Saiga 12 - Tromix Conversion SBS Review

[danbowski40]

Do you send your saiga to tromix and they convert it? or do you by the conversion kit and do it yourself?

[TangoDownProduction]

@danbowski40 You have to send the Saiga off to Tromix for them to do the conversion. It will be quite the wait, but well worth it.

[danbowski40]

@TangoDownProduction Great, can you tell me more or less what I'm looking at price wise to get it looking like yours in the video? I appreciate the response brother. Long live the Republic. - Dan

[TangoDownProduction]

@danbowski40 It's not cheap...that's for sure. If memory serves me correctly, the cost to Tromix plus the $200 tax stamp to Uncle Sam's BATFE for the short-barrel came to a total of $1,700. Keep in mind, that doesn't include the initial purchase of the Saiga-12. Take care of yourself Dan & best wishes. Glad I could be of help.

[howyoudoinralph]

How do they get away with a 10inch barrel?

[TangoDownProduction]

@howyoudoinralph It is classified as a Short-Barrel Shotgun. It is registered with the ATF through a series of paperwork and a background check. You have to jump through more hoops to own this than a standard firearm. In the state of Colorado, we as citizens are allowed to purchase legally owned class 3 firearms (full-auto) and accessories (suppressors).

[howyoudoinralph]

@TangoDownProduction Wow, That's what I was afraid of....Any tips on how to get started with the paperwork? Also what kind of background checks do they do? i.e. domestic stuff or violent stuff like that? And will I have to have a face to face meeting with the ATF? Thanks so much!

[TangoDownProduction]

@howyoudoinralph You can go to the BATFE website and download the forms from there that you will need. If my memory serves me correctly, you will need a Form 1 & a Form 4. Also, you will need either a Sheriff to sign off on your Form 4, or get a "trust" to assign the firearm to. You will have to send off a fingerprint card along with all paperwork. As far as what they look for on the background, I'm not sure. No face-to-face meeting is required.

[howyoudoinralph]

@TangoDownProduction Sir, Once again I thank you. I live in South Florida and I thought we had a liberal Gun law system down here. Hell no they wont let us own class 3 Weapons without the special ATF clearance. However, you can get a carry permit after a 4 hour Deadly force class and fingerprint card but no way fully auto. That's awesome. Go Colorado!! Thanks again...

[howyoudoinralph]

Jesus H Christ its with out a doubt the Best looking Saiga I have ever seen! WOW! Just subscribed!

[TangoDownProduction]

@howyoudoinralph LMAO, thank you very much. 

[TheJackOfAllTradez1]

How would anyone feel about me buying the 16.25" barrel Saiga from Tromix as a personal defense weapon? I just hear all the time a standard 12 ga pump is the best for homes and stuff. I don't know, I feel like this would be better for home defense...

[TangoDownProduction]

@TheJackOfAllTradez1 I think the Saiga would make an excellent home defense shotgun. I tell people all the time, if you can grip the firearm properly, manage the recoil of the chosen caliber, consistently hit what your aiming at, and know how to operate it under stress - then it's a good fit for you. I like the Remington 870 for home defense simple because it won't break the bank, you can get it in 20 or 12 gauge and you can find accessories for it at a reasonable cost.

[gojoe36]

I would like to see you shoot it...20 round clip. What was the total price on all the upgrades? Looks great and that trigger seems very good

[TangoDownProduction]

@gojoe36 I hear you, I would love to get to the range with this bad boy. The 20-Round MD Arms drum requires a bit of fitting before it will work properly. This is common with Tromix conversions. The entire cost of this conversion: $2,400. That includes the initial purchase of the basic Saiga 12, Tromix conversion, and tax stamp for the short-barrel. Not cheap, but damn is it sexy.

[jamaicanjjason]

Looking forward to seeing a vid of it at the range

[svt4life]

I WISH I COULD HAVE ONE IN CA

[TangoDownProduction]

@svt4life Yeah, I hear you. You are going to have to move out of Commifornia if you want to own anything cool (legally).

[MelsEpicWheelTime]

I hate ignorant gun nuts like you. JK LOL i'm just so jealous.... One day i'll have an SBS... one day...

[TangoDownProduction]

@MelsEpicWheelTime LOL, thank you. I hope to get some range time with this bad boy soon. Right now all I have are shells for my 20-gauge tactical. :-)

[rqm420]

does the stock fold with your drum mag in the rifle?

