Vancouver 9/11 Truth confronts journalist Gwynne Dyer

[RiceLUMFAO]

HAHAHAAH this video is fucking hilarious and sums up all conspiracy theorists: they all jump to conclusions, are loud and boisterous, and they're as ignorant as they claim people who disagree with them are

[deliciousmorton]

now gwynne dyer is part of the conspiracy.

the kid asking the questions is a fucking simpleton.

[MegaWolfgang]

To answer that asses question. YES THEY HAVE A SCREW LOOSE JUST LIKE THE MORON PUTTING ON THE SHOW FOR HIS LEFTIE FRIENDS.

[12ut5]

Very embarassing, hard to watch.

[dusthat]

@Vancouver911Truth - You've got a screw loose.

[matbrady123456]

Good on ya. I admire your bravery. I'm glad you spoke up, and I'm even more glad you recorded it. Well done.

[pennjersey83]

another nutcase gets owned

[CHF2]

The largest family members group did NOT say it was an inside job.

ONE guy from the group did!

Why are "truthers" such goddamn liars?

[rfaler]

Why would Vancouver011Truth post this? This is just embarassing for the truther who is clearly faking outrage. I am really surprised Dyer remained so composed while this asshole was speaking.

[1982CFD]

@rfaler What do you mean "faking outrage"?

[DeadlyV1RU5]

"...insult to the victim's family members of 9/11!"

I don't really care whether 9/11 was an inside job or not, climate change is far more important (and this guy has written a book on it called Climate Wars), but I'll level this truther's "insult to the family members" with another one: the idea that the family members on the planes were in on the conspiracy too.

[1982CFD]

@DeadlyV1RU5 What do you mean?

[wyjioc]

You don't become a saint by being a victim. That's a good quote.

[nubbs]

i genuinely pity people these 911 nuts 

[gargano3000]

@nubbs yes me too is the earth still flat?

[nurktwin1960]

This guy is an inside nut job!

[shawandking]

this guy is nuts. he's looking for a fight.

[kevhead66]

The 2001 anthrax attacks was an inside job

[knocked44]

Being a victim does not make you a saint. Words of wisdom people. I agree but would put it this way: victimization does not, in and of itself, impart moral wisdom in the victim. Moral wisdom, or ethical knowledge is not awarded by blows but has to be sought out by one with a self-imposed, disciplined will to know the good.

As for 911, get a life truth'ers. You're theories are like two dimensional dreams, not worthy of the enthusiasm you have for them. Look deeper.

[WiggyTheCanuck]

I fucking love Gwynne Dyer.

[horseytown]

I might point out that your initial post here did not suggest that you were above ad hominem attacks:

"The predictable childish tone of THOSE WHO DEFEND THE OFFICIAL CONSPIRACY..."

"it suggests your response is wholly emotional, one of fear."

"You will not entertain the possibility that those in power might lie to you."

I responded in kind.

Alex Jones is merely a touchstone. I was not accusing you of subscribing to his faith, even if you share some similar views on technical minutiae.

[ezrabiggins]

A critique of rhetoric and the identification of the use of ad hominem (numbnutz, I think one charming person wrote, and of course the chorus of 'retard,' 'loon,' and much worse) in place of substance is a legitimate element of argumentation. So there.

[ezrabiggins]

impossible flying"

Yes, despite the incredible intricasies of their ornate plot, the conspirators thought it wise to blame the attack on pilots who could not fly, and to make crash sites absent of plane wreckage. So it would seem. Again, I can't explain all that happened, much less why. I claim only to believe that in many instances (thus,as a whole) the official conspiracy theory fails. Do you know of any aviation experts who dispute the claim of the flight's difficulty?

[ezrabiggins]

In point of fact, though, a bit of plane 'wreckage' was 'found' at the (not at all peculiar to you?) Pentagon site.

Now, is a conspiracy less ornate if carried out by 'Muslim extremists' than by well-heeled white men with virtually unlimited resources at their disposal? (Again, I'm not sure just who they are, but I have a hunch our paths don't cross at the thrift shop.)

Chemical traces interpreted as thermite.

Falling water interpreted as rain.

Molten metal: NYFD accounts.

[ezrabiggins]

"It did not freefall. " I'm embarrassed for you with this one. . . But the necessary question is, Why do you think each building collapsed? So far all indications are you accept the mumbling from the Commission.

And at risk of monotony, why do you believe the govt is (fine) covering up?

The 'coverup because of embarrassing incompetence' narrative is used to divert from govt (and whoever else) guilt. So far, I gotta say, you sound like Fox News.

