetics and viruses etc.. Can you believe that?
@thekatiejones9 Regardless of whether others believe they have had life-altering experiences or not – or whether my faith is indeed real or not – there is truth and untruth. The brain may give one a false sense of security, but ultimately we must answer the tough questions and grapple with serious issues. The metaphysical questions are the toughest – but this does not negate their value, in fact, I believe, it makes them less ignorable.
@thekatiejones9 We either believe in a supernatural being that created all things ex nihilo or not – it is whether one believes in this or not that will lead to different conclusions on miracles and as to whether the world is in a fallen state. As a Christian, one can accept the idea of a fallen world because humankind has willingly rebelled God's rule.
@thekatiejones9 You complain about his 'presuppositions' concerning miracles, and yet do you not deny that in the process you have accepted an a priori metaphysical prejudice? While accepting the wonderful natural processes of nature, and enjoying the benefits that science can bring in terms of understanding this, there are metaphysical questions that can be answered either one way or another …
@thekatiejones9 Where are you getting your information from? Even the most conservative estimates put the authorship of the Gospel of John circa 1st century AD – probably around 96 AD. (Beasley-Murray, Word Biblical Commentary Vol. 36, John, lxxvii - wrote that 90-100 CE 'is, indeed, favoured by most Johannine scholars'). This is thought comparably late compared to the synoptic gospels.
Funny how he makes the point that the Gospel of Judas was written 150 years later. Wasn't the Gospel of John written roughly that many years later as well? Why was it canonized then? I guess the council thought it fit their image of who they want Jesus to be a little better. Also, he complains about secular presuppositions that miracles are not possible. What I think is far worse is the presupposition that they are as well as the presupposition that we live in a "fallen world."
claiming false things, the bible no way if it says that saintly zombies got out of there graves and walked around jerusalem i believe it. wait a minute saints? there was no saints when this was written. OMG i,ve been conned NOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!!!!!!!
@SuperLoveofGod a personal experience is not evidence i,m afraid. its been proved that people can have the same effect at rock concerts when they see there heros, or going further back hitler supporters claim similar experiences whilst listening to a speech of his. ps lee strobel is a scumbag liar.
To everyone who does not believe that God is real, or that Jesus is the Son of God who was crucified, died, buried and rose for our sins..how do u
explain the filling of the holy spirit that Christians TODAY as myself have experienced and that is recorded in the bible? I received this gift over 10 years ago, the fact that I prayed to God for that gift and immediately began speaking in tounges in evidence! ACTS 2:4
@SuperLoveofGod This is not evidence. This is explained by psychology. Please consider that people of other faiths who believe in different gods from you have also had life-altering conversion experiences. How did they have the same experience with a different god? I assume you'd chalk their experiences up to psychological reasons, but you would never ascribe the same reasoning to yourself.
Delusion and wishful thinking. This guy should listen to Dr Bart Ehrman. The gospels were largely made up. Story telling and hearsay over many, many decades. The disciples didn't write down anything - they couldn't read or write.
Accurately recorded? Questionable. Easy example: Read Mark & John's account of Jesus’ death, and make a list of everything that happened in both and compare your list. You will find that there are stunning differences. In fact there are discrepancies. If these writers were accurate, why are there so many discrepancies in two out of the four Gospels? I’m a Christian, but to claim accuracy is questionable.
@JLeeHaven First you have to understand some histrory, John decided to write his gosple after reading the other 3 becaues of what they left out, if you understood this, you would understand why Johns gosple is so different then the other 3.
The authors of the four Gospels were not eyewitnesses. They are Greek speaking Christians living 35-65 years after the fact. They are telling stories that Christians had been telling during all those years. There was nobody there at the time of Jesus’ death taking notes. Some of the stories were invented, and many were changed. For this reason these accounts are not as useful as historians would like, as historical sources.
Writers approved stories sometimes, and they changed the stories sometimes. The stories got modified in the process of transmission over the course of decades before anybody wrote them stories down. These stories are based on oral reports that have been in circulation for decades. What happens to oral reports in circulation year after year, decade after decade, they get changed. What evidence do we have that the stories about the Jesus’ death and the resurrection got changed? Read Mark & John.
@jettrink60 Turd? Do you know him personally? Just because you are not willing to accept the reality of Christianity, do not dish out insults Jettrin, What do you know about science? Are you qualified to make any remarks?
Sorry to tell all you bible humping sub humans, but 6/7th of the world don't give a fuck about your primitive book. Its the 21st century, go learn something and contribute to humanity. LOL idiots.
We do contribute to humanity. Through the truth of the gospel God uses us, idiots, to rescue alcoholics, drug addicts, lonely and miserable professional and "successful" men and women God totally transforming their lives and families. I am thinking of this particular man an alcoholic whom God recently (6 months ago) put in my path, he surrendered to Jesus, Jesus took all the alcoholism cravings away. His mind healed, Marriage saved, , How's that 4 contributing to humanity?
@Eternitypraise Not really, people that think they are transformed by "jesus" are even more ignorant. When corporations, elites, banks, etc waste the labors of the people by misappropriating resources and these "transformed" people have their backs against the walls because their labor value is worth less and less.......they turn to "jesus" "god" in vain, because the magic guy in the sky isn't going to teach them how to maneuver in the cut throat economic system we are in.....cont.....
@MonkeySpecs301 Monkey, I can understand your plight, you can't see it because your eyes are veiled so even If I said something really great in response to you, your heart and emotions are invested totally in your views. We Christians who by the way, live a totally different reality to yours have an ongoing relationship with Jesus Christ. In my case, My 4 year old was diagnosed with a cognitive impairment to never be able to talk properly...
@MonkeySpecs301 ...I prayed, believed and received the miracle for my girl, this is what I prayed: "That she might surpass her pears in the very area the experts said she was lacking, that she may bet the highest marks in that very area, that she might be gifted in music and able to talk perfectly" God gave us exactly what we asked. Me? I have received miracles all my life too many to count but one day I pray you will be the one testifying "Jesus Saved me, and heal my life" :-)
@Eternitypraise ....what are they to do then? I am trying to show that religion gets in the way, why do i need to ask "jesus" to show me the way to feed my family? I'll just go out networking, do research, obtain new skills, be wise with my finance...etc. If it only took "jesus" to rid him of his addiction, I can guarantee he hasn't tried to reach his potential in his life, he was stimulated enough, or else he would have realize his issue was obstructing his personal growth.
@Eternitypraise When you give credit to "jesus" for some little "solution" it is your ego that wants to give merit to your beliefs. Makes sense? People are better off knowing what is innately common in us, by doing so we create communion with all humanity. When you put the name "christianity" you automatically are prejudice to all other beliefs.....instead of seeing what is common in all the mythologies and archytypes within our human spirit, your chrisitian non sense claims......cont.....
@Eternitypraise ....to be the absolute belief system. Your patient is now gonna go spewing "jesus saved me jesus saved me"....so degrading, and so much disregard for the rest of humanity who's path to enlightenment will probably not involve jesus. So arrogant and egotistic to think your "god" is the one and only method for spiritual ascension. Please dude, go read some Joseph Campbell or Carl Jung, and begin to think holistically. You are just dong patch work not transformation.
only in the last few years has the jewish state actually investigated if the biblical stories have any archaeological evidence to back them up so as to factually and politically statisfy everyone to their political rigt to the land. So they had every reason to want to confirm it. What they found . . . NOTHING .
@scandalasdog Hey Dog, are you sure? What is the extent of your investigation? The man above, Lee Strobel, was totally against Christianity, He, as a journalist was set out to prove Christianity wrong, only to find himself falling in love with the God he was trying to prove wrong. Now this is a man with an intellectual background, yet he had to bow to Jesus Christ, I hope one day you do the same my friend.
@TheDarvus That so? Isn't your fallacious claim desparate? By equating Paul with Josephus, you're showing a lack of investigation. Paul was clearly known as a fervent Christian, Josephus was clearly a fervent Jew. I own the works of Josephus, he's clearly not Christian. Do a bit more research into the evidence for Paul.
"Some of the more convincing evidence for the Apostle Paul's existence is found in the following ancient literature. Clement of Rome cites Paul in his letter to the church at Corinth (c. 95 C.E.). Irenaeus (140-202 C.E.) cites Paul in his work "Against Heresies." There is also a description of Paul's physical appearance in the apocryphal work "Acts of Paul and Thecla."" There are many others. Merely because you do not believe there are evidence does not mean there are none.
@TheDarvus I said that Paul is a proven historical figure. That no historians doubt that. None, zip, zero, zilch - the only ones that ever did died in 1957. They are as dead as your thesis. Paul was very real, what you do with that knowledge is up to you.
