F-16 is more than 20 years old. It was a very good Fighter ( my friend knew an Israeli Pilot), however, Jas 39 is the next generation; you cannot compare the two.
@terrygand These generation designations are just stupid. they are made by americans to make their own planes sound better, and sell better. No other reason.
Om f-35 dras med samma problem som F-22 kommer bara ett fåtal plan vara stridsdugliga emellanåt. Rost och dåliga komponenter(flygdator,keramiken vid utblåset,och fly-by-wire system) och yttre beläggning är bara några av problemen med F-22. Rosten är trots allt den värsta då den slagit ut en stor del av USA's F-22 flotta. Med Norges klimat kan detta bli ödesdigert med fruktansvärda kostnader på ett redan dyrt plan. Norge är ett rikt land, men endå:P
Heh...as I predicted, Norway chose the wrong plane. The US has just grounded ALL their F-35A's due to major problems, that's what you get when you cover up your problems instead of fixing them. But ok Lockheed is smart, now they can get paid to fix th problems and take all the time they want to do it. Good Luck fixing the same problems as the USA.
Norway needed an aircraft that could fil multiple roles and be capable of fighting and BEATING the sukhoi, therefore they chose the f-35 and not the JAS.
@iqtuz The Gripen would probably get its ass handed to it by the F-22. But against the F-35? Facts are coming out and it seems like the F-35 will be expensive to buy, expensive to maintain, expensive to train pilots and it even seems that the supposedly super-stealthy fighter is about (or less) stealthy as the Gripen.
It seems that the F-35 isn't better than the Gripen NG in ANY way.
@hogge87 F-35 is a 5th gen STEALTH fighter with the stealth capability similarto the f-22. The Gripen is a _NON_ stealthy 4th gen fighter. Think about it, the next time Norway will upgrade it's fleet will probably be in 30+ years. Yes, Gripen preforms well at todays standards, but it's not a plane worth investing in if you are looking for a long-therm fighter
The Gripen is much smaller than the F-35 and it's got a small radar signature. The F-35 you're buying isn't as stealthy as the F-35 that won the JSF contest, because the manufacturer couldn't fit all that tech and still maintain the stealth. The F-35 is so bad that the Obama administration last year said they're not going to fund it anymore. The US Navy has decided to buy more F-18's instead.
And the Gripen is planned to remain in service within the Swedish Air Force to AT LEAST 2040.
@hogge87 Still, f-35 is stealthier than the gripen. And considering NATO's "enemies" aka potential, they needed an aircraft that can compete with the new 5th gen sukhoi's. The Gripen cannot.
Not to burst your bubble, but the F-35 cannot compete with PAK-FA. The F-22 might, but not the F-35. The F-35 isn't as stealthy, as cheap, as manouverable or as versitile as it was supposed to, and it's all but certain that it'll ever enter service. Stealth is more of a propaganda weapon than anything else. It's only a matter of time before radars improve, and the stealth doesen't work. The F-35 has the radar crossection of a B2 Spirit: a 30 year old intercontinental nuclear bomber!
What on earth gives you that idea? If you want an airforce with a set ammount of aircraft, buy American. If you want the best airforce possible for a set ammount of money, well then there's no alternative to the Gripen.
Not to mention that I've seen some of the material that Norway made their decision upon. They compared the F-35A to the JAS39A, even though the plane that was competing against the F-35 actually was the Gripen E/F. And the E/F is most definitely on par with F-35.
Denmark still have to deside! The contesters are F-18 Super Hornet, The GripenNG or the F-35. I personaly perfer a twin enigne design. I would rather choose the Eurofighter if I could deside. However the GripenNG is a much improved design which include longer range. Diffucult decision! Greetings from Copenhagen.
2010:Lockheed Martin test pilot David Nelson remained airborne for 89 minutes. This allowed several extra test points to be cecked, which included cycling the undercarriage, 360 deg rolls and raising the nose to 20 deg angle of attack.
F-35A is thus in much the same testing situation that the Gripen was in 1989.
Right choice!? Norway will have to wait a long time for this aircraft and in the meantime fly their ancient F16
Kolla här, jas 39 gripen var byggt för att slå tillbaks ett anfall över havet från ryssland bla och det byggdes för att passa svensk taktik, svenskt landskap och svensk ekonomi. Inget plan kan ersätta jas i att försvara sverige. Nu snackar jag om de vanliga JAS men JAS 39 NG kommer att vara anpassat för den internationella marknaden :)
Theres only one thing you can do with a F35 in case of war. Fly them to England. The F35 is dependent on large airbases and you cant defent your bases from a mix of ballastic and cruise missles. JAS can operate from roads.
@thugproofclips I didnt say it wasnt worth a shit. I just said that it was dependent on large stationary airbases to survive and that Norway couldnt defend such airbases. A problem that both Taiwan and South Corea has to. Its inferior on flight characteristics and hopefully superior on information characteristics, ewen if you havent proofed that yet. It has a range of 2000km so the plan might have been to base them in England anyway
@thugproofclips Ive heard hundreds of such comments but if you take the time and study the facts the F35 is inferior as a airplane. It relies totally of what you call information warfare, a concept that has never been tested against a competent advisory. You have a long line of aircraft in aviation history that was an success until it met a good opponent. The Stuka and the Zero being two of them. So im very sceptical.....
@thugproofclips well. its your money. Try and defend yor airspace with a fighter that flies 500 km / h than the other side with or without afterburner.
The polacks did. Their government ordered the F-16, even though pilots, engineers, officers and financial advisors preferred the Gripen. The reason? The government wanted to kiss the US governments ass.
As it turned out, to make the F-16 to seem cheaper, the government compared the price of Gripens+training+spare parts+future upgrades to... just buying F-16's. So now the polacks have more planes than capable pilots, and a fleet of brand new, grounded planes lacking spare parts.
@thugproofclips It's also a well known fact that the F-16 is a poor fighter. Both the Viggen and Draken could outperform F-16's until they went out of service.
@IntronDepot1 The Israelis use the F-16 as a bomber. Their air-air capability comes from their F-15's.
Greece and Turkey are feared due to their pure numbers.
And I must correct my previous statement: the F-16 WAS a poor fighter. However, I stick to my statement that the Viggen was a supperior fighter to the F-16 until the Viggen was pulled from service.
