Mark Driscoll on Humility

[opendtuning]

I liked what CJ Mahaney said that "He was not an expert on humility, but he was an expert on pride" ... I identify with that... Humility is a complete submissiveness to the will of God...Humility means You are with God, and not with the World,Pride is of the worldly systems...Humility is not to judge...

[rickyd0821]

Spiritually I always thought of Mark Driscoll to be a little wet behind the ears. (That is my own Spiritual pride speaking.) This Sermon proves that everyone can grow along spritual lines so long as we remain teachable. Mark makes my blood boil most of the time, but He has a good following and this shows his willingness to stay teachable. Good Job Mark.

[doraned]

Refreshing and hopeful coming from a man who is on record as saying elders need a punch in the nose.

[Passion4Rock88]

he's teaching, and practicing Humility... Wow, that's actually pretty awesome!

[eisenhowernixon]

It takes humility to acknowledge a lack of it.

[ArchhereticK]

It also takes arrogance to proclaim it.

[eisenhowernixon]

You speak with wisdom. Great observation!

[djking2d]

@ArchhereticK Not necessarily. Moses said he was the most humble man of his time in Numbers. Since Christians believe the Bible is inspired by God, Moses would not have been allowed to write that, unless it were true.

[ArchhereticK]

@djking2d Do you not see the logical absurdity here? An object that is defining itself. It's like a dictionary having the definition of "dictionary" in it. It's a fallacy. Circular reasoning is far from compelling.

[djking2d]

@ArchhereticK Except that the Bible is inspired by God, and He would not permit Moses to write such a blatant lie about his character because that would give the wrong impression about God's character.

[ArchhereticK]

@djking2d Worshipping a book loosely connected to Jesus teaching does not make one a christian, that's idolatry. God wrote his word on the hearts of men, that's more important than the poor imitation by barely literate, blood thirsty, self-righteous, hate-filled and petty tribes from the middle-east.

[djking2d]

@ArchhereticK Christians don't worship a book.

[ArchhereticK]

@djking2d Most people who claim to be christian today do infact worship a book ahead of god. The vast majority.

[djking2d]

@ArchhereticK Well, I'm not one of them.

[doireallyneed1]

@ArchhereticK,

And let us not forget the barely literate, self-righteous, hate-filled, petty (but perhaps slightly less blood thirsty) Tribes from North America.

[ArchhereticK]

@doireallyneed1 Well yeah, most religions deal in absolutist and unweildly moral systems thet inevitebly lead to self-righteous, hate-filled and petty actions.

Open minded critical analysis of demonstrable facts should be the only method of developing moral systems (we can't forget much of the ground work of this was done by christian theologians), any other way is a cop-out.

[dralockhart]

Just because Christianity is the most popular religion now doesn't mean it's right. If popular meant correct, then many other religions would have been the one true religion at various points in world history. If you're honest, you will recognize what a bloody and violent history Christianity has had. The principles of the church are anything but the principles of Christ, as evidenced by the massacres committed in the name of "Jesus."

[ramezgabrail]

True Christianity is not the most popular belief system. Pop culture Christianity is, so that argument doesnt work at all. And yes, pop culture Christianity had a horrible history because it doesnt correlate at all with any of Jesus teachings. Neither do the massacres committed in Jesus name. I can watch porn and claim that it is in the name of Jesus, doesnt mean it is.

[dralockhart]

Your argument is irrelevant here. You have no proof that your form of Christianity is "true" Christianity. Of course you think it's "true"--that's why you adhere to it. People who subscribe to what YOU consider "pop culture" Christianity think their version is true.

The only thing I'm intolerant of is intolerance. All of the things I'm arguing against--i.e. you dismissing others' religions, others massacring other people, etc. is intolerance. I'm just critiquing arrogance and intolerance.

[ramezgabrail]

How do you know I have no proof? Studying the Bible and interpreting what Jesus says is proof. How would you interpret "love your enemies" any differently? Also, do you know what tolerance means? Tolerance implies disagreement. So far I've disagreed with most of what you've said but I've been respectable about it while you've called me uneducated, perverted, etc. That's intolerance. And in terms of arrogance, let me remind you that I admitted to being a vile sinner, whereas you keep judging.

