The Watchtower DEBUNKED! The title "Son of God" implies equality with God

[dunklaw]

(Galatians 3:26) 26 YOU are all, in fact, sons of God through YOUR faith in Christ Jesus.

[Blogrich55]

@dunklaw " YOU are all, in fact, sons of God through YOUR faith in Christ Jesus"

But we are NOT Son of God in the same sense that Jesus Christ was. We are NOT monogenes. You are missing the point of the video. God bless.

[dunklaw]

@Blogrich55 You are completely ignoring the already existent Jewish context and usage of the term "son of god".

[Blogrich55]

@dunklaw "You are completely ignoring the already existent Jewish context and usage of the term "son of god" "

And YOU are completely ignoring John's use of the term monogenes. The term only begotten Son of God has a different meaning than just the terms son and of God combined. A starfish is NOT a star and neither is it a fish. Just because Christians are sons of God by adoption does NOT mean they are Sons of God in the same sense Christ was.

How do you answer the video's argument?

[dunklaw]

@Blogrich55 I can go into more detail if you want - but first I suggest you examine the text's of the early church fathers to see the contrast between the two terms "begotten" & "Unbegotten" and how they are used.

Also (Job 38:7) When the morning stars joyfully cried out together, And all the sons of God began shouting in applause?

Are these adopted?

[dunklaw]

@Blogrich55 (Psalm 89:6) 6 For who in the skies can be compared to Jehovah? Who can resemble Jehovah among the sons of God?

Are these adopted?

[dunklaw]

They called him "son of god", he called himself "son of man".

(Isaiah 63:16) For you are our Father; although Abraham himself may not have known us and Israel himself may not recognize us, you, O Jehovah, are our Father.

[thelambsservant777]

you have changed my question, thats okay, I understand, Jesus was tempted and Jesus reffers to the whole person. Thank you for your time..

[thelambsservant777]

Also Blogrich55 I meant no offense to you nor was I trying to misrepresent you, my first question was based upon the title of the video here itself. I do not think that gives you cause to respond the way you did. Yes, Jesus in the uniquely generated son of the Living God. I am not denying this, However you cannot answer my second question without changing what the Scripture specifically says, Jesus reffers to the whole person, you cannot pick and chose one min. is X and next non X.

[Blogrich55]

@thelambsservant777 "However you cannot answer my second question without changing what the Scripture specifically says"

Not sure what you are trying to say. Could you be more specific?

[TheGenuineChristian]

You can play this game of your with the less familiar individuals, what I want you to do is man up and take the challenge: /watch?v=PkrKOrxRENg

[Blogrich55]

@TheGenuineChristian Yuri please do NOT put links in your comments. If you want me to watch a video SEND it to me in a PM. That is simple enough. I will be more than glad to watch it. As for manning up YOU need to answer the collective biblical witness of John 19:7, John 10:33 and Matthew 26:65 John 5:18 is only the tip of the iceberg! The Jews knew He claimed to be the Son of God which implied equality with God to them The Bible is a Jewish Book Jesus NEVER corrected them!

[thelambsservant777]

@Blogrich55 are you suggesting to us that "son of God" was not used in the OT? Or that other men did not claim YHWH as their own Father in the OT? James D. G. Dunn. in his book Christology in the making, refutes these and scores of refferences simularly used and has never been rebutted, people run from him because he proves the correct understanding Biblically. Even among your own scholars, Trinitarian, do not agree on many things you presented of this topic, rarely.

[Blogrich55]

@thelambsservant777 "are you suggesting to us that "son of God" was not used in the OT?"

Did I ever say this? NO! Look at David! He was called God's son. Many of the messianic Psalms were first written about David and prophetically applied to Jesus. Israel is correctly called God's Son.

THAT said, however, does NOT mean we are the sons of God by nature as was Christ. We are NOT monogenes. We are sons by adoption, spiritually begotten by the Holy Spirit. No one fears Dunn :)

[thelambsservant777]

@Blogrich55 I was simply asking a question. That is all. The actual arguement is not if Jesus is the unique son of God, that's a straw man. That said, can the Fathers nature be tempted to sin? Can the Fathers nature grow in knowledge and favor with Himself? This flip flop from divine Nature to human Nature kind of stuff would have to add to the Scripture and go way beyond such when it says Jesus was tempted....

