Thanks Aronra! I was looking for a suitable analogy to explain to my brother that the ending of the Battlestar Galactica series didn't make any sense whatsoever (ie that humans are descended from an alien species that happened to have the same DNA as some 'primitive' species of human, and then interbred with them). The '2 authors, same book' analogy, is perfect!
Aron Ra - "The biosphere's operated perfectly well without out it for well over 3000 million years"
Carl Sagen - "That's Billion!!!"
Audience - "Hahaa... you got PWNED by a cardboard cut out of Sagen! XD"
Aron Ra - "A billion in English used to represent a million million. I said 3000 million years which was still technically correct & saved unnecessary confusion!"
there are possible candidates for the replacements other than primates, they could be the crow or raven they have or nearly have the same kind of ingeniuty like a chimp or even the octopus though itl take em a while but they are possible candidates
@AronRa, the idea of creating a word for that sort of thing, I'd written something like that before. It was in a science fiction/fantasy novella, and while human beings hadn't gone extinct, they had become more like tribal groups with some exceptions, and due to the extreme environment that earth had become, evolved to mimic other animals (mollusks for example), and were slowly rebuilding.
@NoNamesLeft0102 I guess it would be only partial since people haven't gone extinct and the word would need to apply to the extinction of human beings, but would that suffice if nobody has suggested anything?
Would there actually be a niche to fill? Or will it rather be a restoration of "balance" for want of a better word.
When you are cured of an illness. Does that create a niche for a new illness to take hold? The metaphor is stretched to say the least, but it's the best way i can put it into words.
That said, I can see no reason why another sapience species could not evolve. I just don't see it as a necessity simply because we are no longer there.
@TharosTheDragon don't think so, he's running in such a standard tired way, i've heard this arguement several times all the way through by several different people, anyone who has a critical mind will question it and instantly find a managerie of flaws
@TharosTheDragon where did u get that from? although i do not know aronra outside youtube so i cannot profess to know whether or not he has a critical mindset
@TharosTheDragon oh wait, im talking about the dude in the beginning, his statement is usually followed with an arguement that we have not yet seen a recurrence in a species which is supposed to mean that evolution is false, however, seeing as how the question ends where it does im guessing abdultheimpaler must've heard the statement from a creationist and wanted aronra to correct it
@Stealtheeee You're assuming wrong. This has nothing to do with creationism. It's an imaginitive hypothetical situation akin to science fiction. Just watch the video.
@Stealtheeee I'm not sure I've ever heard the argument that a lack of recurrence in species proves evolution false. That seems bogus even by creationist standards.
Screw it, I'm going to go with George Carlen's joke on this and say, "If the earth needed us it was for one thing, plastic. If we finely kill ourselves off then what would it mater to the earth? it'll just be the earth + plastic.
is it just in my head,or does Abdultheimpailler look like he should be a member of blue oyster cult,you know...the guys who look like they should have been extras in porno from the 70's,but never rock musicians?
I was wondering if a selected breeding program involving chimps, would one day produce a similar intelligence with humans? I've seen some incredible displays of problem solving with well trained subjects. I hope this won't be concidered as "social Darwinism"
Would the next human level creature be required to be a land animal? I suspect yes since fire doesn't work in water and it played a large role in the development of our technology and spread to colder parts of the Earth.
I don't know, any animal that spends its time having sex, playing with its dong, using bi-sexual behaviour to resolve conflict, otherwise fooling around and eating lots of fruit has its sh*t together in my book!
Imagine if after 9/11, bush had asked osama come over and mutually masturbate with him & the families of the victims to say sorry.
Given enough time doesn't the probability of anything, however remote the possibility in isolation, approach 1? My answer would have to be yes but it could take a while. The sun could have gone Supernova by the time it happens.
Pretty good answer I think. However I don't see why humans must die out to 'fill the niche' I think it is entirely possible that an intellectual animal on the same level as humans can arise given time, without the demise of homo sapiens. Of course your answer was framed by the question itself asking whether this would happen IF humans went away.
I vote for meerkats being the ancestor species for the next ambitious sapio-architectonic species. (From the combined etymogies of arkhitektos, being able to build physically as well as to systematize knowledge and sapient, to exhibit wisdom or understanding). They are social, intelligent, and not endangered with habits already consistent with making the front limbs available for manipulation. That is, if we wipe out too many primates to give them a sufficient gene pool to reproduce.
Sure it is possible. Assuming we are living in a infinite universe with an infinite time line everything will happen infinitely often. And even if the universe is doomed to collapse in it self in a new big bang it still might happen but the probability is damn damn damn small. But then it will still definitely happen in one of the coming universes.
Okay, here is a question for you. If humans make it to mars, terraform it, and then colonize it. And the all of a sudden, communication and travel becomes impossible for 5000 or so years. Will the human species on mars, have had enough time, to change so much so, that we are no longer able to copulate with them? And for that matter, would we even be genitally compatible?
I think we would still be genetically compatible, because our generations are so much longer than most other species, and even dogs are still genetically compatible with wolves.
@AronRa Ehh.. It would depend a lot on environmental and societal influences. For the most part I agree with you(of course), but with current trends on earth and possible incomprehensible exposures on mars, stimuli for radical divergence could occur
Humans have been around for approximately 160,000 years right? 5,000 years doesn't really seem to be a long time in the grand scheme of things really. The oldest pyramids of Giza were built no longer than 5,000 years ago. Maybe a unique mutation could randomly occur that shows a benefit in one of the populations and become dominant, but in a "controlled, earth-like" environment it seems unlikely.
Your right. I mean, in all probability, because it would have to be an earth like environment, they wouldn't need to drastically adapt. But I am still curious, that if we did separate, how long would it take for us to become too different. Or would it ever happen? Are we at the end of the line for macro evolution? Hehe, probably not, but this is really fun to think about.
I agree, it's the sort of thing that you can never talk too much about. It's a shame so many people just blindly ignore such a great chance by disbelieving in it. :P
It's interesting because some might say humans no longer have much natural selection (in 1st world countries at least) so mutations could have any sort of effect on two such separated populations.
That is a curious thought! I honestly can't see macro evolution occuring among humans on earth. The fact that indigenous populations seperated for thousands of years can still interbreed, for example Australian natives & Inuit (eskimos) Shows humans have the life spans & ganetic divercity to defy speciation for many thousands of years. With the ever shrinking world the chance of a group being isolated long enough to speciate becomes less & less likley.
@PaperSoapy we would probably still be "genitally compatible" and as far as being not able to breed maybe but u think 5000 years would not be enough but human evolution is complicated because theres no actual natural selection
@PaperSoapy This has happened many times already, as proven by the holy scripture of Star Wars. The alien species such as the Twi'lek and Togruta were isolated from humans and diverged. Also, humans already evolved before us, a long time ago in a galaxy far, far away. So sayeth The Force, amen.
This question and answer reminds me of Red Dwarfs "Cat". A Felissapien being that had evolved for 3Ma from a large litter of kittens whilst the lone crew member was in cryo.
During this time the Felissapien population experienced the "tool age" where they figured how to use the can openers and vending machines. They also decimated their own kind by violent religous wars, by one faction who knew their Gods name was Loister, and the other faction he knew their Gods name was Lister.