[TangoDownProduction]

@rqm420 Yes, it works fine. Thanks!

[TitanTony407]

weapon "system" includes the shooter lol ....weapon + proficiency = weapon system

[class3hotbox]

do you have to have a class 3 liscence or can you have a class 2 and buy the tax stamp?

[TangoDownProduction]

@class3hotbox In reference to the short-barrel, all you need to do is pay the tax stamp ($200) and complete the appropriate ATF paperwork. You will also have to assign the firearm to a trust or business (i.e. Inc., LLC). Assigning it to the business circumvents going through your local sheriff having to sign off on the ATF form-4. If you are wondering about class 3 (full-auto), this weapon is semi-auto. Class 3 has to be manufactured prior to 1986 for a civilian to purchase it. Take care!

[class3hotbox]

@TangoDownProduction well about class 3 i though that sbr's short barreled rifles were class3 or at least in my state does that mean this wouldnt be considered an sbr?

[TangoDownProduction]

@class3hotbox This system is registered with the BATFE as a short-barrel shotgun. It is considered a restricted item under the NFA guidelines. So, yes you need a tax stamp on an sbr/sbs. Some people simply classify all NFA items as Class 3, so I was confused as to what you were referring to. I wasn't sure if you were referring to this shotgun as a full-auto or just simply being short-barrel. My apologies for the confusion. All the NFA stuff is mind boggling.

[class3hotbox]

@TangoDownProduction oh allright because at least here they didnt make the nfa guidlines clear on sbs/sbr thanks

[2jzgteSupraJZA80]

@TangoDownProduction is it possible we can see this in action?

[TangoDownProduction]

@2jzgteSupraJZA80 I think we can manage something like that. I have been very busy with work & family, but as soon as I can get a nice day at the range, I hope to bring this along for the ride.

[joedaddy1227]

Need more light in your shop.

[RumoreTony]

The top cover has been welded up to keep it tight on the receiver. The AR stock adapter is an ACE unit, distributed by J&T. The gun has the optional SRTrigger installed.

Tony Rumore

Tromix

[TangoDownProduction]

@RumoreTony Thank you Tony! and a special thanks to Tromix for the outstanding workmanship on this Saiga-12. Take care & best wishes.

[iggyvb]

optic is not neccesary

[TangoDownProduction]

@iggyvb I agree. But is sure is handy when shooting slugs and in low-light situations.

[Anathoth]

Also.. what type/brand of adapter was used to mount the ctr stock? Overall, very nice build.

[TangoDownProduction]

@Anathoth To be perfectly honest with you...I am not sure. It was installed at the Tromix factory prior to receiving it. It came back with just the receiver extention tube and the stock of choice was then added. It may be possible that is a Tromix product? Sorry I couldn't be more specific. Thank you.

[Anathoth]

Is this with the SRTrigger option, or the standard Tromix trigger? It would be interesting to see if any eventual loss of zero develops on the optic being the top rail has to be mounted on the dustcover

[jamaicanjjason]

Nice review. Do you have trouble reaching around and grasping the vertical fore grip when the 20 re md arms drum is inserted?

[TangoDownProduction]

@jamaicanjjason Not to bad really, it sits low enough and doesn't seem to really get in the way. A good friend of mine who is a police officer attending SWAT school right now will hopefully get to the range with me and get some trigger time with the Saiga.

[MightyBaconSammich]

'kay.

[RumoreTony]

The tri-rail hand guard was made by Kross Firearms, but they have recently gone out of business. Mississippi Auto Arms now has their tri-rail forend available to fit the Tromix S-17 and it is very similar to the old Kross unit.

Tony Rumore

Tromix

[TangoDownProduction]

@RumoreTony Thank you for the information Tony!

[whoopdeedoodee]

so did they officially ban import of these guns yet?

[TangoDownProduction]

@whoopdeedoodee No...but it looks like it is probably going to happen. Unfortunately.

[whoopdeedoodee]

@TangoDownProduction so what will that mean for people who already own the saigas?

[TangoDownProduction]

@whoopdeedoodee For the people who all ready own Saigas will be "Grandfathered" in and not be affected by the law. Basically like all the other magazine fed shotguns (i.e. the Striker) once you own it you will be good to go. I thought about buying one and just holding onto it until all the crap blows over and if they do get banned, sell it for a nice penny then buy something else.

