I agree with the value of being modest, but does it have to be enforced to this degree? If a man wants to look at a woman for sexual enjoyment, he is going to do it regardless of what she is wearing, and so too a woman looking at a man. These rules just seem like a way to show that the community wants to cut itself off from the rest of the world.
As a Jew, I find their request to be completely unacceptable. They must follow the lands of the land in which they live, especially since they receive government funding. The last time I checked, there were no laws against foul language, exposed necklines and shoulders.
@breeeegs I'm not American, but I'm pretty sure that there is no law that tells the people of that country to dress modestly and maintain gender segregation in public. If these were true Torah observant Jews, they'd make aliyah to Eretz Yisrael.
You accuse them of being self-righteous for requesting modesty and politeness for those who visit their little village and yet you look down on them for not making aliyah? Why don't YOU make Aliyah? And militar service in Israel is mandator so I doubt they'd be dodging service anytime soon
@breeeegs Yes, he wouldn't be dodging military service but I can assure you, should the entire population of Kiryas Joel would move to Israel, NONE of "these people" would EVER serve in the military.
And by the way, military men of any country hate religious nut-jobs irrespective of their particular faith; they make lousy recruits because they weigh all military decisions in light of their faith and this causes perpetual breakdowns in discipline.
@breeeegs Sorry, I hit 'post' too quickly: If these were true Torah observant Jews, they'd make aliyah to Eretz Yisrael, live on a settlement where they can cover up as much as they want and have as many kids as they want and dodge military service and basically not contribute anything valuable to society. If this were happening in my country, you'd better believe I'd tell my MP. And before anyone reading this calls me racist, I'm not. I'm Jewish.
Who do you think you are to dictate to people how they should live? You're a hypocrite in the worst possible way, the Jews of Kiryat Joel have created a stable, functioning community that revolves around Torah, I doubt you ever pick up a Tanach in your life
@breeeegs You have a disgusting tone to your messages. You don't know who I am, where I've lived, and where I currently live. You clearly know NOTHING about army service in Israel otherwise you'd know that Chasidim don't normally serve precisely because of their religious observance. That is wrong. All Israeli citizens have a duty to protect Medinat Israel.
So Israeli citizens only have a duty to the state? What is Medinat Yisroel to you? What is the point of Eretz Yisrael's existence if not as the homeland promised to us by G-d, as the holiest place in Creation! Do you have any idea of what Jews have endured for thousands of years just to return to the one tiny piece of land you are fortunate enough to live in? Israel is not a nation like other nations, it is more he than a secular state! The Satmar are angry because Jews like you have forgotten
@breeeegs Judging from the wisdom of @rudabeh who has criticized you for your vitriol that is totally useless, pointless and totally counter-productive, you need to read a non-Torah, non-Oral Law book called "How To Win Friends And Influence People" by Dale Carnegie
However, you and I know you will dismiss such an opus, for after all it can't be anything useful and you would claim this because you know such a book would have no meaning since it is outside the boundaries of Yiddishkeit
@breeeegs I have forgotten nothing. You need to shut your mouth and stop making assumptions about someone you don't know. I'm no longer responding to your vitriolic comments. Goodbye.
You mean the way you made assumptions about an entire community you have never set foot in, telling me to "shut my mouth" on top of it? You are only making a stronger case for Kiryas Joel by the second. Maybe you should go there and learn from them
@breeeegs 01.The creation of the modern-day State Of Israel was not done as according to G-d's laws and words; modern-day Zionism was created by secular Jews in light of The Dreyfus Affair and as an extension of early Socialist movements; very religious Jewry largely rejected this but many did sign on after Israel became a reality.
Even today, the Satmar do reject the the State of Israel for these reasons; at least they are intellectually honest this way, unlike yourself.
@breeeegs 02. Another thing, Israel is a nation pretty much like other nations; what makes Israel such a success is this:
Israel is a Great Nation NOT because it is a Jewish nation; Israel is a great nation because Israel is a FREE Nation (hey, have you ever heard of this? It's called REPUBLICANISM, a thoroughly man-made idea) and wherever there are Free Nations there is GREATNESS.
You, of course, hate the greatness of Republicanism and Freedom; you admire the littleness of Halakah.
Israel is a great nation because G-d promised that it would be would be for those who have followed his Torah. The wisdom of the Torah is greater than the wisdom of man because it comes from Hashem, and many values of western democracy such as compassion and justice come from the Torah. This country is built in accordance with the ten commandments, you obviously know nothing about the history of your own nation
@breeeegs Israel was FOUNDED BY SECULAR JEWS; Theordor Herzl never even had his sons circumcised; in many ways early Zionism was an extension of many other world-wide socialist movements that were in vogue at the time.
What this has to do with "The Wisdom of Torah" is simply beyond me.
Israel is not a nation like other nations, it is a special and holy nation and nothing else you or anyone else says can change that. I also find it interesting that you don't realize the "nation of Israel" IS a name for the Jewish people, so you're saying we're not great. We're great spiritually, not materially. We're not a people that build empires, we're a people who spend every second devoted to God
@breeeegs Yes, I can see from the overall sloppiness and disheveled appearance of Kiryas Joel that violating building codes and having endless garbage lying around is clearly the hallmark of a people who spend every second devoted to God.
Wow, that's not judgmental at all. They're in a marketplace with clothes on display. A report in the New York Times reported about Kiryas Joel that "it has no slums or homeless people. No one who lives there is shabbily dressed or has to go hungry. Crime is virtually nonexistent." That's more than you can say about alot of other parts of America. Until you've visited the community I suggest you refrain from judging them
@breeeegs First of all, there are many other parts of America that are not home to ultra-Orthodox Jews that are as you've described.
Secondly I am very judgemental; the people of Kiryas Joel actively eschew Republicanist values much as Communists and/or the late Rev. Jerry Falwell and his particular brand of Baptists do; to me it's all the same thing.
The Chazon Ish ZT"L that when a camel carrying a wagon with a loaded cart meets one with an empty cart on a narrow road, the empty cart must make room for the full one. The existence of the State of Israel is a blessing but a secular Israel cannot sustain itself alone, it needs Torah to survive or it is an empty shell
In what way? They politely requested that those visiting their community respect its values by dressing modestly. It is a request, not a law. You are the one who is clearly threatened by anything outside the boundaries of your man made secular society.
Attempting to assimilate with the non-Jewish world has only brought destruction and tragedy on the Jewish people, so no, I will not "step into the 20th century",
@breeeegs 01) It's nice to see you're a proud, religious Jew; this of course, is where, in your own mind (such as it is)you believe you have the right to make endless strawmen out of the points that others raise.
Fortunately, if such matters ever came to ahead in a secular court, the basic idiocies of your strawman, non-sequiturious points would endlessly be struck down, irrespective of how many times you claimed them legitimate under The Pentateuch.
@breeeegs 02) Since you're so against what the 20th Century, and secular learning in general has wrought (much of it, by the way, by secular Jews) I would then just suggest you truly be honest (hah!) and just go live at the level of technology that existed when your creed was affirmed.
Since, in those days, most babies didn't live to their first birthday and most older children died before adulthood, odds are, we would then never have to have heard from you at all!!!
Am I against what the twentieth century has wrought? You mean two world wars, a nuclear holocaust the claimed the lives of millions, and an attempted genocide that claimed the lives of my great grandparents and millions of my people? No, I am not proud of those wonderful achievements wrought by the brilliance of man. And I know it must torment you that the descendants of Sinai are still here, alive and well, secular and religious, a living proof of G-d, after everything that has happened to us
You're entire world revolves around materialism and technology. The Jews of Kiryat Joel live and thrive in a purely spiritual environment, which clearly intimidates you. The Jews who G-d took out of the desert are still here, since we relied on Him to take care of us, not on man. The Jewish people are still here. We will always be here, and we will always believe G-d and the Torah he gave us. You may not like that, but that's too bad for you
@breeeegs One of the best things that preserves The State Of Israel are at least 125 nukes, many of them on submarines, always moving around; this is something much of the world truly understands.