AronRa, excellent video, very well detailed and explained.
I have a question which I hope you can answer.
It is anyway possible (and probable) that our evolution can be able to produce another set of human like beings to co-inhabit the earth with "normal" humans?
Sort of like the Cro-Magnons and Neanderthals situation? If it has done it before, can it do it again?
Will it use the human dna, primate dna, both or neither?
From my limited understanding of evolution, that would not be possible, unless specific conditions were met.
The 2 groups would have to be separated from each other is some manner to not allow the 2 gene pools to mix and for a long enough period of time to allow for substantial mutation, and the groups would have to live in different environments.
Otherwise the 2 groups would not be 2 distinct groups.
Read "The Greatest Show On Earth" by Richard Dawkins, great read on evolution.
"AronRanian Functionality" - To fulfill the functionality to the ecosystem identical to that of present, modern human beings complete with equal intellect, communcation skills, self awareness, etc.
Theoretically, given an infinite amount of time two separate authors just might write the same exact book. Similarly new humans may evolve again. Of course if this were true in a finite amount of time in some other cosmos perhaps I will be writing the same comment on Aarons video.
One could even say that nothing is going to happen only once if we have infinite number of universes (and time).
Although your answer was brilliant, it was a bit unfair to the many people who could only stand there and watch your answer fly right over their heads. Let's go simpler
*NO*
Why not? Because the initial conditions and original organisms of which we evolved from, no longer exist.
In evolutionary terms,
"We are what we are today, because of what we were yesterday" Elf Ghost - Realist, atheist, agnostic, anti-theist.
the truth is. there is no truth. only what you wish to percieve. and only you have control over your choices. You cant change the wind but you can ajust sails to get where you want
No mammonra, the truth remains the truth whether you're able to accept it or not. I cannot choose what to believe the way you can, but even you cannot make up your own truth and have it actually be true. To even imagine that you could is to deceive yourself.
@AronRa Interesting discussion. Wouldn't it be just as likely that even with us here that there could eventually be another species that evolves in a similar way as we did? That is if we were able to survive long enough to see it, which I assume is improbable. We'd actually observe the evolution first hand and document it. Where might we be as a species then? Are there any theories in place predicting the evolutionary processes in a species now? Is it even possible to predict such a thing?
I'll even bet heaven is actually secret code used by by beings travelling from the 11th dimension into ours. We're not sure tho. String theory is not a solid theory just yet. Many gaps still exist.
I think there is some arugement that God actually lives in the 12th dimension, but there is no code name for it like heaven.
I'm sure you got some solid evidence tho as to where this logic is faulty?
Prove to me there is NO 11th or12th dimension and that I'm wrong.
Here's how it's gonna be: *POOF* Humanity is gone, in 1 billion years dolphins are gonna crawl onto land wondering why all the boat motors stopped. Their tails will split and become legs, and their flippers will form hands. They will start worshipping the "God" "CNN" and his consort "The Emergency Broadcast System" They will use dynamite to make fishing easier they will develop a taste for beer, french fries, and canned peaches. They will use elevators as toilets, and bathrooms as nurseries.
I'd bet on Bonobos- social enough to learn from one another, if they somehow got over being "conservative" in their problem solving. Unfortunately, if we go, we'll likely have killed them off already.
Off-chance bet: rats. Social, hands of a sort, unlikely to be killed off by us before we go.
If raccoons evolved and developed civilization and eventually a form of waste management system, would they still be likely to get into and tip over their own trashcans?
look at squid/octopi, Aron. they seem to have the brainpower and the necessary appendages to evolve into a sentient life form. the sheer amount of brainpower needed to control their camouflage is staggering. just imagine if that was re-purposed towards complex thought. then we have a species that are "walking" on the ocean floor. it's all very interesting stuff.
I didn't see if this was asked further back in the comments, but why would birds be an unviable base for a technological species? Birds do build (though I suppose other non-dexterous animals such as beavers do as well), and as I'm sure you know as a parrot-owner are very dexterous. Birds already use tools, with their beaks and with their feet. What makes bird feet less suited for adapting to higher dexterity than human hands? We after all do not (in general) have dexterous toes.
I think the capacity to develop a brain large enough to learn such things is a requirements above all. Birds do not have that capacity innate to them at this time. I know that they can learn to mimic and reproduce language and sounds that they hear...but I do not believe that alone is enough to get them started.
I think you're looking for the term "Metacognition," knowing about knowing or cognition about cognition. Basically, the level of intelligence that allows one to recognize one's own thought and think about the mind itself.
well what if only a certain set of very specific conditions could allow a species to evolve to the point where they developed sapience and who could develop technology? Then theoretically that species would adopt extremely similar biological mutations to the ones humans already have. There used to be many hominid species who were very intelligent and capable of building tools yet had no development as a species like humans had. Maybe thats an indication of the demand on sapience.
What do you think would happen if we introduced the MYH16 mutation to pan chimps or bonobos, so that jaw muscle would be weaker and their crania could potentially expand?
I think there is an intelligent, nimble, omnivorous mammal, already accustomed to human civilization in North America that could easily replace us. Yes, raccoons will inherit the Earth
My question about this would be... do you think maybe humans evolved from monkeys (i believe we are most closely related to baboons) and Neanderthals evolved from something more stocky like a gorilla? I was just thinking if that's the case then the earth would have already witnessed those 2 species coming close to the intelligence we now have. So seeing it happen again wouldn't be all that improbable.
Homo sapiens and Homo neanderthalensis are both sister species, both of which descend from Homo erectus. We definitely did not evolve from gorillas and are even more distant from baboons. Check my favorites for the video, 'Turns out we did come from monkeys'. It explains our taxonomy more accurately.
if it is probable that, after the extinction of humans, humans could come into being once again via evolution, and if time goes on infinetly, then such a re-birth will occur.
whereas some life is not conscious at all, other life is conscious but not self-conscious. All consciousness is "intentional", that is, all consciousness is consciousness of something. whereas lower life forms are consciousness of things in the world, humans have the capacity to become conscious of being concious of the world. this "self-consciouness" is the condition for the possibility of writing literature, doing philosophy, building modern cities, and preparing for out future.
How can humans grow evolutionary without killing each other-and the planet ?! Or even exist together in the next 100 years ? Religion,governments-Media thats it-- but WTF,it's just a blink of time-future generations are doomed to have an ant jar battle! No a food battle ,an energy battle,a marketing battle ? NA, fucked up shit is always gonna happen--we're the chikens of Darmstadt !!
I believe in God, and I agree highly with this guy. Why does the amazing atheist have more views? This guy doesn't curse as much or jiggle. I think I might convert to atheism cuz of this guy .lol
Blaise Pascal: 1623-1662 French Mathemetician , "There is a God-shaped vacuum in the heart of every man which cannot be filled by any created thing, but only by God, the Creator, made known through Jesus Christ." (Pensees)? But by Jesus Christ and in Jesus Christ, we prove God and teach doctrine and morals. Jesus Christ, then, is the true God of men."
beastly- relative to Newton and other prominent theist scientist, it is gross misrepresentation to assert that they viewed the Bible as scientific textbook per se, or anything of the sort Rather, faith, reason & the God of the Bible account are essential constituent elements of the worldview of believers. That this eludes UR mind is not at all surprising- this is why the Lord said a man MUST BE born again to see the Kingdom of God.