[dralockhart]

HA! The Bible is not proof. If sacred texts were proof, then Islam and Judaism would also be the "true" religions and Buddhist, Hindu, Taoist scriptures would also be correct. This is why your argument has no logic. If ANYONE had proof of a religion being true, there'd be no need for faith and we'd all belong to that religion.

I'm calling you uneducated because you clearly are and it is a valid point in an argument. I don't recall calling you perverted, perhaps you could offer a quote?

[ramezgabrail]

Sacred texts are in conflict, so either one is right, and all others are wrong, or they're all wrong. I recommend you read "Evidence that Demands a Verdict" or "The Case for Christ." There's empirical evidence for the resurrection of Jesus. Why am I uneducated? I believe in Christianity because of several reasons, mainly that it's way more likely than unlikely, and because biblical texts are the most reliable (with the most number of manuscripts, followed - not closely - by Homer's Iliad).

[ramezgabrail]

As for the pervert comment, here's a quote from you:

"What's hilarious to me is that you zealous, conservative Christians put so much emphasis on the genitalia. People are defined by their genitals.

Seems a little perverted to me."

Not to mention that what you said is not true, and uneducated, it's also quite rude.

[dralockhart]

It is entirely true.

People's entire life roles are defined by their genitalia. How is it not perverted to put such an emphasis on them? Many "Christians" pose as being conservative when it comes to sexual issues, and yet a person is consigned to their fate because of their genitals.

I don't believe your God would be so obsessed with genitals, not if it weren't petty. Plus, if all souls are the same, God would be concerned with spiritual ideals not physical parts.

[ramezgabrail]

Genesis tells us that God created humans as male and female, in His image He created them (this implying equality) and gave humans authority and stewardship over the earth. The fact that He created them male and female means that they are each unique in their own way. Gender is a good thing, it is a blessing. Masculinity and femininity are wonderful things to be celebrated, not cast aside. God is of course concerned with the spiritual, but the physical as well, He created both aspects.

[ramezgabrail]

Also, no one told you to subscribe to this. You're free to believe in whatever you wish.

Women in my church feel quite honoured and appreciated for their uniqueness. They are happy to submit to scripture. This isn't an easy thing to believe, and is not popular in our culture, but we choose to submit to scripture and God's authority.

[ramezgabrail]

How do you know that YOUR version is true. I also study the Bible. You're assuming here that your version is true. When I see Jesus talk about loving one's enemies and loving one's neighbours as one's very own self. Then I see a massacre "in Jesus' name" it's not very hard to realize that it's not Christian.

In terms of arrogance intolerance, you seem to not understand what it means. Scroll to the bottom of the page to see my post on that.

Also, of course I agree that massacres are intolerant.

[dralockhart]

I am an agnostic. I've studied Christianity enough to know that it would be a joke to interpret it literally and act as if there's proof of it being true. The only thing one can reasonably and humbly say is that they can't be sure, because they can't.

I've already seen your post on intolerance. What you don't realize is that literalist Christian agenda pushes intolerance of females, and racial and religious "others." They can only be in good standing if they submit to males. That's intolerance.

[ramezgabrail]

Actually, they can (or at least show that it's way more likely than unlikely). You don't seem to have studied Christian apologetics.

Jesus loved women and made it clear that they are equal to men. Christianity is not intolerant to females, there are different roles. The majority of Christians are female (around more than 60%). If Christianity were intolerant to women, less women would be Christian and they wouldn't be advocating female roles.

[dralockhart]

I know all about the Christian apologetics, and how people like you--the uber-conservative Christians--cast them aside as "pop culture" Christians. You constantly assert that by being wishy-washy and everyone wanting to feel good that it's failing to be Christian, when in actuality it's loving others as Jesus commanded.

This is where your ignorance has reached its peak. You say men and women are equal but have different roles. We learned long ago that SEPARATE is NOT EQUAL.

[ramezgabrail]

Umm I was supporting Christian apologetics. And more than once have I said that we literally believe Jesus' words that we must love our neighbours as ourselves and love our enemies. I don't understand what you just said.

[dralockhart]

Most Christians cast apologetics aside as "pop culture" Christianity because it strives to serve God favoring the greatest commandment over minor technicalities. Uber-conservative Christians bring up the technicalities (usually only found in one or two verses) to chastise and judge others, whereas they fail to miss the Bible's underlying messages.

[YoungBoss08Major]

agreed

[dralockhart]

I also fail to see how it is equal when men have various roles and can choose from pretty much anything they wish, when women are consigned to serving men as masters (how is that equal again?). That's not much of a choice in the role, continuing to further the inequality.