@catothewiser Not only are you incredibly stupid, you're also a total illiterate.
If you attack Israel pre-emptively that means that the Israeli submarine commanders will throw every nuke they have as retaliation; you're really that dumb . . .
@SatchmoSings - sounds like terrorism to me and we should not deal with terrorists. Their little toy submarines are as much as joke as the IDF and Mossad who are the equivalent to keystone cops. Their country was created with the use of terrorism and they are a bad apple for the region. A bad example that you can get what you want with terrorism. Look up the terrorist groups the Irgun and Stern gang.
@catothewiser So, first you deny Israel's power and then you admit to the power of Israeli terrorism; you sound pretty fucked up.
And yes, Israel did threaten to nuke the Arabs in the 1973 War, genius; that's why the Arabs haven't made a "general war" with Israel since as they did in 1948, 1956, 1967 and 1973 because they're afraid and that's no joke.
Go ahead and destroy Israel; if only two nukes from each sub get through, that's more than enough and everyone knows it.
@catothewiser Those subs are not toys; while they're not atomic powered, they are the most technically advanced diesel-electric submarines on earth, after all they're German-designed and built and we all know how much you respect Germany this way.
Most of the people commenting on this with all their hate towards orthodox Jews need to realize that it's just a request. Nobody is forcing visitors to do anything.
Can someone please explain to me how all of these famalies and their religous government live on US tax payers money with their community subsidized by the federal and state governments and yet they do not have to abide equal rights laws?
Actually fundamentalist jews, christians and muslims are VERY similar and in my view are against what America is all about. You guys should all love each other because you are all insane.
What is America all about? YOU are against the religious freedom America was designed to protect, and you are disgracing your fellow Jews by slandering those of us who live in accordance with Torah values
They can request "modesty" all they want, but they can't enforce it. There's simply no way you can require people in a particular city to dress a certain way if they don't want to, unless that group owns the land, effectively making the entire village private property, somewhat akin to the compound where Warren Jeffs moved his FLDS flock in Texas when they left northern Arizona. If a non-member of their religion wants to dress the way they ask, fine, but otherwise, they gotta live with it.
It is my belief that there should be another sign in Kiryas Joel, telling the residents that their village is part of a larger Republic and that they should respect the traditions of same.
This village was founded by one of my relatives, Szatmárnémeti jido, those who live in are a pathetic joke next to the vision on how this village should be.
I'm a Jew who abides by the modesty/dress standards [Tznius] and Kiryas Joel has a right... it can be offending to the men to see a scantily clad women or the women to see a scantily clad man.
@challahbackgirl Kiryas Joel is in a Republic, The United States of America; the courts have ruled, over-and-over, that is is Republicanist Standards that are to prevail in The United States of America, not ones that you just happen to "like."
So by your definition dressing modestly, not swearing and separating men from women in public in a village that encompasses a few miles is against Ameircan law?
@breeeegs First of all, you're making your point with absolute and total dishonesty because you're not really interested in an honest discussion, you just want to "win" the argument.
You're doing this by claiming that it's MY definition of US Law and not of US law ITSELF.
You're also confusing individual rights with those of civil rights and you deliberate jumble all this up as you have to make YOUR point which is ultimately totally pointless; fuck you, you lowlife.
I'm not dishonest, you're the one skirting around the issue. You still haven't answered my question of how these people are violating any part of US law
@breeeegs You are dishonest and I've already explained the "why" to you and I make it a point not to answer a question that contains all these jumbled up mess which you DELIBERATELY combined as you did to make your very own "point."
Civil rights ARE individual rights, if they don't ensure the right of people of any group to practice their religion in peace than what purpose could they possibly serve?
@breeeegs Ah, so now you're making an attempt, as feeble as it is, to be more specific because I've already made the point to you as I have, though ultimately you're still asking your question with, what you obviously think is, a foregone conclusion.
In a court of law, that is the law of THE UNITED STATES, as opposed to your stupid Halakhah, what you asked would be struck down in an instant.
I'm not discussing this crap on your totally idiotic terms; Try again, nimrod.
i suppose theyre happer than us, theyre surrounded with children, help each other, have enough belongings to survive without hunger and respect each other.
hehehe you stupid goyim must accept multicultualism, but us Jews get to keep our homogeneous towns. We own the media, the banks, dwell in the white house and you white gentile pigs fight in the middle east to secure Israel, while your shiksha wives are being fed our inter-racial propaganda through the media. We truly are the chosen people. We destroyed the german people with our Jewish invented communism and now dominate you stupid goyim throughout the globe. AHAHAHAHA STUPID GENTILE SCUM
Although I think that telling people to use "appropriate language" is over the the top, I do not think that asking people to dress modestly when they are coming into THEIR neighborhood is too offensive, after all body exposure - of those body parts we cover up in the winter- is for them like someone uncovering her private parts in public places,
So they have a right to live by their religion not having to be exposed to it in their OWN neighborhood!.
@joebaum613 Asking people to abide by whatever they want to ask others to abide by, is fine. As an American citizen. I freely belong to a religion and country that says I can say and dress however the fuck I want. This neighborhood is in my country and we have this thing called "FREEDOM". Look it up.
@mrdysgo Its not like they're FORCING us to abide by these rules they are are just asking us to be considerate and sensitive to other peoples values and religion.
@joebaum613 "Although I think that telling people to use "appropriate language" is over the the top, I do not think that asking people to dress modestly when they are coming into THEIR neighborhood is too offensive"
This is a town that LIVES off from welfare from the state.
It's not their town, they don't pay for it, the rest of country does.
They are supposedly the poorest town in the nation, because they're a bunch of tax cheats and welfare frauds. They're a gang of criminals.
@BrooklynNotQueens "it would make a great tourist destination with say a bus tour from NYC. "
I think it would be better to put 1/2 the town in jail for tax evasion and welfare fraud.
They are a horrific examples of the Jewish people. They are the stereotype of anti-Semites. They are liars, thieves, and morally bankrupt scumbags. I'm surprised more Jewish people aren't ashamed of such deplorable immoral behavior.
@fuzzywzhe You made a superb point; if the residents of Kiryas Joel lived as the Amish do, I could agree with joebaum613 but since they make it a point to get every bit of government largesse that they can, I say to hell with what that sign has to say.
A small group of friends from New York City went to visit Kiryas Joel on foot. The village public safety officer almost immediately confronted us, demanded identification, and said he would arrest us if we did not comply. He did not arrest us, but he did call the New York State Police, who did arrest two of us. You can see videos of that by pasting these after youtube.com: /watch?v=k3nJ_6xy0-U or /watch?v=UOqBWIExvlk
"This is for people who don't know (what to do)". Would she be referring to the American taxpayers who pay for the welfare checks and food stamps in Kiryas Joel?
While people were worrying about sharia law halacha came instead (Jewish law). No religion in this nation has the right to tell Americans to "maintain gender separation". Keep that crap in Saudi Arabia where it belongs.
from when do we need the mind of the non-jewish people? so much discuss to them that someone don`t be like them with a complete schmutz "civilization"?
You can ask people to dress modestly in a place of worship (e.g., synagogue, church, etc.), but to control what people wear out in town while they are running errands or visiting? That's just ridiculous. If I want to wear a tank top out in public on a hot summer day, I will do so. Living in a democratic country gives me that right..
I agree, the high percentage of welfare recipients doesn't look good. In fact, no population should have to suffer such poverty There is plenty of land; why not raise food for the community instead? I see on the town website showing many parking lots. Those are superfluous, and why pave over G-d's green earth when it can be used for food and nature's creatures instead? There is even a town bus system. Why the need for so many cars? Nu, it's a beautiful area, don't destroy with asphalt.
I wonder what the response would be if Muslims established a town and required all visitors to dress as they do.