@TheDarvus you could try reading Strobel's book if you doubt Mathew, Mark, Luke, and John. You sure love trolling his videos. Try reading one of his books. Your bound to learn something.
@TheDarvus I never said source Q was evidence for Paul. Where did you get that from? Source Q isnt even known to exist. Source Q is simply a theory of some that isnt supported at all. I mentioned source Q in response to what you said about Higher Critical Scholarship.
However, if you right... and source Q doesn't exist. Than that leaves us with the historically accepted authors of Mathew, Mark, Luke, and John as having written the gospels. Alright, I knew you'd come around eventually!
@TheDarvus Then how did they come up with source "Q" Source "Q" is not in the Bible. Higher Critical Scholarship looked at possible authorship and concluded that the historical Paul wrote the letters. It is the only plausable explanation. Don't be a fool, examine the evidence and acquire knowledge. You can do it!
@TheDarvus sure he does, you can't name a single historian that doubts he existed. just you! and you are alone in your theory. Higher Critical Scholarshp examines who the authors were. They call into question the apocrapha books and can even confirm the authors weren't who they claimed to be, which is why they were never included in the Bible. These same scholars, using the same method that you were applauding earlier - confirm Paul as the only possible author. Humbler... for the win!
@TheDarvus they say that Paul wrote the letters without mentioning any other possibiblity because there isn't any other possibility. There would be no reason for them to mention Josephus by name as not having written them because there is zero evidence that anybody other than the historical Paul wrote them. No need to mention by name the other billions of people who didn't write it.
I'm glad you've come to the conclusion that authorship is not in question. We've come a long way.
@TheDarvus They confirm that it was not Josephus that wrote the letters, that it was truly Paul himself. As I've said and been backed up by historical documentation - the authorship is not in question, except by one person out of 6 billion - you!
@TheDarvus Actually it proves that you haven't even examined your own source to find the truth. Higher critical scholarship, of which you were singing the praises of.... actually agrees with me. You fail!
@TheDarvus what... your and idiot! you shouldn't say mean things about yourself.
The facts are that Higher Critical Scholarship confirms Paul as the author of his letters and Josephus is no where to be mentioned concerning authorship by any historian the world over. Paul wrote letters, not history books. Josephus may have been a pharisee, but don't you realize that he was not a Christian and had zero motivation for starting up churches or developing them. You fail... yet again.
@TheDarvus The fact that Paul was Pharisee makes it even stranger. Jewish people were so tied back then to their traditions and laws, that it would be very strange so suddenly they change any of it. And that is what happened. Question is what kind of event would make Jewish people do that.
@TheDarvus It is not strange Paul is not mentioned in historical records. In fact it is quite extraordinary that simple fishermen like apostles and carpenter like Jesus are mentioned by some historians. Simply in that times historians were interested only in kings, nobility, generals. You must also bear in mind Christianity in first 300 years was very underground. Someone to become Christian (get baptised) would require months of testing, proving. Foreign elements had no access there.
@TheDarvus No, haven't seen. Right now I'm looking at possible Hebrew new testament. Many scientists believe originally New Testament was written in Hebrew. Greek version has few errors because some letters were wrongly translated. But difference is subtle.
It is quite possible their names were different in Hebrew. It is quite common people there had two names, one Greek, one Hebrew. Also our spelling of foreign names are very skewed. (Herodotus is master of that)
@TheDarvus And, you know Jews have been passing law and commandments orally for many years. There were great number of rabbis who knew every word of Torah. So it shouldn't be any strange if apostles did that also. There are many things that have been left from apostles and early church like liturgy order, some hymns, customs, that are well preserved in Orthodox Church for this 2000 years.
@TheDarvus Even if that is the case. It is not hundreds of years.
I encourage you to compare that with the gap between event and writings on some other historical events from that times. Even later.
One example. Whole scientific theory about Slavs coming to Helm (Balkans) in 7th century is based on writings of Constantine Porphyrogenitos who lived in 10th century. That is three centuries.
Don't believe for a second Strobel was ever an atheist. A non-believer, maybe, but being an atheist requires analysis of religion and God...that would require intelligence, which Mr. Strobel is totally lacking.
Anyone with an average IQ can see how utterly ridiculous his circular arguments are. They amount to demonstrating an inference as 'true' by using evidence from the Bible, and then saying this proves the truth of...what's written in the Bible.
@Pepotamo1985 Last time i checked the deifintion of an atheist says one who doesnt belong to a religion. You said he was a non believer but not a atheist...so he doesnt have a religion so he was a atheist
@thelotrfan100 I should've been clearer, if only to cover my own back lest a pedantic nerd try and extort some kind of internet win out of me for a bit of personal validation.
What I meant was that I don't think he was ever a conscious non-believer, if indeed a non-believer at all. The fact that he apparently takes everything in the bible as literal truth is an indication he's never thought about it critically, which, for an apparent atheist who was also an investigative journalist, seems odd.
@Pepotamo1985 Your first assumption is that Apostles were liars, and that New Testament is a lie.
But, can you really think that they would be willing to suffer, to die by worst means (throwing into fire, hanging on the cross, eaten by lions...), if they spoke lies.
There is "negative" evidence about Jesus, from Talmud. They called him magician. Clearly they, who hated him most, were positive he performed miracles.
I recommend you read some critical studies of The Bible undertaken by Christians wishing to get a fuller understanding of it, who eventually found it impossible to reconcile their faith with their scholarship. It's littered with internal contradictions and obvious falsehoods, passages added hundreds of years after it was originally written and more which puts its veracity and inerrancy in to question. Add to this The Bible was written hundreds of years after the events it purports to describe.
@Pepotamo1985 Really? Hundreds of years later? If year 125 is hundreds of years from 33 then ok. Many scholars believe that Paul wrote between 35-38. Paul refers to testament he received. Wonder what that is? Apocalypse is written around 96. Are you sure you don't talk about KJV or some Joseph Smith bibles?
@Pepotamo1985 And proof that it is possible to reconcile faith with scholarship is Nicola Tesla. He was faithful Orthodox Christian.
Maybe there's something wrong with that 26 000 versions of faith you got there. They lost continuity with apostolic faith. You can read Bible all day long, but without presence of Holy Spirit, there's no faith.
Again, you're using The Bible to prove the truth of...what's written in The Bible. You have faith in something unprovable which cannot be believed by a thinking person, and modern science every day presents us with revelations that further refute the nonsense written within it.
@Pepotamo1985 Ha ha. Of course your presumption is that Bible is lesser valuable than other historical documents.
You can't compare historical method with proving scientific theories (like chemistry and physics). Simply it is matter of past, you can't bring it back. Many Historical events are proven on much less documents than ones about Christ, and still we accept it.
@jovanj777 Ah, you've just used a straw man argument - I didn't mention anything about miracles. The miracles actually being real events would not prove that The Bible was true in its totality or otherwise, nor that Jesus was the Son of God, nor that any of his teachings, or Biblical teachings are true.
I'd like to see some evidence for your second claim too. If God can heal the sick, why not heal sickness altogether? Why do severed limbs or digits never grow back?
@Pepotamo1985 There is example of severed limb going back. Of cancer going away.
And why God doesn't heal sickness? Because most people don't want to be healed. From the source of disease - passions. Imposing salvation to all would be violation against free will. God wants you to choose him by your own free will.
@netelsg The Kingdom of God was an earthly Kingdom that many Jews, including Jesus, thought would arrive during their lifetime. The Jews thought a warrior, or king, would initiate the Kingdom. That person was known as the Messiah in Hebrew, or Christ in Greek. The K.O.G. never arrived and it never will. Christianity is a bastardized version of the original apocalyptic Jewish cult.
How many copies of the book of Mormon would it take for you to believe it's all true? Quantity has nothing to do with it.
How many historic places and people does the Koran have to mention for you to believe Mohammad really spoke with an angel of God for his revelation - like it says? No number is good enough to prove that, is it?
Why would one assume Mark made up the woman finding the tomb story to convince people to believe & not for some other theological reason - a literary theme?
I believe in the romance of the three kingdoms that one general could fight against 10,000 soldiers, according to eyewitnesses. Strobel says the Bible is written over a long period of time based on eyewitnesses. What is the chance that these people told the true account of what they saw for that long period of time consistently? Chances are some were exaggerated or distorted or not true at all.
@candoyja what are the chances that people in 4 different places, over many many years, telling a story by word rather than by pen, stories first told by four different men, these 4 stories (as you say distorted and consistently changed) end up to be exactly, or 99% exactly the same?
@6MemoryOfForever9 You think that is good enough to believe in the existence of God? It is your call, man. There must have been a way for these people to write the same thing or the history as we know it is not correct. Something is up. I don't think it was God, though.