Some cephalopods are quite intelligent. Their tentacles can be used for any number of tasks. Because of their soft tissue, there is not much that would limit their brin size. What has kept squids from becoming as smart as humans, or would they, assuming they survive us, be likely successors for the role of 'most self-conscious species on earth'?
I salute your attempt to coin a new word and get it accepted. I leave that in your capable hands. But for youtubers, I suggest another new word that is closer to home and possibly more useful;
That an omnipotent and omniscient being would use it's own creation, (Humans), to impart the knowledge of itself, to themselves, via a BOOK, is absurd. If indeed there is a 'God', rest assured that it is a 'thing', and you will never, ever know it.
This comment has received too many negative votesshow
"If indeed there is a 'God', rest assured that it is a 'thing', and you will never, ever know it."
Sorry to BURST YOUR BUBBLE. I do know my Lord and Savior and you could too if you actually cared. The SIN which consumes your life also BLINDS YOU to the TRUTH God would have you know. You suffer from the same SIN which brought down Satan---PRIDE.
bornagain001, your accusations really hurt. I used to be a Christian, and when I began to have doubts about your god existing, I prayed to him every day for guidance. This is, of course, not why I stopped believing in your deity.
However, to say that a skeptic does not "know" your God because they don't "actually care" is just offensive and hurtful, since it implies that other skeptics are skeptics because they don't care, myself included.
The problem is, you put the cart before the horse.
God does NOT hear ANY prayers from any unrepentant sinners. If you have not SURRENDERED your life to Jesus Christ, you do NOT HAVE a mediator. It is only after you surrender your life to the authority of Christ, will God begin to reveal Himself to you and only then will He begin to hear your prayers. You stopped believing because you NEVER HAD FAITH. Ephesians 2:8-9 explains SALVATION and how you receive it.
I was repentant. I apologized for my sins, thoroughly regretting my mistakes and telling this to God. I wasn't expecting any kind of magical apparition, or hearing a mystical voice. I was simply expecting some kind of guidance. Also, as omniscient, he would logically know about all prayers. And as an omni-benevolent being would care enough about every individual person to answer all their prayers.
Saying "Oh you didn't believe hard enough" is just mocking my personal struggle.
"I was repentant. I apologized for my sins, thoroughly regretting my mistakes and telling this to God."
An apology is NOT the same as SURRENDER. When you surrender Your life, you become a follower of Jesus Christ. As a follower of Christ, you live in FAITH. Check your PM for 14 signs of a truly repentant sinner.
Even as a Christian we still exert our FREE WILL as exampled by Ted Haggard. FREE WILL always exists but as a follower of Christ we are to surrender that FREE WILL to the authority of Christ so that HE may you us for His purpose and direct our lives. When we refuse to relinquish our free will, the results will end up like what happened to Brother Ted.
So your telling me that Ted Haggard was not a christian? Also if you are supposed to surrender this free will to god then wouldn't that be equivalent to making man with no free will? What your saying is that we gain free will so that we can either rebel from Christ or become one of his puppets which would make your god somewhat evil because he is making something that will only be detrimental.
"So your telling me that Ted Haggard was not a christian? "
NOPE. I am sure Ted was a Christian and he asserted his FREE WILL to go against God's Will for his life. The result was a disgraceful downfall and loss of his ministry. God CREATES you with free will. Just as Japan and Germany surrendered to the U.S.,man must surrender his free will to God if he wants God to adopt him into His family.
With you japan and germany surrendering to the allies analogy it doesn't work the same. They surrendered because the allies were going to kill them all therefor we were threatening death or surrender your free will of ruling your country. With the christian god its either go to hell or have no free will, which is sorta the same but the allies didn't create Germany and Japan. Also this would still end up with god planning on humans to not have free will.
"They surrendered because the allies were going to kill them all therefor we were threatening death or surrender your free will of ruling your country."
CORRECT. God does NOT force anyone to surrender their will to Him. It is done voluntarily by the BELIEVER who KNOWS God's plans will far exceed our own plans. For 55 years I lived in rebellion to God. Please...don't make the same mistake I did.
You can't know gods plan. Your god expressly forbids it. "Isaiah 55:8 My thoughts are not your thoughts, my acts are not your acts."
And I'm not going to make the same mistake you did, I'm going to realize that your god is as false as Zeus and orbital tea-kettles, and live a life for myself, for my family, for my friends, and for my fellow humans, not one that is subservient to an invisible non-existent sky daddy.
Isaiah is your bible, dumbass. I'm the atheist, you're the Christian. Giving bible quotes to a Christian is rather fruitless, because I see the entire thing as non-sense. It's only effective against people who actually *believe* the thing, like you.
And thank you for proving once again that the bible likes to proclaim bigotry. Christans can judge anyone they want, but Non-christians cannot judge Christians.
"Christans can judge anyone they want, but Non-christians cannot judge Christians."
Trust me on this one. It's FAR BETTER for me as a Christian to call you on YOUR SIN, than it is to die and stand before CHRIST who will Judge you for eternity.
Pascal's Wager? Are you sure you have the right god? Are you positive that your god rewards unquestioning belief, and punishes disbelief, despite the altrusim of the disbeliever?
Because a lot of gods in the past have also claimed rewards and punishments for believing and not believing. You might want to go re-evaluate your religion and make sure you absolutely want to go with this god over the 3500 others that have been postulated to exist.
And a Muslim would say the same thing about Allah. A Hindu would say the same thing about Shiva. A Wiccan or Shinto would say the same things about nature spirits and shit. Ancient Nordic folk would say the same thing about Odin.
"FALSE GODS"
Which people like you dismiss for the same reason people like me blow them all off, and your invisible friend as well. No one can provide any empirical evidence such deities exist, yours included.
"And a Muslim would say the same thing about Allah. A Hindu would say the same thing about Shiva. A Wiccan or Shinto would say the same things about nature spirits and shit. Ancient Nordic folk would say the same thing about Odin."
The problem is that neither Shiva, Odin or Allah has sent someone to bring LIGHT into the DARK world in which you exist. Perhaps they are all on vacation or asleep. Perhaps they do not care. GOD DOES. He has sent me to speak to you. WILL YOU LISTEN?
How predictable. At least you didn't copy-and-paste "The world offers you many religions but only ONE savior!" for the umpteenth time. Maybe you've learned that copy-and-paste answers are not the way to win an argument, but you're still typing every other word in caps. Ugh, such a slow learner....
"He has sent me to speak to you. WILL YOU LISTEN?"
Hard to take someone pushing sixty who has an invisible friend, and screams and demands attention like a whiny toddler, very seriously.
So the answer is NO? And yet God sends his people all over the world to bring the LOST to righteousness and yet because of the SIN which CONSUMES YOUR LIFE, you would rather spend eternity in Hell.
Yet none of you braying, self-righteous pests has evidence. No scientific evidence that invalidates all the research and evidence supporting evolution, the formation of the solar system, and every other scientific theory that undermines your precious Bible. No evidence of miracles or supernatural forces that would set your claims about the Christian god apart from the deities of every other religion.
And for the last time, quoting a storybook that fails to stand up to real scrutiny is idiocy.