This village receives federal funds for their schools, all of which are religious. What would most Americans say if Islamic or Christian schools also received funeral funds. No religious schools should get government money. But somehow if it is religious Jews there is a double standard.
Christian schools don't recieve federal funds? There must be millions of Christian private schools all across America. The Amish live in insular communities and are still considered American, yet you don't seem to have any animosity towards them? It is the only idea of a Jewish community that bothers you, a Jewish community that values modesty and spiritual values instead of the materialism you immerse yourself in every day of your life
@breeeegs I do not believe that ANY religious schools of ANY denomination should receive federal funds. If parents want to send their kids to a religious school let them pay for it. Secular private schools do not get federal funds. Neither should religious schools.
As far as the outmoded rules of Kiryas Joel, I would like to remind you that you live in the US, not Israel or some country that requires "modest" dress, gender separation. You would do well in an Islamic country with the same rules.
@breeeegs So do you believe in the part of Torah that says "Thank G-d I was not born a woman. Thank G-d I was not born a gentile>"
That is why Torah and the Bible are meaningless to me as is ALL relgion based on some sky spook and a Torah and Bible written not by some mysterious G-d but by rabbis and priests who needed to control their people and to have some explanation for how the world began. Relgion has been one of the curses visited on the world. You won't like this posting. I don't care.
I am not angry at you. You are a holy Jew, I know you are Jewish and you have a holy neshama inside you. Thank G-d I was not born a woman, because women have to go through the pains of childbirth. It is not an insult to women at all. There aare prayers extolling the virtue and holiness of women like Aishes Chayil. The mysteries and wisdom of the Torah are infinite and eternal, every word of the Torah is pure and perfect. You put a hypen in G-d's name so I know you must believe in Him
@breeeegs I put a hyphen because that is what my grandfather did. My parents did not and I only put it there because I was writing to you. Otherwise I never use a hyphen. Furthermore I am not a believer in any god. It never made any sense to my parents nor to me nor to my children. BTW, childbirth was a wonderful experience giving me two terrific children. I stopped at 2. More is far too many in this over populated world where already there is not enough food or water for all.
Only by having children can one make the world a better place. In the Torah it is clearly stated as a mitzvah to be fruitful and multiply to bring the light of Hashem's Torah and holiness into the world. Women praise G-d by saying "thank You for having made according to your will." Men and women thank G-d for the number of obligations that G-d gave them which is considered a holy privilege, not out of disrespect for the opposite gender.
@breeeegs When Torah was written it was necessry to populate the world. Nowi it is not necessary. There are already far too many people in the world. Birth control is a mitzvah & should be practiced by all who want to have a decent world for all. I do not believe that anyone but my husband and I made our children. Hashem, as you call him, had nothing to do with it. I also know that there are many women in the world who have children they can't feed or clothe. No mysterious being helps them.
@breeeegs When Torah was written it was necessry to populate the world. Nowi it is not necessary. There are already far too many people in the world. Birth control is a mitzvah & should be practiced by all who want to have a decent world for all. I do not believe that anyone but my husband and I made our children. Hashem, as you call him, had nothing to do with it. I also know that there are many women in the world who have children they can't feed or clothe. No mysterious being helps them.
@breeeegs@breeeegs When Torah was written it was necessry to populate the world. Nowi it is not necessary. There are already too many people in the world. Birth control is a mitzvah & should be practiced by all who want to have a decent world. I do not believe that anyone but my husband and I made our children. Hashem, as you call him, had nothing to do with it. I also know that there are many women in the world who have children they can't feed or clothe. No mysterious being helps them.
@breeeegs When Torah was written it was necessry to populate the world. Nowi it is not necessary. There are already too many people in the world. Birth control is a mitzvah & should be practiced by all who want to have a decent world. I do not believe that anyone but my husband and I made our children. Hashem, as you call him, had nothing to do with it. I also know that there are many women in the world who have children they can't feed or clothe. No mysterious being helps them.
So who gave you your children? Don't you think they are a blessing from Hashem? Who do you think creates all life? Every child and every life is a miracle from Hashem.
There certainly is enough food and water to accomodate everyone in the world, the problem is that people haven't learned to share it with each other, but we can
@breeeegs The rules of Torah are totally outmoded; the efficacy of Republicanism has been proven because, after all, where else could a community like Kiryas Joel exist in the first place!!!
How does the lifestyle of Kiryat Joel and its residents affect you in any way? American taxpayers were giving money to Jersey Shore, the epitome of gashmius and filth, but I didn't hear a single voice raised in protest. Yet when a small community of Jews, who have not violated a single American law, want to live Torah observant lives, liberal Jews like you start frothing at the mouth for a chance to tear them apart?
@breeeegs I am not dictating to anyone how they should live their lives. All I said was that you follow the laws of the land in which you live. The only reason the Jews of Kiryat Joel have a functioning society is because the American government is funding it! Seriously, take your head out of your ass and open your eyes. And I'm not a liberal Jew. I'm a Mizrachi Jew and we don't use such divisions where I come from.
You are certainly dictating how they should live their lives, and if their way of life didn't bother you you wouldn't be commenting here. Judging from the comments here, which are surely more hateful than mine (i have already been called a moron and an idiot many times since i started commenting) I do agree that the Jews of Kiryat Yoel would be better off in Eretz Israel, since that is the land made for the Jews, and I believe we will all return there soon G-d willing
@breeeegs If you people take even one cent of US tax dollars to maintain your "way of life" this offends me. Do not ask for any tax dolllars for roads, for schools, for the electircial grid, for fire and police protection. Pay your own way in everything if you can.
@breeeegs Again, you're trying to "win" your argument by dragging in things that are all totally unrelated.
The Amish GET NO GOVERNMENT LARGESSE; THEY DON'T TAKE FOOD STAMPS OR ANY OTHER FEDERAL, STATE and/or LOCAL WELFARE. The Amish don't pay into Social Security nor do they collect it; at least the Amish are HONEST this way.
Can I move to Israel and put up signs saying "don't dress in black hats and coats" in my community?? Why not? If I'm offended by the dress code there, why can't I do that?
@andyandymax Who cares what these mini-muslims want??? This is the United States and we don't live by sharia or halachic law, period. That's what Israel is for. Go live there. We don't force women to separate themselves from men in this country. YOU have to assimilate to OUR customs, not the other way around.
@bobbydimarzio - Not comparable at all. The Muslims want to impose shariah law EVERYWHERE, and force everyone in the world to keep it. Those hasids just want to keep their own little haven. It doesn't threaten or endanger anyone else.
@chaosbringer127 - LOL! As if they need another spokesman! Don't you ever watch the news? You really doubt that many Muslims want to impose sharia law all over the world? Despite the fact that they are quite clear and open about wnating to do so?
"They" lol. Putting words in a group of 2 billion people's mouths. Good job bro, I hear you have the authority to speak on behalf of 1/4th of the world.
Not really. Just observing how you talk is enough for me.
I can judge 1 person based on his own actions. It makes logical sense.
You, however, are judging 2 billion people on the actions of what? A few thousand insane people?
Want me to judge all white people based on the serial killers that come out of their population? Judge all black people based on some of the murderers that come out of their people? Hispanics, asians, whatever.
@chaosbringer127 - Now you vary your tune. Trying for legitimacy now? I also merely observe. Furthermore, I said MANY Muslims; i did not say all. I think you're a hypocrite.
". The Muslims want to impose shariah law EVERYWHERE," This is what you said. You did not say "many" muslims. You said "the muslims" as if we were one entity.
@chaosbringer127 - I wrote more than one post. And if you bothered to read them, you'd know that I said "many," though not in the one you're referring to. In any case, I don't believe you. I believe that most Muslims want sharia law everywhere. And you're not a spokesman for Muslims either.
@bobbydimarzio - Are you saying that by American law everyone who comes here is required to abandon their religion and assimilate? I'm sorry, but there is no such law, and in fact that is AGAINST American law.