[horseytown]

I am not really interested in what the Commission says.

"The 'coverup because of embarrassing incompetence' narrative is used to divert from govt (and whoever else) guilt."

I have no particular belief concerning what I do not know, only that I find that the government generally distorts the particulars of an event (neg. or pos.) to their maximal advantage. It was a casual remark, not an argument that I was making.

One example that comes to mind is the interpretation of the reasons for...

[horseytown]

the attacks and the obvious rationale of the targets chosen.

The Pentagon Strike was an unfortunate and unforgiving reality when it came to the official rhetoric that al-Qaeda had targeted only "innocent civilians", and it was underplayed while we heard of every single detail from the suffering civvies in the WTC. Ignored were the implications of that building being targeted along with the Pentagon (and possibly the White House).

What aspect of what I write sounds like Fox News? I am curious.

[horseytown]

I am not an US liberal fawning over the Obama presidency, and my knee does not jerk to meet my own chin when I hear the words "Fox News". Nor am I a conservative, nor have I even ever watched Fox News (outside of clips I have seen in documentaries and on YouTube). I am in Canada and do not watch very much television at all.

I am of the left libertarian socialist streak (or anarchist) ... I listen to Doug Stanhope and Bill Hicks and Robert Newman for laughs, if that gives you an idea.

[horseytown]

"is a conspiracy less ornate if carried out by 'Muslim extremists'"

No, but it is more ornate if all those you insist are involved (and are implied to be involved by extension) in the "inside job" version.

"Falling water interpreted as rain."

There were substances absent that rule out thermite use.

How apropos that you made that comparison, when falling water could be the product of countless actions and phenomena other than rain.

But to you it is a foregone conclusion.

[horseytown]

"Do you know of any aviation experts who dispute the claim of the flight's difficulty?"

Certainly, and there are some pilots who debate their ability to fly based on a handful of quotes, but the fact remains that they possessed flight licenses - they may not have been candidates for a reenactment of the Battle of Britain, but the suggestion that only ace pilots could have managed the flying displayed on 9/11 is a terrific stretch. There is a reason the Truthers make their claim piecemeal.

[horseytown]

"impossible flying"

Yes, despite the incredible intricasies of their ornate plot, the conspirators thought it wise to blame the attack on pilots who could not fly, and to make crash sites absent of plane wreckage.

"thermite found at ground zero"

Chemical traces interpreted as thermite.

[horseytown]

"explaining molten and burning metal weeks after 9-11"

This claim is generally derived from photographic evidence of a girder that had been cut, (probably by clearing debris). There is no way of confirming this claim, which is based on broken telephone & second hand information.

"freefalls straight down"

It did not freefall.

[ezrabiggins]

I didn't see a plane in that field. Neither did the first responders. Plane parts were found by recovery crews 3 and 8 miles away. Black box, conveniently, was "found" in the little hole.

Now, I claim for a fact that WTC 1, 2 and 7 were controlled demolitions. You keep bringing up Alex Jones, not me. I've read the debate, I respect Architects and Engineers for 911 Truth (a broad movement with a noble purpose). And I saw how they fell. For my most influential source, see D R Griffin.

[horseytown]

I am familiar with Griffin. He is the man who most famously misinterpreted the PNAC (whose Wikipedia articles I have contributed to ... I have been railing against the neocons and PNAC since long before it became fashionable. Even long before they came to the attention of Gwynne Dyer) and the "new Pearl Harbor" line.

Surprise:

I do believe that it is possible (even likely) that United 93 was shot down or damaged before impact.

[horseytown]

This was supposed to read "I once did believe that it was possible..."

I will return to respond to the other posts soon. My day did not go as I had planned.

[ezrabiggins]

1. A military response, on any normal day, would have had fighters on 175 and probably 11. Fighters were sent into a holding pattern over the ocean. The military had to admit they were not correct in their commission testimony, leaving themselves to the charge of lying (preferable to treason and murder).

2. Have I confused your position for that of a fascist neocon? Gee, sorry. How could that have happened?

3. I repeat: Why do claim to know the govt was involved in 911?

[ezrabiggins]

You're obsessed with Alex Jones. I am not. The discussion here, if it please your majesty, is 9 fucking 11. I'm angry at and frightened of whoever committed those crimes. You're more upset by people whom, in general terms, you claim to agree with. Leave out the ad hominems if you can and talk some facts. What makes you so sure the govt had a hand in it?

[horseytown]

I do not believe that the government had any hand in it.