[ramezgabrail]

Women don't serve men as masters. That's incorrect. In church leadership, the leader is the servant (e.g. Jesus washing the disciples' feet; the first becoming last, etc.). Therefore, the men in leadership are the ones who serve other men as well as women. Again, you don't have to subscribe to this, but the women who do are blessed and are a blessing. The choose to submit to God. If you were tolerant you would've respectably disagreed. No one's limiting your freedom.

[dralockhart]

Well, then I think you need to explain that to the conservative Christian families I know, where the women break their backs laboring over serving the man and even have to ask for his permission to do things that they shouldn't have to ask to do.

Don't talk to me about tolerance while implying that I am not a blessing nor am I blessed for simply not living to serve a male such as yourself. Also don't imply that I don't submit to God simply because I don't submit to men. That's just hypocrisy.

[ramezgabrail]

I'm not sure what you mean by "conservative" Christians. If you're talking about traditional Southern American, organ-loving, people-haters who abuse God's word by twisting it, then it's pointless, because these people don't listen no matter what. God's word is clear on the meaning of leadership; it is self-sacrificial serving in love. That is what women deserve to receive; to be served more than to serve. Biblically speaking, the man ought to serve the woman more than the reverse.

[ramezgabrail]

And what you said after that doesn't really apply, because if you were a woman in my church (or anywhere else) I would gladly serve you, considering you as more important than myself, as the Bible says in Philippians. A man is to honour a woman, love her, serve her, respect her, etc. That is the meaning of Christian leadership, which is very different than the worldly view on women, which regards them as sex objects for the pleasure of men, not equal to men, which in God's sight is heinous.

[dralockhart]

Well, I think this should be the end of our argument. We don't have to agree on everything, but you're clearly not the type of Christian I'm usually repulsed by. I guess we'll just have to disagree on our feelings to Mark Driscoll but we seem to agree on a lot of other attitudes. I don't think it's in our best interest to take this arguing any further.

[dralockhart]

Considering I don't think you'd like me citing Muslim, Jewish, Mormon, Buddhist, or Hindu sacred texts against you.

[ramezgabrail]

I'm sorry is this (and the one below) a reply to any of my posts? Just wondering. Thanks.

[dralockhart]

Yes, it was referring to how you use quotes from the Bible as if they're helping your argument. If I'm arguing against a literalist interpretation, I don't understand how decontextualizing/isolating/ei­segeting helps you at all, considering I've already deemed all three actions irrelevant.

[ramezgabrail]

Eisegeting is always irrelevant, contextualizing (without compromise) is key. All depends on who judges what is isolation or decontextualizing. I take Jesus' authority on that one, not my own.

[dralockhart]

All you do is use isolated Bible quotes. Then you say your interpretation is Jesus' interpretation. "On whose authority? Your own?" Many people who disagree claim their interpretation is Jesus'. If this were so, how can they disagree? The arrogance of it all is not only hilarious but blasphemous as well, and ironic in that they're blaspheming while claiming to speak as Jesus would.

[ramezgabrail]

Can you give me an example? My example is the "love your enemies" one, which needs to be literally interpreted. So far I have not made any "hilarious" nor "blasphemous" statements about Jesus. So please stop accusing me of being arrogant or blasphemous.

[Blissinflux]

Blah blah blee blah blah blah. Sucj a good sound system at Mars Hill, going to such waste listening to this misogynist homopobe. Sorry Marky Mark, there is NO human hierarchy in the eye's of God. I know because God told me so. And then we laughed at you and your ilk.

[dralockhart]

Oh wow, the only time you'll ever find Mark Driscoll being humble is when he teaches on humility... hmm. I wish this guy would take his intolerance and misogyny and go away to some desert island where he can no longer corrupt impressionable minds with his perverted version of Christianity.

[RAIDERJO76]

I always think it's funny when you people, while talking about tolerance, are hateful and intolerant to those who disagree with you.

Driscoll teaches a perverted version of Christianity? What in the heck do you consider to be the "true version" of Christianity, then? Driscoll teaches historic, orthodox Christianity that is based on the auhoritative Word of God. What's perverted about that?