Norway thinks it's better to have happy NATO-friends compared to a better plane. If somthing happens they will have a great war-machine in the back, and not just great planes....
from me reading all the coments , lets see which fighter would last in a high threat invirment , the f-35 is a 5th gen fighter with up to date avionics , now the grippen is a 4.5 gen fighter but it doesnt have the 5th gen technoligy like the f-35 , so in my opinion the f-35 is way better.
@homboy107 depends on the role and the enemy, yes the technology give the F35 a theoretical advantage in air-to-air combat but are Norway likely to come up against a sophisticated well trained enemy airforce? It isn't all rosy on the JSF project, only time will tell if a large number of airforces have bought into an instantly inadequate overprice and under performing heap of s**t or the best fighter aircraft ever produced. I'm keen not to get involved in ignorant arguments, only time will tell.
It's kind of funny that you would say that, considering that the JSF was announced as the "Ground attack plane, of the century", not really a fighter. Also Lockheed Martin altered the specifications for a 5:th generation fighter so that the JSF could fit into that category.
so in my oppinion:
a) norway should have choosen JAS 39 Gripen
b) also they shouldn't have lied by saying the Gripen is more expensive. they should have told the norwegian people they just wanted protection.
@strv90 Norway should have bought planes from people with proper reliable technology, made to operate in the arctic conditions of our part of the world. I know I'm gonna get flamed for this, but norway should have bough MiG's.
I would say that Jas 39 Gripen is the best. The Gripen is just as stealthy as the JSF-35 because of it's small body. I don't know much about the complete facts so Im not gonna say anything about that.
@AtomicSWE Then write like an adult. 'This sucks thats crap...' F-35 has 3 variants mate not all of them are VTOL. VTOL's are designed mainly for the USMC. Its not a true strike aircraft when it comes to range and payload. Its a special requirement aircraft so to speak like the Harrier. Most F-35's will be the Alpha model. Nothing not even the F-22 Raptor even comes close when it comes to avionics compared with the F-35.
@TuAFFalcon saying that the radar cross section of the F22 is smaller and features all aspect stealth... the F35 has a larger cross section and reports say it may only take a offset of 15 degrees from the nose of the F35 to render the stealth useless... I don't want to argue about things that are only speculation, only time will tell!
@OliverWilby Ye its YouTube... I sort of got used to it. Hey besides this video should be comparing the Gripen NG to the F-35. More compatible. Anyways for now i see the F-35 as a flying computer mostly reliant on its electronics rather then its performance. It will detect, jam, co-ordinate with air to air fighters that are more capable of taking out the air threats. I expect some losses but it will be produced in large numbers. You must understand it is mainly an Strike aircraft.
@TuAFFalcon It will be capable of launching Cruise missiles. It will stand off from the enemy and launch missiles rather then short range JDAM's and stay 'hidden' with its stealth if the threat has advanced SAM's.
@TheMilitaryTactics wrong, wrong, wrong... you found it on a site called fighter-planes(dot)com??? well 1 that was the old gripen. 2 there is alot of other fact wrong on thats site so i woundent trust it :) well tryed kid
F-35 har beskrivits som ett plan som är dyrare än alla andra tillsammans men som ändå inte riktigt är lika bra som nått annat på egentligen någonting. Det finns inte en F-35 som kan lösa F-22 uppgifter eller det som uppgraderade F-16 redan klarar av mot markmål. F-35 är så avancerat och har så minimal uppsättning vapen att den i princip bara duger till att precitionsbomba flygplan stående på marken. Norge ska väl inte anfalla andra länder? JAS är ett kostnadseffektivt försvarsvapen mot luftmål
@911205KW also the F-35 is going to be quiet (well by jet standard's) so people will not notice it as easy also the speed on the F-35 is not bad because it can go past Mach 1 but it doesn't need to the weapon's can be as from JDAM's to AMRAAM's and well pretty much anything in-between as well and also the pilot's themselves will have it easier to make the right choices faster. also the air-craft will be very much suited to take on other air-craft's when intercepting without harming the pilot.
@911205KW to be detected and also to have the ability to detect the other 95% of engagement's are done with BVR missiles so the F-35 will have an advantage but luckily in the Swedish air-force both these plane's will be used.
@911205KW Well the F-22 for a start is more manoeuvrable then the JAS can sustain a turn of 20 degree's the F-22 can sustain a turning degree of 30+, so really the F-22 also with lowered Infra-red signature, can dodge heat seeking missiles very easily and in almost all category's the F-22 is grossly out performing any other fighter, the F-35 will be able to just go in and well shoot at any other air-craft or ship using the same weapon's as the JAS. also the stealth play's a big role to not
@911205KW Well i do not know how i do not have a degree in aerodynamics but I am saying facts if you do not think i am right prove me wrong back up that the JAS is more manoeuvrable. also the F/A-22A travels at 1.7 Mach without after burners at 52,000 feet the JAS goes up to about 60,000 feet but cant travel in supersonic unless it uses it's after burners but then it exposes it's self to heat seeking missiles. so the F/A-22A is not just faster but more also more manoeuvrable.
@911205KW no without after burners the F/A-22A goes up to 1.7 Mach with after burners it goes to 2.25 Mach. the F/A-22A has a higher T/W the JAS has one of 0.97 the F/A-22A has one of 1.08 so the F/A-22A has a higher climb rate therefore. but look the fact is is the the F/A-22A is the best better in nearly all the category it has pretty much the same top speed (2/2.25 Mach) but other then that both planes were built for different purposes. JAS was built for high quality but cheap.
@TheMilitaryTactics the f-22 is not eaven close to as manuverable as the gripen. saw it on discovery channel. they said that f-22 raptor had everything witch made it into a "flying turkey" and way less manouverable
@TheSwekebab Prove this and also I have better prove and more prove then the "Discovery Channel" as I have the prove and I can display it for all to see. Do you?
@TheSwekebab On the Discovery channel again they rate by the best of the time that's why the P-51 one is the best in the military channels view. but in a modern battlefield the F-22 is the best it takes on 5/6 other planes at the same time.