I believe they are likely covering up anything that might stain their noble imperial character. That is all.

[horseytown]

I am all for facts. Unfortunately I have received none from you. I will gladly refrain from rejoinders, but I cannot mask my contempt for the 9/11 Cult. They (along with their pitiful eschatological graffiti all around Montreal) nauseate me as much as any other religious fanatic.

Yes, I am saying that 9/11 Conspiracy Theory is a religion and its purveyors are zealots. If you are not one I can only hope that you remain an intellectually curious individual and are cautious to question ALL.

[horseytown]

"I don't have to prove anything about how it was done."

Of course not. But you would if you could.

"You jave to convinvce me it wasn't important enbough for the Commission to discuss."

No I do not, because this is not my opinion. I can, however, reject the wild conclusions that the "Truth" movement has arrived at.

"NO military response?"

There was a military response.

"No plane in Pentagon."

There was a plane in the Pentagon.

Oh, I forgot that the NWO forgot that detail in their plot.

[ezrabiggins]

But in your case I'll make an exception asshole.

I don't know what you are "talking about here," but I'm saying that parts of the govt and military -- or someone who controls them (note I make no claim to knowing who such people are) perpetrated 9-11 somehow. I've cited evidence, and I won't put the word in quotation marks. You talk about your desire for truth, but you're not a "Truther." You have "no doubt" the govt is culpable, but you've seen no evidence you find conclusive.

[horseytown]

Capable, not "culpable". What evidence? You have posted the same urban myth-level nonsense as any Alex Jones truther...how was I to know you were not one of them?

More doozies:

"No plane in that Pennsylvania field"

There was a plane in that field.

"plenty of evidence it was shot down"

No plane...but it was shot down ...AND there was no military response? Interesting.

[ezrabiggins]

Well, horseytown, you're insulting, not persuasive.

"reveal what is surely being obfuscated by power" Why "surely"? Are you keeping some secret evidence? Is your cause for suspecting the govt somehow not inane?Are you a "CTer"? I do not believe your claims about your open-mindedness. Nor do I subscribe to Alex Jones, fear the approach of Nibiru or believe that the Jesuits run the world. OTOH, I try not to insult or speak contemptuously to other human beings.

[horseytown]

There is a reason Alex Jones et al. tell their followers to say what you just typed, and it is that they know that their daily dispatches often negate or contradict each other. With such a mountain of disparate and incompatible claims, no Truther wants to think of making sense of it.

[ezrabiggins]

The burden of proof is on those who claim the collapse of the towers was not controlled demolition. All evidence, and hundreds of architects and engineers, say it was. All that is required, however, is sufficient doubt to be cast on the official story for a prima facie case to be made that an independent investigation is in order. No? You claim you've seen no evidence. Have you read D.R. Griffin's demolition of the Popular Mechanics article and book?

[ezrabiggins]

Do you accept that the Commission had suppressed and ignored any inquiry into why Bldg 7 collapsed (just like a controlled demolition)? I don't have to prove anything about how it was done. You jave to convinvce me it wasn't important enbough for the Commission to discuss. The Commission controlled by Zelikow, a member of C Rice's transition team. Cell phones didn't work at 5k ft let alone 40k. NO military response? The Report is especially lame at covering that up. No plane in Pentagon.

[ezrabiggins]

No plane in that Pennsylvania field (and plenty of evidence it was shot down). Oh gosh, impossible flying by a guy who couldn't land a cessna, thermite found at ground zero (explaining molten and burning metal weeks after 9-11?) Twin Towers' core columns collapse with the floors? Into little pieces? Simultaneously? And evidence removed and destroyed? Twr 2 ceases rotation and (sorry Newton) freefalls straight down? No evidence? For such a wild man you take a lot on faith. BTW I'm atheist.

[horseytown]

As I have already stated: I am for an independent commission. If only because I would hope that its conclusions would

a) reveal what is surely being obfuscated by power

b) dispel and demystify some of the fractured and incomplete information which is obscenely exploited by the likes of Alex Jones. Hopefully this would help rationalists deprogram the not so-far-gone CTers who have been gobbled up by the inane 9/11 cult.

[horseytown]

"The burden of proof is on those who claim the collapse of the towers was not controlled demolition."

Why? Because that is convenient to your understanding of the case, of course. "All evidence" - really? What evidence? The plumes of dust, the freefall... ... the two pieces of erroneous/or willfully fabricated information that you learned from 9/11 Truthers and then regurgitated here in defence of another Truther's distorted facts?

I have six spent years reading and viewing 9/11 Truth.