[dralockhart]

I'm not hateful, I just don't tolerate intolerance. That would only allow it to spread even more. I consider the true version of Christianity to be one wherein men and women have an equal place at a table, and people do not have to subscribe to (worldly) gendered social norms in order to be Christian. I also don't consider it Christianly to refer to images of Christ's gentleness as being a "limp-wristed" "fairy." What pride you have in calling Calvinism the "Word of God."

[Zeares]

First off, the bible makes very clear the importance of gender roles in the home. It still propgates the equality and respect for your partner.

Secondly, Driscoll's comments on this limp wristed Jesus were referring to people who seem to think that Jesus is incapable of punishing his people, and that he can be taken advantage of. Look at his actions at the temple when the people were treating it as a market, he responded with anger and punisment, but he does it out of love

[dralockhart]

The Bible also makes it very clear that eating shrimp is an abomination and so is wearing more than one fabric. Have you ever worn a cotton-poly blend or a T-shirt and jeans while eating a crustacean of some kind?

Also, Jesus was gentle. The money changer scene is ONE among MANY where Jesus reacts gently. Look at the adulteress woman.

Of course you would advocate Bible gender roles. You're a man and benefit from them. The Bible was written in a patriarchal society with no thought to women.

[Avlc0n]

What do you mean by intolerance? The way I understand it is excepting everyone's view as correct and that someone cannot say someone else is wrong. Jesus said that isn't correct. He said, in John 14:6, "I am the way, and the truth, and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me." Buddhist, Muslims, Jews, Hindus and Atheists can go to heaven, but they have to go through faith in Jesus. They must repent and trust in Jesus and his work alone for salvation, and follow Him.

[dralockhart]

So you say. But what I find incredibly interesting is that most religions affirm their own truthiness while insisting that others are wrong and incapable of providing true fulfillment. The religion you subscribe to is largely in part to geography and heritage, making the scriptural condemnation of outsiders nothing more than an excuse for xenophobia. I wish people would recognize how ridiculous it was to say their religion is right when everyone believes that of their own and no one has proof.

[ramezgabrail]

I am Egyptian and I'm a Christian. Truth transcends race. The centre of Christianity started in the MidEast, moved to Europe, then to North America, and now is moving to the far east (it is estimated today that there are more Asian Christians than White Christians). Compare this to any other religion.

"Worthy are You to take the book and to break its seals; for You were slain, and purchased for God with Your blood men from every tribe and tongue and people and nation" (Revelation 5:9).

[dralockhart]

In addition, Horus already did everything Jesus did. But no, it wasn't ancient Egyptian mythology that's right. It's Christianity. Why? Oh, because it came out of their culture, not someone else's. It's all a testament to how phobic people are of anyone different than them (which is why men, who had power during that time and wrote the Bible, used their position to put women beneath them... convenient, eh?... I don't think our souls have sexes and I don't think Jesus looks at us differently).

[ramezgabrail]

The story of Horus was first documented by the Greco-Roman historian Plutarch, who lived between AD 46 - 120. Meaning that if Plutarch had started his work on Osiris by the age of 20 (this being quite a conservative estimate), this would place the first manuscript concerning Horus at around AD 66. By that time Christianity was well known. Plutarch probably wanted to spice up the Horus story a bit. Check the New Larousse Encyclopaedia of Mythology, p. 18.

[kybucki]

By not tolerating intolerance isn't that intolerance?

Funniest thing I have read today!

[ramezgabrail]

First you judge the guy then you don't tolerate him and then you try to justify your intolerance? Anyway, here's a verse you might want to consider when speaking of authority in the church:

"But I do not allow a woman to teach or exercise authority over a man, but to remain quiet. For it was Adam who was first created, and then Eve. And it was not Adam who was deceived, but the woman being deceived, fell into transgression. (1 Tim 2:12-14)

True Christianity is biblical, not whatever suits us.

[dralockhart]

And who wrote 1 Tim 2:12-14? A man. I'm sure it suited him to exercise authority over a woman. Your entire version of Christianity is an exercise in flagrant misogyny. It suits your small little mind to put yourself on a pedestal over women.

What's hilarious to me is that you zealous, conservative Christians put so much emphasis on the genitalia. People are defined by their genitals.

Seems a little perverted to me.