@candoyja haha this is not at all even 0.5% of why I believe in God... look, we are not as stupid as people try to make us look, ok? we have reasons to believe, maybe they are wrong, but even science with all its proof is wrong many many times. Just keep your mind open that maybe we have good reason to believe, and believe me, we do question life and our religion."you have to know your God before you can love Him!"I hope you find answers to your questions in life, and I hope you have a good one!
@dcderek24 thousands of miracles I have seen.... My aunt cured of cancer when she was supposed to die, my cousin's sister-in-law cured of an eye problem (incurable), personal miracles, my mom was told in a dream she will get married in 1 year and have a baby in three years... she did get married 1 year later, she went through depression because she couldn't conceive all the following year, then the third year she got her first child.
p.s. many of the cases we're medically IMPOSSIBLE, ...
@6MemoryOfForever9 ... not improbable or unknown, impossible.... like say, you can see without having a retina, it is impossible, yet you do.
2-my mom NEVER lies about this or any other thing of which I know, especially to me, so overlooking science, doctors, priests, pastors, etc.... my mom never lies....coincidence? maybe, but it's one hell of a coincidence..(p.s., it wasn't one dream btw.)
3-I don't really care whether you believe that or not, or what you think of it, so don't bother! bye
@6MemoryOfForever9 thats nice. studies on this subject have been done for years and prayer has had seemed to have no effect on patients terminally ill.
they divided people in 2 groups.
1 group theyd pray for them
2 they didnt
all terminally ill there has been about 50 studies on this . all of them come back with no positive results for prayer.
medically impossible? the body is designed to heal itself.
@dcderek24 Hello, actually prayer isnt to heal people. Its about hoping something. You know, sometimes christians say if its your will. god knows if they will live or die already. and even if they were to heal people. god would answer only the ones that have good reason
@dcderek24 There are countless cases of people being healed by prayer before icons in Christ or Saints. Orthodox world. You should travel to Russia, or Greece.
That prayer you speak about is questionable. First, not all prayers are same. Some people pray better, like monks who devote whole live to it. Second, prayer from person belonging to Catholic/Protestant sect is really not a prayer. Catholicism and all that followed is heresy, that doesn't belong to Christian church any more.
This is a quick summary of the Bible's reliability by a famous and well-respected idiot. And a lair too. Metzger did not tell him that the Gospels are based on eye-witness testimony, not is there any other evidence for a thing he says. I guess in Lee's Bible it says "Thou shalt Lie."
Perhaps the Biblical authors wanted to affect a change in the status of women in Jewish society?
Hilarious. Trust lawyers to ignore all the evidence. Ask any historian, the bible is just a collection of myths. A few bits are bound to be true, but it's full of contradictions, and is way off on many things.
@Ozzyman200 I am sure you can name "historians" and point out these "contradictions." Wait. No, I am not sure. Because "historians" who stand and say the Bible is a "myth" either ignore the evidence, or are biased. And these "contradictions" are simply not there.
No, that;s just what you've assumed because you are biased. Just because you personally don't know the contradictions, don't assume they don't exist. Read the bible for yourself with an open mind, do some research. Look at both sides.
@Ozzyman200 Biased like you?It never ceases to amaze me how someone who doubts the reliability of the Bible ( I say this because to date archaeologists have yet to disprove the Biblical accounts)refuses to show evidence that supports their claim, and goes directly to the "your biased, so it doesn't matter what I say" defense. It is better than the typical insult. Oh, and I have read and continuously read it.
"Biased like you?" Really? Are you 4? That was your best retort. Instead of petty insults, try to back up something you say with evidence or reasoning. The ball is in your court. Keep an open mind and do a little research. We are waiting for this evidence.
@Ozzyman200 Nay nay, sunshine. Because all the evidence I'll ever need to back up the Bible and my beliefs was handled by Lee Strobel himself. Try reading A Case For Faith and A Case For Christ. By the way, I'd like for you to point out any insulting remarks that I had made.
"Because all the evidence I'll ever need to back up the Bible and my beliefs was handled by Lee Strobel himself. "
Ah, now that is text book bias. The only evidence you have even considered comes from a theist, a glib lawyer. Broaden your horizon, read the bible for yourself, read the other side of the argument, read what a historian thinks instead. Educate yourself, think for yourself, don't just believe one guy. You have admitted your bias, that is a good first step.
@scrmngchicken403 Lee Strobel said certain things couldnt be made through evolution in the "Case for the Creator". This is the basis for his and Behe's "intelligent design" group. They went to court with this argument and were proven wrong. Watch "judgement day:intelligent design on trial'. Worse yet, the ID group was said to have testified inconsistantly or lied outright. There were calls to bring perjury charges against them. Lee's ideas were proven wrong in court, enough said.
@dutchpuppy2 Behe (representing the ID group) talks about the bacterial flagellum in Judgement Day: Intelligent Design on trial in #8...#9. Though I think you are missing a lot not to watch all 12 parts. Thanks for watching it and getting educated on the matter.
@scrmngchicken403 You seem to agree with Lee that the Gospels provide a historically accurate record. If this is the case then at the very least you would expect to be able to determine when Jesus was born. Are you able to do this so that you can identify the year of his birth (not looking for a full DoB) & point me at the chapters & verses which allow you to determine this basic fact?
If your personal moral law is defined by culture, then you are part of a cult. If your moral law is defined by objective truth (evidence external to your own imagination) AND your moral truth matches reality then you are not part of a cult. Historical Christianity is not a cult.
what is funny is that people don't see the tactic religious people use...they try to trick people into their cults, and through history and even today try to convert people out of fear, religions need to start keeping their poison to themselves, and stop Nazi style Brainwashing kids at a young age and wait till they are adults that would know better than to beleive in a scam, instead they are indoctrinated so early...It is sad, im lucky that i escaped religion, it is called becoming an adult
The Bible Proved INSPIRED? Through the Computer Analysis of Every Letter in the Original Hebrew TaNaKh and Greek NT!
And Through 24 Separate Evaluations of sets of WORDS and LETTERS Which Are All DIVISIBLE Evenly By SEVEN?
On the List are the Number of All Words, All Letters in the Vocabulary,Names of Men,Women,Words that begin with a Consonant ,Vowel, the Number of Nouns and Non Nouns,All will Divide Evenly by SEVEN and 16 Other Proofs of the Evaluation!
i can give a shit about what any bible says, it is not the word of god, nobody has talked to god, people have talked to themselves YES, but you cant talk to something that is not there, thats insanity, so shove your divinci code bullshit up your man pleaser
Copies of this Analysis have been sent to over 500 Centers for Agnostic and Atheistic beliefs including Universities and Centers of Learning conducted by Non-Christian Organizations!
The Challenge was Issued: "Disprove the Report and its data OR produce any other text written by men as the scribes,that will contain any of the same phenomena?"
No one has ever taken up that challenge, and they are still waiting after three years~
irrelevant when the gospels are assumed to be first written, because the first bibles or part of bibles we have are in ancient greek and are 4th century AD.... which doesnt give it any historical validity... unless u find the original scripts, then what does this argument prove?
All Other Writings Alleged to be "Additional" Scriptures, FAILED ON EVERY POSSIBLE PHENOMENA when Evaluated by the same criteria as the Tanakh and New Testament.
Such as the Quran, Book of Mormon, Pearl of Great Price, Doctrine, Covenants and Commandments of the Mormon Church, Jehovah's Witnesses and MANY, MANY, Others!
By adding the Apocryphal Books Not One of these Books contains even One of the Proofs of the Phenomena found in the Bible!
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The Gospels are all anonymous. They are not written by eye witnesses. They are Hearsay. Matthew and Luke used Mark as a template and edited Mark, added conflicting details, to make an improved fictional account. John doesn't agree in so many instances that it appears to be a story of another Jesus. The gospels were not written in Judea but in other countries. They were written in Greek. The Jews of Judea spoke Aramaic. The Gospels were written at least 40 years after the events.
Call me crazy but none of this really sounds so crazy or joke-like. This roughly 7.5 minute snippet doesn't say as much as Strobel's book, The Case for Christ, does. The first six chapters of his book were devoted to looking at the reliability of the new testament. I read the evidence. The evidence made sense to me. If anyone is judging Strobel based on this video without having looked into the book, I encourage you to check the book. Your acceptance or disbelief of the evidence is your choice.
@leetdahl i read the book, strobel is embarrassing, but not as embarrassing as the amount of people that take his word without doing their own research. christians should be investigating this so called "avalanche of evidence" for THEMSELVES, not taking as "gospel" what yet another book-seller tells them is the truth
@leetdahl i read strobels book and many of his debates. the guy is an idiot plain and simple.
he does not address the historical problems of the gospels. the contradictions and asserts josephus as a historical source for the divinity of christ. when everyone knows josephus is blatant known forgery even recognized by christian scholars. secondly he makes broad claims like "the fossil record doesnt support evolution" umm ok strobel, can you expalin a little more. he doesnt.
haha the n.t. is not reliable. that's a joke... the manuscripts changed all the way up to the 14th century. don't believe me? 1 John 5:7, it even says it in NKJV bibles that that verse wasn't in any greek manuscripts up to the 14th century... haha. woow.