@TheMilitaryTactics dont tell me stuff i allready know ^^ im just trying to tell you that its not eaven as close to as manuverable as gripen... im not saying gripen is better...
im trying to tell you that a plane that is described as a "flying turkey" cant be eaven close to as manouverable as a lightweight plane like the gripen ^^ and no it can take 5 planes alone... the eurofighter won against it 1v1
@TheSwekebab Maximum instantaneous turn rate: 30 degrees/second
Maximum sustained turn rate: 20 degrees/second. That is for the JAS 39 this is the F-22A Maximum sustained turn rate: 28 degrees/second (The instantaneous turn rate is classified still). also the ratio of kills of the F-22A and the EF-2000 is 10.1(EF-200):1(F-22A).
@TheMilitaryTactics I don't remember the proof, it was an exercise in India I believe, or somewhere in the desert.
JAS39 was the only aircraft of like 7 to start up every single time in the desert heat, it also got a kill on an EF2000.
In an exercise in Alaska a few years ago, Sweden brough old JAS39B's (4th gen), and we able to get 6 kills on F16 Vipers, the F16's couldn't even get a single lock on a JAS39, which got 100 Ops success...
@SuperColossal33 Can you present evidence to support these claims if not then we have nothing to settle here also I would not consider the JAS39 to be having the best exercise ops rate's but if you can show me that it does then show please as I would be very much wanting to know and read about it.
@TheSwekebab the f-35 would take out any other plane before the other plane even know if it was there f-35 can pull 9 g's and same with the eurofighter (eurofighter can do it over mach one but what dog fight will be like that)and same with the jas-39
@911205KW But the F/A-22A was built to get and hold air-dominance it's project was in the 90+ billions about 200-300 million per aircraft and the JAS is just 40-45 million the F/A-22A is expensive but will get the job done against any air-craft the JAS was built to be high end good fighter and multi role fit for any air-force.
@911205KW You're thinking about the two proposed designs from SAAB for the SOUTH KOREAN KFX fighter project. North Korea are mainly flying various old MiG's...
@911205KW Hi! It's an ongoing project with the goal to design a multirole fighter for the South Korean and also Indonesian Air force with introduction around 2020. The development of Gripen NG don't have anything to do with this project as far as I know. The only real link is SAAB, which may end up as a partner.
@911205KW I have have a good reason of why the JSF was chosen well it started in red flag where the JAS was beaten by the F-22 (obviously) but it was taking on 4/5 of them at a time and what the F-35 was intended to do was to create that sort of outmatching yet for everyone and to be a very good multi-role at the same time so it not only can go in destroy the same sites and command canter's whilst being virtually invisible to infra-red and radar detection it will also be able to keep the sky.
@pepscalibra4x4 norge har penger til å kjøpe alt det de vil av de beste avanserte våpen..Ja,da kjøper vi jo det som funker best for landet og de allierte.men du snakker som om du ikke fatter hva faen det går ut på.vi kjøper ikke våpen av land for å få en klapp på skulderen,men vi kjøper det beste for å forsvare oss om noe skulle skje!
Det som funkar bäst för Norge är alltså en flygplanstyp som inte funkar?
De orsaker som er regereing angav för att köpa F-35 var rent skitsnack. F-35 kan inte vara billigare än Gripen, om USAs flotta ratat F-35 för att den är för dyr. Stealthegenskaperna ska vara mycket sämre på produktionsplanen än på de prototyper som fick F-35 att vinna JSF-tävlingarna. Det polska försvarets officerer har i alla fall stake nog att säga att de vill ha Gripen, men inte regeringen!
Ni har köpt ett plan som inte existerar. Ni har köpt en fantasi. Ni har köpt ett plan som inte längre har något stöd i sitt hemland. US Navy köper F-18 istället för F-35. Ni har köpt ett plan som är så avancerat, att det inte kan tillverkas. Planet är inte mindre på radar än vad Gripen är, underhållskostnaderna är idiothöga och prestanda är under all kritik!
Precis som polackerna (vars flygvapenstab är pissed), så valde ni att slicka röv istället för att köpa det bästa planet.
@foxinterspecial The Gripens had the SAAB 340 Erieye AEW aircraft patrolling the area for them and the Gripens unexcelled capability of intercommunicating digitally gave them air superiority. They did decline the AWACS the US used as they didn't find it necessary.
Only real way to find out is an actual air to air combat, buddy boy. Even then it will depend on the speed and target acquisition acuity of the ATA sidewinder missles when once launched from the respective fighter jets. Therefore, buddy boy, it all depends on the armaments really. But, lest we forget that once r missile released its a hope that your EW evasive manuevres and chaff measures are superior than your opponent!
One word, NATO. Only a stupid Norweigan enjoy paying overprice for a military airplane they will never use in war. If Norway had balls they would stand up against the preassure from USA/NATO. But weak chickens are weak chickens ...
Advantage of the rafale over the f35 (and btw gripen demo) : the OSF that combine an IRST plus a TV/laser rangefinder channel for positive identification of threats needed before shot. It also allows missile shot with radar turned off, but in a clear sky and below 50km.
@911205KW " It´also the onely multi-role jetfighter in the world. " lol? Is this april fools or what? Oh wait, its not.. You can't be serious!?!? "has the no.1 radar ever made" One that has a detection range of a 1980s apg-63 Maybe 30 years ago, the radar would've been a serious threat, "It can put 9G " Lovely, until it and pilot can pull 50+Gs, its still Aim-9X's food. "start/land in just 400m" F-35B can do it in 0m :)
@cr9527 both the Gripen E/F and F-35 use AESA radar. I hope you are not comparing the old gripens to a modern F-35 when the Gripens have recently been upgraded.
@stefannordberg Lol you do know that saab isnt norweigan right? It is swedish. Sweden has the most high tech military in the world. Sweds are not dumb. Everyday things like a computer mouse and ball bearing and ratchet and alot of games.
Block 50/52 think. get over your SupiriorityComplex F16 has never been as good as gripen they are diffrent generations. F16 is a old plane with new gadgets.
Block 50/52 think. get over your SupiriorityComplex F16 has never been as good as gripen they are diffrent generations. F16 is a old plane with new gadgets.
@cr9527 Well, the scenario was supposed to have Good Guys and Bad Guys. The communication and awareness systems of the Gripens and the Eirieye AEW were far superior to what the US could muster. Once their radar signatures were picked up by a Swedish plane, in most cases the result was a kill. The Falcon pilots were said to be very impressed by the Gripen planes.