[horseytown]

I have seen mountains of what is CLAIMED by conspiracy theorists (CTers) as "evidence" , but I have yet to see any information that it even approaches incontrovertible.

" prima facie case to be made that an independent investigation is in order"

There should have been a proper independent investigation with or without the fantasies drawn up by Alex Jones cultists and the NWO paranoiacs. There is no doubt all matter of criminality relating to 9/11 being kept under wraps by the gov't, but...

[horseytown]

that is not what we are talking about, is it? The discussion here concerns what "Truthers" KNOW is THE TRUTH. The undeniable & incontestable TRUTH.

That means you. Truthers like to claim that they are in pursuit of an investigation into the origins of 9/11, but this is no different from Christians calling for an investigation into the origins of the universe. If the conclusion of an independent investigation differed from yours and Jones (and his many sheeplike followers), it would be rejected

[ezrabiggins]

The predictable childish tone of those who defend the official conspiracy theory does not at all help you make a persuasive case. Rather, it suggests your response is wholly emotional, one of fear. You will not entertain the possibility that those in power might lie to you. More than this, you attack anyone who will consider that possibility, as if you yourselvesare under attack. Why? You should discuss facts, and you should also value truth. The framers of the Const'n didn't trust govt.

[horseytown]

Who is that you are addressing here?

I am an anarchist (a left libertarian socialist end of the spectrum) and it is my firm belief that the government is entirely unscrupulous and is certainly capable of carrying out such a "false flag" operation as is suggested by the Truth movement...but it remains that I have not seen a SINGLE piece of evidence that supports the "inside job" theory.

Mostly I have seen a paranoid mysticism swirl around a new cult of gibberish religious wonks.

[Nitetripper1965]

This guy should ask his doctor if paxil is right for him.

[shemp2]

Dude's got a screw loose.

[davidsmind]

This guy is gross.

[ganubis]

Gwynne Dyer, unlike these gibbering demagogues that populate the distortion-based and hilariously titled "truth movement", actually writes informed opinion and mercilessly hacks away at the neoliberal imperialists in his columns. For this (and his critical columns on the subject of Israel) he was thrown out of most Canadian newspapers (by Conrad Black, Israel Asper, etc.).

But no...obviously he works for the illuminati because he doesn't happen to agree with Dylan Avery's nonsense.

[ganubis]

Oh, to live in the black & white world of the 9/11 CTer. Everything is so simple. Simplicity for simpletons.

I work in an organic grocery store and I deal (and work with) all sorts of tinfoil hatters. We recently had a customer come in with a list of "facts" that cited, amongst others, Loose Change, Alex Jones, Sherry Shriner, Peggy Kane, David Icke, and not only did she believe 911 was an inside job, but she believed that Iraq was invaded so that the Iluminati could gain control of

[ganubis]

the inter-dimensional portal located there.

Really. I have the photocopies of her "theories" scanned and in my photobucket account for anyone who wishes to read them.

You people are in good company.

Watch for those reptilians.

[ganubis]

"just explain why Marvin Bush happened to be in charge of security on 911 at wtc"

Marvin Bush WAS NOT "in charge" of security at the WTC on 911. Of course that has not stopped a single NWO conspiracy theorist from spreading around this and other fabrications (ex. the hijackers are still alive) that they pick up from misinformed and poorly researched drivel on youtube and 9/11 truth websites.

What "missiles around the Pentagon" were turned off. Please provide evidence of this.

[ezrabiggins]

Marvin Bush was a large shareholder and the director of Securacom, the company that handled electronic security at WTC. Wirt D. Walker, a Bush cousin, was also a large shareholder in Securacom. Securacom also handled electronic security at Dulles Intl Airport.  Now, how did the man asking the questions in this video display irrationality? Where does he mention space aliens? Why does the skepticism of citizens about a very strange story warrant your outrage and personal insults?

[horseytown]

Wrong. Marvin was on the board of directors and only until 2000.

Also, Securacom only handled electronic security until 1998. The same with Dulles.

Marvin Bush also worked for HCC Insurance Holdings and they, being an insurance company, lost tens of millions in the 9/11 attacks.

Of course, these tenuous links are enough for Truthers to extrapolate that Marvin could have ordered security to stand down and allow for the building to be wired for controlled demolition (which would take months),

[Dalwhinnie15]

The truther pretty much affirmed Gwynne Dyer's 'Loose screws' theory.