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I think that we should all have access to whatever drug he is on because he is totally fucked up. I can't believe that he was an atheist and then bought this bull shit.
Strobel is slick, but full of bs. None of the verifications he mentions of the Gospels are real. His "research" consist of interviewing like minded Christian fundamentalists and presenting it as evidence.
The Gospels are fabricated docs created after Paul to put some meat on a struggling religion. None of the events are verified by contemporary witnesses.
Strobel shows his ignorance by referring to Gnostic's as 2 god believers. Wrong, those were Marcionites.
Perhaps your religion is causing you reading difficulty. I never used the term "fundy", you did. Bruce Metzker is dead so we cannot ask his opinion. My issue is with the character of Lee Strobel, (a mere fundy). He seem to break the 9th commandment a lot. You know, the one dealing with false witness.
I think Strobel will burn in hell. What do you think?
LIke the pre-supposition of a god and that Jesus was its son? I just want a little bit of that "avalanche of evidence" and I need a bit more than an empty tomb found by women which if accepted would prove that there was an empty tomb and nothing more.
csosa1978 3 hours ago
wow. if you read the bible and learn about it... no. eyewitnesses are discrepant and it depends on what book you read in it to see who did what when.
anyone who calls evolution 'Darwinism' and says they were atheists, they are lying.
This is a word not used by people who study it and know how it works (not 'believes' - understands) and want it to be another 'ism'
If you actually are looking to learn about the bible's historical basis, watch these.
watch?v=dtQ2TS1CiDY
kelbykross1 1 month ago
I find it really hard to believe Strobel is a "former atheist" and journalist. He relies on some of the most flimsy and tainted evidence. For example, he never addresses the question of why there is not a single Greek or Roman mention of Jesus of any kind in the 1st century. Zip. Only bible sources, which is circular attestation (except for Jewish Josephus, who is considered a possible forgery).
paulinator61 2 months ago
@paulinator61 Actually ther are non-Christian historians like Josephus, Tacitus, Pliny the Younger &other who do mention Jesus in their writing. Not only that, their writing are as early as the early 2nd century, & they mention things about Jesus that's consistent with the gospel concerning that they were hostile towards Christians.
bigmike5989 1 month ago in playlist case
@bigmike5989 you are correct. I would like to point out further that although Josephus mentioned Jesus, later christian scribes altered his work and had him say that Jesus was the messiah, and performed miracles. If he believed these, he would've been Christian.
kelbykross1 1 month ago
@kelbykross1 Some people assume that Josephus was a Christian because of the three lines that was inserted by the unknown Christian copyist.
bigmike5989 1 month ago
Nice vid on the bible's reliability, dude!
Can you do another one on how all sickness and disease is caused by demons and evil spirits? The stupid ignorant scientists and atheists actually think it's caused by genetics and viruses etc.. Can you believe that?
GodsTalkingSnake 2 months ago
@thekatiejones9 Regardless of whether others believe they have had life-altering experiences or not – or whether my faith is indeed real or not – there is truth and untruth. The brain may give one a false sense of security, but ultimately we must answer the tough questions and grapple with serious issues. The metaphysical questions are the toughest – but this does not negate their value, in fact, I believe, it makes them less ignorable.
onfiremusicman 2 months ago
@thekatiejones9 We either believe in a supernatural being that created all things ex nihilo or not – it is whether one believes in this or not that will lead to different conclusions on miracles and as to whether the world is in a fallen state. As a Christian, one can accept the idea of a fallen world because humankind has willingly rebelled God's rule.
onfiremusicman 2 months ago
@thekatiejones9 You complain about his 'presuppositions' concerning miracles, and yet do you not deny that in the process you have accepted an a priori metaphysical prejudice? While accepting the wonderful natural processes of nature, and enjoying the benefits that science can bring in terms of understanding this, there are metaphysical questions that can be answered either one way or another …
onfiremusicman 2 months ago
@thekatiejones9 Where are you getting your information from? Even the most conservative estimates put the authorship of the Gospel of John circa 1st century AD – probably around 96 AD. (Beasley-Murray, Word Biblical Commentary Vol. 36, John, lxxvii - wrote that 90-100 CE 'is, indeed, favoured by most Johannine scholars'). This is thought comparably late compared to the synoptic gospels.
onfiremusicman 2 months ago
Funny how he makes the point that the Gospel of Judas was written 150 years later. Wasn't the Gospel of John written roughly that many years later as well? Why was it canonized then? I guess the council thought it fit their image of who they want Jesus to be a little better. Also, he complains about secular presuppositions that miracles are not possible. What I think is far worse is the presupposition that they are as well as the presupposition that we live in a "fallen world."
thekatiejones9 2 months ago
How can you have a "former atheist"? What happened - did he hit his head?
shoutatthesky 3 months ago
hmm, this person is somewhat of a joke.
omegaman20 3 months ago
Thanks for the comments about the Gospel of Judas. Lee Strobel you are passionate & committed to proclaiming the only person that can save us-Jesus!
preachyification1 4 months ago
Lee Strobel is a joke, all assertion, no evidence whatsoever. Fail
MrArokOleary 4 months ago
claiming false things, the bible no way if it says that saintly zombies got out of there graves and walked around jerusalem i believe it. wait a minute saints? there was no saints when this was written. OMG i,ve been conned NOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!!!!!!!
JOOGAL1111 4 months ago
@SuperLoveofGod a personal experience is not evidence i,m afraid. its been proved that people can have the same effect at rock concerts when they see there heros, or going further back hitler supporters claim similar experiences whilst listening to a speech of his. ps lee strobel is a scumbag liar.
JOOGAL1111 4 months ago
To everyone who does not believe that God is real, or that Jesus is the Son of God who was crucified, died, buried and rose for our sins..how do u
explain the filling of the holy spirit that Christians TODAY as myself have experienced and that is recorded in the bible? I received this gift over 10 years ago, the fact that I prayed to God for that gift and immediately began speaking in tounges in evidence! ACTS 2:4
SuperLoveofGod 4 months ago
@SuperLoveofGod This is not evidence. This is explained by psychology. Please consider that people of other faiths who believe in different gods from you have also had life-altering conversion experiences. How did they have the same experience with a different god? I assume you'd chalk their experiences up to psychological reasons, but you would never ascribe the same reasoning to yourself.
thekatiejones9 2 months ago
Delusion and wishful thinking. This guy should listen to Dr Bart Ehrman. The gospels were largely made up. Story telling and hearsay over many, many decades. The disciples didn't write down anything - they couldn't read or write.
MrJohndl 5 months ago
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MrJohndl 5 months ago
Accurately recorded? Questionable. Easy example: Read Mark & John's account of Jesus’ death, and make a list of everything that happened in both and compare your list. You will find that there are stunning differences. In fact there are discrepancies. If these writers were accurate, why are there so many discrepancies in two out of the four Gospels? I’m a Christian, but to claim accuracy is questionable.
JLeeHaven 5 months ago
@JLeeHaven First you have to understand some histrory, John decided to write his gosple after reading the other 3 becaues of what they left out, if you understood this, you would understand why Johns gosple is so different then the other 3.
gtepp031387 4 months ago
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JLeeHaven 5 months ago
The authors of the four Gospels were not eyewitnesses. They are Greek speaking Christians living 35-65 years after the fact. They are telling stories that Christians had been telling during all those years. There was nobody there at the time of Jesus’ death taking notes. Some of the stories were invented, and many were changed. For this reason these accounts are not as useful as historians would like, as historical sources.
JLeeHaven 5 months ago
Writers approved stories sometimes, and they changed the stories sometimes. The stories got modified in the process of transmission over the course of decades before anybody wrote them stories down. These stories are based on oral reports that have been in circulation for decades. What happens to oral reports in circulation year after year, decade after decade, they get changed. What evidence do we have that the stories about the Jesus’ death and the resurrection got changed? Read Mark & John.
JLeeHaven 5 months ago
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JLeeHaven 5 months ago
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JLeeHaven 5 months ago
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JLeeHaven 5 months ago
@jettrink60 Turd? Do you know him personally? Just because you are not willing to accept the reality of Christianity, do not dish out insults Jettrin, What do you know about science? Are you qualified to make any remarks?
Eternitypraise 6 months ago
Sorry to tell all you bible humping sub humans, but 6/7th of the world don't give a fuck about your primitive book. Its the 21st century, go learn something and contribute to humanity. LOL idiots.