F-16 is more than 20 years old. It was a very good Fighter ( my friend knew an Israeli Pilot), however, Jas 39 is the next generation; you cannot compare the two.
terrygand 1 month ago
@terrygand Jas will gonna get rape by JSF
razor11079 1 month ago
@terrygand These generation designations are just stupid. they are made by americans to make their own planes sound better, and sell better. No other reason.
NiamOfAsuras 2 weeks ago
Bad decision Norway... very bad..
wassupMannn 2 months ago
@wassupMannn Indeed it was.
NiamOfAsuras 2 weeks ago
Om f-35 dras med samma problem som F-22 kommer bara ett fåtal plan vara stridsdugliga emellanåt. Rost och dåliga komponenter(flygdator,keramiken vid utblåset,och fly-by-wire system) och yttre beläggning är bara några av problemen med F-22. Rosten är trots allt den värsta då den slagit ut en stor del av USA's F-22 flotta. Med Norges klimat kan detta bli ödesdigert med fruktansvärda kostnader på ett redan dyrt plan. Norge är ett rikt land, men endå:P
ZL4D 3 months ago
Heh...as I predicted, Norway chose the wrong plane. The US has just grounded ALL their F-35A's due to major problems, that's what you get when you cover up your problems instead of fixing them. But ok Lockheed is smart, now they can get paid to fix th problems and take all the time they want to do it. Good Luck fixing the same problems as the USA.
Nizzemancer 6 months ago
Norway needed an aircraft that could fil multiple roles and be capable of fighting and BEATING the sukhoi, therefore they chose the f-35 and not the JAS.
iqtuz 6 months ago
@iqtuz The Gripen would probably get its ass handed to it by the F-22. But against the F-35? Facts are coming out and it seems like the F-35 will be expensive to buy, expensive to maintain, expensive to train pilots and it even seems that the supposedly super-stealthy fighter is about (or less) stealthy as the Gripen.
It seems that the F-35 isn't better than the Gripen NG in ANY way.
hogge87 5 months ago
@hogge87 F-35 is a 5th gen STEALTH fighter with the stealth capability similarto the f-22. The Gripen is a _NON_ stealthy 4th gen fighter. Think about it, the next time Norway will upgrade it's fleet will probably be in 30+ years. Yes, Gripen preforms well at todays standards, but it's not a plane worth investing in if you are looking for a long-therm fighter
iqtuz 5 months ago
@iqtuz
The Gripen is much smaller than the F-35 and it's got a small radar signature. The F-35 you're buying isn't as stealthy as the F-35 that won the JSF contest, because the manufacturer couldn't fit all that tech and still maintain the stealth. The F-35 is so bad that the Obama administration last year said they're not going to fund it anymore. The US Navy has decided to buy more F-18's instead.
And the Gripen is planned to remain in service within the Swedish Air Force to AT LEAST 2040.
hogge87 5 months ago
@hogge87 Still, f-35 is stealthier than the gripen. And considering NATO's "enemies" aka potential, they needed an aircraft that can compete with the new 5th gen sukhoi's. The Gripen cannot.
iqtuz 5 months ago
@iqtuz
Not to burst your bubble, but the F-35 cannot compete with PAK-FA. The F-22 might, but not the F-35. The F-35 isn't as stealthy, as cheap, as manouverable or as versitile as it was supposed to, and it's all but certain that it'll ever enter service. Stealth is more of a propaganda weapon than anything else. It's only a matter of time before radars improve, and the stealth doesen't work. The F-35 has the radar crossection of a B2 Spirit: a 30 year old intercontinental nuclear bomber!
hogge87 5 months ago
@hogge87 And yet it is better than Gripen. I don't know, that says something about the Gripen : )
iqtuz 5 months ago
@iqtuz
What on earth gives you that idea? If you want an airforce with a set ammount of aircraft, buy American. If you want the best airforce possible for a set ammount of money, well then there's no alternative to the Gripen.
Not to mention that I've seen some of the material that Norway made their decision upon. They compared the F-35A to the JAS39A, even though the plane that was competing against the F-35 actually was the Gripen E/F. And the E/F is most definitely on par with F-35.
hogge87 5 months ago
@hogge87 ....which is ridiculously small. Dude, quit talkin, your brain is mush.
IntronDepot1 2 months ago
Comment removed
hogge87 2 months ago
Denmark still have to deside! The contesters are F-18 Super Hornet, The GripenNG or the F-35. I personaly perfer a twin enigne design. I would rather choose the Eurofighter if I could deside. However the GripenNG is a much improved design which include longer range. Diffucult decision! Greetings from Copenhagen.
Badger071 7 months ago
song at 0:52 ?
deltaD07 8 months ago
2010:Lockheed Martin test pilot David Nelson remained airborne for 89 minutes. This allowed several extra test points to be cecked, which included cycling the undercarriage, 360 deg rolls and raising the nose to 20 deg angle of attack.
F-35A is thus in much the same testing situation that the Gripen was in 1989.
Right choice!? Norway will have to wait a long time for this aircraft and in the meantime fly their ancient F16
Flodis68 9 months ago
imsty2
thugproofclips 9 months ago
Kolla här, jas 39 gripen var byggt för att slå tillbaks ett anfall över havet från ryssland bla och det byggdes för att passa svensk taktik, svenskt landskap och svensk ekonomi. Inget plan kan ersätta jas i att försvara sverige. Nu snackar jag om de vanliga JAS men JAS 39 NG kommer att vara anpassat för den internationella marknaden :)
TheSwekebab 9 months ago
@IMSTY2 bygg erat eget då !
å faen glömde ju ni kan ju inget alls utan polacker å svenskar , grattis folket me tummen mitt i näven.
pepscalibra4x4 9 months ago
idiot
thugproofclips 9 months ago
Theres only one thing you can do with a F35 in case of war. Fly them to England. The F35 is dependent on large airbases and you cant defent your bases from a mix of ballastic and cruise missles. JAS can operate from roads.
aon10003 9 months ago
@aon10003 hehe.do u know anything at all about f 35?
thugproofclips 9 months ago
@thugproofclips we will see whos rigth
aon10003 9 months ago
@aon10003 sure.we all know that the f 35 sucks and its not worth shit..come on man
thugproofclips 9 months ago
@thugproofclips I didnt say it wasnt worth a shit. I just said that it was dependent on large stationary airbases to survive and that Norway couldnt defend such airbases. A problem that both Taiwan and South Corea has to. Its inferior on flight characteristics and hopefully superior on information characteristics, ewen if you havent proofed that yet. It has a range of 2000km so the plan might have been to base them in England anyway
aon10003 9 months ago
@aon10003 i dont think norway buy airplanes that dont do what it has to do...
thugproofclips 9 months ago
@thugproofclips Ive heard hundreds of such comments but if you take the time and study the facts the F35 is inferior as a airplane. It relies totally of what you call information warfare, a concept that has never been tested against a competent advisory. You have a long line of aircraft in aviation history that was an success until it met a good opponent. The Stuka and the Zero being two of them. So im very sceptical.....
aon10003 9 months ago
@aon10003 good to know from an expert like you )
thugproofclips 8 months ago
@thugproofclips well. its your money. Try and defend yor airspace with a fighter that flies 500 km / h than the other side with or without afterburner.