@andyandymax I'm saying they have no right to tell AMERICANS to assimiliate to their middle eastern ways. Don't like it? You have a whole country you can go to based on your middle eastern ways.
@bobbydimarzio get your facts right and learn that the Jews are not mini muslims. SEcondly, no one is enforcing any laws on any americans here, but rather a small village of Jews erected a sign ASKING nicely that people entering to please respect their values by modest dress and behavior. Now ask yourself how you'd be reacting if the Amish of Kentucky erected such a sign upon entering their remote village. Of course everyone would think its interesting. This is just anti semitism.
@familykazor Yes, they are minimuslims when they are telling women to cover up and be modest like muslims do. No difference. Now if these were muslims "asking" people to cover up would you be so nice about it? No, of course not. And if the Amish did this, I'd protest that, too. But they aren't. Kiryas Joel is.
@bobbydimarzio - Unlike the Muslims, they created their own little town where they would not have to impose on other people. Again, Muslims have openly declared that they will impose and enforce their lifestyle on the entire world. These guys in Kiryat Joel have no such intention. It can in no way affect you or 99% or all Americans. That's not what this is about. You're just spitting out hatred.
@andyandymax THEY IMPOSE ON US WITH ALL THE TAXES THEY GET FROM US! GET REAL, ON WELFARE , FOOD STAMPS AND DEALING DIAMONDS. GIVE ME A BREAK! THEY HAVE MILLIONS TO BUY REAL ESTATE BUT NEED SOCIAL SERVICES. B.S. SO IT DOES AFFECT US. MAKE YOUR OWN LITTLE TOWN SOMEWHERE ELSE. THEY PAY LITTLE TAXES AND REEM THE BENEFITS. WAKE UP! CALL IT HATRED OR WHATEVER YOU WANT. IT'S A FACT AND THE TRUTH AND EVERYBODY KNOWS IT! BIGGEST FRAUD IN ORANGE COUNTY! DRIVE THROUGH, CHECK OUT THE NEW HOMES WE PAID FOR!
@bobbydimarzio "YOU have to assimilate to OUR customs, not the other way around."
Two responses:
(1) These Hasidic Jews include many who were born in America. They are as American as anyone else.
(2) The original Americans were either Native Americans or Puritans. So how far do you want to take this demand for assimilation? Maybe we all have to dress in loincloths and live in the forests, or put scarlet letters on adulterers?
I agree with the value of being modest, but does it have to be enforced to this degree? If a man wants to look at a woman for sexual enjoyment, he is going to do it regardless of what she is wearing, and so too a woman looking at a man. These rules just seem like a way to show that the community wants to cut itself off from the rest of the world.
matisyahup613 4 days ago
Clearly this city needs more diversity!!!!!!!!!!! Let's call the NAACP!
catothewiser 5 days ago
As a Jew, I find their request to be completely unacceptable. They must follow the lands of the land in which they live, especially since they receive government funding. The last time I checked, there were no laws against foul language, exposed necklines and shoulders.
rudabeh 2 weeks ago 2
They ARE following American law to the letter. Name one law or amendment they have violated
breeeegs 1 week ago
@breeeegs I'm not American, but I'm pretty sure that there is no law that tells the people of that country to dress modestly and maintain gender segregation in public. If these were true Torah observant Jews, they'd make aliyah to Eretz Yisrael.
rudabeh 1 week ago
You accuse them of being self-righteous for requesting modesty and politeness for those who visit their little village and yet you look down on them for not making aliyah? Why don't YOU make Aliyah? And militar service in Israel is mandator so I doubt they'd be dodging service anytime soon
breeeegs 1 week ago
@breeeegs Yes, he wouldn't be dodging military service but I can assure you, should the entire population of Kiryas Joel would move to Israel, NONE of "these people" would EVER serve in the military.
And by the way, military men of any country hate religious nut-jobs irrespective of their particular faith; they make lousy recruits because they weigh all military decisions in light of their faith and this causes perpetual breakdowns in discipline.
SatchmoSings 1 week ago
@breeeegs Sorry, I hit 'post' too quickly: If these were true Torah observant Jews, they'd make aliyah to Eretz Yisrael, live on a settlement where they can cover up as much as they want and have as many kids as they want and dodge military service and basically not contribute anything valuable to society. If this were happening in my country, you'd better believe I'd tell my MP. And before anyone reading this calls me racist, I'm not. I'm Jewish.
rudabeh 1 week ago
Who do you think you are to dictate to people how they should live? You're a hypocrite in the worst possible way, the Jews of Kiryat Joel have created a stable, functioning community that revolves around Torah, I doubt you ever pick up a Tanach in your life
breeeegs 1 week ago
@breeeegs You have a disgusting tone to your messages. You don't know who I am, where I've lived, and where I currently live. You clearly know NOTHING about army service in Israel otherwise you'd know that Chasidim don't normally serve precisely because of their religious observance. That is wrong. All Israeli citizens have a duty to protect Medinat Israel.
rudabeh 1 week ago
So Israeli citizens only have a duty to the state? What is Medinat Yisroel to you? What is the point of Eretz Yisrael's existence if not as the homeland promised to us by G-d, as the holiest place in Creation! Do you have any idea of what Jews have endured for thousands of years just to return to the one tiny piece of land you are fortunate enough to live in? Israel is not a nation like other nations, it is more he than a secular state! The Satmar are angry because Jews like you have forgotten
breeeegs 1 week ago
Who we are!
breeeegs 1 week ago
@breeeegs Judging from the wisdom of @rudabeh who has criticized you for your vitriol that is totally useless, pointless and totally counter-productive, you need to read a non-Torah, non-Oral Law book called "How To Win Friends And Influence People" by Dale Carnegie
However, you and I know you will dismiss such an opus, for after all it can't be anything useful and you would claim this because you know such a book would have no meaning since it is outside the boundaries of Yiddishkeit
SatchmoSings 1 week ago
@breeeegs I have forgotten nothing. You need to shut your mouth and stop making assumptions about someone you don't know. I'm no longer responding to your vitriolic comments. Goodbye.
rudabeh 1 week ago
You mean the way you made assumptions about an entire community you have never set foot in, telling me to "shut my mouth" on top of it? You are only making a stronger case for Kiryas Joel by the second. Maybe you should go there and learn from them
breeeegs 1 week ago
@breeeegs 01.The creation of the modern-day State Of Israel was not done as according to G-d's laws and words; modern-day Zionism was created by secular Jews in light of The Dreyfus Affair and as an extension of early Socialist movements; very religious Jewry largely rejected this but many did sign on after Israel became a reality.
Even today, the Satmar do reject the the State of Israel for these reasons; at least they are intellectually honest this way, unlike yourself.
SatchmoSings 1 week ago
@breeeegs 02. Another thing, Israel is a nation pretty much like other nations; what makes Israel such a success is this:
Israel is a Great Nation NOT because it is a Jewish nation; Israel is a great nation because Israel is a FREE Nation (hey, have you ever heard of this? It's called REPUBLICANISM, a thoroughly man-made idea) and wherever there are Free Nations there is GREATNESS.
You, of course, hate the greatness of Republicanism and Freedom; you admire the littleness of Halakah.
SatchmoSings 1 week ago
Israel is a great nation because G-d promised that it would be would be for those who have followed his Torah. The wisdom of the Torah is greater than the wisdom of man because it comes from Hashem, and many values of western democracy such as compassion and justice come from the Torah. This country is built in accordance with the ten commandments, you obviously know nothing about the history of your own nation
breeeegs 1 week ago
@breeeegs Israel was FOUNDED BY SECULAR JEWS; Theordor Herzl never even had his sons circumcised; in many ways early Zionism was an extension of many other world-wide socialist movements that were in vogue at the time.
What this has to do with "The Wisdom of Torah" is simply beyond me.
