Penn Jillette on Capitalism, Magic and Morality

[Berelore]

why not show the video of the entire interview? podcast is only ~7min longer

[BatmanOneOhOne]

"The West Wing: Liberal Porn" - Penn Jillette

[DyeTyme]

I want more Bullshit episodes!!!

[SuperIllusiveman]

@DyeTyme Was the show canceled?

[thispoorguy]

@SuperIllusiveman I forgot exactly what Penn said, but I think they wanted to stop the show, but not cancel it forever, just take an extended break, but Showtime ended up canceling it because they went on to do the show "tell a lie" on discovery.

[SuperIllusiveman]

@thispoorguy Such terrible news. They had a good thing going on Showtime. Oh well, Bullshit had a good run. It will be missed.

[Pseudologic]

The biggest mistake of libertarians is that they assume that people are always rational.

[nechodimnaprednasky]

@Pseudologic no thats not assume, thats a fact...thats human itself...rational is part of your mind, not mine, or other mind only yours, so evertihning is rational...but irrational is violence from the state...the biggest mistake of fanatic socialist is their love to violence

[Pseudologic]

@nechodimnaprednasky You're not making sense, and no, people aren't always rational, if ever.

[Ichiboy900]

@Pseudologic I don't think people are rational, the only reason I identify as libertarian is because I don't want government promoting any one group's morality. I don't want government establishing a national religion, but I also I don't want government to tell me that I have to take care of someone that I've never met. I don't want my tax dollars to be divided evenly between a guy who can't get a job because he's a sex offender and a single mother.I should be able to choose how my money's spent

[Pseudologic]

@Ichiboy900 So you don't want the government taking away some Jack the Ripper's freedoms, by forcing its morality on him? And you do take care of someone you've never met, by paying taxes for police and fire department services. Humanity has established long ago that it's the most efficient way to do things, so that you can concentrate on whatever it is you do and not worry that your family gets burned/murdered. Think about it.

[Ichiboy900]

@Pseudologic I think there is a big misunderstanding that libertarians are anarchists. That's about the same as calling liberals communists. Obviously some government is need for infrastructure and a justice system, but I prefer less rather than more. I'm even a minority in libertarians in that I think an education system is needed. But as for something like welfare, someone who works hard for their money and someone who just lives off of the government shouldn't get equal treatment.

[Pseudologic]

@Ichiboy900 You can't apply one standard to social security and another to education or police. If anything, it tells me that you don't see the benefits of social security, only the costs, which is wrong. You might want to study what how social programs helped educate generations of poor people with no access to education and how that subsequently turned sick monarchies into what we call now the "Western World".

[Ichiboy900]

@Pseudologic That makes no sense. By your logic that means the only two options would be anarchy or totalitarianism. Some gov't programs are needed, some aren't, that's what politics is about. Social Security was created when people died much younger, the gov't didn't expect to pay people living until 80. Thus we're stuck in a system where the gov't either pays out money it doesn't have or keeps money from the elderly. All because it was started by irrational people running the government.

[Pseudologic]

@Ichiboy900 Sure it makes sense, when you deal with stupid concepts like "government is bad". Who decides, which programs are needed and aren't? You? And I presume you have the omnipotent knowledge that leads to maximization of utility for the society? Social security was started by people, who thought that poor old people dying in the streets isn't good for economy or any society that wishes to call itself civil. And yes, there are plenty of money to go around, if the few don't own most.

[Ichiboy900]

@Pseudologic I don't know what's best for all people, but neither does the government. I don't think "The Government is Bad", but too much of it could be. Just curious, are you for gay marriage or legalization of marijuana? The government seems to think that society would collapse if two men married each other. Do you agree with that?

[Pseudologic]

@Ichiboy900 The government is made of people, selected through democratic process. To doubt the government is to doubt the system. Gay marriage and legalization aren't harmful to society, but removing safety net and allowing great wealth concentration is. You've made your case, you just haven't given me a good enough reasoning of why it's good to have a lot of desperate poor people, who can't afford a doctor and education in the society.

[Ichiboy900]

@Pseudologic I wasn't trying to convince you, this the internet and in the history of the internet no has ever convinced anyone of anything. I was just showing you an example of a libertarian that doesn't think people are rational.

[AGeekWithAShotgun]

@Pseudologic

"The government is made of people, selected through democratic process"

There is nothing "Democratic" about how Bush and JFK were elected. Bush had the Florida vote rigged and JFK's father bought him his presidency.

"you just haven't given me a good enough reasoning of why it's good to have a lot of desperate poor people"

Maybe because to have Federal intervention would inevitably lead to societal collapse?

You're a government-sympathizing nanny-statist.

[AGeekWithAShotgun]

@Pseudologic

"To doubt the government is to doubt the system"

The system is corrupt and benefits the aristocracy known as the greedy politicians who use the corporate market to their advantage to scam the People and the business owners, ergo the government is corrupt as well.

"who can't afford a doctor and education in the society."

Life isn't fair and it ought not be. I'm not trying to be a condescending asshole, but forcing altruism down other's throats is bullshit.

[666or999]

@Pseudologic I'm a libertarian and i don't believe this. I think you are misunderstanding what people mean when they talk about people doing x in a free market system because it's more rational. We're not saying that everybody will 100% of the time do that thing just that someone who doesn't do what is more rational choice most of the time isn't that likely to be succesful and so it's more likely that in a situation that a successful person would pick the more rational choice.