[Blogrich55]

@thelambsservant777 "can the Fathers nature be tempted to sin?"

Of course NOT! No Trinitarian believes Jesus was the Father incarnate. This is the heretical position of the Jesus Only or Apostolic Pentecostals.

There is NO flip flop. I will go you one step further about Jesus. There are two phrases often used of Him in regard to sin:

1. It was possible for Him not to sin.

2. It was not possible for Him to sin.

The second is the correct biblical position. Again Phil 2:5-11

[WCOFTheology]

Amen, brother, great video! But I must ask you, do you have any milk? I'm hungry, and you have plenty of nuts and flakes in this comment section to spare a little! LOL

[Blogrich55]

@WCOFTheology No milk at this time, brother, but I am sure an old heifer or two might show up and talk smack :) God bless!

[TheGenuineChristian]

I see you totally ignored what Jesus said about them wanting to murder him in John 7-8. But hey, you being a Trinitarian it wouldn't help you case, it would just expose your bias. The real reason that they probably put him to death is due to what he did in the Temple as historians say.

[Blogrich55]

@TheGenuineChristian "The real reason that they probably put him to death is due to what he did in the Temple as historians say."

Who CARES what historian say? The Jews said it themselves in John 10:33 "For a good work we do not stone You, but for BLASHPEMY, and because You, being a Man, make Yourself GOD." get it? Got it? Good!

Try dealing with the various texts for a change and quit showing your obvious heretical bias (^_^)

[TheGenuineChristian]

@Blogrich55 And Jesus rejected their accusation. But hey, I don't expect you to agree with Jesus, for we know what side you're truly on.

[Blogrich55]

@TheGenuineChristian "And Jesus rejected their accusation."

WHERE? Chapter and verse please! This video REFUTES your lame claim Yuri!

[TheGenuineChristian]

@Blogrich55

Rich, you wish. I don't want to give anything anyway. I will be covering all accusation verses in a near future video. It's quite a shame that you Trinitarians stoop down so low as to agree with sons of the Devil, perhaps you do it because they're your brothers.

[Blogrich55]

@TheGenuineChristian "It's quite a shame that you Trinitarians stoop down so low as to agree with sons of the Devil"

It is really quite a shame that YOU and your cohorts frail to acknowledge that the Bible is a Jewish book written from the Jewish perspective. I have had enough of the simplistic Watchtower nonsense about how John 5:18 merely shows the "Jew's opinion." This was NOT just the opinion of the sons of the devil. It was the Jewish mentality who saw it that way!

[TheGenuineChristian]

@Blogrich55 I don't argue that it was a "Jew's opinion." You, on the other hand, agree with the sons of the Satan, who was always the accuser. It's not small wonder that you agree with them, because you are them.

[TheGenuineChristian]

Looks like you watched my video on John 5:18. Anyways, you got to consider John 11 where Martha has no problem in calling him the 'Son of God' and yet believes he's not God. Another great passage is Matthew 27:43.

Jesus is only equal to God in works as I already have demonstrated in my John 5:18 video /watch?v=gMBarQ4B6LY

[Blogrich55]

@TheGenuineChristian Your video proved nothing! He claimed God was His Father and THEY took that to mean He was claiming equality with God. Why didn't Jesus bother to correct them? Did He go to the cross because of a misunderstanding? Did the Great Teacher Yeshua FAIL to communicate? Your video merely clouds the issue. See John 19:7, John 10:33 and

Matt 26:65 The Jewish leaders understood Him perfectly. Too bad you anti-Trinitarians fail to get the message from the Bible.

[October31st1517]

Amen Mi hermano. You hit the nail on the head!!!!

[Blogrich55]

@October31st1517

Gracias hermano:) God bless you! How have you been?

[October31st1517]

@Blogrich55 Very well. Hope you;re the same.

[OnlyTheScriptures]

Daniel 7:13 is the passage Caiaphas understood when Jesus was asked if he was the SON OF GOD..not God..they did not ask if Jesus was God but are you the Son of God..They understood it was the vision of the Messiah approaching the ancient of days in Daniel 7:13

[Blogrich55]

@OnlyTheScriptures "they did not ask if Jesus was God but are you the Son of God"

You have FAILED to deal with the argument presented and the subject matter of the video. The Jewish mind understood that to imply equality with God. They killed Jesus for blasphemy.