[williamfann]

I really like the saiga 12 design, but there is one issue. On your tromix does the safty still scratch the side of the gun?

[TangoDownProduction]

@williamfann I really haven't had enough range-time with this particular firearm. As soon as the weather gets better, I hope to get together with my friend Pete and get some quality range time with the Siaga. As far as what firing the weapon has done, I didn't notice any unusual safety wear on the receiver. I will keep you posted if I notice any significant wear on it! Thank you for the post!

[313rossini]

NICE!

[wesdeclement]

if you dont mind me asking how much did you pay for the conversion i am really wanting everything you got there without the sbr and did they overhaul your gas system

[TangoDownProduction]

@wesdeclement This system cost $2,700 total with the tax stamp (cost of the initial purchase included). So you can deduct $200 for that. I think just the conversion itself ran around $1,200. When Tromix did the conversion, they basically overhauled the entire weapon. The gas system, fire control group, receiver, etc...is all re-worked by Tromix. Hope this helps.

[twm3006]

very nice saiga 12. i picked up my tromix s17 about a month ago. got a really good deal on it from a class three dealer needed money, has all the upgrades that he offers. the flash from a 8 inch barrel with buckshot is pretty intense. that trigger job is does is pretty sweet too. just the look you get at the range when people see and hear it is worth having one. very happy with it.

[TangoDownProduction]

@twm3006 Thank you very much. I am glad you are happy with your Saiga 12. They are one bad-ass shotgun.

[datamaggot]

Excellent review, thanks for sharing your detailed thought on the weapon.

Some questions:

1.) For a 10" barrel, doesn't Tromix offer longer handguards?

2.) Do you think you can fit a Magpul AFG on the lower rail? (they're long)

3.) How is the muzzle flash at night with the breacher brake?

4.) would the Galil charging handle interfere with your T1 style optic?

[TangoDownProduction]

@datamaggot Thank you for your inquiry! The handguard is actually not from Tromix. I am not sure of the manufacturer, but it is after-market. The Magpul AFG will not fit "flush" on this hand-guard, it is a bit too long. The muzzle flash is pretty intense at night with this little shotgun. I don't believe Galil-style charging handle would interfere with this optic. There is a bit of room for play there. Thanks again!

[9MillWill1]

FUCK Rantinandravin! Very nice  gun... sub

[TangoDownProduction]

@9MillWill1 Thank you very much 9millWill1. I appreciate it. Yeah...as for Mr. "Rantinandravin", I don't tolerate people like him and in fact don't condone people like him being allowed to even look at firearms let alone own one. People like him are careless, reckless and dangerous to society. Take care!

[madmax4x4]

nice video, nice gun!

[madmax4x4]

@RantinAndRavin

your a tool.

[BrokenTengu99]

DAMN that shit is HOT !

[BrokenTengu99]

SCOTT !!! Good to see ya again, buddy ! Finally ! Dude ...quit jaggin' off with MY shotgun ! I want it back NOW !!!

...don't make me come over there ...

[TangoDownProduction]

@RantinAndRavin Congratulations!  You've been blocked. Disrespectful and childish name-calling shows me your education level along with your maturity...or lack thereof. As MY channel states, I do NOT tolerate this behavior. Have a great day.

[Sharkman3472]

Dude! that is a sexy shotgun!

[grimgreg1]

Holy. Shit. Me.Want.Now.

lol, she's a real beauty! One thing to mention though, when viewing the stock portion of the gun, along with the rear sight, it was pretty dark, so maybe keep the gun closer to that light behind you? But overall, amazing vid. Thanks a ton, now I'm gonna try to order one!

[TangoDownProduction]

@grimgreg1 Thank you for the feedback. This is the first official video from my new "man cave" so I am playing with the lighting. Thank you for the feedback and yes...this Saiga is a real peach.

[krazy45cat]

Tromix is an awesome company ! Great Video !!!

[Transporter1022]

Price and where to buy? (other than directly from the manufactuer if any)

[TangoDownProduction]

@Transporter1022 If you are talking about this exact Saiga 12, you are looking at about $2,700 with the tax stamp. Finding a Tromix converted Saiga like this for sale in the open market for under $3,000 will be difficult. You will be better off buying a stock Saiga 12 from your local dealer, then contact Tromix and have them contact you when they will be able to take your order. Right now they aren't taking any more orders for 1 year. A stock Saiga will cost you around $500 - $600.