I would pay money to see that.
aon10003 8 months ago
@aon10003 lets agree to be disagree...
thugproofclips 8 months ago
@thugproofclips Good idea.....
aon10003 8 months ago
@thugproofclips
The polacks did. Their government ordered the F-16, even though pilots, engineers, officers and financial advisors preferred the Gripen. The reason? The government wanted to kiss the US governments ass.
As it turned out, to make the F-16 to seem cheaper, the government compared the price of Gripens+training+spare parts+future upgrades to... just buying F-16's. So now the polacks have more planes than capable pilots, and a fleet of brand new, grounded planes lacking spare parts.
hogge87 5 months ago
@thugproofclips It's also a well known fact that the F-16 is a poor fighter. Both the Viggen and Draken could outperform F-16's until they went out of service.
hogge87 5 months ago
@hogge87 What? Are you retarded? Is that why the Israeli air force, Turkish air force, Greek, Singaporean etc are so feared by all their neighbors?
IntronDepot1 2 months ago
@IntronDepot1 The Israelis use the F-16 as a bomber. Their air-air capability comes from their F-15's.
Greece and Turkey are feared due to their pure numbers.
And I must correct my previous statement: the F-16 WAS a poor fighter. However, I stick to my statement that the Viggen was a supperior fighter to the F-16 until the Viggen was pulled from service.
hogge87 2 months ago
@aon10003 u gotta have some faith man
thugproofclips 9 months ago
Politics...politics..everyone wants to be friend with the US...would like to see Norway choosing JAS before F-35, ha ha :) US face would be like :|
maaaakn 10 months ago
Norway should have bought SAAB 29 Tunnan, they could have got 30 planes for one F-35!!!
74santafe 10 months ago
Jas will fuckin rape that shit plane.
easton1337 11 months ago 5
@easton1337 hahaha
razor11079 1 month ago
Helt enig!!! Norge er som en lydig hund til USA.
Så Norge "Kjøp Jas Gripen.
Mvh. Svein Meyer
BODØ.
bergvoll14 11 months ago 2
Norway thinks it's better to have happy NATO-friends compared to a better plane. If somthing happens they will have a great war-machine in the back, and not just great planes....
benho278 1 year ago
Gripen should have won...
Torikkaa 1 year ago
I hope Finland would buy Jas 39 instead of the F-35
RatedRsupeRme 1 year ago
from me reading all the coments , lets see which fighter would last in a high threat invirment , the f-35 is a 5th gen fighter with up to date avionics , now the grippen is a 4.5 gen fighter but it doesnt have the 5th gen technoligy like the f-35 , so in my opinion the f-35 is way better.
homboy107 1 year ago
@homboy107 depends on the role and the enemy, yes the technology give the F35 a theoretical advantage in air-to-air combat but are Norway likely to come up against a sophisticated well trained enemy airforce? It isn't all rosy on the JSF project, only time will tell if a large number of airforces have bought into an instantly inadequate overprice and under performing heap of s**t or the best fighter aircraft ever produced. I'm keen not to get involved in ignorant arguments, only time will tell.
OliverWilby 1 year ago
@homboy107
It's kind of funny that you would say that, considering that the JSF was announced as the "Ground attack plane, of the century", not really a fighter. Also Lockheed Martin altered the specifications for a 5:th generation fighter so that the JSF could fit into that category.
so in my oppinion:
a) norway should have choosen JAS 39 Gripen
b) also they shouldn't have lied by saying the Gripen is more expensive. they should have told the norwegian people they just wanted protection.
strv90 8 months ago 6
@strv90 Norway should have bought planes from people with proper reliable technology, made to operate in the arctic conditions of our part of the world. I know I'm gonna get flamed for this, but norway should have bough MiG's.
NiamOfAsuras 2 weeks ago
I would say that Jas 39 Gripen is the best. The Gripen is just as stealthy as the JSF-35 because of it's small body. I don't know much about the complete facts so Im not gonna say anything about that.
GodHatesWar 1 year ago
its politics witch will decide , not quality
1957attilazaborszky 1 year ago
F-35 sucks, what can it do more than take off vertical? And all the mechanics behind the VTOL? How good is that? It will fail....
AtomicSWE 1 year ago
@AtomicSWE Your a complete tool. Im not even going to bother with a 15 year old.
TuAFFalcon 1 year ago
@TuAFFalcon First, I´m not a tool and second I´m not 15, I´m 60...and third, I did my military service in Swedish Airforce :)
AtomicSWE 1 year ago
@AtomicSWE Then write like an adult. 'This sucks thats crap...' F-35 has 3 variants mate not all of them are VTOL. VTOL's are designed mainly for the USMC. Its not a true strike aircraft when it comes to range and payload. Its a special requirement aircraft so to speak like the Harrier. Most F-35's will be the Alpha model. Nothing not even the F-22 Raptor even comes close when it comes to avionics compared with the F-35.
TuAFFalcon 1 year ago
@TuAFFalcon saying that the radar cross section of the F22 is smaller and features all aspect stealth... the F35 has a larger cross section and reports say it may only take a offset of 15 degrees from the nose of the F35 to render the stealth useless... I don't want to argue about things that are only speculation, only time will tell!
OliverWilby 1 year ago
@OliverWilby I said F-35 has better avionics not better stealth but ye.