[ramezgabrail]

Flagrant misogyny? The same man who wrote that also wrote "Husbands, love your wives, just as Christ also loved the church and gave Himself up for her" (Eph 5:25). A Christian husband is to lay down his life for his wife. Misogyny? Really? Men and women have the same value (Gen 1:27), but different roles. Also, you're saying that I am perverted and have a little mind, taking shots at me shows me that you're losing an argument and are desperate. Proverbs 26:4-5 is what I leave you with.

[ramezgabrail]

Furthermore, scripture says a lot of things that do not suit me. There are plenty of truths that I wished were not true. One of which is in 2 Tim 3:12 (which perhaps is one of the simpler ones). Another one is a command in Matt 5:44. But I believe these truths/commands, regardless of whether they suit me or not. Loving my wife as Christ loved the church! That does NOT suit me. Once you start to pick and choose you start compromising.

[dralockhart]

It does not suit you to love your wife? You must be a terrible person. I'm sorry but these "roles" are terribly unbalanced. A woman must both love and SERVE her husband and all a man has to do is "love" his wife? Misogynists are evil but what is worse is people who exploit religion to manipulate and marginalize others. Furthermore, if truth transcends race then explain to me why there are so many religions. Also, isolating a passage from context and using eisegesis doesn't serve as an argument.

[ramezgabrail]

Of course I will love my wife, but to love her in the same way that Jesus loved the church (laid down His life for her) does not suit me because it means that she deserves a kind of love that is of a very high standard and Im a self-centred sinner. A man must be a servant-leader, and he has to live a life of self-sacrifice and selfless love (so he should serve her more than she serves him).

Check out Driscolls excerpt called who do you think you are? addressing men.

[ramezgabrail]

As for truth, Christianitys adherers are of almost every race, whereas the adherers of other religions tend to be of one particular race. Christianity has no limits in terms of language, race, or gender. There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither slave nor free man, there is neither male nor female; for you are all one in Christ Jesus. (Gal 3:28)

And you're right; I'm a terrible person (a sinner); another truth that does not suit me. My heart's deceitful &desperately wicked (Jer 17:9)

[dralockhart]

Christianity "adherers" are of almost every race because it is a missionary religion (i.e. shove it down other people's throats, tell them their religion is terrible and they will burn in hell for it if they don't change). Islam and Judaism are the same way, and members of both of those religions have "adherers" of numerous races also.

[ramezgabrail]

You totally missed the point on that one. And honestly, the old argument of missionaries "shoving Christianity down people's throats" is getting really old. Enough with uninformed judgments already. I lived with missionaries who left the comfort of America to live in an Arab country where they were treated like crap to spread the love of Christ. 3 of them were killed in 2002. Christianity is one of the very few religions where apostasy is allowed. Have you ever asked yourself why?Think about it.

[dralockhart]

It is kind of shoving it down throats when "Christians" burn villages, burn, boil, and hang people, and use appeals to fear to push their agenda of conversion. Apostasy is only not allowed in Islam. Judaism allows for it as well, and you're clearly uninformed if you think anything like apostasy exists in Buddhism, Hinduism, Daoism. How about getting educated before you make blatant lies?

[ramezgabrail]

Good quotation marks on "Christians." You judge a tree (good or bad) by its fruit. Jesus warned us in Matthew 7 to beware of false teachers. You don't judge a belief system by some of its members, you judge whether the members are truly part of that belief system by whether they display these characteristics or not. Don't confuse the two

I judge you by your fruit. So far youve called be a liar, perverted, terrible, uneducated, and what have I called you?Thats taking love of the Bible literally

[dralockhart]

I've lived among missionaries my entire life. They are the most judgmental and hypocritical people I have met in my entire life. They condescend anyone from another religion without having ever studied that religion. They also expect everyone they speak to to convert, but whenever anyone offers them their own religion, they turn it down without ever bothering to hear about it.

[ramezgabrail]

Again, you dont judge a belief system by those who claim to be members, but you figure out whether theyre members or not by comparing them to how the system says they should be. Jesus said to love our neighbours as ourselves and love our enemies. If they dont display these characteristics then chances are theyre not Christian, let alone missionaries who should be displaying the love of Jesus who said to go and make disciples of all nations because Christianity is not exclusive.

[dralockhart]

You're kidding yourself if you think I'm going to listen to anything by Mark Driscoll. He is a Calvinist and that goes fundamentally against the Bible. He has also made numerous anti-woman remarks. Mark Driscoll is everything that's wrong with Christianity today and I refuse to watch him. Also, I'm not sure why you're still quoting scripture---I already told you it bears no place in an argument against someone who is not a literalist/recognizes the fallacy of eisegesis.