"And, of course, special pleading. What exactly differentiates your god from the other 3500 other gods?"
I already know how he'll answer. He'll use one of his cut-and-paste answers, raving that the world gives you many religions but ONE savior. Gleefully ignoring that Christianity is the only religion obsessively stressing the need for any savior in the first place.
Which surprises me, because that just screams "CONTROL." People who already feel worthless and down trodden (The peasants if you will) would want more in life to the point of blindly following people that say they can be saved by giving money to the church and doing whatever they say without question.
Thanks Aronra! I was looking for a suitable analogy to explain to my brother that the ending of the Battlestar Galactica series didn't make any sense whatsoever (ie that humans are descended from an alien species that happened to have the same DNA as some 'primitive' species of human, and then interbred with them). The '2 authors, same book' analogy, is perfect!
LostSubsForever 2 days ago
Or cephalopods
ytmndman 4 weeks ago
@caveman73 Caveman73's favorite spanking video:
/watch?NR=1&v=A3A1nprfuJs
RadarGuidedVermin 4 months ago
Aron Ra - "The biosphere's operated perfectly well without out it for well over 3000 million years"
Carl Sagen - "That's Billion!!!"
Audience - "Hahaa... you got PWNED by a cardboard cut out of Sagen! XD"
Aron Ra - "A billion in English used to represent a million million. I said 3000 million years which was still technically correct & saved unnecessary confusion!"
Audience - "Damn, the arguements water tight!!"
MrLittletomdj 5 months ago
The small dogs would miss us. They'd be dinner. :-D
zeldaofarel 5 months ago in playlist More videos from AronRa
Is it just me or does AbdultheImpailler look like ray comfort?
wohodude100 10 months ago
Damn Aron, you are smart!
hypercub 10 months ago
there are possible candidates for the replacements other than primates, they could be the crow or raven they have or nearly have the same kind of ingeniuty like a chimp or even the octopus though itl take em a while but they are possible candidates
Hypastpist 11 months ago
this Abdultheimpailler.... Is he Ray Comfort's evillusionary twin? I see a resemblance o.O
xESOTERlC 1 year ago
My money's on the Squids.
Tazz2006 1 year ago
@AronRa, the idea of creating a word for that sort of thing, I'd written something like that before. It was in a science fiction/fantasy novella, and while human beings hadn't gone extinct, they had become more like tribal groups with some exceptions, and due to the extreme environment that earth had become, evolved to mimic other animals (mollusks for example), and were slowly rebuilding.
NoNamesLeft0102 1 year ago
@NoNamesLeft0102 I guess it would be only partial since people haven't gone extinct and the word would need to apply to the extinction of human beings, but would that suffice if nobody has suggested anything?
NoNamesLeft0102 1 year ago
I propose 'homosapience', or maybe 'anthroposapience'.
hackenbollox 1 year ago
I propose 'homosapience'.
hackenbollox 1 year ago
How about "sapient"? Which means (If I'm not mistaken) "capable of thought"?
This is supposed to be why we are called "homo sapiens sapiens", which (should) mean "man who thinks about thinking".
GoblinKnightLeo 1 year ago
To me, a related question would be.
Would there actually be a niche to fill? Or will it rather be a restoration of "balance" for want of a better word.
When you are cured of an illness. Does that create a niche for a new illness to take hold? The metaphor is stretched to say the least, but it's the best way i can put it into words.
That said, I can see no reason why another sapience species could not evolve. I just don't see it as a necessity simply because we are no longer there.
Tnx 4 the vid
19RedLineR74 1 year ago
stopped at 1:02 and answered its so close to impossible that it might as well be
Stealtheeee 1 year ago
@Stealtheeee I think you might change your mind if you actually watch the video.
TharosTheDragon 1 year ago
@TharosTheDragon don't think so, he's running in such a standard tired way, i've heard this arguement several times all the way through by several different people, anyone who has a critical mind will question it and instantly find a managerie of flaws
Stealtheeee 1 year ago
@Stealtheeee So you're saying AronRa doesn't have a critical mind?
TharosTheDragon 1 year ago
@TharosTheDragon where did u get that from? although i do not know aronra outside youtube so i cannot profess to know whether or not he has a critical mindset
Stealtheeee 1 year ago
@TharosTheDragon oh wait, im talking about the dude in the beginning, his statement is usually followed with an arguement that we have not yet seen a recurrence in a species which is supposed to mean that evolution is false, however, seeing as how the question ends where it does im guessing abdultheimpaler must've heard the statement from a creationist and wanted aronra to correct it
Stealtheeee 1 year ago
@Stealtheeee You're assuming wrong. This has nothing to do with creationism. It's an imaginitive hypothetical situation akin to science fiction. Just watch the video.
TharosTheDragon 1 year ago
@TharosTheDragon ahh i see, ive heard the arguement that way so many times, if phrased as a question it loses signifigance
Stealtheeee 1 year ago
@Stealtheeee hmm might be spelled with a c
Stealtheeee 1 year ago
@Stealtheeee I'm not sure I've ever heard the argument that a lack of recurrence in species proves evolution false. That seems bogus even by creationist standards.
TharosTheDragon 1 year ago
@TharosTheDragon why d'you think i stopped watching? I've heard it in school a lot cuz my grade has a good deal of christians
Stealtheeee 1 year ago
Small question, is that an arapaima on the wall behind you?
xShadowxPhoenix 1 year ago
That would be unlikely that there wouldn't be any human DNA left.Even fossilized DNA can be abstracted.
20lbsledge 1 year ago
Screw it, I'm going to go with George Carlen's joke on this and say, "If the earth needed us it was for one thing, plastic. If we finely kill ourselves off then what would it mater to the earth? it'll just be the earth + plastic.
MrCarbon14 1 year ago
"...if the bonobo's ever pull thier s*%t together." ROFL
Bless those pleasure-seeking little critters. =)
temporaldisplacement 1 year ago
Hey dude you talk too quickly i can't understand
Glasyeur0 1 year ago
his rate of speech is fine, I think that you're too stupid to understand what he is talking about.
hogo1 1 year ago
"If the Bonobos got their shit together". I'm still chuckling! Bloody brilliant quote :D
LostSubsForever 2 years ago
macrogenodexterous may mean able to make complex technologies
arachnophile01 2 years ago
If the Bonobo's get their shit together im off to join them
BFGStevo 2 years ago 22
@BFGStevo It would be like the movie Planet of the Apes.
celshader 1 year ago
Cosmopa-sapienoids.
BusinessIDBAI 2 years ago
I call it... A furry!
Daclunator 2 years ago
Nice coelacanth!
Nosferatu2285 2 years ago 2
What if we gave dolphins hands?
That would be... epic.
Seera8472 2 years ago
I recon "Cat" from Red Dwarf would be a likely candidate!
jimrbsn 2 years ago
Word for the uniquely human mental level? It is not a word, but it is a short phrase: Critical Thinkers.
We are the only species on the planet that does this, according to Moore & Parker (2007) in Critical Thinking: Basics, 8th Edition.
"We humans are unique among animals in our ability to subject our thoughts to rational scrutiny..." (page 2, para. 3)
balanceseeker 2 years ago
is it just in my head,or does Abdultheimpailler look like he should be a member of blue oyster cult,you know...the guys who look like they should have been extras in porno from the 70's,but never rock musicians?