TuAFFalcon 1 year ago
@TuAFFalcon Yeah I know, nice to meet another educated view! some of the comments I've seen... oh dear
OliverWilby 1 year ago
@OliverWilby Ye its YouTube... I sort of got used to it. Hey besides this video should be comparing the Gripen NG to the F-35. More compatible. Anyways for now i see the F-35 as a flying computer mostly reliant on its electronics rather then its performance. It will detect, jam, co-ordinate with air to air fighters that are more capable of taking out the air threats. I expect some losses but it will be produced in large numbers. You must understand it is mainly an Strike aircraft.
TuAFFalcon 1 year ago
@TuAFFalcon It will be capable of launching Cruise missiles. It will stand off from the enemy and launch missiles rather then short range JDAM's and stay 'hidden' with its stealth if the threat has advanced SAM's.
TuAFFalcon 1 year ago
@TheMilitaryTactics wrong, wrong, wrong... you found it on a site called fighter-planes(dot)com??? well 1 that was the old gripen. 2 there is alot of other fact wrong on thats site so i woundent trust it :) well tryed kid
TheSwekebab 1 year ago
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TheSwekebab 1 year ago
F-35 har beskrivits som ett plan som är dyrare än alla andra tillsammans men som ändå inte riktigt är lika bra som nått annat på egentligen någonting. Det finns inte en F-35 som kan lösa F-22 uppgifter eller det som uppgraderade F-16 redan klarar av mot markmål. F-35 är så avancerat och har så minimal uppsättning vapen att den i princip bara duger till att precitionsbomba flygplan stående på marken. Norge ska väl inte anfalla andra länder? JAS är ett kostnadseffektivt försvarsvapen mot luftmål
MrThundermouth 1 year ago
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MrThundermouth 1 year ago
This is so gay!
FishyMikeBravo 1 year ago
haha jsf 35 ser ut som en jävla åsna xD Dom måste ju vara helt järntvättade av usa att gå med på att köpa den =0
Vingbreaker 1 year ago 2
hehe.
pepscalibra4x4 1 year ago
sorry bro a gripen is better because its moutch cheaper, its a multi role plane and moutch lighter
poppoplingonsylt 1 year ago
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911205KW 1 year ago
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911205KW 1 year ago
@911205KW also the F-35 is going to be quiet (well by jet standard's) so people will not notice it as easy also the speed on the F-35 is not bad because it can go past Mach 1 but it doesn't need to the weapon's can be as from JDAM's to AMRAAM's and well pretty much anything in-between as well and also the pilot's themselves will have it easier to make the right choices faster. also the air-craft will be very much suited to take on other air-craft's when intercepting without harming the pilot.
TheMilitaryTactics 1 year ago
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911205KW 1 year ago
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911205KW 1 year ago
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911205KW 1 year ago
@911205KW to be detected and also to have the ability to detect the other 95% of engagement's are done with BVR missiles so the F-35 will have an advantage but luckily in the Swedish air-force both these plane's will be used.
TheMilitaryTactics 1 year ago
@911205KW Well the F-22 for a start is more manoeuvrable then the JAS can sustain a turn of 20 degree's the F-22 can sustain a turning degree of 30+, so really the F-22 also with lowered Infra-red signature, can dodge heat seeking missiles very easily and in almost all category's the F-22 is grossly out performing any other fighter, the F-35 will be able to just go in and well shoot at any other air-craft or ship using the same weapon's as the JAS. also the stealth play's a big role to not
TheMilitaryTactics 1 year ago
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911205KW 1 year ago
@911205KW Well i do not know how i do not have a degree in aerodynamics but I am saying facts if you do not think i am right prove me wrong back up that the JAS is more manoeuvrable. also the F/A-22A travels at 1.7 Mach without after burners at 52,000 feet the JAS goes up to about 60,000 feet but cant travel in supersonic unless it uses it's after burners but then it exposes it's self to heat seeking missiles. so the F/A-22A is not just faster but more also more manoeuvrable.
TheMilitaryTactics 1 year ago
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911205KW 1 year ago
@911205KW no without after burners the F/A-22A goes up to 1.7 Mach with after burners it goes to 2.25 Mach. the F/A-22A has a higher T/W the JAS has one of 0.97 the F/A-22A has one of 1.08 so the F/A-22A has a higher climb rate therefore. but look the fact is is the the F/A-22A is the best better in nearly all the category it has pretty much the same top speed (2/2.25 Mach) but other then that both planes were built for different purposes. JAS was built for high quality but cheap.
TheMilitaryTactics 1 year ago
@TheMilitaryTactics the f-22 is not eaven close to as manuverable as the gripen. saw it on discovery channel. they said that f-22 raptor had everything witch made it into a "flying turkey" and way less manouverable
TheSwekebab 1 year ago
@TheSwekebab Prove this and also I have better prove and more prove then the "Discovery Channel" as I have the prove and I can display it for all to see. Do you?
TheMilitaryTactics 1 year ago
@TheMilitaryTactics watch top 10 millitary aircrafts on discovery channel ^^
TheSwekebab 1 year ago
@TheSwekebab On the Discovery channel again they rate by the best of the time that's why the P-51 one is the best in the military channels view. but in a modern battlefield the F-22 is the best it takes on 5/6 other planes at the same time.
TheMilitaryTactics 1 year ago
@TheMilitaryTactics dont tell me stuff i allready know ^^ im just trying to tell you that its not eaven as close to as manuverable as gripen... im not saying gripen is better...
im trying to tell you that a plane that is described as a "flying turkey" cant be eaven close to as manouverable as a lightweight plane like the gripen ^^ and no it can take 5 planes alone... the eurofighter won against it 1v1
TheSwekebab 1 year ago 6
@TheSwekebab Maximum instantaneous turn rate: 30 degrees/second
Maximum sustained turn rate: 20 degrees/second. That is for the JAS 39 this is the F-22A Maximum sustained turn rate: 28 degrees/second (The instantaneous turn rate is classified still). also the ratio of kills of the F-22A and the EF-2000 is 10.1(EF-200):1(F-22A).
TheMilitaryTactics 1 year ago
@TheMilitaryTactics JAS-39C has shot down a EF-2000 in exercise, but the opposite has never happened.
SuperColossal33 1 year ago
@SuperColossal33 Can you prove evidence of this as this is a highly unlikely situation.
TheMilitaryTactics 1 year ago
@TheMilitaryTactics I don't remember the proof, it was an exercise in India I believe, or somewhere in the desert.
JAS39 was the only aircraft of like 7 to start up every single time in the desert heat, it also got a kill on an EF2000.