[ramezgabrail]

So wait, you say that Calvinism goes against the Bible but you don't take the Bible literally? I hope you see the contradiction in that argument. Also, Jesus quoted OT scripture all the time and considered it to be God's objective truth. If you don't take the Bible seriously then you don't take Jesus seriously.

It doesn't matter what you think about Driscoll, but I suggest that you listen to other stuff about him before you make an uninformed judgment. I used to wonder if he was a chauvinist.

[dralockhart]

Anyone who takes the Bible literally is clearly uneducated. Just because Jesus quoted OT scripture doesn't mean you have to interpret it literally; that is the most illogical argument I've heard yet. Even so, it would only be the OT we'd have to take seriously since Jesus didn't quote the NT.

[ramezgabrail]

On what authority are you making this judgement? Your own? And then you claim that anyone whos different than you is uneducated. Its ironic that this argument started by you calling Driscoll intolerant. Such hypocrisy. If Jesus took the OT scripture literally, we must too. Theres nothing illogical about that. And the OT is incomplete without the new. Some things are to be taken literally depending on the context. When Jesus said to love our enemies, He meant to love our enemies.

[dralockhart]

I'm taking this authority on someone who has studied the Bible's various contexts and someone who has studied the contexts of other literary works. You can't ever take ANYTHING at total face value, without trying to look underneath its surface. It's just dumb. People are biblical literalists because they're lazy. Rather than having to work or apply principles to questions, they treat the Bible as a "cheat sheet" for life. You can't not put yourself to work and use the Bible as a cop out.

[dralockhart]

Also, after having actually studied the Bible I am able to contextualize it historically, socially, politically, and literarily.

Calvinism does not correlate with any of the Bible's underlying messages. It does not take a literal interpretation to understand that.

Wow, your arguments contain no reason whatsoever. The logical fallacies you have taken (appeals to emotion, ad hominems, etc.) are off the charts. It must be because you've had your head in fairytales that you've lost credibility.

[yourbrotherinchrist]

I don't agree with Mark Driscoll on every point, but the man uses the Word as his standard for teaching, and loves Jesus. Though you disagree with his interpretation, as do I on some theological point, I don't think you should right him off. I don't know the man, but he seems like the type of guy who would be happy to sit down, study the bible together, and discuss the truth. Don't be so harsh, pray for him, and when you see an error in teaching, reprove and back up with scripture out of love.

[yourbrotherinchrist]

(write*) After all, what would have happened if Paul stopped talking to Peter and listening to him after Peter didn't hang with the gentiles?

[silverlakes211]

mark driscoll really doesnt understand the gay scene. he goes on about cardigans lemon and pansies. Mark check out the gay scene in Seattle they look a lot like you with your sharp hair and hip clothes.careful you might get hit on!

[UNOMINER]

They just been on the news in the UK they instaling gay bishops now this is a total abomination to God. For it is also written "that every man shall do what is right in his own eyes." Thats what people are doing now doing whats right in their own eyes not Gods.

We should be a joy to God, we should be a pleaseure to him. NOT to pleasure ourselves of this world in our hearts desire. Does in not also say te heart is deceitfully wicked above all other members.

Worship God NOT self.

[mattymattb]

awesome!

[acaval3]

praise the LORD! driscoll showing humilty (this comment comes from a HUGE driscoll fan)

[stoptripn]

You're still an arrogant weenie boy.

[RAIDERJO76]

grow up

[kmew216]

He's completely right about the attitude coming out of his church. He needed to address this, and the fact that he was willing to acknowledge his fault in this matter just boosted my respect for him 110%. I actually may come and sit in on a real sermon now.

[MarkettaLuv]

He comes across as a jerk and those who believe his crap need therapy.

[RAIDERJO76]

geeze at least try to act like a grown-up...

[harmonysound]

Would love to hear the full sermon.

[therealdrag0]

I bet it's on their website marshillchurch . org

[angarkitek]

that's very courageous of Mark Driscoll. May the Lord bless him more.

[Adelaartje]

I really need to get hold of this book of CJ sometimes..

[gailowens]

God bless Pastor Mark, I needed to hear this sermon.

[BiblicalAnswers]

Very well said. This is exactly what I need. Time to go find the full sermon. Thanks for posting this.