If Jesus was NOT claiming equality with God and they were WRONG on that score, WHY did He fail to correct them? Was the Great Teacher unable to make Himself understood? Did Christ die for a misunderstanding?

[OnlyTheScriptures]

@Blogrich55 Jesus claimed to be the Son of God...and for this reason they killed him..Mat 26:63 But Jesus held his peace. And the high priest answered and said unto him, I adjure thee by the living God, that thou tell us whether thou be[ the Christ,] the Son of God. They understood Jesus was claiming to be just that.the Messiah..not God

[Blogrich55]

@OnlyTheScriptures "They understood Jesus was claiming to be just that.the Messiah..not God"

Oh really? Since when is claiming to be the Messiah considered blasphemy?

[OnlyTheScriptures]

@Blogrich55 Daniel 7:13..they understood Jesus was the blessed one ..approaching the throne of the Ancient of days in the verse..notice a human being approaching God..

[Blogrich55]

@OnlyTheScriptures "They understood..."

They understood that this claim IMPLIED equality with God. THAT is why the high priest tore his robes. ONLY YHWH would come in clouds of Judgment.

See Isaiah 19:1 for example and consider Matt 26:64 and Rev 1:7 He was coming in clouds of judgment and only YHWH would give unto every man according to his ways (Jeremiah 17:10) see Rev 2:23 as well.

[msm1876]

@OnlyTheScriptures >>>did not ask if Jesus was God but are you the Son of God..

Based on their understanding of what it meant for Jesus to say he was God's Son in Jn 5:18...what did their question in Mark 14 mean? And how was it answered?

[OnlyTheScriptures]

I am a son of God

[Blogrich55]

@OnlyTheScriptures "I am a son of God"

You are NOT The Only Begotten Son of God by nature. You are NOT the monogenes. You, if born again, are a son of God by adoption. BIG difference. See our video.

[OnlyTheScriptures]

@Blogrich55 Proud to be adopted and be a joint heir with my brother Christ...we both have the same God..and I have been born again and a son of God :)

[Blogrich55]

@OnlyTheScriptures ".and I have been born again and a son of God"

I truly hope and pray you are. But IF you are, God, the Holy Spirit, will certainly have to straighten out your heretical notions.

[OnlyTheScriptures]

@Blogrich55 the only heretical notion is believing God became a man or that Jesus claimed to be God..

[Blogrich55]

@OnlyTheScriptures See Phil 2:5-11 and John 1:1-18 oh and Titus 2:13

[OnlyTheScriptures]

@Blogrich55 neither of those verses offer what you been programmed to believe..Paul did not think Jesus was God..

[gibsonjammer1]

@OnlyTheScriptures

John chapter 1 would tend to disagree with your statement. Jesus is the word, Jesus is God, Jesus became flesh

[Blogrich55]

@gibsonjammer1 Amen! God bless!

[OnlyTheScriptures]

@gibsonjammer1 Jesus is what the word BECAME..the definition of logos does not = son..John did not say in the beginning was the son and the son was with God and the son was God..sorry..stick to shredding :)

[gibsonjammer1]

@OnlyTheScriptures

ok what about the verse 3 that says all things were created by him. Before you say that is speaking of the father, look at what is being talked about. There is a distiction between the father and the logos but the logos is the creator. John is talking about Jesus. And yes I will do a little shredding, ;) by the way are you a JW?

[OnlyTheScriptures]

@gibsonjammer1 did u know there are 8 English translations PRIOR to the KJV that translated verse 3 as IT rather than HIM..{all things made by IT}that is the spoken logos of God.What God SPOKE came to be..Logos is defined as plan,blueprint,thought that God had in his mind.Revelation 13:8 tells us this..the lamb was slain when? God had this planned.His word was Christ being made and becoming his unique human Messiah.No I am not a JW though I agree that YHWH is only God,not Jesus

[Blogrich55]

@OnlyTheScriptures "..Logos is defined as plan,blueprint,thought that God had in his mind"

The Logos DID refer to Jesus.Now HOW do you explain John 17:5 where Jesus claims He had glory WITH the Father "before ever the world was"? He shared the glory with the Father. It is hard to share things with ideas and plans.

[anissueofursincerity]

Israel was the son of God.