ViralMessiah 2 years ago
I was wondering if a selected breeding program involving chimps, would one day produce a similar intelligence with humans? I've seen some incredible displays of problem solving with well trained subjects. I hope this won't be concidered as "social Darwinism"
toelesshoe 2 years ago
Would the next human level creature be required to be a land animal? I suspect yes since fire doesn't work in water and it played a large role in the development of our technology and spread to colder parts of the Earth.
Aerosteon 2 years ago
"Bonobo's need to get their shit together", Funniest thing I've heard all day,
Aerosteon 2 years ago 3
I don't know, any animal that spends its time having sex, playing with its dong, using bi-sexual behaviour to resolve conflict, otherwise fooling around and eating lots of fruit has its sh*t together in my book!
Imagine if after 9/11, bush had asked osama come over and mutually masturbate with him & the families of the victims to say sorry.
On second thoughts, let's not.
wearealltubes 2 years ago
Possibly the most intelligent post ever on youtube! :)
thisisaguy 2 years ago 3
Given enough time doesn't the probability of anything, however remote the possibility in isolation, approach 1? My answer would have to be yes but it could take a while. The sun could have gone Supernova by the time it happens.
janevski 2 years ago
A sapiodexterous raccoon would be win.
Perspektyva 2 years ago
Pretty good answer I think. However I don't see why humans must die out to 'fill the niche' I think it is entirely possible that an intellectual animal on the same level as humans can arise given time, without the demise of homo sapiens. Of course your answer was framed by the question itself asking whether this would happen IF humans went away.
etatauri 2 years ago
I vote for meerkats being the ancestor species for the next ambitious sapio-architectonic species. (From the combined etymogies of arkhitektos, being able to build physically as well as to systematize knowledge and sapient, to exhibit wisdom or understanding). They are social, intelligent, and not endangered with habits already consistent with making the front limbs available for manipulation. That is, if we wipe out too many primates to give them a sufficient gene pool to reproduce.
laraesque 2 years ago
The odds in favor of humans evolving in exactly the same fashion as to who/how/what we are today are indeed staggeringly large.
Improbability drive kicking in!
Great video.
devjock 2 years ago
Words for things like people... I would go with Humanalogous...
human + analogous = Humanalogous
JSparkleZ2 2 years ago 2
"if the bonobos would get their shit toghether" LMFAO my favorite part.
TheReptilianAgenda 2 years ago
Sure it is possible. Assuming we are living in a infinite universe with an infinite time line everything will happen infinitely often. And even if the universe is doomed to collapse in it self in a new big bang it still might happen but the probability is damn damn damn small. But then it will still definitely happen in one of the coming universes.
Greetings from Lübeck, Germany
Foamy86 2 years ago
Comment removed
Sohtaraz 2 years ago
Okay, here is a question for you. If humans make it to mars, terraform it, and then colonize it. And the all of a sudden, communication and travel becomes impossible for 5000 or so years. Will the human species on mars, have had enough time, to change so much so, that we are no longer able to copulate with them? And for that matter, would we even be genitally compatible?
PaperSoapy 2 years ago 4
I think we would still be genetically compatible, because our generations are so much longer than most other species, and even dogs are still genetically compatible with wolves.
AronRa 2 years ago 6
@AronRa He didn't say genetically compatible. He said genitally compatible. Like "would it fit?"
TharosTheDragon 1 year ago
@AronRa Ehh.. It would depend a lot on environmental and societal influences. For the most part I agree with you(of course), but with current trends on earth and possible incomprehensible exposures on mars, stimuli for radical divergence could occur
xESOTERlC 1 year ago
Humans have been around for approximately 160,000 years right? 5,000 years doesn't really seem to be a long time in the grand scheme of things really. The oldest pyramids of Giza were built no longer than 5,000 years ago. Maybe a unique mutation could randomly occur that shows a benefit in one of the populations and become dominant, but in a "controlled, earth-like" environment it seems unlikely.
Just an opinion of course :D What do ya think?
BrellK 2 years ago
Your right. I mean, in all probability, because it would have to be an earth like environment, they wouldn't need to drastically adapt. But I am still curious, that if we did separate, how long would it take for us to become too different. Or would it ever happen? Are we at the end of the line for macro evolution? Hehe, probably not, but this is really fun to think about.
PaperSoapy 2 years ago
I agree, it's the sort of thing that you can never talk too much about. It's a shame so many people just blindly ignore such a great chance by disbelieving in it. :P
It's interesting because some might say humans no longer have much natural selection (in 1st world countries at least) so mutations could have any sort of effect on two such separated populations.
BrellK 2 years ago
That is a curious thought! I honestly can't see macro evolution occuring among humans on earth. The fact that indigenous populations seperated for thousands of years can still interbreed, for example Australian natives & Inuit (eskimos) Shows humans have the life spans & ganetic divercity to defy speciation for many thousands of years. With the ever shrinking world the chance of a group being isolated long enough to speciate becomes less & less likley.
SkyDoginthetube 2 years ago
'genitally compatible?'
hur hur... sorry.
Yeeksquilack 2 years ago
@PaperSoapy we would probably still be "genitally compatible" and as far as being not able to breed maybe but u think 5000 years would not be enough but human evolution is complicated because theres no actual natural selection
patrickledford420 1 year ago
@PaperSoapy This has happened many times already, as proven by the holy scripture of Star Wars. The alien species such as the Twi'lek and Togruta were isolated from humans and diverged. Also, humans already evolved before us, a long time ago in a galaxy far, far away. So sayeth The Force, amen.
logicked 9 months ago
What about Baboons or Macaques?
Seldom mentioned, often forgotten, I think they have good potential ; ).
heloizyjhenifer 2 years ago
This question and answer reminds me of Red Dwarfs "Cat". A Felissapien being that had evolved for 3Ma from a large litter of kittens whilst the lone crew member was in cryo.
During this time the Felissapien population experienced the "tool age" where they figured how to use the can openers and vending machines. They also decimated their own kind by violent religous wars, by one faction who knew their Gods name was Loister, and the other faction he knew their Gods name was Lister.
ChickenHawk110 2 years ago
AronRa, excellent video, very well detailed and explained.
I have a question which I hope you can answer.
It is anyway possible (and probable) that our evolution can be able to produce another set of human like beings to co-inhabit the earth with "normal" humans?
Sort of like the Cro-Magnons and Neanderthals situation? If it has done it before, can it do it again?
Will it use the human dna, primate dna, both or neither?
Does this make sense?
I'd love to hear your expertise on this.
notimefortheliving 2 years ago
From my limited understanding of evolution, that would not be possible, unless specific conditions were met.
The 2 groups would have to be separated from each other is some manner to not allow the 2 gene pools to mix and for a long enough period of time to allow for substantial mutation, and the groups would have to live in different environments.
Otherwise the 2 groups would not be 2 distinct groups.
Read "The Greatest Show On Earth" by Richard Dawkins, great read on evolution.
jbiemans77 2 years ago
It has been speculated that some people have neanderthal ancestry. Might have been proved I ma not sure.
2042nicky 2 years ago
"AronRanian Functionality" - To fulfill the functionality to the ecosystem identical to that of present, modern human beings complete with equal intellect, communcation skills, self awareness, etc.
