Animal Rights / Vivisection Debate on "Third Thursday" pt. 1

[kimberlily1983]

Well, this is not the angle most people would approach this from, but just want to give my 2 cents.

I'm an antinatalist. I'm choosing to not reproduce - ever - because bringing life into the world involves great risk to that being, great harms: disease, abuse from others, war, etc. Conversely, not being brought into the world does not harm one; there is no benefit - to that being - to being brought into the world. Therefore, reproducing is wrong, in my view. (continued)

[kimberlily1983]

@kimberlily1983 (cont) ... Now, let's for argument's sake assume that a small amount of animal testing/experimentation is useful and valuable for medical progress. The tiny fraction of risk to my potential offspring that this research would eliminate, first of all, would not be enough to make me see bringing a child into this world as something morally neutral or right; it would still be wrong. Second of all, even if bringing children into the world was a morally neutral activity... (continued)

[kimberlily1983]

@kimberlily1983 (cont)... , if it wasn't wrong to the child him/herself, it would definitely be wrong to bring children into the world if the only way you could protect them from certain harms was by harming other beings (here, the animals in laboratories, etc.).

Unfortunately, as far as I can see, there's no way around the antinatalist argument: it is wrong to bring people into the world. Fortunately, for those of us who do it anyway, there are other, vastly more effective and... (continued)

[kimberlily1983]

@kimberlily1983 (cont) .... reliable ways to protect our children than torturing animals, from clinical trials, in vitro culture tests, etc. A healthy diet free of animal products and full of antioxidant-rich produce, active lifestyle, eating organic as much as possible, maintaining a healthy weight, social support, sanitary living conditions, not to mention having the proper attitude towards the rights of others, having empathy, compassion... this is what makes for a good, healthy human life.

[kimberlily1983]

@kimberlily1983 *** Just want to clarify a point in my previous post, for people who've not looked into this much: I wanted to distinguish clinical trials and in vitro tests, etc. FROM animal testing. These are two examples of medical studies that are entirely cruelty-free, to my knowledge, and involve only humans and/or tissues/cells from humans and animals (no live animals). These are the kinds of fields that can be both ethical and provide a vast amount of useful knowledge. ***

[dalektaliban]

i think doctor who summed it up best " if people exist because others suffer then life is worthless"

[smokeybiut]

FUCK ALL PEOPLE THAT SUPPORT ANIMAL RESEARCH. Go straight to hell mother fuckers. And I'll help you along if I can. Your kids suck and arn't worth taking the life of a fly to save them. I seriously hope you get right in the head and let your average kids die rather than taking other innocent lives that are equally important. I swear I hope you all suffer a painful tradgic death in the near future. FUCK YOU TO HELL. In fact I hope your buried underneath the hell.

[jeffmagic32]

they saved my life. I thank them every day.

[jeffmagic32]

without animal research I would be dead - thanks so much for the scientists who have to put up with these animal wackos to provide the rest of us with life saving knowledge.

[goingemoguy]

Thanx to the pharma industry and animal testing I lost family members to the drug vioxxx. Animal research is scientific fraud.

[jeffmagic32]

how do you think we should test drugs?

[AsSomedayItMayHappen]

You both are at the fundamental core of this debate: Does a human life take precedence over a non-human being?

I think from a biological standpoint, it can be argued that despite clear differences between human beings and animals, we are the same.

Having said that, any reasonable person, if given the choice between saving a human being or an animal, would pick the human being.

[jeffmagic32]

from a physics standpoint a human is worth no more than a rock. Just wait - in another 50 years or so we will have wackjobs trying to "save the rocks".

[FreethinkingJim]

reasonable? I think with a conservation mindset and I realize that humans have no value as far as conserving them goes. We're overpopulated and the only people who deny this are the religulous.

[FreethinkingJim]

I think we should test drugs on habitual murderers and rapists and terrorists. They hurt society (unlike beagles who actually do good for humans)

[xxxxxxxxxx713]

@FreethinkingJim

i heard China does that

[jeffmagic32]

that's a lie - you are the fraud

[scorpk8]

@jeffmagic32 Please explain how did it save your life? I want too hear this

[jeffmagic32]

I have had juvenile onset diabetes. So do one out of every hundred people in the world. Thanks to research of dogs and fish, scientists discovered how insulin is produced and used by the body. Without that knowledge, the millions of diabetics all over the world would be dead.

[scorpk8]

How ignorant you are, so sad. diabetes is cure able and preventable.

[jeffmagic32]

Of course Juvenile Onset Diabetes is not preventable, or curable. Who do you think knows more about this - me, who has had diabetes since I was 3, or you, who has been a animal rights ignoramus for the last few months?

[scorpk8]

OK now you think you know me? You think you know what I know about diabetes? Well for your information my father is diabetic as well as my sister as well as other family members. My father is as thick as you about diabetes. my sister is curing hers at this time. Yours was preventable, but your fat greedy parents were obviously as thick as you. I have been for animal rights my whole life by the way dick head. Go on being sick moron...

[jeffmagic32]

Now you have insulted both me and my family. However, I forgive you, because I know that your hate is born of profound ignorance.

Its clear that you don't understand the difference between Type 1 and Type 2 diabetes. I have zero insulin producing beta cells in my body.

Educate yourself then get back to me. I will be happy to accept your sincere apology.

[scorpk8]

As I said "go on being sick!" or just google reversing diabetes

I think for you to assume youknow my knowledge on the subject is none is an insult to me. so lose the guilt trip dork.

[jeffmagic32]

I HAVE TYPE 1 DIABETES !!! What about this don't you understand? Either you are terribly misinformed, or you are deliberately spreading dangerous lies.

[FreethinkingJim]

I really want to watch someone stuff angel food cake down your face hole and watch you die of a diabetic coma. You're the reason so many lives are martyred for no reason except to save your parasitic ass. Thats what you are, a parasite. What kind of human doesn't produce their own insulin? One that genetically failed. Your mom should've aborted you. I hate humans.

[jeffmagic32]

You have exposed your morality for all to see. Hate humans? Kill yourself.

[jeffmagic32]

You are non-productive. Animals don't give a crap about you. It would be better for the planet if you had never existed.

[FreethinkingJim]

@jeffmagic32 Why don't we genetically give them the cognition to care and see what they really think? That'd help humanity. Also I am productive to this planet as I'm on my way to becoming a game warden. :)

[jeffmagic32]

you're joking, right?

[FreethinkingJim]

@jeffmagic32 Nope. gonna arrest lotsa morons. :)

[jeffmagic32]

yeah right. The animals don't need a warden. It's a make work program designed to employ the socially retarded.

[TaraZatara]

Anybody who believes in the cold-blooded suffering of good nice animals should be punished. They should be made to be punished by made to do tons of work with no pay and made to eat only sexy white womens' spit, urine and feces. They should only think this is good because their food came from good nice sexy white women.

[jeffmagic32]

I laugh at you as I eat a delicious steak

[elamena]

you are a disgusting ignorant person

[jeffmagic32]

Your ignorance, if implemented, would cause the death of millions and millions of people.