SatchmoSings 1 week ago
@SatchmoSings Zionisms is Nazism for Jews.
catothewiser 5 days ago
Israel is not a nation like other nations, it is a special and holy nation and nothing else you or anyone else says can change that. I also find it interesting that you don't realize the "nation of Israel" IS a name for the Jewish people, so you're saying we're not great. We're great spiritually, not materially. We're not a people that build empires, we're a people who spend every second devoted to God
breeeegs 1 week ago
@breeeegs Yes, I can see from the overall sloppiness and disheveled appearance of Kiryas Joel that violating building codes and having endless garbage lying around is clearly the hallmark of a people who spend every second devoted to God.
SatchmoSings 1 week ago
Wow, that's not judgmental at all. They're in a marketplace with clothes on display. A report in the New York Times reported about Kiryas Joel that "it has no slums or homeless people. No one who lives there is shabbily dressed or has to go hungry. Crime is virtually nonexistent." That's more than you can say about alot of other parts of America. Until you've visited the community I suggest you refrain from judging them
breeeegs 1 week ago
@breeeegs First of all, there are many other parts of America that are not home to ultra-Orthodox Jews that are as you've described.
Secondly I am very judgemental; the people of Kiryas Joel actively eschew Republicanist values much as Communists and/or the late Rev. Jerry Falwell and his particular brand of Baptists do; to me it's all the same thing.
SatchmoSings 1 week ago
@breeeegs - it was the way most of America was until these very same Jews foisted Blacks on us. I say it is time we return the favor.
catothewiser 5 days ago
@breeeegs - Israel is not a nation at all - they refuse to define their borders which means they are not a legitimate country.
catothewiser 5 days ago
The Chazon Ish ZT"L that when a camel carrying a wagon with a loaded cart meets one with an empty cart on a narrow road, the empty cart must make room for the full one. The existence of the State of Israel is a blessing but a secular Israel cannot sustain itself alone, it needs Torah to survive or it is an empty shell
breeeegs 1 week ago
Oh my god, what's the big deal about the small request. Is it so hard to be modest for like 10 sec. when u pass there village? Seriously!!!! C'mon!
13920road 1 month ago
@13920road Yes; yes it is; it is a destruction of another's freedom.
SatchmoSings 1 week ago
In what way? They politely requested that those visiting their community respect its values by dressing modestly. It is a request, not a law. You are the one who is clearly threatened by anything outside the boundaries of your man made secular society.
breeeegs 1 week ago
Dear Ultra-Orthodox, Please make an effort to step into at least the 20th century. Sincerely, A Fellow Jew
chamuda610 1 month ago
Dear assimilated Jew with contempt for Torah,
Attempting to assimilate with the non-Jewish world has only brought destruction and tragedy on the Jewish people, so no, I will not "step into the 20th century",
Sincerely,
A proud religious Jew
breeeegs 1 week ago
@breeeegs 01) It's nice to see you're a proud, religious Jew; this of course, is where, in your own mind (such as it is)you believe you have the right to make endless strawmen out of the points that others raise.
Fortunately, if such matters ever came to ahead in a secular court, the basic idiocies of your strawman, non-sequiturious points would endlessly be struck down, irrespective of how many times you claimed them legitimate under The Pentateuch.
SatchmoSings 1 week ago
@breeeegs 02) Since you're so against what the 20th Century, and secular learning in general has wrought (much of it, by the way, by secular Jews) I would then just suggest you truly be honest (hah!) and just go live at the level of technology that existed when your creed was affirmed.
Since, in those days, most babies didn't live to their first birthday and most older children died before adulthood, odds are, we would then never have to have heard from you at all!!!
SatchmoSings 1 week ago
Am I against what the twentieth century has wrought? You mean two world wars, a nuclear holocaust the claimed the lives of millions, and an attempted genocide that claimed the lives of my great grandparents and millions of my people? No, I am not proud of those wonderful achievements wrought by the brilliance of man. And I know it must torment you that the descendants of Sinai are still here, alive and well, secular and religious, a living proof of G-d, after everything that has happened to us
breeeegs 1 week ago
You're entire world revolves around materialism and technology. The Jews of Kiryat Joel live and thrive in a purely spiritual environment, which clearly intimidates you. The Jews who G-d took out of the desert are still here, since we relied on Him to take care of us, not on man. The Jewish people are still here. We will always be here, and we will always believe G-d and the Torah he gave us. You may not like that, but that's too bad for you
breeeegs 1 week ago
@breeeegs One of the best things that preserves The State Of Israel are at least 125 nukes, many of them on submarines, always moving around; this is something much of the world truly understands.
SatchmoSings 1 week ago
@SatchmoSings - clearly they are a threat that needs to be attacked pre-emptively, then.
catothewiser 5 days ago
@catothewiser Not only are you incredibly stupid, you're also a total illiterate.
If you attack Israel pre-emptively that means that the Israeli submarine commanders will throw every nuke they have as retaliation; you're really that dumb . . .
SatchmoSings 5 days ago
@SatchmoSings - sounds like terrorism to me and we should not deal with terrorists. Their little toy submarines are as much as joke as the IDF and Mossad who are the equivalent to keystone cops. Their country was created with the use of terrorism and they are a bad apple for the region. A bad example that you can get what you want with terrorism. Look up the terrorist groups the Irgun and Stern gang.
catothewiser 4 days ago
@catothewiser So, first you deny Israel's power and then you admit to the power of Israeli terrorism; you sound pretty fucked up.
And yes, Israel did threaten to nuke the Arabs in the 1973 War, genius; that's why the Arabs haven't made a "general war" with Israel since as they did in 1948, 1956, 1967 and 1973 because they're afraid and that's no joke.
Go ahead and destroy Israel; if only two nukes from each sub get through, that's more than enough and everyone knows it.
SatchmoSings 4 days ago
@catothewiser Those subs are not toys; while they're not atomic powered, they are the most technically advanced diesel-electric submarines on earth, after all they're German-designed and built and we all know how much you respect Germany this way.
SatchmoSings 4 days ago
Most of the people commenting on this with all their hate towards orthodox Jews need to realize that it's just a request. Nobody is forcing visitors to do anything.
runnerman550 2 months ago
@janba32 That's a lie.
runnerman550 2 months ago
this is ORHODOX judaism. it snt bad to wanna b modest, but i mean extremism is TOO much
MakeTheVid61 2 months ago
Can someone please explain to me how all of these famalies and their religous government live on US tax payers money with their community subsidized by the federal and state governments and yet they do not have to abide equal rights laws?
YeshuaisShekinah 2 months ago 5
sad....
MultiBoiron 3 months ago
Also, anyone notice their accents? How isolated are these people, I wonder.
leopoldmarsh 3 months ago
@leopoldmarsh They mostly speak Yiddish in the town.
coffeefreak0 2 months ago
Thank G-d they are far away from you
breeeegs 1 week ago
Oh yay, a miniature theocracy in New York. How wonderful.
leopoldmarsh 3 months ago
THIS IS CRAP!!!! GET RID OF THAT STUPID SIGN THIS IS NOT FUCKING ISRAEL
MattiasAyd 4 months ago
@MattiasAyd Look you knee-jerk Jew hater, most Jews in Israel are quite secular and they too, find such signs crap.
SatchmoSings 3 months ago
they hate everyone who is not their kind. Saying they are not very nice is an under statement.
monseyhunt 5 months ago
@monseyhunt as you do.
breizhcatalonia1993 3 months ago
No religious groups should get government support AT ALL
MusicJew158 5 months ago
Actually fundamentalist jews, christians and muslims are VERY similar and in my view are against what America is all about. You guys should all love each other because you are all insane.
MusicJew158 5 months ago
@MusicJew158 All religious people put their beliefs ahead of The US Constitution; that's why they're religious freaks.