MonkeySpecs301 6 months ago
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Eternitypraise 6 months ago
We do contribute to humanity. Through the truth of the gospel God uses us, idiots, to rescue alcoholics, drug addicts, lonely and miserable professional and "successful" men and women God totally transforming their lives and families. I am thinking of this particular man an alcoholic whom God recently (6 months ago) put in my path, he surrendered to Jesus, Jesus took all the alcoholism cravings away. His mind healed, Marriage saved, , How's that 4 contributing to humanity?
Eternitypraise 6 months ago
@Eternitypraise Not really, people that think they are transformed by "jesus" are even more ignorant. When corporations, elites, banks, etc waste the labors of the people by misappropriating resources and these "transformed" people have their backs against the walls because their labor value is worth less and less.......they turn to "jesus" "god" in vain, because the magic guy in the sky isn't going to teach them how to maneuver in the cut throat economic system we are in.....cont.....
MonkeySpecs301 6 months ago
@MonkeySpecs301 Monkey, I can understand your plight, you can't see it because your eyes are veiled so even If I said something really great in response to you, your heart and emotions are invested totally in your views. We Christians who by the way, live a totally different reality to yours have an ongoing relationship with Jesus Christ. In my case, My 4 year old was diagnosed with a cognitive impairment to never be able to talk properly...
Eternitypraise 6 months ago
@MonkeySpecs301 ...I prayed, believed and received the miracle for my girl, this is what I prayed: "That she might surpass her pears in the very area the experts said she was lacking, that she may bet the highest marks in that very area, that she might be gifted in music and able to talk perfectly" God gave us exactly what we asked. Me? I have received miracles all my life too many to count but one day I pray you will be the one testifying "Jesus Saved me, and heal my life" :-)
Eternitypraise 6 months ago
@Eternitypraise ....what are they to do then? I am trying to show that religion gets in the way, why do i need to ask "jesus" to show me the way to feed my family? I'll just go out networking, do research, obtain new skills, be wise with my finance...etc. If it only took "jesus" to rid him of his addiction, I can guarantee he hasn't tried to reach his potential in his life, he was stimulated enough, or else he would have realize his issue was obstructing his personal growth.
MonkeySpecs301 6 months ago
@Eternitypraise When you give credit to "jesus" for some little "solution" it is your ego that wants to give merit to your beliefs. Makes sense? People are better off knowing what is innately common in us, by doing so we create communion with all humanity. When you put the name "christianity" you automatically are prejudice to all other beliefs.....instead of seeing what is common in all the mythologies and archytypes within our human spirit, your chrisitian non sense claims......cont.....
MonkeySpecs301 6 months ago
@Eternitypraise ....to be the absolute belief system. Your patient is now gonna go spewing "jesus saved me jesus saved me"....so degrading, and so much disregard for the rest of humanity who's path to enlightenment will probably not involve jesus. So arrogant and egotistic to think your "god" is the one and only method for spiritual ascension. Please dude, go read some Joseph Campbell or Carl Jung, and begin to think holistically. You are just dong patch work not transformation.
MonkeySpecs301 6 months ago
THIS CARTOON is too FORCEFUL. Something is fishy.
JennaSmith987 7 months ago
only in the last few years has the jewish state actually investigated if the biblical stories have any archaeological evidence to back them up so as to factually and politically statisfy everyone to their political rigt to the land. So they had every reason to want to confirm it. What they found . . . NOTHING .
scandalasdog 7 months ago
@scandalasdog Hey Dog, are you sure? What is the extent of your investigation? The man above, Lee Strobel, was totally against Christianity, He, as a journalist was set out to prove Christianity wrong, only to find himself falling in love with the God he was trying to prove wrong. Now this is a man with an intellectual background, yet he had to bow to Jesus Christ, I hope one day you do the same my friend.
Eternitypraise 6 months ago
@scandalasdog Hey scandalasdog, there is a response to you above starting with the words: "Hey Dog"
Eternitypraise 6 months ago
Darvus continues with his nonsense I see, "Josephus was Paul" he claims without even a shred of evidence to support that nonsense.
Humbler25 8 months ago
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טז חִכּוֹ, מַמְתַקִּים, וְכֻלּוֹ, מַחֲמַדִּים; זֶה דוֹדִי וְזֶה רֵעִי, בְּנוֹת יְרוּשָׁלִָם.
فمه هو الأكثر الحلو؛ نعم، تماما انه هو محمد. هذا هو بلدي الحبيب، وهذا هو صديقي يا بنات أورشليم '.
[16] His words are the most loved: yea, he is most definantly Muhammad [מַחֲמַדִּים]
. This is my beloved, and this is my friend, O daughters of Jerusalem. soung of soungs
hallalmart 9 months ago
@TheDarvus That so? Isn't your fallacious claim desparate? By equating Paul with Josephus, you're showing a lack of investigation. Paul was clearly known as a fervent Christian, Josephus was clearly a fervent Jew. I own the works of Josephus, he's clearly not Christian. Do a bit more research into the evidence for Paul.
vexx801 9 months ago
"Some of the more convincing evidence for the Apostle Paul's existence is found in the following ancient literature. Clement of Rome cites Paul in his letter to the church at Corinth (c. 95 C.E.). Irenaeus (140-202 C.E.) cites Paul in his work "Against Heresies." There is also a description of Paul's physical appearance in the apocryphal work "Acts of Paul and Thecla."" There are many others. Merely because you do not believe there are evidence does not mean there are none.
vexx801 10 months ago
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vexx801 10 months ago
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vexx801 10 months ago
@TheDarvus like the churches he started up and discipled... ok... done... that was easy.
Humbler25 10 months ago
@Humbler25 Right
tylrjsph 8 months ago in playlist BibleStudyGrid-004-StudingTheBible
@TheDarvus I said that Paul is a proven historical figure. That no historians doubt that. None, zip, zero, zilch - the only ones that ever did died in 1957. They are as dead as your thesis. Paul was very real, what you do with that knowledge is up to you.
Humbler25 10 months ago
@TheDarvus you could try reading Strobel's book if you doubt Mathew, Mark, Luke, and John. You sure love trolling his videos. Try reading one of his books. Your bound to learn something.
Humbler25 10 months ago
@TheDarvus I never said source Q was evidence for Paul. Where did you get that from? Source Q isnt even known to exist. Source Q is simply a theory of some that isnt supported at all. I mentioned source Q in response to what you said about Higher Critical Scholarship.
However, if you right... and source Q doesn't exist. Than that leaves us with the historically accepted authors of Mathew, Mark, Luke, and John as having written the gospels. Alright, I knew you'd come around eventually!
Humbler25 10 months ago
@TheDarvus Then how did they come up with source "Q" Source "Q" is not in the Bible. Higher Critical Scholarship looked at possible authorship and concluded that the historical Paul wrote the letters. It is the only plausable explanation. Don't be a fool, examine the evidence and acquire knowledge. You can do it!
Humbler25 10 months ago
@TheDarvus sure he does, you can't name a single historian that doubts he existed. just you! and you are alone in your theory. Higher Critical Scholarshp examines who the authors were. They call into question the apocrapha books and can even confirm the authors weren't who they claimed to be, which is why they were never included in the Bible. These same scholars, using the same method that you were applauding earlier - confirm Paul as the only possible author. Humbler... for the win!
Humbler25 10 months ago
@TheDarvus they say that Paul wrote the letters without mentioning any other possibiblity because there isn't any other possibility. There would be no reason for them to mention Josephus by name as not having written them because there is zero evidence that anybody other than the historical Paul wrote them. No need to mention by name the other billions of people who didn't write it.
I'm glad you've come to the conclusion that authorship is not in question. We've come a long way.
Humbler25 10 months ago
@TheDarvus They confirm that it was not Josephus that wrote the letters, that it was truly Paul himself. As I've said and been backed up by historical documentation - the authorship is not in question, except by one person out of 6 billion - you!
Humbler25 10 months ago
@TheDarvus Actually it proves that you haven't even examined your own source to find the truth. Higher critical scholarship, of which you were singing the praises of.... actually agrees with me. You fail!
Humbler25 10 months ago
@TheDarvus what... your and idiot! you shouldn't say mean things about yourself.
The facts are that Higher Critical Scholarship confirms Paul as the author of his letters and Josephus is no where to be mentioned concerning authorship by any historian the world over. Paul wrote letters, not history books. Josephus may have been a pharisee, but don't you realize that he was not a Christian and had zero motivation for starting up churches or developing them. You fail... yet again.
Humbler25 10 months ago
@TheDarvus The fact that Paul was Pharisee makes it even stranger. Jewish people were so tied back then to their traditions and laws, that it would be very strange so suddenly they change any of it. And that is what happened. Question is what kind of event would make Jewish people do that.
jovanj777 10 months ago
@TheDarvus Higher Critical Scholarship confirms Paul as the author of his letters. Zero chance of Josephus - look it up.