Ripley747 2 years ago
homotyrannasapienus
muddieair 2 years ago
If all human DNA would disappear, I guess all primates would disappear also, along with other species. So the question is actually: Did humans evolve?
I admire your patience to answer these people.
prakkari 2 years ago
Theoretically, given an infinite amount of time two separate authors just might write the same exact book. Similarly new humans may evolve again. Of course if this were true in a finite amount of time in some other cosmos perhaps I will be writing the same comment on Aarons video.
One could even say that nothing is going to happen only once if we have infinite number of universes (and time).
Have a feeling that Im missing something.
Respect Aaron.
namesnikola 2 years ago
2nd try at posting comment.
Although your answer was brilliant, it was a bit unfair to the many people who could only stand there and watch your answer fly right over their heads. Let's go simpler
*NO*
Why not? Because the initial conditions and original organisms of which we evolved from, no longer exist.
In evolutionary terms,
"We are what we are today, because of what we were yesterday" Elf Ghost - Realist, atheist, agnostic, anti-theist.
ElfGhostX 2 years ago
This has been flagged as spam show
the truth is. there is no truth. only what you wish to percieve. and only you have control over your choices. You cant change the wind but you can ajust sails to get where you want
mammonra 2 years ago
No mammonra, the truth remains the truth whether you're able to accept it or not. I cannot choose what to believe the way you can, but even you cannot make up your own truth and have it actually be true. To even imagine that you could is to deceive yourself.
AronRa 2 years ago 15
@AronRa Interesting discussion. Wouldn't it be just as likely that even with us here that there could eventually be another species that evolves in a similar way as we did? That is if we were able to survive long enough to see it, which I assume is improbable. We'd actually observe the evolution first hand and document it. Where might we be as a species then? Are there any theories in place predicting the evolutionary processes in a species now? Is it even possible to predict such a thing?
Reip187 6 months ago
its improbable not impossible :P
sacredgeometry 2 years ago
Damn those Bonobo's, with their shit all over the place.
Spoonfoon 2 years ago
I'll even bet heaven is actually secret code used by by beings travelling from the 11th dimension into ours. We're not sure tho. String theory is not a solid theory just yet. Many gaps still exist.
I think there is some arugement that God actually lives in the 12th dimension, but there is no code name for it like heaven.
I'm sure you got some solid evidence tho as to where this logic is faulty?
Prove to me there is NO 11th or12th dimension and that I'm wrong.
You can't. It's axiomatic
HisTruthbeUNKOWN 2 years ago
Here's how it's gonna be: *POOF* Humanity is gone, in 1 billion years dolphins are gonna crawl onto land wondering why all the boat motors stopped. Their tails will split and become legs, and their flippers will form hands. They will start worshipping the "God" "CNN" and his consort "The Emergency Broadcast System" They will use dynamite to make fishing easier they will develop a taste for beer, french fries, and canned peaches. They will use elevators as toilets, and bathrooms as nurseries.
gforce527 2 years ago
"...they might even be apes, if the bonobos would get their shit together."
LOL
movsepian 2 years ago
"comparably competent creatures currently creeping about."
Haha! :P
Raakiszh 2 years ago
I'd bet on Bonobos- social enough to learn from one another, if they somehow got over being "conservative" in their problem solving. Unfortunately, if we go, we'll likely have killed them off already.
Off-chance bet: rats. Social, hands of a sort, unlikely to be killed off by us before we go.
ReadingApe 2 years ago
"if the Benobo's could their shit together" LOL!
Rockster969 2 years ago
The super parasite species.
nadiaTeeze 2 years ago
If raccoons evolved and developed civilization and eventually a form of waste management system, would they still be likely to get into and tip over their own trashcans?
0okamino 2 years ago
lol
nice video
Idontknowwhat2type 2 years ago
They call it the "Cerebral Niche".
FlowCell 2 years ago
look at squid/octopi, Aron. they seem to have the brainpower and the necessary appendages to evolve into a sentient life form. the sheer amount of brainpower needed to control their camouflage is staggering. just imagine if that was re-purposed towards complex thought. then we have a species that are "walking" on the ocean floor. it's all very interesting stuff.
vinak963 2 years ago 2
"They might even be apes if bonobos would get their shit together."
LOL. Bonobos are hilariously loopy.
saltygrasshopper 2 years ago 3
cognizoid?
senorspiegel 2 years ago
there are peopleish apes right now, the bonobos seem to be able to learn to write and use advanced tools(not just sticks to poke ants out of trees)
might humans die out, and they find our stuff(wich ofcourse wont vanish with us) they prolly adapt to be able to use them, over time ofcourse.
that is atleast the way i think they might evolve.
munsking 2 years ago
sounds like a good story for a multiverse where different universes have different species evolving to sentients dominance
gnosticwarrior70 2 years ago
I didn't see if this was asked further back in the comments, but why would birds be an unviable base for a technological species? Birds do build (though I suppose other non-dexterous animals such as beavers do as well), and as I'm sure you know as a parrot-owner are very dexterous. Birds already use tools, with their beaks and with their feet. What makes bird feet less suited for adapting to higher dexterity than human hands? We after all do not (in general) have dexterous toes.
mathlaura 2 years ago
I think the capacity to develop a brain large enough to learn such things is a requirements above all. Birds do not have that capacity innate to them at this time. I know that they can learn to mimic and reproduce language and sounds that they hear...but I do not believe that alone is enough to get them started.
Trenaur 2 years ago
The word you are looking for is People-ish... Yes.
Fishysticksauce 2 years ago
I think you're looking for the term "Metacognition," knowing about knowing or cognition about cognition. Basically, the level of intelligence that allows one to recognize one's own thought and think about the mind itself.
Vekin86 2 years ago
well what if only a certain set of very specific conditions could allow a species to evolve to the point where they developed sapience and who could develop technology? Then theoretically that species would adopt extremely similar biological mutations to the ones humans already have. There used to be many hominid species who were very intelligent and capable of building tools yet had no development as a species like humans had. Maybe thats an indication of the demand on sapience.
doedicurus 2 years ago
"Comparative, competent, currently, creeping about", what a mouthful lol
fouf88 2 years ago
a lot of my friends are primates
sgthunter09 2 years ago
What do you think would happen if we introduced the MYH16 mutation to pan chimps or bonobos, so that jaw muscle would be weaker and their crania could potentially expand?
GBart 2 years ago
Comment removed
GBart 2 years ago
I think there is an intelligent, nimble, omnivorous mammal, already accustomed to human civilization in North America that could easily replace us. Yes, raccoons will inherit the Earth
NewMargaritaville 2 years ago
lol! Bonobos are too busy fucking to do anything productive.
CaptChrisT 2 years ago 4
Just a side question: Is an "Impailler" a person who totes buckets?
Turandot29 2 years ago
My question about this would be... do you think maybe humans evolved from monkeys (i believe we are most closely related to baboons) and Neanderthals evolved from something more stocky like a gorilla? I was just thinking if that's the case then the earth would have already witnessed those 2 species coming close to the intelligence we now have. So seeing it happen again wouldn't be all that improbable.
schubird43 2 years ago
Homo sapiens and Homo neanderthalensis are both sister species, both of which descend from Homo erectus. We definitely did not evolve from gorillas and are even more distant from baboons. Check my favorites for the video, 'Turns out we did come from monkeys'. It explains our taxonomy more accurately.