In an exercise in Alaska a few years ago, Sweden brough old JAS39B's (4th gen), and we able to get 6 kills on F16 Vipers, the F16's couldn't even get a single lock on a JAS39, which got 100 Ops success...
SuperColossal33 1 year ago
@SuperColossal33 that should be 100% ops success*
SuperColossal33 1 year ago
@SuperColossal33 Can you present evidence to support these claims if not then we have nothing to settle here also I would not consider the JAS39 to be having the best exercise ops rate's but if you can show me that it does then show please as I would be very much wanting to know and read about it.
TheMilitaryTactics 1 year ago
@TheMilitaryTactics
it was Hungarian JAS39C's that got the EF2000 kill in India. JAS39 easily has the best exercise Ops success in the last 10 years of any aircraft.
SuperColossal33 1 year ago
@SuperColossal33 For example the Czech NATO Tiger Fleet :)
BohemiaPatriot 1 year ago
@SuperColossal33 The JAS39C SAAB GRIPEN is from Sweden, not Hungary
PHILLE564 11 months ago
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SuperColossal33 11 months ago
@PHILLE564 i never said it was from Hungary, I said Hungary has a fleet of JAS39's.
SuperColossal33 11 months ago
@TheSwekebab These new jets they have today are a long way from the F-100's I loved as a little boy. No comparison.....
hddragracer1 10 months ago
@TheSwekebab the f-35 would take out any other plane before the other plane even know if it was there f-35 can pull 9 g's and same with the eurofighter (eurofighter can do it over mach one but what dog fight will be like that)and same with the jas-39
USAmilitarypower 5 months ago
@USAmilitarypower Before the f-35 can take out a target it has to turn on the radar, imediatly betraying its posision...
TheSwekebab 4 months ago
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911205KW 1 year ago
@911205KW But the F/A-22A was built to get and hold air-dominance it's project was in the 90+ billions about 200-300 million per aircraft and the JAS is just 40-45 million the F/A-22A is expensive but will get the job done against any air-craft the JAS was built to be high end good fighter and multi role fit for any air-force.
TheMilitaryTactics 1 year ago
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911205KW 1 year ago
@911205KW You're thinking about the two proposed designs from SAAB for the SOUTH KOREAN KFX fighter project. North Korea are mainly flying various old MiG's...
DeathAndChocolate 1 year ago
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911205KW 1 year ago
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911205KW 1 year ago
@911205KW Hi! It's an ongoing project with the goal to design a multirole fighter for the South Korean and also Indonesian Air force with introduction around 2020. The development of Gripen NG don't have anything to do with this project as far as I know. The only real link is SAAB, which may end up as a partner.
DeathAndChocolate 1 year ago
@911205KW I have have a good reason of why the JSF was chosen well it started in red flag where the JAS was beaten by the F-22 (obviously) but it was taking on 4/5 of them at a time and what the F-35 was intended to do was to create that sort of outmatching yet for everyone and to be a very good multi-role at the same time so it not only can go in destroy the same sites and command canter's whilst being virtually invisible to infra-red and radar detection it will also be able to keep the sky.
TheMilitaryTactics 1 year ago
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911205KW 1 year ago
norge e en liten lydig tös utan egen vilja som gör allt storebror usa önskar...
pepscalibra4x4 1 year ago 33
@pepscalibra4x4 m, norge e som messi mot pep, liten klänning in mot kvällen o lyder peps önskningar.
ThePannKaka1 1 year ago
@pepscalibra4x4 hvorfor er du så fientlig da?
thugproofclips 9 months ago
@pepscalibra4x4 norge har penger til å kjøpe alt det de vil av de beste avanserte våpen..Ja,da kjøper vi jo det som funker best for landet og de allierte.men du snakker som om du ikke fatter hva faen det går ut på.vi kjøper ikke våpen av land for å få en klapp på skulderen,men vi kjøper det beste for å forsvare oss om noe skulle skje!
thugproofclips 8 months ago
@thugproofclips
Det som funkar bäst för Norge är alltså en flygplanstyp som inte funkar?
De orsaker som er regereing angav för att köpa F-35 var rent skitsnack. F-35 kan inte vara billigare än Gripen, om USAs flotta ratat F-35 för att den är för dyr. Stealthegenskaperna ska vara mycket sämre på produktionsplanen än på de prototyper som fick F-35 att vinna JSF-tävlingarna. Det polska försvarets officerer har i alla fall stake nog att säga att de vill ha Gripen, men inte regeringen!
hogge87 5 months ago
@thugproofclips
Ni har köpt ett plan som inte existerar. Ni har köpt en fantasi. Ni har köpt ett plan som inte längre har något stöd i sitt hemland. US Navy köper F-18 istället för F-35. Ni har köpt ett plan som är så avancerat, att det inte kan tillverkas. Planet är inte mindre på radar än vad Gripen är, underhållskostnaderna är idiothöga och prestanda är under all kritik!
Precis som polackerna (vars flygvapenstab är pissed), så valde ni att slicka röv istället för att köpa det bästa planet.
hogge87 5 months ago 2
@pepscalibra4x4
Så lenge vi ikke gjør som Sverige sier så er det et fett
pro2man 8 months ago
@pro2man As an American, we compleately own your country. You do everything we say haha
cryteeek 8 months ago
@pepscalibra4x4 Det samme gælder for dk
ARAKIZ2007 5 months ago
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911205KW 1 year ago
What I'v heared the Gripen was the best in test but the Norwegans did for some reasons choose not to buy it. *bribe*
SWEmanque 1 year ago
@SWEmanque no.we just learned who we can trust during ww2
hallep9 1 year ago
The rason for Enterprise to be the hero of ww2...
Is Bofors canons....