[gspotjazz]

The government's explanation, by definition is a "conspiracy theory." A conspiracy is "two or more people secretly planning an illegal act." The government's explanation of the events, is, therefore, a conspiracy theory, since it their theory about those (19 hijackers & others), who planned the crime. Unfortunately, the evidence does support their theory as well as the evidence advanced by the 911 truth movement. The description "Conspiracy theory" is a convenient label by those in denial.

[yomomatsu]

LOL, what a fucking retard.

Like all conspiracy theory types.

[wdgarraway]

I find it fascinating that even Noam Chomsky thinks that these 911 conspiracy theories are just plain wrong.

[persianlor]

This guys is yelling about "an honest discussion", but instead he wanted to preach his conspiracy theory. I like that Dyer had the balls to stand up to him with dignity, and be honest in his opinion, regardless of how cruel it may seem.

[3642130]

well gee mr. Gwynne just explain why Marvin Bush happened to be in charge of security on 911 at wtc--oh wait just tell me who deactivated(a bin laden ally?)the missiles around the pentagon. after all the military would have a list of anyone who turned on or off any weapon system, they like details like that. and If terrorists hate our freedoms they would attack all those more free countries like Mexico or attack Americas real leader the Queen of England

[Fishignton]

This Johnny fellow was clearly just looking for a confrontation, what an asshole. Maybe if he actually wanted to have an honest discussion rather than just preach his ideas this would have actually gone somewhere. I think the official 911 story has a lot of holes in it, but these people have turned this into a cult.

[345607]

He is not an asshole! Does everybody whoses ideas differ from you an asshole?

[Fishignton]

If you actually read what I'd wrote, which you clearly did not, you'd notice that I didn't call him an asshole because of his ideas. I called him an asshole for trying to high-jack the presentation to attack Gwynne Dyer, forcing everyone else listen to him list of names instead of even saying something useful.

There's nothing wrong with disagreeing, however, this man wasn't actually responding to what Gwynne was saying, he was just their to push his ideas on others. He's an asshole

[zerlic]

Those families should deal with their grief in a way that shows some respect to their government, their neighbors, and the OTHER victims of 9/11. They are spewing out crap wherever they go. I'm sure the majority of people don't appreciate what those families are saying. The really should just shut up.

[zerlic]

But the reality is Dyer was merely pointing out the fact that those people can not possibly be rational in such circumstances. Dyer is a journalist. It's his job to say the right thing when everyone else is shutting their eyes and ears. People can't go on blaming others without substantial evidence. No amount of deluded rationalization should allow someone to place the blame on parties and agents that do not deserve it! Dyer did justice to society with that article...(cont)

[zerlic]

It's understandable that people would be upset, being victims of a horrible event, had it appeared they were being directly insulted...(cont)

[T0MMYVERCETTI]

a while back i emailed Gwynne asking him to backup his claims that we the truthers are wackos, asked him for a link to a website or point me to a video explaining the events of 9/11 in detail without leaving out stuff like building 7 and to explain the fire theory. As you can imagine he never got back to me. Why am i not surprised ? COWARD. He will bad mouth a person but wont even backup what he claims

nice video man, good job

[ahachie]

Why would he waste his time, responding to your nonsense.

[T0MMYVERCETTI]

If he writes about it in his article shouldn't he have to back it up, or do we live in a world where a member of the media can bad mouth people with no proof ? I think that's slander

[macljack]

it is rather entertaining to see people who have such terrible knowledge of subject matter making such remarks i think that you all need to tighten your screws!

[hawkeyicockburn]

PhD Gwynne Dyer, has the charm of a 5th grader resorting to childish school yard insults and name calling when addressing the Jersey Girls, He's old school it seems where as during time of war we should all STF-UP and kiss his navel Reserve ass with our respect... Hasn't anyone ever taught Gwynne that respect is a two way street, We salute the JERSY GALS! NOTE: 108 dead by fighting Canada's war on 9/11 retribution, He probably doesn't want us to talk about that either. hypocrite

[345607]

I am so proud of you little brother.

[Burnside69x]

Great job, Johnny!

Jean-Philippe, Montreal 9/11 Truth

[insidejob323]

Great stuff Johnny. Mr. Dyer do people such as Dr.Bob Bowman(former Star Wars head),Andreas Von Bulow(former German Defence Secretary),Robert D. Steele(veteran CIA officer)& 100s also have a screw loose?

Or maybe you're one those 'who pays the piper plays the tune.'

[dillandaily]

Woohoo!  Talk about THAT on CBC Gwynne. Way to go Johnny!

[MTL911Truth]

Awesome confrontation my Vancouver brothers. His arrogance is staggering.