[Pseudologic]

@666or999 Yes, of course, I'm the one, who got it wrong.

[ihavebeenawakened]

3rd Amendment trick would be easy. Have the box like the one the lady disappears in as a house front door. "Imagine your house, with your privacy and personal space, and just enough food for your family, and a few unwelcome guests drop in". Then the box keeps producing British soldiers who fill up the stage, eating, talking, rifling through papers, ect......

[wootuser]

@SuperSkepticman

Looks like I hit a nerve, you socially awkward idiot.

Am I telling you what's right and wrong? No.

Is Penn? Yes.

Most Atheist are like Penn and you.

They love to preach but don't believe others should.

[LogicalFlawDetector]

CATO = real libertarians

[DefinitlyStrange]

@LogicalFlawDetector Hah! MISES.ORG = real libertarians

[MandragGanon]

Penn's a really smart guy.

[FartyFace]

lol Garth Brooks rule

[TheLukeSchiltz]

@MrAdamFontana That's what the "X" button is for...

[wootuser]

It's a sad day when this fat fuck piece of crap, self absorbed moron is looked on with admiration by some very young goofball, socially awkward idiots.

And then he talks about Morality. Just fucking sweet Penn, an atheist who supposedly doesn't like o preach morality to others, preaching what he think is moral. Can you say arrogant? Yes Penn, join the clan it's not beneath you. Whatever pays the bills right? And string along those morons who admire you.

[BriscoCountyJr23]

File your Claim of Right and you can do that bullet catch trick anywhere in the USA, in Canada as well. We are not members of the Law Society and therefore are not subject to their incomprehensible statues.

[GOPsithlord]

Penn remains an absolute stand up guy and I really like the classy and eloquent philosophy on what makes him and Garth Brooks secular entertainers. Well said.

[0HippyHunter0]

that man can do nothing wrong.

[CalebMTurberville]

When he talks about The Star-Spangled Banner, I don't get what Penn means when he says "the one verse that doesn't mention God." Where is God mentioned in the first verse, for instance?

[conductus]

@CalebMTurberville Penn is referring to the 2nd verse. Perhaps he meant one of the "other" verses that doesn't mention "God." The 4th verse plainly does.  The 3rd verse gives some vague references to the "gloom of the grave." Perhaps that's what he meant. On another note, the 2nd verse includes the two words I love most in the "Star Spangled Banner." They are, "haughty host." We just don't write like that anymore.

[CalebMTurberville]

@conductus Oh, well. I think Penn should explain that a little better. But anyways, I like the video and I found the story of Penn's conversion to libertarianism to be interesting and somewhat similar to mine.

[safewaysecurity]

Did he just say Lawrence O'Donnel is one of his best friends?? Wha???

[MEPBlue1]

@safewaysecurity Some of my closest friends are liberals. We just disagree on many issues.

[safewaysecurity]

@MEPBlue1 I can't imagine O'Donnel being friends with someone who believes in freedom though. Have you seen his comments on the second amendment? O'Donnel is about as anti-gun as they come.

[betty4gators]

not a fan of the Cato Institute.

[Atreus21]

To Penn's point at 4:10. I agree to an extent, but more important than awakening your opponent to suspected condescension is the possibility of invoking his ego. Once you've insulted your opponents (or allow him to think you've insulted him), that puts up just as strong a wall.

[luke55664]

@Atreus21 That's probably why MSNBC has poor ratings comparatively.

[TrueEmergence]

Oh cool

Penn but not on pen says

[MoneyIsSilver]

CATO = Fake Libertarians

[rockhuddy]

@MoneyIsSilver It's true, Cato = fake libertarians, but let's at least give them partial credit for heading in the right direction. Maybe once they graduate to Rothbard they'll make it the rest of the way.

[bigboss686]

@rockhuddy how pitiful it must be for you to think that every libertarian has to endorse 9/11 conspiracy theories or write despicable isolationism.

It is a great piece of mind to know that idiots like you will never be the majority

[Iammram]

@bigboss686

Which Libertarian organizations endorse that?

What isolationism?

[rockhuddy]

@bigboss686 My main critique of "fake" libertarians is that they do not apply their so called principles across the board. So redistribution of wealth is bad, unless it's foreign aid, or social security, etc. The other major critique is that they have the monetary issue wrong. Many endorse the central bank, and in general want to tinker with existing programs rather than remove them entirely.

[bigboss686]

@rockhuddy it amazes me the purity testing you libertarian types do, under your insane directives about 3% of the population may qualify, if not less. It's like libertarianism is a non-ending exercise of no true Scotsman LOL

To call yourself something you only have to agree with most of the philosophical points, you don't have to agree with all of them.

[bollesleik]

@MrAdamFontana

Then press one button to remove them.

[dirksilver]

lawrence o'donnell is a huge tool

[inspectorchao2]

Why does Caleb refuse to show his face?

[leastsquares]

@inspectorchao2 Caleb was horribly disfigured in a podcasting accident.

[vxbinaca]

@MrAdamFontana Turn off annotations.

[MrHamncheez]

@MrAdamFontana click on the "hide annotations" button and they will go away.

[tugger]

Penn and Teller are fucking awesome!