Humbler25 10 months ago
@TheDarvus It is not strange Paul is not mentioned in historical records. In fact it is quite extraordinary that simple fishermen like apostles and carpenter like Jesus are mentioned by some historians. Simply in that times historians were interested only in kings, nobility, generals. You must also bear in mind Christianity in first 300 years was very underground. Someone to become Christian (get baptised) would require months of testing, proving. Foreign elements had no access there.
jovanj777 10 months ago
@TheDarvus No, haven't seen. Right now I'm looking at possible Hebrew new testament. Many scientists believe originally New Testament was written in Hebrew. Greek version has few errors because some letters were wrongly translated. But difference is subtle.
It is quite possible their names were different in Hebrew. It is quite common people there had two names, one Greek, one Hebrew. Also our spelling of foreign names are very skewed. (Herodotus is master of that)
jovanj777 10 months ago
@TheDarvus And, you know Jews have been passing law and commandments orally for many years. There were great number of rabbis who knew every word of Torah. So it shouldn't be any strange if apostles did that also. There are many things that have been left from apostles and early church like liturgy order, some hymns, customs, that are well preserved in Orthodox Church for this 2000 years.
jovanj777 10 months ago
@TheDarvus Even if that is the case. It is not hundreds of years.
I encourage you to compare that with the gap between event and writings on some other historical events from that times. Even later.
One example. Whole scientific theory about Slavs coming to Helm (Balkans) in 7th century is based on writings of Constantine Porphyrogenitos who lived in 10th century. That is three centuries.
jovanj777 10 months ago
"eye witness testimonies" lawl
Chitownboy1023 10 months ago
Now prepare yourself like a man; I will question you, and you shall answer Me.
-God
krnbboyprd 10 months ago
well respected my ass
cattlexing 11 months ago
Don't believe for a second Strobel was ever an atheist. A non-believer, maybe, but being an atheist requires analysis of religion and God...that would require intelligence, which Mr. Strobel is totally lacking.
Anyone with an average IQ can see how utterly ridiculous his circular arguments are. They amount to demonstrating an inference as 'true' by using evidence from the Bible, and then saying this proves the truth of...what's written in the Bible.
Pepotamo1985 1 year ago 2
@Pepotamo1985 Last time i checked the deifintion of an atheist says one who doesnt belong to a religion. You said he was a non believer but not a atheist...so he doesnt have a religion so he was a atheist
thelotrfan100 11 months ago
@thelotrfan100 I should've been clearer, if only to cover my own back lest a pedantic nerd try and extort some kind of internet win out of me for a bit of personal validation.
What I meant was that I don't think he was ever a conscious non-believer, if indeed a non-believer at all. The fact that he apparently takes everything in the bible as literal truth is an indication he's never thought about it critically, which, for an apparent atheist who was also an investigative journalist, seems odd.
Pepotamo1985 11 months ago
@Pepotamo1985 Your first assumption is that Apostles were liars, and that New Testament is a lie.
But, can you really think that they would be willing to suffer, to die by worst means (throwing into fire, hanging on the cross, eaten by lions...), if they spoke lies.
There is "negative" evidence about Jesus, from Talmud. They called him magician. Clearly they, who hated him most, were positive he performed miracles.
Htogrom 10 months ago
I recommend you read some critical studies of The Bible undertaken by Christians wishing to get a fuller understanding of it, who eventually found it impossible to reconcile their faith with their scholarship. It's littered with internal contradictions and obvious falsehoods, passages added hundreds of years after it was originally written and more which puts its veracity and inerrancy in to question. Add to this The Bible was written hundreds of years after the events it purports to describe.
Pepotamo1985 10 months ago
@Pepotamo1985 Really? Hundreds of years later? If year 125 is hundreds of years from 33 then ok. Many scholars believe that Paul wrote between 35-38. Paul refers to testament he received. Wonder what that is? Apocalypse is written around 96. Are you sure you don't talk about KJV or some Joseph Smith bibles?
Our translation in Slavic is much older.
jovanj777 10 months ago
@Pepotamo1985 And proof that it is possible to reconcile faith with scholarship is Nicola Tesla. He was faithful Orthodox Christian.
Maybe there's something wrong with that 26 000 versions of faith you got there. They lost continuity with apostolic faith. You can read Bible all day long, but without presence of Holy Spirit, there's no faith.
jovanj777 10 months ago
@jovanj777
Again, you're using The Bible to prove the truth of...what's written in The Bible. You have faith in something unprovable which cannot be believed by a thinking person, and modern science every day presents us with revelations that further refute the nonsense written within it.
Pepotamo1985 10 months ago
@Pepotamo1985 Ha ha. Of course your presumption is that Bible is lesser valuable than other historical documents.
You can't compare historical method with proving scientific theories (like chemistry and physics). Simply it is matter of past, you can't bring it back. Many Historical events are proven on much less documents than ones about Christ, and still we accept it.
jovanj777 10 months ago
@Pepotamo1985 Just because you are sceptic concerning the miracles, and you didn't saw them doesn't mean they are less true.
They happen every day. But to the ones who really need them. Who have faith.
Maybe one day some event will make you wonder a bit. To cry to the Lord for help. Until then, may God help you!
jovanj777 10 months ago
@jovanj777 Ah, you've just used a straw man argument - I didn't mention anything about miracles. The miracles actually being real events would not prove that The Bible was true in its totality or otherwise, nor that Jesus was the Son of God, nor that any of his teachings, or Biblical teachings are true.
I'd like to see some evidence for your second claim too. If God can heal the sick, why not heal sickness altogether? Why do severed limbs or digits never grow back?
Pepotamo1985 10 months ago
@Pepotamo1985 There is example of severed limb going back. Of cancer going away.
And why God doesn't heal sickness? Because most people don't want to be healed. From the source of disease - passions. Imposing salvation to all would be violation against free will. God wants you to choose him by your own free will.
jovanj777 10 months ago
@jovanj777
Oh, OK, you should've said from the off that you were a delusional theocrat.
Would love to see a citation for someone's limb growing back.
Pepotamo1985 10 months ago
@Pepotamo1985 St John Damascene.
Htogrom 10 months ago
@Htogrom
Excuse me?
Pepotamo1985 10 months ago
@Pepotamo1985 That is the name of the guy who had his arm healed.
jovanj777 10 months ago
How does this guy live with himself? What a tool.
murchimal 1 year ago
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"The Gospel is foolishness to those who are perishing." 1 Corinthians 1:18
Bosingr 1 year ago
@cattlexing hi there. I read his books and then checked out his facts - I am afraid he is quite the fibber. Take care
bagospannerz 1 year ago
I like Lee but he is not thinking outside the box.
wachnathan 1 year ago
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Religion is based on the fear of death, nothing else.
qwertypoiu4321 1 year ago
Matt 6:33 "But seek ye first the Kingdom of God, and His righteousness; and all these things shall be added unto you."
Have anyone found your K.O.G. yet?
Where is it ? Don't know, can ask me.
netelsg 1 year ago
@netelsg The Kingdom of God was an earthly Kingdom that many Jews, including Jesus, thought would arrive during their lifetime. The Jews thought a warrior, or king, would initiate the Kingdom. That person was known as the Messiah in Hebrew, or Christ in Greek. The K.O.G. never arrived and it never will. Christianity is a bastardized version of the original apocalyptic Jewish cult.
4312ton 1 year ago
How many copies of the book of Mormon would it take for you to believe it's all true? Quantity has nothing to do with it.
How many historic places and people does the Koran have to mention for you to believe Mohammad really spoke with an angel of God for his revelation - like it says? No number is good enough to prove that, is it?
Why would one assume Mark made up the woman finding the tomb story to convince people to believe & not for some other theological reason - a literary theme?
Etc.
myintellectualjourny 1 year ago
The host is on a pretty good buzzz
kfDafne 1 year ago
wait then what's the real story of Judis? ...Jew-dis hah
HeadGinger 1 year ago
I believe in the romance of the three kingdoms that one general could fight against 10,000 soldiers, according to eyewitnesses. Strobel says the Bible is written over a long period of time based on eyewitnesses. What is the chance that these people told the true account of what they saw for that long period of time consistently? Chances are some were exaggerated or distorted or not true at all.
candoyja 1 year ago
@candoyja what are the chances that people in 4 different places, over many many years, telling a story by word rather than by pen, stories first told by four different men, these 4 stories (as you say distorted and consistently changed) end up to be exactly, or 99% exactly the same?