SatchmoSings 3 months ago
What is America all about? YOU are against the religious freedom America was designed to protect, and you are disgracing your fellow Jews by slandering those of us who live in accordance with Torah values
breeeegs 1 week ago
@breeeegs Yeah, Torah-values are just so cool; I guess you're angry that US secular law prohibits you from owning a slave or two.
SatchmoSings 1 week ago
Ughh religious nuts suck
MusicJew158 5 months ago
They shouldn't get government support
MusicJew158 5 months ago
They can request "modesty" all they want, but they can't enforce it. There's simply no way you can require people in a particular city to dress a certain way if they don't want to, unless that group owns the land, effectively making the entire village private property, somewhat akin to the compound where Warren Jeffs moved his FLDS flock in Texas when they left northern Arizona. If a non-member of their religion wants to dress the way they ask, fine, but otherwise, they gotta live with it.
tambocha 5 months ago
It is my belief that there should be another sign in Kiryas Joel, telling the residents that their village is part of a larger Republic and that they should respect the traditions of same.
SatchmoSings 6 months ago
This village was founded by one of my relatives, Szatmárnémeti jido, those who live in are a pathetic joke next to the vision on how this village should be.
Shame.....
nyamcz 6 months ago
I'm a Jew who abides by the modesty/dress standards [Tznius] and Kiryas Joel has a right... it can be offending to the men to see a scantily clad women or the women to see a scantily clad man.
challahbackgirl 6 months ago
@challahbackgirl Kiryas Joel is in a Republic, The United States of America; the courts have ruled, over-and-over, that is is Republicanist Standards that are to prevail in The United States of America, not ones that you just happen to "like."
SatchmoSings 6 months ago
So by your definition dressing modestly, not swearing and separating men from women in public in a village that encompasses a few miles is against Ameircan law?
breeeegs 1 week ago
@breeeegs First of all, you're making your point with absolute and total dishonesty because you're not really interested in an honest discussion, you just want to "win" the argument.
You're doing this by claiming that it's MY definition of US Law and not of US law ITSELF.
You're also confusing individual rights with those of civil rights and you deliberate jumble all this up as you have to make YOUR point which is ultimately totally pointless; fuck you, you lowlife.
SatchmoSings 1 week ago
I'm not dishonest, you're the one skirting around the issue. You still haven't answered my question of how these people are violating any part of US law
breeeegs 1 week ago
@breeeegs You are dishonest and I've already explained the "why" to you and I make it a point not to answer a question that contains all these jumbled up mess which you DELIBERATELY combined as you did to make your very own "point."
SatchmoSings 1 week ago
Civil rights ARE individual rights, if they don't ensure the right of people of any group to practice their religion in peace than what purpose could they possibly serve?
breeeegs 1 week ago
@breeeegs Ah, so now you're making an attempt, as feeble as it is, to be more specific because I've already made the point to you as I have, though ultimately you're still asking your question with, what you obviously think is, a foregone conclusion.
In a court of law, that is the law of THE UNITED STATES, as opposed to your stupid Halakhah, what you asked would be struck down in an instant.
I'm not discussing this crap on your totally idiotic terms; Try again, nimrod.
SatchmoSings 1 week ago
i suppose theyre happer than us, theyre surrounded with children, help each other, have enough belongings to survive without hunger and respect each other.
ZVEZDAjeZAKON 6 months ago
Kiryas Joel sounds like Curious George's orthodox cousin.
kelath5555 6 months ago
hehehe you stupid goyim must accept multicultualism, but us Jews get to keep our homogeneous towns. We own the media, the banks, dwell in the white house and you white gentile pigs fight in the middle east to secure Israel, while your shiksha wives are being fed our inter-racial propaganda through the media. We truly are the chosen people. We destroyed the german people with our Jewish invented communism and now dominate you stupid goyim throughout the globe. AHAHAHAHA STUPID GENTILE SCUM
JoanBeatrington001 6 months ago
A Welcome Sign should NOT come with restrictions.
ForShari 6 months ago 2
Whites need to do this since it is clearly legal. Run the non-Whites out of town because they are "suspicious."
catothewiser 6 months ago
I think we should all go to Curious George and run around in bikinis. Especially the fats.
whatawookie5000 6 months ago
Although I think that telling people to use "appropriate language" is over the the top, I do not think that asking people to dress modestly when they are coming into THEIR neighborhood is too offensive, after all body exposure - of those body parts we cover up in the winter- is for them like someone uncovering her private parts in public places,
So they have a right to live by their religion not having to be exposed to it in their OWN neighborhood!.
joebaum613 6 months ago
@joebaum613 Asking people to abide by whatever they want to ask others to abide by, is fine. As an American citizen. I freely belong to a religion and country that says I can say and dress however the fuck I want. This neighborhood is in my country and we have this thing called "FREEDOM". Look it up.
mrdysgo 6 months ago
@mrdysgo Its not like they're FORCING us to abide by these rules they are are just asking us to be considerate and sensitive to other peoples values and religion.
joebaum613 6 months ago
@mrdysgo Thank you for your plain-spoken Republicanism; spoken like a true American and as someone that believes in FREEDOM!!!
@joebaum613
SatchmoSings 6 months ago
@joebaum613 "Although I think that telling people to use "appropriate language" is over the the top, I do not think that asking people to dress modestly when they are coming into THEIR neighborhood is too offensive"
This is a town that LIVES off from welfare from the state.
It's not their town, they don't pay for it, the rest of country does.
They are supposedly the poorest town in the nation, because they're a bunch of tax cheats and welfare frauds. They're a gang of criminals.
fuzzywzhe 6 months ago
@fuzzywzhe it would make a great tourist destination with say a bus tour from NYC.
BrooklynNotQueens 6 months ago
@BrooklynNotQueens "it would make a great tourist destination with say a bus tour from NYC. "
I think it would be better to put 1/2 the town in jail for tax evasion and welfare fraud.
They are a horrific examples of the Jewish people. They are the stereotype of anti-Semites. They are liars, thieves, and morally bankrupt scumbags. I'm surprised more Jewish people aren't ashamed of such deplorable immoral behavior.
fuzzywzhe 6 months ago
@fuzzywzhe they aren't Jews they are antizionist satmar gentile hasids. feh.
BrooklynNotQueens 6 months ago
@BrooklynNotQueens "they aren't Jews they are antizionist satmar gentile hasids."
This is like Christians claiming that Hitler wasn't a Catholic, and Deacons didn't run run concentration camps.
You can't just say they aren't Jews because they are acting like scum. They are scum, and they are Jews.
Neturei Karta claims Zionists aren't Jews, because Lehi offered to work with Hitler, and sabotaged rescue efforts of world wide Jewry - but they were.
fuzzywzhe 6 months ago
@fuzzywzhe nah they really ain't Jews. the hasidic religion broke off from judaism less than 300 yrs ago.
the problem with people confusing hasids and jews comes down to having to learn about jewish history in some detail.
hasids believe in a form of witchcraft called "chassidut" and believe their guru rebbes have magical powers.
calling hasids jewish is more like calling mormons christian.
BrooklynNotQueens 5 months ago
@BrooklynNotQueens "nah they really ain't Jews. the hasidic religion broke off from judaism less than 300 yrs ago."
Protestantism is less than 500 years old - is that non Christian then?
"hasids believe in a form of witchcraft called "chassidut" and believe their guru rebbes have magical powers."
I can't find any reference to witchcraft anywhere in the definition of chassidut on the Internet, but I realy don't care anyhow. They are Jewish.
fuzzywzhe 5 months ago
@fuzzywzhe
well if this were school and you given this question to answer in a 3 page pape you would understand.
"in hasidism what is the mechanism that is believed to link masturbastion and the increase of evil in the world."
BrooklynNotQueens 5 months ago
@fuzzywzhe why the hatin'?
joebaum613 6 months ago
@fuzzywzhe You made a superb point; if the residents of Kiryas Joel lived as the Amish do, I could agree with joebaum613 but since they make it a point to get every bit of government largesse that they can, I say to hell with what that sign has to say.