026marcuseriksson 1 year ago
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026marcuseriksson 1 year ago
yeah go JAS JAS JAS JAS
Diab668 1 year ago
@gferngren thats right
Diab668 1 year ago
jas stands for jakt/hunt=J attack/attack=A spaning/spy=S 39 gripen/griffin
gferngren 1 year ago
@foxinterspecial The Gripens had the SAAB 340 Erieye AEW aircraft patrolling the area for them and the Gripens unexcelled capability of intercommunicating digitally gave them air superiority. They did decline the AWACS the US used as they didn't find it necessary.
joeytruelove 1 year ago
@cr9527
Blcok 50/52 i think
foxinterspecial 1 year ago
@foxinterspecial
Mind u give me a source?
cr9527 1 year ago
Only real way to find out is an actual air to air combat, buddy boy. Even then it will depend on the speed and target acquisition acuity of the ATA sidewinder missles when once launched from the respective fighter jets. Therefore, buddy boy, it all depends on the armaments really. But, lest we forget that once r missile released its a hope that your EW evasive manuevres and chaff measures are superior than your opponent!
timbtufuga 1 year ago
It's all about the pilot if you ask me, the plane is just a took
Rumblinpara 1 year ago
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Rumblinpara 1 year ago
Swedish powers
Ericalvsjo 1 year ago
F35 is owerrated sht. The only thing its good att is stealth and politcs.
zingovalp 1 year ago
One word, NATO. Only a stupid Norweigan enjoy paying overprice for a military airplane they will never use in war. If Norway had balls they would stand up against the preassure from USA/NATO. But weak chickens are weak chickens ...
Loaded1mbimage 1 year ago
Advantage of the rafale over the f35 (and btw gripen demo) : the OSF that combine an IRST plus a TV/laser rangefinder channel for positive identification of threats needed before shot. It also allows missile shot with radar turned off, but in a clear sky and below 50km.
Mymosah 1 year ago
neither the Gripen demo has RAM on fuselage or ceramic nozzle on the engine to decrease IR radiancy. Rafale has both, just like f35
Mymosah 1 year ago
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911205KW 1 year ago
cr9527 1 year ago
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911205KW 1 year ago
@cr9527 Gripen has Metero missiles, something the US does not have yet (although it will likely get them for the F35 in 5-10 years time.
Gripen also has AESA radar.
SuperColossal33 1 year ago
@SuperColossal33
Gripen's radar is underpowered. And since the meteor is only as good as the radar carried, it is hardly an advantage.
cr9527 1 year ago
@cr9527 both the Gripen E/F and F-35 use AESA radar. I hope you are not comparing the old gripens to a modern F-35 when the Gripens have recently been upgraded.
SuperColossal33 1 year ago
@SuperColossal33
Yes, but F-35's radar is considerably larger in size, and power.
cr9527 1 year ago
This has been flagged as spam show
Well, norwegian has never ben known as amart people ;)
Probably the Americans put som serius preasure on the norwegian defens ministery.
To bad.
The gripen is a better plane specialy if you look att the whole system.
And off topic, the jsf i a realy ugly plane.
stefannordberg 1 year ago
Well, norwegian has never ben known as amart people ;)
Probably the Americans put som serius preasure on the norwegian defens ministery.
To bad.
The gripen is a better plane specialy if you look att the whole system.
And off topic, the jsf i a realy ugly plane.
stefannordberg 1 year ago
@stefannordberg Lol you do know that saab isnt norweigan right? It is swedish. Sweden has the most high tech military in the world. Sweds are not dumb. Everyday things like a computer mouse and ball bearing and ratchet and alot of games.
fpsHacker5950 1 year ago
@stefannordberg
Whole system? sure, why don't we look at it.
Gripen is as capable as an F-16 Block 50/52, except smaller, more maneuverable, and can deliver less payload.
Its stealth measures are as useless as spoilers on a school bus.
Its cheap, and is currently competing against F-16s which are being replaced by F-35.
cr9527 1 year ago
@cr9527. A SINGLE gripen took out 7 F-16's in Red Flag. That tells a lot, doesnt it?
SoPlEoReD 1 year ago
@SoPlEoReD
What were the ROEs, which version of F-16s, who were flying the F-16s? Instructors or students? What was the situation?
Unless you can provide some of the above, it tells nothing.
cr9527 1 year ago
@cr9527
Gripen were B-Force and there mission was to simply lose but the f16 couldnt even see them so they got shot down. It was F16 C/D
foxinterspecial 1 year ago
@foxinterspecial
Nobody's mission is to loose.
Also, which block F-16? C/D ranges a lot.
cr9527 1 year ago
@cr9527
Block 50/52 think. get over your SupiriorityComplex F16 has never been as good as gripen they are diffrent generations. F16 is a old plane with new gadgets.
foxinterspecial 1 year ago
@cr9527
Block 50/52 think. get over your SupiriorityComplex F16 has never been as good as gripen they are diffrent generations. F16 is a old plane with new gadgets.
foxinterspecial 1 year ago
@cr9527 Block 50/52.
foxinterspecial 1 year ago
@cr9527 Blcok 50/52
foxinterspecial 1 year ago
@cr9527 Well, the scenario was supposed to have Good Guys and Bad Guys. The communication and awareness systems of the Gripens and the Eirieye AEW were far superior to what the US could muster. Once their radar signatures were picked up by a Swedish plane, in most cases the result was a kill. The Falcon pilots were said to be very impressed by the Gripen planes.
joeytruelove 1 year ago
@joeytruelove
Source if you don't mind
cr9527 1 year ago
@joeytruelove Gripen didnt have Awacs in the excerice, they were offered awacs by USAF but declined the offer. (Redflag)
foxinterspecial 1 year ago
Avionics, the PS-05A on the Gripen has about a third the power output as the APG-81 on the F-35.
Plus, Gripen lacks the level of sensor fusion of F-35, F-35 wins
BvR, with F-35's stealth, and far longer ranged radar, Gripen is of no challenge
WvR, while Gripen is agile, it cannot match F-35's 360 degree off bore shot capability of the Aim-9X + DAS.
Payload, its simple numbers, 8+ Tons(F-35) vs 5+ Tons.
What can Gripen do better than F-35? Airshows. Don't expect much more.
cr9527 1 year ago
@cr9527 Dude, gripen got 8 tons+
anden191 1 year ago
@anden191
Thats Gripen NG's expected value, it isn't even close to being ready
cr9527 1 year ago
@cr9527 The C/D got 7+, The E/F or as it called NG got 8+.
NG got flying ex so its starting to being produced in 2011-2012
anden191 1 year ago
@anden191 Got a source for that?
The best I can tell, C/Ds have 6+ Ton payload.
cr9527 1 year ago
@cr9527 It was on the swedish airforce homepage
anden191 1 year ago
@anden191
pm me the links.
cr9527 1 year ago
@cr9527 it isnt there anymore
anden191 1 year ago