6MemoryOfForever9 1 year ago
@6MemoryOfForever9 You think that is good enough to believe in the existence of God? It is your call, man. There must have been a way for these people to write the same thing or the history as we know it is not correct. Something is up. I don't think it was God, though.
candoyja 1 year ago
@candoyja haha this is not at all even 0.5% of why I believe in God... look, we are not as stupid as people try to make us look, ok? we have reasons to believe, maybe they are wrong, but even science with all its proof is wrong many many times. Just keep your mind open that maybe we have good reason to believe, and believe me, we do question life and our religion."you have to know your God before you can love Him!"I hope you find answers to your questions in life, and I hope you have a good one!
6MemoryOfForever9 1 year ago
@6MemoryOfForever9 Your points are well taken. I don't think religious people are stupid.
Lee Strobel seems to be just a person who knows how to do sleek talk. He is slimy and repulsive.
candoyja 1 year ago
@candoyja well, your views on a person are your own views, no one can change them ^_^
6MemoryOfForever9 1 year ago
@6MemoryOfForever9
I know. ^.^
Did you know there was a study done on people to see if they can discern what kind of person a subject is by just looking at the face???
I wonder what lee strobel will get from the study.
I guess: dishonest, manipulative....
candoyja 1 year ago
@candoyja strobe is either A stupid or B preys on ignorance which makes him an manipulative bastard.
i haven't figured out which one yet
dcderek24 1 year ago
@6MemoryOfForever9 name one reason " good reason" you believe in the god of the bible
dcderek24 1 year ago
@dcderek24 thousands of miracles I have seen.... My aunt cured of cancer when she was supposed to die, my cousin's sister-in-law cured of an eye problem (incurable), personal miracles, my mom was told in a dream she will get married in 1 year and have a baby in three years... she did get married 1 year later, she went through depression because she couldn't conceive all the following year, then the third year she got her first child.
p.s. many of the cases we're medically IMPOSSIBLE, ...
6MemoryOfForever9 1 year ago
@6MemoryOfForever9 ... not improbable or unknown, impossible.... like say, you can see without having a retina, it is impossible, yet you do.
2-my mom NEVER lies about this or any other thing of which I know, especially to me, so overlooking science, doctors, priests, pastors, etc.... my mom never lies....coincidence? maybe, but it's one hell of a coincidence..(p.s., it wasn't one dream btw.)
3-I don't really care whether you believe that or not, or what you think of it, so don't bother! bye
6MemoryOfForever9 1 year ago
@6MemoryOfForever9 thats nice. studies on this subject have been done for years and prayer has had seemed to have no effect on patients terminally ill.
they divided people in 2 groups.
1 group theyd pray for them
2 they didnt
all terminally ill there has been about 50 studies on this . all of them come back with no positive results for prayer.
medically impossible? the body is designed to heal itself.
this happens even to atheists.
anthropic model. look that up
dcderek24 1 year ago
@dcderek24 Hello, actually prayer isnt to heal people. Its about hoping something. You know, sometimes christians say if its your will. god knows if they will live or die already. and even if they were to heal people. god would answer only the ones that have good reason
thelotrfan100 11 months ago
@dcderek24 There are countless cases of people being healed by prayer before icons in Christ or Saints. Orthodox world. You should travel to Russia, or Greece.
That prayer you speak about is questionable. First, not all prayers are same. Some people pray better, like monks who devote whole live to it. Second, prayer from person belonging to Catholic/Protestant sect is really not a prayer. Catholicism and all that followed is heresy, that doesn't belong to Christian church any more.
Htogrom 10 months ago
Did he make that neck-tie out of one of TBN's used chair upholstery? Maybe Jan Crouch's fat ass once sat on that golden-glittery thing!
grassburner 1 year ago
Sales. Disgusting sales of rotten lemons. If I bought every bullshit that somebody tried to sell me, my home would be full of garbage.
bigsteakjoe 1 year ago
Do protestants use the gospels the Catholics through out?
gregrutz 1 year ago
This is a quick summary of the Bible's reliability by a famous and well-respected idiot. And a lair too. Metzger did not tell him that the Gospels are based on eye-witness testimony, not is there any other evidence for a thing he says. I guess in Lee's Bible it says "Thou shalt Lie."
Perhaps the Biblical authors wanted to affect a change in the status of women in Jewish society?
HConstantine 1 year ago
Hilarious. Trust lawyers to ignore all the evidence. Ask any historian, the bible is just a collection of myths. A few bits are bound to be true, but it's full of contradictions, and is way off on many things.
Ozzyman200 1 year ago
@Ozzyman200 we dont even know who wrote them!
espyd21c 1 year ago
@Ozzyman200 I am sure you can name "historians" and point out these "contradictions." Wait. No, I am not sure. Because "historians" who stand and say the Bible is a "myth" either ignore the evidence, or are biased. And these "contradictions" are simply not there.
scrmngchicken403 1 year ago
@scrmngchicken403
No, that;s just what you've assumed because you are biased. Just because you personally don't know the contradictions, don't assume they don't exist. Read the bible for yourself with an open mind, do some research. Look at both sides.
Ozzyman200 1 year ago
@Ozzyman200 Biased like you?It never ceases to amaze me how someone who doubts the reliability of the Bible ( I say this because to date archaeologists have yet to disprove the Biblical accounts)refuses to show evidence that supports their claim, and goes directly to the "your biased, so it doesn't matter what I say" defense. It is better than the typical insult. Oh, and I have read and continuously read it.
scrmngchicken403 1 year ago
@scrmngchicken403
"Biased like you?" Really? Are you 4? That was your best retort. Instead of petty insults, try to back up something you say with evidence or reasoning. The ball is in your court. Keep an open mind and do a little research. We are waiting for this evidence.
Ozzyman200 1 year ago
@Ozzyman200 Nay nay, sunshine. Because all the evidence I'll ever need to back up the Bible and my beliefs was handled by Lee Strobel himself. Try reading A Case For Faith and A Case For Christ. By the way, I'd like for you to point out any insulting remarks that I had made.
scrmngchicken403 1 year ago
@scrmngchicken403
"Because all the evidence I'll ever need to back up the Bible and my beliefs was handled by Lee Strobel himself. "
Ah, now that is text book bias. The only evidence you have even considered comes from a theist, a glib lawyer. Broaden your horizon, read the bible for yourself, read the other side of the argument, read what a historian thinks instead. Educate yourself, think for yourself, don't just believe one guy. You have admitted your bias, that is a good first step.
Ozzyman200 1 year ago
@scrmngchicken403 Lee Strobel said certain things couldnt be made through evolution in the "Case for the Creator". This is the basis for his and Behe's "intelligent design" group. They went to court with this argument and were proven wrong. Watch "judgement day:intelligent design on trial'. Worse yet, the ID group was said to have testified inconsistantly or lied outright. There were calls to bring perjury charges against them. Lee's ideas were proven wrong in court, enough said.
Information39 1 year ago
@Information39 There are several clips with the same title. Which of these would you recommend?
dutchpuppy2 1 year ago
@Information39 I just watched part one. When is Lee and his group's views presented? Which installment out of the 12?
dutchpuppy2 1 year ago
@dutchpuppy2 Behe (representing the ID group) talks about the bacterial flagellum in Judgement Day: Intelligent Design on trial in #8...#9. Though I think you are missing a lot not to watch all 12 parts. Thanks for watching it and getting educated on the matter.
Information39 1 year ago
@dutchpuppy2 Looks like 8 through 12. They are only like 8 minutes a piece.
Information39 1 year ago
@scrmngchicken403 You seem to agree with Lee that the Gospels provide a historically accurate record. If this is the case then at the very least you would expect to be able to determine when Jesus was born. Are you able to do this so that you can identify the year of his birth (not looking for a full DoB) & point me at the chapters & verses which allow you to determine this basic fact?
hexkid 1 year ago
'A famous and well respected former atheist' or to put it more accurately, a charlatan and an idiot.
mycatistigger 1 year ago
Lee does his job well - he's got a clean, passionate style - and that all helps when you've got a book to sell.
He wears a suit and knows how to wave his arms about - 2 factors that are very convincing
I think he'd make a great second-hand car salesman - he could sell any old rubbish
simonhumby 1 year ago
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Did Judas or priests purchase Potter's field?
How did Judas die?
Did Jesus suck on a sponge while crucified?
Which of several choices were Jesus' last words?
Who visited the tomb Easter morning?
Who was Jesus' putative paternal granpa? Heli or Jacob?
Not too reliable, apparently,
as the gospels and Acts contradict each other on each of these points.
Imaginefree69 1 year ago
If your personal moral law is defined by culture, then you are part of a cult. If your moral law is defined by objective truth (evidence external to your own imagination) AND your moral truth matches reality then you are not part of a cult. Historical Christianity is not a cult.
goalkik753 1 year ago
@goalkik753 Aside from the unicorns and talking snakes and donkeys
and the requirement to practice ritualized cannibalism
and 600 year old goat herders building Titanics from desert shrubs
we see that your god commanded his people
to rip little girls from the bloody arms of their dead mothers
and take them home to share with YHVH's priests.