@joebaum613
SatchmoSings 2 months ago
The entire town is a town of grifters.
Over 50% of the population is on foodstamps, and you pay for it.
fuzzywzhe 6 months ago
@fuzzywzhe Actually, look up the article on this town on "Wikipedia;" your numbers are actually low.
SatchmoSings 6 months ago
A small group of friends from New York City went to visit Kiryas Joel on foot. The village public safety officer almost immediately confronted us, demanded identification, and said he would arrest us if we did not comply. He did not arrest us, but he did call the New York State Police, who did arrest two of us. You can see videos of that by pasting these after youtube.com: /watch?v=k3nJ_6xy0-U or /watch?v=UOqBWIExvlk
JZwinck 6 months ago
"This is for people who don't know (what to do)". Would she be referring to the American taxpayers who pay for the welfare checks and food stamps in Kiryas Joel?
sophizzy 7 months ago
If these people had their way, they would send the entire planet back to the fucking stone age... damn animals.
TheDFanatic 7 months ago 2
You're the one living in the darkness
breeeegs 1 week ago
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You're the one living in the darkness
breeeegs 1 week ago
My skyperson >>> Your skyperson
BUSean 7 months ago 2
Spencer Tunick should totally flash mob this place
3DAndy76 7 months ago
in my country there is problem...
d6j6r6 7 months ago
While people were worrying about sharia law halacha came instead (Jewish law). No religion in this nation has the right to tell Americans to "maintain gender separation". Keep that crap in Saudi Arabia where it belongs.
bobbydimarzio 8 months ago 7
from when do we need the mind of the non-jewish people? so much discuss to them that someone don`t be like them with a complete schmutz "civilization"?
mitzvatO 9 months ago
jews are weird as fuck!
sonofthejaybirdwinds 10 months ago
You can ask people to dress modestly in a place of worship (e.g., synagogue, church, etc.), but to control what people wear out in town while they are running errands or visiting? That's just ridiculous. If I want to wear a tank top out in public on a hot summer day, I will do so. Living in a democratic country gives me that right..
rudabeh 11 months ago 2
I agree, the high percentage of welfare recipients doesn't look good. In fact, no population should have to suffer such poverty There is plenty of land; why not raise food for the community instead? I see on the town website showing many parking lots. Those are superfluous, and why pave over G-d's green earth when it can be used for food and nature's creatures instead? There is even a town bus system. Why the need for so many cars? Nu, it's a beautiful area, don't destroy with asphalt.
soycheezy 11 months ago
How many Amish are on social services? Cut the tax support for this special interest group!
stixin2000 1 year ago 17
There is no such thing as "Seperation of Church and State" in Kiryas joel! BOYCOTT KJ!!!
stixin2000 1 year ago
I wonder what the response would be if Muslims established a town and required all visitors to dress as they do.
This village receives federal funds for their schools, all of which are religious. What would most Americans say if Islamic or Christian schools also received funeral funds. No religious schools should get government money. But somehow if it is religious Jews there is a double standard.
Check out the Forward for this story.
Janba32 1 year ago 41
Christian schools don't recieve federal funds? There must be millions of Christian private schools all across America. The Amish live in insular communities and are still considered American, yet you don't seem to have any animosity towards them? It is the only idea of a Jewish community that bothers you, a Jewish community that values modesty and spiritual values instead of the materialism you immerse yourself in every day of your life
breeeegs 1 week ago
@breeeegs I do not believe that ANY religious schools of ANY denomination should receive federal funds. If parents want to send their kids to a religious school let them pay for it. Secular private schools do not get federal funds. Neither should religious schools.
As far as the outmoded rules of Kiryas Joel, I would like to remind you that you live in the US, not Israel or some country that requires "modest" dress, gender separation. You would do well in an Islamic country with the same rules.
Janba32 1 week ago
The rules of the Torah are not outmoded, they are eternal and they will still endure long after people like you have vanished
breeeegs 1 week ago
@breeeegs So do you believe in the part of Torah that says "Thank G-d I was not born a woman. Thank G-d I was not born a gentile>"
That is why Torah and the Bible are meaningless to me as is ALL relgion based on some sky spook and a Torah and Bible written not by some mysterious G-d but by rabbis and priests who needed to control their people and to have some explanation for how the world began. Relgion has been one of the curses visited on the world. You won't like this posting. I don't care.
Janba32 1 week ago 3
I am not angry at you. You are a holy Jew, I know you are Jewish and you have a holy neshama inside you. Thank G-d I was not born a woman, because women have to go through the pains of childbirth. It is not an insult to women at all. There aare prayers extolling the virtue and holiness of women like Aishes Chayil. The mysteries and wisdom of the Torah are infinite and eternal, every word of the Torah is pure and perfect. You put a hypen in G-d's name so I know you must believe in Him
breeeegs 1 week ago
@breeeegs I put a hyphen because that is what my grandfather did. My parents did not and I only put it there because I was writing to you. Otherwise I never use a hyphen. Furthermore I am not a believer in any god. It never made any sense to my parents nor to me nor to my children. BTW, childbirth was a wonderful experience giving me two terrific children. I stopped at 2. More is far too many in this over populated world where already there is not enough food or water for all.
Janba32 1 week ago
Only by having children can one make the world a better place. In the Torah it is clearly stated as a mitzvah to be fruitful and multiply to bring the light of Hashem's Torah and holiness into the world. Women praise G-d by saying "thank You for having made according to your will." Men and women thank G-d for the number of obligations that G-d gave them which is considered a holy privilege, not out of disrespect for the opposite gender.
breeeegs 1 week ago
@breeeegs When Torah was written it was necessry to populate the world. Nowi it is not necessary. There are already far too many people in the world. Birth control is a mitzvah & should be practiced by all who want to have a decent world for all. I do not believe that anyone but my husband and I made our children. Hashem, as you call him, had nothing to do with it. I also know that there are many women in the world who have children they can't feed or clothe. No mysterious being helps them.
Janba32 1 week ago
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@breeeegs When Torah was written it was necessry to populate the world. Nowi it is not necessary. There are already far too many people in the world. Birth control is a mitzvah & should be practiced by all who want to have a decent world for all. I do not believe that anyone but my husband and I made our children. Hashem, as you call him, had nothing to do with it. I also know that there are many women in the world who have children they can't feed or clothe. No mysterious being helps them.
Janba32 1 week ago
@breeeegs @breeeegs When Torah was written it was necessry to populate the world. Nowi it is not necessary. There are already too many people in the world. Birth control is a mitzvah & should be practiced by all who want to have a decent world. I do not believe that anyone but my husband and I made our children. Hashem, as you call him, had nothing to do with it. I also know that there are many women in the world who have children they can't feed or clothe. No mysterious being helps them.
Janba32 1 week ago
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@breeeegs When Torah was written it was necessry to populate the world. Nowi it is not necessary. There are already too many people in the world. Birth control is a mitzvah & should be practiced by all who want to have a decent world. I do not believe that anyone but my husband and I made our children. Hashem, as you call him, had nothing to do with it. I also know that there are many women in the world who have children they can't feed or clothe. No mysterious being helps them.
Janba32 1 week ago
So who gave you your children? Don't you think they are a blessing from Hashem? Who do you think creates all life? Every child and every life is a miracle from Hashem.
breeeegs 1 week ago
There certainly is enough food and water to accomodate everyone in the world, the problem is that people haven't learned to share it with each other, but we can
breeeegs 1 week ago
@breeeegs Yeah, Torah says a bat is a bird; Torah is perfect!
SatchmoSings 1 week ago
@breeeegs The rules of Torah are totally outmoded; the efficacy of Republicanism has been proven because, after all, where else could a community like Kiryas Joel exist in the first place!!!