AronRa 2 years ago
if it is probable that, after the extinction of humans, humans could come into being once again via evolution, and if time goes on infinetly, then such a re-birth will occur.
jhayn002 2 years ago
whereas some life is not conscious at all, other life is conscious but not self-conscious. All consciousness is "intentional", that is, all consciousness is consciousness of something. whereas lower life forms are consciousness of things in the world, humans have the capacity to become conscious of being concious of the world. this "self-consciouness" is the condition for the possibility of writing literature, doing philosophy, building modern cities, and preparing for out future.
jhayn002 2 years ago
the conceptual term that is traditionally used to distinguish the human being from all other life is "self-conscious"
jhayn002 2 years ago
How can humans grow evolutionary without killing each other-and the planet ?! Or even exist together in the next 100 years ? Religion,governments-Media thats it-- but WTF,it's just a blink of time-future generations are doomed to have an ant jar battle! No a food battle ,an energy battle,a marketing battle ? NA, fucked up shit is always gonna happen--we're the chikens of Darmstadt !!
steviebkhall 2 years ago
Why didn't you just say 'no'? Just kidding:)
aaaaicit2 2 years ago
I believe in God, and I agree highly with this guy. Why does the amazing atheist have more views? This guy doesn't curse as much or jiggle. I think I might convert to atheism cuz of this guy .lol
Dudex58 2 years ago 3
Great Answer!
GordonYKWong 2 years ago
Blaise Pascal: 1623-1662 French Mathemetician , "There is a God-shaped vacuum in the heart of every man which cannot be filled by any created thing, but only by God, the Creator, made known through Jesus Christ." (Pensees)? But by Jesus Christ and in Jesus Christ, we prove God and teach doctrine and morals. Jesus Christ, then, is the true God of men."
shieldsff 2 years ago
beastly- relative to Newton and other prominent theist scientist, it is gross misrepresentation to assert that they viewed the Bible as scientific textbook per se, or anything of the sort Rather, faith, reason & the God of the Bible account are essential constituent elements of the worldview of believers. That this eludes UR mind is not at all surprising- this is why the Lord said a man MUST BE born again to see the Kingdom of God.
shieldsff 2 years ago
Some cephalopods are quite intelligent. Their tentacles can be used for any number of tasks. Because of their soft tissue, there is not much that would limit their brin size. What has kept squids from becoming as smart as humans, or would they, assuming they survive us, be likely successors for the role of 'most self-conscious species on earth'?
Lingula77 2 years ago
Hey Aron,
I salute your attempt to coin a new word and get it accepted. I leave that in your capable hands. But for youtubers, I suggest another new word that is closer to home and possibly more useful;
Chronocide
Obviously this is just, "killing time."
scumpic 2 years ago
and again i am enlightened by the brilliant mind of AronRa :o)
If I would read it can't understand...
If it's explainted to me like AronRa does, I can understand
These Videos are very important for my education
Care4alot 2 years ago
NO EVIDENCE will ever be revealed to you by God.
You have to be "open" to the evidence first which YOU ARE NOT.
bornagain001 2 years ago
Hahaha..."if the bonobos would get their shit together." I almost died laughing!!!
saxamachick 2 years ago
AronRa has perfect diction. I just wish he would slow his pace of delivery a little. :-)
KiaOra53 2 years ago
lol@the bonobo comment...they should get their shit together, but theyre too busy fucking each other and having a great time :D
Tryambakam 2 years ago
And then God said let the plague of bornagain001 be upon this video and reduce all comments to idiocy that is utterly unrelated to the video's topic.
Whoever1224 2 years ago
Ok, that was off-topic. I've been drinking.
Zirantonus 2 years ago
That an omnipotent and omniscient being would use it's own creation, (Humans), to impart the knowledge of itself, to themselves, via a BOOK, is absurd. If indeed there is a 'God', rest assured that it is a 'thing', and you will never, ever know it.
Zirantonus 2 years ago 4
This comment has received too many negative votes show
"If indeed there is a 'God', rest assured that it is a 'thing', and you will never, ever know it."
Sorry to BURST YOUR BUBBLE. I do know my Lord and Savior and you could too if you actually cared. The SIN which consumes your life also BLINDS YOU to the TRUTH God would have you know. You suffer from the same SIN which brought down Satan---PRIDE.
bornagain001 2 years ago
Shut the fuck up.
Jski94 2 years ago
And you suffer from the same sin that will eventually bring down humanity: stupidity.
ammoMtaFoY 2 years ago 4
This comment has received too many negative votes show
"Professing THEMSELVES to be wise, they became FOOLS." Romans 1:22
bornagain001 2 years ago
@bornagain001.
yeah, that absolutely undoes everything he said.
btw
/watch?v=fdVucvo-kDU
ScepticalMisha 2 years ago
Pure christian self-pwnage
PoliomanGamer 2 years ago
FAIL. Put the fiction back on the shelf. This comment section is for knowledge and facts.
Alifornication 2 years ago
Light blinded fool! Sin is a device of control! Not by satan - but by Men, of Men.
Virtues is what you call the diminishing, the meek, the subordinate, the weak, the cowardly.
Sin is what you call the challenging, the arousing, the inspiring, the ambitious, the strong.
I want no part of your "virtues". "Sin" is what I want to live, to breathe, to produce. Fear is the enemy. Not Sin.
NichtDieseTone 2 years ago
bornagain001, your accusations really hurt. I used to be a Christian, and when I began to have doubts about your god existing, I prayed to him every day for guidance. This is, of course, not why I stopped believing in your deity.
However, to say that a skeptic does not "know" your God because they don't "actually care" is just offensive and hurtful, since it implies that other skeptics are skeptics because they don't care, myself included.
SugarWater00 2 years ago
The problem is, you put the cart before the horse.
God does NOT hear ANY prayers from any unrepentant sinners. If you have not SURRENDERED your life to Jesus Christ, you do NOT HAVE a mediator. It is only after you surrender your life to the authority of Christ, will God begin to reveal Himself to you and only then will He begin to hear your prayers. You stopped believing because you NEVER HAD FAITH. Ephesians 2:8-9 explains SALVATION and how you receive it.
bornagain001 2 years ago
I was repentant. I apologized for my sins, thoroughly regretting my mistakes and telling this to God. I wasn't expecting any kind of magical apparition, or hearing a mystical voice. I was simply expecting some kind of guidance. Also, as omniscient, he would logically know about all prayers. And as an omni-benevolent being would care enough about every individual person to answer all their prayers.
Saying "Oh you didn't believe hard enough" is just mocking my personal struggle.
SugarWater00 2 years ago
"I was repentant. I apologized for my sins, thoroughly regretting my mistakes and telling this to God."