This is the book you are basing your morality on?
How obscene.
"I also will laugh at your calamity;
I will mock when your fear cometh" Says YHVH
Imaginefree69 1 year ago
@Imaginefree69
That is old testament. Who cares what ot says?
compsciguy 1 year ago
@compsciguy
Yes, yes, I know.
Christians love to discard the bits they find inconvenient,
yet they batter others with the same bits
(such as the OT words about homosexuality).
Such hypocrisy.
Imaginefree69 1 year ago
@goalkik753
Evolution supplies all that is needed for the development
of codes of conduct that preserve and facilitate
survival and co-operation.
Such sensitivities in no way support any particular god.
In fact, as Christians believe that their most heinous acts
will be magically vanished and forgotten via human sacrifice,
they actually have very little incentive to act in a moral manner.
Hmmm..
That explains a lot.
Imaginefree69 1 year ago
@goalkik753
Why is belonging to a cult a bag thing? The cult is not bad all the time.
Even Anton Lavey Satanists don't kill people to sacrifice them to Satan. They actually don't really believe in the deity known as Satan.
compsciguy 1 year ago
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goalkik753 1 year ago
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goalkik753 1 year ago
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@compsciguy "That which does not kill people" defines a part of your moral law. Where did you get this idea from?
goalkik753 1 year ago
lee strobel,be blessed!!!you and your household!!!BLESSED ARE THOSE WHO HAVEN"T SEEN JESUS CHRIST YET HAVE FAITH IN HIM!!!
MrBenoemi 1 year ago
what is funny is that people don't see the tactic religious people use...they try to trick people into their cults, and through history and even today try to convert people out of fear, religions need to start keeping their poison to themselves, and stop Nazi style Brainwashing kids at a young age and wait till they are adults that would know better than to beleive in a scam, instead they are indoctrinated so early...It is sad, im lucky that i escaped religion, it is called becoming an adult
MadMAn12gauge 1 year ago
@Skeptics?
The Bible Proved INSPIRED? Through the Computer Analysis of Every Letter in the Original Hebrew TaNaKh and Greek NT!
And Through 24 Separate Evaluations of sets of WORDS and LETTERS Which Are All DIVISIBLE Evenly By SEVEN?
On the List are the Number of All Words, All Letters in the Vocabulary,Names of Men,Women,Words that begin with a Consonant ,Vowel, the Number of Nouns and Non Nouns,All will Divide Evenly by SEVEN and 16 Other Proofs of the Evaluation!
Google Rangeguide/Panin
JesusFul100sProphec 1 year ago
i can give a shit about what any bible says, it is not the word of god, nobody has talked to god, people have talked to themselves YES, but you cant talk to something that is not there, thats insanity, so shove your divinci code bullshit up your man pleaser
MadMAn12gauge 1 year ago
@JesusFul100sProphec , Nothing proved inspired! How can inspiration be proved? It can't, it hasn't, it never will!
99minerkc 1 year ago
the bible has no authority this is a load of crap. You dont have to believe in the authority of the bible to be Christian.
henryforshaw 2 years ago
@henry
Copies of this Analysis have been sent to over 500 Centers for Agnostic and Atheistic beliefs including Universities and Centers of Learning conducted by Non-Christian Organizations!
The Challenge was Issued: "Disprove the Report and its data OR produce any other text written by men as the scribes,that will contain any of the same phenomena?"
No one has ever taken up that challenge, and they are still waiting after three years~
Check my Channel for more!
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JesusFul100sProphec 1 year ago
Check out tent maker ministries.
henryforshaw 1 year ago
@JesusFul100sProphec , copies were sent? Why not the originals?
99minerkc 1 year ago
religion is bogus
jazzguitar09 2 years ago
irrelevant when the gospels are assumed to be first written, because the first bibles or part of bibles we have are in ancient greek and are 4th century AD.... which doesnt give it any historical validity... unless u find the original scripts, then what does this argument prove?
phaywood 2 years ago
@phaywood
Cont:
All Other Writings Alleged to be "Additional" Scriptures, FAILED ON EVERY POSSIBLE PHENOMENA when Evaluated by the same criteria as the Tanakh and New Testament.
Such as the Quran, Book of Mormon, Pearl of Great Price, Doctrine, Covenants and Commandments of the Mormon Church, Jehovah's Witnesses and MANY, MANY, Others!
By adding the Apocryphal Books Not One of these Books contains even One of the Proofs of the Phenomena found in the Bible!
Google Rangeguide/Panin
GodWalksThruHisBody 1 year ago
This comment has received too many negative votes show
The Gospels are all anonymous. They are not written by eye witnesses. They are Hearsay. Matthew and Luke used Mark as a template and edited Mark, added conflicting details, to make an improved fictional account. John doesn't agree in so many instances that it appears to be a story of another Jesus. The gospels were not written in Judea but in other countries. They were written in Greek. The Jews of Judea spoke Aramaic. The Gospels were written at least 40 years after the events.
Ebal
ebaltrace 2 years ago
Call me crazy but none of this really sounds so crazy or joke-like. This roughly 7.5 minute snippet doesn't say as much as Strobel's book, The Case for Christ, does. The first six chapters of his book were devoted to looking at the reliability of the new testament. I read the evidence. The evidence made sense to me. If anyone is judging Strobel based on this video without having looked into the book, I encourage you to check the book. Your acceptance or disbelief of the evidence is your choice.
leetdahl 2 years ago
@leetdahl do you know where I can get it from? any site I could ask for it from?
6MemoryOfForever9 1 year ago
@leetdahl i read the book, strobel is embarrassing, but not as embarrassing as the amount of people that take his word without doing their own research. christians should be investigating this so called "avalanche of evidence" for THEMSELVES, not taking as "gospel" what yet another book-seller tells them is the truth
cattlexing 1 year ago
@cattlexing Did you make a counter-investigation to refute the so-called avalanche of evidence?
jerdominate 1 year ago
@leetdahl i read strobels book and many of his debates. the guy is an idiot plain and simple.
he does not address the historical problems of the gospels. the contradictions and asserts josephus as a historical source for the divinity of christ. when everyone knows josephus is blatant known forgery even recognized by christian scholars. secondly he makes broad claims like "the fossil record doesnt support evolution" umm ok strobel, can you expalin a little more. he doesnt.
dcderek24 1 year ago
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@leetdahl there is no evidence of jesus. there is no contempary historical evidence of jesus.
dcderek24 1 year ago
@leetdahl i read the book, there was actually NO evidence, did YOU read it? or had you already made up your mind?
cattlexing 11 months ago
haha the n.t. is not reliable. that's a joke... the manuscripts changed all the way up to the 14th century. don't believe me? 1 John 5:7, it even says it in NKJV bibles that that verse wasn't in any greek manuscripts up to the 14th century... haha. woow.
TroothBeT0ld 2 years ago
why do you believe the rantings of bronze aged goat herders
krypto1947 2 years ago
/watch?v=fFH0khjgA0U
TheHonestTheist 2 years ago
This comment has received too many negative votes show
I think that we should all have access to whatever drug he is on because he is totally fucked up. I can't believe that he was an atheist and then bought this bull shit.
Socrates679 2 years ago
Strobel is slick, but full of bs. None of the verifications he mentions of the Gospels are real. His "research" consist of interviewing like minded Christian fundamentalists and presenting it as evidence.
The Gospels are fabricated docs created after Paul to put some meat on a struggling religion. None of the events are verified by contemporary witnesses.
Strobel shows his ignorance by referring to Gnostic's as 2 god believers. Wrong, those were Marcionites.
4312ton 2 years ago
Metzger is a credentialed scholar, not a mere "fundy".
vbfl920 2 years ago 2
This comment has received too many negative votes show
Strobel is a first class manipulator and misrepresents and fabricates "information".
Even in this video he lies about the amount of information on the historicity of Jesus.
4312ton 2 years ago
Again, you stated that he interviewed "fundies".
Bruce Metzger was a renowned scholar from Princeton, not a mere "fundy".
vbfl920 2 years ago 2
"Again,you stated that he interviewed "fundies"."
Perhaps your religion is causing you reading difficulty. I never used the term "fundy", you did. Bruce Metzker is dead so we cannot ask his opinion. My issue is with the character of Lee Strobel, (a mere fundy). He seem to break the 9th commandment a lot. You know, the one dealing with false witness.
I think Strobel will burn in hell. What do you think?
4312ton 2 years ago
There are no writings by eyewitnesses to Jesus. Not one.
FreePlay 2 years ago