SatchmoSings 1 week ago
How does the lifestyle of Kiryat Joel and its residents affect you in any way? American taxpayers were giving money to Jersey Shore, the epitome of gashmius and filth, but I didn't hear a single voice raised in protest. Yet when a small community of Jews, who have not violated a single American law, want to live Torah observant lives, liberal Jews like you start frothing at the mouth for a chance to tear them apart?
breeeegs 1 week ago
@breeeegs I am not dictating to anyone how they should live their lives. All I said was that you follow the laws of the land in which you live. The only reason the Jews of Kiryat Joel have a functioning society is because the American government is funding it! Seriously, take your head out of your ass and open your eyes. And I'm not a liberal Jew. I'm a Mizrachi Jew and we don't use such divisions where I come from.
rudabeh 1 week ago
How are they not following American law?
breeeegs 1 week ago
You are certainly dictating how they should live their lives, and if their way of life didn't bother you you wouldn't be commenting here. Judging from the comments here, which are surely more hateful than mine (i have already been called a moron and an idiot many times since i started commenting) I do agree that the Jews of Kiryat Yoel would be better off in Eretz Israel, since that is the land made for the Jews, and I believe we will all return there soon G-d willing
breeeegs 1 week ago
@breeeegs If you people take even one cent of US tax dollars to maintain your "way of life" this offends me. Do not ask for any tax dolllars for roads, for schools, for the electircial grid, for fire and police protection. Pay your own way in everything if you can.
Janba32 1 week ago
@breeeegs Again, you're trying to "win" your argument by dragging in things that are all totally unrelated.
The Amish GET NO GOVERNMENT LARGESSE; THEY DON'T TAKE FOOD STAMPS OR ANY OTHER FEDERAL, STATE and/or LOCAL WELFARE. The Amish don't pay into Social Security nor do they collect it; at least the Amish are HONEST this way.
SatchmoSings 1 week ago
Can I move to Israel and put up signs saying "don't dress in black hats and coats" in my community?? Why not? If I'm offended by the dress code there, why can't I do that?
bobbydimarzio 1 year ago 3
@bobbydimarzio u can do it, i dont have a problem with it....in addition to that, put "Clothing optional :) "
doglin82 1 year ago
democracy in action
Whiteplane 1 year ago
This community is the dump of Orange County. I will make it a point to be in only my underwear every time that I am in your smelly shthole.
kevincarsley 1 year ago
It's not just the leaders who want it that way. It's EVERYONE. That's the way they live.
andyandymax 1 year ago
@andyandymax Who cares what these mini-muslims want??? This is the United States and we don't live by sharia or halachic law, period. That's what Israel is for. Go live there. We don't force women to separate themselves from men in this country. YOU have to assimilate to OUR customs, not the other way around.
bobbydimarzio 1 year ago 2
@bobbydimarzio - Not comparable at all. The Muslims want to impose shariah law EVERYWHERE, and force everyone in the world to keep it. Those hasids just want to keep their own little haven. It doesn't threaten or endanger anyone else.
andyandymax 1 year ago
@andyandymax Yes, and now they want to impose halachic law on Americans. I say hell no. If they try this elsewhere, there will be hell to pay.
bobbydimarzio 1 year ago
@andyandymax
woah bro, wasn't aware you were a spokesman for muslims.
chaosbringer127 9 months ago
@chaosbringer127 - LOL! As if they need another spokesman! Don't you ever watch the news? You really doubt that many Muslims want to impose sharia law all over the world? Despite the fact that they are quite clear and open about wnating to do so?
andyandymax 9 months ago
@andyandymax
"They" lol. Putting words in a group of 2 billion people's mouths. Good job bro, I hear you have the authority to speak on behalf of 1/4th of the world.
chaosbringer127 9 months ago
@chaosbringer127 - Do you know only one tune?
andyandymax 9 months ago
@andyandymax
Funny how that applies exactly to you.
chaosbringer127 9 months ago
@chaosbringer127 - Oh, so you're a spokesman on my behalf now? (shrug)
andyandymax 9 months ago
@andyandymax
Not really. Just observing how you talk is enough for me.
I can judge 1 person based on his own actions. It makes logical sense.
You, however, are judging 2 billion people on the actions of what? A few thousand insane people?
Want me to judge all white people based on the serial killers that come out of their population? Judge all black people based on some of the murderers that come out of their people? Hispanics, asians, whatever.
Logical fallacies are great, arent they?
chaosbringer127 9 months ago
@chaosbringer127 - Now you vary your tune. Trying for legitimacy now? I also merely observe. Furthermore, I said MANY Muslims; i did not say all. I think you're a hypocrite.
andyandymax 9 months ago
@andyandymax
". The Muslims want to impose shariah law EVERYWHERE," This is what you said. You did not say "many" muslims. You said "the muslims" as if we were one entity.
Try again, hypocrite.
chaosbringer127 9 months ago
@chaosbringer127 - I wrote more than one post. And if you bothered to read them, you'd know that I said "many," though not in the one you're referring to. In any case, I don't believe you. I believe that most Muslims want sharia law everywhere. And you're not a spokesman for Muslims either.
andyandymax 9 months ago
@andyandymax Yes, they do, and apparently, so do Jewish people. Don't accept that from any religion.
bobbydimarzio 8 months ago
@bobbydimarzio - Are you saying that by American law everyone who comes here is required to abandon their religion and assimilate? I'm sorry, but there is no such law, and in fact that is AGAINST American law.
andyandymax 1 year ago
@andyandymax I'm saying they have no right to tell AMERICANS to assimiliate to their middle eastern ways. Don't like it? You have a whole country you can go to based on your middle eastern ways.
bobbydimarzio 1 year ago
@bobbydimarzio get your facts right and learn that the Jews are not mini muslims. SEcondly, no one is enforcing any laws on any americans here, but rather a small village of Jews erected a sign ASKING nicely that people entering to please respect their values by modest dress and behavior. Now ask yourself how you'd be reacting if the Amish of Kentucky erected such a sign upon entering their remote village. Of course everyone would think its interesting. This is just anti semitism.
familykazor 1 year ago
@familykazor Yes, they are minimuslims when they are telling women to cover up and be modest like muslims do. No difference. Now if these were muslims "asking" people to cover up would you be so nice about it? No, of course not. And if the Amish did this, I'd protest that, too. But they aren't. Kiryas Joel is.
bobbydimarzio 1 year ago
@bobbydimarzio - Unlike the Muslims, they created their own little town where they would not have to impose on other people. Again, Muslims have openly declared that they will impose and enforce their lifestyle on the entire world. These guys in Kiryat Joel have no such intention. It can in no way affect you or 99% or all Americans. That's not what this is about. You're just spitting out hatred.
andyandymax 1 year ago
@andyandymax THEY IMPOSE ON US WITH ALL THE TAXES THEY GET FROM US! GET REAL, ON WELFARE , FOOD STAMPS AND DEALING DIAMONDS. GIVE ME A BREAK! THEY HAVE MILLIONS TO BUY REAL ESTATE BUT NEED SOCIAL SERVICES. B.S. SO IT DOES AFFECT US. MAKE YOUR OWN LITTLE TOWN SOMEWHERE ELSE. THEY PAY LITTLE TAXES AND REEM THE BENEFITS. WAKE UP! CALL IT HATRED OR WHATEVER YOU WANT. IT'S A FACT AND THE TRUTH AND EVERYBODY KNOWS IT! BIGGEST FRAUD IN ORANGE COUNTY! DRIVE THROUGH, CHECK OUT THE NEW HOMES WE PAID FOR!
stixin2000 1 year ago
This has been flagged as spam show
@bobbydimarzio "YOU have to assimilate to OUR customs, not the other way around."
Two responses:
(1) These Hasidic Jews include many who were born in America. They are as American as anyone else.
(2) The original Americans were either Native Americans or Puritans. So how far do you want to take this demand for assimilation? Maybe we all have to dress in loincloths and live in the forests, or put scarlet letters on adulterers?
sevendust62 1 year ago
lordy lordy lordy
tshavyt 1 year ago