An apology is NOT the same as SURRENDER. When you surrender Your life, you become a follower of Jesus Christ. As a follower of Christ, you live in FAITH. Check your PM for 14 signs of a truly repentant sinner.
bornagain001 2 years ago
Holy fucking shit bornagain001. If we surrender to Christ then WHERE THE FUCK IS THE FREE WILL. nub
dwoclan 2 years ago
Even as a Christian we still exert our FREE WILL as exampled by Ted Haggard. FREE WILL always exists but as a follower of Christ we are to surrender that FREE WILL to the authority of Christ so that HE may you us for His purpose and direct our lives. When we refuse to relinquish our free will, the results will end up like what happened to Brother Ted.
bornagain001 2 years ago
So your telling me that Ted Haggard was not a christian? Also if you are supposed to surrender this free will to god then wouldn't that be equivalent to making man with no free will? What your saying is that we gain free will so that we can either rebel from Christ or become one of his puppets which would make your god somewhat evil because he is making something that will only be detrimental.
dwoclan 2 years ago
"So your telling me that Ted Haggard was not a christian? "
NOPE. I am sure Ted was a Christian and he asserted his FREE WILL to go against God's Will for his life. The result was a disgraceful downfall and loss of his ministry. God CREATES you with free will. Just as Japan and Germany surrendered to the U.S.,man must surrender his free will to God if he wants God to adopt him into His family.
bornagain001 2 years ago
With you japan and germany surrendering to the allies analogy it doesn't work the same. They surrendered because the allies were going to kill them all therefor we were threatening death or surrender your free will of ruling your country. With the christian god its either go to hell or have no free will, which is sorta the same but the allies didn't create Germany and Japan. Also this would still end up with god planning on humans to not have free will.
dwoclan 2 years ago
"They surrendered because the allies were going to kill them all therefor we were threatening death or surrender your free will of ruling your country."
CORRECT. God does NOT force anyone to surrender their will to Him. It is done voluntarily by the BELIEVER who KNOWS God's plans will far exceed our own plans. For 55 years I lived in rebellion to God. Please...don't make the same mistake I did.
bornagain001 2 years ago
Actually he does attempt to force you to surrender your freewill by threatening that all who don't will all go to hell.
dwoclan 2 years ago
You can't know gods plan. Your god expressly forbids it. "Isaiah 55:8 My thoughts are not your thoughts, my acts are not your acts."
And I'm not going to make the same mistake you did, I'm going to realize that your god is as false as Zeus and orbital tea-kettles, and live a life for myself, for my family, for my friends, and for my fellow humans, not one that is subservient to an invisible non-existent sky daddy.
Have a nice day.
Konraden 2 years ago
You can't know gods plan. Your god expressly forbids it. "Isaiah 55:8 My thoughts are not your thoughts, my acts are not your acts."
That you for your scripture. Here's another one FOR YOU that will explain why you don't think the BELIEVER can KNOW God's plans.
1 Corinthians 2:14-16
bornagain001 2 years ago
Isaiah is your bible, dumbass. I'm the atheist, you're the Christian. Giving bible quotes to a Christian is rather fruitless, because I see the entire thing as non-sense. It's only effective against people who actually *believe* the thing, like you.
And thank you for proving once again that the bible likes to proclaim bigotry. Christans can judge anyone they want, but Non-christians cannot judge Christians.
1 Cor 2:14-16. THat's what that is.
Konraden 2 years ago
"Christans can judge anyone they want, but Non-christians cannot judge Christians."
Trust me on this one. It's FAR BETTER for me as a Christian to call you on YOUR SIN, than it is to die and stand before CHRIST who will Judge you for eternity.
bornagain001 2 years ago
Pascal's Wager? Are you sure you have the right god? Are you positive that your god rewards unquestioning belief, and punishes disbelief, despite the altrusim of the disbeliever?
Because a lot of gods in the past have also claimed rewards and punishments for believing and not believing. You might want to go re-evaluate your religion and make sure you absolutely want to go with this god over the 3500 others that have been postulated to exist.
Konraden 2 years ago
"Are you sure you have the right god?"
100%. I spoke to Him this morning.
"Are you positive that your god rewards unquestioning belief, and punishes disbelief, despite the altrusim of the disbeliever?"
Yep. Spoke to Him this morning.
"Because a lot of gods in the past have also claimed rewards and punishments for believing and not believing. "
FALSE GODS
bornagain001 2 years ago
"100%. I spoke to Him this morning."
And a Muslim would say the same thing about Allah. A Hindu would say the same thing about Shiva. A Wiccan or Shinto would say the same things about nature spirits and shit. Ancient Nordic folk would say the same thing about Odin.
"FALSE GODS"
Which people like you dismiss for the same reason people like me blow them all off, and your invisible friend as well. No one can provide any empirical evidence such deities exist, yours included.
megagrey 2 years ago 2
"And a Muslim would say the same thing about Allah. A Hindu would say the same thing about Shiva. A Wiccan or Shinto would say the same things about nature spirits and shit. Ancient Nordic folk would say the same thing about Odin."
The problem is that neither Shiva, Odin or Allah has sent someone to bring LIGHT into the DARK world in which you exist. Perhaps they are all on vacation or asleep. Perhaps they do not care. GOD DOES. He has sent me to speak to you. WILL YOU LISTEN?
bornagain001 2 years ago
How predictable. At least you didn't copy-and-paste "The world offers you many religions but only ONE savior!" for the umpteenth time. Maybe you've learned that copy-and-paste answers are not the way to win an argument, but you're still typing every other word in caps. Ugh, such a slow learner....
"He has sent me to speak to you. WILL YOU LISTEN?"
Hard to take someone pushing sixty who has an invisible friend, and screams and demands attention like a whiny toddler, very seriously.
megagrey 2 years ago
So the answer is NO? And yet God sends his people all over the world to bring the LOST to righteousness and yet because of the SIN which CONSUMES YOUR LIFE, you would rather spend eternity in Hell.
Proverbs 12:15 comes to mind.
"The way of a FOOL is right in his own eyes, But he who heeds counsel is wise. "
bornagain001 2 years ago
Yet none of you braying, self-righteous pests has evidence. No scientific evidence that invalidates all the research and evidence supporting evolution, the formation of the solar system, and every other scientific theory that undermines your precious Bible. No evidence of miracles or supernatural forces that would set your claims about the Christian god apart from the deities of every other religion.
And for the last time, quoting a storybook that fails to stand up to real scrutiny is idiocy.
megagrey 2 years ago
Nope.
Turandot29 2 years ago
You appear to be exhibiting delusional behavior.
And, of course, special pleading. What exactly differentiates your god from the other 3500 other gods?
Konraden 2 years ago
"And, of course, special pleading. What exactly differentiates your god from the other 3500 other gods?"
I already know how he'll answer. He'll use one of his cut-and-paste answers, raving that the world gives you many religions but ONE savior. Gleefully ignoring that Christianity is the only religion obsessively stressing the need for any savior in the first place.
megagrey 2 years ago
Which surprises me, because that just screams "CONTROL." People who already feel worthless and down trodden (The peasants if you will) would want more in life to the point of blindly following people that say they can be saved by giving money to the church and doing whatever they say without question.
Konraden 2 years ago
"I was simply expecting some kind of guidance."
Did you find yourself IMMERSED in God's Word.
Did you find a Bible preaching Church?
Did you find yourself wanting to listen to Christian radio more than any other stations?
If not...how were you expecting to get the answers you claimed to seek? God uses OTHERS (especially pastors and HIS WORD) to give you answers.
bornagain001 2 years ago